Smart choice to debut Batman in action by showing him beat up Juggalos.
DC Movies Thread - Shazam saves the day
-
-
What the hell are Juggalos?
-
Justice League Snyder cut trailer, Suicide Squad movie trailer, Suicide Squad videogame trailer, info on Black Adam, info on Teen Titans next season And a New Batman movie trailer
Holy shit big day for DC
-
Also out of curiosity from the trailer (and to update myself) I looked up The Batman and it has Colin Farrell cast as The Penguin. How the hell did they decide to cast a gorgeous Irish Man as the fucking Penguin? (also Paul Dano as The Riddler which should be . . . . interesting.)
And kudos for making the first Black Jim Gordon.
-
Jebus, Pattinson looks hot in this movie. O.o
-
What the hell are Juggalos?
People who idolize the Insane Clown Posse.
Also out of curiosity from the trailer (and to update myself) I looked up The Batman and it has Colin Farrell cast as The Penguin. How the hell did they decide to cast a gorgeous Irish Man as the fucking Penguin?
The same way they can put pretty boy Heath Ledger in white face paint and green hair dye which becomes progressively disheveled
-
For anyone who didn't notice, that's Riddler in the mask.
Also, Reeves said he used Ego by Darwyn Cooke as inspiration for Bruce's journey. It will be Bruce's 2nd year as Batman.
Best part was Jeffrey Wright's Gordon
-
Certainly better than starting off with an over-the-hill Bruce Wayne. But it looks like they're going to be attempting to cram way too much into it. Hope that's not the case.
-
People who idolize the Insane Clown Posse.
The same way they can put pretty boy Heath Ledger in white face paint and green hair dye which becomes progressively disheveled
Who are the Insane Clown Posse? Joker cult?
And it'd better be the miracle-level transformation that was Heath Ledger, because I cannot put "hot Irish guy" and "The Penguin" in one image.
-
Somebody put an end to Snyder’s career and his salt right cult fanbase already.
-
Who are the Insane Clown Posse? Joker cult?
Insane Clown Posse is a hip-hop duo that wear clown makeup. Most notably, they made this song.
-
Insane Clown Posse is a hip-hop duo that wear clown makeup.
And sometimes wrestlers, not terribly good wrestlers.
-
. . . . . okay then.
-
Seeing that trailer so many of the Squad are gonna die
If King Shark eats one of them that'll make me happy. Aside from that go crazy with the deaths
-
Seeing that trailer so many of the Squad are gonna die
If King Shark eats one of them that'll make me happy. Aside from that go crazy with the deaths
Wait, there's also already a trailer for The Suicide Squad? Or were you referring to the Batman trailer? Because that one would have to take place way in the past and The Suicide Squad would have to take place in the present because they didn't form the first one until the 20-whatever movie and now my head hurts trying to figure out how they're going to manage the timeline.
-
Wait, there's also already a trailer for The Suicide Squad?
Not a full trailer, but more of a behind the scenes preview. In addition to the separate full announcing of the cast.
-
The Batman looks great. I love Nolan's trilogy, but he's bad at shooting combat up close (which Snyder did well also). I'm looking forward to another take, even grittier. Suit looks great. And I this point, there's absolutely no reason to doubt Pattinson's acting chops. Bringing up Twilight is just silly now.
-
I like how he doesn't look like a rugby player.
-
…I like how hot he looks with eye makeup...
...uh...hey, I hope the film's good! And has an actually good music score!
-
Just glad it's out of Snyder's hands, presumably permanently. A lot late for damage control on the universe but they've been solid since Aquaman so I'm happy to give them the benefit of the doubt til they make another sub-par entry.
-
Well, the "Snyder Cut" looks as awful as I expected. The plot looks largely unchanged, Jack Kirby's vibrant and colorful Fourth World characters are even more bland forgettable grey-brown crud CGI Monsters, and there was no footage of Superman talking so I can't determine if he's in character like he was in the theatrical cut. (But I doubt it because Snyder)
The only thing that gives me a glimmer of (much needed) hope here is that it appears Wonder Woman did succeed in saving those kids at the start of the movie. I honestly believed in the Snyder Cut, she would have failed to save them and she would have been understandably sad about it the entire movie.
The fact that she not only succeded but Gasp SMILED at the little girl who then SMILED Back…
Everything else looked pretty good tho.
WW84 had a pretty good trailer. I liked the Blue Monday instrumental in the original a bit more, but Cheetah looks good IMO.
Also, they are REALLY leaning into Maxwell Lord being a stand-in for Trump... lolThe Suicide Squad looks SO FREAKING GOOD
I should have expected this with James Gunn being behind it, but yeah, it looks AMAZING.
The costumes all look amazing, especially Harley, and doing a deep dive into DC lore to get a bunch of D-Listers was a brilliant decision because now, I have no idea who is going to die.Unlike the original where it was obvious from the get-go it was gonna be Slipknot. He's the only D-Lister in the cast, and got no introduction or fanfare in any of the marketing or even the start of the movie itself.
The Flash concept art and stuff looked good. the suit looks WAY better. Not much else to chew on here, but I'm thinking this IS going to Flashpoint away the bad movies so cool. Thinking this might be good, waiting for more tho.
Shazam: Fury of the Gods is a cool title, and it looks like Sinbad is going to be in it? I saw it suggested he's gonna be Tawky Tawny which would kinda be amazing, so now I want that. Looking forward to it either way.
As for "The Batman"... Color me cautiously optimistic. I hope when he was brutally beating that guy on the ground, the guy survived, but otherwise I'm down. An actual Mystery based noir movie with Riddler? Yes please.
But seriously, I just want ONE Live Action cinematic Batman who doesn't kill please.
-
The Snyder Cut is just such a hilariously horrible thing. Like, this guy just keeps pissing away any good will he could have had with his public comments then you turn around and see the terrible dialogue Batman delivers at the end of the trailer and I'm like "Goddamn, this is going to be an awkward, clunky mess!"
How the heck is this supposed to be a four hour film, anyway? The film has to have some semblance of a linear story, right? Or is it just going to be "Delay getting to the climax as long as possible!"?
I mean, hell, I have a hard enough time imagining this movie working as an 80 minute film let alone a 240 minute film.
-
Wasn't that the case with BvS, where it was hardly any better and didn't really fix the biggest problems?
-
The Snyder Cut is just such a hilariously horrible thing. Like, this guy just keeps pissing away any good will he could have had with his public comments then you turn around and see the terrible dialogue Batman delivers at the end of the trailer and I'm like "Goddamn, this is going to be an awkward, clunky mess!"
How the heck is this supposed to be a four hour film, anyway? The film has to have some semblance of a linear story, right? Or is it just going to be "Delay getting to the climax as long as possible!"?
I mean, hell, I have a hard enough time imagining this movie working as an 80 minute film let alone a 240 minute film.
The first pass workprint cut he posted a picture of was 3.5 hours long. Often they shoot more footage than they end up needing for either coverage or to account for things. They often still need to go back for reshoots to correct eyelines and account for the placement of CG stuff or to fill in new scenes when they end up cutting subplots and the like, but the initial shoot usually results in a LOT of footage. Suicide Squad apparently had like 6 hours of footage.
That then gets whittled down in editing to make things more cohesive and punchier.
They said this was gonna be 4 1 hour episodes so I guess at least some of that time will be taken up by an opening credits scene, maybe a brief recap/lead in from the prior "Episode" and end credits so taking that into account, it's probably just his original 3:35 minute Workprint with some new CG heavy scenes of Darkseid and/or other new gods set on Apokolips.
-
As for "The Batman"… Color me cautiously optimistic. I hope when he was brutally beating that guy on the ground, the guy survived, but otherwise I'm down. An actual Mystery based noir movie with Riddler? Yes please.
But seriously, I just want ONE Live Action cinematic Batman who doesn't kill please.
Maybe it'll be the first live-action Batman to really focus on Batman's "detective" side. And who better to bring that out than The Riddler? istillloveyoujimcarrey
-
Batman brutally beating the shit out of people makes perfect sense, the entire point of his crusade is to deter crime, crippling and hospitalizing criminals makes them less likely to go back to crime out of fear, it’s basically why he does what he does
Him killing people is where they need to cross the line, since it’s what separates him from the villains he hunts
If they want to make a Batman who kills in the name of justice they should just make a punisher movie (or whoever the DC equivalent to that is)
-
Not killing people but stopping short by giving them comas and internal bleeding is a pretty low bar that doesn't exactly makes Bats an endearing protagonist. But I'll be fine with it if he has a character arc in this movie where he realizes that, no, denying your humanity by trying to become a monster does not make you a hero. Let alone healthy or inspiring.
Give us a take where he can occasionally learn to crack a smile, open up others, and maybe finally give him a Robin again. I can't believe it's been TWO DECADES since we've seen a live-action movie with Batman and Robin because nobody can take the dynamic duo seriously without ironically ribbing on how silly it looks at first glance.
I'm glad we're finally getting Riddler and what seems like a detective mystery-driven plot, but at the same time that greeting card felt way too generic a serial killer motif. I'm worried they're not going to execute Riddler with the theatrical narcissist genius nature that define the character and make him so fun. I'd love to be proven wrong though, and I don't mind experimenting with the character can be as long as this isn't another faux "Batman is rEaLiztiK" take like the Nolan films. I want to see Clayface finally get his due and Mr. Freeze return.
And why are Batman movies still afraid of giving Catwoman an actual cat costume? Along with calling her Catwoman instead of vague workaround reference to appease analytical comic book dorks. We can have Batman wear horns and a cape, Joker wear makeup with a purple suit, half of Two-Faces can get scarred to the point he looks like a zombie, and Scarecrow can wear a freaking burlap sack over his head, but the line is drawn at triangle ears and round goggles? Just use the modern designs from the Arkham games and even that underrated 2000s The Batman show. Please give her a better costume by the end of the movie.
Robert Battinson wearing black eye makeup under the film is the only real pleasant surprise in the trailer for me. It's always been obvious Batman actors wear black makeup under their cowls.
I've said this before, but until a new take on Bats is willing to inject with some actual capacity for empathy and supervillain theatrics, the LEGO Batman movie is still the best Batman film.
-
@Count:
Not killing people but stopping short by giving them comas and internal bleeding is a pretty low bar that doesn't exactly makes Bats an endearing protagonist. But I'll be fine with it if he has a character arc in this movie where he realizes that, no, denying your humanity by trying to become a monster does not make you a hero. Let alone healthy or inspiring.
Give us a take where he can occasionally learn to crack a smile, open up others, and maybe finally give him a Robin again. I can't believe it's been TWO DECADES since we've seen a live-action movie with Batman and Robin because nobody can take the dynamic duo seriously without ironically ribbing on how silly it looks at first glance.
I'm glad we're finally getting Riddler and what seems like a detective mystery-driven plot, but at the same time that greeting card felt way too generic a serial killer motif. I'm worried they're not going to execute Riddler with the theatrical narcissist genius nature that define the character and make him so fun. I'd love to be proven wrong though, and I don't mind experimenting with the character can be as long as this isn't another faux "Batman is rEaLiztiK" take like the Nolan films. I want to see Clayface finally get his due and Mr. Freeze return.
And why are Batman movies still afraid of giving Catwoman an actual cat costume? Along with calling her Catwoman instead of vague workaround reference to appease analytical comic book dorks. We can have Batman wear horns and a cape, Joker wear makeup with a purple suit, half of Two-Faces can get scarred to the point he looks like a zombie, and Scarecrow can wear a freaking burlap sack over his head, but the line is drawn at triangle ears and round goggles? Just use the modern designs from the Arkham games and even that underrated 2000s The Batman show. Please give her a better costume by the end of the movie.
Robert Battinson wearing black eye makeup under the film is the only real pleasant surprise in the trailer for me. It's always been obvious Batman actors wear black makeup under their cowls.
I've said this before, but until a new take on Bats is willing to inject with some actual capacity for empathy and supervillain theatrics, the LEGO Batman movie is still the best Batman film.
I get the wanting not to see Batman be a straight-up killer but when you put him in a position where there's no way out without having to use lethal force, like when he has to save Gordon's son from Two-Face in TDK or when he throws the coins at Two-Face in Batman Forever, I'm more satisfied knowing he'll do the right thing rather than let someone else come to harm due to his inaction and have to brood over it later like he's already doing all his life from his parents' deaths. Unless there's always a deus ex machina to get around doing that, we just have to deal with it. I'd love if there was a way to handle things like he did in the animated Justice League Unlimited, for instance, where Ace of the Royal Flush Gang was warping reality and would soon die of a brain aneurysm or something and the only way to stop it from blowing up and killing a ton of people would be to take her down, but he just talks to her, and defuses the situation without violence, lethal or otherwise. Batman thinking his way out of a situation, being the world's greatest detective, is something we should demand because that can be as rewarding as a hard-won battle if done right (Doctor Strange's method of defeating Dormammu, for example). The question is, do we demand more cerebral situations and possibly implausible gadgets or do we grin and bear it when Batman has to take a life because it lends itself to the continuation of the violent action we wanted to see in the rest of the film?
Clayface would be an amazing villain on the big screen but how does Batman fight him without it getting ridiculous? Usually it looks like needing liquid nitrogen grenades in most of the animated adaptations, but otherwise making him vulnerable to water or other abundant streams of chemicals could work, but with water it would be like, 'too easy', and with other chemicals you'd have to accept battles only happening in places where it's available so that puts a limit on things too. I really wish Batman would get into more supernatural stuff in the movies like how Wonder Woman and Shazam are all about magic. Batman's usually the bridge between the Justice League and Justice League Dark from what I've seen so it just seems like he should finally have a crack at that sort of thing on the big screen. Lazarus Pits could be a good start.
-
Clayface would be an amazing villain on the big screen but how does Batman fight him without it getting ridiculous? Usually it looks like needing liquid nitrogen grenades in most of the animated adaptations,
In Batman TAS he defeated Clayface by having him lose his shit, leading to him electrocuting himself, the next time he defeated him via technicality due to his body falling apart due to being unstable, and there's the two times he was defeated in the New Adventures Of Batman one of which was pretty much a retread of the first.
-
So apparently I wasn't the only one who couldn't believe that Colin Farrell was playing Penguin. But the prosthetics makeup came though:
https://www.insider.com/the-batman-colin-farrell-the-penguin-photo-2020-8What hilarious is all the people who thought he was Richard Kind. I wouldn't mind Richard Kind as the Penguin.
-
Well I knew Pattinson was going to be the sweet and cute Batman, so no complaints.
-
I just learned today that Catwoman's look in The Dark Knight Rises is a near shot-to-shot remake of her Batman '66 Adam West show appearance. I wonder if they did it on purpose or through sheer coincidence of not wanting to do the full spandex mask.
Doesn't change the fact both of those costumes looked pretty meh though.
I get the wanting not to see Batman be a straight-up killer but when you put him in a position where there's no way out without having to use lethal force, like when he has to save Gordon's son from Two-Face in TDK or when he throws the coins at Two-Face in Batman Forever, I'm more satisfied knowing he'll do the right thing rather than let someone else come to harm due to his inaction and have to brood over it later like he's already doing all his life from his parents' deaths.
I'm with you there actually. If a hero has to kill to save a life, I'm fine with it as long as it's treated with gravity. I didn't mind when Superman snapped Zod's neck. Believe it or not, my theater actually clapped when that happened. Probably because they only saw Superman as a do gooder boyscout. There is power in having a hero be forced to kill depending on how it's framed.
I was referring more to the dark edgy takes on Batman that fanboys love to stan, such as how badass Batman looks when he severely beats up people near death but stops just short of killing them. I feel like people praise Batman as a superhero for the wrong reasons more often than not. And aren't willing to see him be criticized or grow as a person at all. You know, the guys who love to parrot the "Bruce Wayne is the mask, he's really Batman" shlock. Or all the "I'M BATMAN" memes. Or always eating up whenever he delivers a witty comeback or pulls a ridiculous keikaku "this all went according to my plan" moment that makes no sense.
I would have loved a trailer like this when I was a teenager, but nowadays I'm sick of grounded, gritty Batman.
Although I will admit that I would like to see a live-action Batman movie where Bats does not kill someone. He killed Joker in the first Burton film, planted a bomb on a goon in the Batman Returns sequel before indirectly killing Penguin at the end of the film, fools Two-Face into killing himself in Batman Forever, Batgirl and Robin kill Bane in Batman and Robin, Batman lets Ra's explode in Batman Begins, Batman tackles Two-Face off a platform with enough force to snap his neck in The Dark Knight, Catwoman kills Bane in The Dark Knight Rises, and Batman blows up a car with people inside during Batman v. Superman.
Every live-action Batman has to have Bruce or someone in the Bat Family kill someone. No matter how much of a relief it is to see Batman willing to choose saving people over naive principles, Batman either liking to kill or being forced to kill has been done to death. It feels funny to keep adapting a character who is known as THE non-killing superhero, and have him directly or indirectly murder at least one person in every film he's in.
Unless there's always a deus ex machina to get around doing that, we just have to deal with it. I'd love if there was a way to handle things like he did in the animated Justice League Unlimited.
I love the Ace scene. Same with the Baby Doll episode in Batman The Animated Series. Those are the types of Batman moment I love to see and wish there was more of in the movies. The closest we ever got that is when he tells Gordon his secret identity at the end of The Dark Knight Rises. His capacity to empathize and help people in need. Not just beating up the bad men and calling it a day.
A good writer can balance over the top action here with a clever well earned cerebral solution. Doctor Strange was still a trippy action flick up until Strange used the Time Stone against Dormammu. Spider-Man 2 has Spidey fight Doc Ock twice in some of the best superhero movie fights to this day before appealing to his humanity and convincing him to undo his experiment in the finale. I'm not saying either movie is perfect, but it has been done.
I think my favorite instance of Batman winning a battle with his wits was in the Superman/Batman: Apocalypse movie where Bruce extorts Darkseid into freeing Supergirl from his brainwashing by revealing he plants bombs in Apokolips. A really clever, yet simple plan I can actually see someone do. It helps empathize his both his intellect and compassion as a character without nerfing Darkseid with a plot device like Super-Ultra-Platinum-Hellstorm Arcade Edition Bat Armor to make Batman seem invincible.
The question isn't wondering if it's possible, it is if DC cares about wanting both action and wits instead of only one. And how much effort with common sense they will put in.
Clayface would be an amazing villain on the big screen but how does Batman fight him without it getting ridiculous?
Drive him crazy or use electricity like Green vs Red said, use cryo pellets, or trap Clayface somewhere to get bombarded by a LOT of water.
Or if you really can't think of anything, just have Clayface redeem himself in the end. Both the recent Detective Comics stories and The Batman 2004 cartoon showed Clayface try being a hero to switch things up.
So make a movie script where Batman doesn't win over Clayface externally, but internally. Batman stories love to talk about how the city is filled with insane supervillains but they can't be killed because they have tragic backstories and deserve to be rehabilitated. So have Clayface actually be the first cinematic Batman villain turn a new leaf so that Gotham doesn't look like a perpetual cycle of insanity and violence.
-
Catwoman 66 looked great though? There's been five decades of fashion since so yeah its dated, but it still looked good.
-
I'm not into the domino mask design with tiara cat ears. It looks more like one of those cheap Party City sexy black cat Halloween costume than a suit. It's not bad, but not great to me either because it can't take it seriously since it looks so generically Halloween-y. It's like the villain equivalent of Miles wearing the Halloween Spider-Man costume for most of Spider-Verse, but unironic.
Matt Reeves talks a lot in this video about how the film focuses on a Year 2 Batman. It skips the origin story and focuses on a young Bruce refining his flaws from vengeful vigilante to symbol of hope, and realizing the true depth of Gotham's corruption. A bunch of other characters like Catwoman and Penguin are also going to evolve into something resembling their original incarnations too.
He convinced me to have a lot more faith in the movie.
It would be pretty neat if they take a page from Telltale Batman and reveal to Bruce that the Waynes were corrupt. It would very timely and fit with the character arc of not letting himself be defined by the grief of his tragedy. I can imagine a scene where he makes a new Bat symbol because the one he currently has is probably made from the gun that killed his parents.
-
I get the wanting not to see Batman be a straight-up killer but when you put him in a position where there's no way out without having to use lethal force, like when he has to save Gordon's son from Two-Face in TDK
I actually don't REALLY have a problem with the TDK trilogy even if it's not perfect and he technically kills sometimes in those movies. The series acknowledges his no-kill rule and seems to take the stance that as long as he's not actively trying to kill, if bad guys die as a result of the things he has to do to save the day it's ok.
Ra's was suspect, moreso than the rest because he straight up makes the choice not to save him, but the rest there's an argument to be made.
He didn't kill fake Ra's or any of the LoS Ninjas. He created a fire as a distraction to get away that got out of hand. He didn't kill Harvey, he tackled him to get the kid and then only had time to grab the kid etc.
Like, you can argue that still doesn't count and he totally kills those people but the movies at least TRY to reconcile things. They say out loud he has the rule and never show him directly and intentionally killing people.
And then there's BvS that has him killing a bunch of dudes casually with the Batmobile. Then, BvS fans tell me that's supposed to be the point. He's Fallen, he's bad now and that's his arc is becoming a good guy again… so in the (Admittedly kinda awesome) warehouse brawl, where I'm told he's been redeemed and this is his triumphant "Batman is Back!" moment it's semi-plausible he didn't intentionally kill anyone... Grenade guys dropped THEIR OWN grenades, Flamethrower guy might have gotten a bad burn but otherwise survived etc... But then the "Ultimate" Cut happens and a ton of blood splatters are added that make it pretty explicit most of these guys died..
or when he throws the coins at Two-Face in Batman Forever
This is one of the ones that bugs me. Two-Face didn't have a hostage to save or anything, Batman knew he was on bad footing and threw the coins, and then he and Robin did nothing to save him while he was falling.
Honestly considering his arc was learning not to let Vengeance consume him, it would have been good alternatively for Robin if he DID jump down and save Two-Face.
-
I don't really mind Batman killing, I just think one doesn't need to be an insufferable baby about it like Snyder is. Like, guy coming after him with a knife? I'm not going to cry any tears if he redirects the knife into another good's eye or something. The problem is that these characters don't try to resolve their issues through anything but violence. You can earn that nice, satisfying kill if you just have your protagonist try to talk things out with their foes. Sometimes that prevents violence, others it doesn't.
-
I actually don't REALLY have a problem with the TDK trilogy even if it's not perfect and he technically kills sometimes in those movies. The series acknowledges his no-kill rule and seems to take the stance that as long as he's not actively trying to kill, if bad guys die as a result of the things he has to do to save the day it's ok.
Ra's was suspect, moreso than the rest because he straight up makes the choice not to save him, but the rest there's an argument to be made.
He didn't kill fake Ra's or any of the LoS Ninjas. He created a fire as a distraction to get away that got out of hand. He didn't kill Harvey, he tackled him to get the kid and then only had time to grab the kid etc.
Like, you can argue that still doesn't count and he totally kills those people but the movies at least TRY to reconcile things. They say out loud he has the rule and never show him directly and intentionally killing people.
And then there's BvS that has him killing a bunch of dudes casually with the Batmobile. Then, BvS fans tell me that's supposed to be the point. He's Fallen, he's bad now and that's his arc is becoming a good guy again… so in the (Admittedly kinda awesome) warehouse brawl, where I'm told he's been redeemed and this is his triumphant "Batman is Back!" moment it's semi-plausible he didn't intentionally kill anyone... Grenade guys dropped THEIR OWN grenades, Flamethrower guy might have gotten a bad burn but otherwise survived etc... But then the "Ultimate" Cut happens and a ton of blood splatters are added that make it pretty explicit most of these guys died..
This is one of the ones that bugs me. Two-Face didn't have a hostage to save or anything, Batman knew he was on bad footing and threw the coins, and then he and Robin did nothing to save him while he was falling.
Honestly considering his arc was learning not to let Vengeance consume him, it would have been good alternatively for Robin if he DID jump down and save Two-Face.
I consider 'not saving' Ra's as killing because he knows Ra's will 100% die even if he is the leader of the League of Shadows. But I don't mind because he knows exactly how dangerous Ra's is and that breaking out of any cell they put him in will never work. We have to kind of use our heads to justify that one but we can do it without them explicitly saying so. And in the situation in TDK with Harvey, that plays into his retirement not just due to his physical injuries but the guilt of not being able to save the guy who was unlucky enough to have lost his mind and gone down the wrong path out of grief. At least there are either justifiable reasons for it, or real aftermath consequences.
Batman was holding his girlfriend when Two-Face was standing over them in Batman Forever, so that seems like a hostage situation, and maybe Batman or Robin didn't have enough gadgets left to save Two-Face and escape the place themselves, I don't remember, been a while since I last watched that one. But you're definitely right, Robin should have saved him as a way to show Bruce he overcame his desire for revenge over justice. But then, Two-Face was still sane and knew Bruce's identity so that would have been a liability, while Nygma at least had completely lost his shit and wouldn't be able to blab.
I don't really mind Batman killing, I just think one doesn't need to be an insufferable baby about it like Snyder is. Like, guy coming after him with a knife? I'm not going to cry any tears if he redirects the knife into another good's eye or something. The problem is that these characters don't try to resolve their issues through anything but violence. You can earn that nice, satisfying kill if you just have your protagonist try to talk things out with their foes. Sometimes that prevents violence, others it doesn't.
The line that separates the (vigilante) hero from the villain is thin and depending on the circumstance, I'm in favor of them killing when the outcome will be worse if they don't. The choice of the writer is to put situations where the morality is ambiguous, which make us have to ponder what we would do in their shoes (an extrapolation being Team Cap vs. Team Iron Man in CA: CW) or have them be a cold-blooded killer like the Punisher. So we either get something nuanced, or we get a turn-off-your-brain action thing where we ought to go in with that expectation. But normally when it's the latter, we see the person affected significantly by it even if they continue to do it. Batman isn't usually presented in that way and doesn't normally go out of his way to kill when the situation doesn't call for it. It's more fitting with his style to avoid that as often as possible and give us a reason not to side with Gotham PD and think of him as a vigilante menace who should be arrested. Keeping Arkham's cells full rather than making the Gotham Mortuary a fortune is the only reason Gordon works with him anyway.
Personally I'm more satisfied when even at personal cost, Batman can defuse a situation without a fatality, not taking the easy way out, so I'm always going to prefer that. There can still be violence, just not with a mortal outcome. Doctor Who even gives the villains he knows will never accept a peaceful solution the chance to surrender, and Batman's the world's greatest detective, I'd expect him to be able to get inside the villains' heads to make them second-guess themselves when a physical contest isn't going in his favor.
-
Right. I mean, Black Lightning got a multi-season TV series. Seems like the logical place to go with it, maybe go with Young Justice's portrayal and have Static appear at the end as an apprentice?
-
I would prefer Static operating solo. DC is chock full of teenage sidekicks without any of them acting independently unless they're the Teen Titans or a sanctioned junior Justice League. And would help contrast with MCU Spider-Man being so closely affiliated with the Avengers and SHIELD.
Granted, none of the DC films have incorporated sidekicks for the past couple decades. But it'd feel really weird to have Static be the first one of all people.
-
They just announced they're relauncing Milestone comics, so I imagine this goes hand in hand with that.
I always liked the line, it got seriously shortchanged. I was a big fan of Blood Syndicate and I liked Rocket. Static is the one that got all the acclaim though, mostly because he's the one that got a cartoon I suppose.
-
I never had a problem with the no killing rule. But it's probably because I already find it dodgy that people decide they should be able to dish out justice without the oversight. So them killing people while skirting the law would annoy me. And also if they are supposed to be example I personally prefer them not doing something as extreme as killing people regardless how more realistic people believe it makes them. Especially when they wont to prison or get any real consequences. Just feel really bad about and continue to be judge and jury that can decide wether you live or die unilaterally.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
A static movie could be a very cool kind Miles Morales from into the spiderverse live action movie.
-
I find the whole concept ridiculous because these stories and characters never tackle how all cops are bad, not just 'the bad ones'. A rotten apple spoils the bunch, after all, and it's these stories' refusal to be truly political and say something that might actually make their readers think that really cut their legs off from being any sort of realistic. Making superheroes cops by tying them to oversight is just going to be an even greater mockery of the people who suffer endlessly from cops (marginalized people).
-
@Count:
I would prefer Static operating solo. DC is chock full of teenage sidekicks without any of them acting independently unless they're the Teen Titans or a sanctioned junior Justice League. And would help contrast with MCU Spider-Man being so closely affiliated with the Avengers and SHIELD.
Granted, none of the DC films have incorporated sidekicks for the past couple decades. But it'd feel really weird to have Static be the first one of all people.
Shazam is probably as close as they got to doing that anyway.
-
Don’t Batman comic books almost every once in awhile feature corrupt police officers?
I even read a summary of Gotham Knight story that revolved around a plot in which Harvey Dent prior to becoming Two Face tried to put a guy away using questionable legal tactics.
-
Don’t Batman comic books almost every once in awhile feature corrupt police officers?
I even read a summary of Gotham Knight story that revolved around a plot in which Harvey Dent prior to becoming Two Face tried to put a guy away using questionable legal tactics.
But they still fall back on "there's a few good cops!" Except no, there is no such thing. If you want to support marginalized people you quit the police and join the protests. Sticking around in the cess pool will either corrupt you or do nothing but help the corrupt system. The system needs to be thrown out entirely, there is no reforming it.
-
I don’t think the solution is that simple since some of the problems can only truly be fixed starting with fixing government and of course the criminal justice system which no one seems to be in any hurry to fix
-
Super off topic, but I do agree with the major points being made. No one INSIDE the system is in a hurry to fix it, and too many people have been duped into voting against their own interests or supporting with a violent fervor those who espouse the rhetoric they agree with even if those espousing it are lawless predators.
-
We fix the government through organizing, protesting and rioting. The police were forced in the first place to protect the 'property' of the wealthy. They do and forever will protect only the wealthy and the privileged. There's no fixing from within the system. The system must be destroyed and the government must be made to fear the people. Otherwise they're just going to keep doing what their donors want.
-
That didn’t work for the people of Hong Kong protesting their Government and Police being lapdogs for the Chinese.
And if you look at the challenges minorities and women in this country still face it’s still an
uphill and tedious battle.