[https://mangaplus.shueisha.co.jp/viewer/1006372
There is a misplacement of pages here.](https://mangaplus.shueisha.co.jp/viewer/1006372)
Chapter 973: The Kozuki Clan
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Nice chapter. First in Wano I read withou seeing spoilers first and was glad. So many good things in this one, (like the nunbers tease), but felt they were obscured by the amount of things we didn't see. Like, why did Toki not send Hiyori to the past? And what happened to her?
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I'm most confused by that panel with Denjiro and "Kyoshiro." Maybe I'm just missing the obvious and its supposed to show how he changed, but it looks like 2 separate people to me. I guess I'll need to read through the spoiler thread to figure out what others have thought. As for the chapter, it felt really rushed, but I enjoyed it.
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Kaido is retarded. Chopper-style weird.
That conversation with Momo, the whole situation, is so absurd. As if Kaido doesn't know how to interact with humans. Read the scene loud a couple times and tell me it's not awkward. Kaido: What is your name? (he knows his name)
Momo: Urgh uffff…!
Kaido: Your father is a fool of a lord (as if he's just repeating things he heard somewhere, like a child).
With your death, I presume the Kozuki clan is finished.
Momo: Nooo! Father is a great warrior! One day I will carry this nation on my shoulders!
Kaido: A dream someone else put in your mouth. I didn't realise you were so young... Unless there is some twist coming I consider Kaido a literal dragon (Punk Hazard subject) with a Hito fruit. At least that would explain his behavior and reputation somewhat, with Chopper as a reference.
Really enjoyed Oden hanging out with the kids. Wish we would have gotten more of that during the FB.
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After such a long pause this chap was quite confusing sometimes. Where did Kaido suddenly come from? Why were Inu and Neko fighting, I don't get their problem? Why did Toki decides to die that way?
“As I stand out here in the wonders of the unknown at Hadley, I sort of realize there’s a fundamental truth to our nature: Man must explore!” – David Scott, Moon
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Kaido is retarded. Chopper-style weird.
Maybe he is just drunk. Zoro is not smarter with his one liners and drinking problem.:ninja:
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Kaido is retarded. Chopper-style weird.
That conversation with Momo, the whole situation, is so absurd. As if Kaido doesn't know how to interact with humans. Read the scene loud a couple times and tell me it's not awkward. Kaido: What is your name? (he knows his name)
Momo: Urgh uffff…!
Kaido: Your father is a fool of a lord (as if he's just repeating things he heard somewhere, like a child).
With your death, I presume the Kozuki clan is finished.
Momo: Nooo! Father is a great warrior! One day I will carry this nation on my shoulders!
Kaido: A dream someone else put in your mouth. I didn't realise you were so young... Unless there is some twist coming I consider Kaido a literal dragon (Punk Hazard subject) with a Hito fruit. At least that would explain his behavior and reputation somewhat, with Chopper as a reference.
Really enjoyed Oden hanging out with the kids. Wish we would have gotten more of that during the FB.
It seems to me like there's some conflict in Kaido concerning his defeat to the man and how it happened. It seems silly after such a long flashback, but I'm really looking forward to Kaido's own one at this point. He's fascinating to me and I want to know what makes him tic.
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After such a long pause this chap was quite confusing sometimes. Where did Kaido suddenly come from? Why were Inu and Neko fighting, I don't get their problem? Why did Toki decides to die that way?
Kaido flew there in his dragon form off screen, on his way there he presumably also had a short bout with Ashura & Denjiro seen before. Neko & Inu were fighting about Neko taunting Kaido after Oden survived the 1 hour. Toki was content with dying along with Oden and tried to pass down the prophecy to inspire hope among citizens and scare Orochi.
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Nice chapter. First in Wano I read withou seeing spoilers first and was glad. So many good things in this one, (like the nunbers tease), but felt they were obscured by the amount of things we didn't see. Like, why did Toki not send Hiyori to the past? And what happened to her?
Toki died. Ch. 939 explained why Hiyori didn't travel through time, she was the backup plan to preserve the Kozuki bloodline if Momo died.
After such a long pause this chap was quite confusing sometimes. Where did Kaido suddenly come from? Why were Inu and Neko fighting, I don't get their problem? Why did Toki decides to die that way?
I mean Kaido can fly, is it really that confusing?
And Neko and Inu were fighting due to the argument started in the previous chapter.
As for Toki, I mean, she had two arrows in her back and fell after giving the prophecy, it's kind of out of her hands. Though going off of 920 it does seem like she was content to die that day anyhow
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I'm most confused by that panel with Denjiro and "Kyoshiro." Maybe I'm just missing the obvious and its supposed to show how he changed, but it looks like 2 separate people to me. I guess I'll need to read through the spoiler thread to figure out what others have thought. As for the chapter, it felt really rushed, but I enjoyed it.
Yes, it's a depiction of how much he changed. How he changed is anybody's guess, if you don't want to believe his own statement.:getlost:
“When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it–always.”
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Translation didn't make me see how Hiyori family treated her in a better light.
Must be nice to be a backup plan and be knowingly put through suffering for years, hmm
Why couldn't she time flash them both and have her stay out of Kaidou sight and the entire war if she was to be a back up plan?
Instead she was put into danger in a situation of poverty and when she could die anytime.
Flash forward 20 years and I don't see a difference.
Current situation if she and Momo dies in this arc, it doesn't even matter.
How is she a back up plan if she is going to get involved in 20 years anyway.There was no reason for her to suffer for 20 years.
Such a bad taste to an otherwise good flashback. -
I still think Toki is alive.
She has to be….
Why introduce someone that was alive during the void century just to kill her off in the past.... -
I still think Toki is alive.
She has to be….
Why introduce someone that was alive during the void century just to kill her off in the past....For the eventual void century flashback
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She is Im-Sama. :ninja:
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It seems to me like there's some conflict in Kaido concerning his defeat to the man and how it happened. It seems silly after such a long flashback, but I'm really looking forward to Kaido's own one at this point. He's fascinating to me and I want to know what makes him tic.
Yeah, Oda is deliberately keeping his character obscure, this is not lazy writing.
He still needs to tie Vegapunk to the endgame after all, it wouldn't surprise me if Kaido's backstory will be told when that time comes (again, PH artificial dragons).
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Yes, it's a depiction of how much he changed. How he changed is anybody's guess, if you don't want to believe his own statement.:getlost:
It's a weird panel. No one would be questioning it if it didn't look like it did and if Oda wants that to be the only conclusion, he could have done something to emphasize that dark hair Denjiro is meant to be seen in the foreground and not as a separate person. Oda is really good at clarity in his panels, which is why I'm so curious. Plus, there's the red herring of Zoro's teacher, Koushiro (who possessed the Wado Ichimonji, just like Denjiro did in his first appearance). If Denjiro was 5 years younger than Ki'nemon then it's a perfect match.
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I don't really mind Denjiro being Kyoshiro, I just might have found it cooler if he wasn't and Kyoshiro was more of a rogue with his own agenda.
I wonder if Oda didn't intend for Kyoshiro's hair to be blue like it is in the anime. Because when we see his new hair for the first time it really feels like it suddenly whitened from his rage and emotion. But maybe he just dyed it.
Spoiler:
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Denjiro had the "Wado Ichimonji"?
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Denjiro had the "Wado Ichimonji"?
It's never outright stated, but the sword he carries is identical to the Wado Ichimonji . Greg brought it up at the end of this article.
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I'm having troubles reading the chapter on M+, here is the Viz link for those who need it. https://www.viz.com/shonenjump/one-piece-chapter-973/chapter/20110?action=read
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It's a weird panel. No one would be questioning it if it didn't look like it did and if Oda wants that to be the only conclusion, he could have done something to emphasize that dark hair Denjiro is meant to be seen in the foreground and not as a separate person. Oda is really good at clarity in his panels, which is why I'm so curious. Plus, there's the red herring of Zoro's teacher, Koushiro (who possessed the Wado Ichimonji, just like Denjiro did in his first appearance). If Denjiro was 5 years younger than Ki'nemon then it's a perfect match.
What red herring? That was always a far-fetched theory.
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Great chapter. I kinda had a feeling that Kyoshiro was Denjiro mostly due to the anime have him with the samurais in the current opening in the anime. Also it was nice to see more of Oden's travel with Roger.
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What red herring? That was always a far-fetched theory.
I think Denjiro was designed so we wondered whether he was Koushiro and him having Wado Ichimonji was meant to push some people toward that conclusion even more. This chapter slaps that in the face! I'm not fully convinced there's not something unrevealed about it, though.
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Did he really have "Wado Ichomonji" though? Not really sure.
Maybe Greg had some insider info or maybe he was just speculating like everyone else.
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I think if he had "Wado Ichimonji", Oda would have confirmed it just like he is now confirming that Denjiro became Kyoshiro.
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Koshiro is probably gonna be more related to the guy that actually made Wado Ichimonji (and Emma), Shimotsuki Kozaburo, who left Wano 50 years ago.
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I think One Piece is an ongoing manga.
What would be the point of confirming it now though? Oda even had Zoro and Kyoshiro clash and nothing. -
Kaido is retarded. Chopper-style weird.
That conversation with Momo, the whole situation, is so absurd. As if Kaido doesn't know how to interact with humans. Read the scene loud a couple times and tell me it's not awkward. Kaido: What is your name? (he knows his name)
Momo: Urgh uffff…!
Kaido: Your father is a fool of a lord (as if he's just repeating things he heard somewhere, like a child).
With your death, I presume the Kozuki clan is finished.
Momo: Nooo! Father is a great warrior! One day I will carry this nation on my shoulders!
Kaido: A dream someone else put in your mouth. I didn't realise you were so young... Unless there is some twist coming I consider Kaido a literal dragon (Punk Hazard subject) with a Hito fruit. At least that would explain his behavior and reputation somewhat, with Chopper as a reference.this whole conversation feels like Oda was just referencing the foreshadowing he did, with some lines slapped in to glue this together, he probably didn't want to extend it and the rest of the flashback, that's why it feels nonsensical imo
Kaido: What is your name?
Chapter 701
Kaido: Your father is a fool of a lord
Chapter 819
I still think Toki is alive.
She has to be….
Why introduce someone that was alive during the void century just to kill her off in the past....she exists just so that Oda shows her time-jumping in the void century flashback 200 chapters from now
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Toki died. Ch. 939 explained why Hiyori didn't travel through time, she was the backup plan to preserve the Kozuki bloodline if Momo died.
Mmmmm… ok. Maybe we could have seen an expanded version of this argument, especially in a chapter concering the Kozuki family lineage and it's future.
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What would be the point of confirming it now though? Oda even had Zoro and Kyoshiro clash and nothing.
Do you mean what would be the point of not confirming it now? I don't know.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
she exists just so that Oda shows her time-jumping in the void century flashback 200 chapters from now
I wonder if anyone has her fruit today. In a flashback featuring 2 people with fruits we've seen on other people, it would be fitting for her devil fruit to end up in the plot again.
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Hyori or and child as back up plan… I am amazed that she even survived
To be honest I do not get how after all these years Orochi hasn't managed to kill all scabbards.
Especially Kawamatsu who was captured.
If he really is that paranoid why let him alive?
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What would be the point of confirming it now though? Oda even had Zoro and Kyoshiro clash and nothing.
It's too early to dismiss anything. Considering he doesn't have the same sword any more. Sure, might have changed it to avoid anyone recognizing him, but the fact itself still leaves possibility.
I do think it would only have been fair of Oda to have Zoro recognize Kyoshiro's style or something and Kyoshiro taking notice of Wado that Zoro was using at the time, if there really is some kind of a connection.
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So kyoshiro could have alliance with xdrake. Denjiro trying to get the marines here to help take down kaidou, and that is where sengoku lesson chapter comes in, he keeps contact with drake knowing everything about orochi and kaidou from kyoshiro, and sengoku is the leader of xdrake like he was in charge of corazon that was marine and infiltrated pirate doflamingo. And sengoku tries to get akainu to send marines at wano. Marines are coming, bring on greenbull and fujitora to rain his meteros on the dinosaurs of kaidou.
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Kaido flew there in his dragon form off screen, on his way there he presumably also had a short bout with Ashura & Denjiro seen before. Neko & Inu were fighting about Neko taunting Kaido after Oden survived the 1 hour. Toki was content with dying along with Oden and tried to pass down the prophecy to inspire hope among citizens and scare Orochi.
Thank you very much for your clarification.
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I think Denjiro was designed so we wondered whether he was Koushiro and him having Wado Ichimonji was meant to push some people toward that conclusion even more. This chapter slaps that in the face! I'm not fully convinced there's not something unrevealed about it, though.
Eh, that just sounds like confirmation bias tbh? Unless Oda is calling attention to it himself through another character or what have you, I wouldn't describe that as a red herring. All it has ever been was people thinking they looked similar, and then they ran with that theory. I wouldn't say the manga has done anything to push us in that direction. No one, including Kinemon, has commented on the Wado Ichimonji, or whatever sword Denjiro possesses either.
Koshiro is also in East Blue, we weren't gonna have an arc build towards the 9 Scabbards where one of them isn't even present. Also I'm pretty sure I've read before that the timeline wouldn't match up anyhow. Maybe some connection to Koshiro is still possible, you never know, but I never understood thinking they were one and the same myself.
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Kaido feels that he can break their spirit. So, it's not up to Orochi to kill them. Maybe it's a Rocks thing to take strong outsiders in for your cause. Drake came in and attacked, now he's allowed in the crew. As long as you're tough, he feels he can use you.
The biggest things I take from Kaido
- he considers the way that Luffy goes about being a pirate is like a game, basically Luffy isn't serious
- he considers Oden a fool
- he seems to not be too fond of those who carry on dreams of others
He gives me Doffy vibes in the sense that he might not want to be the PK or something in that lane. Away from that and more to his core, he wants to go out in a grand way, so weapons and the strongest fighters could help him attract that. Anything that could attract his ideal battle. Almost like chasing a thrill to the point he wanted to join the Paramount War and Shanks stopped him.
He comes from a crew that would fight and the strongest survived. Xebec's ambition may have been so grand that he isn't impressed by the next guy coming along with a dream. He's like the ol head that says "back in my day, we fought to the death and loved it". Reminds me of how Kata was willing to hurt himself to even up the fight with Luffy. He even killed Higurashi. There's more to Kaido, but this is my take on him so far.
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Nice chapter altogether, maybe it ends the flashback for good this time and the next one opens on present day Kyoshiro/Hyori. The Kaido/Momo scene is a bit clunky though ("I flew all the way here to end the Kozuki line myself but I turn my heels with all of them still alive") and Denjiro's reveal wasn't anything unexpected, but I still enjoyed it all. Oden & family moments were touching, it wouldn't have hurt to see this earlier. And yes, how Oden's swords ended with Hitetsu is a bit foggy, but that can easily be cleared later with a few flashback panels.
Now we have confirmation of Denjiro's identity, my money for the traitor is still on Kanjuro if it is a Scabbard. Carrot could still be it otherwise, or (tinfoil hat time
), Momonosuke is afraid to shoulder the responsibility his dead parents put on his shoulders and has been secretely undermining his own retainer's efforts all along. -
Something is happening in the cover story so that's nice.
I liked this chapter. It was a fun montage.
So Kaido went ahead to see what Oden's family was made of and was disappointed. And transformed Momo's love for great heights into a fear. I like the guards in the ground and the squished faced of Momo was pretty good.
But is it me or is Kaido weirdly drawn? I feel he is was to lean and at times seems like a quick scribble.
Kappa saving Hiyori was cool. If she was into music I wonder why Hiyori she ended as a prostitute instead. Also I supposed she wandered into the capital to see her father's corpse or something.
Denjiro's transformation was cool. Also I see he took Oden's method to heart of getting followers by simply displaying his strength.
Hiyori really feels like she was treated as the second fiddle of the family.
So did Toki care about the 800 year prophecy or not? I feel her thoughts mean she was just trying to escape misery rather than follow a prophecy.
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I still bet against the odds that Shinobu is running a loooooong con on them.
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@uniaka:
[…]Marines are coming, bring on greenbull and fujitora to rain his meteros on the dinosaurs of kaidou.
uh i'd like that panel, a fitting image for the downfall of kaido's army (higher ups)
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Eh, that just sounds like confirmation bias tbh? Unless Oda is calling attention to it himself through another character or what have you, I wouldn't describe that as a red herring. All it has ever been was people thinking they looked similar, and then they ran with that theory. I wouldn't say the manga has done anything to push us in that direction. No one, including Kinemon, has commented on the Wado Ichimonji, or whatever sword Denjiro possesses either.
Koshiro is also in East Blue, we weren't gonna have an arc build towards the 9 Scabbards where one of them isn't even present. Also I'm pretty sure I've read before that the timeline wouldn't match up anyhow. Maybe some connection to Koshiro is still possible, you never know, but I never understood thinking they were one and the same myself.
Wado Ichimonji is the attention grabber. The sword is where Oda called attention to it, not a character, and that's just as good. It would be confirmation bias if the similarity in appearance was the second piece of evidence, but Wado Ichimonji is the really strong evidence that there's some relation there. One could argue that thinking the sword is Wado Ichimonji is confirmation bias, but Oda has been remarkably consistent about distinctive sword designs and I doubt he'd flub one for who is becoming a pretty important character.
As for the timelines, Denjiro as Koushiro would have worked if Denjiro was a few years younger than Kin'emon. Honestly I don't know what to make of the situation now, but it's definitely interesting and I think there's something that'll connect Koushiro to Wano and Denjiro. (and Kyoushiro has a different sword than Wado Ichimonji, by the way. it has a square guard instead of round)
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I don't think Hiyori was just a back-up plan, though I know that was told her. I think the other important part was that she remained and "suffered" with the people of Wano together just like a few scabbards.
You see, this was brought up by Ashura Doji. If every scabbard and Hiyori and Momo went forward in time, would they still be considered to be one of the people who suffered there? The people would be like Ashura, not so keen on forgiving and not supporting someone, who almost without any hardship just turns up and says, "Hey, I'm gonna rule over Wano, help me defeat this other ruler". Of course, since Momo is a symbol at the moment, he has support. But as this chapter pointed out, he is not sure of his dream either. He could be travelling around the world first, like his father and then be a shogun, until then, Hiyori might take the lead. Or something like that. -
So Hiyori becomes Shogun and Momo becomes full time Pirate? W/o her Kozuki name, Hiyori has gained the love of the people as Komursaki like Toki did in Oden's absence. Momo has the Udon prisoners through Luffy's actions. He has to do something on his own like defeat Orochi or show some sign of honor like his father did.
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Now we have confirmation of Denjiro's identity, my money for the traitor is still on Kanjuro if it is a Scabbard. Carrot could still be it otherwise, or (tinfoil hat time
), Momonosuke is afraid to shoulder the responsibility his dead parents put on his shoulders and has been secretely undermining his own retainer's efforts all along.Maybe it could still be Denjiro. If he was playing his chess game in order for all the parts to fit in properly for a complete success.
Don't forget he let Shimotsuki die. Whether he could have done much about that or not, it at least means he isn't afraid to make some sacrifices.
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I really want to know when Hyori decided to work as prostitute and how Denjiro reacted to it.
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