One Piece 723: Change of plans

Cyan D. Funk

ahahaahahahaha fucking lol at that signature

Ravaha

Why did you ignore my post of Cannon?

I wasnt, your post backs up exactly what Hachi Said. Mariejois is directly above Fishman Island and Shabondy. The path to Mariejois does not equal the exact center of it. An admiral was deployed to Shabondy in less than an hour from Marineford. Are you claiming Mariejois is a tiny spot only above one single place and cannot be above 2 points that are rediculously close together? How long did it take for an admiral to arrive on Shabondy? How long did it take for Law to get there?

DRAGONPIECEZ

I got chills on that last page where Sanji came and intervened. Yes, he mostly acknowledges women as his main motivation for rescue to keep up appearances. But what many Sanji haters don't seem to recognize is that when the shit hits the fan, he's all about the whole crew. There is evidence of it throughout the series and there's a grade A example of it in this chapter.

asm00200

@Ravaha:

Thanks for providing a link that proves they are right next to one another. It took Law no time at all to sail from Shabondy to Marineford. Your link just shows how close they all are to one another. I forgot about that panel, thanks it just further backs up what I have been saying and what Hachi was claiming in the earlier pages I posted.

At no time did Oda show the Red Line ine the background of both Shabondy or Marineford (which is much closer to Mariejois, I should add).

Here, the island where Duval was introduced is FIVE KILOMETERS away from Shabondy… so, the Red Line would at least be 15 km away from Shabondy: http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/24917_one-piece-chapter-491/page_10

Ravaha

The red line is under the water as well. You are missing that. Think of it as a continental shelf with a hole in it. That hole leads to Fishman Island That whole shelf is the red line. The red line is a barrier. Land above the water isnt considered a barrier as much as the land below the water that prevents ship and fish to travel from ocean to ocean.

asm00200

@Ravaha:

I wasnt, your post backs up exactly what Hachi Said. Mariejois is directly above Fishman Island and Shabondy. The path to Mariejois does not equal the exact center of it. An admiral was deployed to Shabondy in less than an hour from Marineford.

Check again! And where did you get the HOUR from?

Are you claiming Mariejois is a tiny spot only above one single place and cannot be above 2 points that are rediculously close together?

10 to 15 KM!!!

Ravaha

@asm00200:

Check again! And where did you get the HOUR from?

10 to 15 KM!!!

Read my previous post and the page you linked and the pages I linked. The Red Line isnt just a barrier that prevents travel on the surface. It is also a barrier that prevents travel at the bottom of the ocean with the exception of a small hole that leads to Fishman Island.

Monkey King

@Ravaha:

He is ignoring Cannon directly from the manga that has pictures and everything clearly illustrated. I agree with you that BB battle will be the Climax of the manga and not the ending of the manga. Apparently Monkey King doesnt know the difference between the climax and the ending because he tried claiming I was using it wrong. Unless he was trying to say i dont know what an orgasm is, then that would be very immature, dumb, and trying to insult me because he has nothing to back up his claims. In either case he is wrong.

Climax is the final action and plot events, all that comes after is just conclusion and wrap up.
If Blackbeard is the climatic villain, then he is the final villain.
Also it's "canon". You're spelling it wrong and randomly capitalizing it for no reason.

Thanks for providing a link that proves they are right next to one another. It took Law no time at all to sail from Shabondy to Marineford.

So how long did the Marineford battle take.

Your link just shows how close they all are to one another. I forgot about that panel, thanks it just further backs up what I have been saying and what Hachi was claiming in the earlier pages I posted.

What you're saying is physically impossible, so no you're still wrong.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Ravaha:

Mariejois is directly above … Shabondy. The path to Mariejois does not equal the exact center of it. An admiral was deployed to Shabondy in less than an hour from Marineford. Are you claiming Mariejois is a tiny spot only above one single place and cannot be above 2 points that are rediculously close together? How long did it take for an admiral to arrive on Shabondy? How long did it take for Law to get there?

I can drive to New York in about an hour if the traffic is good. I live near Bridgeport. Get a map. See that distance? If New York exploded would Bridgeport explode? No.

asm00200

@Ravaha:

The red line is under the water as well. You are missing that. Think of it as a continental shelf with a hole in it. That hole leads to Fishman Island That whole shelf is the red line. The red line is a barrier. Land above the water isnt considered a barrier as much as the land below the water that prevents ship and fish to travel from ocean to ocean.

"It's like a chair that's turned upside down, both the front and the back legs are above what you put your back on"–> This is the only way that Shabondy and Mariejois can be considered above Fishman Island... but even then we can never use the word "directly above" because that's just wrong!!

Furthermore, I'm surprised that you think Shabondy will be destroyed by the destruction of Mariejois, yet you left Marineford which is literally right next to it!?

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Ravaha:

Read my previous post and the page you linked and the pages I linked. The Red Line isnt just a barrier that prevents travel on the surface. It is also a barrier that prevents travel at the bottom of the ocean with the exception of a small hole that leads to Fishman Island.

I know what the Red Line is and what it does and does not allow… that doesn't prove anything.

Monkey King

@asm00200:

Check again! And where did you get the HOUR from?

An hour is fine lol. Trust me he still loses.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Ravaha:

Read my previous post and the page you linked and the pages I linked. The Red Line isnt just a barrier that prevents travel on the surface. It is also a barrier that prevents travel at the bottom of the ocean with the exception of a small hole that leads to Fishman Island.

The Red Line doesn't prevent travel on the surface, just sea travel on the surface.

Ravaha

@Monkey:

Climax is the final action and plot events, all that comes after is just conclusion and wrap up.
If Blackbeard is the climatic villain, then he is the final villain.
Also it's "canon". You're spelling it wrong and randomly capitalizing it for no reason.

So how long did the Marineford battle take.

What you're saying is physically impossible, so no you're still wrong.

Please prove I am wrong with pages from the One Piece manga. I have provided pages that illustrate and say that you are wrong and that I am right. A story can have multiple Climaxes and endings can be more than just a wrap up. The wrap up can also be of great importance. So you are saying the Climax is the end of One Piece and whatever comes after it doesnt matter because it is just tying up lose ends and wrapping everything together?

I and many others here are of the opinion that Akainu and others in the WG are more of a Villain to Luffy and Robin than BB is.
@asm00200:

"It's like a chair that's turned upside down, both the front and the back legs are above what you put your back on"–> This is the only way that Shabondy and Mariejois can be considered above Fishman Island... but even then we can never use the word "directly above" because that's just wrong!!

Furthermore, I'm surprised that you think Shabondy will be destroyed by the destruction of Mariejois, yet you lift Marineford which is literally right next to it!?

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

I know what the Red Line is and what it does and does not allow... that doesn't prove anything.

The manga illustrates them as clearly directly above and directly below one another. The manga states that, not me. Hachii is the one who said it in the manga. You are arguing with Oda not me…........

square

Pretty hilarious he put something like that in his signature.

Haros

^and he claims that he proves his points with pages from manga all you need to do is check his signature and you see he is hallucinating

desa

Having a Monkey King quote in your signature really is becoming popular.

asm00200

@Ravaha:

The manga illustrates them as clearly directly above and directly below one another. The manga states that, not me. Hachii is the one who said it in the manga. You are arguing with Oda not me…........

Ok, stop using the word "directly" and I'll agree that they are both above sea water and thus above FI.

soul_king_brook

@Monkey:

So I don't think you understand what symbolism is because as a narrative unit? Like if we got out the gear and measured it? It outweights the crap out of everything else.
Blackbeard being given symbolic contrast with Luffy is the number one thing pointing to his role as the final villain. And I mean final final.
Because symbolism plays into the POINT of the series. How Oda wants to make Luffy the hero who fits his quest, how Oda wants to comment on his ultimate message of the series, how Oda wants to wrap it altogether.
Blackbeard plays into ALL of that. It's why he pretty much HAS TO be the final villain.

You can't brush that aside as marginally important, it's incredibly important. And no such thing at all has been established with the Gorusei or Akainu. Or friggin' Coby.

I agree he is a dark luffy.

What do YOU think One Piece is about anyway? What's the main theme? Right now it looks like you're just looking at it all superficially, as a series of actions that lead to other actions. Would you say Blackbeard isn't directly plugged into the main point in his way?
And my whole point is that being Pirate King is about a lot more than reaching Raftel. And that as you just said, Blackbeard has ambitions far larger than prestige (he's never shown interest in that) and simply the same exact thing Luffy does.
Reminder, this is not my interpretation. Oda already established that Luffy has his own view of what being Pirate King means, the most free person in the sea.
So given that, what do you think Blackbeard wants out of Raftel. Do you really think it's just an adventure and freedom?

I hope you agree to the point that there is no such title as pirate king i.e. it is just a name that civilians called Roger because he did the impossible, the thing that was never done before, he reached raftel.
so when anyone who says I want to become Pirate King,it would mean that I want to reach raftel

Having said that PK is a imaginary title BB thoughts about who a PK may differ(like luffy's guy with most freedom) but not what he should do, to become one.
So even if BB has different idea about a pirate king, cannot become one after luffy reaches raftel.
Edit:
So if Blackbeard means something else by saying he wants to be a PK,yeah he can still have his ambtion after luffy reached raftel,
So till it is confirmed in the manga what BB actually wants and what he thinks One Piece is , I cannot agree with the fact he will be the final villan, as the BB showed till now has nothing to do with history (which will play imp. part in the War) except that he is also a 'D'. So what you say is currently one of the possibility that may happen .

Final war. And it does not have to have just two players. It would most likely be many sided.

Agreed.

Oda is a fan of a series called "Dragonball" you may have heard of before.
In this series there is a major quest (several times over) to collect magical balls.
But once you complete the quest, even if you beat someone else to it? There's a chance that the reward can be stolen out from under you, with the wish being intercepted by someone else. This was attempted several times in Dragonball.
Do you see what I'm getting at here?

I dont think you can compare DB with One Piece, I believe OP is more complex Story than DB, and I am sorry i dont get where you are getting at.

He hasn't.
Coby looks up to Luffy like a big brother.

Yes, he may be.

benjamminbrown

@Ravaha:

Please prove I am wrong with pages from the One Piece manga. I have provided pages that illustrate and say that you are wrong and that I am right. A story can have multiple Climaxes and endings can be more than just a wrap up. The wrap up can also be of great importance. So you are saying the Climax is the end of One Piece and whatever comes after it doesnt matter because it is just tying up lose ends and wrapping everything together?

I and many others here are of the opinion that Akainu and others in the WG are more of a Villain to Luffy and Robin than BB is.

The manga illustrates them as clearly directly above and directly below one another. The manga states that, not me. Hachii is the one who said it in the manga. You are arguing with Oda not me…........

The manga page that asm provided where Elder Nyon is talking about the Gates of Justice does not depict Mariejois as being above either Marineford or Shabondy. It is a map. Up and down in that map probably correspond to the cardinal directions of Northwest and Southeast, respectively.

Do you understand maps?

edit: Double checked and corrected my directions. Really, the best argument is what MK keeps saying: You can't see the Redline from Shabondy. If Mariejois is on top of the Red Line, how could it be above Shabondy?

Monkey King

@Ravaha:

Please prove I am wrong with pages from the One Piece manga.

Imagine I posted every single panel taking place on Saobody here, because in none of them is the Red Line visible lol.

I have provided pages that illustrate and say that you are wrong and that I am right.

You provided proof that you are blind, autistically literalist, and believe in impossible geographical facts.

A story can have multiple Climaxes

Acts have climaxes, arcs have climaxes. But we weren't talking about arcs and acts. We were talking about the entire story.

and endings can be more than just a wrap up.

Yeah they can leave things open ended etc.
But they don't include another climax loll.

The wrap up can also be of great importance. So you are saying the Climax is the end of One Piece and whatever comes after it doesnt matter because it is just tying up lose ends and wrapping everything together?

Resolutions are of great importance, but they aren't climaxes. They are of a completely different nature.
Why are you so ignorant of plot structure lol.

I and many others here are of the opinion that Akainu and others in the WG are more of a Villain to Luffy and Robin than BB is.

Akainu is the least likely of all to be the final villain. The entire basis of that is on the incredibly stupid premise that avenging Ace is the main point of the story.
The Gorusei are more credible but there are many reasons they don't work.
I've crushed the arguments for both of them many times over in the theory thread, just do a thread search for my posts in there.
Also Robin isn't the main character, fyi.

The manga illustrates them as clearly directly above and directly below one another. The manga states that, not me. Hachii is the one who said it in the manga. You are arguing with Oda not me…........

So just to reiterate, you think Mariejois and the Red Line are floating above Saobody somehow. Just want to be sure on this.

benjamminbrown

^ Sure is a lot of sky and sunshine at Shabondy for a place buried under an entire continent.

Monkey King

@soul_king_brook:

I hope you agree to the point that there is no such title as pirate king i.e. it is just a name that civilians called Roger because he did the impossible, the thing that was never done before, he reached raftel.
so when anyone who says I want to become Pirate King,it would mean that I want to reach raftel

Luffy has already displayed a personal meaning to what he thinks that title means, and what he wants to really be.

Having said that PK is a imaginary title BB thoughts about who a PK may differ(like luffy's guy with most freedom) but not what he should do, to become one.
So even if BB has different idea about a pirate king,he cannot become one after luffy reaches raftel.

Except what he feels he needs to do IS up to interpretation. Not just what he thinks it means.
Blackbeard is probably very very interested in the revelations.

I dont think you can compare DB with One Piece, I believe OP is more complex Story than DB, and I am sorry i dont get where you are getting at.

One Piece is far more complicated yes. My point was just to compare a sort of plot trope.
The hero (or villain) getting the object of desire, but having it taken from them in some fashion by their foe just as they get it.

I'm suggesting, Luffy reaches Raftel, Robin reaches the Real Poneglyph, but the Blackbeards, true to their actual goal can still arrive and do something like find out dangerous secrets regarding the ancient kingdom.
Recall, Blackbeard is a D. Suggesting he too has ties to the Ancient Kingdom.

andre

I can't think of a thematic reason for why Shaboady would be destroyed? The slave traders? Would that even be necessary after Mariajoas is taken down, though?

Pirate Bartolomeo

@andre:

I can't think of a thematic reason for why Shaboady would be destroyed? The slave traders? Would that even be necessary after Mariajoas is taken down, though?

the slaves shop already close after luffy punched the CD

Schabrak

The Redline is like ten km above sea level, it's literally impossible to not see it from Shaobody if it's really that near.
Ravaha you come over as stupid with all those false assertions. edit: Mentally retarded is the better choice because you didn't even understood what's in your posted pages.

@Ravaha:

The manga illustrates them as clearly directly above and directly below one another. The manga states that, not me. Hachii is the one who said it in the manga. You are arguing with Oda not me…........

It does not, learn to read and look.

@Hacchi:

Hacchan: It's pretty much right underneath Mariejoa itself. / You just head straight down about ten thousand metres to the ocean floor, and it's right there!! It's a great place!

Nowhere in your links in your signature does it talk about SA, nowhere. Your sig is prove that you are wrong and you even proudly put it there, oh my.

Couldn't do it even more basic.

Master Luffy

I saw the spoilers are out today!

Can someone confirm if the chapter can come out tomorrow, or we have to wait for Wednesday?

Monkey King

@Pirate:

the slaves shop already close after luffy punched the CD

Pretty damn sure there was more than one slave shop considering there was a huge slave trade.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Master:

I saw the spoilers are out today!

Can someone confirm if the chapter can come out tomorrow, or we have to wait for Wednesday?

They're actually gonna be out at the start of next month thanks to a spoiler provider strike. Log back in when November comes.

Master Luffy

They're actually gonna be out at the start of next month thanks to a spoiler provider strike. Log back in when November comes.

I don't understand what do you mean?

Dryish

@Master:

I don't understand what do you mean?

It was reported that the chapter would be released a couple of days earlier, so we're expecting scanlations to show up sometime tomorrow.

Master Luffy

@Toraish:

It was reported that the chapter would be released a couple of days earlier, so we're expecting scanlations to show up sometime tomorrow.

Well, thank you for the info! I could not be active in the forum to read the report.

@MonkeyKing :there is no need for sarcasm..

CCC

@Master:

I saw the spoilers are out today!

Can someone confirm if the chapter can come out tomorrow, or we have to wait for Wednesday?

There is a need when week after week people start talking about spoilers and chapter release timeframes in the previous week's chapter thread, and then I or someone else has to come in here and tell you it's explicitly and implictly against the rules to do that, in addition to being really annoying.

My first instinct was to just delete your post without saying anything, but then you wouldn't learn. So that's why sarcasm is necessary.

So once again, here we go!
All posts about spoilers/the next chapter in this thread from this point on will be deleted.

Master Luffy

@CCC:

There is a need when week after week people start talking about spoilers and chapter release timeframes in the previous week's chapter thread, and then I or someone else has to come in here and tell you it's explicitly and implictly against the rules to do that, in addition to being really annoying.

My first instinct was to just delete your post without saying anything, but then you wouldn't learn. So that's why sarcasm is necessary.

So once again, here we go!
All posts about spoilers/the next chapter in this thread from this point on will be deleted.

Well, I am sorry as I did not know such a rule existed! (I am aware to not talk about the spoilers outside of the spoiler thread though)
Would you mind telling me in which thread I can make questions for the next chapter? Thanks, and sorry once again you can delete the post.

Schabrak

In the spoiler thread for 724 obviously.^^

**To those of you who have the tl;dr attitude, here's a bloody list for you:

HERE IS WHAT WE CONSIDER SPOILER LEAK (included, but not limited to):

posting spoiler outside spoiler forum

posting FAKE spoiler outside spoiler forum

ASKING about spoilers outside spoiler forum (use PM if you don't know where it is)

posting a REACTION to the spoiler outside spoiler forum

posting a REACTION to the FAKE spoiler outside spoiler forum

posting a REACTION to someone ASKING about the spoiler outside spoiler forum

changing your avatar/signature/talking habit as a response to the spoiler**

7. NO WHINING ABOUT NEW CHAPTER
that's pretty self-explanatory. new topics with title "omg i cant wait for next chapter!!!!!111" will not be tolerated. if you can't wait, that's too bad for you. if you feel the need to express the fact that you can't wait, you have your pets or parents or even neighbors for that, but not here. if you feel the need to discuss something, USE THE NEWEST CHAPTER THREAD.

Those sticky threads at the top of each and every forum containing the word rules are to be read before you start visiting the threads below.
http://apforums.net/showthread.php?t=9829

TheCrystalShip

Did MK really spend all that time arguing with somebody who thought that Sabaody was under Mariejois and above Fishman Island? Like really? How does one come to that conclusion?

Schabrak

Nobody knows, because no rational reason was given.

Ravaha

@Schabrak:

The Redline is like ten km above sea level, it's literally impossible to not see it from Shaobody if it's really that near.
Ravaha you come over as stupid with all those false assertions. edit: Mentally retarded is the better choice because you didn't even understood what's in your posted pages.

It does not, learn to read and look.

Nowhere in your links in your signature does it talk about SA, nowhere. Your sig is prove that you are wrong and you even proudly put it there, oh my.

Couldn't do it even more basic.
http://i3.minus.com/ijuVkDFVv2nLb.png

Im talking about a huge explosion that would destroy the Red Line. Something that huge would obviously destroy Things close by like Marineford and Shabondy. They are right next to eachother. That woulc be like your neighbor setting off 100 pounds of TNT and claiming it your house isnt right next to the explosion. OR setting off 100 pounds of TNT under your neighbors and claiming your house wasnt directly above the blast when your house is sitting in the crater of it. In perspective to the theory and such a huge explosion, Marineford and The archipelago are going to be above the explosion and destroyed. Shabondy is right next to the red line and every character has stated its above fishman island, even though it might be a few miles towards the red line. Its dumb to argue over semantics like that and Monkey King was trying to claim the Red line is some large distance away to not be affected by the Red Line being obliterated. If the Red line was obliterated so would everything within 100 miles of it.

Also Monkey King is saying your drawing is not accurate because you cannot see Mariejois from the Shabondy arc pages. What do you think would happen to Marineford and Shabondy if the Red Line was destroyed?

Panda Bear

@Schabrak:

In the spoiler thread for 724 obviously.^^

Those sticky threads at the top of each and every forum containing the word rules are to be read before you start visiting the threads below.
http://apforums.net/showthread.php?t=9829

In fairness – and with apologies to CCC for giving him more posts to have to moderate -- he really wasn't breaking any of those rules. He certainly couldn't really have been construed to have been 'whining' about the chapter; he simply asked if early spoilers indicated an early release, which is, honestly, a pretty valid query. I suppose you could say that simply mentioning that the spoilers are out within this thread is toeing a line, but even then, he isn't talking about the spoilers, per se, but simply their existence.

As for suggesting he ask whether he should expect the next chapter early within the spoiler thread, that would be a fair idea, if not for the very possible scenario of him not wishing to spoil himself.

CCC has spoken, and I'm not one to want to undermine a moderator's authority, but I do rather think the rest of you guys are being a little hard on him for asking what is ultimately a pretty harmless question.

@TheCrystalShip:

Did MK really spend all that time arguing with somebody who thought that Sabaody was under Mariejois and above Fishman Island?

Honestly, having come in in the middle of that whole nonsense, my first reaction was to be really confused as to why everybody was dog-piling the guy for saying that Mariejois was directly over Fishman Island, considering that was more or less directly stated in the manga.

Then I went through the posts a little bit more closely, and discovered that he was including Sabaody as being in between them, and that explained that.

CCC

@Panda:

snip

As I said, I wasn't actually going to do anything this time, for a singleton. Usually there's a 5+ poster pileup asking about spoilers/release dates (and then another cluster again after a mod comments).
But he wanted to know why MK responded with sarcasm.

IMO, if you want to ask about that stuff, you can do it in the spoiler thread.

Ravaha

@Panda:

In fairness – and with apologies to CCC for giving him more posts to have to moderate -- he really wasn't breaking any of those rules. He certainly couldn't really have been construed to have been 'whining' about the chapter; he simply asked if early spoilers indicated an early release, which is, honestly, a pretty valid query. I suppose you could say that simply mentioning that the spoilers are out within this thread is toeing a line, but even then, he isn't talking about the spoilers, per se, but simply their existence.

As for suggesting he ask whether he should expect the next chapter early within the spoiler thread, that would be a fair idea, if not for the very possible scenario of him not wishing to spoil himself.

CCC has spoken, and I'm not one to want to undermine a moderator's authority, but I do rather think the rest of you guys are being a little hard on him for asking what is ultimately a pretty harmless question.

Honestly, having come in in the middle of that whole nonsense, my first reaction was to be really confused as to why everybody was dog-piling the guy for saying that Mariejois was directly over Fishman Island, considering that was more or less directly stated in the manga.

Then I went through the posts a little bit more closely, and discovered that he was including Sabaody as being in between them, and that explained that.

I am not talking about a straight line though. I am talking about if a blast destroying Fishman Island, Mariejois, and the whole red line. A blast that big would put things in perspective. Monkey king was trying to argue that the archepelago would be unharmed. He also stated Marineford would also be fine…......

NER

@CCC:

As I said, I wasn't actually going to do anything this time, for a singleton. Usually there's a 5+ poster pileup asking about spoilers/release dates (and then another cluster again after a mod comments).
But he wanted to know why MK responded with sarcasm.

IMO, if you want to ask about that stuff, you can do it in the spoiler thread.

But.. assuming that I want to ask, I really can't go to the spoiler thread because I don't want the content of the chapter spoiled for me.

Cant you guys just stick the approximate dates of chapters "release" somewhere? I think it'll pretty much be a good solution to end the weekly trend of people asking about when the chapter is coming out

Monkey King

@Ravaha:

Im talking about a huge explosion that would destroy the Red Line. Something that huge would obviously destroy Things close by like Marineford and Shabondy.

Being close by doesn't have to mean as close as you seem to think.
Again, do you think that if New York City exploded, that Bridgeport CT would also be exploded. We're talking about an hour away via car.
In reality no, but do YOU imagine that this would be the case? Because you sure seem to!

They are right next to eachother. That woulc be like your neighbor setting off 100 pounds of TNT and

Except they aren't right next to eachother since Red Line, the massive rock wall, was not visible from either one. They are different settlements close to eachother. Much like a small city like Bridgeport is close to a massive city like New York.
That area is like a metro area.
We have the capital of the One Piece world (many miles up), the army headquarters city of Marineford, and a civilian city of Saobody. All within one aquatic metro area.
Like these.
Being of relation, proximity, importance, and interdependency does not mean DIRECTLY NEXT TO.

In perspective to the theory and such a huge explosion, Marineford and The archipelago are going to be above the explosion and destroyed.

Wait now BOTH Marineford and Saobody are directly above Fishman Island?? And under Mariejois?? lolllllll

Shabondy is right next to the red line

Not close enough for an explosion to effect it.

and every character has stated its above fishman island,

But Fishman Island is below the Red Line and Mariejois…it is literally impossible for it to be directly above Fishman Island.
You're also ignoring that the Strawhats were making mostly forward movement on their trip underwater, with about two major points of near vertical movement. So they unquestionably moved AWAY from Saobody for quite a long time before reaching Fishman Island.
How do you explain THAT.

even though it might be a few miles towards the red line.

If it was a few miles where the fuck is the Red Line in all three of those volumes at Saobody lol.

Its dumb to argue over semantics like that

SEMANTICS lol.
You're the one arguing semantics! All you're going off is a pointlessly literalist interpretation of words. While people shove visual and physics based evidence in your face!

If the Red line was obliterated so would everything within 100 miles of it.

And what are you basing that on?

CCC

@NER:

Cant you guys just stick the approximate dates of chapters "release" somewhere? I think it'll pretty much be a good solution to end the weekly trend of people asking about when the chapter is coming out

The thing is, we never really know. Sometimes we think it's coming a day early, but then it doesn't. Other times the release is delayed several hours past the typical release time. And it seems to have no connection to the time of the spoiler release.
A difference of 24 hours in OP release really shouldn't be such a big deal that anyone NEEDS to ask about it, when nobody even knows. Hopefully you're not planning your wife going into labor around it.
But if you MUST, feel free to ask in the spoiler thread. That's honestly just too bad if you don't want to be spoiled.

And lookit that. We have another multi-post pileup about nothing to do with the chapter.

On-topic: Sabaody isn't directly under Mariejois. That's silly.

Panda Bear

@NER:

Cant you guys just stick the approximate dates of chapters "release" somewhere? I think it'll pretty much be a good solution to end the weekly trend of people asking about when the chapter is coming out

Well, to turn right around and argue the other side, I think there's a couple of reasons this wouldn't really work very well.

First of all, in the vast majority of cases, we get each chapter at roughly the same time every week, so making a post to say so wouldn't really serve much purpose; this is also why, by and large, people asking about when the chapter will come out are nothing more than impatient nuisances.

Beyond that, though, for those relatively infrequent times when the chapter comes out early or late, the simple fact of the matter is that there's no good way of being able to say exactly when scans will be out. It does seem like you're aware of this, given your reference to 'approximate' dates, but it seems you may not have thought of one of the implications of this fact. To wit, if there is an 'official' post on when to expect the next chapter release, then – no matter how clearly it states that the date is approximate -- the moment said date should come, and the chapter not yet be out, there will almost undoubtedly be far more people asking why the chapter isn't out yet, and when they can expect it, than there otherwise would be.

Ravaha

@Monkey:

Being close by doesn't have to mean as close as you seem to think.
Again, do you think that if New York City exploded, that Bridgeport CT would also be exploded. We're talking about an hour away via car.
In reality no, but do YOU imagine that this would be the case? Because you sure seem to!

Except they aren't right next to eachother since Red Line, the massive rock wall, was not visible from either one. They are different settlements close to eachother. Much like a small city like Bridgeport is close to a massive city like New York.
That area is like a metro area.
We have the capital of the One Piece world (many miles up), the army headquarters city of Marineford, and a civilian city of Saobody. All within one aquatic metro area.
Like these.
Being of relation, proximity, importance, and interdependency does not mean DIRECTLY NEXT TO.

Wait now BOTH Marineford and Saobody are directly above Fishman Island?? And under Mariejois?? lolllllll

Not close enough for an explosion to effect it.

But Fishman Island is below the Red Line and Mariejois…it is literally impossible for it to be directly above Fishman Island.
You're also ignoring that the Strawhats were making mostly forward movement on their trip underwater, with about two major points of near vertical movement. So they unquestionably moved AWAY from Saobody for quite a long time before reaching Fishman Island.
How do you explain THAT.

If it was a few miles where the fuck is the Red Line in all three of those volumes at Saobody lol.

SEMANTICS lol.
You're the one arguing semantics! All you're going off is a pointlessly literalist interpretation of words. While people shove visual and physics based evidence in your face!

And what are you basing that on?

http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25040_one-piece-chapter-602/page_15
The name if this chapter is "Rudder Straight Down"
http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25041_one-piece-chapter-603/page_7
They are right off the coast of Shabondy
http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25042_one-piece-chapter-604/page_2 This is probably the lowest zone whales and most other fish travel to. The Fishman Island red line hole is another 9000m deeper.
http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25042_one-piece-chapter-604/page_12
This explains how they are not moving almost anywhere but down. The currents where they are are rediculously slow. Previous pages also commented how slow the currents are. It also explains the currents they are trying to catch are almost entirely downward.
http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25042_one-piece-chapter-604/page_13

All these things point to their travel as almost entirely downward until the very end.
http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25042_one-piece-chapter-604/page_15
This is the almost completely downward current they take to 10k meters deep.

So how was their movement even remotely close to being "mostly forward"? Several times they mentioned that they were basically not moving anywhere but down and that the ocean currents in that area were ridiculously slow.

NER

@CCC:

The thing is, we never really know. Sometimes we think it's coming a day early, but then it doesn't. Other times the release is delayed several hours past the typical release time. And it seems to have no connection to the time of the spoiler release.
A difference of 24 hours in OP release really shouldn't be such a big deal that anyone NEEDS to ask about it, when nobody even knows. Hopefully you're not planning your wife going into labor around it.

And lookit that. We have another multi-post pileup about nothing to do with the chapter.

On-topic: Sabaody isn't directly under Mariejois. That's silly.

Hmm, I was just thinking about something more in general, to keep people from asking, not the specific time or anything.
But yeah, you do as what you see fit, and its not like I care, the chapter is coming when the chapter is coming and knowing won't change anything. :P

On-topic: No matter how anyone try to interpert it, how is Sabaody supposed to be under anything? |:

Schabrak

@Ravaha:

I am not talking about a straight line though. I am talking about if a blast destroying Fishman Island, Mariejois, and the whole red line. A blast that big would put things in perspective. Monkey king was trying to argue that the archepelago would be unharmed. He also stated Marineford would also be fine…......

Because it would unless part are falling further away than it's high. Ten km seem high if you are right beside the Redline, but the ocean is so far more wast in size that the distance between the Redline and Marineford/Sabaody is far bigger than the potential distance pieces could fall upon.
@Ravaha:

Also Monkey King is saying your drawing is not accurate because you cannot see Mariejois from the Shabondy arc pages. What do you think would happen to Marineford and Shabondy if the Red Line was destroyed?

Just because we can see those two on a basic shematic doesn't mean a normal human would be capable of doing so. The green and red lines are still very far apart from each other. Even one of those roots has a gigantic diameter, think about that.

At least not obliterate a whole archipelago. I don't like the idea of something that big exploding to begin with as that doesn't make any sense anyway. Thousands if not hundreds of thousands innocents would die because of that. It's not like MJ and SA are only full of criminals or villainous that are allowed to die, and even if they are evil, who gave someone the right to take so many lives? Oo

@Ravaha:

All these things point to their travel as almost entirely downward until the very end. This is the almost completely downward current they take to 10k meters deep.

Imagine what would change if it only deviated by one single degree over ten kilometers, do it once, do it again with two instead of one and remember your own words.

Monkey King

@Ravaha:

http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25040_one-piece-chapter-602/page_15
The name if this chapter is "Rudder Straight Down"

lolll, I don't think fiction is your thing brosef

http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25041_one-piece-chapter-603/page_7
They are right off the coast of Shabondy

And then those roots vanish, and we see lots and lots of open seafloor both on the high part and the lower part as they move FORWARD.
I mean jesus christ duder, does the ship look like it's facing straight down to you?
This is the last page we see the roots of Saobody on.
Hmm? Where did those roots go I wonder? It's almost like they moved away from them while going down!

http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25042_one-piece-chapter-604/page_2 This is probably the lowest zone whales and most other fish travel to. The Fishman Island red line hole is another 9000m deeper.

Yo, you either never read Fishman island or skimmed it. There ARE tons of fish and even whales at Fishman Island.
And it's really really obvious that they are both moving down AND forward, the ship is not sinking straight down, your seriously blind if you think that's what's happening.

http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25042_one-piece-chapter-604/page_12
This explains how they are not moving almost anywhere but down.

No in fact that's direct evidence you're wrong lolllll
They're riding a sea current TOWARD the wall of the Red Line and the trench where they have to go down to reach Fishman Island.
This is basic rl geography and earth science.
Sea currents exist and they go down at certain points where they reach a lower current that goes another direction.
Look at directly what Nami is saying "we're GOING TO". They are not on the downward current yet! They're moving TOWARD it.
It's kind of hard to miss this because the entire scene when they first run into the Kraken takes place right at the point where they run into the downward current!

The currents where they are are rediculously slow.

The slow sea current you're thinking of is the deep one! Not the upper one that they're riding on!
Read the manga and take a physical geography class!

Previous pages also commented how slow the currents are. It also explains the currents they are trying to catch are almost entirely downward.
http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/25042_one-piece-chapter-604/page_13

No! It doesn't say that anywhere! Learn to read!

They are riding these!
Does that look mostly vertical to you? No it damn well does not! They're riding a horizontal part of that to the point that it goes down and curls under into a deep sea current, in order to speedily get to the deepest part of the ocean and enter the deep sea trench that leads to Fishman Island!

All these things point to their travel as almost entirely downward until the very end.

Except for…literally everything!!

the almost completely downward current they take to 10k meters deep.

No that's the first downward movement! There's ANOTHER one later! They go down, and then they're on the deep sea floor the next chapter!
They then find the trench to Fishman Island LATER.

Shadowgreed

Doesn't somebody have a graphic explanation for him, it might work If you show him cute images rather than words

CaptainKid

@Monkey:

Pretty damn sure there was more than one slave shop considering there was a huge slave trade.

Yeah but I think there was only one that specifically sold humans and not just giants/mermen/minkmen ect. Maybe I'm wrong but it was named the "ヒューマン (human)" auction house, so it seemed to me like it was the only place where human beings were sold. I think that's why the CD's went there and why it was so popular, then again I might be completely wrong.

Schabrak

@Shadowgreed:

Doesn't somebody have a graphic explanation for him, it might work If you show him cute images rather than words

I can't draw a picture big enough to show that the roots appearing vertical don't matter at all. Understanding the rest about currents etc, might be impossible if he/she hasn't yet, not after MK made it so very clear so often already.

Monkey King

@CaptainKid:

Yeah but I think there was only one that specifically sold humans and not just giants/mermen/minkmen ect. Maybe I'm wrong but it was named the "ヒューマン (human)" auction house, so it seemed to me like it was the only place where human beings were sold. I think that's why the CD's went there and why it was so popular, then again I might be completely wrong.

If a restauraunt says "BURGERS AND FRIES" would you assume it was the only place that sold Burgers and Fries…in the world??

Plus no, we saw a completely different shop while they were searching for where Camie was brought. And there were clearly humans in there.

indigoink

How is this even an argument? Saobody is "above" Fishman Island? Sure, Fishman Island is nearby, and 10,000m underwater. But you seem to be arguing it is DIRECTLY above…? No. Fishman Island is 10,000m underwater in a hole in the Red Line. Mariejois is directly above Fishman Island. Someone already posted this: http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/24951_one-piece-chapter-522/page_10 What more evidence do you need?

As well as the page you also posted http://www.mangainn.com/manga/chapter/24922_one-piece-chapter-496/page_12, what is Hachi talking about when he's pointing straight down? Mariejois. "It's pretty much right underneath Mariejois itself. You just head straight down about 10,000m to the ocean floor and it's right there." Where is the confusion here? He's not saying head straight down from 'our current location Saobody'; he's saying head straight down from Mariejois. All that trajectory stuff which would come into play even if he wasn't explicitly talking about Mariejois (which makes the claim doubly bizarre by the way… "your ship is about to go 10km under the sea to a city on the ocean floor! And you also have to continue forwards for 10km! Both of these are clearly equally dramatic statements! Shall I make a 45 degree angle and point towards the precise geographical location??") is not even necessary.

So anyway. I agree Blackbeard has to be the final villain based on how he has been built up in the narrative in so many ways since his introduction. I'm interested to see how destroying Mariejois i.e. Fishman Island will play out though as presumably that is going to be a massive plot point which will also be near the end of the story. If the argument is about whether destroying Mariejois will also destroy Saobody, if it's 10-15km away that is not going to happen; unless the Eve Tree which is said to be like "the big boss of the Saobody mangroves" is LITERALLY connected to all of those mangrove islands through its roots - which unless I'm mistaken has never been cleared up either way? - and destroying Mariejois/FI kills the Eve tree, and if the Eve tree dies all the mangrove trees die...