2012 Presidential Election Discussion

Monkey King

http://www.isidewith.com/results/68169946:962406?ref=nf
http://www.isidewith.com/results/68169946

Well these were my results. It turns out I'm a libertarian at heart. It'll be interesting comparing myself with the overwhelmingly democratic majority in this thread. :)

Edit: You guys all suck and only posted the percentages, not links to your responses, lol. >_<

Considering we post about these topics all the time it would be a bit redundant unless we were fresh faces from the previous month like yourself.

Also lol at NATO in Sudan.

commonyoshi

Lol, it was the best option out of the three. I didn't write my own, partly because I was too lazy, and partly because I dont have an answer I'm 100% comfortable with.

I actually figured that one would be something I had in common with Obama (and you guys because of how much you agree with him), except this time he hasn't addressed it, at least not in the poll. He urged action like a decade ago, but hasn't done anything since becoming President.

Monkey King

@commonyoshi:

Lol, it was the best option out of the three. I didn't write my own, partly because I was too lazy, and partly because I dont have an answer I'm 100% comfortable with.

I actually figured that one would be something I had in common with Obama (and you guys because of how much you agree with him), except this time he hasn't addressed it, at least not in the poll. He urged action like a decade ago, but hasn't done anything since becoming President.

Action in what sense though. NATO doesn't even really have the leverage to extend itself that far geographically speaking. NATO has been expanding east and southwards since the Cold War ended, which allowed us to hit up Serbia and then Libya, and though messy the possibility of going into Syria is there.
North Sudan is not in the sphere yet. Even if it was it would be a frightful job to get done.

andre

@Chrissie:

Has this been posted here? Funny stuff especially since I missed Ryan's speech :')
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/

I feel really uninformed. I don't do enough real research and I never expected Fox News to condemn Ryan and Romney. This is nice.

commonyoshi

@Monkey:

Action in what sense though. NATO doesn't even really have the leverage to extend itself that far geographically speaking. NATO has been expanding east and southwards since the Cold War ended, which allowed us to hit up Serbia and then Libya, and though messy the possibility of going into Syria is there.
North Sudan is not in the sphere yet. Even if it was it would be a frightful job to get done.

I didn't pick that option because of NATO. It had more to do with intervention, whether that be NATO, the UN, or the African Union.

Monkey King

@commonyoshi:

I didn't pick that option because of NATO. It had more to do with intervention, whether that be NATO, the UN, or the African Union.

The UN is awful at interventions lol, they're good on cleanup duty.
And the African Union is a corrupt club for crooked politicans and dictators lol.
NATO is the only way to go-o.

Ubiq

NATO here really meaning the US Navy since it's the only group in NATO really capable of doing anything in Sudan.

Aohige_AP

That poll is weird.
I got 51% on Romney (lowest) and 79% on Obama (highest), despite the fact I disagree with pretty much everything Romney says.

I guess the "importance bar" has a lot of effect on the outcome, I didn't touch that bar at all.

Ubiq

It definitely alters some things depending on how you weight an issue.

!
!

Stein went up several points when I didn't assign any importance to those issues.

Monkey King

Bill Clinton owns, that is all.

Aohige_AP

@Monkey:

Bill Clinton owns, that is all.

So you love China, and hate Japan?

/jk

Barkworm

The quiz shouldn't ask if you "believe in the theory of evolution" but rather if you believe in creationism. Evolution is not a theory but a scientifically proven fact.

Monkey King

@Barkworm:

The quiz shouldn't ask if you "believe in the theory of evolution" but rather if you believe in creationism. Evolution is not a theory but a scientifically proven fact.

You're not from around here are you.

Barkworm

Haha, no, I'm not. It's just mind-boggling to me that something like believing in a fairy tale or acknowledging facts is even a factor in an election. Same thing with the whole climate change issue.

Ubiq

So, hey, this National Review cover for Romney looks kinda familiar.

!

I wonder why…

!

Ohhhhh…

Monkey King

@Barkworm:

Haha, no, I'm not. It's just mind-boggling to me that something like believing in a fairy tale or acknowledging facts is even a factor in an election. Same thing with the whole climate change issue.

?
Evolution isn't a factor in any election really.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Ubiq:

So, hey, this National Review cover for Romney looks kinda familiar.

! http://i.imgur.com/X8B0s.jpg

I wonder why.

! http://i.imgur.com/EIPEe.jpg

Ohhhhh…

In it's Paul Ryanest form Libertarianism actually has a lot of similarities to Communism as a political movement so that's actually really fitting lol.

Urouge

I'm still waiting for the day that Romney scares me less than he did the day before.

@Barkworm:

scientifically proven fact.

I apologize for going a little off topic here, but for the sake of science, please don't ever put those three words together like that ever again. It directly opposes the intent of science, and is the reason that Galileo (among many others) was nearly killed prematurely.

And this has nothing to do with the theory of evolution, which I believe is the best explanation we have. But to assume that anything like that is perfect and unchallengable is extremely dangerous.

Bill

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/01/jon-stewart-clint-eastwood-romney_n_1848979.html

All this serious talk! Time for some humor to balance things!

igetownd

http://www.isidewith.com/results/93485895

I'm a goddamn hippie :P.

Cyan D. Funk

Bill Clinton should've spent his speech yelling at a table that he claimed Romney was eating on

igetownd

@Barkworm:

The quiz shouldn't ask if you "believe in the theory of evolution" but rather if you believe in creationism. Evolution is not a theory but a scientifically proven fact.

"Scientifically proven fact" is a political term. Just say that evolution is the most probable phenomenon because we've found the remains of ancient organisms scattered across the planet, and have found a sequential progression of differences and similarities when comparing DNA of modern creatures to the remains and to the remains of even earlier organisms. Correction, just say evolution is much more likely to be correct than creationism, because creationism is based on fabrication with no objective supporting evidence.

Or simply say evolution happens. End of argument.

Shandian

@Bill:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/01/jon-stewart-clint-eastwood-romney_n_1848979.html

All this serious talk! Time for some humor to balance things!

You should post this on Laugh out Loud threat becaue these clips were most hilarious things in this week for me… I think democrats should just sit back and let repulicans self-destruct their own presidental campaign.

Barkworm

@igetownd:

Or simply say evolution happens.

So evolution is a fact. Is that really that much different from what I said?

Ubiq

Oh, man, this John Kerry speech. "He's even blurted out the preposterous notion that Russia is our number one political foe. Folks, Sarah Palin talked about how she could see Russia from Alaska. Mitt Romney talks like he's only seen Russia in Rocky IV!"

Monkey King

@Ubiq:

Oh, man, this John Kerry speech. "He's even blurted out the preposterous notion that Russia is our number one political foe. Folks, Sarah Palin talked about how she could see Russia from Alaska. Mitt Romney talks like he's only seen Russia in Rocky IV!"

To be fair they kind of are, but what Romney doesn't admit/realize (probably the latter) is that aside from localized nutjobs like NK and Iran, being a number one geopolitical foe these days doesn't really mean a whole lot. Of course the republican strategy of "treat the world like everythign everything will kill us!1!1!!!" more or less sees the Cold War, WW2, and what have you behind every rock. Responsible bunch of blokes to be sure.

Jabra

I don't know if it is of interest to any of you US guys, but most Germans would vote for Obama according to a recent survey.

86% would vote for him.

http://www.presseportal.de/pm/6694/2320664/ard-deutschlandtrend-september-2012-deutsche-wuerden-obama-waehlen

2506 interviewed people above 18, through randomly generated computer-assisted telephone interviews. Chance of error: 1,4 - 3,1 %, survey period: 03 - 05 september.

Riddler

@Jabra:

I don't know if it is of interest to any of you US guys, but most Germans would vote for Obama according to a recent survey.

86% would vote for him.

http://www.presseportal.de/pm/6694/2320664/ard-deutschlandtrend-september-2012-deutsche-wuerden-obama-waehlen

2506 interviewed people above 18, through randomly generated computer-assisted telephone interviews. Chance of error: 1,4 - 3,1 %, survey period: 03 - 05 september.

Not surprising. I don`t know a single person who would vote or support Romney.

Mugiwara_no_Ice

Of course, Europe is more to the left politically when compared to America.
Even the extreme right parties wouldn't go as far as what we heard of some republicans.
Maybe about immigrants and islam and such but if they talk about women or abortus in that way they would be deleted from the political landscape.

So Obama is just in the middle for us, so alot of people can adhere to his policy.

@Monkey:

I'm not sure I agree, I dunno, maybe that's because America is by nature the sort of country that is defined by coming here rather than having roots here though. Even our roots are about coming here lol.
Dunno how I'd feel about it if I lived in Belgium, though that you say this as an immigrant is even more interesting.

Sorry to come back to this one, haven't been in a writing mood the other day. Well let me take an example: Are you ok with someone being mayor of "your" city that came fresh from let's say Los Angeles or the westcoast? I wouldn't, I don't think anyone would that's why in a democracy it actually almost never happens.
When it comes to a country I think the link should be deeper than for a city.

Of course for a vast and diverse country as the US, it wouldn't be the same as for a little country like Belgium, I understand that.

Monkey King

@Mugiwara_no_Ice:

Sorry to come back to this one, haven't been in a writing mood the other day. Well let me take an example: Are you ok with someone being mayor of "your" city that came fresh from let's say Los Angeles or the westcoast?

Depends on how long he's lived here. If he's just arrived I wouldn't, but if he's been here for decades or such why not? People do move around the US all the time anyway.
And well heck, immigrants CAN run for stuff like mayors, governors, councils, and everything BUT president.

I wouldn't, I don't think anyone would that's why in a democracy it actually almost never happens.
When it comes to a country I think the link should be deeper than for a city.

But it happens a fair amount here lol. I mean Arnold got California didn't he? And I'm more than willing to bet there's multiple mayors and other such people around my area with all the immigrants.

Mugiwara_no_Ice

Well that's the point I think. I don't think it was a good idea to let Arnold become governor, see what he has done? lol.

Jokes aside, I do think that where you're born, where you grew up and your roots/lineage/and such do matter in how you feel/are connected with a place or people. I might be wrong, but that's how I see things.

Monkey King

@Mugiwara_no_Ice:

Well that's the point I think. I don't think it was a good idea to let Arnold become governor, see what he has done? lol.

Jokes aside, I do think that where you're born, where you grew up and your roots/lineage/and such do matter in how you feel/are connected with a place or people. I might be wrong, but that's how I see things.

Than this simply has to come down to the difference between historical nation states and diaspora newbie countries I guess. To an American this just sounds like a strange sentiment.

Insider2000

Driving to pick up dinner, and I had a car in front of me with a bumper sticker saying, "Impeach Obama, Bring Back Bush".

That doesn't make a god damn lick of sense in any way, shape or form.

I have doubt and feel like this is going to be a very close election. Either way, I don't know how the Republican party can go on like this. I don't think Republicans are crazy. I think there are plenty of intelligent people in the world who just don't agree with Obama's plans or methods. But the way the Republican Convention went down? Christ, I don't even know where the party is going. Between the obvious lies and the Looney Toon antics, it's freaking scary.

Shandian

These are difficult times with world economy growing increasingly unstable and geopolitical situation constantly changing USA can't have idiot president that world will look upon, people blame Obama for everything and blame weak economy on him while he has been actually pretty decent president able to do those hard decisions and being much better president that Bush whose mess he is still cleaning.

Romney winning might actually be bad for Republicans, its easy to shout from bushes but when you actually have to take the fall on everything is happening and I think Romney's 'solutions' dont really help but instead make problems more severe it would turn masses against him and party quite quickly.

But memory of people can be short and republican party can just blame and alienate Romney much like they did with Bush after his terms, and of course Fox news is there to mend the wounds for Romneys mistakes.

So lets hope that Obama wins becasue he is simply better man for the job.

Nemilla

@Barkworm:

The quiz shouldn't ask if you "believe in the theory of evolution" but rather if you believe in creationism. Evolution is not a theory but a scientifically proven fact.

Just a quick sidenote: In scientifical language the word "theory" is used also about hard facts. Unfortunately this causes misuderstandings. Also deliberate misunderstandings, like in discussions about evolution vs. creationism (especially in English - other languages, including my own, are slightly more safe).
(Mandatory Wikipedia article about the word and its many meanings: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory )

Carry on.

TLC

I'm surprised no one's mentioned this yet.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/ezra-klein/wp/2012/09/12/the-romney-campaign-gets-desperate/

This was in pretty poor taste even for Romney. To claim the President felt sympathy for the terrorists that murdered his officials? He's imploding in on himself.

Gliblord

This is pretty much business as usual now. That's not "desperation."

Whoops, did our troglodytic he's a terrorist subtext become explicit? We'll just pop it back into the exploitation box and… there we go!

Kaiolino

Today in my university class the lecturer asked who would vote Obama and who would vote Romney. 100+ people and they unanimously went for Obama.

Gliblord

Damn universities and their insidious liberal "learning"

Insider2000

I'm waiting for Romney to say something stupid along the lines of "Hitler wasn't such a bad guy". Then I can see as his supporters do all sorts of dances and jigs to reshape what he said.

Also…

"This isn't the change I voted for."

Keyword: 'I'

Kaze

Both are horrible choices. And I'm still debating on voting or not.

Monkey King

@Kaze:

Both are horrible choices. And I'm still debating on voting or not.

You're in Texas what does it matter?

The Laughing Man

@Kaze:

Both are horrible choices. And I'm still debating on voting or not.

Obama/Biden is clearly the lesser of the two evils, though. Freaking Romney/Ryan gives me (bad) chills just thinking about it.

Robby

@Monkey:

You're in Texas what does it matter?

Gives the right to complain for the next four years.

Supernademan

How stunned would you guys if obama lost? me fuckin shitting bricks…

Monkey King

@Supernademan:

How stunned would you guys if obama lost? me fuckin shitting bricks…

I'm pretty sure being as we're from the same place that you speak normal intelligible English lol, can you rephrase that?

Cyan D. Funk

There would need to be Putin-style ballot tampering to give Romney even a _chance_ of getting elected

Silence

@Cyan:

There would need to be Putin-style ballot tampering to give Romney even a _chance_ of getting elected

Yeah,
Well, about that…

http://www.aclu.org/facts-about-voter-suppression-infographic
http://www.brennancenter.org/content/resource/2012_summary_of_voting_law_changes/

Supernademan

@Monkey:

I'm pretty sure being as we're from the same place that you speak normal intelligible English lol, can you rephrase that?

How stunned would you guys be if Obama lost? or Romney wins ? or both ala the 2000 election? I for one, would shit bricks. Ps; i typed this with my ps3 controller and i rush alot while typing with it, sides its the internet most of its nonsense.

Gliblord

There's an encouraging phenomenon, apparently, where people who say they'll vote Romney to appease their conservative parents actually vote Obama when they hit the polls

Monkey King

@Gliblord:

There's an encouraging phenomenon, apparently, where people who say they'll vote Romney to appease their conservative parents actually vote Obama when they hit the polls

I've known some of these people if I'm not mistaken lol. Does this by chance happened to be the Millennial South?

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Supernademan:

How stunned would you guys be if Obama lost? or Romney wins ? or both ala the 2000 election? I for one, would shit bricks. Ps; i typed this with my ps3 controller and i rush alot while typing with it, sides its the internet most of its nonsense.

Nigga if I can't read your post what the fuck is the point lol.

Anyway no, it's close though Obama has maintained a lead. I'm pretty sure O will win, but turnout is an unpredictable bitch.