So, with the chapter out, does the "X" mark the spot?
Is this the Xth crewmember?(No, IMO, but it will be inevitable discussion for some time).
There's another character who's associated with the X mark and that's Vivi.
Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)
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Were they?
Brook's design and gags were defined, but the story about his crew and laboon which is what really makes him feel like a person wasn't. I remember at the time people thinking Brook was just a gag character and had no chance of joining, until his flashback happened.
Franky looked cool but we didn't know he wanted to be a carpenter (which he wasn't at the time) or that he liked ships or that he wasn't evil.
Jinbe was the most defined of the three but we still hadn't gotten stuff like him befriending Ace, hadn't gotten to see the extreme degrees his loyalty can take him to, or the context of Fishman Island's history that greatly plays into his motivations.
Yamato isn't any worse than Brook, at the very least.
That's an insult to Brook and Oda's foreshadowing.
Luffy wanting a musician since the beginning
Laboon
Afros in Davy Back arc
Luffy mentioned wanting to see a talking skeleton
Luffy wanting Brook immediately after meeting himYamato is Kaido's child that met Ace. Yamato idolizes Oden. Did Yamato, a child at the time, see Oden die? Could Ace and Yamato ever have met in the battlefield, Whitebeard Pirates vs Beast Pirates?:ninja: Yamato is Kaido's Ace. Out of control. Only Kaido can beat him, none of the Calamities. Big Mom's secret son, perhaps? The favor?
:ninja:Yamato is worse candidate than Brook was, at the least.
Bounty: 382M Quirks: High Places | Garchu
Roles: Ship Guard | Ship's Cat | Lookout
Clues: Ch 175 | Statue | Foxy Flag | Paw DF
Dreams: Travel w/ PK | The Dawn
Survival: Moon Resurrection | Will of P
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Koby is in the Marines spreading Luffy propaganda. The Drake flashback said it all. Lock him up. Sakazuki has to deal with Fuji, Smoker and Koby spreading nonsense. I hope there's more Marines who are extremely against the Straw Hats specifically to balance this.
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We've seen what Carrot can do. We literally have zero idea of what Vivi is currently capable of.
I'm not arguing for her to get any of those things, she can still use yoyos for all I care. That's on Oda. But there's plenty of established power up routes available, some of them like devil fruits near instant and some demonstrably learnable in a few days or weeks. And the timeskip means none of it would need to be pulled out of thin air or really explained just "I wanted to protect my country so I trained these last years as well."
If she rejoins the crew, she's going to be stronger than she was. In what way? I have no idea.
I don't think she's rejoining the main group anyway except for the final stuff. She'll be needed for the stuff at the end, though maybe not for fighting Blackbeard's crew.
I'm not saying she can't do those things to some extent. It's not what I personally expect or hope for, but I'm sure she won't just be helpless when the time comes.
However, I don't think Carrot has shown everything she can do, not by a long shot. I still think she has a few tricks up her sleeve. She's dived down low out of sight in order to rise up high very soon, and she'll do something big, right in front of Luffy. Just watch.
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Franky and Usopp gonna improve Carrot's gauntlets in the future if she joins
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Is it fair to judge Yamato's character (or lack thereof) right now when narratively it'd be kind of awkward to do so given the whole raid and chaotic nature of everything at the moment? Right now feels more like Oda setting up the pieces for the epic climax at the end of the arc, and giving a character backstory now, with everything happening, would definitely affect the flow of the story and tension. I assume Yamato's character will be fleshed out more when his backstory is intertwined in Kaido's inevitable backstory at some point down the line.
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Is it fair to judge Yamato's character (or lack thereof) right now when narratively it'd be kind of awkward to do so given the whole raid and chaotic nature of everything at the moment? Right now feels more like Oda setting up the pieces for the epic climax at the end of the arc, and giving a character backstory now, with everything happening, would definitely affect the flow of the story and tension. I assume Yamato's character will be fleshed out more when his backstory is intertwined in Kaido's inevitable backstory at some point down the line.
It's exactly because Yamato's introduction was at this moment in the arc that he feels empty. There was no foreshadowing of Yamato at all in any of the Onigashima scenes before, and the arc was on the second half of the third act when he was first mentioned. You usually don't introduce important characters so late in a story, when there's so many other things to care about.
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Is it fair to judge Yamato's character (or lack thereof) right now when narratively it'd be kind of awkward to do so given the whole raid and chaotic nature of everything at the moment? Right now feels more like Oda setting up the pieces for the epic climax at the end of the arc, and giving a character backstory now, with everything happening, would definitely affect the flow of the story and tension. I assume Yamato's character will be fleshed out more when his backstory is intertwined in Kaido's inevitable backstory at some point down the line.
Of course I take into consideration the fact that there's this huge war going on while Yamato is being introduced, and that's why I had decided to give him time to show me his character… and I'm very generous, so I'm open to any further development until the end of arc. I don't want to enforce any arbitrary deadline.
However, what I asked for in those first 10 chapters was not a huge level of depth, or a backstory, or a complete character. No, I didn't have this kind of nonsensical expection. All I wanted was Yamato's basic characterization to be well done according to my own subjectivity. However, despite his character being full of ideas, the presentation was extremely expository and uninspired, like checking boxes from a list. The gags were not well delivered. The supposedly emotional moments didn't show a spark of emotion.
Right now, readers only like Yamato for his design and strength, which is fine. It's the common desire to want to see the crew looking more infamous and menacing.
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Is it fair to judge Yamato's character (or lack thereof) right now when narratively it'd be kind of awkward to do so given the whole raid and chaotic nature of everything at the moment? Right now feels more like Oda setting up the pieces for the epic climax at the end of the arc, and giving a character backstory now, with everything happening, would definitely affect the flow of the story and tension. I assume Yamato's character will be fleshed out more when his backstory is intertwined in Kaido's inevitable backstory at some point down the line.
It just reminds me earlier with Carrot and now some of those folks are basically doing the same thing (at least to me as people say emotion and I say Oda failed entirely with the mentor connection with Carrot which killed the emotions for me which hell I cried with fucking Pound an which imo comes off as:
Don't act like Champs cause you'll end up like the Clippers going into a game 7 now
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My wife and I went through the new sketches of the crew and Jinbe and some of the older ones from DB Green. You can check it out here: http://apforums.net/showthread.php?t=52242&p=4082525&viewfull=1#post4082525
I'll just re-emphasize something here: the DBG info said Jinbe's early design made him look like a villain; it didn't say he was one. My thought is that he was intended to give off that vibe initially, especially with what it said about his character being more dynamic and boss-like, but he was always meant to be a good guy.
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In terms of Vivi joining, she has always been an option, even if she is far behind strength wise and such or lacks a role.
Vivi has always been different then every tag along and treated different then everyone, she has stayed popular all throughout the series eversince Arabasta and is popular in both hemispheres.
Vivi has always been the closet to the Strawhats that no matter the distance or the passage of time she still remains imo the closest to the Strawhats above everyone they meet, when ever something happens to the Strawhats its Vivi thats close by, wasn't surprised at all by Robin joining, was deciphering Luffys message when he went to marineford again (considering she knew Robin join before it was really reported don't underestimate her), clearly still has the same spirit from Sailing and that no-nonsense attitude.
She is even developed different compared to the WG princesses just by rereading Arabasta not to long ago, active to take roles in participating in the Government from a young age, knowing the meaning of her actions with Wapol, taking charge to chase and infiltrate BW.
Now with Revivre, we learn/know Arabasta is treated differently then any of the other 20 Royal Families that formed the WG, confronted CP-0 not giving a rats ass, Im has plans for her as unlike dangerous people/targets like Luffy, Blackbeard and Shirahoshi that were torn up Vivi has left unscathed and just the news of Arabasta, hell Greg on twitter brought this up I think is worth mentioning:
I've never been concerned with Power as @robby says Oda can come up with whatever he wants to bridge the ower gap if he wants:
- Training with pell and co since the Timeskip
- Inheriting Kumas Fruit or some other fruit
- Training with the Revs if/when we learn there stories are linked together with the Revivre
Oda can come up with anything if he really wants to, I don't think anyone should dismiss Vivi as she is clearly treated differently then every other Princess or Strawhat Ally
Discount Vivi at your own expense.
Vivi also has a god tier unit in Treasure Cruise that atm will never be power crept out.
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It just reminds me earlier with Carrot and now some of those folks are basically doing the same thing (at least to me as people say emotion and I say Oda failed entirely with the mentor connection with Carrot which killed the emotions for me which hell I cried with fucking Pound an which imo comes off as:
https://media1.tenor.com/images/05fa088085599efef08aa13698bbe6b6/tenor.gif?itemid=14095777Don't act like Champs cause you'll end up like the Clippers going into a game 7 now
The difference being:
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my ackowledgement of my own subjectivity, and the fact that I'm not ruling out Yamato for nakama just because of that. On the other hand, a lot of anti-Carrot comments are much more disingenuous, usually claiming that she has absolutely no chance of joining and undermining her presence throughout the story, as if she were Camie, like someone just did.
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while Carrot's emotional moments may not have resonated with you, they were extensively portrayed in the pages of the manga.
Chapter 877 contextualized Pedro's death with his dialogue with Carrot, but still no emotion since the death only happens at the very last page. In chapter 878 is facing what just happend trapped between sadness and anger, attacking Katakuri and stuff to avenge his mentor. Chapter 879 shows Carrot broken, crying a lot, and there's a progressive emotional development until she literally wipes her tears away to move on, going to the mast to do her duty as lookout, and then she sees Perospero chasing them on top of his sweet slug and Carrot starts crying again out of frustration and sadness. Chapter 888 makes her go Sulong while remembering of Pedro. Chapter 902 have a heartwarming scene between Carrot and Sanji where they comfort each other.
The emotions were unmistakably there regardless of how anyone felt about it. And, in my opinion, it was beautifully portrayed.
In comparison, Yamato's emotional moments were shaken off with minimum attention… and I think that was a bit of a failure regardless of Yamato's true importance. That said, this issue can be fixed.
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@Monkey
There was a reddit thread some time back discussing symbols that look similar
I feel like Tom's tat follows the same pattern
!
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That's an insult to Brook and Oda's foreshadowing.
Luffy wanting a musician since the beginning
Laboon
Afros in Davy Back arc
Luffy mentioned wanting to see a talking skeleton
Luffy wanting Brook immediately after meeting himYamato is Kaido's child that met Ace. Yamato idolizes Oden. Did Yamato, a child at the time, see Oden die? Could Ace and Yamato ever have met in the battlefield, Whitebeard Pirates vs Beast Pirates?:ninja: Yamato is Kaido's Ace. Out of control. Only Kaido can beat him, none of the Calamities. Big Mom's secret son, perhaps? The favor?
:ninja:Yamato is worse candidate than Brook was, at the least.
You are arguing Brook was more developed because he had foreshadowing, but we only know all that now after we got to see Brook in a full arc. Again, when we first saw Brook he had zero depth.
You could argue Yamato got foreshadowing due to all the Oden references, or some other reference we can't see now but will later on after we get their full flashback.
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the symbol is from the Hosokawa clan, who used to rule over Kumamoto, Odas hometown.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hosokawa_clanthe most famous Hosokawa samurai is actually Hosokawa Gracia, and her birth is name is Akechi Tama, yeah she was the daughter of the famous traitor Akechi Mitsuhide. And her given name, Tama, is written with the same Kanji as the One Piece's Tama.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hosokawa_Graciahttps://japanesehistoryenthusiast.wordpress.com/tag/hosokawa-gracia/
the helmet we saw behind Hawkins in this chapter also looks like Kato Kiyomasas helmet, the dude who built Kumamoto Castle.
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I’m confused Carrot supporters were saying “she’s definitely gonna be a big part of this arc, she’ll get her moment to shine, you’ll all see”
Now that she’s been doing nothing for a while, there saying “Well it’s suspicious that Oda hasn’t had her do anything…. so clearly He has something planned for her”
So basically went from “She’s gonna stand out” to “well the fact that she hasn’t stood out proves she’s going to stand out”
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I’m confused Carrot supporters were saying “she’s definitely gonna be a big part of this arc, she’ll get her moment to shine, you’ll all see”
Now that she’s been doing nothing for a while, there saying “Well it’s suspicious that Oda hasn’t had her do anything…. so clearly He has something planned for her”
So basically went from “She’s gonna stand out” to “well the fact that she hasn’t stood out proves she’s going to stand out”
Nothing has changed. She will be a big part of this arc, she will get her moment to shine, and you'll definitely see it when it happens.
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I’m confused Carrot supporters were saying “she’s definitely gonna be a big part of this arc, she’ll get her moment to shine, you’ll all see”
Now that she’s been doing nothing for a while, there saying “Well it’s suspicious that Oda hasn’t had her do anything…. so clearly He has something planned for her”
So basically went from “She’s gonna stand out” to “well the fact that she hasn’t stood out proves she’s going to stand out”
she doesn't even have an arc to claim as her own like the other Straw Hat. i'm only against her on a sound reason that she dose not have three quotas of mine checked to make me believe.
1: no arc
2: no flashback of her trauma (even law has that)
3: no dream/ inheriting dream from their dead idolPSN: The_BlueOGRE
Twitch: twitch.tv/blueogre
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she doesn't even have an arc to claim as her own like the other Straw Hat. i'm only against her on a sound reason that she dose not have three quotas of mine checked to make me believe.
1: no arc
2: no flashback of her trauma (even law has that)
3: no dream/ inheriting dream from their dead idolTotto Land was the start of her metamorphosis into an active character, and Wano isn't over yet. Pedro is her mentor whose death galvanized her into action: just because it happened in the present doesn't take away it's importance to her development. And he gave her the mission of helping the SHs bring the new dawn to the world.
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@blueigre
I was with you on the first half of #3, but the 2nd half was kinda off.
For the #1, i'd have to ask if FI arc or WCI arc were all about Jinbe? Or were any of them mostly about Jinbe? Shirahoshi took up the bulk of focus in FI and Sanji for WCI arc. I do get it tho because Carrot isn't the cornerstone of any of the 3 arcs. More of a running narrative of her own that doesn't push the immediate plot of those arcs. The fact that no one can put a finger on a non conflicting destination for her narrative is why I continue to question where the writer is going with this.
For #2, i'd have to ask another question. Where was Nami's traumatic flashback in her first 3 arcs? None in her first arc or Syrup Village and she disappeared for most of the Baratie arc. Why are things asked for from new possible nakama that can't be applied to every nakama? Law got a traumatic flashback in his 4th arc where he was notable. I might be wrong, but Law was strongly part of Sabaody - MF - PH and then finally got his traumatic flashback in the 4th arc of Dressrosa. That's 1 nakama in Nami and your example of Law. Both examples didn't get a traumatic flashback until the 4th arc.
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For the #1, i'd have to ask if FI arc or WCI arc were all about Jinbe?
he can share FI with Shirahoshi like how he share WCI with Sanji (and yes i consider it Sanji's second arc as he also gets a second flashback. including a second idol who dies this time)
For #2
i consider Arlong Park as her arc just like how Dressrosa is Law's
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I’m confused Carrot supporters were saying “she’s definitely gonna be a big part of this arc, she’ll get her moment to shine, you’ll all see”
Now that she’s been doing nothing for a while, there saying “Well it’s suspicious that Oda hasn’t had her do anything…. so clearly He has something planned for her”
So basically went from “She’s gonna stand out” to “well the fact that she hasn’t stood out proves she’s going to stand out”
Theres so many characters this arc. Even Marco barely has any screentime since he got here. Just gotta be patient with these big arcs.
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TL;DR
So…no Carrot in that group shot there. That would have shut me right the hell up about her chances, frankly. I'd argued that even if Oda had been setting her up for it, he's going about it in the worst, most bass-ackwards way so even if, after all this time, he decided to give her a spotlight amid the group, I'd concede, begrudgingly, but I'd do it. I just don't know what to make of her conspicuous absence there nor what her defenders think about it.
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The thing about Carrot to me is that after so many years and arcs, there's nothing hinting at hidden depths or a story waiting to be told. She's pretty straightforward and, besides seeing Pedro avenging, I don't see anything being set up for her.
This is different from characters like Nami, Robin, Law and others trhat took many arcs to flesh them out. All of them were hinted multiple times at having pasts and motivations to be explored.
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She works well as a straightforward character. She doesn't have to change substantialy who she is. All she has to do is channel her energy into this battle, show what she wants to do with Pedro pushing her on. I think that'll end up being enough.
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She works well as a straightforward character. She doesn't have to change substantialy who she is. All she has to do is channel her energy into this battle, show what she wants to do with Pedro pushing her on. I think that'll end up being enough.
Question, do you think Carrot will get her own personal flashback like all the other straw hat crew members got, or does Pedro's sacrifice at whole cake island fulfill that already? dead mentor, dream that needs to be fufilled
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Question, do you think Carrot will get her own personal flashback like all the other straw hat crew members got, or does Pedro's sacrifice at whole cake island fulfill that already? dead mentor, dream that needs to be fufilled
I don't think we need to see how she lost her parents or something like that. I hope we get a little into her Sulong training with Pedro, maybe a little insight into their mentorship and what she wants, but I don't think she needs a lot more than that. I'll be happy if we do get more, of course.
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. Again, when we first saw Brook he had zero depth.
Really ! In his first chapter he is already making skull and panties jokes. He is drinking his cup of tea and joining the crew in a big cliffhanger
In the second chapter he explains how he was alone for decades and reveal he is a musician while bonding with all the crew during a diner.
Is that what you call zero depth ?Compared to Yamato who has that much personality that he wants to be someone else.
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The thing about Carrot to me is that after so many years and arcs, there's nothing hinting at hidden depths or a story waiting to be told. She's pretty straightforward and, besides seeing Pedro avenging, I don't see anything being set up for her.
This is different from characters like Nami, Robin, Law and others trhat took many arcs to flesh them out. All of them were hinted multiple times at having pasts and motivations to be explored.
I checked out of curiosity, it's about to be 5 in october, 5 years…
@Lord:In terms of Vivi joining, she has always been an option, even if she is far behind strength wise and such or lacks a role.
Vivi has always been different then every tag along and treated different then everyone, she has stayed popular all throughout the series eversince Arabasta and is popular in both hemispheres.
Vivi has always been the closet to the Strawhats that no matter the distance or the passage of time she still remains imo the closest to the Strawhats above everyone they meet, when ever something happens to the Strawhats its Vivi thats close by, wasn't surprised at all by Robin joining, was deciphering Luffys message when he went to marineford again (considering she knew Robin join before it was really reported don't underestimate her), clearly still has the same spirit from Sailing and that no-nonsense attitude.
https://i.imgur.com/6WUFuVT.pngShe is even developed different compared to the WG princesses just by rereading Arabasta not to long ago, active to take roles in participating in the Government from a young age, knowing the meaning of her actions with Wapol, taking charge to chase and infiltrate BW.
Now with Revivre, we learn/know Arabasta is treated differently then any of the other 20 Royal Families that formed the WG, confronted CP-0 not giving a rats ass, Im has plans for her as unlike dangerous people/targets like Luffy, Blackbeard and Shirahoshi that were torn up Vivi has left unscathed and just the news of Arabasta, hell Greg on twitter brought this up I think is worth mentioning:
https://pm1.narvii.com/6204/7617a2ce89f17c2d27235aaf76361f836b64600d_hq.jpgI've never been concerned with Power as @robby says Oda can come up with whatever he wants to bridge the ower gap if he wants:
- Training with pell and co since the Timeskip
- Inheriting Kumas Fruit or some other fruit
- Training with the Revs if/when we learn there stories are linked together with the Revivre
Oda can come up with anything if he really wants to, I don't think anyone should dismiss Vivi as she is clearly treated differently then every other Princess or Strawhat Ally
Discount Vivi at your own expense.
Vivi also has a god tier unit in Treasure Cruise that atm will never be power crept out.
Too late, my evil plans of turning the forum into a Drake Dino Club is taking over.
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She works well as a straightforward character. She doesn't have to change substantialy who she is. All she has to do is channel her energy into this battle, show what she wants to do with Pedro pushing her on. I think that'll end up being enough.
And that’s why she faded away in the background, she’s built to be a supporting character. When the story is not about her, she’s barely present until she’s needed again. This fuels my opinion that she isn’t joining.
Wano predictions: There will be 5 acts; All Straw Hats will get fights, some in Act 4; Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Carrot will have her moment, but won't join; Yamato will be a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5; Next arc is Mary Geoise.
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Swerve! The final crewmember is Panda Man!
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I don't think we need to see how she lost her parents or something like that. I hope we get a little into her Sulong training with Pedro, maybe a little insight into their mentorship and what she wants, but I don't think she needs a lot more than that. I'll be happy if we do get more, of course.
I mean, any effort to make her feel like a real person would be welcome at this point!
Really ! In his first chapter he is already making skull and panties jokes. He is drinking his cup of tea and joining the crew in a big cliffhanger
In the second chapter he explains how he was alone for decades and reveal he is a musician while bonding with all the crew during a diner.
Is that what you call zero depth ?Compared to Yamato who has that much personality that he wants to be someone else.
Yep. All of that you described is not depth. It's the surface stuff. That's his basic design, the stuff he presents first. The depth is what he showed later, when he shows what actually goes in his mind.
Now granted Brook is a bit of an overdesigned character (a skeleton with an afro who drinks tea and is a gentleman but likes panties and is almost 3m tall and a musician and missing his shadow) but that just means he started with more surface stuff than everyone else.
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Yep. All of that you described is not depth. It's the surface stuff. That's his basic design, the stuff he presents first. The depth is what he showed later, when he shows what actually goes in his mind.
Adding to this comment: most characters with depth are presented with just surface, but signs of depth. For instance, way before we got to Nami's story, she had commented about losing a loved one to a pirate. Later, she was fixated on one of the bounty posters brought by Yosaku and Johny, and after she stole the Merry we saw her crying.
Likewise, before joining, Robin asked about the "D", shown signs of betrayal towards Croc, was found to have gotten a bounty at mere eight years old, and we learn she was part of the "Demons of Ohara".
Law, before his flashback, was shown to know about "D", to want to get "the right throne" before going to the New World, and even his reasons for saving Luffy were a mystery.
All of those things hint at hidden depths: stories waiting to be told.
I don't get any such vibe from Carrot. She didn't get on the ship because of some hinted dream, but because she wanted to have fun. She doesn't seem to have any purpose, it's only a naive character facing the world for the first time. She's fun and happy-go-lucky, but not much beyond that. It feels like she has no story to tell, she's only there to finish the arc started when she got in the ship with Pedro/Pekoms, and that arc most likely will end with her thanking for the adventure and returning home.
Now, it could have been easy to hint at mysteries and motivations over the past five years. For instance, when she heard about Luffy taking Pekoms to WCI, if she had just thought "Yes, this is finally my chance!" (something she was waiting for) instead of "This sounds like fun!" (spur of the moment), it would hint at a story to be told.
When she revealed herself in the Sunny, if she had reacted to the crew thinking of returning to Zou with "No, please, there's something I must do/learn at sea" instead of "Wanda will be mad", it would have given her some depth.
If in her many interactions with Chopper/Pedro/Crew in WCI she had at least once hinted at a purpose, objective or dream, it would make her more likely to be developed.
Instead, she stayed at surface level the entire time. The Carrot we met in Chapter 804/805 is pretty much the same Carrot we know in 990. I don't think Oda would have waited 5 years to start developing her if she was meant to join the protagonists.
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Simply put, as I've said many years in the past, if he had no plans for Carrot, he wouldn't have brought her along this far to begin with and she would have just remained in the background.
There is always a hidden agenda. Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. -
Simply put, as I've said many years in the past, if he had no plans for Carrot, he wouldn't have brought her along this far to begin with and she would have just remained in the background.
There is always a hidden agenda. Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.Exactly, I feel like this discussion is moot until Wano is actually done. If nothing truly happens soon, then sure it was never meant to be. However just the prime fact that he has kept her around with Nami instead of with Inu like she was in the first half of the arc, is interesting to say the least.
Its sort of my mentality for both Carrot and Yamato. I believe there can and possibly will be opportunities to explore their motivations/backgrounds/etc, but we have to also realize Oda is playing a massive balancing Act with like 40 other major characters this arc. If or when Carrot/Yamato get their moments, it will be a point when Oda needs it to be important to drive the story.
Technically, Carrot has had more to do on Onigashima than Chopper or Usopp as of yet. I personally think Oda is, like many people are thinking, keeping her around to drive an eventual point of relevancy. Possibly this will happen through Perospero or this may happen eventually by some other aspect. She is NOT with the Minks transforming or avenging her country against Jack. Its weird.
Yamato is sort of in a similar boat but even more so due to actual relevancy in the plot currently. He has already proclaimed his allegiance to Luffy, has pretty major ties to a past character, hints at a major flashback, is currently serving a function in the plot (taking care of Momo/Shinobu).
In the end, the point I'm making is that Wano has so much to cover, that it takes weeks or months to even truly realize a full plot point being made. Hawkins was gone for 35 chapters, nearly a full year. It took Apoo 40 chapters to be introduced in the arc, and another 30 to do something relevant. Law hasn't even done much in the last 7-8 chapters. Neither has Kid. There's only so much Oda can draw in a 15-17 page chapter with irregular breaks.
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@The:
Swerve! The final crewmember is Panda Man!
Secretly he has been with the Strawhats the whole time
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It would be consistent with Greg's words. The original crew Oda envisioned is there, but with an extra member that plays a role far away.
it is kinda strange that the original sketches and Vivre Cards amount to 10 people, but then you have Luffy claiming he'd like to have 10 and Teach's Titans.
it's like a "no but yes" scenario we have here.
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I think you are all seeing Carrot in a completely wrong way. The whole point of Carrot would be that she DOESN'T have a sad or tragic backstory. She grew up on the peaceful Zou. Pedro trained her in using the gauntlets after she didn't have the talent for swordsmanship. He became her mentor and later even trained her in Sulong. Because of Pedro she is also the only Musketeer with a green (Guardian) cape and also holds the special position as a rulers aide (a position that is no longer needed).
Pedro probably told her about his experiences and that's how she began to dream about this "Wonderland". When the Straw Hats arrived she took the first chance she got to explore this Wonderland, showing how naive she was about the whole thing. During this "fun" adventure she saw her mentor die who told her with his last words about the "Dawn" and that the Straw Hats are important to achieve it.
There is no complex background left to explore for Carrot. This is the START of her journey. She isn't a character who already has set ideals that she wants to achieve in the world, but because of the experiences in Zou, WCI and Wano she will come to realize what it is that she wants to do, what goals she wants to pursue and decide on how to achieve those. And that's what makes her so unique and interesting to me compared to all the other Straw Hats.
If Carrot were like all the other Straw Hats then Pedro would have died in a flashback because of some kind of attack on Zou and with his last words told her about the Dawn. Carrot then began to research the Dawn to find out more about it before she eventually met the Straw Hats and joined them to reveal the mystery of the Dawn. But Oda didn't do that. Instead he is showing us all of this in "real time" and not a flashback.
Does it really make such a huge difference that it was not a flashback? A lot of these comments read like as if all the problems you guys have with Carrot would disappear if it would have just been a simple flashback.
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Simply put, as I've said many years in the past, if he had no plans for Carrot, he wouldn't have brought her along this far to begin with and she would have just remained in the background.
There is always a hidden agenda. Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.She has a purpose. Doesn't mean that purpose is to be a main character.
And Carrot has been in the background for the entirety of Wano. Why?
To me, it's because she has no role outside of her own mini-arc, which is more related to Big Mom and Pedro. If so, she will have her resolution during the war and stay behind, her purpose fulfilled.
Wano predictions: There will be 5 acts; All Straw Hats will get fights, some in Act 4; Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Carrot will have her moment, but won't join; Yamato will be a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5; Next arc is Mary Geoise.
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And Carrot has been in the background for the entirety of Wano. Why?
In the background with the crew. That's the key thing here. I've compared her to Chekhov's gun earlier, and it still holds true to me. If Oda has kept her solely with the group this whole time and didn't make a show of giving her an errand to do apart from the group like he did with Yamato, then that implies she has a job to do with the group. When she does that job, it'll be something only she can do, and it'll be in direct service to the crew.
Carrot does not have to change. She just needs to do what she's been there to do. That's how she'll prove she's meant to be a Straw Hat.
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She has a purpose. Doesn't mean that purpose is to be a main character.
And Carrot has been in the background for the entirety of Wano. Why?
To me, it's because she has no role outside of her own mini-arc, which is more related to Big Mom and Pedro. If so, she will have her resolution during the war and stay behind, her purpose fulfilled.
There's no real cause to specifically have Carrot avenge Pedro when you remember Pekoms exist. He was part of the original Nox Pirates, he gave up and led the other barring Pedro and Zepo away till they arrived in Totland and became BM's subordinates. His story is already built for redemption and carry over for what Pedro had started and he abandoned. None of this needed to involve Carrot. So she simply existed to do something another character who had a bit more history with her mentor and actually knew of the circumstances of his shortened lifespan could do, huh?
Don't buy it. A lot of things in the story as it stands could continue regardless of Carrot's involvement, yet why she had to present with the crew throughout Whole Cake Island to Onigashima needs a level of justification, not just for her character, but the story as well.
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Newest SBS has Oda clarifying his "done in five years" statement. Basically he expects to be done with Luffy's story, IE, getting to the One Piece, in 5 years, but then there's going to be a big war after that which will take however long it takes. So probably more like 7 or 8 years as we've expected, and more reasonable on Oda's part as well..
Factor that into all future considerations of "there's not much time left."
@The:
Swerve! The final crewmember is Panda Man!
I would not be against this. He's been with us the whole time after all. Even had his own sub adventure on the covers!
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So… how about someone different?
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With the five years thing clarified as not containing the final arc, I can more clearly see how the next saga will unfold. No need to rush, after all.
I still think the 11th Straw Hat will join after Wano, probably in the first arc of next saga.
My theoretical roadmap is:
- Wano Act 5 to prep the saga. Shanks meets Luffy and challenges him to come to his territory and defeat his crew. Only then the Straw Hat can be returned. Zoro and Sanji have their arcs (Wano and WCI) finished. Blackbeard's entire crew revealed.
- Mary Geoise arc (Sabo, Vivi, Hancock stuff), meet Bonney. Kuma's story starts. Revolutionary/Robin stuff explored.
- Vegapunk arc. Finishing Kuma's story. Franky gets his arc.
- Blackbeard vs Shanks and we explore the story of Rocks.
- Elbaf arc. Usopp's arc.
- Race to Laugh Tale. Luffy and Blackbeard crews face off.
- The big freaking war.
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There's no real cause to specifically have Carrot avenge Pedro when you remember Pekoms exist. He was part of the original Nox Pirates, he gave up and led the other barring Pedro and Zepo away till they arrived in Totland and became BM's subordinates. His story is already built for redemption and carry over for what Pedro had started and he abandoned. None of this needed to involve Carrot. So she simply existed to do something another character who had a bit more history with her mentor and actually knew of the circumstances of his shortened lifespan could do, huh?
Don't buy it. A lot of things in the story as it stands could continue regardless of Carrot's involvement, yet why she had to present with the crew throughout Whole Cake Island to Onigashima needs a level of justification, not just for her character, but the story as well.
What even is that logic though?
You're essentially saying that any interpretation of Carrot's "Purpose" is invalid if that purpose could have been fulfilled by somebody else. You're saying that you believe that Carrot can only exist to do something that no one else can do. What Oda doesn't do is irrelevant though. He chose Carrot to do the things she did, so until a greater purpose makes itself known, then we can only take Carrot as she is and not as we want her to be. You say Pekoms could avenge Pedro, but Pekoms is not here. You know who is here, Carrot, ready to fulfill that purpose in the story.
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In the background with the crew. That's the key thing here. I've compared her to Chekhov's gun earlier, and it still holds true to me. If Oda has kept her solely with the group this whole time and didn't make a show of giving her an errand to do apart from the group like he did with Yamato, then that implies she has a job to do with the group. When she does that job, it'll be something only she can do, and it'll be in direct service to the crew.
Carrot does not have to change. She just needs to do what she's been there to do. That's how she'll prove she's meant to be a Straw Hat.
There's no real cause to specifically have Carrot avenge Pedro when you remember Pekoms exist. He was part of the original Nox Pirates, he gave up and led the other barring Pedro and Zepo away till they arrived in Totland and became BM's subordinates. His story is already built for redemption and carry over for what Pedro had started and he abandoned. None of this needed to involve Carrot. So she simply existed to do something another character who had a bit more history with her mentor and actually knew of the circumstances of his shortened lifespan could do, huh?
Don't buy it. A lot of things in the story as it stands could continue regardless of Carrot's involvement, yet why she had to present with the crew throughout Whole Cake Island to Onigashima needs a level of justification, not just for her character, but the story as well.
In both cases, I think you are confusing what you want to happen with what breadcrumbs are being left for us to follow.
I may be the wrong one here, but I don't see a protagonist being fleshed out, only a supporting character being held to fulfill her story purpose before she goes on her own business.
Wano predictions: There will be 5 acts; All Straw Hats will get fights, some in Act 4; Big Mom Pirates will arrive; Carrot will have her moment, but won't join; Yamato will be a Kouzuki samurai and Wano's Guardian; Shanks will visit Luffy in Act 5; Next arc is Mary Geoise.
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What even is that logic though?
You're essentially saying that any interpretation of Carrot's "Purpose" is invalid if that purpose could have been fulfilled by somebody else. You're saying that you believe that Carrot can only exist to do something that no one else can do. What Oda doesn't do is irrelevant though. He chose Carrot to do the things she did, so until a greater purpose makes itself known, then we can only take Carrot as she is and not as we want her to be. You say Pekoms could avenge Pedro, but Pekoms is not here. You know who is here, Carrot, ready to fulfill that purpose in the story.
Simple, the thing is no one knows what her purpose in the story is. She was supposed to stay back on Zou with the Musketeers while Luffy and the Sanji Retrieval Team SH go retrieve Sanji. Pekoms was their guide into Totland and Pedro went under the guise of being a Mink representative. Nekomamushi exclusively allowed Pedro to go because of his connection to Pekoms, which we later find out the more we read the arc. Under no circumstances was Carrot's involvement in the arc necessary and it was strange since she had no narrative ties to the arc at hand or really a reason to go outside of "adventure." The justification the story needs to establish is why was Carrot necessary to set off with the Straw Hats to Whole Cake Island to rescue Sanji, hear Pedro speak of the Dawn and allude to the Straw Hats significance in accomplishing it, strangely help out the crew on her own volition, and even be present for this raid with them as opposed to following Shishillian into battle against Jack. The narrative decisions around Carrot are never clear because she never attracts agency to the plot, but she's always there and I doubt its just her being purely fanservice.
Honestly, I've said this for the past 4-5 years.In both cases, I think you are confusing what you want to happen with what breadcrumbs are being left for us to follow.
I may be the wrong one here, but I don't see a protagonist being fleshed out, only a supporting character being held to fulfill her story purpose before she goes on her own business.
She can't fulfill the purpose if you don't know what the purpose is.
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In both cases, I think you are confusing what you want to happen with what breadcrumbs are being left for us to follow.
I may be the wrong one here, but I don't see a protagonist being fleshed out, only a supporting character being held to fulfill her story purpose before she goes on her own business.
I don't want Carrot to join any more than I wanted Jinbe to join. I see Oda pushing them together with the crew, which I believe is for the purposes of getting them to join.
Carrot was alone with the crew at WCI. She's been alone with the crew up to a chapter ago. That, more than anything, tells me she's there for reasons concerning the crew. I am strictly following breadcrumbs here.
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