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**Eiichiro Oda
I gave the One Piece Card Game starter decks to my staff, and they played for like ten hours. Is it that fun?! I’m going to try it!
Welp translation didn't really manage to salvage much about how screwed this is as an end note to the arc.
Oh well at least it's over.
Liked: the farewell to Momo, the pirates leaving, the final samurai image (thought I wish it was a two-page spread).
Didn't like: No exploration of Yamato. Hiyori's speech being unnecessarily morally ambiguous (thought I assume the best meaning).
I wish Oda had freed 4 pages (two of the speaker's theatrical narration, and Hiyori's double page) and instead had used them for fleshing out Yamato's decision and a Zoro/Hiyori moment.
However, that final theatrical display was probably Oda's teased final scene of Wano, so he couldn't help but fulfill his vision.
Despite being over, Wano still left hanging a lot of plot threads that I feel will still get covered.
In 1058, I could see one or two pages for flashbacks of both Carrot's and Yamato's talks with the crew, just to put those threads to rest. That, of course, assuming Carrot is not stowing away in the Sunny again.
Wano predictions: There will be 5 acts; All Straw Hats will get fights, some in Act 4; Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Carrot will have her moment, but won't join; Yamato will be a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5; Next arc is Mary Geoise.
About Yamato's reasons presented in this chapter, I think most people are missing out that Yamato didn't choose to stay in Wano only to travel around the country first... at least that's not what the dialogue with Kinnemon seems to point out. If we look at the timeline of Yamato's decision-making process, he made up his mind about travelling the land of Wano last chapter (1056), AFTER his talk with Luffy when he communicated to the crew his decision of staying, which is made very clear in the chapter since Kinnemon even highlights this detail. So it seems like there's something else omitted to the readers. How important it is, I don't know. My theory is that Yamato is waiting to "open the borders of Wano", as was Oden's final wish.
As for the twist itself of Yamato staying, my opinion is that Oda did it too late. That's a terrible idea, especially when Oda didn't even properly showcase Yamato's change of mind onscreen. He shouldn't play with readers' expectations like he did throughout this arc about Yamato joining and then disappoint them. Unless Yamato plays a bigger role (as a SH) in the future.
I don't really have much to say that has already been said. Really strange the sudden shift in Yamato not wanting to leave even if you can make sense of it on paper. I want to like the whole farewell with Momo, but I just can't muster any feelings towards him. He's not the unlikable brat he started out as, but like with so much other characters from the arc he just feels so underutilized. There's also the fact that he had so little interaction with Luffy the whole thing of him calling Momo a little brother just doesn't work for me. The whole "here's our flag to raise" moment.
Perhaps in the future on a reread I'll be a little more receptive to this arc, but at this time this arc was just a slog to get through. Some fun characters like Queen with some neat moments, such as Jinbei finally joining. However, those great moments were few and far between with so much mediocrity.
I've been seeing people predicting Carrot could still join. While not against it, I laugh at the idea because if true it would be such a jarring thing with how little screen time she has had since the end of Whole Cake Island.
I can't say I hated this arc because it has my favorite moment in the series(gear 5) but too many other things were off panelled or put to the side, so I can't love it either as it will always feel like an incomplete arc.
@theackwardstation said in Chapter 1057: The End:
As for the twist itself of Yamato staying, my opinion is that Oda did it too late.
I don't think it's too late, but that the lack of Yamato's perspective made it too jarring.
For a long time I thought we'd get an Yamato exploration chapter, in which we delve into his mind, past and dreams, he finds an epiphany about himself, and makes his final decision.
The thing is, that chapter was completely skipped. So his decision feels like a middle finger to the reader.
Still, I hope we get at least a flashback to his talk with Luffy and the others.
Wano predictions: There will be 5 acts; All Straw Hats will get fights, some in Act 4; Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Carrot will have her moment, but won't join; Yamato will be a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5; Next arc is Mary Geoise.
@theackwardstation said in Chapter 1057: The End:
About Yamato's reasons presented in this chapter, I think most people are missing out that Yamato didn't choose to stay in Wano only to travel around the country first... at least that's not what the dialogue with Kinnemon seems to point out. If we look at the timeline of Yamato's decision-making process, he made up his mind about travelling the land of Wano last chapter (1056), AFTER his talk with Luffy when he communicated his decision to stay to the crew, which is made very clear by the chapter since Kinnemon even highlights this detail. It seems like there's something else omitted to the readers. How important it is, I don't know. My theory is that Yamato is waiting to "open the borders of Wano", as was Oden's final wish.
As for the twist itself of Yamato staying, my opinion is that Oda did it too late. Terrible idea, especially when Oda didn't even properly showcase Yamato's change of mind onscreen. He shouldn't play with readers' expectations like he did throughout this arc about Yamato joining... unless Yamato somehow plays a bigger role (as a SH) in the future.
I came across this theory made on Reddit. I do personally think it has some merit given the event with Yamato in 1057
https://www.reddit.com/r/OnePiece/comments/wt3zu0/on_a_recent_change_of_plan_1057_spoilers/
Even if there is more to Yamato staying on Wano, narratively it would’ve got better this chapter than posted as an afterthought next chapter. And it should be explicit given Oda posted explicitly so much about Yamato wanting to head out to sea, having the reason stay behind be implied is unsatisfying narratively.
I've seen people in other places mention the JP twitter reaction to the Kurozumi thing is mirroring ours but not sure if that is true but would be really interesting to hear about it.
The chapter was pretty good. I love that Momo and Kin got the "honorary SH" treatment because they deserve it, even if their farewall was not as iconic as Vivi's. But the scene was still memorable with Luffy giving them his flag while telling them they're part of the crew. IMO, ending the arc with the theatrical play was a super creative touch that's aesthetically pleasing to me, since it connects well with the Act Structure of the arc itself with the kabuki references, shamisen and curtains. And I adore the panel of Momo with his samurai, Yamato included, where they all look happy ever after. At the end of the day, I love this cast.
As for Hiyori's controversial line, I read it in good faith as a pun without the persecutory connotation, just to send off Orochi and the hatred of the Kurozumi as the narration itself was building up to. Stephen's tranlation is the best one yet, because it doesn't use the article "the" and the phrase is written in the singular (as it should be, because it's "charcoal is meant to burn", not "charcoals are meant to burn"), so it becomes more specific to Orochi and his allies. But this is very dangerous discourse from a practical point of view if it were not fiction (because it could have hypothetical consequences in the real world, but there's no such thing in fiction). Anyway, it's a terrible oversight to let it publish like this when it can be understood so terribly, so I hope Oda addresses this in the future in a SBS or another official message. I'd even suggest changing the phrase in the volume for, in japanese, "Kurozumi's hatred is made to burn".
I expect next chapter we will find out more about the Sabo situation or such.
@Deicide said in Chapter 1057: The End:
@theackwardstation said in Chapter 1057: The End:
As for the twist itself of Yamato staying, my opinion is that Oda did it too late.
I don't think it's too late, but that the lack of Yamato's perspective made it too jarring.
For a long time I thought we'd get an Yamato exploration chapter, in which we delve into his mind, past and dreams, he finds an epiphany about himself, and makes his final decision.
The thing is, that chapter was completely skipped. So his decision feels like a middle finger to the reader.
Still, I hope we get at least a flashback to his talk with Luffy and the others.
This is an annoying trend with modern Oda where he writes things with the intention of ending the chapter in a cliffhanger, so he may sacrifice some scenes that should be there in order to pump fans for the next chapter.
Reading older chapters, you can tell this was never a concern. He could end things with a bang or a whimper or even a laugh. Not trying to be nostalgic or anything, but it's one of the more noticeable changes you can point out in his writing along the years.
@Hakase said in Chapter 1057: The End:
I've seen people in other places mention the JP twitter reaction to the Kurozumi thing is mirroring ours but not sure if that is true but would be really interesting to hear about it.
Yeah, they are. But that's not surprising. Hardcore One Piece fans usually have the same reactions regardless of where they're from
The Japanese fans also thought it was a bit off huh? Nice to be on the same page for once
@King-Cannon I feel this is mostly Wano's huge scope. Too many plot points, too many characters. But Yamato sure deserved a better conclusion regardless, given how important he was for the arc and how impactful his introduction was.
But I also feel Ch 1057 was done with the end of Volume 104 in mind. If Vol. 104 has 11 chapters, it ends here, with the curtains closing, so Oda may have swapped things around to end Wano with the volume.
If so, there's still chance that we may see something more of Yamato's decision in 1058, as Oda tries to compensate the lack of information.
I'm seeing a lot of people coming to the conclusion that Yamato didn't tell the whole truth to Momo so the later doesn't feel guilty for Yamato's decision.
There's quite a few issues with this chapter (from Yamato's quick change of mind to the awful "kurozumis are born to burn"), but man, Luffy's comments to Momo about him being all weak made me flinch. Maybe if Momo wasn't still mentally a little kid, I'd might feel different (Luffy lacks of care for social conventions that he would dare berate a king is one thing I like about him).
I don't know, maybe if Momo had more interesting interactions with the Strawhats beyond Luffy, I might feel more for their goodbye but alas.
Well to be fair it's JP twitter which is not the same as "fans" just wanna clarify. But really I'm curious about anything about it.
To me it's definitely the thing that has soured me the most on this chapter as the longer I sit on it the more it feels not very One Piece and Oda just went for the poetry of mirroring the Oden bit and all the editors were on vacation not present to tell him about the implications of it.(I'm being facetious about that but if there was any convo about this I'm really curious if someone even brought it up about how it reads.)
@Deicide said in Chapter 1057: The End:
Liked: the farewell to Momo, the pirates leaving, the final samurai image (thought I wish it was a two-page spread).
This! I thought the goodbye was rather sweet and I really wish it could have been a two page spread.
Wish we could have gotten more insight into the Yamato decision, but oh well I guess.
Excited to be leaving wano at last!
I really like the Momo/Luffy moment.. I really enjoyed Luffy the last couple chapters and this continue to be a nice one with him reassuring Momo and giving him his flag and a promise. I have generally been really enjoying Luffy the last chapters and feeling like a veteran inspiring others.
Luffy calling him a little brother really made me wish Momo returned to his kid self to really lend the little brother Luffy is looking out for and I generally dont like the idea of an 8 year kid running around in a adult body.
I think Yamato best moments were with Momo so I'm not upset he is not joining. But the way it was done feels it was only done to be surprising rather than a natural growth. I would have liked to learn he planned to travel the land with Momo or if his reason was to protect momo until he has become strong enough. As it is presented it feels like a twist that we only got for the sake of shock. No extra development is given to make it natural payoff to his last declaration of wanting to travel.
Orochi was overall a stronger villain for the arc. He has a stronger backstory, a bigger connection to the misery of the people and a more memorable death. I truly wish he had gotten more focus.Considering how the story end I really wish we had more time on Orochi as a villain and Hiyori 20 years of anger over her family. Thats like a solid samurai movie pitch and I love a revenge story. Its dealier and grimmier and I think I would have quite enjoy it.
But the story given was pretty traditional one piece so far so the ending felt uncharateristcally vindictive . As If the people got Hordy started stomping on him and his people for almost killing them and their family. it would be deserved and can even be a parallel to having them stomp on the queen but I would find it very out of tone with the story of the arc.
For me Hiyori existence gives me an undertone " better to have a kid pretending to be an adult as king then having a woman in power" and that rubs me the wrong way. You add that ending that feels pretty vindictive and the country getting to keep its border close. And that Wano had many of the bad aspects of its community/culture be rewarded or not adressed.
The chapter was nice with some major frustrations scattered about.
For all the dropped plot threads, I'm glad we get a goodbye for Kin'emon and Momo. That's the most important one. Momo's gotten a little better since Wano started, but the one I'm gonna miss is Kin'emon. He really grew on me. The scene with the captains was nice, and I like the style of theatrical play, ending with the curtains closing. It feels like a proper goodbye to the arc.
Yamato staying behind could've been handled better. I don't understand the point of having him repeatedly state he wants to join the crew if it neither leads to introspection nor joining. It comes across as cruel bait rather than an exploration of his character. "Oh I discussed it off screen with Luffy" feels like a final send off to Wano's back-and-forth pacing. Maybe we get more info about it, who knows, but as of right now I don't get any sense this is an issue that'll be revisited.
Hiyori's line is a still a bit iffy. The translation handled it much better than the spoilers, and I can appreciate it to a degree. It's a pun, a throwback to Oden and Hiyori gets a final comment in, that'll all good. But then you put Kanjuro and Orochi's flashbacks beside it... What frustrates me most is the lack of acknowledgement of the persecution. No mentions, no condemnation, no moment when anyone points out that they should avoid such a situation happening again. Considering how many of the samurai faced persecution themselves, you'd think they'd understand.
I did actually enjoy the chapter quite a bit, but the above points are gonna nag me every time I reread it.
Mentioned this in another thread, but I get the suspicion Yamato will have to deal with her own insecurities and gain greater purpose before finally setting out with Luffy.
Shift
I like Luffy making a promise to Momo and kinemon he travelled with forever after their time together. And his promise to the young girl that had nothing and be the older brother Ace was for her. I think its solid parallel.
But Yamato presence in the promise annoyed me. He feels so much like a groupie and I hate that he is rewarded with a ever burning vigil from our crew. Either we should have bite the bullet and have him join or he should have became a clear retainer. Honestly considering what Yamato ultimate role was I kinda wish the character simply wasnt around.
@desa said in Chapter 1057: The End:
I like Luffy making a promise to Momo and kinemon he travelled with forever after their time together. And his promise to the young girl that had nothing and be the older brother Ace was for her. I think its solid parallel.
But Yamato presence in the promise annoyed me. He feels so much like a groupie and I hate that he is rewarded with a ever burning vigil from our crew. Either we should have bite the bullet and have him join or he should have became a clear retainer. Honestly considering what Yamato ultimate role was I kinda wish the character simply wasnt around.
I would say we don't know what their ultimate role really is at this point.
Not saying it's going to be joining but merely Oda offpaneled the reason for the mind change and Pluton is a thing that will make Wano intersect into the story again. I wouldn't be surprised that in the interim we get a cover story with Yamato and whenever the strawhats cross with Wano again Oda decides to tell us the actual reason for the change of mind. Or course this might be it is also a legit possibility but it seems like the kind of unsatisfying resolution Oda would generally fix later. Like Oda went back to make Jack eat shit twice. So the chance is there to put an actual conclusive end note on that character in the future whatever it may be.
My "TL;DR" reaction to this chapter: "Lol ok."
While I was never won over by Yamato as a character and, unlike my sheer joy when Jimbei returned, felt completely apathetic about him joining--other than hoping he would drop the Oden schtick--this still feels like a silly ending for him that makes me wonder what the point was of his whole character. To double down on the Oden cosplay to the point of trying to replicate his life and experience 1-for-1? Gag. But then again, there are a lot of things in this arc that felt like they didn't really pay off or have much purpose in the end (most of Act 2, anyone?), so I guess Yamato's just one more to add to the pile.
Also gotta say: what is with this weird thing of trying to push Law as "totally definitely Luffy's rival now for real!"? Like, Luffy has had way more of a "rival" dynamic with Kid all this time, so the whole attempt at "Luffy and Law and Kid are three-way-rivals and equals like they originally were at Sabaody" is just not really believable after Luffy and Law have been allies for nearly 400 chapters (almost 40% of the entire story by now) and acted more like vitriolic friends when it was just the two of them around without Kid. And hell, it's not even just Law; I always kinda liked that One Piece averted the whole "stock Shonen rival" thing by having the closest thing to a rival for Luffy be his main enemy Blackbeard, so trying to force this whole rivalry thing now with even Kid, let alone Law, this late in the story just feels hard to take seriously. Meh, sure, whatever.
So, with this end chapter, I guess one thing I can say is: at least this arc was consistent! As in, this was a pretty "blegh" ending to a messy, pretty "blegh" arc. 
Hidden:
Dope chapter. I like how Hiyori responded to Orochi's last words.
@BellisarioFaith said in Chapter 1057: The End:
Also gotta say: what is with this weird thing of trying to push Law as "totally definitely Luffy's rival now for real!"? Like, Luffy has had way more of a "rival" dynamic with Kid all this time, so the whole attempt at "Luffy and Law and Kid are three-way-rivals and equals like they originally were at Sabaody" is just not really believable after Luffy and Law have been allies for nearly 400 chapters (almost 40% of the entire story by now) and acted more like vitriolic friends when it was just the two of them around without Kid. And hell, it's not even just Law; I always kinda liked that One Piece averted the whole "stock Shonen rival" thing by having the closest thing to a rival for Luffy be his main enemy Blackbeard, so trying to force this whole rivalry thing now with even Kid, let alone Law, this late in the story just feels hard to take seriously. Meh, sure, whatever.
Law acts normally with Luffy 90% as they have been allied for a all almost the whole new world and Luffy kinda helped him accomplished his biggest wish and he appreciates it and help out pretty willingly. And he is not reckless enough to risk breaking his ship or take mom attack to the face for grandstanding purposes.
So when suddenly Oda need to make a callback to how they are rival from the archipelago because Kidd is around I just ignore it because its doesnt much basis in reality.
So, after 149 chapters, four years and a lot of shit happened, Wano ended. A bit of hate&love arc, for sure, but - alas - seeing all of this ending put a smile on my face. An hype smile, seeing as we don't have any idea, cliffhanger or hint to what will come next. While I don't doubt it will be a long-waited arc (Elbaf, Ace's grave or whatever), it is since Fishmen Island we didn't have the void waiting for us. Such an awesome feeling.
BTW the smile easily fades away. I loved Yamato in all of his points and I feel like this ending-not-ending is kinda of a mess, to say it less. While I highly encouraged for him to join the crew, I'd have preferred a clear "no" to this "well see ya later" which kinda sounds like Jinbe before. I mean, I will happily accept Yama, Kin and Momo all together on the ship, but I don't think we have a lot of time ahead of us to enjoy crewmates that will join even later than now. Surely Yamato doesn't look like a character which met his narrative closure.
The Hiyori/Orochi thing is a bit ambiguous but I'll try to put what the poor Japanese I know allowed me to understand of the original scene. Hiyori's claim basically trace Oden's sign line, which in JAP sounds like "Niente nanbo no!!! 'Oden' ni soro!!!", where Oden works like both his name and the dish name. The official translation "I am Oden, I am born to boil" is kinda a compromise with the unique original Japanese meaning, which uses the structure "[X] nanbo no!!! [Y] ni soro!!!"`, which works like: "[Y] is what it is cause [X]". Oden's full pun can be translated like "the Oden is what it is cause it boils", transferred on himself like "I am Oden cause I boil (like Oden, but metaphorically)".
Hiyori instead claims "Moeru nanbo no!!! 'Kurozumi' ni soro!!!", where Kurozumi works for both Orochi's clan name and 'black charcoal'. The literal translation should sound like "the charcoal is what it is cause it burns", which on Orochi become "You are what you are (a charcoal) cause you burn (like charcoal)". So the point is she's not saying that Orochi is born to be burned down as a Kurozumi clan member, but that he is burning, so he is a charcoal.
If someone knows Japanese better and want to confirm or deny my interpretation, feel free to.
I think it's less that we don't get the double entendre of the phrase, it just more like is that actually worth it when you consider how it could be read, like Oda trying to be cute here with it to me isn't really worth the having the less generous reading being there to receive attention in an arc where we didn't ever really dive or reflect on what made it all happen.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure we are supposed to see the Koruzumi as just rotten people. The problem is that they were not portrayed to be that way entirely of their own making. If they were, Hiyori's retort wouldn't seem so bad...Still not something to celebrate though. Should have just focused on the Kozuki being back.
At this point I think the only thing that saves it all is when the "good" Tenryuubito Mjosgard visits Wano in the end and celebrates national burn Kurozumi day.
Yes bad jokes rn is how I'm coping with this.
Considering the past world-building chapters that took place at the end of Wano acts, I can only begin to imagine what we're in store for next week with the first post-Wano chapter.
It somehow bugs me that Momo got robbed of his childhood and not too much good really came from. Now he's a 28 year old being waved goodbye by his 20 year old big brother and that's how it'll stay i guess.
Seeing the flashback and and the hug really reminded how unconfortable Momo being an adult makes me. I truly dislike it. This is clearly a child and he should look like one.
I think it's tragic that he lost 20 years I don't mind that as being a sacrifice he made but I will say as with many things Oda just flubbed to make it resonate emotionally in favor of keeping the human reveal secret for a while.
So the first thing that comes out of the sacrifice is Shinobu crying about the resemblance and the celebratory BEEEEEEG DRAGON.
The tragedy of it really never had any space to breath and we also never lingered on it in the post raid chapters. Instead the discrepancy is generally used as a gag like when Momo tries to hug Nami and gets punched.
Man how much hurtful is with the arc's end we now know charcoals are meant to burn, but yet we don't know if big blue fishes and soul-eating mamas are meant to melt.
It's over! And I hate to say it, but the final chapter is definitely one of Wano's weakest. There definitely seem to be a few things missing from this post-battle portion of the arc, and whether that's because of Film Red, a desire to finish things off in volume 104 (bold to end a volume with a chapter called "The End" when the series is still ongoing), or just because Oda was ready to move on I can't say. If we look at other big arcs, Dressrosa took 10 chapters to wrap up following Doflamingo's ultimate defeat. The Water Seven Saga lasted a full 14 chapters from the last hit on Rob Lucci. Wano, longer than both of those arcs by a significant margin, is given just 8 chapters from Kaido's fall. My ultimate impression of the arc is positive - I did a full reread of it during the month break and there's some incredibly strong material throughout - but this was a rough way to end it.
Before we even get to the obvious talking points of Yamato and the Kurozumis, there have been some truly strange omissions in this last portion of the arc that should have been easy point scoring for Oda. Not things that break the story by their absence, but still bizarre to not do. The dawn, for example. I know the references to dawns are a long-term thing being built up, not literally the break of day after the battle, but the symbolism of showing the latter as a step toward the former is such an obvious moment. Jinbe's welcome too - it doesn't need to be spelled out that the party of the last few chapters is as much his welcome as it is a celebration of Wano's freedom, but again, showing the toast from his abandoned first welcome being picked back up and completed would have cost literally nothing and earned so much goodwill from the fanbase that the mind boggles it not being done. Zoro and Ryuma's grave too I guess, but that one I can see being saved for a flashback to go with his next-arc powerup. I can see it getting old trying to do the sheer number of goodbyes there could have been to say, from Hyogoro to Marco to Carrot and to everyone else a crewmate had a significant interaction with, but if this is to be the final chapter, at least those three characters should have had a panel to show what kind of lives they were settling into now that the fighting's done. We don't need these things, but they would have given enough fans enough happiness that their exclusion is baffling.
I'll suck it up though. Wano is obviously important to the series' endgame, and we'll definitely be going back to it in the next couple of years. The story isn't over yet. Just because some of the arc's characters weren't given their closure at this seemingly-opportune moment it doesn't mean it'll never happen.
That was a pretty negative opening, and there's more criticism to come, but let's take a break and look at the stuff that works here. The three captains bickering and challenging each other as they set sail is beautiful wonderful and entertaining. The real star of the chapter, however, has to be Momo. It's great attention to detail that he has to run to the coast - his ability to fly has been built up in this arc as an emblem of bravery and adulthood, so for him to lose it in this moment of weakness, when his doubts about the future are overwhelming him, is right in line with that. I felt for the kid when he broke down crying near the end. Of course it was never about Luffy snubbing him by leaving without saying goodbye, he's just pretty reasonably scared. Even when he tried to take on Aramaki himself, there was the knowledge that Luffy and co were still there, just out of sight, as backup. It's setting in for real now that Wano will be on its own. Anyone would be anxious in his shoes, let alone an eight year old forced to grow up way too fast.
I'm a big fan of Luffy leaving the flag, an offer to sail together again, and calling Momo a little brother as a way to resolve the scene. It sells the bond they've made since Punk Hazard and lets Luffy protect Wano in a way without limiting his or their independence. It's also pretty funny that Momo now has a little sister that's (chronologically) older than him and a big brother who's (biologically) younger than him.
And now we go from the pure positives to something I have mixed feelings about: Yamato. I was never fully on board with Yamato as part of the crew. It didn't feel right. He should have at least been built up from the start of Wano rather than the start of Onigashima regardless of where he was going to end up. The way he shot from non-existent to essential over the course of a couple of volumes and started dominating Jump covers and merch ahead of characters with far greater legacies never sat right with me. And it's not that I dislike his character in a vacuum, he's interesting and entertaining and has a compelling backstory and connections to the lore, but going from nowhere to everywhere that quick gave me kind of a Poochie vibe.
So yeah, I'm happy he's not joining the crew. The main characters we have now have been established over such a long period of time that an addition as hurried as Yamato could only have felt out of place, and the time it would have taken to properly let him settle in and find a place in the character dynamics would have been at odds with the story accelerating into its endgame.
But that means I got the Yamato ending I was hoping for. Why am I building this up as a partial complaint then?
Because this ending - the right one for the larger story - genuinely doesn't feel like the end of the story Oda's been telling for the past couple of years. As someone who didn't want Yamato sticking around, I was looking for reasons for his story to change course, I loved Jinbe saying "that's the captain's decision," and was hoping for anything else to suggest his mentality changing. But after the Aramaki fight, even I was making my peace with Yamato's presence. As much as I wanted this, it's too sudden of a swerve to feel like the story naturally built up to it.
Now, there wasn't nothing in the story leading to Yamato staying behind. As much as he liked to tell us he would be going to sea, what we were shown from his actions and Oda's framing of events was a far quicker partnership and deeper bond with Momo than any of the Strawhats. I also think staying in Wano makes more sense for the Oden shtick than it initially seemed. Oden may have felt stifled when he was confined to Wano, but Yamato has spent 20 years confined to just Onigashima. The outside world to him is as much Wano as it is anywhere else. It's genuinely a good idea of him to get to know the country of the man he idolises firsthand, not just through a journal. And it does give the nation a bit of extra insurance while Momo finds his feet and organises his defences. Oden's flaws - his selfishness and gullibility - were instrumental in Kaido and Orochi's rise to power, particularly when the former drove him to abandon the country and his responsibilities to pursue adventure twice, so it would be powerful for the self-proclaimed new Kozuki Oden to learn from the first and do right where he failed.
Buuuuut I wish all those factors had led to a more gradual and visible shifting of Yamato's mentality over time. At the very least, Yamato should have been allowed to participate in the Aramaki fight, rather than framing it as something Momo was doing in part to show him he could be free. Just a single panel of suggestion that he'd reconsidered some stuff during his vigil over Luffy and Zoro would have gone a long way.
I kind of wish I'd saved my reread for after the final curtain now. I really want to review Yamato's scenes to see if there's any more build-up for his actual ending I can see with the benefit of hindsight, but it's way too soon after just doing it during the break.
And then there's the goddamn Kurozumi thing. Yikes, this is a bad one. Even with the Oden panel there to make it as clear as possible it's meant to parallel him joking that his name destined him to boil, it feels wrong. Some people online have definitely taken it a bit far and made it seem worse than it actually is, acting like Hiyori is some kind of genocide-advocating nazi, which she absolutely is not. Making generalisations about a bloodline, especially one that every (known) living member of which has been a complete and willful bastard, isn't the same as generalising about a race. I wouldn't blink twice at some kind of "they're all dickheads who can go burn for all I care" blanket statement about, say, the Trump family, for example, but something about the portrayal here still manages to feel at odds with the series' philosophies up to this point.
The Kurozumi family persecution was always an odd lingering thread in the Wano mythos. Initially, I was interested in Oda's portrayal of the Wano in Oden's flashback as flawed, exhibiting xenophobia, poverty, organised crime bosses with political influence and a whole lawless state in Kuri. And, of course, the vigilante mob that terrorised the disenfranchised Kurozumis. It seemed like an obvious point to demonstrate change in the rebuilt nation. Would Momo as shogun implement some kind of social change so the embers of resentment would never again be fanned into a fire? Would it be made clear that Higurashi and Orochi exaggerated what had been done by a small, unsanctioned minority of the population and projected that hatred onto the whole country? We aren't sticking aroung long enough to see what Momo is going to change as a ruler (at least it was made clear that he wasn't planning to follow his father blindly) but the play feels like a poor start to me.
It's also a missed opportunity that Raizo wasn't handsomed up and allowed to be popular by Aramaki's attack, but that's small potatoes compared to the last thing.
And that's it. The final shot of Momo and his retainers as a group and the curtains sliding closed sure are satisfying to see after all this time. I'm glad to be moving on from it. It's been a wild ride, but I want to see a new setting and new story build up.
I want to drop a review of the arc as a whole in the Wano thread soon, but the summary here is that it was an arc of tremendous highs and abyssal lows. Act One and the first half of Act Three have some of the series' strongest material, but Act Two and the latter half of Act Three, while definitely having their moments, were bloated and muddled and showcased some of Oda's greatest flaws as a writer. A few major fights not quite hitting home and the epilogue not quite sticking the landing are going to leave a bad taste in the fanbase's mouth for a while, but I think new readers who catch up from here and don't have to wait for the story to inch forward week by week will have a much kinder perspective. The broader opinion on Wano will soften as time goes on, but it's never going to be the best of One Piece's big battle arcs.
@Hakase said in Chapter 1057: The End:
I think it's tragic that he lost 20 years I don't mind that as being a sacrifice he made but I will say as with many things Oda just flubbed to make it resonate emotionally in favor of keeping the human reveal secret for a while.
So the first thing that comes out of the sacrifice is Shinobu crying about the resemblance and the celebratory BEEEEEEG DRAGON.
The tragedy of it really never had any space to breath and we also never lingered on it in the post raid chapters. Instead the discrepancy is generally used as a gag like when Momo tries to hug Nami and gets punched.
You can read it as a tragedy but I dont think its ever presented as a tragedy. Its presented as him finally being able to help. We never see him think look at some children playing. Or Kinemon crying "oh my lord you've lost decades". Everyone sees it as a positive.
@desa said in Chapter 1057: The End:
@Hakase said in Chapter 1057: The End:
I think it's tragic that he lost 20 years I don't mind that as being a sacrifice he made but I will say as with many things Oda just flubbed to make it resonate emotionally in favor of keeping the human reveal secret for a while.
So the first thing that comes out of the sacrifice is Shinobu crying about the resemblance and the celebratory BEEEEEEG DRAGON.
The tragedy of it really never had any space to breath and we also never lingered on it in the post raid chapters. Instead the discrepancy is generally used as a gag like when Momo tries to hug Nami and gets punched.You can read it as a tragedy but I dont think its ever presented as a tragedy. Its presented as him finally being able to help. We never see him think look at some children playing. Or Kinemon crying "oh my lord you've lost decades". Everyone sees it as a positive.
That's what I said, literally?
Like it's tragic because I as a person think if you have a heart and see an 8 year old loses 20 years of time due to forced circumstances, that's tragic. And then I go on to explain in detail how Oda just sells non of the tragedy of this circumstance and even plays on it more as a joke.
Like unless you disagree and think yep 8 year old losing his childhood not just mentally but also physically is not really a tragedy then there is really nothing to argue.
Hiyori scene aside, I actually really liked this chapter by itself. Momo made me cry, the bit with the three captains was funny, the shot of Yamato finally finding his place among friends was wholesome.
Not gonna pretend like it gives a proper closure to this arc, not gonna pretend like the twist with Yamato changing his mind was properly executed, but the chapter itself I think was pretty good. The problems I consider are much bigger than this chapter alone and belong to the arc as a whole (which, I have absolutely no doubt in my mind, is in the absolute bottom of my list - it had many good moments, but in 150 chapters it is impossible to not have good things here and there; aside from Oden's flashback, I don't think there was any point in this arc I found to be consistently good, but there was a lot that was really bad or just simply not entertaining).
My biggest expectation for the new arc is... [suspense]... a new editor. Can't really know if the blame for Wano being what it was lies on the current editor, but I want to hope so, this way at least it can be contained.
The way I see it, all of Oda's editors are young editors, so they can learn from Oda, and not the other way around.
@Hakase said in Chapter 1057: The End:
Like unless you disagree and think yep 8 year old losing his childhood not just mentally but also physically is not really a tragedy then there is really nothing to argue.
Since you mention the tragedy wasnt given space to breath I thought you were saying the story also presented it as a tragedy. It just didnt spend enough time on it.
To be fair my biggest problem with the momo thing isnt really the tragedy of 20 year lost (I dont necessarily mind him dying at 55 rather 75 and I dont think he'll be less happy).
My problem is more how sketchy and unconfortable a kid in a grown body is on the long term. Any interraction i with either kids or adults is tainted by me wither thinking of the grown body or the kid inside. Wether he is giving advice to a 12 year old or thinking prospect of marriage. Like I understand the fantasy for a kid or the rediscovering the simple joy for a kid. But only in a limited time period. But once its irreversible the possibilites me in a very unconfortable ways.
@Hakase said in Chapter 1057: The End:
@desa said in Chapter 1057: The End:
@Hakase said in Chapter 1057: The End:
I think it's tragic that he lost 20 years I don't mind that as being a sacrifice he made but I will say as with many things Oda just flubbed to make it resonate emotionally in favor of keeping the human reveal secret for a while.
So the first thing that comes out of the sacrifice is Shinobu crying about the resemblance and the celebratory BEEEEEEG DRAGON.
The tragedy of it really never had any space to breath and we also never lingered on it in the post raid chapters. Instead the discrepancy is generally used as a gag like when Momo tries to hug Nami and gets punched.You can read it as a tragedy but I dont think its ever presented as a tragedy. Its presented as him finally being able to help. We never see him think look at some children playing. Or Kinemon crying "oh my lord you've lost decades". Everyone sees it as a positive.
That's what I said, literally?
Like it's tragic because I as a person think if you have a heart and see an 8 year old loses 20 years of time due to forced circumstances, that's tragic. And then I go on to explain in detail how Oda just sells non of the tragedy of this circumstance and even plays on it more as a joke.Like unless you disagree and think yep 8 year old losing his childhood not just mentally but also physically is not really a tragedy then there is really nothing to argue.
I think what helps in there is Momo already ceased to be a carefree child for a while and I think his good-good time just stopped when he left the Oro Jackson. At first he and his family got hunted by Orochi's man, then people began to mistreat them as children of the Fool-dono. Ultimately he acknowledged his father's death, his family house burned down, Kaidou's menacing grip and in his own heart he probably just knew he wouldn't have seen his mom again. Then 20 years skip, his country land totally different in worse, Kaidou's hunting, Raizou's shipwreck, Doflamingo's brutality, Caesar's cruelty, the DF's shock, then again Doffy, Zou, Wano, crucified by Kaidou, witnessing a lot of his comrades fall (or seemingly do).
I mean: Momo can't be a child now. He just used to see his own age as a weakness to the point to freely exchange it for strength. And there we are. A child heart with man body and experience. And this will be for a while. It's not like there's no drama in sudden aging, but I think he'll acknowledge it later, when he'll metabolize what the hell happened until now and then remember the good ol' times. But we'll not be around Wano for then.
@access-timeco said in Chapter 1057: The End:
My biggest expectation for the new arc is... [suspense]... a new editor. Can't really know if the blame for Wano being what it was lies on the current editor, but I want to hope so, this way at least it can be contained.
I dont know if Oda is at a level where the magazine has interest in limiting what he wants for story. Its kinda like when george Lucas made star wars. Once you've proven you're your idea is a juggernaut you pretty much get to do what you want.
Next arc is bound to be better just by virtue of starting at a lower scope.
I still fear for the end of the saga, but at least for a few arcs we should do fine.
Wano predictions: There will be 5 acts; All Straw Hats will get fights, some in Act 4; Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Carrot will have her moment, but won't join; Yamato will be a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5; Next arc is Mary Geoise.
@Deicide it takes inspiration and hardwork to write any chapter of One Piece: Oda needs to think of interactions, jokes, set ups, content management, and all the technical details and effort that goes into drawing it all. And writing the start of a new arc also comes with many challenges too. Nothing writes itself.
If Oda "lost it", anything in the future can be bad... or simply bland uninspired stuff.
@theackwardstation I think Wano's problem was the bloated amount of characters and plots. Too much stuff to cover at once, so he had to cut everything that was remotely important (which boils down to minor fights, character interactions, character explorations and slow moments).
I feel Oda was also fadigued by Wano and eager to start something new and refreshing.
Wano predictions: There will be 5 acts; All Straw Hats will get fights, some in Act 4; Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Carrot will have her moment, but won't join; Yamato will be a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5; Next arc is Mary Geoise.
@Deicide I'm optimistic because I actually think Oda's been writing a lot of good scenes lately, even if there's the issue of "offscreening" other stuff... which, in fact, as you said, doesn't need to be a problem after Wano.
Unless I missed it, there's no in-universe reason Luffy didn't say goodbye to Momo and Kin. It's just there because Wano needed an emotional ending. And I'm annoyed at Yamato not joining. That's one heck of an 180 after all signs pointed to it happening. Well, at least it's over. Wano's not a bad arc but I think it went on way too long.
NNID: jervinnectar
