@indigo~ink:
I was thinking about that, it comes right back to the core double standard issue of how women are objectified for their appearance and treated as overly fragile if they fit the mould, but if they don't fit the mould of femininity their worth as an aesthetic object is reduced and so they are treated as a man.
Yeah it's like we have the full circle here haha. Women are objectified, except when they're not – but then they aren't actually women! That's basically what you'd have to believe to accept that line of thought. However you're right; while I'm having a laugh at that concept in this particular instance, there's definitely this unspoken standard in general where if you make a woman ugly/brutish enough then it's okay to do things to them that you wouldn't do to a "real woman." An argument can probably even be made for this in OP with Alvida (as an isolated incident). I don't mean in OP overall because well, we've been talking about this for a while now lol. But thinking about it, I mean Alvida was actually obsessed with being called beautiful and nothing set her off more than being called an ugly old hag soooo I wonder what that says.
@skeletons_cant_poop:
Did the fat acceptance crybabies just find this thread?
You are a terrible poster and I'm on the verge of banning you. Consider this your first and last warning.
@PirateHunter:
I'm not saying that anything is justified. My point is simply that Zoro's discrimination is based on observation of certain "feminine characteristics." Ms. Monday actually exhibits qualities on the opposite end of that spectrum (overtly "masculine" characteristics)
I'm not making any general points regarding sexism in the real world. That was, I thought obviously, analysis completely contained in the context of Zoro's consistent characterization.
Consistent? How is that consistent? Zoro's like the one SH who has been specifically characterized as gender-indiscriminate since childhood. It's the INCONSISTENCY that's a problem.
@NuFiasco:
I think this topic is overdramatized. It's just Oda having a particular style.
So where are the people boycotting One Piece or calling Oda a disgusting pig? Oh right… there aren't any. The only drama in this thread is by people who lack the maturity to participate in the interesting discussion the rest of us are trying to hold.
@indigo~ink:
That's fine if that's your opinion, I'm sure a lot of people feel that way. For me, I just think it's worth thinking about the effects of such stylistic choices when the manga is so hugely popular. I can't say the representation of women in OP doesn't bother me; sure there are a lot of things that are fine, I don't have a problem with everything. I still think having a critical look at these things is important. Such as why pretty women are treated differently to men or even ugly women, why women are repeatedly given "girly" powers rather than fighting with their own strength, etc etc see the rest of the topic for more detail lol.
This is probably how a lot of us feel. And even without being bothered per se, there can always be interesting analysis and discussion. You can also take tiny, "insignificant" details – about pretty much anything, not just One Piece! -- and spark worthwhile conversation from them. It is miscontextualization to then look at those conversations and claim people are making a big deal out of nothing. If it doesn't interest you; if you just want to see wacky character beating up wacky villains and never have to think about it, this is not the thread for you.