So now One Piece is an RPG? So Luffy has to get a sword and later on find the ultima weapon
Last Two Nakamates (vol. 5)
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@RobbyBevard:
Rhyzkahl. I'm going to save everyone,including yourself, some headaches and temp ban you from this thread. Go back and read it from the start, at least skim it some, and see why tossing around Perona theories, especially now, is a bad idea. Educate yourself a little more on the series, Jonny and Yosaku aren't major traveling companions, and see what other theories have already been thrown out time and time again about "crew positions that need filling".
It's a long thread so I'll give you some proper time to do it. A week seems like a reasonable amount of time without being unfair. You can come back before Christmas. You're free to look at this thread, and post anywhere else on the board in the meantime.
This isn't a punishment, it's for your own benefit, as well as everyone else's.
Am I the only one who sees that he's Agog making he's return. I mean how many person in the world still believes that Perona will join, and would post about it (here in AP out of all places)?
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So now One Piece is an RPG? So Luffy has to get a sword and later on find the ultima weapon
Amazing… U get that from my post? Really??
Anyway just to clarify, what I meant was the character's design / fighting style / archetype follows a certain common stereotype. Which obviously similar to those found in japanese RPGs as well.
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Don't feed the troll
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Don't feed the troll
Ok if we go that way… We need Boa as love interest for the main character at the crew and Robin can fill they flying stereotype in some way.
And of course the calm, sensei-like stereotype
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Ingenious theory.
Very lolworthy post, maybe bioware have been collaborating with Oda since the beginning.
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Wow. U guys really saw it that way huh? Oh well. can't be helped then I guess.
Don't feed the troll
LOL. just curious, by troll did u mean me?
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Wow. U guys really saw it that way huh? Oh well. can't be helped then I guess.
The manga is about pirates, equating roles to stuff out of Faerun will obviously make people see it like that.
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The manga is about pirates, equating roles to stuff out of Faerun will obviously make people see it like that.
True. Its about pirates and I'm not saying its the exact same as RPG or anything. Like I said, its a common stereotype, a certain theme that a lot of people use when creating characters in a team/group, especially those that involves fighting.
Try it urself, try designing a large team (prolly around 10-20 people), with their own unique design and abilities. U'll find urself following a couple (if not all) of the same pattern (stereotype) I listed in my post
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True. Its about pirates and I'm not saying its the exact same as RPG or anything. Like I said, its a common stereotype, a certain theme that a lot of people use when creating characters in a team/group, especially those that involves fighting.
Try it urself, try designing a large team (prolly around 10-20 people), with their own unique design and abilities. U'll find urself following a couple (if not all) of the same pattern (stereotype) I listed in my post
You are generalizing various roles under one term, like swordman, barbarian and bare hand fighter. There are certain combinations you can do in RPG's which are restricted to what you have available, unlike in One Piece which is not as restricted as RPG's, due to the devil fruits and weapons and the actual character in question. Basing future crew members on this is iffy, and types like fat guy and twins is laughable.
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LOL. just curious, by troll did u mean me?
No, the banned guy. But if you think it was for you…
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I really wanna read these legendary Agog posts now, but I'm also scared. What madness will I unwittingly plunge into.
What was his worst argument for Perona joining?
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I really wanna read these legendary Agog posts now, but I'm also scared. What madness will I unwittingly plunge into.
What was his worst argument for Perona joining?
All of them .
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The door argument is a standout one, however.
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@Cyan:
The door argument is a standout one, however.
Could you give me a summary, I have looked at a few of his posts and I don't want to have to sift through however many posts of that length it takes to find that argument.
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Since robby brought it up and some new people are curious:
@Louis:Could you give me a summary, I have looked at a few of his posts and I don't want to have to sift through however many posts of that length it takes to find that argument.
Ehh, that was his argument against Jinbe.
[hide]@AGOG:The doorways are "1 Luffy and 1 Usopp" in width, Jimbei is around 3 Luffy.
Usopp = Luffy just about…
So, 3 ≠ 2 Luffy.
Having to increase every door will lead to a completely redone ship.... IN other words, Oda will have to say that he made a plot hole present.
_So, if Oda wanted a character like Jimbei to join, in order to avoid a plot hole, he might have made the ship fit him or the character fit in.[/hide]But what really set him apart was the lengths he'd go to in attempt to never admit defeat.
[hide]@AGOG:That's what you get for facing pirates with half-assed resolve.
…...!! What resolve? The resolve to kill a person easily? Is that a pirate's resolve ...?
That's not it.
It's the resolve to bet your own life!!that: demonstrative pronoun
is: verb (to be = infinitive form)
what: relative pronoun
you: personal pronoun
get: verb (to get = infinitive form)
for: coordinating conjunction
facing: verb (to face = infinitive form)
with: preposition
half-assed: adjective (descriptive)
resolve: noun
the: article
to: preposition
kill: verb (to kill = infinitive form)
a: article
person: noun
easily: adverb
pirate: noun
it: personal pronoun
bet: verb (to bet = infinitive)
your: possessive personal pronoun
own: adjective (in this case, possession)
life: nounNow, let's use this in terms of sentence structure:
That's what you get for facing pirates with half-assed resolve.
The underlined part, it is the main clause. "Independent clause" if you will. Even though it sounds fishy, it is a complete sentence, at heart. The part that is not "underlined" that certain part is a "dependent clause" as it depends upon another "complete" clause to make itself complete, in other words, it would be "nonessential" at heart.
…...!! What resolve? The resolve to kill a person easily? Is that a pirate's resolve ...?
These are questions, which are called "interrogative sentences" at heart, they would not be "complete" as they do not actually answer anything.
That's not it.
This would be a statement.
It's the resolve to bet your own life!!
This is a "sentence" but it lacks information, however, it is a sentence nonetheless; complete.
Now, let's actually get to the reason why you are "wrong" and I am right…
That's what you get for facing pirates with half-assed resolve.
…...!! What resolve? The resolve to kill a person easily? Is that a pirate's resolve ...?
That's not it.
It's the resolve to bet your own life!!To start, the first part to know is that you do not need the things in "italics" in order to grasp the meaning of the conversation, in other words, they do not contribution to the meaning…
So, let's remove them...
That's what you get for facing pirates with half-assed resolve.
It's the resolve to bet your own life!!So, we are left with two odd sentences…
Sentence 1: "It's the resolve to bet your own life!!"
This one tells us, the readers, that this is the other form of the whole sentence: "It is the resolve to bet your own life!!"
The subject is "it" and we do not know what the "it" actually means, without additional information.
The verb is the infinitive "to bet" and we know what it means... The verb, infinitive form, is followed by "your own life" ... Which is in the possessive case.
Resolve would be a "noun".Anyhow, the main idea of this sentence is this:
It is the resolve to bet your own life…
The "it" is in reference to something that you need to grasp what the sentence's meaning is... In our sense, the "it" is the answer to the question beforehand. "resolve to bet your own life" is basically the "answer" _to this question:
"Is that a pirate's resolve …?"
Now, when you've gotten here, you assume that YOU are correct because you seem to think that "Pirate's resolve" is the entire "subject" of the conversation... That is where you made a mistake. In reality, this is merely "nonessential information" that matters not to the actual conversation...
That's what you get for facing pirates with half-assed resolve.
This is the "topic" of what we are talking about… This statement comes from the observation of Nami shaking...
That is what you get for facing pirates with half-assed resolve.
So, the "that" is specifically discussing the "shaking" that Ms. Nami is doing prior to this statement. Now, the action that we are doing is basically "facing pirates" because in this whole entire thing, Nami is facing pirates. However, she is doing it with a "half-assed" resolve.
Needless to say, it is not needed in this sentence, because it is pointless to the actual meaning.
Here's the summary of the whole thing:
Now, the meaning is simple:
That is what you get for facing pirates with half-assed resolve.In order to face pirates, one must be forced to "bet their life"… It has to have the "face pirates" part because it is stated that way. Regardless, it is talking about that particular "event" which is to "face pirates"...
Luffy is merely talking about HOW to face the pirates ("with the resolve to risk your own life") that will avoid the "shaking"...
The "English" Viz Media guys have already read this "literally" and figured that the best way to avoid having "reading miscues," they would need to make it "clear" ...
"That's what you get for going up against pirates unprepared!"
Unprepared!?
You mean not being prepared to kill someone like it's nothing?
No.
It means being prepared to risk your own life!!"In other words, since the action is about "fighting pirates" and Nami hasn't been properly prepared when she fights them, she's basically at a disadvantage and the reason why she is "timid" (Your hands are shaking <–- Luffy says this prior to that first sentence.) is because she never "prepared" for it. Nami needs clarification towards what "prepared" means... So, she requests an answer... "to risk your own life" would be the answer...
In this sense, you can substitute that for "unprepared" as this term is basically indicated as a deeper/ specific definition when discussing this exact conversation/ event.
Of course, adding a "without" would only make sense to this…
"That's what you get for going up against pirates without risking your own life!!"
You can basically continue this:
"That is what you get [A/N: this is in reference to the previous comment, "your hands are shaking."] for going up against pirates without risking your own life!!"
The person that is doing the action is Nami.
The action is going up against pirates (facing pirates).The significance of the "without risking your own life (resolve)" part is basically additional information. It only describes how the situation is, or what is "bad" about what she is doing… Nothing important.
Now, the intent of this whole conversation is to provide Nami guidance on how to "face" a pirate. Luffy comments specifically on "how to face pirates" and nothing else. It is ONLY on how to face the pirates. I cannot stress how much this means towards the "meaning" of the whole conversation.
So, he is ONLY commenting on this ONE thing as a means of "how to deal with it" and nothing more. This is the ONLY thing this sentence/ conversation states.
The reason you "read" it wrong was because you assumed that Luffy is actually discussing what "resolve" each PIRATE has to have. That is WHAT you failed at. He never "says" this at all; instead, he merely says "in order to fight a pirate, you have to risk your life..." and nothing more.
Urouge is here typing consistently that Luffy's point of view states: "In order to join my crew, you must follow what I believe all pirates show. Every pirate has a resolve to risk their own life."
Urouge then assumes that the very few sentences that we've constantly argued over, those few are basically not following in any sense of what "Urouge" assumes of every crew member to hold.
The point that I am making is that actual "meaning" of that sentence DOES NOT in any sense suggest any clarification towards what exactly Luffy personally thinks a pirate must have. In other words, he has "read" it incorrectly.
You did too… "Pirate's resolve" is not talking about his "personal" thought on what all pirates hold, instead, it is merely explaining what Nami needs to fight a pirate... Nothing else.
However, because you didn't read it correctly, you assumed that "Pirate's Resolve" meant that Luffy thinks "every pirate" has that "resolve" that he says; his own personal bias of the whole "resolve" concept. Despite this NOT being in the sentence, you assumed it is there and that is the intent of the sentence due to poor reading ability; a minor misreading on your part.
For that reason, like Urouge, I basically corrected him because he assumed a "groundless statement" that Luffy didn't even mean was what to base every future nakama on, therefore, it is his answer that Perona is not going to be a "nakama"... However, in the conversation, that is not the case and Luffy never states that at all.
So, I am merely saying that he is NOT correct and this "idea" is not backed by the mouth of Luffy because he read it incorrectly. Therefore, it doesn't discredit Perona at joining in any sense.
That would be the reason why you are wrong, it is because you got "confused" by the actual meaning of the sentence and thought that your own "translation" was more accurate to that of the "meaning" in that conversation.[/hide]Now then, this thread isn't about him, but that's a starting point for those who really care. Go back into volumes 3 and 4 and sift through his posts if you really care. It doesn't matter when or where. It's all basically the same. Let's keep the discussion off of it, though.__
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Could you give me a summary, I have looked at a few of his posts and I don't want to have to sift through however many posts of that length it takes to find that argument.
WHY JINBEI CANNOT JOIN THE CREW!!:
To be honest, my Jinbei overview is rather deep… this is like a little sample from the surface. When I type stuff like the really deep stuff, people can't seem to accept it. So, I basically just stress samples from the surface until someone says "true"!! and then I stress another thing until it is confirmed so that people follow along. Then it gets to the deep stuff. In order to really convince you that Jinbei can't join though, this part basically relies on literal reads and judging his character. I can seriously go deep on this, but I will go "step by step" just to basically have people follow along.
Now, the idea that Jinbei is a bad person, I don't agree. He has never "killed" anyone in front of our eyes. He hasn't even been there to basically harm anyone since he was in jail. As well as the idea that his lack of DF doesn't really harm anyone. He basically doesn't seem like he wants to hurt anyone and seems to fear taking someone's life. As he didn't comply with Crocodile. So, if he seems so bent on non-violence, it doesn't suggest he is evil at heart.
BUT, Jimbei is too wide to fit through the doors, given that, it's hard to imagine that Oda would make a mistake that badly in an effort to basically leave a plot hole for Jimbei to join. He'd basically have to cover it up to redo the ship, which seems way too absurd. If he planned for Jimbei to join, he would have made the Sunny bigger or the man able to fit it. So, it throws off him joining... The ship is basically Franky's dream, so basically upgraded it for a bigger one is not feasible. I am so against Oda being that wrong on it.
Yes, I know that Jinbei is not taller, he is "3" Luffy's in width. The doorways are "1 Luffy and 1 Usopp" in width.
Usopp = Luffy just about...
So, 3 ≠ 2 Luffy.
Therefore, since it can only be a "Luffy and a Usopp" that can fit at once through a door according to the manga example, it shows that a "3" Luffy seems like it will break it. Then, "make it all wider" is something that seems so absurd because it's a plot hole and in addition you would have to increase every room for "2" Luffy to "3.1" Luffy... Of course, this has a side effect that Chopper will have a hard time in half form and that'll probably lead to someone dying even... All because Chopper couldn't open a door fast enough. Of course, that is before the problems with the layouts that the sunny already has and all the current stuff seems like Franky is better off to just get a new ship than bother.
Having to increase every door will lead to a completely redone ship.... IN other words, Oda will have to say that he made a plot hole present. So, if Oda wanted a character like Jimbei to join, in order to avoid a plot hole, he might have made the ship fit him or the character fit in. I can go into details why other things suggest he doesn't join, but this one is more "functional". You can just say "true"!! and then I stress another thing until it is confirmed.
I wrote this… It's my other username that basically had this done. So yeah, thanks for reposting it here... I was wondering where it went. There was an actual analysis of EVERY door and how it relates, you can check that one out too.
^^ Tip of the iceburg.
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Every AGOG post needs to be edited to include "THIS IS WHAT AGOG ACTUALLY BELIEVES" at the bottom of it.
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Just because Agog was against Jinbe joining doesn't make it more likely that it'll happen :getlost:
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I really wanna read these legendary Agog posts now, but I'm also scared. What madness will I unwittingly plunge into.
What was his worst argument for Perona joining?
http://apforums.net/showpost.php?p=1955514&postcount=7617
enjoy.
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In addition to the mininum 16-characters per post rule, there should be a maximum 160 words-per-post rule just for AGOG.
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There's already a maximum zero words-per-post rule for AGOG.
It's called being banned.
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Since robby brought it up and some new people are curious:
Ehh, that was his argument against Jinbe.
But what really set him apart was the lengths he'd go to in attempt to never admit defeat.
Now then, this thread isn't about him, but that's a starting point for those who really care. Go back into volumes 3 and 4 and sift through his posts if you really care. It doesn't matter when or where. It's all basically the same. Let's keep the discussion off of it, though.Wow, that was one of the most entertaining reads I have had in a while!
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yeah, that dude wrote a whole book lol
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I have never ever read anything that large with absolutely no substance in it….
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Okay. Time for another Theory. (No. I'm not posting a XXX FOR NAKAMA!!! theory)
So far the debate for next crew has been about the Job aspect, while it is true that each person should fit in a certain position, I would just like to offer a new point of view.
Right when Franky was introduced as a cyborg, I got a strong hunch that he'll join. The reason for it (while he is certainly weird enough for a SH) is that I think its kinda stereotypical for a "Group" / "Team" / or WhatHaveYou in a fantasy series to have a robot in their ranks.
Now, if we see the commonly used stereotypes in terms of character design and fighting style (in japanese anime/manga anyway) we'll have:
1. Swordsman (Zoro)
2. Monk / bare-hand fighter (Sanji)
3. Wizard (Nami)
4. Thief (Nami) <thx gliblord="">5. Shooter (Ussopp)
6. Big-Guy type / Brute / Barbarian (Franky and Chopper)
7. Robot (Franky)
8. Heavy Artillery fighter (again Franky)
9. Scholar (Robin)
10. Little-Guy type (Chopper)
11. Animals (again chopper)
12. Musician (Brooke)
13. Super-speed guy (Brooke, in a way)So what do we have thats still not in the list?
1. Mid-range fighter using a Whip / Rope (Paulie)
2. Fat-Guy type (Jimbei)
3. Flier (Marco)
4. Brothers / Twins (Decalvan Brothers)Well, cant think of anything else at this moment, so if any of u have anything to add that'll be nice. The names is just an example, I'm not even remotely saying they would join, or even has a chance. Just an example.
Now Oda isn't really the conventional type, as u can see he made a hybrid out of even the unlikely types (Chopper). So what about the next nakama?
I'm thinking that it'll be the Brother/Twin type, and we got the remaining 2 crews (assuming its really 10 crew not counting Luffy). Knowing Oda he'll probably make a very unlikely twin, one is probably a fat guy who can semi-fly (like the flying fish). And the other would be that mid-range fighter.
Though u might say "Why would they need that in terms of in-ship job", but in terms of character diversity, it works well. We still haven't got a fat, round guy in the crew. And a whip user is an interesting addition to the crew's fighting style as well.
So thats basically the theory </thx>
Nice Theory,
But Pokemon didnt have those :(
Next Nakama is Jinbei.
If it is not Jinbei we will probably get someone who has a connection with Fisher Tiger and Mermaid Princess…. and is a subordinate of Jinbei o.o.
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I am starting to think it will be better if we get a different fishman/fishwoman instead of jinbe i have nothing against jinbe joining however if jinbe trained someone in the 2 year time skip we might get a younger version also maybe a fishwoman because we don't have a ugly female on the crew lol.
the reason i say this is because it is spelled jinbe and people are still put the i at end of his name and still calling him jimbei as well so i think it would be for the best if we got someone with a new name so we get everyone using the same spelling.
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I am starting to think it will be better if we get a different fishman/fishwoman instead of jinbe i have nothing against jinbe joining however if jinbe trained someone in the 2 year time skip we might get a younger version also maybe a fishwoman because we don't have a ugly female on the crew lol.
the reason i say this is because it is spelled jinbe and people are still put the i at end of his name and still calling him jimbei as well so i think it would be for the best if we got someone with a new name so we get everyone using the same spelling.
so the real spelling is jinbe. then where did "jimbei" come from?
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I think that came from someone who wanted him to have 2 names. Jim Bei, like Jim Bob.
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This post is deleted!
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so the real spelling is jinbe. then where did "jimbei" come from?
Didn't VIZ make it Jimbei?
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i do believe the last nakama should be lifeguard. this means camie should join yup
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i do believe the last nakama should be lifeguard. this means camie should join yup
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i do believe the last nakama should be lifeguard. this means camie should join yup
for that any fishman/ mermaid will do, so why the always damsel in distress with her dream fulfilled camie?
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I can't imagine a worse lifeguard than Camie.
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Yeah, as far as lifeguard's concerned it just needs to be a fishman/merperson. Wonder where we'll find one of them.
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i do believe the last nakama should be lifeguard. this means camie should join yup
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Guys, we should totally have Kuro join as the crew's hedge-trimmer. It would be less retarded than Camie joining as lifeguard.
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Guys, we should totally have Kuro join as the crew's hedge-trimmer.
lol, this is the funniest thing i've read in a while
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camie is a babe. kuro is a pus.
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I would have preferred not to.
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Nice to see your thought process there.
lets just say sanji and i are very similar. well… without the nosebleeds and fainting
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Sorry for the next lines
FUCK Jinbei, Boa, Perona, Caribou, unknown shitty not as awesome fishmen… Screw them all...
Give me CAMIE!!!
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Sorry for the next lines
FUCK Jinbei, Boa, Perona, Caribou, unknown shitty not as awesome fishmen… Screw them all...
Give me CAMIE!!!
no. Give ME camie!!!!!! and yeah caribou as a choice for nakama wtf. he's a serial killer. and he doesn't have tits
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Idiots! That cutie mermaid-chan is all MINE!!! Keimei would make a nice female addition to the crew.
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the second Camie makes an appearance i just knew ppl were gonna necro this thread like crazy -.-
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cute mermaids do that
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Camie!
Just kidding…
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Perona 's gonna be NN…..
CALLING IT NOW. Oda is unpredictable. She is gonna join the SH's. Boa is just fail anyway.