Ok… Luffy won't defeat Doflamingo, then who?
Chapter 779: "Final Fight"
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Nothing exists; even if something exists, nothing can be known about it. Even if something can be known about it,knowledge about it can't be communicated to others. Even if it can be communicated, it cannot be understood.
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@Shobu:
Ok… Luffy won't defeat Doflamingo, then who?
Our main man Sabo of course! Oh I'm sorry, I meant Ace 2.0
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Even without G2, Luffy almost destroyed an Island sized ship.
On the other hand Meteors of OPU are nothing as dangerous as their real world counterparts. If they were, Dressrosa along with most of the grand line would have been obliterated by the very first meteor brought down by Fujitora.I am not saying it's definite Luffy will be the one destroying BirdCage. But he is certainly capable enough.
The force of each meteor that has come down has been reduced significantly or redirected.
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@Shobu:
Ok… Luffy won't defeat Doflamingo, then who?
Kaido, maybe Fujitora, Big mom, Sabo.
ZORO.
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@•Ace•:
That's the thing. Why mention it when it wasn't going to have any relevance? I also think that DD gave away the location of CC to BM for some reason.
YES
I just thought about this now.
Doflamingo must know that Ceaser is in debt, so he knows BIG MOM an emperor is gunning for him.
She would capture Ceaser and Doflamingo would pay off what Ceaser owes big mom with a bonus for inconvenience.
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@DHL:
The force of each meteor that has come down has been reduced significantly or redirected.
It doesn't really matter to the point I was making. A real meteor's power comes from the insane speed, the resulting heat from air-friction and the explosion caused by it. (and some radioactivity)
Even if the meteors were slowed down just before landing on the ground, a real one wouldn't have reached such low altitude in a single piece.
The final impact is one of the lesser concerns when a meteor strikes Earth. -
Shrugs Not my definition. Blame the linguists.
Though thank you, according to that defition Whitebeard didn't defeat Sakazuki. I will remember to throw it in everybody's face next time it gets brought up…
Man you guys argue about weird stuff.
Feel free to quote me :D -
Though thank you, according to that defition Whitebeard didn't defeat Sakazuki. I will remember to throw it in everybody's face next time it gets brought up…
I am in total agreement. I don't consider Whitebeard's actions a win either. It was badass, but he certainly didn't win.
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Our main man Sabo of course! Oh I'm sorry, I meant Ace 2.0
Why is Sabo Ace 2.0?
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@•Ace•:
I also think that DD gave away the location of CC to BM for some reason.
When did this happened?
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Why is Sabo Ace 2.0?
Because he's also Luffy's Older "Brother" and has the same exact powers as Ace did now. He carries on Ace's spirit.
I called it wrong, so long ago. I guess this needs to be changed.
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@Fire Fist:
Because he's also Luffy's Older "Brother" and has the same exact powers as Ace did now. He carries on Ace's spirit.
That makes so much sense!
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Nothing exists; even if something exists, nothing can be known about it. Even if something can be known about it,
knowledge about it can't be communicated to others. Even if it can be communicated, it cannot be understood.
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Luffy lost the battle against dolfy not the war. :ninja:
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Luffy lost the battle against dolfy not the war. :ninja:
War?
For your information, just like Defeat means obstructing someone's goal, War is merely the coolest sport on earth, there always people playing at it. Oda stated that while there isn't Aqua Laguna there's pirates playing Davy Back Fight, that is the real war.
Nothing exists; even if something exists, nothing can be known about it. Even if something can be known about it,knowledge about it can't be communicated to others. Even if it can be communicated, it cannot be understood.
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Why is Sabo Ace 2.0?
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When did this happened?
When he could have done it? During the time when his clone was taking his place when he was at the palace, Im assuming. Can't say when the clone took his place, but we know when the real one came back from who knows where and what he was up to. Im also thinking DD is most likely going to use Luffy as a bartering chip in exchange for CC.
EDIT: Okay. I'm remebering things wrong. BM's crew showed up a lot earlier than I remembered so Im not sure when he could have done it. Maybe right after Sanji's side got away. I don't know. Got to reread the arc again.
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Why is Sabo Ace 2.0?
He's Luffy's second overprotective big brother whose existence was never mentioned until maybe 15 chapters before his full appearance and after the first big brother's death he arrives before Luffy and takes the dead guy's power+starts using his exact techniques maybe?
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I'm much more interested in the cover story now. Nothing new in Dressrosa.
IF YOU DIE, I'LL KILL YOU….
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I'm still hopeful the end of this arc has an unexpected twist.
…
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I'm still hopeful the end of this arc has an unexpected twist.
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I'd be surprised if there wasn't at least one
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luffy got bodied by magellion, croc, aokiji, ect…...but not stopped. it is a case of losing battles but not the wars. in any case luffy was beaten and has lost fights.
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http://img4.mangasee.co/series/OnePiece/0455-018.png
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Darth's enel counts as a defeat, a ring out is a ring out.
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And with doffy, Luffy has been unable to fight him for 20 chapters:
! http://img4.mangasee.co/series/OnePiece/0760-010.png
! http://img4.mangasee.co/series/OnePiece/0761-007.pngMoria: Alright. Darth wasn't referring to this moment but honestly I agree with you. I can totally accept that someone interprets this as Luffy's defeat. I'm not sure I do, but I tend to agree and I think it's worth debating.
Ener: there I can't agree, it wasn't a sumo fight or a game of tag. They were fighting to destroy each other until Ener got scared and ran away. How is that Luffy's defeat ?
Doffy: again Darth wasn't referring to this moment. Though this time I don't agree.
Why did he send a string clone and a controlled Bellamy after Luffy if he was already defeated ?
Doffy won the round if you like to put it this way. Did he defeat Luffy ? no.
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luffy got bodied by magellion, croc, aokiji, ect…...but not stopped. it is a case of losing battles but not the wars. in any case luffy was beaten and has lost fights.
66% of the characters you mentioned weren't defeated by Luffy.
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I'm still hopeful the end of this arc has an unexpected twist.
…
Having an entire country doing nothing while Dofla and Luffy and Sabo and burgess(?) are brawling doesn't seem right.
Something HAS to happen unless it's sped up.
It would honestly kill the mood if oda just let them party and sail happily. Shit has to get down and no time for breaks.
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If Luffy was defeated by Lucci by being thrown between two buildings, and by arlong by being thrown into a pool, then he was defeated by doffy by being thrown out of the battleground, twice.
Luffy needed Nami's speech to move again and escape the Laguna. In my opinion, falling from the "ring" didn't harm Luffy in any physical or psychological way. And Luffy has been fighting non stop. He wasn't resting or anything.
As for Arlong I think it depends on your own interpretation of defeat. I don't have a definitive opinion on this matter.
But I definitely can't see where Luffy is in a state of defeat against Doffy.
Mah maybe I'm too confident to see that this is also a matter of interpretation. I will give you that.
@KageKageKing:Does this means Luffy Vs Krieg resulted in Krieg's victory?
Cause you know, if Sanji wasn't there….Both interpretations are worth considering IMO. Actually there are 3 interpretations. One could argue that it was a draw…or not!
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No, how do you know that Ace didn't have strong grasp on haki?
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Yes. ,
We don't know that for sure, but the only haki we ever saw him use was CoC. Whitebeard often talked about needing more training and thats obviously haki…. if he had haki he would have been able to counter BB more
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Why is Sabo Ace 2.0?
Probably because he suddenly got the same mid lenght haircut and the same fire fruit. Oh, and the same "I'm so cool" attitude too. And him also being another overprotective older brother probably help as well.
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We don't know that for sure, but the only haki we ever saw him use was CoC. Whitebeard often talked about needing more training and thats obviously haki…. if he had haki he would have been able to counter BB more
Considering Haki pre-timeskip was invisible, again, how do you know that?
Also, where did Whitebeard did that? I have to admit, I personaly don't remember it being a thing.
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I am in total agreement. I don't consider Whitebeard's actions a win either. It was badass, but he certainly didn't win.
Huh, that is nice to hear, it's one of those things I usually get disagreed on. Let's not touch the war though.
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Man you guys argue about weird stuff.
Only when there is break. :ninja:
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I'm still hopeful the end of this arc has an unexpected twist.
…
Heh, I'm pretty sure I have the bet going on with Shadogreed regarding that.
But it might be just wishful thinking on my part. I think Oda's actually going to do this painfuly straight.
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Alright so with the new chapter hopefully coming out around the next 24 hours (give or take), I'm going to make some guesses about what will happen next chapter.
I doubt that we will see what happened with Law, since Oda seems to leave the two week cliffhangers to be revealed at the end of the chapter, or wait till another chapter completely. So what we still have yet to conclude before the Doflamingo fight is Trebol, and assuming it's not him that Koala was talking about, the mystery character, who I will assume is Burgess. My biggest guess will be we will actually have a chapter dedicated to Sabo confronting Burgess, and get some idea about their relative strengths. Chance at the end that we will see what Law looks like with Luffy confronting Doflamingo. Best guess would be we see Luffy's anger, but nothing on Law.
Other guess is it's focused on Trebol and maybe him fighting whoever will defeat him. Quick little flashback about him going to Flower Gardens to retrieve Mansherry, having learned they have lost her. Kyros is down for the count, and Rebecca isn't doing shit at this point, so it's either Robin, or someone else arrives to do it, being most likely Cavendish.
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I'm still hopeful the end of this arc has an unexpected twist.
…
We might get a glimpse of who this Jack guy is. Or even better Oda with finally reveal what Kaido looks like, Bit like he did with Big Mom at the end of FI arc.
I know more about One Piece than you FACT.
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@DHL:
66% of the characters you mentioned weren't defeated by Luffy.
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Having an entire country doing nothing while Dofla and Luffy and Sabo and burgess(?) are brawling doesn't seem right.
Something HAS to happen unless it's sped up.
It would honestly kill the mood if oda just let them party and sail happily. Shit has to get down and no time for breaks.
Am I the only one around here that misses those breaks where the SH's sail around having fun and acting silly? I always felt that was an integral part of the adventure they are having and that this is exactly what Luffy is doing all this for. Freedom.
Remember, remember, the 5th of November
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We might get a glimpse of who this Jack guy is. Or even better Oda with finally reveal what Kaido looks like, Bit like he did with Big Mom at the end of FI arc.
… Would that be a twist though? Twists are unexpected, and everyone expects to see at least a glimpse of Kaido before the arc ends.
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… Would that be a twist though? Twists are unexpected, and everyone expects to see at least a glimpse of Kaido before the arc ends.
Fujitora feels the wrath of Kaido dangerously approaching the island and at the last moment decides to use his powers to move the whole island into a safe place. That would be a cool twist.
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Unearthing the whole island, now that would be awesome (and truly worthy of an admiral)
Might get Darth to swoon, too. -
Only when there is break. :ninja:
And it just so happens there's at minimum a 5-day break every week :ninja:
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… Would that be a twist though? Twists are unexpected, and everyone expects to see at least a glimpse of Kaido before the arc ends.
The biggest twist: Meadows was Kaido all along!
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Unearthing the whole island, now that would be awesome (and truly worthy of an admiral)
Might get Darth to swoon, too.I have this special emote for whenever Marines do something awesome on panel.
Needless to say, it haven't seen much use this arc.
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Whats the most ridiculous or gross thing you would do for the next 100 chapters of One Piece?
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Whats the most ridiculous or gross thing you would do for the next 100 chapters of One Piece?
I'd be like Senor Pink, and walk around in his outfit, the current one. Perhaps I would become as hard boiled as him as well. I'd wear it according to chapters, so 1 week for every chapter.
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Am I the only one around here that misses those breaks where the SH's sail around having fun and acting silly? I always felt that was an integral part of the adventure they are having and that this is exactly what Luffy is doing all this for. Freedom.
I miss that too. Maybe the meeting at Zou will bring back the usual Straw Hat fun.
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They still do that, just. . .in a much more reduced manner.
The trip from Sabaody to Fishman Island had some silliness, what with the fishing and stuff, and the same on the way back to the surface. . .just, very short.
Punk Hazard to Dressrosa was mostly heavy plot exposition and little silliness, so I won't count that.
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so it seems there will be no chapter today…
thank you mangapanda for the false hope -
@Shobu:
War?For your information, just like Defeat means obstructing someone's goal, War is merely the coolest sport on earth, there always people playing at it. Oda stated that while there isn't Aqua Laguna there's pirates playing Davy Back Fight, that is the real war.
Lol… Please don't tell me you have been even serious... Starting with that ridiculous metaphor of war. Likely didn't understand what I meant...
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I agree with Darth. While not distinct defeats, Luffytends to have "rounds" with bosses. His first round went very much like Sanji, initial attack, combo strike, string slash and KO. His second fight was in the well with the clone, I count the Trafalgar Law and Luffyvs Dofla Trebol and Bellamito as one fight
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It reminds me that Dofla didn't bring up the new age either. Yes, Dofla only believe in strength and strong people but what exactly is that New age that Dofla was talking about in volume 32? Is it the same New era involving the Supernovaes? This is kind of bugging me really. There are a few things I wish Oda is going to develop in this fight, I hope we are going to learn more about Dofla's personality and I want good interactions between Luffy and Dofla as well. Also, the crossed smile symbol, its meaning (which btw was considered as being an anti-dream thing).
Doflamingo, pre skip: New age of piracy! New ballgame! Sweep away all the complacent weaklings!
Doflamingo, post skip: Gets called out for being a complacent Old timer, content to sit on his ass and maintain the status quo please. New Age what?I guess thats the danger of separating a characters first appearance with his own proper arc by 400 chapters…
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@Daz:
Doflamingo, pre skip: New age of piracy! New ballgame! Sweep away all the complacent weaklings!
Doflamingo, post skip: Gets called out for being a complacent Old timer, content to sit on his ass and maintain the status quo please. New Age what?I guess thats the danger of separating a characters first appearance with his own proper arc by 400 chapters…
There are many hints this is not the case:
- Monet's "you're gonna be the pirate king". How exactly? There is clearly a long term plan going on here.
- "there are many ways to kill a stronger enemy"
- the whole "doflamingo is trying to kill the yonkou" thing, I know it's a theory but still, it may be up to something
- the Momonosuke being a card problem, clearly we still don't know many things
Doflamingo is losing because he and his crew spent 10 years sitting on their asses, but this doesn't mean there isn't a plan going on.
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Also, the cocky smug ass that called Doffy a "complacent old timer sitting on his ass" is currently missing an arm sitting in a pool of his own blood. For the second time in a row. Cause of the complacent old timer.
And I don't believe for a second that the man that "wants to destroy the world as it is now" is happy with maintaining the status quo. Either there's something else to his dealings with the Yonko or I'll call Bullshit on that one.
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@Daz:
Doflamingo, post skip: Gets called out for being a complacent Old timer, content to sit on his ass and maintain the status quo please. New Age what?
He's got his fingers in pies all over The New World though.
Breeding wars with his arms deals and juicing up a major enemy of the World Government, and that's probably just for starters.
I don't think we know the whole story in regards to Doffy's goals, not by a long shot.
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Its true that a reveal of Doflamingos ultimate plan (or indeed any plan) might put his whole character into perspective, and I hope those final pieces of the puzzle get dropped sooner rather than later. The Pluton concept was introduced very late in Alabasta, but we'd had "Croc wants to take over the kingdom" as a goal until then, and Pluton was just an extension of that. Whereas Doflamingo has fingers in so many pies that he's a little bit all over the place; Some "destroy the world" here, some "World Noble blackmail" there, some "exclusive Kaido dealings" over here, with a side order of "General Unrest Promotion" is just the tip of the iceberg, but overall he's been presented as a guy just wanting to keep a good thing going, until those rowdy young upstarts came and shook his tree.
Thats something to elaborate on another day, but hopefully Oda can tie up as many of Doflamingos myriad threads (pun not intended) in the finale. -
1 more day for the chapter
i really cant wait
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@Daz:
Its true that a reveal of Doflamingos ultimate plan (or indeed any plan) might put his whole character into perspective, and I hope those final pieces of the puzzle get dropped sooner rather than later. its true that the Pluton concept was introduced very late in Alabasta, but we'd had "Croc wants to take over the kingdom" as a goal until then, and Pluton was just an extension of that. Whereas Doflamingo has fingers in so many pies that he's a little bit all over the place; Some "destroy the world" here, some "World Noble blackmail" there, some "exclusive Kaido dealings" over here, with a side order of "General Unrest Promotion" is just the tip of the iceberg.
Thats something to elaborate on another day, but hopefully Oda can tie up as many of Doflamingos myriad threads (pun not intended) in the finale.Indeed, Doffy does have a lot on his plate.
Wouldn't that be the best way to try and create/implement the idea of A New Age though?
Multiple world changing enterprises?
_"_Now! This is it! Now is the time to choose! Die and be free of pain or live and fight your sorrow! Now is the time to shape your stories! Your fate is in your hands!" - Auron
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@The:
Alright so with the new chapter hopefully coming out around the next 24 hours (give or take), I'm going to make some guesses about what will happen next chapter.
I doubt that we will see what happened with Law, since Oda seems to leave the two week cliffhangers to be revealed at the end of the chapter, or wait till another chapter completely. So what we still have yet to conclude before the Doflamingo fight is Trebol, and assuming it's not him that Koala was talking about, the mystery character, who I will assume is Burgess. My biggest guess will be we will actually have a chapter dedicated to Sabo confronting Burgess, and get some idea about their relative strengths. Chance at the end that we will see what Law looks like with Luffy confronting Doflamingo. Best guess would be we see Luffy's anger, but nothing on Law.
Other guess is it's focused on Trebol and maybe him fighting whoever will defeat him. Quick little flashback about him going to Flower Gardens to retrieve Mansherry, having learned they have lost her. Kyros is down for the count, and Rebecca isn't doing shit at this point, so it's either Robin, or someone else arrives to do it, being most likely Cavendish.
I am glad at least someone made an attempt at this. This is a big area which we could have been debating instead of what a defeat and such is…
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@Daz:
Its true that a reveal of Doflamingos ultimate plan (or indeed any plan) might put his whole character into perspective, and I hope those final pieces of the puzzle get dropped sooner rather than later. The Pluton concept was introduced very late in Alabasta, but we'd had "Croc wants to take over the kingdom" as a goal until then, and Pluton was just an extension of that. Whereas Doflamingo has fingers in so many pies that he's a little bit all over the place; Some "destroy the world" here, some "World Noble blackmail" there, some "exclusive Kaido dealings" over here, with a side order of "General Unrest Promotion" is just the tip of the iceberg, but overall he's been presented as a guy just wanting to keep a good thing going, until those rowdy young upstarts came and shook his tree.
Thats something to elaborate on another day, but hopefully Oda can tie up as many of Doflamingos myriad threads (pun not intended) in the finale.I, on the contrary, have been thinking about Dofla's hidden strings being unveiled progressively, even after his demise (or apparent demise). Like midway through the Kaido arc the smile warriors start going batshit crazy, or stop following Kaido's orders or something, and it's revealed that was Doflamingo's intention from the beginning to destroy Kaido from within or something. Even with Doflamingo down (or not. . .), he could still be messing things up.
Also, seeing how virtually every villain gets his second run (or in Buggy's and Crocodile's cases, a third or even fourth run), I don't think Doffy's going down after 1 arc. I mean, Enel's doing something in the future, Moriah's doing something in the future, maybe even Lucci's doing something ¿in the present? I think Oda's gonna give Doffy a second chance, I hope, at mischieving some more (as long as his second run doesn't mean redemption or an attempt of redemption ala Crocodile).
Or it's all wishful thinking.
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I, on the contrary, have been thinking about Dofla's hidden strings being unveiled progressively, even after his demise (or apparent demise). Like midway through the Kaido arc the smile warriors start going batshit crazy, or stop following Kaido's orders or something, and it's revealed that was Doflamingo's intention from the beginning to destroy Kaido from within or something. Even with Doflamingo down (or not. . .), he could still be messing things up.
Also, seeing how virtually every villain gets his second run (or in Buggy's and Crocodile's cases, a third or even fourth run), I don't think Doffy's going down after 1 arc. I mean, Enel's doing something in the future, Moriah's doing something in the future, maybe even Lucci's doing something ¿in the present? I think Oda's gonna give Doffy a second chance, I hope, at mischieving some more.
Or it's all wishful thinking.
Yeah, Doffy is most certainly going to have a prominent role again, sometime after his defeat in this arc.
Too much has been made of his business relationship with Kaido and such for him to not factor into that conflict in some way.
Especially considering the inherent risk of that deal and the relatively minor payoff that Doffy gets from it.
There's got to be more.
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Indeed, Doffy does have a lot on his plate.
Wouldn't that be the best way to try and create/implement the idea of A New Age though?
Multiple world changing enterprises?
Are all those different tendrils working together to create an unified vision though? Or is it just a case of "its a new age now, because a bunch of separate things are now different"?
Really, my main beef with it is how it impacts on Doffys portrayal of a villain; I'm personally a fan of Less is More, keeping them concise, defined, understandable. Doffys plans, myriad enterprises and indeed most of his character is just so sprawling at the moment that I think it'd do him real good to get a single defined goal to tie everything else together- a goal less vague than create new age/ be a big player in the new age/create general unrest and somehow ""DESTROY WORLD""
