Nami and zoro!
…I feel zoro should be near more luffys level.
Nami to eat a Devil Fruit…..........Yeah, you heard me!
Nami and zoro!
…I feel zoro should be near more luffys level.
Nami to eat a Devil Fruit…..........Yeah, you heard me!
I had a thread like this a lil way ago i will post some of the stuff from that thread.
@MonkeyDMalcolm:
Getting back on topic. Seeing how the SHP have encountered Aokiji, CP9, Moria and Kuma. The difference in power is obvious they we're able to overcome the CP9 and Moria. However with the new world fast approaching and the possibility of another/stronger shichibukai they world all need to level up some how.
Luffy- Gears only bring him to a certain level and i don't think they will be a huge factor when coming to the new world.
Zoro- Has Asura which may possibly launch him to the next level if it becomes fully developed or mastered.
Sanji- Diable Jambe his strongest attack was able to defeat one of the CP9 with it doubt it would have done anything to Lucci. I don't think this technique can take him much futher what can he do to be elevated to the next level.
Robin- Alot of clutches and grappling. She needs an upgrade in her physical strength and hand to hand combat. I doubt that she would go the route of judo but she needs a something to push her over the top.
Franky- he's an Cyborg so it would be hard for him to become stronger. He can't really undergo physical training to be stronger. He needs an upgrade or something.
Nami- Had a weapon upgrade in the last arc. Made her stronger several folds. I think she would need some way to upgrade her speed and the power of her weapon.
Chopper- He has the rumble balls. After overconsumption's of the rumble balls he becomes Monster Point. He has no control of the Monster Point. So an upgrade of the rumble balls and being able to control the Monster Point will ultimately lead to chopper becoming stronger.
Usopp/Sogeking- Snipper no hand to hand combat skills. Fails to hit fast targets. Takes hits well and he's fast. Weapon Kabuto. Deception is his best tactic. Need strength upgrade and a weapon upgrade. Needs to be able to hit fast moving targets.
I didn't include brooke back then because he was new to the crew and we really didn't see him fight. However I will say now that he will need to up his endurance as he became tired out from fighting the flying fish riders.
Put it like this. We know that Shichibuiki + Admirals == Yonkou. Thus if Luffy wants to be pirate king he needs to basically be on the level of Shichibuiki/Admirals + Yonkou as do Zoro and Sanji.
luffy could eat another devilfruit because he´s made of rubber and cant explode…
zorros cursed could give him a power up
sanji could wear wheits around his feet
usopp could actually eat a devilfruit because he´s the weakest
nami too
chopper could learn to control monsterchopper or he could invent another kind of rumbleball with the help of doctor vegapunk
robin could maybe clone herself or control the size of her hands
franky could get an cyborg update if they meet dr vegapunk
and about brook, i have no idea...
luffy could eat another devilfruit because he´s made of rubber and cant explode…
NOOOOO HE STILL WOULD! EPIC FAILURE
zorros cursed could give him a power up
WHAT? That makes NO sense AT ALL.
sanji could wear wheits around his feet
God no >< No more WEIGHTS!
usopp could actually eat a devilfruit because he´s the weakest
He's getting better, the Dials make him actually formidable. He needs NO DEVIL FRUIT. The crew NEEDS non-hammers in their crew.
nami too
GOD NO.
chopper could learn to control monsterchopper
Maybe….
or he could invent another kind of rumbleball with the help of doctor vegapunk
NO. 99% Sure Vegapunk is a villain.
robin could maybe clone herself
Yes, sounds excellent, is your post getting better?
or control the size of her hands
NO, nvm, still failing.
franky could get an cyborg update if they meet dr vegapunk
NO, just NO.
if anything of this things happens, you will call me god and kiss my feet^^
and if (the more likely scenario) none of it happens?
if anything of this things happens, you will call me god and kiss my feet^^
What will you do if it never happens. :P
Sorry, but your predictions are kinda obvious. Oda doesn't do the obvious, he does the unexpected.
Plus one already happened. Remember against Moria she used dozens of arms to create 5 giant ones.
I don't know, but I always imagine Robin's future ability to copy herself. You know, some clones, or something like that…
Sounds like "Kage Bunshin no Jutsu", hehe (shame over me!)
I don't quite understand why everyone thinks that Nami, robin, and chopper need power ups.
Luffy said that there were people who were not strong that were on his ship, but he still wanted to bring them along. That's why he made the gears technique.
Now, Zoro and Sanji might want to get a power up, and indeed may in this arc, but I don't think everyone needs to get a power up. Not yet anyways.
I really want to see what powers Brooke pulls out this saga. He's faster than anybody else in the crew, and he showed his lullaby move, but I want to see how he does his major damage aside from just swordfighting.
I also want to see more Franky weapons. They're always a delight to see a new one.
Maybe Chopper invents a new form. I think it was implied that he could make up new ones when he first ate his rumble ball.
Want to see Robin pull out some moves that involve things besides her hands.
And when I heard Sanji say that he wouldn't use his hands to fight, I couldn't help but imagine that if he chose to, he would be almost unbeatable. Not bloody likely, since he's training in kick fighting. Also, more knife-fighting Sanji
But what I like about One Piece is that everyone powers up realistically (so to speak). You don't look at the character and feel like you've forgotten what they used to be. You see the progress they made, since most of it was gradual or just logically tied to their original skills. That's where Bleach, Naruto, and DBZ failed: Super Saiyan Syndrome
well luffy usually powers up after experiencing some event. he learned soru when he fought cp9 but god knows where he learned gears from. anyways since he experienced that huge power upgrade at thriller bark thanks to all those shadows i think he will make an attack based off of that. luffy really needs to learn how to use soru with out using gears and gain some power technique that will let him fight without using gears as well.
well luffy usually powers up after experiencing some event. he learned soru when he fought cp9 but god knows where he learned gears from. anyways since he experienced that huge power upgrade at thriller bark thanks to all those shadows i think he will make an attack based off of that. luffy really needs to learn how to use soru with out using gears and gain some power technique that will let him fight without using gears as well.
When did he get an power upgrade? I don't think taking away his Fatique is upgrade. Unless you are talking about Nightmare Luffy, which was a temp. powerup which we'll never see or hear about again.
I don't quite understand why everyone thinks that Nami, robin, and chopper need power ups.
Luffy said that there were people who were not strong that were on his ship, but he still wanted to bring them along. That's why he made the gears technique.
Now, Zoro and Sanji might want to get a power up, and indeed may in this arc, but I don't think everyone needs to get a power up. Not yet anyways.
I agree, I think it'd be much better to have more team battles in which the weaker members cover each other's weaknesses. Remeber Sanji's 'speech' to Usopp "you do what I can't do/I do what you can't do".
Also, I dont think its that people dont like 'power up's', but in series such as DBZ and Bleach where you see power-up's with alot of build up-supposedly 50 years training needed to acquire Bankai,'Super Saiyjin' supposed to be a myth(?)-and then see everyone and thier dog use it over and over again. Basically,it gets stale quick.
Saying that though, I think Oda has done a good job in balancing them out-I dont see why Chopper's 'Monster Point' has been called a power up when he can potentially harm his friends and himself when using it. The same with Gear 2nd/3rd in terms of the drawbacks. Not so much with Diable Jambe though(that felt a bit thrown in at the last minute IMO).
I like Diable Jambe think it brings him closer to being like Zeff maybe blood wasn't the real reason his foot was red.
Its true Choppers Monster point is like your final move before your killed by an overwhelming opponent and afterwards your dieing from being in the form
Gears drawbacks have been stated and luffy would need another different power up without the side effects.
Zoro is in a bad way and if he gets a power up i think its not gonna be one of those one of techniques but a technique well thought out by Oda to be used by Zoro a bit more like he uses his pound techniques (even though some could say his gorrilla attack is a power up i still think he needs more)
Group fights between the weaker 3 would be the best way for them to power up without seeming too fake.
For the mid 3 except for robin their preety new and i don't see how franky or brooks could get a meaningful good powerup without it seeming too much/fake
I think they will meet vegapunk in the new world soon, and then many df oppurtunities will be presented. Vegapunk will give nami's clima-tact some sort of df, sanji will get seastone toed/heeled shoes, zoro will get a seastone sword, chopper will learn to control his transformations better, franky will get an upgrade, etc.
Also, in reference to choppers monster point. It's not really a power up, but rather it's more like a last resort. Zoro said to Ussop that Monster Chopper looked like the one close to death rather then themselves.
Speaking of power ups, I was wondering just how changeable Franky's body is. I know he built himself, but could he repair himself? Or could someone else do it? What if he was blown in half and they met the guy who made Bartholomew Kuma? And could he modify his weapons to be bigger and badder?
Speaking of power ups, I was wondering just how changeable Franky's body is. I know he built himself, but could he repair himself? Or could someone else do it? What if he was blown in half and they met the guy who made Bartholomew Kuma? And could he modify his weapons to be bigger and badder?
99% sure vegapunk is on the government's side.
so I'm 99.9% sure that Vega wouldn't repair franky, when franky could do it himself. because like you said he made himself, I'm sure he's repaired himself before as well.
Oh yeah, I want them to power up! ^^
Chopper should gain control over his monster, it'd be cool.
As for Nami, her weapon is fine but she still lacks speed.
New attacks for Luffy, Zoro, Sanji and Robin of course!
Franky's body should be ameliorated a bit.
And I want to see more of Brook's attacks and of Ussop's Kabuto's powers! ^^
well luffy usually powers up after experiencing some event. he learned soru when he fought cp9 but …..
Well, Luffy doesn't learn Soru. Maybe, he doesn't even know the name of it.
He use the gears to simulate an ability that seems like Soru. Only that.
Well, Luffy doesn't learn Soru. Maybe, he doesn't even know the name of it.
He use the gears to simulate an ability that seems like Soru. Only that.
Re read luffy vs Bluno of the cp9 he clearly says hes using Soru and luffy thanks him for the technique
and maybe reread another few arcs of one piece
Re read luffy vs Bluno of the cp9 he clearly says hes using Soru and luffy thanks him for the technique
He thanks for the idea of technique. It's impossible he learn Soru in so short time!
He thanks for the idea of technique. It's impossible he learn Soru in so short time!
luffy even explains how the techniqued worked so yeah he did learn it
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/388/07/
now heres luffy explaining it
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/388/09/
so again luffy knows how to use soru
What if Chopper learn to use Bio Feedback( don't know if the name is correct. The same thing Kumadori and Lucci used)? He can grow gradually to a monster without rumbleballs.
Imagine a combination of jump,arm and horn-point at the same time. Bio Feedback Chopper = bad ass monster without time limit.
I think they will meet vegapunk in the new world soon, and then many df oppurtunities will be presented. Vegapunk will give nami's clima-tact some sort of df, sanji will get seastone toed/heeled shoes, zoro will get a seastone sword, chopper will learn to control his transformations better, franky will get an upgrade, etc.
Zoro will never use a seastone-sword. It is not honourous in his eyes. His best sword will be the one from Kuina.
He thanks for the idea of technique. It's impossible he learn Soru in so short time!
Nothing's impossible in a shonen.
Zoro will never use a seastone-sword. It is not honourous in his eyes. His best sword will be the one from Kuina.
LOL WHUT?
…Sorry,but this sounds quite silly(Kuina's sword being the best that is-im not saying it's bad but it wont be the best sword)
LOL WHUT?
…Sorry,but this sounds quite silly(Kuina's sword being the best that is-im not saying it's bad but it wont be the best sword)
your not understanding what he means
the guys saying that Kuina's sword is Zoro's best sword and its unlikly Zoro will ever change that sword as its the sword that was meant to be used by KUINA to complete her dreams and now its Zoro's
and its true Zoro would never use a seastone he would never want that kind of an advantage over his opponent
unless he was just that far naturally stronger than his opponent.
LOL WHUT?
…Sorry,but this sounds quite silly(Kuina's sword being the best that is-im not saying it's bad but it wont be the best sword)
Um what? THAT sounds quite silly.
Kuina's sword stood up to the best sword in the world, Hawkeye's.
LOL WHUT?
…Sorry,but this sounds quite silly(Kuina's sword being the best that is-im not saying it's bad but it wont be the best sword)
no point of reasoning with this guy and plus its off topic
Without one seastone sword, how is he supposed to fight logias? Also, I'm pretty sure hawkeye's sword is seastone and possibly the black one zoro recieved on thriller bark. After all, it was said it's greatest characteristic was it's hardness and seastone is supposed to be as hard as diamond and it's black. Not an unreasonable presumption, I think.
So the other day, my friend and I were having talking about Bleach since he just recently bought this Bleach Box set with volumes 1-21, and now the kid is head over heels for it. Cool, I guess. I don't know how One Piece got into the discussion, but yeah he really respects One Piece and everything, but he has this weird idea that One Piece has no explanation how the characters get stronger or learn new moves. That caught my attention.
This is how I see it. Oda shows natural growth in his characters. Since this is a manga with no power system that completely determines the fight's outcome like reiatsu and chakra, Oda has a lot more freedom, and can give the readers a lot more to speculate when it comes to characters fighting instead of just saying "Oh he has more chakra, so therefore he can pull bigger moves." and stuff.
Another thing I enjoy about this manga is that there is no way for a character to automatically jump into top tier within a short period of time. Training arcs tend to make characters godly for a short period of time, until the villain is cornered, and pulls something epic out of his ass, kicking the hero around for a bit, until some other random deus ex ish thing develops within the character.
what do you think? How do you think the characters in this series progress in overall power, and which do you prefer? Training or natural growth?
Fighting is training. They get stronger through battles.
Another thing I enjoy about this manga is that there is no way for a character to automatically jump into top tier within a short period of time. Training arcs tend to make characters godly for a short period of time, until the villain is cornered, and pulls something epic out of his ass, kicking the hero around for a bit, until some other random deus ex ish thing develops within the character.
This is probably one of the best things about One Piece. I absolutly love that Oda has avoided the power ranking cliche that appears to be in most Shonen Manga. I always thought one of Akira Toriyama's biggest mistakes in Dragonball was introducing Power Levels. I hate those things with a passion.
One Piece does have power levels, but only Fukurou can see them. And of course, it doesn't account for the devil fruit skills. Still, I did kind of lol when that happened.
I love the style of One Piece's progression, and how all the fighters get stronger. I have no complaints with it, but…
I will say though, all of a sudden in Enies Lobby and Thriller Bark, most of the crew suddenly pulled out insane new techniques out of nowhere.
Not that I have any complaint, but it's true that Oda does pull things out of nowhere, and it's not necessarily natural or gradual.
Luffy's Gear Second and Third, Sanji's Diable Jambe, Zoro's Asura, Chopper's Monster Point, and Robin's ability to fly briefly on wings made of many arms, and also to use giant amounts of arms to create a giant hand.
It's like, all of a sudden Luffy can do those insane Gear things, Sanji can catch on fire, Zoro can have three faces and six arms (though not literally), Chopper can turn into a giant monster, an Robin can use an almost infinite amount of limbs to make seemingly anything of any size.
I really like it, change is exciting, and that's part of why Water 7/Enies Lobby and Thriller Bark are my favorite arcs. But it wasn't exactly gradual or natural, it was just all of a sudden after all this time some crazy exciting new things just changed everything.
I'm just waiting for Luffy to finally be able to harness his fighting power into a ball of energy, and be able to throw that fireball hadoken at somebody. That's all I'm asking for.
Training arcs grind everything to a halt. They're always just some boring and or silly explanation as for why the characters skill/power/whatever jumps by leaps and bounds. The funniest one I've ever read had to be Naruto's. After a three year period of training he comes back, kinda sucks, then goes into some training arc where he jumps by a bigger leap than he seemingly did during three years of training did, in only a few days.
Then Luffy just sort of figures out how the CP9 guys jump while in the air, then he does it. Simple, believable and wastes zero time. The Gear 2nd and 3rd thing I attribute to him just having a better and better understanding of his body after so many battles. Culminating in him figuring out what he's capable of.
i like that Oda does this yes i do believe that they all got stronger naturally after so many battles and adventures they have gotten stronger.
but that doesn't mean that they are all powerful of course if it was like that it would be boring.
like someone said there is a ranking system but only fuku can see it apprantly.
anyways training arcs yeah i don't like them unless it has a meaning to them i think?
Its generaly good but i wish it was less sudden with the gears like an accidental activation or something along those lines.
@Psycho_Kenshin:
One Piece does have power levels, but only Fukurou can see them. And of course, it doesn't account for the devil fruit skills. Still, I did kind of lol when that happened.
Bounties are a very rough system of power levels that at least give each fighter a specific scope. The only reason they gave Fukurou that ability was to emphasize just how much stronger Lucci and Kaku were without labeling them with bounties (and, seeing as they were government employees, that would've been a silly thing to do). With all the other Marines and such, their rank determines their strength, but we really had no way to guage the CP9.
@Psycho_Kenshin:
I will say though, all of a sudden in Enies Lobby and Thriller Bark, most of the crew suddenly pulled out insane new techniques out of nowhere.
They do train, you know. Oda just doesn't waste our time by making us watch them. Especially for an anime-only person like you, it's shown many times that Zoro is constantly training aboard the ship. Chopper and Robin's moves were from before they met the Strawhats anyways; there simply wasn't a desperate enough time before this to use them.
@Psycho_Kenshin:
Not that I have any complaint, but it's true that Oda does pull things out of nowhere, and it's not necessarily natural or gradual.
Zoro slowly increases his speed and the intensity of his blows even NUMERICALLY from fight to fight. Each fight he's that much stronger. The same's true for Sanji. I really have no idea what you're talking about except for Luffy, and the whole point of Luffy is he pulls these wild ideas out of his ass. Which is natural for him.
@Psycho_Kenshin:
It's like, all of a sudden Luffy can do those insane Gear things, Sanji can catch on fire, Zoro can have three faces and six arms (though not literally), Chopper can turn into a giant monster, an Robin can use an almost infinite amount of limbs to make seemingly anything of any size.
If Luffy's Gears were anything but spontanious it wouldn't be Luffy. Sanji and Zoro both had natural progressions; hell, the Arlong Arc even foreshadows Zoro's ability if you read deeply between the lines. Chopper and Robin were not spontanious at all; they both clearly explained that they had done these techniques before (it's why Chopper knows what will happen to him and Robin says her wings will only last for about five seconds). Besides, there never seemed to be a limit on how many limbs Robin could produce before; she just never had a need to make them. She's only been in two real battles.
@Psycho_Kenshin:
I'm just waiting for Luffy to finally be able to harness his fighting power into a ball of energy, and be able to throw that fireball hadoken at somebody. That's all I'm asking for.
Please, just go watch your Naruto already and leave One Piece to the real fans. One Piece may not be particularly deep, but even so, you don't get it, do you =\
Here's a brief response to your giant post:
Like I said, I wasn't complaining. I love everything about One Piece the way it is. I was just pointing out how around Enies Lobby suddenly everybody got insane new attacks.
And it is funny that Luffy gaining the ability to become hot and steaming, supersonically fast, or giant limbed is believable, but you mock my lighthearted suggestion of a fireball-ish attack.
I'm a bit of a black sheep on the forums, I like weapon based upgrades like kabato and clima tact. Also I like training arcs. I'm just plain wierd that way.
If Luffy's Gears were anything but spontanious it wouldn't be Luffy. Sanji and Zoro both had natural progressions; hell, the Arlong Arc even foreshadows Zoro's ability if you read deeply between the lines. Chopper and Robin were not spontanious at all; they both clearly explained that they had done these techniques before (it's why Chopper knows what will happen to him and Robin says her wings will only last for about five seconds). Besides, there never seemed to be a limit on how many limbs Robin could produce before; she just never had a need to make them. She's only been in two real battles.
Heck and even luffy had some basis. Gear 2 was based off soru. and gear 3's bone balloon seems like a natural step form the regular balloon. And it's not cannon, but robin made a comibned a huge arm in one of movies (I want to say four or five, but I have no real clue).
@Capt:
And it's not cannon, but robin made a comibned a huge arm in one of movies (I want to say four or five, but I have no real clue).
Yep, that was movie 4. And also they showed Luffy's Gear Second in Movie 7, although that was after it had been revealed in the manga for that one.
And Oda is the man, he does make everything fit. Once he reveals a crazy new move, a logical explanation is certainly present.
Just sayin', I don't think gradually over time is necessarily how I'd put it, since I pretty much associate Enies Lobby and after that to be when we suddenly started seeing all these radical new techniques.
And it was great, really shook things up, kept it fresh.
Training arcs are ass and you are criminal to want them.
Anyone else noticed the slow but progressive increase in technology, too? We started off with matchlocks, and then moved quickly to flintlocks, then revolvers, and now we've got semi-automatic rifles in Impel Down, a cyborg, a sea train, among many other things.
That is true, there's a progressive increase there, which is cool. There are also sudden revelations, I mean the technology revealed in Kuma was meant to be shocking and out of nowhere.
Kuma is one of my favorite characters, mostly because of how shocking and crazy that was.
@Psycho_Kenshin:
Here's a brief response to your giant post:
Like I said, I wasn't complaining. I love everything about One Piece the way it is. I was just pointing out how around Enies Lobby suddenly everybody got insane new attacks.
And it is funny that Luffy gaining the ability to become hot and steaming, supersonically fast, or giant limbed is believable, but you mock my lighthearted suggestion of a fireball-ish attack.
I know you're weren't complaining; I was just pointing out the falsity of what you said. I didn't mean offense until the last statement, but hell, I make my own ridiculous claims. None as bad as that, but even so.
I've also noticed the increase in technology. Cyborgs are of course the most obvious, but also the ways the Den Den Mushis can be used have grown to our level of technology. First was just the normal phones, then the cell phone-like ones, then the spy Den Den Mushis, and now we have camera ones. It's awesome how versatile those snails are 8D
Hmm, where is Vanessa when you need her? Oda has a tendency to introduce a form of "power levels" per arc. Maybe not as blatantly in each arc, and maybe not at all, but he does do it. The difference is that actual threat in One Piece cannot be measured by one element, and thus cannot be measured at all. Douriki is likely the closest we will ever come to real power levels, but as mentioned even that does not determine anything other than basic stats. Strength, speed, and maybe flexibility or something are likely all that are calculated with douriki. Given that, skill and experience, as well as a Devil's Fruit, can change everything. Circumstances and locations change things too, keeping a nice balance.
As to the actual question, the closest answer would be "off-screen". We know that some things are learned during battle (Zoro's Breath, Nami's Clima Tact, Luffy's Soru, etc.), while other things are trained for or learned off screen. Luffy mentions training so he can become stronger after fighting Aokiji, which is how Gear 2nd and 3rd came about. Zoro is always seen weight training. Strength and skill are complemented and grown through experience, or at least that is how we see it most often. On a similar note, the power ladder in One Piece isn't a straight incline, so you can expect to see ups and downs as they fight various people with different powers and abilities.
Lastly, there is one minor inconsistency. Well, not really inconsistent, just confusing. We can pretty much follow timeliness through the series, so we know that not much time has passed since they entered the Grand Line. Since then, however, we have seen fair sized jumps in power from all of the characters. This means that, despite the small amount of time between arcs, the crew has had time to either train or heal up and grow naturally in strength. Not that big a deal either way, but I thought it was worth mentioning.