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One Piece Chapter 744 - Revolutionary Army Chief Advisor
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Also Whitebeard's Quake Bubbles.
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Keep in mind that those strings are solid though
That's same as imbuing a weapon, though
Yup,you are both right,maybe gravity and fire for example can't be treated this way.On the other hand,altough not a devil fruit attack,Zoro's flying air slash managed to cut Monet.Either she was careless or anything is possible.
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Yup,you are both right,maybe gravity and fire for example can't be treated this way.On the other hand,altough not a devil fruit attack,Zoro's flying air slash managed to cut Monet.Either she was careless or anything is possible.
Law's Mes was able to bypass Smoker's Logia intangibility too.
Though Fujitora's case should be different. The gravity is not a product of his ability. He just changes it.
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Yup,you are both right,maybe gravity and fire for example can't be treated this way.On the other hand,altough not a devil fruit attack,Zoro's flying air slash managed to cut Monet.Either she was careless or anything is possible.
Question was it proven that zorro use haki against monet ? I know he cut it her face but she didn't expect zorro to attack be cuss she was a woman.
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Ok. Law's "Mes".
Well it was inside the Room. I think that's a difference. Not sure how the combination of Haki and Law's ability should affect logia. Maybe his ability affects logias too, if they aren't prepared. For example, Smoker could have made a hole in himself (like how he avoided Vergo's dart) but he didn't see the attack because Law sent it through a rock.
Also Whitebeard's Quake Bubbles.
I can't remember if it was seen hurting logias.
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Though Fujitora's case should be different. The gravity is not a product of his ability. He just changes it.
This. It's more complicated than just throwing an attack.
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Sakazuki is a Logia.
Ok, the difference there is that Whitebeard's fists connected with Akainu.
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At the least?
Oh dear Lord.
The admiral's are some of the strongest fighters in the world. If Sabo is anywhere near them at all then he's outstandingly strong.
The admirals are the peak that has to be aimed for, not a measuring stick for competence.
you wouldn't think that the revolutionary army's general\commander in chief is one of the strongest ?
so there's not even one amongst the revolutionaries is admiral tier except for dragon , while the government has god knows how many admiral\admiral+ tiers
dear lord indeedThe admiral and yonkos should stat hiding now, since admiral level Sabo ate the mera mera no mi. :ninja:
i think he will be in the power gap between admirals and yonkos :ninja:
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Oh? Interesting. It seems that you miunderstood. I do not say I judged him to early. I say that it may be revised later on.
There exists a equal possibility that it may not.
If it isn't, everything I said stands.
And what my points were proven wrong, exactly?
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... Sorry, I will answer to that as soon as I stop laughing at blatant hipocrisy.
Do you have anything to actually contribute?
RobZilla pretty much proved you wrong when you said that Sabo owned Burgess and Diamante to which he respond by saying that he outsmarted them which is exactly what is shown in the manga since both of them weren't even trying or going all out against Sabo . Hell Diamante was more interested in abusing Rebecca verally then he was interested in Sabo . But of course Sabo is sueish because you said it .
Do i have something to contribute?! Umm no i was looking for a nice discussion until you showed up and ruin that but don't let that stop you from doing your usual stuff seeing as how people who were arguing with you have stopped i might as well stop this pointless talk .
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I think we for sure will see Dragon after this arc if not duringg. Gonna be epicā¦just to see Dragon
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we sure don't know if sabo is one of he strongest character out there or not,but for sure is one of the most complete..speed,close combat,long range,fruit power
only thing we don't know for sure it's his resistance to damage and stamina -
we sure don't know if sabo is one of he strongest character out there or not,but for sure is one of the most complete..speed,close combat,long range,fruit power
only thing we don't know for sure it's his resistance to damage and staminaNice summary. I almost want him to get one of Burgess punch now. Almost.
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Nice summary. I almost want him to get one of Burgess punch now. Almost.
hepefully he will get hit by someone by the end of this arc.
also,in the previous post i forgot he seems quite smart too,at least combat -wise,and that always help
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hepefully he will get hit by someone by the end of this arc.
also,in the previous post i forgot he seems quite smart too,at least combat -wise,and that always help
Well, he has always been smarter than Ace and Luffy when they were child. Growing stupid was unlikely.
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At the least?
Oh dear Lord.
The admiral's are some of the strongest fighters in the world. If Sabo is anywhere near them at all then he's outstandingly strong.
The admirals are the peak that has to be aimed for, not a measuring stick for competence.
The Yonkou are the peaks, Admirals are a rung down.
I expect dragon to be yonkou level, and sabo to be ben beckman level. Comparable to Admirals
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Sabo is, at the very least, on par with yonkou commanders who were able to fight on equal terms with the admirals. With the addition of a powerful fruit, I think he's safely into the admiral strength tier, in terms of power. He probably still lacks experience, though we see him fighting pretty much on par with burgess, compared to decades of service in the marines/just general fighting to get stronger, i doubt being 1 on 1 with an admiral is a position he'll brush off with a cocky smile, a la Ace.
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Ivm going to say sabo > ace by a fair margin and i expect him to be able to fight fujitora to a standstill
My reasoning is as follows
- sabo left the island long before ace
- sabo met his leader (and presumably started training with him) almost immediately after leaving
- sabo is number 2 after dragon. Not A commander in AN organisation (hence the beckman comparison)
- sabo is a beast who toys with yonkou commanders even without a devil fruit
- sabo has a brain and common sense
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Ivm going to say sabo > ace by a fair margin and i expect him to be able to fight fujitora to a standstill
My reasoning is as follows
- sabo left the island long before ace
- sabo met his leader (and presumably started training with him) almost immediately after leaving
- sabo is number 2 after dragon. Not A commander in AN organisation (hence the beckman comparison)
- sabo is a beast who toys with yonkou commanders even without a devil fruit
- sabo has a brain and common sense
well, Garp was training Ace and Luffy at that time as well..
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@Uncanny:
well, Garp was training Ace and Luffy at that time as well..
While also being away for long times doing his duty as a VA, while Sabo did probably stay with him most of the time.
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Ivm going to say sabo > ace by a fair margin and i expect him to be able to fight fujitora to a standstill
My reasoning is as follows
- sabo left the island long before ace
- sabo met his leader (and presumably started training with him) almost immediately after leaving
- sabo is number 2 after dragon. Not A commander in AN organisation (hence the beckman comparison)
- sabo is a beast who toys with yonkou commanders even without a devil fruit
- sabo has a brain and common sense
A lot of that is just making guesses. For all we know, Sabo could have spent just as much time studying as training. There was his dream about writing a book. The fact that he's a Revolutionary leader means that he was involved in many projects from start to finish. I think the fighting experience kinda leveled out in the end. Don't think he was stronger than Ace 2 years ago, since Ace was always portrayed as the toughest and strongest of the bros.
I'm not sure "toying with Yonkou commanders" is a correct way to put it. He was pretty much equal to Burgess in their one clash. Later he was avoiding his attacks. I don't see no wounds on Burgess either. I use the term "toying" when someone fights with less than their full strength and defeats an opponent easilly. Didn't see either of the two here, honestly.
I agree he was always the more level headed. Compared to Ace the hot headed and Luffy the empty headed
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I put Sabo at Yonkou commander level, which is in my opinion a couple of hair widths behind the Admirals, but this is complicated because some commanders have been shown to be able to hang with Admirals toe to toe (barring a fatal blow to family = distraction). He seems to have complete mastery of Haki, which I think would be a requirement for his position, but we've barely seen what he can do, so I may be wrong about that. If he were fighting some other Yonkou commander rather than a dimwit, we might have seen Sabo not fooling around. We must also keep in mind that he did what he did because he came to the country with an objective, to stop the weapons trade. So he fought his opponents in the ring with two motives rather than one. One being his main mission, the other being the fruit. You could say Becca had two objectives also, butā¦ehhhhh, she couldn't back it up.
Now that I think about it, Becca played the damsel in distress; protected by Bart, and swooped up by Sabo when he attacked the ring... but she's only a 16 yr old girl with no offensive capabilities in a ring with world class monsters. I guess she gets a pass.
This is interesting, if the Strawhats and Law had not been in Dressrosa, then the one to take down Doflamingo and his crew (and by extension liberate the country) would be Sabo and the revolutionaries. But alas, this is pure speculation (I'm granted that at page 90 of a chapter thread with a break, right??).
Something I'm really looking forward to at the conclusion of this arc is Sabo talking to Dragon via den den mushi about Luffy. Man, can you imagine?
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Well, he has always been smarter than Ace and Luffy when they were child. Growing stupid was unlikely.
Ace was reckless rather than straight up stupid. Can't argue for Luffy.
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Sabo is, at the very least, on par with yonkou commanders who were able to fight on equal terms with the admirals. With the addition of a powerful fruit, I think he's safely into the admiral strength tier, in terms of power. He probably still lacks experience, though we see him fighting pretty much on par with burgess, compared to decades of service in the marines/just general fighting to get stronger, i doubt being 1 on 1 with an admiral is a position he'll brush off with a cocky smile, a la Ace.
All assumption since the only commander(that was his rank,right?) we saw was Ivankov who wasn't at this level.
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@Uncanny:
well, Garp was training Ace and Luffy at that time as well..
I think Coby showed what proper training with Garp looks like. He seemed to visit them from time to time and make them do a little exercise.
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I agree he was always the more level headed. Compared to Ace the hot headed and Luffy the empty headed
Luffy is not really stupid, he is so careless he didnt give a damn about al most nothing. Combatwise he is one of the most adaptive person seen so far and he got also a very developed intuition regarding selecting people. He is just totally in his own world. Anyway he really looks so stupid from time to time is impossible to argue
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Nice summary. I almost want him to get one of Burgess punch now. Almost.
Didnt he take Burgess' punch head on and destroy his armor?
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A lot of that is just making guesses.
None of it is making guesses. The sole presumption i've made is clearly marked
And you're right that ace was portrayed as slightly stronger than sabo as a child. Still doesn't change anything i've wrote. Even if sabo spent half his time with dragon reading books, he still had far more time for the rest of his training with his superior than ace
And i do feel that sabo was toying with burgess. The only direct confrontation they had resulted in the destruction of burgess's armour. Sabo used burgess for his own ends (in weakening the stadium) . Sabo did not display any sense of fear, doubt or hesitation during the match. Sabo was always in control of the match and was never in danger of losing (as was illustrated fairly clearly to ourselves the readers).
Let's also not forget that sabo was a beast without a devil fruit, whereas ace was a useless pussy without his
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Why can't people just say "Sabo is definitely strong" and just move on with it? Everyone pulls out their power ranking charts and start analyzing all sorts of battle information, in this case for Sabo, it's very little. Just enjoy his appearance and pray for a fight, that's all we can do.
By the way, who else is excited to see the Sanji and Big Mom scenario?
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to break from this Sabo is X strong discussion-
@Alpha:
By the way, who else is excited to see the Sanji and Big Mom scenario?
Me. Oda has been holding out for a while, no doubt to focus on the Tontatta's SOP plan and the tournament finishing. But it's been so long, that I'm almost anxious as to what happened. Sanji and co were dealing with members of an Emperor, a Yonkou's crew, so making them seem anything less than threatening (coughJoracough) wouldn't be very good.
On the flip side, I'm sure we wouldn't be very pleased that four Straw Hats were curbstomped so soon after a 2 year training session.
But what could've happened? Are they still fighting? Did they get captured by the Big Mam pirates and are thinking of a way out? Marines? More Dofla goons?
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@Alpha:
By the way, who else is excited to see the Sanji and Big Mom scenario?
I'm starting to feel that the whole Big Mom scenario was just an excuse to keep Sanji and the others outside of the ongoing plot.
The incident will probably be shown in a flashback.
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you wouldn't think that the revolutionary army's general\commander in chief is one of the strongest ?
so there's not even one amongst the revolutionaries is admiral tier except for dragon , while the government has god knows how many admiral\admiral+ tiers
dear lord indeedi think he will be in the power gap between admirals and yonkos :ninja:
I didn't comment on how strong Sabo actually is.
I took issue with your ridiculous "Sabo is at least as strong as an admiral" which is based on nothing and like I said, makes the admirals seem like a measuring stick rather than top fighters in their own right.
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The Yonkou are the peaks, Admirals are a rung down.
I expect dragon to be yonkou level, and sabo to be ben beckman level. Comparable to Admirals
We've seen one yonko fight them, a yonko who previously fought on par with essentially the strongest guy ever.
We don't know how the other yonko measure up to the admirals.
I doubt there's a whole "rung" between them.
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I'm starting to feel that the whole Big Mom scenario was just an excuse to keep Sanji and the others outside of the ongoing plot.
The incident will probably be shown in a flashback.
Also to bring KHA back into the fold as well, at least that's my theory.
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But what could've happened? Are they still fighting? Did they get captured by the Big Mam pirates and are thinking of a way out? Marines? More Dofla goons?
I'm expecting Kidd to rescue those guys, and then make an alliance of alliances(Allianception) and fight Big Mom and Kaido at the same time.
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I'm starting to feel that the whole Big Mom scenario was just an excuse to keep Sanji and the others outside of the ongoing plot.
The incident will probably be shown in a flashback.
Also to create an awesome bond between him and a certain other substitute captain.
!
It will be amazing on so many levels.
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Me. Oda has been holding out for a while, no doubt to focus on the Tontatta's SOP plan and the tournament finishing. But it's been so long, that I'm almost anxious as to what happened. Sanji and co were dealing with members of an Emperor, a Yonkou's crew, so making them seem anything less than threatening (coughJoracough) wouldn't be very good.
I think we'll be waiting until Dressrosa is done.
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I'm starting to feel that the whole Big Mom scenario was just an excuse to keep Sanji and the others outside of the ongoing plot.
It's not the first time Oda has just removed characters from an arc. Like Usopp and Sanji being asleep through most of Whiskey Peaks ā¦ while Zoro beats a hundred bounty hunters and then fights Luffy, who both casually KO Mr 5 and Miss Valentine ... Vivi is revealed to be the Princess of Alabasta, Crocodile is revealed to be Mr 0 and Nami basically ends up stuck having to help Vivi ... in exchange for money. So much!
In the Drum arc, Zoro does very very little until right at the end. Because he's meant to be staying on the ship to guard it and all. And Carue sits out the whole arc for related reasons.
In Jaya, all the stuff that happens in Mock Town happens while Usopp, Sanji and Chopper are on the ship, and Robin is just 'getting info' while the other three meet Bellamy and Blackbeard ...
It's a good move if it gives more breathing space to the characters who are left.
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Sanji and co were dealing with members of an Emperor, a Yonkou's crew, so making them seem anything less than threatening (coughJoracough) wouldn't be very good.
On the flip side, I'm sure we wouldn't be very pleased that four Straw Hats were curbstomped so soon after a 2 year training session.
But what could've happened? Are they still fighting? Did they get captured by the Big Mam pirates and are thinking of a way out? Marines? More Dofla goons?
They could have just used coup de burst to get away in the end like they always do. That thing has stumped literally everyone in the series to this point.
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They could have just used coup de burst to get away in the end like they always do. That thing has stumped literally everyone in the series to this point.
Yeah, but how many barriers of cola do they even have? The just used it to get out of Doflamingo's range.
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Yeah, but how many barriers of cola do they even have? The just used it to get out of Doflamingo's range.
I'm sure they travel well stocked. There hasn't once ever been a mention of running low on barrels of cola. Just comments about the barrels going empty and needing a minute to replace them.
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Yeah, but how many barriers of cola do they even have? The just used it to get out of Doflamingo's range.
It was the first one they did post-timeskip IIRC.
EDIT: I think they might have done it too in Fishman Island, but I'm not sure.
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Also to create an awesome bond between him and a certain other substitute captain.
! http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130806071119/onepiece/images/0/0f/Bepo_Post_Skip.png
It will be amazing on so many levels.
it's pretty much foreshadowed then that they'll meet up on the next island. I forsee Luffy+ co. coming to the island and not knowing what the heck is going on and Sanji+co. missing. Slowly they uncover the mystery and take out the island's leader/arc boss (who probably is a yonko subordinate).
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I'm expecting Kidd to rescue those guys, and then make an alliance of alliances(Allianception) and fight Big Mom and Kaido at the same time.
They are after Cesar, not the crew. They don't need rescuing. Also your sig is wrong better take law out and put zoro in.
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They are after Cesar, not the crew. They don't need rescuing. Also your sig is wrong better take law out and put zoro in.
But Sanji's group isn't giving Ceasar away that easy so they're getting in more trouble with the yonkou.
my sig is more than right -
It was the first one they did post-timeskip IIRC.
EDIT: I think they might have done it too in Fishman Island, but I'm not sure.
I'm not sure If they did it on Fishman Island and If they did, they most likely refill them, so it should be good I guess.
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I wonder who Ryokugyu will end up facing as a final villain. Sabo? Blah I guess it's pointless to even discuss this at this point.
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They could have just used coup de burst to get away in the end like they always do. That thing has stumped literally everyone in the series to this point.
And then Big Mom's ship shoots a large string of gum to catch them in mid-air.
Now that I think about it, that would be fun to see.
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@Portgas-D-Ace:
I wonder who Ryokugyu will end up facing as a final villain. Sabo? Blah I guess it's pointless to even discuss this at this point.
Yup, we hate this.
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am i the only who actually thinks this scenario with big mom and trying to escape to zou will lead to the whole vivre card situation?
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am i the only who actually thinks this scenario with big mom and trying to escape to zou will lead to the whole vivre card situation?
Ya mean the one Lola gave them?
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Ya mean the one Lola gave them?
that i do. it's literally the perfect opportunity to tie it in if that's actually what oda has planned.
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that i do. it's literally the perfect opportunity to tie it in if that's actually what oda has planned.
The vivre card might give them a 1 time pass.
I still want Luffy to fulfill his promise to Big Mom.