Fantastic thread. Great job sandman
Oda's Interviews
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Here's the whole quote, I think we should replace the one in the opening post since it's so out of context:
Thanks! That really clears it up.
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I really like this line from Oda
"There is a trend that people who point out the inconsistency of a story are rated high, but I don't necessarily think a story must be written coherently." GHIBLI Magazine (2014)
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I really like this line from Oda
"There is a trend that people who point out the inconsistency of a story are rated high, but I don't necessarily think a story must be written coherently." GHIBLI Magazine (2014)
Actually, I agree.
There is no formal requirement for the story to be coherent or logical. There is also no "must be good" standard. There is no "must" on character development. There is no "must" on anything, except for one thing.
It must sell.
Which is why Togashi can release his scribbles and have them sold.
Why things as terrible as Bleach and Fairy Tail still sell in milions.
Quality is not something that readers/watchers require from creators, therefore it is not needed.
Though manga world (or any form of art, written or otherwise) would greatly benefited from opposite situation.
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Actually, I agree.
There is no formal requirement for the story to be coherent or logical. There is also no "must be good" standard. There is no "must" on character development. There is no "must" on anything, except for one thing.
It must sell.
Which is why Togashi can release his scribbles and have them sold.
Why things as terrible as Bleach and Fairy Tail still sell in milions.
Quality is not something that readers/watchers require from creators, therefore it is not needed.
Though manga world (or any form of art, written or otherwise) would greatly benefited from opposite situation.
Stop stalking me. :getlost:
When it comes to Togashi only his art is medicore at best. Greed Island was weakest part of HxH but rest is a quality work.
Kubo is an artist with screwing up his work deeper and deeper and Fairy Tail is well Fairy Tail. Putting HxH(also calling it scribbles) and those 2 in one post is pretty bad move to prove any point. -
This post is deleted!
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Greed island was pretty cool, but i thought this thread was about Oda's interviews.
"I live Based, so don't try to be Based" - Lil B
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When it comes to Togashi only his art is medicore at best. Greed Island was weakest part of HxH but rest is a quality work.
Kubo is an artist with screwing up his work deeper and deeper and Fairy Tail is well Fairy Tail. Putting HxH(also calling it scribbles) and those 2 in one post is pretty bad move to prove any point.I meant Togashi's period of releasing works that look as poor sketches. Still sold relatively well, if I recall.
And he did that. Come on! Things like this:
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Or this
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Come on. This is objectively scribbles. There is no room for interpretation here art wise, it is scribbles.
The argument here is that there is no inherent standard that must be kept for work to sell, but at the same time it would be nice if there were.
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I still laugh to myself when I see that quote about blood relations.
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Greed island was pretty cool, but i thought this thread was about Oda's interviews.
It is. Which is why I was trying to comment on Oda's comment that I find really interesting industry wise and brought HxH (And more specificaly, Togashi's behavior towards that can hardly be considered ethical) as an example. It was not my intention to start the discussion on the quality of the story itself. Even if I am not a fan.
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lol oda's bullshitting on the "OH WHAT I DRAW HAS NO MESSAGES LA DI DA please ignore everything I have the world government do and fishman island"
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I'm making this my signature.
And I will point towards it every bloody time somebody tells that I just don't get it and that I don't understand the story.
It also has a plenty of potential to backfire. Your interpretations might lead to point-missing criticism (remember that Oda still has his own intentions), and that might lead to several neverending debates (which probably means nothing here will really change, so whatever).
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"Oda said that he didn't intend for certain messages in his work. That means that Akainu is the good guy and all pirates are bad guys who need to die."
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Greed island was pretty cool, but i thought this thread was about Oda's interviews.
Yes, youre right - sorry - I gotten into exchange with master complainer and it went to complaining at other great manga.
Darth- I give up, think whatever you want.
It also has a plenty of potential to backfire. Your interpretations might lead to point-missing criticism, and that might lead to several neverending debates.
Be very careful of that quote.
Thats why I asked him to read it few times but he doesnt get it imo
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That was very fun to read, so many things I never knew, it really paints a picture about Oda and what direction One Piece is going!
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It also has a plenty of potential to backfire. Your interpretations might lead to point-missing criticism (remember that Oda still has his own intentions), and that might lead to several neverending debates (which probably means nothing here will really change, so whatever).
@Cyan:
"Oda said that he didn't intend for certain messages in his work. That means that Akainu is the good guy and all pirates are bad guys who need to die."
Yes, youre right - sorry - I gotten into exchange with master complainer and it went to complaining at other great manga.
Darth- I give up, think whatever you want.
Thats why I asked him to read it few times but he doesnt get it imo
Here we have three consecutive messages that have nothing to do with this good idea of a thread and serve only to pointlessly stir shit up, as if we didn't need to deal with that already.
Thus instead of responding to them from this day on, I will report every comment aimed at me personaly instead of discussing things One Piece related as spam.
I know that discrediting opponent in a discussion is one of the old eristic classics, but keep it to yourself.
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thank you Sandman. Best thread of the year definetely
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Here we have three consecutive messages that have nothing to do with this good idea of a thread and serve only to pointlessly stir shit up, as if we didn't need to deal with that already.
Thus instead of responding to them from this day on, I will report every comment aimed at me personaly instead of discussing things One Piece related as spam.
I know that discrediting opponent in a discussion is one of the old eristic classics, but keep it to yourself.
We're discussing something about One Piece that Oda stated in a interview in a thread called "Oda's interviews".
I believe it is on-topic and One Piece-related.
Not that I want it to deviate from sandman's work, which is very much appreciated.
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@Cyan:
lol oda's bullshitting on the "OH WHAT I DRAW HAS NO MESSAGES LA DI DA please ignore everything I have the world government do and fishman island"
The complete quote is that he doesn't start with the message, it's not like he went to the buggy arc thinking "this is about the meaning of treasure" and started doing everything, he did it the other way around, he wanted luffy to defeat a pirate, and the point of contrast that he found with him was the definition of what they value the most (money and fame vs personal relations)|
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So good to have it all in one piece, I mean place. Thanks sandman, you da real MVP!
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We're discussing something about One Piece that Oda stated in a interview in a thread called "Oda's interviews".
It is on-topic and One Piece-related.
No, we are discussing a methodology of discussing about One Piece.
And your apparent incapability to understand that one can understand the message and still disagree with it.
Baseless conjecture, patronizing and condescending comments I do see. Not so much the so called discussion.
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And your apparent incapability to understand that one can understand the message and still disagree with it.
I can understand that.
I was talking about not understanding the message in the first place.
But alas, I think it's better to drop this issue if you're feeling this bothered.
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Great thread.
Most of the stuff is already known due to Greg's website, but it's still nice to have everything in one place (and stickied, please!).I just wish some sources were more accessible. Really curious about the context in some cases, like
"Don't speak ill of Zoro."　Niconico Live Broadcast (28 December 2011)
lol.
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"Basically I don't kill any characters because I wish the readers to feel satisfied after an arc ended." Asahi Evening Newspaper (26 November1999)
Weird reasoning, but ok.
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Greed island was pretty cool, but i thought this thread was about Oda's interviews.
Honestly I had no fun whatsoever reading that arc. I was almost bored to death.
One of my worst reading experiences.–- Update From New Post Merge ---
In other news I really liked the quote Ods had about how he draws characters and the one where he said that he prefers to draw the crew hanging out rather then fighting.
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I'd wish that instead of "the crew with animals" he'd use these covers to show the crew hanging out in sunny during the travels as in "this happened back then when they were traveling here"
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@Cyan:
"Oda said that he didn't intend for certain messages in his work. That means that Akainu is the good guy and all pirates are bad guys who need to die."
Ohh you so silly
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Here we have three consecutive messages that have nothing to do with this good idea of a thread and serve only to pointlessly stir shit up, as if we didn't need to deal with that already.
Thus instead of responding to them from this day on, I will report every comment aimed at me personaly instead of discussing things One Piece related as spam.
I know that discrediting opponent in a discussion is one of the old eristic classics, but keep it to yourself.
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In the final scenes of ONE PIECE, there will be a pirate who appears with an eye patch. One Para (2007)
Who might be? someone we already know or a new character?
maybe zoro would wear and eyepatch
also luffy's mom would possibly be big mom now since Oda said she was not pretty and has a perm lol
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Stop stalking me. :getlost:
When it comes to Togashi only his art is medicore at best. Greed Island was weakest part of HxH but rest is a quality work.
Kubo is an artist with screwing up his work deeper and deeper and Fairy Tail is well Fairy Tail. Putting HxH(also calling it scribbles) and those 2 in one post is pretty bad move to prove any point.I can name a lot of problems with Hunter x Hunter.
It might have less problems that Bleach or Fairy Tail, but it's massively overrated for what it is. The only arc it has that's above average is the Yorknew City arc. The Chimera ant arc is debatable. The rest was just ranged from average to mediocre. Mentioning it in the same sentence as FT and Clorox isn't an insult.
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I can name a lot of problems with Hunter x Hunter.
It might have less problems that Bleach or Fairy Tail, but it's massively overrated for what it is. The only arc it has that's above average is the Yorknew City arc. The Chimera ant arc is debatable. The rest was just ranged from average to mediocre. Mentioning it in the same sentence as FT and Clorox isn't an insult.
but you still read those 3 series
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Weird reasoning, but ok.
Definitely interesting reasoning and one that's also causing it's own problems.
The most obvious thing is that the convolutions to keep characters alive are now dis-satisfying in themselves. The most recent example being Monet and Vergo (and yes, we know they're still alive
). Personally I find it interesting, we have Sabo who returns and ends countless rounds of speculation, and Hody's crew who are the first who've been very definitively and permanently taken out of the action using non-lethal means.
After 15+ year even the youngest reader with the story from the beginning is now nearly 20 and hopefully prepared to deal with real death. It's right that Oda doesn't want to use it as an incidental thing (even though fodder, possibly different arguement) but the question is what balance will he strike. -
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I've not read HxH in a loooooooooong, long time but unless it has seriously nose dived in quality it is surely miles above the glop that is Fairy Tail.
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I deleted my comment about Greed Island cause I didn't want the HxH discussion to keep on going, I guess it was for naught.
C'mon guys, let's leave this discussion out of the thread, and let's keep it focused just on what it is, which is great.
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My favorite quote has to be the one about how Oda gets pissed off by people calling his villains weak, and that provoking him to power-up these villains.
Have we seen any instance where that might've happened during the series?
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I deleted my comment about Greed Island cause I didn't want the HxH discussion to keep on going, I guess it was for naught.
C'mon guys, let's leave this discussion out of the thread, and let's keep it focused just on what it is, which is great.
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My favorite quote has to be the one about how Oda gets pissed off by people calling his villains weak, and that provoking him to power-up these villains.
Have we seen any instance where that might've happened during the series?
Crocodile, I was surprised by his performance in the war against DD, Mihawk and Akainu.
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Crocodile, I was surprised by his performance in the war against DD, Mihawk and Akainu.
Crocodile was always strong, he and Moriah lost to Luffy due to overconfidence not lack of power, so no Croco boy didnt get any power up.
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I deleted my comment about Greed Island cause I didn't want the HxH discussion to keep on going, I guess it was for naught.
C'mon guys, let's leave this discussion out of the thread, and let's keep it focused just on what it is, which is great.
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My favorite quote has to be the one about how Oda gets pissed off by people calling his villains weak, and that provoking him to power-up these villains.
Have we seen any instance where that might've happened during the series?
Answer to that question was right below that Oda comment.
"I get annoyed to hear people speaking ill of characters in ONE PIECE. For example, when they say ‘this villain is weak’, I can't help thinking that then I'll make him much stronger!" Color Walk 6 (2014)
"Don't speak ill of Zoro."　Niconico Live Broadcast (28 December 2011)
Pre Timeskip Zoro always get the most injuries after a fight. He struggles more in a fight when compared to opponents Sanji beat easily and they are not that weaker than opponents Zoro is struggling with. Example: Kaku and Jyabura, Sanji beat Jyabura faster and easier but Zoro struggled with Kaku who's not that far superior to Jyabura.
And last two arcs before Kuma separated them Zoro was in his weakest state. So I guess people started calling Zoro weak then but now after Timeskip Oda has Zoro looking invisble.
EDIT: will they make this thread sticky? Wouldn't be fun if it goes bye bye and forgotten.
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So Oda says he doesn't put any message in what he draws but we all know that's some ol' bullshit.
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My favorite quote has to be the one about how Oda gets pissed off by people calling his villains weak, and that provoking him to power-up these villains.
Have we seen any instance where that might've happened during the series?
Does Bellamy count?
Probably Moriah too.
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Does Bellamy count?
Probably Moriah too.
You know I wonder when Oda actually planned to bring Bellamy back.
It'd be pretty neat if he had this idea back in his head when writing Jaya. -
Awsome thread, well done sandman!!.
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You know I wonder when Oda actually planned to bring Bellamy back.
It'd be pretty neat if he had this idea back in his head when writing Jaya.I think that quote applys to Bellamy more so then Moria, I've always liked Bellamy and he's shining more then ever giving even Luffy a surprise.
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thanks a lot sandman
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Thanks a lot Sandman :)
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Sandman is Oda I tell ya people
He is using break and doing his research and hes sharing bit of it with us :ninja:
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"I get annoyed to hear people speaking ill of characters in ONE PIECE. For example, when they say ‘this villain is weak’, I can't help thinking that then I'll make him much stronger!"
I love this. Seriously I love it. Now we even have a reason to keep the shit out of AP
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Huge Kudos to you sandman. Just awesome -
Thank you Sandman alot of work went into this!
"Don't speak ill of Zoro."　Niconico Live Broadcast (28 December 2011)
Best Thing I've read this whole month.
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Was the Kenshin stuff that bad?
It was only in the volumes anyways.If you ever get your hands on the Kenshin volumes don't read any comments from Watsuki. Not because of the copious amount of bullshit about nothing that Ordinary is referring to, but because when Watsuki is talking about the series he's revealing himself as an incredibly depressive inconfident person who just constantly shits on his own creation and self.
It makes the manga less enjoyable when he's constantly talking about every other character being a failed attempt at something.I don't think Kenshin is anything special as a manga to begin with, but it is enjoyable so it's no good to have it's creator rain on his own parade.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
I'm making this my signature.
And I will point towards it every bloody time somebody tells that I just don't get it and that I don't understand the story.
Yes Darth I'm sure Oda means he would smile and nod if people interpreted One Piece as an ode to pedophilia…nazism...murdering people...or pro-authoritarianism such as yourself.
This doesn't make you actually good at reading comprehension, it makes you even fucking worse than we thought lol.--- Update From New Post Merge ---
I can name a lot of problems with Hunter x Hunter.
It might have less problems that Bleach or Fairy Tail, but it's massively overrated for what it is. The only arc it has that's above average is the Yorknew City arc. The Chimera ant arc is debatable. The rest was just ranged from average to mediocre. Mentioning it in the same sentence as FT and Clorox isn't an insult.
Fairy Tale is the absolute bottom of the fucking shonen barrel. What the hell are you talking about.
And lol at comparing HunterXHunter to Bleach.
If Fairy Tale is a massive volcano of turds, Bleach is the complete absence of sensation.
Even your own description of HxH comes nowhere near either of those awful awful comics.–- Update From New Post Merge ---
I've not read HxH in a loooooooooong, long time but unless it has seriously nose dived in quality it is surely miles above the glop that is Fairy Tail.
No it's been as great as ever…and as questionable as ever.
The strange sadomasochistic reading experience of thinking Togashi is both an idiot and genius, though always a lazyass except when it comes to overly explaining his awesome concepts in pages and pages of words. -
I think people are misunderstanding what Oda meant by messages. I think he meant he doesn't straight up leave a message in a chapter like "even though Chopper and Hiluk aren't blood related they are still family". Instead he writes the story and allows those things to come out. "If I draw a story, the themes emerge all on their own."
