At the very least it seems like both sides are starting to realize where the other side is coming from now so that these arguments can calm down. Hopefully as things progress in Dressrosa this will become even more apparent, too.
One Piece Chapter 742 - I'll always be close to you
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Yay, first post!
I really wish I could read all 40 pages of discussion on this chapter, but I can't, though I tried to read as much as I could!
In general, I thought this chapter was a solid A. I usually don't like flashback chapters because I'm itching to get to the action, but I was moved. I was also glad that we got a resolution to the SOP strategy as I'd rather the story progress forward (so many things are happening!)
Some specific notes:
• Cool cover (anything with Robin is great, my fav SH)
• Scarlet's death by disease had me rolling my eyes … until of course it was revealed to be fake ... making her eventual death that much more tragic (you got me Oda)
• Kyros's leg sacrifice was epic (hope it gets animated well)
• Great explanation of why Sugar's first toy mistakenly didn't get a contract (just kind of a quick jam situation)
• Great plot narrative expounding on how tragic Sugar's power in making people forgotten really is (I may be overanalyzing this, but I see parallels with Toy Story and Neverland about toys and youth of innocence being forgotten ... well, I'm sure someone has already posted something about this too)
• Yeah, I was super sad when Toy Soldier had Scarlet die in his arms and he was a toy and couldn't feel her. Two bullet points devoted to how great this plot narrative is with Sugar's Hobi Hobi no mi
• Good evil character development of Diamente, especially him taunting Rebecca (and great tie-in with the earlier flashback). Can't wait to see him get his punishment by whomever
• Nice buildup of everyone chanting Usoland only to show he's been defeated. Of course I was bummed, but that's part of the plot narrative. I do hope like others he gets some more frametime for his efforts in the anime tho
• I LOVED the last panel. The whole SOP strategy was ridiculous from the start anyway. Yes, it would've been great to see Ussop shine, and I hope he really does in the New World, I'm sure he will. But a ridiculous end to a ridiculous strategy with no real plot holes is just great. Very in keeping with OP silliness. I am very happyI think it's just so hard to make everyone happy. But I believe in Oda!
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Dude do us a favor and stop with the condescension. We have different idea of what character growth is. With perona's fight he slowly allowed his brave side to come through from when things turned against him and he stood back up…so yeah. Okay cool. I'm not going to argue this with someone going around saying, "please look up blahblahblah." It gets tiring.
This topic's been talked to death now and I was only presenting an alternative possibility, something some people on here said that we didn't have in mind.
Courage. The word you're looking for is courage.
There was no bravery in any of Usopp's fight pre-TS, well there is but it's hidden by persona, lies or use of intimidation.
I'm guessing you didn't look it up then, even though I said please…
You don't seem to understand why I was stressing the matter in the first place. You don't see the LINE, you're not trying to see the difference between the two words and that's why you and EVERYONE else who became disappointed and just deemed Usopp's growth last chapter as just a repeat.
Courage is the word to be used in his fight against Perona, from what I already stated, Usopp was already giving up when Kumacy was beating the crap out of him - who does he turn to? Sogeking. Now I have no problem with anyone liking Sogeking, I do too but Sogeking IS a crutch in Usopp, he is what Usopp wants to be - BRAVE, like that very moment Sogeking stuck that salt into Kumacy's mouth without any hesitation. Courage is what Usopp's shown after he had an internal discussion with his alter ego, he tried to keep a level head and assessed the situation and done what he had to - LIKE all his other fights I can recall right now pre-TS.
Courage is fighting in a situation knowing the dangers and with fear beside you but you still show your mettle. Bravery on the other hand is not letting the dangers worry you and carry on, that's WHY there's a small difference between bravery and stupidity. If you still insists of saying they're the same, fine but you know the story itself is proving you wrong right? If it's bravery Usopp shows and not courage then Usopp is already brave and we're already done with one of the Straw Hat's dream guys! If it's bravery and not courage then he wouldn't be b*tching about the dangers of an island before they get to it. IF it's bravery and not courage then I guess I really should be disappointed in him for not attacking every enemy first EVER and say "I'm USOPP, Sniper of the Straw Hat Pirates! I don't care if I die, I'll become a LEGEND!".
I'm sorry if it's been discussed to death, I am, but is my opinion to be dismissed because this has already been discussed? was I there? can I vote? If it has been discussed to death though then why are you still confused about these 2 words? Don't get me wrong I am also disappointed in what was shown in the last page even though I found it hilarious after being confused for a bit but One Piece has always been pretty ridiculous but lighthearted and funny. Usopp has always been that guy that gets the short end of the stick but always, SOMEHOW, through it all even with luck or an involuntary face fault gets the job done - it just so happens that this time he lost the battle but he won the war, I would say.
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The difference is that in this case is just an exaggeration of real life when in Fairy Tail is totally Bullshit even for Supernatural Battle manga.
People get disappointing because the scene was funny, but the thing is that the base of it has nothing to do with that.
Enel face, did people complained that in a serious moment, where the villain, discovers that his unbeatable powers until that moment, don't do nothing to the main character. Notice that similar moments happen in real life and aren't funny at all.
Luffy face, did people complained that in a serious moment, where Luffy finally discovered that his long lost brother was indeed alive.
Notice that similar moments to this happen in real life as well and aren't funny at all.
Ussop and Sugar faces, people are complaining that it was played for laughs, but something like that happen in real life, when normally it doesn't happen because of spicy things(normally is because of more serious things, like heart attack or fainting, or somebody making a joke and trying to scare), but sometimes it happen because of that(I already seen something similar happening. Somebody eating something that he didn't knew it was spicy(I even see about salty, sweet, …) and his reaction scares everybody close to him). Now when something scares you suddenly your body gets stress out in such a degree that heartbeat, blood flow, adrenaline levels in the blood and breath, all become abnormal in a to short period of time. Normally, this have no real impact to a person, only a little stress at the time, but a frail person(or a person that for some reason his internal system is frail at that time) can even pass out with that. Now think that in One Piece, with a Special Grape, the Tatabasco, and that it scares a kid. With that is easy to see that is anything but Bullshit, and that those situations being used as a joke(That in real life and normally in other manga aren't used) is something that Oda have been doing, note that at least 3 times in these arc serious moments were used as a joke using that face(Ussop when he knew the plan of the dwarfs; Robin, Franky and Ussop When they discovered that is their fault that the dwarfs going to war against Doflamingo; When Luffy found out about Sabo).Comparing Enel, Luffy moments compared to this is really beyond ludicrous. Other than the overdramatic face that has comedic element, how the hell did you even put them together? Serious scene adding a comedic moment =/= terrible, written plot device like the girl getting freaked out to the point of unconsciousness being in any way similar to what happened on previous occasions. Sugar has been living at least as long as Luffy, Ussop & Co. considering she was the same age by the time DD crew attacked Dressrosa. She has been part of a team that has been killing and torturing people on a regular basis and apparently some of you seem to make her some innocent child whose mind is so new to the world, that something like this would logically shock her. Your hilarious excuse of someone like Sugar being possibly frail considering which crew she works with is nearly as ridiculous as some guy a few pages back trying to explain how Ussop's long nose being deformed Enel-style helped shock her. The excuses in this thread keep getting more and more insane by every few pages which tells really the story of people trying to explain whatever it was that happened.
This is bad writing (for me anyways), probably the worst piece of the manga/anime I have read and watched even going back to 2013. Unfortunately my terrible memory doesn't go farther than that. This is part of the totally bullshit even for supernatural battle manga to me, but a lot of OP fans don't see it. To me, this is writing level to the same quality of Fairy Tail, which I personally consider a below average series though others might see it in a far more positive light. This is one of the worst nonsencial things I have seen Oda do in the entire series. Don't even get me started with Ussop.
But this moment doesn't detract too much for me thankfully, since the flashback was on the opposite end of pulling out Oda's best talent, amazing flashback storytelling pulling on the heart strings. -
I felt so retarded for fail to understanding how you guys can take the last chapter as Usopp's win, can someone explain it to me, please?
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Even though I am satisfied with the chapter, I admit that Sugar felt a bit out of character in the last page. She is too important to the plot to have been taken down so easily. I believe many of us are disappointed because the climax felt unsatisfying for such an evil person. But, for Usopp all the actions leading up to the moment (attempted escape, return, beatdown) were completely in character IMHO. It wasn't a win but it wasn't a regression either.
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Comparing Enel, Luffy moments compared to this is really beyond ludicrous. Other than the overdramatic face that has comedic element, how the hell did you even put them together? Serious scene adding a comedic moment =/= terrible, written plot device like the girl getting freaked out to the point of unconsciousness being in any way similar to what happened on previous occasions. Sugar has been living at least as long as Luffy, Ussop & Co. considering she was the same age by the time DD crew attacked Dressrosa. She has been part of a team that has been killing and torturing people on a regular basis and apparently some of you seem to make her some innocent child whose mind is so new to the world, that something like this would logically shock her. Your hilarious excuse of someone like Sugar being possibly frail considering which crew she works with is nearly as ridiculous as some guy a few pages back trying to explain how Ussop's long nose being deformed Enel-style helped shock her. The excuses in this thread keep getting more and more insane by every few pages which tells really the story of people trying to explain whatever it was that happened.
This is bad writing (for me anyways), probably the worst piece of the manga/anime I have read and watched even going back to 2013. Unfortunately my terrible memory doesn't go farther than that. This is part of the totally bullshit even for supernatural battle manga to me, but a lot of OP fans don't see it. To me, this is writing level to the same quality of Fairy Tail, which I personally consider a below average series though others might see it in a far more positive light. This is one of the worst nonsencial things I have seen Oda do in the entire series. Don't even get me started with Ussop.
But this moment doesn't detract too much for me thankfully, since the flashback was on the opposite end of pulling out Oda's best talent, amazing flashback storytelling pulling on the heart strings.I mostly agree with you. With a little bit of tweaking it might have turned out a lot more believable. Usopp pulling off a trick, third party helping out, dwarves not being taken out so easilly…
But on the bright side, Oda probably won't pull a silly stunt like this again. Certainly not in Usopp fights, where he already made 2 girls faint in a ridiculous fashion.
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I'll be honest, I really thought that the chapter was great, and I loved the humor of the last spread.
But I also agree with all of the people who are saying that it really makes Sugar seem like she is laughably weak. Doffy is incredibly powerful, and some of his crew have been shown to be extremely strong as well, but I was expecting a little more from an officer, I guess.
And, yeah, this totally could have been fixed if Oda had just shown more of the fight. He really could have hyped up all three who were involved.
Unless there really is Haki at play, here, I'm a little disappointed in the way that Sugar was portrayed.
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Ussop attacks, trebol recovers.
Trebol attacks ussop.
He does the "tears from the eyes"-funny face while running for cover.Ussop internal dialogue "oh crap crap crap".
Trebol: [some mocking comment making fun of how weak he is]
Cut to people cheering him on (toys and crew mate), as a pan out view shows the shipyard slowly getting destroyed by Trebol attacking him and ussop avoiding (b/c you know he's good at dodging)
Cuts back to him getting his ass owned with some scraps of stuff being thrown at him, so ussop slowly gets wounded (showing it isn't an easy fight).
Internal dialogue: "I should've ran, oh well, I'm going to die might as well take sugar down while I'm at it. (or something like that)."
Ussop tries attacking again and does his "watch out or my 3422349 thousand followers will get you…etc." thing, another ship throw right at him, and another hilarious One Piece ::gulp:: scared face.Eventually battle takes him to where the other enslaved dwarves are, and he sees how badly they are treated, Trebol taunts him more and more. Ussop snaps, he uses a barrage of attacks to distract Trebol, while laying down some traps without Trebol noticing (over confidence of a logia who just takes the attack and gets cut up again instead of avoiding the attack), and then smoke screen They can't see anything else besides maybe a meter or two in front of them, as sugar is walking around, anticipating an attack she gets tangled in a plant (trap laid by ussop earlier) and can't move. Ussop by this point would've snuck right by her and attacks her with his 1000000 ton hammer, she opens her mouth in shock at which point he throws the chilli grape into her mouth and she does the funny fire breath and passes out....
^ that is how i imagined it going. A lot of "oh shit" funny face moments, more character growth and ussop winning without actually taking down Trebol.
I would have preferred something like that as well. However, there is another point why I dislike the execution of this part of the story. Aside from Usopp, Robin is also handled very terribly in my opinion. So she got turned into a toy. Okay. However, there's still the fact that no contract was made. But despite having free will and the ability to move freely around, she decides to do just nothing. If Toy Soldier can put up a fight, we not her? She's smart, isn't she, so I would have expected her to cause as much ruckus as possible and make Trebol's and Sugar's to hell as much as it's possible for her in this state.
Even if Robin's actions for example can only distract Trebol for very few seconds, at least she has contributed something to the overall fight.
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But on the bright side, Oda probably won't pull a silly stunt like this again. Certainly not in Usopp fights, where he already made 2 girls faint in a ridiculous fashion.
Actually, this isn't just the first time Oda pulled a "silly" scene. Remember the Sanji nosebleed thing in FI? That's probably the worst.
But what does this recent "silly" thing tells us? These stuff are part of Oda's style and writing. He chose that way. We can't be certain it won't happen again.
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Ussop attacks, trebol recovers.
Trebol attacks ussop.
He does the "tears from the eyes"-funny face while running for cover.Ussop internal dialogue "oh crap crap crap".
Trebol: [some mocking comment making fun of how weak he is]
Cut to people cheering him on (toys and crew mate), as a pan out view shows the shipyard slowly getting destroyed by Trebol attacking him and ussop avoiding (b/c you know he's good at dodging)
Cuts back to him getting his ass owned with some scraps of stuff being thrown at him, so ussop slowly gets wounded (showing it isn't an easy fight).
Internal dialogue: "I should've ran, oh well, I'm going to die might as well take sugar down while I'm at it. (or something like that)."
Ussop tries attacking again and does his "watch out or my 3422349 thousand followers will get you…etc." thing, another ship throw right at him, and another hilarious One Piece ::gulp:: scared face.Eventually battle takes him to where the other enslaved dwarves are, and he sees how badly they are treated, Trebol taunts him more and more. Ussop snaps, he uses a barrage of attacks to distract Trebol, while laying down some traps without Trebol noticing (over confidence of a logia who just takes the attack and gets cut up again instead of avoiding the attack), and then smoke screen They can't see anything else besides maybe a meter or two in front of them, as sugar is walking around, anticipating an attack she gets tangled in a plant (trap laid by ussop earlier) and can't move. Ussop by this point would've snuck right by her and attacks her with his 1000000 ton hammer, she opens her mouth in shock at which point he throws the chilli grape into her mouth and she does the funny fire breath and passes out....
^ that is how i imagined it going. A lot of "oh shit" funny face moments, more character growth and ussop winning without actually taking down Trebol.
One thing you forgot is that Sugar has the tabasaco so Ussop can't snipe something he doesn't have into Sugar's mouth. Nami's the thief not Ussop.
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Isn't it a bit weird that Hajrudin would like to repay for being fred as being slave to someone else? :) Will he follow Ussopp now? Hajrudin for New Nakama!
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
@Panda:
I think were I take issue, at least somewhat, is that it seems to me that a number of people are simply calling the scene poorly done (horribly written, a travesty that marks the downfall of One Piece, pick your level of hyperbole as you wish) as a sort of reflexive lashing out in their disappointment.
The disappointment itself, mind, is completely valid, and I find it ridiculous that anyone would imply otherwise. Usopp has, in my opinion, some of the greatest in-fight moments in the series, due to how badly the odds are inevitably stacked against him. Of course people would look forward to more such scenes, and this situation absolutely had the potential to go that way. In fact, I would very much argue that we were meant to expect it would, as subverting that, as I mentioned before, is the very basis for the joke we ended up with. When looked at that way, though, I suppose it does bring to light what is no doubt a sore point for many people: the joke was quite literally, or at the very least effectively, at the expense of those who wanted to have a serious, dramatic, emotional Usopp moment. For good or for ill, many people find it difficult to appreciate a joke when it is at their own expense, and I legitimately believe we're seeing quite a bit of that in people's reactions to the scene.
At any rate, the disappointment is certainly valid. Beyond that, I could even see people sincerely arguing that the scene was bad; I myself gave reasoning for why I felt it could have been done better, and while I personally wouldn't say it was bad as is, everyone has their own standards. Again, though, what gets to me are the occasions when it very much comes across that someone is accusing the scene of being poorly done, without really thinking of any valid, narrative arguments for why that is the case, but simply due to how upset and disappointed they were by not getting what they had hoped for.
In short, disappointment with how a situation was resolved, as compared to a resolution actually being poorly done, are two separate issues; while this particular case could arguably be accused of either, or both, I feel like at least some people are allowing that line between the two concepts to become blurred.
Very well put, thank you. I expected awesome fight and struggle from Usopp, like Usopp vs Perona, but instead we got offpanel ownage and lucky "win".
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Ussop attacks, trebol recovers.
Trebol attacks ussop.
He does the "tears from the eyes"-funny face while running for cover.Ussop internal dialogue "oh crap crap crap".
Trebol: [some mocking comment making fun of how weak he is]
Cut to people cheering him on (toys and crew mate), as a pan out view shows the shipyard slowly getting destroyed by Trebol attacking him and ussop avoiding (b/c you know he's good at dodging)
Cuts back to him getting his ass owned with some scraps of stuff being thrown at him, so ussop slowly gets wounded (showing it isn't an easy fight).
Internal dialogue: "I should've ran, oh well, I'm going to die might as well take sugar down while I'm at it. (or something like that)."
Ussop tries attacking again and does his "watch out or my 3422349 thousand followers will get you…etc." thing, another ship throw right at him, and another hilarious One Piece ::gulp:: scared face.Eventually battle takes him to where the other enslaved dwarves are, and he sees how badly they are treated, Trebol taunts him more and more. Ussop snaps, he uses a barrage of attacks to distract Trebol, while laying down some traps without Trebol noticing (over confidence of a logia who just takes the attack and gets cut up again instead of avoiding the attack), and then smoke screen They can't see anything else besides maybe a meter or two in front of them, as sugar is walking around, anticipating an attack she gets tangled in a plant (trap laid by ussop earlier) and can't move. Ussop by this point would've snuck right by her and attacks her with his 1000000 ton hammer, she opens her mouth in shock at which point he throws the chilli grape into her mouth and she does the funny fire breath and passes out....
^ that is how i imagined it going. A lot of "oh shit" funny face moments, more character growth and ussop winning without actually taking down Trebol.
That would be much more satisfying :/
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Isn't the fact that Oda used so many pages of Usopp runing around buiding his comeback then off panel the whole fight that much worse? After so long build up shouldn't the outcome (all that happenes after Usopp comes back to face Trebol) take more time? That's what really bug me.
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Ussop attacks, trebol recovers.
Trebol attacks ussop.
He does the "tears from the eyes"-funny face while running for cover.Ussop internal dialogue "oh crap crap crap".
Trebol: [some mocking comment making fun of how weak he is]
Cut to people cheering him on (toys and crew mate), as a pan out view shows the shipyard slowly getting destroyed by Trebol attacking him and ussop avoiding (b/c you know he's good at dodging)
Cuts back to him getting his ass owned with some scraps of stuff being thrown at him, so ussop slowly gets wounded (showing it isn't an easy fight).
Internal dialogue: "I should've ran, oh well, I'm going to die might as well take sugar down while I'm at it. (or something like that)."
Ussop tries attacking again and does his "watch out or my 3422349 thousand followers will get you…etc." thing, another ship throw right at him, and another hilarious One Piece ::gulp:: scared face.Eventually battle takes him to where the other enslaved dwarves are, and he sees how badly they are treated, Trebol taunts him more and more. Ussop snaps, he uses a barrage of attacks to distract Trebol, while laying down some traps without Trebol noticing (over confidence of a logia who just takes the attack and gets cut up again instead of avoiding the attack), and then smoke screen They can't see anything else besides maybe a meter or two in front of them, as sugar is walking around, anticipating an attack she gets tangled in a plant (trap laid by ussop earlier) and can't move. Ussop by this point would've snuck right by her and attacks her with his 1000000 ton hammer, she opens her mouth in shock at which point he throws the chilli grape into her mouth and she does the funny fire breath and passes out....
^ that is how i imagined it going. A lot of "oh shit" funny face moments, more character growth and ussop winning without actually taking down Trebol.
Glad it doesn't turn out this way, and how did you come up with this narudo filler scenario quality?
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Even though I am satisfied with the chapter, I admit that Sugar felt a bit out of character in the last page. She is too important to the plot to have been taken down so easily.
Well, first off, she's only really been put in the spotlight for about five chapters where all she really did was nonchalantly use her powers and make snide remarks towards Trebol. There really wasn't a whole lot to go off of regarding her character, so her being startled didn't exactly contradict anything.
On top of that, the fact that Trebol was assigned to guard her proves that, despite still being pretty strong on her own thanks to her powers, she's still fragile enough that she needs someone physically powerful to make sure that she's kept safe. Obviously this was effective, but Trebol wasn't expecting this turn of events to happen and there really was nothing he could do to stop it.
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So much for Kyros fighting someone famous, lol.
Sucks that he only has one leg. Don't see how he means to defeat Dofla. I guess Rebecca really is her father's daughter.Flashback was really emotional, you could almost feel the pain.
And looks like Burgess didn't use a machine after all. We really need to see more of that fight.
I'm not too happy with the way Sugar was made to faint. But now that Usopp has made another person faint and foam from their mouths, I guess it's confirmed he has Conqueror Haki.
! http://soaringwingsblog.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/usopp-beats-persona-psychologically.jpg
! http://d220.diamond.fastwebserver.de/series/OnePiece/0742-020.png
Damn that page with outcome of Perona vs Usopp still gives me chills. So epic and funny. Too bad there was nothing like that with newest chapter… Only a bit of a laugh with bitter taste ;/
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
Yeah, that doesn't really make sense. Especially with him still having a sword. Probably just a screwup on Oda's part. Possibly one of Doflamingo's regular grunts like the ones in the casino. I don't really see it getting explained unless it ends up as a SBS question.
Yeah that was kinda weird. Remind me a bit of Marco being hand-cuffed ;)
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Also, just to throw in my final two cents, I feel like people will be a lot less bitter about this part of the story years down the line when Dressrosa can be read through in bulk instead of having to wait for new chapters on a week-by-week basis in order to see what developments happen next. Sometimes the chapter cliffhangers end up painting some sort of skewed picture in the minds of certain readers that, in the end, will be completely irrelevant by the time something happens later on in the story. Oda writes the way he does for a reason, and normally it takes a while to see the full extent of what he has planned. That's why I don't like to count my chickens before they hatch.
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One thing you forgot is that Sugar has the tabasaco so Ussop can't snipe something he doesn't have into Sugar's mouth. Nami's the thief not Ussop.
Why'd it even have to be the tabasaco? One Impact Wolf to the face and she's out.
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Why'd it even have to be the tabasaco? One Impact Wolf to the face and she's out.
I don't think Oda is the kind of person to draw someone who looks like a little girl getting physically beaten like that unless an antagonist was doing it.
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I'm curious, what would have happened if Usopp had fired those shrurikens at Sugar? If Trebol had shielded her, he would have to take physical damage. If he went into logia mode, she would have been done for. Kinda remains me of what happened between Ace and Luffy at Marineford.
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I'm curious what the end of the chapter means for next week.
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Comparing Enel, Luffy moments compared to this is really beyond ludicrous. Other than the overdramatic face that has comedic element, how the hell did you even put them together? Serious scene adding a comedic moment =/= terrible, written plot device like the girl getting freaked out to the point of unconsciousness being in any way similar to what happened on previous occasions. Sugar has been living at least as long as Luffy, Ussop & Co. considering she was the same age by the time DD crew attacked Dressrosa. She has been part of a team that has been killing and torturing people on a regular basis and apparently some of you seem to make her some innocent child whose mind is so new to the world, that something like this would logically shock her. Your hilarious excuse of someone like Sugar being possibly frail considering which crew she works with is nearly as ridiculous as some guy a few pages back trying to explain how Ussop's long nose being deformed Enel-style helped shock her. The excuses in this thread keep getting more and more insane by every few pages which tells really the story of people trying to explain whatever it was that happened.
This is bad writing (for me anyways), probably the worst piece of the manga/anime I have read and watched even going back to 2013. Unfortunately my terrible memory doesn't go farther than that. This is part of the totally bullshit even for supernatural battle manga to me, but a lot of OP fans don't see it. To me, this is writing level to the same quality of Fairy Tail, which I personally consider a below average series though others might see it in a far more positive light. This is one of the worst nonsencial things I have seen Oda do in the entire series. Don't even get me started with Ussop.
But this moment doesn't detract too much for me thankfully, since the flashback was on the opposite end of pulling out Oda's best talent, amazing flashback storytelling pulling on the heart strings.How did I put those moments together?
They were all serious moments played as a joke! Simple. Enel moment is similar to the moment where Crocodile was pounding Luffy in the tomb, but Luffy was always getting back. In Enel it was played for laughs(and the chapter even ended with Luffy pounding Enel. Basically a week where it wasn't sure if Enel had completely loosed or if he was gonna fight back in any way), in Crocodile it was played to be Epic and serious.
Luffy moment with Sabo is similar to the moment where the Strawhat found that Merry was still alive in Ennies Lobby. Luffy with Sabo was played for laughs, the Merry Go wasn't.
All those similar moments you could interchange them(Make Enel make a serious face of surprise and Crocodile make a funny face of surprise. Make Luffy cry and Smile while crying when he found Sabo was still alive and Ussop(or other member of the strawhats) make a funny face of surprise when finding that Merry was still "alive").
Choosing the moment to be serious or funny is irrelevant if done right. This moment with sugar was done right. She got surprised by Ussop eating the Grape that she thought would make him die, while he had a super spicy attack.Common readers(This includes me and you) shouldn't talk about technical words all the time to try to express how they feel about how something in the story was treated. You use a lot the expression Plot device, and in a negative way. Every conflict trigger and resolution in a story is technically a "plot device". Please don't use "plot device" like is something special and bad. Talk just about the scene -> "The event was badly written" suffix or "The event was badly handled and forced".
Now it wasn't badly written, because it makes a lot of logic in fiction and it was prepared gradually and smoothly. Look at the first appearance of the grape and it explanation, look at all the instances Sugar thought the grape was poisonous, look at her decision to give Ussop the grape, look at her expectations to his reaction of her giving the grape to him, look at the surprise and the exaggeration of the surprise she had. All of them make a lot of sense and merge well with the story and the fiction, specially the exaggeration of reactions, this is basically a law of One Piece(and a reason some people say they can't get to One Piece). There is nothing in that scene that isn't plausible in One Piece world.When I said frail people, I'm not talking of emotionally, I'm talking of physiologically. It doesn't matter if you're the biggest murder or if you are an adult or anything, when things happen totally out of your expectations, in a short period of time you react(and depending in the situation you freak out). The event is so fast that isn't your brain that process it, but your spinal cord, because she reacts faster than your brain. Now, as I said in my previous post, that fast reaction will increase the levels of adrenaline, the heart will suddenly increase the beating rate where during that acceleration some beats will be irregular causing momentarily bad blood flow in the body, and other things. If physiologically a person is frail, they can pass out because of it(if you don't know, people pass out because of low blood flow in the brain. It doesn't matter what causes that low blood flow, as soon as the flow decreases to a dangerous level, your brain shuts down. That is the reason why after someone passes out people give sweet water, because that helps the flow of your blood to stabilize), having an heart attack, an AVC or other problem. This happens in real life is not some invention. Old people hearts normally don't work well, and because of that is advised that they don't have exhilarating experiences. That is because that can make them pass out or worse having an heart attack or something else bad.
About she being a kid. That isn't because kids are more frail, but because kids react in a more exaggerated way than adults. Is Normally funnier to make a prank to a kid than an adult, because of that. It has nothing to do with kids being more innocent.
The thing that I talked about exaggeration is something that is commonly seen in One Piece and his seen in these scene has well. Normally in a good scare the victim looses his breath for some seconds(and reacts funny :)). If you take the simple exaggeration that this scare was over 9000 better than a good scare, than his easy to understand that she pass out.
One thing is if you were expecting something different, something not comical, and because of that(or not because of that) didn't thought the scene was specially funny. Other thing is saying this scene was badly written, something that it wasn't.
You can say that this resolution wasn't satisfactory for you, but to say it doesn't make any sense, it came from nowhere and it was forced, is completely wrong.
I don't even know why I have to talk about the physiology of the reaction of surprise and why she reacts the way she reacts. That should be obviously to the reader and seen as a normal reaction in her case. The passing out should be simple understood as well. -
IMO here is what will probably happen in the next chapter:
- The toys start turning back. Realizing that they're screwed, Trebol grabs sugar and tries to escape.
- Doflamingo is super pissed
- Chaos in the crowd. They start booing Diamante.
- Fujitora reacts to the news, probably with a "…" dialogue
- End chapter with a double page of Kyros and Luffy entering Diamante's room
Of course, Oda might play it out in a totally different way and skip to Sanji's group for a while.
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I felt so retarded for fail to understanding how you guys can take the last chapter as Usopp's win, can someone explain it to me, please?
Who said it was Ussop's win? The SOP plan was successful and the people at the underground(the toys and the dwarves) will give the merits to Ussop, but in reality he didn't win.
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What you say is true, and it's perfectly exposed. Still, that "flaw" that you see in the scene, to me, it's a pretty huge one. From many angles.
Not showing the fight Usopp went through after "maning up" robs us of a potentialy entertaing scene but it also robs us of some potential drama were Oda could've played with our expectations, the reader knowing deep down inside that it will end up fine, and then, blam, Usopp is defeated to the point of unconsciousness. From a narrative and tension building angle, Oda didn't win anything in the process by off-screening the whole struggle, quite the opposite.
As you put it, and it does seem like what people are having trouble dealing with, is the fact that Usopp was utterly defeated. And as you say, he didn't win by luck or by a gag; he lost. "But it could've been anyone else in his place and the result would've been the same!", yes, of course, because he lost. On that aspect, I think you just hit the nail on why the scene is so polarizing. But, to me, that "nuisance" that is Oda not showing the scene is actualy the biggest mistake of the scene, not what actually happened, which I've been okay since the beginning.
This is writing 101, "show, don't tell". Oda, lately, is "telling, not showing". This fight should've been a tension builder, so when the inevitable loss happens, the reader feels the despair of the situation. If you go from "fight starts!" to "other stuff!" and then "fight ends!", the tension and the drama is totally diminished and the reader doesn't feel the same impact he would've felt if shown the whole (or a big chunk) of the struggle. We saw the toys and the dwarves cheering for Usopp, but we didn't have any chance to do so, and we should, cause we're the audience this story is directed at. To me, that was one of the biggest mistakes Oda has made till now, and one of the biggest dangers of the sped-up pace and the off-paneled conflicts happening in order for Oda to be able to put as much stuff in his manga as possible.
At the same time, I DO actually appreciate what he's trying to do: he's trying to give us as much stuff happening as possible. Problem, as been said a gazillion times, is that by not dwelving deeper into each and every one or these scenarios taking place at the same time, they lose relevance and dramatic impact. So, by trying to give "more" to the readers, he's, in the end, giving them "less". The intentions are good, I'm sure of it, but the result is harmed during the process.
Now, if the climax delivers, people will probably be much more forgiving with this issues. If this keeps up, people will start to be more and more disappointed that a great story with great characters and lots of potential is not being used to its fullest. As many have said before me, it feels like current One Piece is "good", no doubt about it, but it shouldn't be "good", it should be "excellent", something it has been in the past and that Oda is fully capable of doing.
What you see as potentially entertaining scene and potential drama, other people may see them as boring parts,I don't think anyone ever expected Usopp to win the fight,so trying to play with expectations would be a waste of time.
Also,what Oda did isn't telling it's showing,he showed the end of the fight and skipped the fight,which I'm fine with.
Under other circumstances,it could have been entertaining,but in this arc there are other things that the reader cares more about,so in this case showing a fight we know Usopp was going to lose and had no character development,for the sake of feeling despair of the situation and more drama, will slow down the pace even more and the reader will get exhausted.As for Usopp,he already had his moment,there is no reason to show him struggling(if he had the chance to struggle) especially if there is another fight for him.
You said,"Problem, as been said a gazillion times, is that by not dwelving deeper into each and every one or these scenarios taking place at the same time, they lose relevance and dramatic impact." it's quite the opposite,by delving deeper into some scenarios(less interesting),the reader lose interest in other scenarios(more interesting).
I see it more as sacrificing "less" to give you "more".
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IMO here is what will probably happen in the next chapter:
- The toys start turning back. Realizing that they're screwed, Trebol grabs sugar and tries to escape.
- Doflamingo is super pissed
- Chaos in the crowd. They start booing Diamante.
- Fujitora reacts to the news, probably with a "…" dialogue
- End chapter with a double page of Kyros and Luffy entering Diamante's room
Of course, Oda might play it out in a totally different way and skip to Sanji's group for a while.
I'd rather see Picachu and that swordsman guy
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I'd rather see Picachu and that swordsman guy
That fight is pretty much irrelevant to what's happening right now.
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all this talk about CoC has me thinking, how hilariously awesome would it be in trebol reports back to doflamingo that ussop used it to K.O sugar. and then everyone in the world starts to think that ussop has it, and he gets like a super high bounty because of it.
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While I'd obviously like to see the outcome of Zoro vs Pica, if they cut to that for the entirety of the next chapter then I'd be kind of annoyed. Granted, I don't believe that this is going to happen at all, but considering the fact that every toy going to be turned back to normal I think it's way more important that the next chapter emphasizes the aftermath of that.
I also think that Burgess is going to end up destroying the Colosseum, causing it to collapse and for all the competitors to fall into the Toy Factory. Then even more chaos ensues.
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How did I put those moments together?
They were all serious moments played as a joke! Simple. Enel moment is similar to the moment where Crocodile was pounding Luffy in the tomb, but Luffy was always getting back. In Enel it was played for laughs(and the chapter even ended with Luffy pounding Enel. Basically a week where it wasn't sure if Enel had completely loosed or if he was gonna fight back in any way), in Crocodile it was played to be Epic and serious.
Luffy moment with Sabo is similar to the moment where the Strawhat found that Merry was still alive in Ennies Lobby. Luffy with Sabo was played for laughs, the Merry Go wasn't.
All those similar moments you could interchange them(Make Enel make a serious face of surprise and Crocodile make a funny face of surprise. Make Luffy cry and Smile while crying when he found Sabo was still alive and Ussop(or other member of the strawhats) make a funny face of surprise when finding that Merry was still "alive").That has nothing to do with it. Something being funny is not what the issue is. Do you deliberately misinterpret or pretend to not understand someone? The issue is what came of such comedic moment. To compare Enel or Luffy's face and how such a serious/intense scene with what happened with Sugar makes no fucking sense. You basically state that they're all serious scenes, then there's a comedic moment, then close your eyes and ears and run off to the sunset.
Choosing the moment to be serious or funny is irrelevant if done right. This moment with sugar was done right. She got surprised by Ussop eating the Grape that she thought would make him die, while he had a super spicy attack.
The moment could have been serious, funny or whatever adjective you'd like to use to describe it. The point is that it was absolutely idiotic when viewing it. She got surprised he didn't die when he had a super spicy attack? What are you even talking about?
Common readers(This includes me and you) shouldn't talk about technical words all the time to try to express how they feel about how something in the story was treated. You use a lot the expression Plot device, and in a negative way. Every conflict trigger and resolution in a story is technically a "plot device". Please don't use "plot device" like is something special and bad. Talk just about the scene -> "The event was badly written" suffix or "The event was badly handled and forced".
Now it wasn't badly written, because it makes a lot of logic in fiction and it was prepared gradually and smoothly. Look at the first appearance of the grape and it explanation, look at all the instances Sugar thought the grape was poisonous, look at her decision to give Ussop the grape, look at her expectations to his reaction of her giving the grape to him, look at the surprise and the exaggeration of the surprise she had. All of them make a lot of sense and merge well with the story and the fiction, specially the exaggeration of reactions, this is basically a law of One Piece(and a reason some people say they can't get to One Piece). There is nothing in that scene that isn't plausible in One Piece world.There's absolutely no logic at all in that scene. We could have completely ignored the fact that Trebol should have just killed him, instead left him alive while he was trying to kill the dwarves when he was stepping on them, or Sugar to turn him into a toy, instead she goes right next to him and gets shocked when a poisonous grape makes him look ridiculous, so that she faints out of shock. The fact that she even knew the grape itself was poisonous should have made her less surprised at Ussop.
Yes I understand you know, basically you will pray to Lord Oda and any ridiculous written piece will be excused as "plausible in One Piece, because crazy shit happens here all the time".
When I said frail people, I'm not talking of emotionally, I'm talking of physiologically. It doesn't matter if you're the biggest murder or if you are an adult or anything, when things happen totally out of your expectations, in a short period of time you react(and depending in the situation you freak out). The event is so fast that isn't your brain that process it, but your spinal cord, because she reacts faster than your brain. Now, as I said in my previous post, that fast reaction will increase the levels of adrenaline, the heart will suddenly increase the beating rate where during that acceleration some beats will be irregular causing momentarily bad blood flow in the body, and other things. If physiologically a person is frail, they can pass out because of it(if you don't know, people pass out because of low blood flow in the brain. It doesn't matter what causes that low blood flow, as soon as the flow decreases to a dangerous level, your brain shuts down. That is the reason why after someone passes out people give sweet water, because that helps the flow of your blood to stabilize), having an heart attack, an AVC or other problem. This happens in real life is not some invention. Old people hearts normally don't work well, and because of that is advised that they don't have exhilarating experiences. That is because that can make them pass out or worse having an heart attack or something else bad.
Nice to know that Sugar is frail psychologically, I love non-mentioned incredibly convenient facts. There's been so many shocking moments, it's just good to know to this one time when it needed to be this way (because Oda also can't have the kid being KO'd), it happens this time.
About she being a kid. That isn't because kids are more frail, but because kids react in a more exaggerated way than adults. Is Normally funnier to make a prank to a kid than an adult, because of that. It has nothing to do with kids being more innocent.
Except that you know.. she's not a kid. The only way she's a child is in physical form, she is at least as old as Luffy, Ussop and Nami, possibly being older than someone like Robin depending when she got the fruit. But I get it, you want her to remain exactly the same mentally despite living a lot more than her physical form portrays.. it's the only way you're trying to explain this situation.
The thing that I talked about exaggeration is something that is commonly seen in One Piece and his seen in these scene has well. Normally in a good scare the victim looses his breath for some seconds(and reacts funny :)). If you take the simple exaggeration that this scare was over 9000 better than a good scare, than his easy to understand that she pass out.
You really love clutching at straws, don't you? Oda should hire you as his PR man.
One thing is if you were expecting something different, something not comical, and because of that(or not because of that) didn't thought the scene was specially funny. Other thing is saying this scene was badly written, something that it wasn't.
You can say that this resolution wasn't satisfactory for you, but to say it doesn't make any sense, it came from nowhere and it was forced, is completely wrong.
I don't even know why I have to talk about the physiology of the reaction of surprise and why she reacts the way she reacts. That should be obviously to the reader and seen as a normal reaction in her case. The passing out should be simple understood as well.Comedy can be added if executed properly, you keep constantly going back to it. Even if I were to find the situation itself funny, the plot side of it was utterly cringeworthy and this is where the issue lies. I think it's about that time that I get a drink and get back to work. This conversation isn't going to go anywhere (but opinions!!). You're just repeating yourself like Little Wayne saying he's the best ever hoping that if you say the same thing a lot of times, you can convince people, including yourself. I don't think we're going to change one's opinions. This was some really poor writing from Oda which started overall in somea aspects with Ussop, and I'm quite disappointed in him considering the massive standards I have for the man.
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Why'd it even have to be the tabasaco? One Impact Wolf to the face and she's out.
Operation SOP was based on the Tabasaco being used to knock her out. So however Oda was going to end it was going to somehow be based around the Tabasaco plot point. Not just Sugar getting beaten up.
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The moment could have been serious, funny or whatever adjective you'd like to use to describe it. The point is that it was absolutely idiotic when viewing it. She got surprised he didn't die when he had a super spicy attack? What are you even talking about?
There's absolutely no logic at all in that scene. We could have completely ignored the fact that Trebol should have just killed him, instead left him alive while he was trying to kill the dwarves when he was stepping on them, or Sugar to turn him into a toy, instead she goes right next to him and gets shocked when a poisonous grape makes him look ridiculous, so that she faints out of shock. The fact that she even knew the grape itself was poisonous should have made her less surprised at Ussop.
This two comments show that you don't know the difference between Poison and spicy!
For you:
and
when
and 
got poisoned they reacted like this 
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The moment could have been serious, funny or whatever adjective you'd like to use to describe it. The point is that it was absolutely idiotic when viewing it. She got surprised he didn't die when he had a super spicy attack? What are you even talking about?
Well, she wasn't expecting a screamer.
There's absolutely no logic at all in that scene. We could have completely ignored the fact that Trebol should have just killed him, instead left him alive while he was trying to kill the dwarves when he was stepping on them, or Sugar to turn him into a toy, instead she goes right next to him and gets shocked when a poisonous grape makes him look ridiculous, so that she faints out of shock. The fact that she even knew the grape itself was poisonous should have made her less surprised at Ussop.
Because dying from poison totally makes you look ridiculous.
Yes I understand you know, basically you will pray to Lord Oda and any ridiculous written piece will be excused as "plausible in One Piece, because crazy shit happens here all the time".
Seriously, are you one of those people who think that everybody defending this is a Goda worshipper?
Nice to know that Sugar is frail psychologically, I love non-mentioned incredibly convenient facts. There's been so many shocking moments, it's just good to know to this one time when it needed to be this way (because Oda also can't have the kid being KO'd), it happens this time.
Wasn't the entire point of the plan to scare Sugar? SOP (Sugar Off-guard Panic)?
That suggests me that they knew Sugar could be easily scared (they had scouts to know that), or else they would have went with a different name.
Except that you know.. she's not a kid. The only way she's a child is in physical form, she is at least as old as Luffy, Ussop and Nami, possibly being older than someone like Robin depending when she got the fruit. But I get it, you want her to remain exactly the same mentally despite living a lot more than her physical form portrays.. it's the only way you're trying to explain this situation.
Being an adult doesn't mean being immune to sudden scares.
You really love clutching at straws, don't you? Oda should hire you as his PR man.
No need to act like an asshole.
Comedy can be added if executed properly, you keep constantly going back to it. Even if I were to find the situation itself funny, the plot side of it was utterly cringeworthy and this is where the issue lies. I think it's about that time that I get a drink and get back to work. This conversation isn't going to go anywhere (but opinions!!). You're just repeating yourself like Little Wayne saying he's the best ever hoping that if you say the same thing a lot of times, you can convince people, including yourself. I don't think we're going to change one's opinions. This was some really poor writing from Oda which started overall in somea aspects with Ussop, and I'm quite disappointed in him considering the massive standards I have for the man.
Ok, valid point, but if you're going to say that you have massive standards, then you're admitting that the problem is mostly yours.
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T
There's absolutely no logic at all in that scene. We could have completely ignored the fact that Trebol should have just killed him, instead left him alive while he was trying to kill the dwarves when he was stepping on them, or Sugar to turn him into a toy, instead she goes right next to him and gets shocked when a poisonous grape makes him look ridiculous, so that she faints out of shock.Why should Trebol have just killed him? His role is protect Sugar. If he decides to kill, immobilize or hurt sugar attacker is a decision for only Trebol to make at that moment, and all of them are plausible and acceptable decisions. Trebol decided to beat him to a pulp and immobilize him.
The decision that he made previously against other targets as nothing to do with that decision.
The decision of Killing or turning into a Toy is one for Sugar to make, and like Trebol decision both are plausible and acceptable decisions. She decided to kill him with the Tatabasco.
The grape wasn't poisonous! I'm seeing that your problem is the difference between poison and spicy. Spicy is any substance that "burns" the tongue and a lot of people put in the food to eat. Poison is any substance that in ingestion causes disturbances to the organism in a MOLECULAR SCALE. -
To be fair, a face like that would also scare some grownups.
As for the poison/spicy arguement. The way people react to poison and something being spicy is really different. Sugar just expected Ussop to die from the poison. If he was knocked out, he probably wouldn't even reacted while the poison took effect. She wasn't prepared for the freakout spicy face which happened immediately. It caught her completely off guard. It looking as crazy as it did just freaked her out more.
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Nice to know that Sugar is frail psychologically, I love non-mentioned incredibly convenient facts. There's been so many shocking moments, it's just good to know to this one time when it needed to be this way (because Oda also can't have the kid being KO'd), it happens this time.
Why did you reach that conclusion for what I said? Are you saying that old people with heart problems are psychologically frail?
Physiologically means physical!
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hei, about SOP Operation, it's big success, isn't it? since Sugar was Offguard and Panic. Ah, and about sugar i think there's something that we still don't know about her. Remember, (well, i forget what chapter it is) when Trebol told Sugar that they don't know anything about Sugar.
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@DēBON!!!:
hei, about SOP Operation, it's big success, isn't it? since Sugar was Offguard and Panic. Ah, and about sugar i think there's something that we still don't know about her. Remember, (well, i forget what chapter it is) when Trebol told Sugar that they don't know anything about Sugar.
That was just refering to them (SHs) not knowing about Sugar. So Trebol was basically reassuring Sugar not to worry since they're only after the factory and not her. It wasn't a reference to some super secret Sugar is hiding.
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Except that you know.. she's not a kid. The only way she's a child is in physical form, she is at least as old as Luffy, Ussop and Nami, possibly being older than someone like Robin depending when she got the fruit. But I get it, you want her to remain exactly the same mentally despite living a lot more than her physical form portrays.. it's the only way you're trying to explain this situation.
The reason why most children react in a more exaggerated way has nothing to do with experience, but with how undeveloped their nervous system is. Note that I'm not talking about why more things scare them. That is because they are inexperienced about the world. I'm talking about the reactions when they are surprised suddenly. That has nothing to do with experience because it doesn't even reach the brain. And notice that I said most children and not all, because some kids react why better than some adults. In the end it varies from person to person, but normally when the person his young reacts more strongly.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
You really love clutching at straws, don't you? Oda should hire you as his PR man.
I'm just saying that exaggeration in the world of One Piece, specially moments of comedy, is a normal occurrence in One Piece and you nor anybody, should be shocked about that. The only reason Sugar passed-out with a scare was because of exaggeration.
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How will Kyros fight after getting back to normal? :wassat:
He only has one leg… and I think that he cannot fly or run with ONE leg!Kinimon fought brook decent enough with ONLY his torso. No head or legs. He had to jump around using one arm and fight with another.
I should think being only 1 leg would be much easier than this. And the hype that Kyros has, i imagine he will be just fine.
Don't forget this is also from the manga where the author states that Shanks is not any weaker with 1 arm than he is with 2 arms.
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I for one, am happy that Sugar was knocked out because now we can FINALLY get the plot moving. Bring on the chaos and destruction!
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Ussop attacks, trebol recovers.
Trebol attacks ussop.
He does the "tears from the eyes"-funny face while running for cover.Ussop internal dialogue "oh crap crap crap".
Trebol: [some mocking comment making fun of how weak he is]
Cut to people cheering him on (toys and crew mate), as a pan out view shows the shipyard slowly getting destroyed by Trebol attacking him and ussop avoiding (b/c you know he's good at dodging)
Cuts back to him getting his ass owned with some scraps of stuff being thrown at him, so ussop slowly gets wounded (showing it isn't an easy fight).
Internal dialogue: "I should've ran, oh well, I'm going to die might as well take sugar down while I'm at it. (or something like that)."
Ussop tries attacking again and does his "watch out or my 3422349 thousand followers will get you…etc." thing, another ship throw right at him, and another hilarious One Piece ::gulp:: scared face.Eventually battle takes him to where the other enslaved dwarves are, and he sees how badly they are treated, Trebol taunts him more and more. Ussop snaps, he uses a barrage of attacks to distract Trebol, while laying down some traps without Trebol noticing (over confidence of a logia who just takes the attack and gets cut up again instead of avoiding the attack), and then smoke screen They can't see anything else besides maybe a meter or two in front of them, as sugar is walking around, anticipating an attack she gets tangled in a plant (trap laid by ussop earlier) and can't move. Ussop by this point would've snuck right by her and attacks her with his 1000000 ton hammer, she opens her mouth in shock at which point he throws the chilli grape into her mouth and she does the funny fire breath and passes out....
^ that is how i imagined it going. A lot of "oh shit" funny face moments, more character growth and ussop winning without actually taking down Trebol.
And how do you fit in the parts where Oda is not ready to unveil any of officers attacks into this bedtime story? Again Usopp came back to save the dwarves from getting killed. He doesn't give two fingers about SOP.
This forum can be funny at times. If someone said Luffy should defeat Mingo while having Fujitora on his tail. They do be laughed at and given an award at the end of year. Here we multitudes wishing Usopp to disable Sugar while tanking Trebol. Just because erm…...Usopp is smart? Goodness me!!!
IF YOU DIE, I'LL KILL YOU….
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And how do you fit in the parts where Oda is not ready to unveil any of officers attacks into this bedtime story? Again Usopp came back to save the dwarves from getting killed. He doesn't give two fingers about SOP.
This forum can be funny at times. If someone said Luffy should defeat Mingo while having Fujitora on his tail. They do be laughed at and given an award at the end of year. Here we multitudes wishing Usopp to disable Sugar while tanking Trebol. Just because erm…...Usopp is smart? Goodness me!!!
It also makes Trebol look alot worse than from what we've seen of him in the manga. Ussop is able to dodge his attacks when Trebol has been shown to be super fast and extremely accurate with his attacks. Ussop is able to set up numerous traps without Trebol noticing when he was able to catch on pretty fast that Robin was trying to trick him. So Trebol isn't really a gullible type of character. But whatever…........let's see more fanfics of Ussop taking down Sugar while he's being attacked by Trebol.
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Trebol didn't need to put any energy towards killing Usopp because there would be no point. We pretty much saw that he managed to restrain him without so much as breaking a sweat. And on top of that, Usopp was pretty badly beaten up as well. Having to resort to killing Usopp was pretty much unnecessary since he was incapacitated in nearly every conceivable way.
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How did I put those moments together?
They were all serious moments played as a joke! Simple. Enel moment is similar to the moment where Crocodile was pounding Luffy in the tomb, but Luffy was always getting back. In Enel it was played for laughs(and the chapter even ended with Luffy pounding Enel. Basically a week where it wasn't sure if Enel had completely loosed or if he was gonna fight back in any way), in Crocodile it was played to be Epic and serious.
Luffy moment with Sabo is similar to the moment where the Strawhat found that Merry was still alive in Ennies Lobby. Luffy with Sabo was played for laughs, the Merry Go wasn't.
All those similar moments you could interchange them(Make Enel make a serious face of surprise and Crocodile make a funny face of surprise. Make Luffy cry and Smile while crying when he found Sabo was still alive and Ussop(or other member of the strawhats) make a funny face of surprise when finding that Merry was still "alive").
Choosing the moment to be serious or funny is irrelevant if done right. This moment with sugar was done right. She got surprised by Ussop eating the Grape that she thought would make him die, while he had a super spicy attack.Common readers(This includes me and you) shouldn't talk about technical words all the time to try to express how they feel about how something in the story was treated. You use a lot the expression Plot device, and in a negative way. Every conflict trigger and resolution in a story is technically a "plot device". Please don't use "plot device" like is something special and bad. Talk just about the scene -> "The event was badly written" suffix or "The event was badly handled and forced".
Now it wasn't badly written, because it makes a lot of logic in fiction and it was prepared gradually and smoothly. Look at the first appearance of the grape and it explanation, look at all the instances Sugar thought the grape was poisonous, look at her decision to give Ussop the grape, look at her expectations to his reaction of her giving the grape to him, look at the surprise and the exaggeration of the surprise she had. All of them make a lot of sense and merge well with the story and the fiction, specially the exaggeration of reactions, this is basically a law of One Piece(and a reason some people say they can't get to One Piece). There is nothing in that scene that isn't plausible in One Piece world.When I said frail people, I'm not talking of emotionally, I'm talking of physiologically. It doesn't matter if you're the biggest murder or if you are an adult or anything, when things happen totally out of your expectations, in a short period of time you react(and depending in the situation you freak out). The event is so fast that isn't your brain that process it, but your spinal cord, because she reacts faster than your brain. Now, as I said in my previous post, that fast reaction will increase the levels of adrenaline, the heart will suddenly increase the beating rate where during that acceleration some beats will be irregular causing momentarily bad blood flow in the body, and other things. If physiologically a person is frail, they can pass out because of it(if you don't know, people pass out because of low blood flow in the brain. It doesn't matter what causes that low blood flow, as soon as the flow decreases to a dangerous level, your brain shuts down. That is the reason why after someone passes out people give sweet water, because that helps the flow of your blood to stabilize), having an heart attack, an AVC or other problem. This happens in real life is not some invention. Old people hearts normally don't work well, and because of that is advised that they don't have exhilarating experiences. That is because that can make them pass out or worse having an heart attack or something else bad.
About she being a kid. That isn't because kids are more frail, but because kids react in a more exaggerated way than adults. Is Normally funnier to make a prank to a kid than an adult, because of that. It has nothing to do with kids being more innocent.
The thing that I talked about exaggeration is something that is commonly seen in One Piece and his seen in these scene has well. Normally in a good scare the victim looses his breath for some seconds(and reacts funny :)). If you take the simple exaggeration that this scare was over 9000 better than a good scare, than his easy to understand that she pass out.
One thing is if you were expecting something different, something not comical, and because of that(or not because of that) didn't thought the scene was specially funny. Other thing is saying this scene was badly written, something that it wasn't.
You can say that this resolution wasn't satisfactory for you, but to say it doesn't make any sense, it came from nowhere and it was forced, is completely wrong.
I don't even know why I have to talk about the physiology of the reaction of surprise and why she reacts the way she reacts. That should be obviously to the reader and seen as a normal reaction in her case. The passing out should be simple understood as well.thank you for this post..:wub:
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Trebol didn't need to put any energy towards killing Usopp because there would be no point. We pretty much saw that he managed to restrain him without so much as breaking a sweat. And on top of that, Usopp was pretty badly beaten up as well. Having to resort to killing Usopp was pretty much unnecessary since he was incapacitated in nearly every conceivable way.
This. Its not like he is a top officer for one of the most sadistic villains around. The man has principles dammit. What would Doflamingo say if he had killed Ussop, the poor guy would be out of a job.
Usopp is a sniper who uses plants as a weapon. Why not have the dwarves and robin engage trebol while usopp terrorizes sugar from long range. Thats kind of his style with his freaky attacks but nah, lets have him run away like a coward. Get totally beat up and fluke a win. Makes more sense.
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I'm just saying that exaggeration in the world of One Piece, specially moments of comedy, is a normal occurrence in One Piece and you nor anybody, should be shocked about that. The only reason Sugar passed-out with a scare was because of exaggeration.
Perhaps she had some latent phobia involving seeing someone's eyeballs and tongue writhe out of their skulls like snakes–probably bloodshot after eating that fiery substance? Though I'm sure it had more to do with Usopp practically being in a coma and suddenly bursting to life like an oozing zombie and wailing his head off like a banshee, with his grotesque face fault as merely icing on the cake to scaring her out of her mind.
And before anyone suggests that those eyes were mere visual exaggeration, remember back during the Bon Clay vs Sanji fight in which Bon Clay physically kicked Sanji's heart-shaped eyeball as it stretched two feet out of its socket (My eye!!) ? It pretty much established that the series inhabits a cartoon universe in which their eyes, teeth etc are literally flying off their faces, so Sugar pretty much saw the panel face as is.
Though some of the interpretations here are funny ones too. KO'd by noxious tabasco breath? CoC unleashed through a searing hot gastrointestinal system (Usopp's rumble balls!)? Loving it!
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This. Its not like he is a top officer for one of the most sadistic villains around. The man has principles dammit. What would Doflamingo say if he had killed Ussop, the poor guy would be out of a job.
Usopp is a sniper who uses plants as a weapon. Why not have the dwarves and robin engage trebol while usopp terrorizes sugar from long range. Thats kind of his style with his freaky attacks but nah, lets have him run away like a coward. Get totally beat up and fluke a win. Makes more sense.
You mean the dwarves that Trebol round up in an instant? Oh btw, Robin did engage Trebol for about 60secs or less and Trebol recovered and respond quickly.
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Maybe this has already been discussed, but how did Doflamingo know Kyros' wife is the princess? Do you think it will be clarified in later chapters? Or are we supposed to assume that Doflamingo just known by interrogating people in the palace/ gain info via Monet ?
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Maybe this has already been discussed, but how did Doflamingo know Kyros' wife is the princess? Do you think it will be clarified in later chapters? Or are we supposed to assume that Doflamingo just known by interrogating people in the palace/ gain info via Monet ?
16 chars of via Violet.
I'm up all night to get lucky. -
My prediction next chapter is that the scene will transfer to sanji's team.
Cause the sop operation has been done, the beautiful flashback of kyros was over
so it would be possible to change scene ^_^
just saying
