About the trouble the Strawhats had with Hina's ships. Think about what the Merry was. Merry wasn't a warship, or built with piracy in mind. I was a rich womans private vessel, with the cannons meant to be a deterient to pirates. And Ussop still maneged to sink some navel warships with it. So just imagine the Strawhats in something that was built for piracy or fighting. Especally something armed with weaponry Frankey made. They'd probably sink the marine ships so fast that the Vice Admrils wouldn't even have time to think of boarding. Unfourtnatly this is all hypothetical, and I don't know if this would come into play this arc. Here are the ways I can see the gang surviving this Buster Call.
Escape. Either with one of the trains, stealing a ship, or Iceburg shows up in their new ship(maybe what Franky was working on) they get out before the buster call arives, or they break through without actually doing a real fight.
Hide. The strawhats either go through the gate of justice, or down into impel down and hide. Wherever they are survives, and so do they.
Outside interfernce. Dragon or someone shows up and saves them.
Chapter 409 "Bad News Emergency Broadcasting" Discussion
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I actually think the Buster Call is being overestimated. This arc is also about ships and shipwrights, and an onslaught of powerful ships is perfect for it. On this island we have a group of skilled ship dismantlers, the SHs, and ….maybe something new later.
I think they can beat this. Okay, maybe they'll run to Water 7 first, or get their new ship.
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If the ships are far enough away from the island, then does it matter if the Strawhats are strong enough to fight it? I mean, if the ships can level the island with long range weapons, then avoiding it is the best option. If they get reasonably close before firing, then I see everyone's point about fighting it off.
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But metal ships do exist, Franky landed on one after he got hit by the sea train 22 years ago and used it to fix his body. And it looked like a cargo you can find in the real world.
Actually, the scrapped ship Franky found is a wooden ship with a metal superstructure and pieces of metal slapped on here and there. Look at the hull when it first appears and the deck when Franky collapses.
Looking at it again, it's a weird looking vessel. I wonder if he's been rebuilding that ship all these years as a way of thanking it for saving his life.
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Look, the Straw Hats came to Enies Lobby for one purpose and one purpose only:
Rescue Robin!
Once they get Robin, they will retreat like they have never retreated before, now that they know the Buster Call is coming and what it actually is.
You can't realistically expect them to fend off an ENTIRE ARMADA OF SHIPS PLUS FIVE VICE ADMIRALS (INCLUDING AOKIJI)!!!
Look how badly they fared against Aokiji last time. Can you imagine when ALL FIVE VICE-ADMIRALS show up at EL?
Even for the Straw Hats, facing this kind of firepower concentrated solely on them would be a tall order. All of the Straw Hats know the limits of their own abilities by now, so unless they want to go out in a blaze of glory, they'd be smart to just leave as quickly and as discreetly as possible.
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@Master:
Look, the Straw Hats came to Enies Lobby for one purpose and one purpose only:
Rescue Robin!
Once they get Robin, they will retreat like they have never retreated before, now that they know the Buster Call is coming and what it actually is.
You can't realistically expect them to fend off an ENTIRE ARMADA OF SHIPS PLUS FIVE VICE ADMIRALS (INCLUDING AOKIJI)!!!
Look how badly they fared against Aokiji last time. Can you imagine when ALL FIVE VICE-ADMIRALS show up at EL?
Even for the Straw Hats, facing this kind of firepower concentrated solely on them would be a tall order. All of the Straw Hats know the limits of their own abilities by now, so unless they want to go out in a blaze of glory, they'd be smart to just leave as quickly and as discreetly as possible.
Well, I've been thinking about that. Ao kiji and these other 2 guys are "admirals" or whatever the rank ahead of vice admiral is. Does that mean that all these vice admirals will be near the strength of Ao Kiji?
Rank doesn't always mean strength in One Piece.
It's possible that they won't be unbelievably strong. They don't even have to fight the admirals, just break the ships.
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@Master:
You can't realistically expect them to fend off an ENTIRE ARMADA OF SHIPS PLUS FIVE VICE ADMIRALS (INCLUDING AOKIJI)!!!
Aokiji is an Admiral, not a Vice Admiral, so he won't be accompanying the Buster Call. The ability of the Straw Hats to defeat a Buster Call is entirely dependent on the strength of the Vice Admirals; the battleships themselves are much less important.
The way Enies Lobby is laid out means that the battleships will not be able to easily bombard the island like they would normally, but will have to form a battleline and shell part of it from a distance, perhaps the Justice Tower in an attempt to destroy the peninsula that juts out over the waterfall. Ohara was a lot easier to destroy because it was such a small island, Enies Lobby is not.
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Well maybe Garp and John Giant are probably going to appear in the Buster Call since they are Vice-Admirals althought the other know Vice-Admirals like Tsuru and Komil I don't think they're going to be part of the Buster Call
Tsuru is Sengoku's Chief Adviser so probably she won't be part of Buster Call
Komil isn't even near the Marine HQ so don't think he'll be part of Buster Cal either
As for John Giant he the one that gave the order to put Buster Call in march maybe he's going to be the leader ?
Garp is in Marine HQ he's a Vice-Admiral, so he's the best bet in the whose appearing
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I actually think the Buster Call is being overestimated.
I think they can beat this. Okay, maybe they'll run to Water 7 first, or get their new ship.You mean Robin overestimates it?
Both Spandam and Robin (and Aokiji and …) know, that Buster Call is the ultimate power, that the Marine HQ can summon, and that there is no hope to escape it, which means that's what Oda wants it to be. You shouldn't underestimate it's destructive power.
Of course the SHs can beat it eventually, but not just yet.
(unless they find Pluton or have some other extraordinary luck (which seems likely )) -
@Raphael:
The admirals (not the vices) back then. What happened to them?
Mayby there was olny one admirals back then
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You mean Robin overestimates it?
Both Spandam and Robin (and Aokiji and …) know, that Buster Call is the ultimate power, that the Marine HQ can summon, and that there is no hope to escape it, which means that's what Oda wants it to be. You shouldn't underestimate it's destructive power.
Of course the SHs can beat it eventually, but not just yet.
(unless they find Pluton or have some other extraordinary luck (which seems likely ))Oh, it has desructive power, but it's not invicible. Didn't Saul destroy 6 of these ships before being taken down by Ao Kiji? Saul is strong, but I think he's weaker then some of the Strawhats.
Plus, an island is a still target, and only Saul had the strength to fight it back then. This situation is a little different.
I imagine these ships have good weapons, but their armor isn't unbreakable. Their are so many ship dismantlers on the island right now. Do you think this is a coincidence? I think they will beat the Buster Call. Now right away, but at least before the arc is over.
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Saul is not weaker than the strawhats, He was a Vice admiral and chosen thusly because he could fight against pirate crews like that of Gol D (since Vice Admiral is practically the second highest position and Gol D was the most powerful pirate of the time).
When the SH left Alabasta, they were almost destroyed by 5 ships (or was it 4?) Now they don't even have cannons to fight back, they are stranded on land.
You really overestimate the SH, I love them and all, but after EVERY major arc fight, they are all exhausted and there is no way in hell they'll be able to fight off the Buster call. Not that they could fight it at full strength without a ship, it would be different with a ship, but when you are stranded on an island you are an easy target.Imagine the best batter in history is sitting on a tiny island and 3 pitchers are pitching to him at the same time. He will hit for the first hour (extreme exaturation) but eventually he will get tired. Also the vice admirals can come onto the land and then you have no focus, do you fight the guys on the land or the cannonballs coming at you? You lose either way.
Also Saul could enter the water to sink the ships (I don't think it was 6 it was fuzzy in the pictures) Luffy, Robin and Chopper can't enter the water, so it would be up to Sanji Zoro and Franky alone?
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Also Saul could enter the water to sink the ships (I don't think it was 6 it was fuzzy in the pictures)
Unless I missed one somewhere, the most wrecked ships that we see in a single shot is four, but it's pretty likely that he destroyed five of them. The four that we see at the same time seem to be a short distance off the shore while the first ship he sank was right next to the beach.
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Plus Robin was given the blame of destroying what Saul did, so unless we count Aka inu's attack, Saul destroyed 6 Buster Call ships.
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He sank five ships actually while the surviving five were probably those with a Vice Admiral aboard.
Just a minor correction, he sank six ships. Since Kuzan wasn´t there to protect his ship it is fair game to assume that it was his Vice Admiral ship that got destroyed by Saul.
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Plus Robin was given the blame of destroying what Saul did, so unless we count Aka inu's attack, Saul destroyed 6 Buster Call ships.
Why wouldn't the World Government count the refugee ship as being destroyed by Robin?
Just a minor correction, he sank six ships. Since Kuzan wasn´t there to protect his ship it is fair game to assume that it was his Vice Admiral ship that got destroyed by Saul.
Considering that Kuzan came at him from behind, the more likely scenario is that he left his ship behind and came across the island to attack as that put them both on solid ground and removed any chance that Sauro had of beating him.
Why else did it take so long for Kuzan to do anything? It's not like he had to take a boat ashore or anything as he would have just walked ashore after freezing the water and he also didn't need to attack from behind either.
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As someone has already mentioned, the real strength of a Buster Call are the Vice-Admirials, not the ships. Ohara proved that well enough. Saul was the biggest threat to the Buster Call at that point, who was promptly taken out by Aokiji.
Even if the Strawhats start busting a few ships, the VCs are going to attack themselves. Now whether the SHs can beat the five VCs (after their intensive fights with CP9) is unknown. However, if we use what we saw from Saul and Aokiji as an example of what a VC is capable off, then the Strawhats are screwed. I mean, the CP9 members were b***hin' tough and all, but honestly, scale them against Aokiji, and they are woefully weaker. The Vice-Admirials can't be too far behind strength-wise from an Admirial. The few that are not about brute force are probably master tacticians and might still be able to beat the Mugiwara bunch by out-manouevering them.
And I'm pretty sure the marines chosen on a Buster Call run will be elites, compareable to Enies Lobby marines. Invading a ship and scuttling it will be extremely hard, especially if there's a Vice-Admirial on board. And, as pointed out, the Strawhats don't have a ship to reach the BC ships anyways.
The Buster Call isn't over-rated at all actually. Yes, I'll admit, the ships are probably the easy part. The hard part will be the Vice-Admirials. And considering the current (and projected) state of the Strawhats, I doubt they would be able to beat the Vice-Admirials.
And thus do I conclude my case on "Mugiwaras vs. Buster Call", May 09 2006.
Byeeeee for now y'all homely people!!
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sanji s gonna have a more than 30 minutes sleep after being rubbed all over by califa.. don't you think he's gonna be all powered up after that? O.o
note: do you think the 8 cp9s stronger than the 5 VCs? -
Considering that Kuzan came at him from behind, the more likely scenario is that he left his ship behind and came across the island to attack as that put them both on solid ground and removed any chance that Sauro had of beating him.
Why else did it take so long for Kuzan to do anything? It's not like he had to take a boat ashore or anything as he would have just walked ashore after freezing the water and he also didn't need to attack from behind either.
So are you agreeing or disagreeing with me here? As far as how he got on the island is concerned I always thought that he came with the boat he gave Robin later on. But either way it doesn´t matter that much actually IMO.
As far as the number of destroyed marine ships is concerned, we don´t know when Kuzan left his ship. All we know is that last time he was seen aboard it was on page 12 of chapter 396, which was a couple of pages before Saul attacked the first ship.
This doesn´t prove when he left but it definitely shows that it leaves room for multiple interpretations. Two of them would be either a) he left his ship after Sauls attack or b) he left it the second he realized Saul was on that island. Personally I´ll go with b. No proof just a personal hunch.
The thing is we know 6 marine ships were destroyed. Ok, the WG lied by telling it was Robins doing, but I take the rest for true. It would absolutely serve no purpose to say she destroyed 6 ships when it really was just 5. There just is no logic in stretching the amount by one ship more.
And considering that it was in fact 5 Vice Admirals in total of which we saw Kuzan on the island in the end it fits all together that 6 were destroyed and those with the remaining 4 Vice Admirals stayed in tact. Those numbers work together too good to be a coincidence. We´re talking about Oda here after all, so there most probably is a constructive thought behind it.
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So are you agreeing or disagreeing with me here?
I don't think that one of those ships was Kuzan's because he left it behind him when he attacked Sauro. There's no reason for it to move to attack Sauro if Kuzan was personally going ashore to attack him as well.
The thing is we know 6 marine ships were destroyed. Ok, the WG lied by telling it was Robins doing, but I take the rest for true. It would absolutely serve no purpose to say she destroyed 6 ships when it really was just 5. There just is no logic in stretching the amount by one ship more.
Did you miss the refugee ship? Why are people unwilling to count it as one of the six when the World Government has proved to be bastards enough to blame Robin for it?
If there were six battleships destroyed, then why wasn't she blamed for having sunk seven ships? A sense of fairplay? If seven ships really that much less believable of a number for a mere child to have destroyed than six?
Those numbers work together too good to be a coincidence. We´re talking about Oda here after all, so there most probably is a constructive thought behind it.
Well, again, one ship by the shore, four a short distance off the shore, and a refugee ship make six. Again, why wouldn't they count the refugee ship? There's no reason for them not to do so.
By their logic, Sauro destroyed the five battleships and Sakazuki destroyed the refugee ship because of Robin so that makes her fault they were sunk. As far as the World Government's concerned, she sank those ships.
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The problem is, we don't know if these vice admirals are strong. All we've heard about so far is, "buster call, buster call, buster call" without a mention of the vice admirals strength. Yes, Ao kiji was a vice admiral, but does the fact that he got promoted show that the vice admirals are strong or that ao kiji was stronger then a vice admiral? And Garp being there is just speculation, plus who's to say he doesn't fall asleep again?
They have to beat the buster call within this arc. If they run, they'll probably have to carry Robin away, as she would be paralyzed with fear. Robin fear fear has to be alleaviated before the next arc.
And people are speaking like having the buster call defeated along with the CP9 is the end of the Waorld Governemnt. No, they still have the vice admirals, shichibukai, fighters like Smoker and Hina, and they surely have more then 10 warships!
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The problem is, we don't know if these vice admirals are strong. All we've heard about so far is, "buster call, buster call, buster call" without a mention of the vice admirals strength. Yes, Ao kiji was a vice admiral, but does the fact that he got promoted show that the vice admirals are strong or that ao kiji was stronger then a vice admiral? And Garp being there is just speculation, plus who's to say he doesn't fall asleep again?
Three of the five Vice-Admirals commanding the Ohara Buster Call were Kuzan, Sakazuki and Saul. That speaks volume about the Vice-Admirals strenght.
They have to beat the buster call within this arc. If they run, they'll probably have to carry Robin away, as she would be paralyzed with fear. Robin fear fear has to be alleaviated before the next arc.
As previously stated, Robin fear won't be alleviated until Sengoku, Aokiji and Akainu are defeated by the Strawhats, even if they do beat the Buster Call (which I'm almost sure won't happen yet) she'll still be terrified by the power of the 3 Admirals.
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I also think that SHE will defeat them…...........
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First of all thx to all who have to be thanked.
I personally think that defeating Buster Call at this point of the story would be to early, so I think they have to escape.
And people are speaking like having the buster call defeated along with the CP9 is the end of the Waorld Governemnt. No, they still have the vice admirals, shichibukai, fighters like Smoker and Hina, and they surely have more then 10 warships!
I don't know about the WG having the shichibukai. For me it looked always like the WG isn't able to command them arround. They seem to act to their own ambitions rather than taking commands.
Furthermore I think you meant admirals not vice admirals. But IMO admiral isn't that far above of a vice admiral in terms of fighting power. I would say that 5 vice admiral could overcome one admiral. Yeah I know someone will mention Kuzan now, but I have always problems at comparing logia users to none logias. But take one of the other admirals who I think didn't have logia abilities(I always liked the idea of having one logia, one para…(can't remember the name at the moment)and one zoan admiral with sengoku as none DF user). I doubt that he would stand a chance against 5 vice admirals, who are possible future admirals.
BTW who says that none of the vice admirals could have a logia and that the Buster Call has no fighters like Smoker and Hina.So if the SH beat Buster Call now the marine only would have Kuzan and Smoker and possible other Logias left(Seeing this is shonen(sp?) I doubt there will be too many fighters stronger than vice admiral with a rank lower than vice admiral around). The rest would be no match to the SH especially because they will proceed to grow in terms of strength. And having the SH not to escape from marines anymore after this arc wouldn't feel right for me.
What the WG has besides the marine to fight against pirates is an other question.Three of the five Vice-Admirals commanding the Ohara Buster Call were Kuzan, Sakazuki and Saul. That speaks volume about the Vice-Admirals strenght.
I agree with you. Who says the vice admirals now should be weaker than those back than.
I also think that SHE will defeat them…...........
Come on. Robin defeating the Buster Call alone(that's what I take this post for)?
I have read these whole discussions about Robins strength compared to the other SH and like some people have mentioned her fighting style is based on submission/technique. Submission don't need much strength but submission one a ship won't work. Further I think you can overcome submission by brute force if you are much much stronger than the one who tries it on you. -
As previously stated, Robin fear won't be alleviated until Sengoku, Aokiji and Akainu are defeated by the Strawhats, even if they do beat the Buster Call (which I'm almost sure won't happen yet) she'll still be terrified by the power of the 3 Admirals.
Everything else aside, I don't think see knows who Akaunu is. She knows, _of the admirals,_ but Ao Kiji is the one she's really afraid of. He's the one who killed Saul, after all.
And no, I doubt Robin could she him in the Buster Call.
Lastly, there's gonna be hell to pay in the "wrongness in general" thread…
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Just somethings I've thought about… Given the strength displayed by Aokiji so far, wouldn't it be appropriate to assume that even when he was a vice-admiral, he was/is above average strength for vice-admiral rank. The way I see it, I expect the Admirals to be considerably stronger than the vice-admirals. I think Kuzan and Sakazuki were just above average strength vice-admirals at that time and hence they got promoted to admiral ranks.
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They are vice-admirals, some of you talk as if they were little children. I am 100% convinced that those vice-admirls will be incredible strong. There could be weak vice-admirals, but if the WG realy want's to make the Buster Call scary/invincible they will want strong people to be in command.
And if Franky does become a member, then there could be a showdown between Luffy, Zorro, Sanji, Franky, Robin and the 5 vice-admirals. Maybe if that happens all the Sanji fans will be happy that there hero got a strong opponent to fight. As for the other Strawhats' there could be some strong second in commands, for them to fight like, that swordsman of Garp. -
Just somethings I've thought about… Given the strength displayed by Aokiji so far, wouldn't it be appropriate to assume that even when he was a vice-admiral, he was/is above average strength for vice-admiral rank. The way I see it, I expect the Admirals to be considerably stronger than the vice-admirals. I think Kuzan and Sakazuki were just above average strength vice-admirals at that time and hence they got promoted to admiral ranks.
This is true, but who's to say history hasn't repeated itself? The thought that not a single current Vice Admiral has the strength to possibly become an Admiral when both Kuzan and Sakazuki had the potential to be an Admiral is strange one. Chances are at least one of the Vice Admirals is at least 3/4 the strength of Aokiji or Akainu, and as we've seen from Luffy's battlew with Aokiji, Luffy (the strongest Strawhat, no less) has a long way to go before he even gets to that level of strength.
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If Admiral Garp's part of the Buster Call, that means:
Coby and Helmeppo
will be making an appearance…
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@Duce:
They are vice-admirals, some of you talk as if they were little children. I am 100% convinced that those vice-admirls will be incredible strong. There could be weak vice-admirals, but if the WG realy want's to make the Buster Call scary/invincible they will want strong people to be in command.
And if Franky does become a member, then there could be a showdown between Luffy, Zorro, Sanji, Franky, Robin and the 5 vice-admirals. Maybe if that happens all the Sanji fans will be happy that there hero got a strong opponent to fight. As for the other Strawhats' there could be some strong second in commands, for them to fight like, that swordsman of Garp.The artillery of the Buster Call makes it scary. The vice admirals are the ones who are high-ranks enough to lead them.
Frankly, I think they're just going to obliterate the buster call warships with whatever their new ship is.
I'd hate it if this arc suddenly shifted from the CP9 being the biggest threat (in person) to the vice admirals being the biggest threat. It's to soon for a new enemy, not until after Lucci is out. The vice admirals are "no-names" right now anyway, we only know about Garp right now and he might not even be there! And how the hell did Giant John leave such an mpression on people, I've long forgotten about that guy. He appeared after the Arlong arc right?
And Lucci and Luffy will probably fight duing the Buster Call–that'd make for a great setting.
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Sorry but i don't see any of the Strawhats except maybe Luffy being capable of taking on a Vice-Admiral. None of the others are at his rank in power.
And me thinks the Lucci vs Luffy fight will be over by the time the Buster-call arrives. All the fights are taking place simultaneously and they are hardly going to last for 30 mins.
I think it will be simply like it was in Alabasta. An entire episode based on what happenned in 5 mins. -
I still don't think the vice admirals are going to be strong! First of all, they are all going to be busy guiding the blasting cannons at Enies Lobby, so it's unlikely that anyone will reach those ships. Any fighting to these ships will do done from a distance.
I hat seeing how everyone assumes that ranks means power. First of all, there are only 3 supreme admirals right? Akainu and Ao Kiji were Vice admirals before being promoted. I assume this means, that out of all the vice admirals, these guys are stronger. I don't think Aokiji strength is an indicator of the Vice-admirals strength.
Also, several characters of equal ranks have had varying strengths. Smoker is a marine captain isn't he? Well, Nezumi (the rat)was a Captian, and T-Bone was a captain, and Axe-Hand Morgan was a captian. Yet all of these guys don't have the same level of strength.
When the buster call arrive, they'll be dealing with the ships firepower most likely. The vice admirals will probably stay on the ship.
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Vice-admirals are going to have to be strong. After all- it is very likely there are future Admirals amongst the current Vice-admirals.
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wow, such long posts… haven't read'em all, still a few pennys:
Saul drifted after his boat sank or something. Robin scaped in a boat Aokiji gave her.Robin is the character most likely to be able to sink multiple battleships due to her DF ability. And she should be the most rested Mugiwara (INCLUDING FRANKY!!!! :P), and I don't get why people keep saying she would have to defeat the whole world govt to be at ease. Seeing a defeated BusterCall, and to a greater extent helping defeating it, is a major milestone in her development, most of her fear from the WorldGovt comes from the BusterCall since she accepts it as being it's most powerful weapon (altought i don't think the same way).
The concept of the Galley-La + FF working on a escape vessel is also a charming one.
Also, several characters of equal ranks have had varying strengths. Smoker is a marine captain isn't he? Well, Nezumi (the rat)was a Captian, and T-Bone was a captain, and Axe-Hand Morgan was a captian. Yet all of these guys don't have the same level of strength.
Partially agreed, Smoker is a Marine HQ Captain,so is Hina, while the others are offshore bases captains. I expect the MarineHQ ones to be stronger. I have to research that SBS where Oda explain the marine ranks further since I have a recollection of him mentioning as MarineHQ Captain being different from regular ones but this is for later today. off to work
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I still don't think the vice admirals are going to be strong! First of all, they are all going to be busy guiding the blasting cannons at Enies Lobby, so it's unlikely that anyone will reach those ships. Any fighting to these ships will do done from a distance.
The Buster Call was introduced as the ultimate weapon of the marine. If its strength would only be the canons, it could only be used against large areas and other ships. To shoot at single persons wouldn't make much sense cause you wouldn't really get them with the canons. So you need something to deal with single persons. And thats were the vice admirals comes into play.
BTW if those Buster Call ships would fight from the distance the SH wouldn't be able to fight back. They didn't have any canon or a ship at the moment to fight back. Further I don't think they would start firing at Enies Lobby without sending out a scout. Its at least WG property so I don't think they would just blasting the hell out of Enies Lobby without any confimation and when they get a hold on the situation they will most likely send out troops including the vice admirals.I hat seeing how everyone assumes that ranks means power. First of all, there are only 3 supreme admirals right? Akainu and Ao Kiji were Vice admirals before being promoted. I assume this means, that out of all the vice admirals, these guys are stronger. I don't think Aokiji strength is an indicator of the Vice-admirals strength.
I don't get this point. First you say rank doesn't mean power. Than you say because Akainu gets promoted he was one of the strongest vice admirals. That is what I would call assuming rank as power.
From Akainu we haven't seen anything real. He just has given a command. So we can't say how strong he really is. He could get promoted because of loyality or something else. He could be an extraordinary strategist.
Ao Kiji was most likely the strongest vice admiral back than so he isn't a good indicator for the strength of a vice admiral but you can't say because of that that all the other vice admirals are weak. Ao Kiji is one hell of a fighter. He isn't called strongest battle power of the marines for no reason.Also, several characters of equal ranks have had varying strengths. Smoker is a marine captain isn't he? Well, Nezumi (the rat)was a Captian, and T-Bone was a captain, and Axe-Hand Morgan was a captian. Yet all of these guys don't have the same level of strength.
Smoker and T-Bone are Captain of Marine HQ. Nezumi and Morgan aren't, if I remember right. Also I think Oda mentioned that the difference between a captain of HQ and of one of the blues is equal to three ranks in one SBS.
EDIT: Damn. d3adpool beated me.Also Smoker is strong fighter due to his DF. But T-Bone also was a strong fighter. Zoro took him as an serious opponent, judging by taking on his bandana and using three sword style. Nezumi and Morgan were indeed weak compared to them.
But this doesn't show the vice admirals to be weak. It shows more that there will be some weaker vice admirals and some stronger ones. I personally think that e.g. Crane, who's vice admiral, is rather weak related to physical power. But theres no evidence to say all vice admirals are weak.
IMO if all the vice admirals would be weak the marines would have been pumeled down long ago by some strong pirates. You can't keep the marines alive with just a few strong fighters. They have to protect the whole planet. If you haven't lots of strong guys you can't operate in the Oda world.Off topic: The thing, which for I admire Oda the most, is when he introduced Ao Kiji for the first time he made clear that the marines are one of the good ones, and not bad guys just because they are opposing the SH.
I'd hate it if this arc suddenly shifted from the CP9 being the biggest threat (in person) to the vice admirals being the biggest threat. It's to soon for a new enemy, not until after Lucci is out. The vice admirals are "no-names" right now anyway, we only know about Garp right now and he might not even be there!
Here I agree with you. The CP9 should be the biggest thread in this arc. It wouldn't feel right if someone else would get the spotlights. So they have to escape the Buster Call IMO.
And its true. We haven't seen many vice admirals yet. So give them names and a character and show them and i think many would change their mind. Many underestimate the vice admirals due to the fact that we didn't know anything about them. The whole Buster Call thing has to much potential to be wasted now.
I personally think they will escape with Puffing Tom. -
I always thought T-Bone was an Admiral.
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Did you miss the refugee ship? Why are people unwilling to count it as one of the six when the World Government has proved to be bastards enough to blame Robin for it?
I´m not counting it in because of a very simple reason. It´s not a Marine ship. Long before we even knew what a Buster Call was, it was said that 6 Marine ships were destroyed. And the refugee ship just looks like a regular vessel without the typical Marine spots on it.
And I seriously don´t feel a need to get deeper into this. The numbers speak for themselves. A total of 10 ships. 6 said to be destroyed and 4 Vice Admirals never left their ships. It is far more plausible for me to think of Kuzan´s ship to be destroyed too, instead of going by against the numbers.
If there were six battleships destroyed, then why wasn't she blamed for having sunk seven ships? A sense of fairplay? If seven ships really that much less believable of a number for a mere child to have destroyed than six?
Again an easy answer. She was blamed for being a dangerous member of the Demons of Ohara who at an age of 8 years could destroy 6 of the strongest ships the Marine has in their armada. That is what makes for good propaganda.
There is absolutely no need to even mention a refugee ship. It works quite well to frame all the people of Ohara as Demons. Of course they are not, but then again, neither were just the scholars demons. So there really is no difference in blaming innocent scholars as demons or innocent scholars + innocent citizens as demons. Nobody will ever find out the truth anyway, so there really is no need to talk about refugee´s. And just as I said, when Robin´s "crime" was introduced the first time, it seemed as if it was spoken about somewhat armed ships.
In the end it all comes down to personal interpretation. Personally I see zero reasons to think that the refugee ship is part of the 6 ship count. If you think of it otherwise then I guess that´s cool too but not my cup of tea. :happy:
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I would think that the WG would prefer to keep the destruction of a refugee ship on the down-low. No matter who allegedly destroyed it, it makes the Marines look bad.
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Everything else aside, I don't think see knows who Akaunu is. She knows, _of the admirals,_ but Ao Kiji is the one she's really afraid of. He's the one who killed Saul, after all.
I'm pretty much sure she knows who Akainu and Kizaru are. Maybe she never met them in person, but she probably heard about what they were able to do and the extent of their power, based on her personality and the way she lived during 20 years, she must be very knowledgeable about the world.
As for Akainu in particular, she at least heard his real name when the refugee ship got blown apart. And I bet the promotion of a Vice-Admiral to the rank of Admiral is an event that's talked about in the entire world, so it's possible she heard about Vice-Admiral Sakazuki, the man who took part in the destruction of her homeland and slaughtered the few family members she had, becoming Admiral Akainu. That would be vastly enough for Akainu to terrify her as much as Aokiji.
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Robin is not afried of Akainu, she's olny afried of Kuzan
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i must say..these fights..are awesome..i esp loved choppers..i think its his best fight..and he redeemed his cowardness in sky piea..and the frank fight..man..loved it..i hope one piece does not go downhil from here..i def hope not…so freakin gooood..XD
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I'd hate it if this arc suddenly shifted from the CP9 being the biggest threat (in person) to the vice admirals being the biggest threat. It's to soon for a new enemy, not until after Lucci is out. The vice admirals are "no-names" right now anyway, we only know about Garp right now and he might not even be there!
Completly agree! I'd feel sorry for the CP9-ers. Not only would they have had their rears handed to them, they also forgotten…poor chaps! Oda is a good story teller...I'm sure he won't take away CP9s limelight :biggrin:
And again, the Strawhats beating a Buster Call at this point in time would be ridiculous. If the Vice-Admirials are so worthless that they won't be able to beat Luffy and Co. right after each Strawhat was involved in an intense deathmatch, why are they VCs? Yes, yes, rank isn't power I know, but the best in the OP-verse ARE also the most powerful. Aokiji is an Admirial because of his power. The Shichibukai are who they are because of their power. Gol D. Roger was the pirate king because of his power. The strongest people hold the highest positions. And even if some VCs are not power based, they will still have to be exceptional people anyways. They are the next in line for Admiriality...they would have to have shown amazing abilities somehow or the other to get where they are. If the Strawhats can just walk over them when they have 10 warships (which can obliterate an island) backing them up, that would be wrong. Might as well have Luffy reach Raftel next and duke it out with Whitebeard.
And come on...if the Strawhats beat five VCs now, that would put the CP9 crew on par with them. Lucci and his people are strong, but they are no way compareable to the Marines creame of the crop (or so I believe).
They will run, simply because they are/will not be in any condition to fight. Even if they were, the odds are way against them. Of course, I have no idea how they will avoid the BC, but I love this arc anyways. I'm dying to see how Oda takes the story from here on. I still think Aokiji gave the Buster Call option to Spandam, knowing that Spandam will fail. If the jerk makes a call, Aokiji can just come over to Enies Lobby himself to deal with the situation. Actually, that's a bad idea. Aokiji is probably much more dangerous than a Buster Call. I mean, how do you escape? He can just Ice Age the ground and freeze you, or Ice Age the ocean and freeze you ship...
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what can u guys tell me about admiral Nelson?
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Really really very very incredibly fat. (We're talking Jabba fat, here). Sought power of Millenium Dragons in an anime filler, taken out by "Kamaitachi" Erik, a mercenary he'd hired. Not really much else there.
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I'm curious…Why are people referring to the Vice Admirals as VC's? I would think that it would be shortened to VA.
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I noticed to. I figured just a typo, didn't matter much to me as long as we knew who was being referred to.
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Brainstorm! What would happen if Lucci and Luffy were not able to finish their fight before the Buster Call commences? Then maybe they would sort of team up to take down the government to save their lives. I do not think Lucci would mind fighting the government since he only joined to legally kill people.
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@ultimateclima:
Brainstorm! What would happen if Lucci and Luffy were not able to finish their fight before the Buster Call commences? Then maybe they would sort of team up to take down the government to save their lives. I do not think Lucci would mind fighting the government since he only joined to legally kill people.
From where they are located at the moment, would BC affect them? They seemed to be in some underground passage.
Btw, which direction is the BC coming from?
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The BC should be coming from beyond the Gate of Justice, since the ships are heading to Enies Lobby from the Marine HQ.
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The BC should be coming from beyond the Gate of Justice, since the ships are heading to Enies Lobby from the Marine HQ.
we will see…we see or know that the gate is on land or the entrance for people is on land(they talk about to push it open by man) but it is also huge and can have a water way through it but than it must open wide...