Oh god, he's in my state right now…
I feel unclean just being here right now...
Indecision 2016 - In Soviet Russia, we elect american president!
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Pardon me if my words sound a bit rude, but I have to say it.
This dumbass thinks he can run in a general election all by himself. Really? REALLY?? What about campaigns? And fundraising? And getting the support of your party?
This must be the biggest idiot I've ever had the unfortunate privilege of learning about. Fuck him, and FUCK YOU GOP, you have brought this mess upon yourselves.
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How did things end up this way? Trump and his followers Smh.
Perfect storm of terrible events.
Mostly the GOP being so broken they can't manage to field a single decent candidate among the lot of them, nor could they decide to even work together amongst themselves until it was too late. 17 nobodies fighting each other allowed the loudest voice in the room to reach an audience and by the time they decided to actually try to work against him it was four months too late. They SHOULD have been down to three candidates by December, and all of them against Trump but nope! (And if they can't cooperate with themselves, how can they ever cooperate with Democrats?)
Not even a token trot out a token milquetoast centralist candidate.
If it makes you feel any better, the horrible numbers for him are still only like 3% of the actual population, and all signs point to a Goldwater style blowout when the time comes.
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Another poll that shows quite well the reality of things.
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Oh god, he's in my state right now…
I feel unclean just being here right now...
You already have to deal with John McCain, Joe Arpaio, & up until a while ago Jan Brewer.
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So do you think once he gets the nomination (if the GOP is really willing to give it to him, that is) he will change the tone of his speach? Because if he still plans to continue with that BS, then is like many of you said: he has no idea on how to run a campaign.
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He was already supposed to change his tone weeks ago lol. That's why he spoke with a teleprompter once.
(Remember when the GOP got mad that Celebrity Candidate Obama used a teleprompter?)
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So do you think once he gets the nomination (if the GOP is really willing to give it to him, that is) he will change the tone of his speach? Because if he still plans to continue with that BS, then is like many of you said: he has no idea on how to run a campaign.
Lol his rhetoric is the same stuff the establishment and tea party Republicans have been pushing for years if they haven't
changed or backed away from it he sure as hell isn't. -
I actually came across this article a few hours ago lol "Trump asks for $100,000 emergency donations" apparently to set up some kind of Clinton-counter ad campaign
http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/18/politics/donald-trump-emergency-fundraising/
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Sorry for the thread being locked, it was trump's fault.
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I actually came across this article a few hours ago lol "Trump asks for $100,000 emergency donations" apparently to set up some kind of Clinton-counter ad campaign
I was really surprised when I saw that. That's roughly the amount of money you'd beg for if you're running for Representative in a small media market or even a city level seat in a larger one. Not what you'd ask for if you're a theoretical candidate for the Presidency of the United States and especially not if you're one "capable" of throwing around vast sums at will.
Of course, there's been plenty of stories lately about the dire straits his campaign in money-wise, which are mostly self-inflicted. Like how he was given a list of about two dozen high level GOP donors to hit up, made about three phone calls, and apparently quit bothering.
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I think if the Dems wanted a solid landslide at this point, the easiest thing to do would be for Hilary to have Sanders as her running mate. But I get the feeling she just hates him and probably promised the position to someone else long ago anyway.
Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible. - Frank Zappa
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Maybe we'll finally see a third party conservative candidate get a real chunk of the vote?
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I think if the Dems wanted a solid landslide at this point, the easiest thing to do would be for Hilary to have Sanders as her running mate. But I get the feeling she just hates him and probably promised the position to someone else long ago anyway.
Probably mutual at this point plus I don't think Bernie would be content to stand back and let her have the spotlight even if he did accept.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Maybe we'll finally see a third party conservative candidate get a real chunk of the vote?
Possible since Gary Johnson is pulling a good chunk of Trump's support in the polls with him in it; enough to conceivably put states like Utah into play for Hillary.
Complicating things since 2009.
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Probably mutual at this point plus I don't think Bernie would be content to stand back and let her have the spotlight even if he did accept.
I think he'd gladly take the vice presidency, assuming she pushed some of his policies. Really, she needs to accept the fact that reuniting the party is more important than winning alone.
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I think he'd gladly take the vice presidency, assuming she pushed some of his policies. Really, she needs to accept the fact that reuniting the party is more important than winning alone.
California being a landslide for Hillary had probably already done as much for party unity; had Bernie made it a close contest, talking about taking it to the convention would have seemed more reasonable to people in general. As is, I think he's, if you excuse it, burned off a lot of potential leverage already by not endorsing Hillary and her poll numbers perking up is a reflection of that.
While I'm not a fan of giving up that Massachusetts Senate seat if Hillary wins (especially if it results in them picking Coakley again for the special election), Hillary could send just as much as a peace offering to the Sanders' crowd by picking Warren as she could Bernie.
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I'd love to see a third party win, but I think the chances of that happening are still very small, and sadly, a strong third party contender at this point will probably only have the Ross Perot effect and could end up handing Trump the presidency.
Whoever Hilary chooses for the VP is going to be very important, because she really isn't incredibly liked by the public.
Quite frankly, I've never been so completely disgusted by my choices in my lifetime. I've been apathetic, for sure, but I'm really dreading November no matter what happens. At the same time I'm kind of looking forward to it being over. I hate election years. >.<
Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible. - Frank Zappa
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I think if the Dems wanted a solid landslide at this point, the easiest thing to do would be for Hilary to have Sanders as her running mate. But I get the feeling she just hates him and probably promised the position to someone else long ago anyway.
I doubt Hillary care enough to hate Bernie after she won and I'm sure Bernie wouldn't feel confortable assuming that position after fighting her that long.
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I doubt Hillary care enough to hate Bernie after she won and I'm sure Bernie wouldn't feel confortable assuming that position after fighting her that long.
Politicians will do a lot of things for a lot of reasons. It would be nice if there was all that much altruism and dignity, but there isn't a whole lot of it. If it was decided that would be the best way to ensure the democratic nomination, I think they would do it. But like Ubiq said, there are other candidates that would garner a similar reaction. I think Bernie is probably pretty happy that he was as popular as he was - if Hilary actually loses, than the democratic party at large will feel very foolish.
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I'd love to see a third party win, but I think the chances of that happening are still very small, and sadly, a strong third party contender at this point will probably only have the Ross Perot effect and could end up handing Trump the presidency.
Perot's campaigns didn't really alter either results of the two elections he ran in though other than to prevent a landslide against Republicans. His support was drawn from both parties but actually had a bigger effect on Clinton's numbers than either Bush or Dole.
An election where a third party candidate actually undermined one of the major parties would be 1912 or 2000.
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Gary Johnson's got a legitimate chance at winning Utah since the state has rock-bottom approval ratings for both major candidates and he could theoretically leverage a protest vote. To a lesser extent he could be a factor in other Western states like Colorado, Arizona, and New Mexico, as well as some other states like Maine.
If you get dunked on in the dream, you get dunked on in real life
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Gary Johnson's got a legitimate chance at winning Utah since the state has rock-bottom approval ratings for both major candidates and he could theoretically leverage a protest vote. To a lesser extent he could be a factor in other Western states like Colorado, Arizona, and New Mexico, as well as some other states like Maine.
Johnson would be mostly drawing from the Republican vote, so in states like Utah and Arizona wouldn't the result of that be a freak Dem win because of split opposition?
Meanwhile uh…Maine and New Mexico are pretty if not very solid blue states.
Colorado trends blue. -
@Monkey:
Johnson would be mostly drawing from the Republican vote, so in states like Utah and Arizona wouldn't the result of that be a freak Dem win because of split opposition?
Meanwhile uh…Maine and New Mexico are pretty if not very solid blue states.
Colorado trends blue.Utah he could actually win because neither candidate is favorable.
The others are ones where he might potentially influence the outcome, not necessarily win. Several of Maine's polls have actually showed Trump relatively close to Hillary, and current thinking has the non-coastal West being fairly amenable to Libertarian ideas. Johnson might have a leg up in New Mexico since he was the governor there for two terms.
If you get dunked on in the dream, you get dunked on in real life
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Several of Maine's polls have actually showed Trump relatively close to Hillary,
I looked everywhere and couldn't find a single poll of Maine for the General Election. So uh…what?
and current thinking has the non-coastal West being fairly amenable to Libertarian ideas. Johnson might have a leg up in New Mexico since he was the governor there for two terms.
Yes but regardless of how much they deny it, the Libertarian party is a right wing one for all intents and purposes. The main voting draw will be from disgruntled Republicans.
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Utah he could actually win because neither candidate is favorable.
People keep saying that but there's a big difference in why the two candidates have high unfavorability ratings.
Hillary's numbers are high because of what people have been saying about her. Trump's are high because of what he's been saying.
One of those is going to have a big change before the election and the track record is pretty clear that it's not going to be for Trump.
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I really don't know what people see in the third parties in this country.
The Libertarians are just Republicans who like weed and the Greens are incompetent fucks.
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@Cyan:
I really don't know what people see in the third parties in this country.
The Libertarians are just Republicans who like weed and the Greens are incompetent fucks.
For a lot of independents, it's probably just the ability to feel superior to the sheep that belong to the two main parties while still allowing them to block vote for the candidates from those two parties.
Complicating things since 2009.
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For a lot of independents, it's probably just the ability to feel superior to the sheep that belong to the two main parties while still allowing them to block vote for the candidates from those two parties.
An aged white hippie, Grateful Dead shirt adorned with a NADER '00 sticker, watches Bush get sworn in.
A pang of certainty passes over him, but it is repressed by his mental image of Al Gore being sad.
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@Monkey:
I looked everywhere and couldn't find a single poll of Maine for the General Election. So uh…what?
My bad, I was mistaken. Trump is polling better than past Republican candidates in the Northeast but not really enough to contest them. Maine, on the other hand, voted Cruz, so Johnson could have a decent showing there as an alternative. Probably not enough to affect the outcome, but a noticeable one.
Yes but regardless of how much they deny it, the Libertarian party is a right wing one for all intents and purposes. The main voting draw will be from disgruntled Republicans.
Agreed. They might pull a few Democratic votes but the major draw will be from disgruntled Republicans. A shit Republican candidate plus growing Libertarian support could make for the best third-party showing since Ross Perot.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
People keep saying that but there's a big difference in why the two candidates have high unfavorability ratings.
Hillary's numbers are high because of what people have been saying about her. Trump's are high because of what he's been saying.
One of those is going to have a big change before the election and the track record is pretty clear that it's not going to be for Trump.
Given how overwhelmingly red Utah normally is, the healing of the Democratic party might have limited benefits there.
If you get dunked on in the dream, you get dunked on in real life
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this is leaving me scratching my head…
Donald Trump threatens to self-fund campaign if GOP support wavers -
My bad, I was mistaken. Trump is polling better than past Republican candidates in the Northeast but
Uh no he isn't.
Maine, on the other hand, voted Cruz, so Johnson could have a decent showing there as an alternative.
Wait are you basing everything you're saying around the Republican primaries…?
....Why? Especially in super blue states thats a really terrible idea. -
this is leaving me scratching my head…
Donald Trump threatens to self-fund campaign if GOP support waversreading this where he's blaming republicans- it would be interesting to see current repubs losing jobs over this if he doesn't get elected, but then again I'm sure they'd find someone even worse to replace them.
Also it's really funny, you know, where the media outlets, they have to quote Trump's exact way, his exact speech pattern, you know raises one pointed finger for emphasis that speech pattern
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@Monkey:
Uh no he isn't.
Better than recent ones, at least. For instance, Romney and McCain lost New York and New Jersey by ~26 and ~17 points, respectively. Recent polling had Trump trailing by 21 points in New York and 4 points in Jersey. He's doing relatively well in Connecticut too.
Wait are you basing everything you're saying around the Republican primaries…?
....Why? Especially in super blue states thats a really terrible idea.No, or I'd be saying a lot more Midwest states could swing left. The upper northeast just has a history of picking weird outsider candidates for office.
If you get dunked on in the dream, you get dunked on in real life
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The upper northeast's idea of weird outsider candidates are generally in the left persuasion.
Except for New Hampshire sometimes.
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reading this where he's blaming republicans- it would be interesting to see current repubs losing jobs over this if he doesn't get elected, but then again I'm sure they'd find someone even worse to replace them.
Also it's really funny, you know, where the media outlets, they have to quote Trump's exact way, his exact speech pattern, you know raises one pointed finger for emphasis that speech pattern
Along with the obligatory repeating himself.
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https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClUz-cIWIAAJoqY?format=jpg&name=largeI almost can't believe how comical this is turning out to be
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Mostly the GOP being so broken they can't manage to field a single decent candidate among the lot of them, nor could they decide to even work together amongst themselves until it was too late. 17 nobodies fighting each other allowed the loudest voice in the room to reach an audience and by the time they decided to actually try to work against him it was four months too late. They SHOULD have been down to three candidates by December, and all of them against Trump but nope! (And if they can't cooperate with themselves, how can they ever cooperate with Democrats?)
Yes, I agree. If they actually were less candidates, the GOP would actually have a better candidate for the main election. Though truthfully, the ones that were running were not that great compared to the Democrats. I think anyone that wants to hurt people's human rights, or force their religion into the government is not a good candidate, not at all.
Maybe we'll finally see a third party conservative candidate get a real chunk of the vote?
That would be interesting to say the least. I know Gary Johnson is running, so maybe a bunch of Republicans will vote for him. I actually think he did well when he was governor of New Mexico, plus it be interesting to see a third party candidate take a state at least.
Anyways, I think after this election, the Republican Party will probably change its platform. Probably brand new changes to them, to say the least. And maybe combine parties with the Libertarian Party even, since they are similar somewhat, but not really. Though I think the Libertarians are more superior out of the two of them. Though there's the off chance, they won't change, and be stubborn about it, so it be their loss for not realizing that they are wrong on many issues.
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@Cyan:
I really don't know what people see in the third parties in this country.
The Libertarians are just Republicans who like weed and the Greens are incompetent fucks.
It's a little more nuanced than that, but sheerly having someone not tied to the quagmire or the current parties is the main thing. The current parties are so entrenched in trying to appeal to so many that there's just some areas they overlook.
Voting for them shows some support, which shows interest, which means they could grow to be something next time.
Its never enough to get them to being really viable on a national level, but in local elections it can move forward a bit.
But yes, if my dad is any indication, it's mostly a "i'm morally superior" vote.
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[qimg]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClUz-cIWIAAJoqY?format=jpg&name=large[/qimg]
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClUz-cIWIAAJoqY?format=jpg&name=largeI almost can't believe how comical this is turning out to be
Oh my god…. is Trump not spending ANY money to attack Hillary?!?!?! Is he thinking that the media focusing on him all the time is enough?... is his Ego so high he can't fathom losing to her on name recognition alone?!?!?!?!?
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Something tells me he really doesn't wanna win.
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Oh my god…. is Trump not spending ANY money to attack Hillary?!?!?! Is he thinking that the media focusing on him all the time is enough?... is his Ego so high he can't fathom losing to her on name recognition alone?!?!?!?!?
He only cares about his ego, his money, & a woman's menstruation cycle.
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Better than recent ones, at least. For instance, Romney and McCain lost New York and New Jersey by ~26 and ~17 points, respectively.
Why are you comparing the election results to ….polls that at the latest are being taken in June (if they've been taken at all).
To make the comparison you need to compare June to June. Or whatever month the polls are in.
Polling in no election stays some sort of consistent throughout, they rise and fall like nuts.Recent polling had Trump trailing by 21 points in New York and 4 points in Jersey. He's doing relatively well in Connecticut too.
You didn't check the whole data on those did you.
Because that is Trump vs Clinton.
They also polled Trump vs Sanders (in the same polls at least for Connecticut).
New Jersey: Trailing by 18 points.
Connecticut: Trailing by 19 points. The 4 trail for Jersey is an outlier poll anyway. The other polls are at least 7, at most 15….for Clinton Vs. Trump.What you're seeing there is that the democrat vote hasn't consolidated yet, yielding a more enthusiastic Bernie bounce. While Trump's numbers stay the same more or less.
No, or I'd be saying a lot more Midwest states could swing left. The upper northeast just has a history of picking weird outsider candidates for office.
The Northeast in general does stuff like have independents in major positions (governors, senators). But that doesn't translate to supporting hard-right populism just because it's out of the ordinary lol.
Those independents tend to be super moderate dull people like Joe Lieberman and Lincoln Chafee. And well the other major example is Bernie himself.–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Oh my god…. is Trump not spending ANY money to attack Hillary?!?!?! Is he thinking that the media focusing on him all the time is enough?... is his Ego so high he can't fathom losing to her on name recognition alone?!?!?!?!?
The long and short of it is he doesn't have any idea how to run a real campaign, and because of his immense doofus ego he is barely if at all listening to the advice of the GOP people.
It seems like he thinks he can just do what he did in the primary and be a-ok lol.
Oh and also that he sees nothing wrong with a Republican candidate for president sinking money and time into campaigning for New York and California. -
This is an interesting article that sums up very well the current GOP situation: https://newrepublic.com/article/134366/donald-trump-will-buried-electoral-avalanche
There’s a Politico story out today about how the RNC gave him the names of twenty big GOP donors to call. He got bored or frustrated and stopped after calling three. And this comes after deciding that he actually doesn’t need to raise a billion dollars.
Long story short, they told him to "f*ck off".
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This is an interesting article that sums up very well the current GOP situation: https://newrepublic.com/article/134366/donald-trump-will-buried-electoral-avalanche
Long story short, they told him to "f*ck off".
That wasn't my takeaway from the article.
My takeaway was that Donald was too bored/lazy to actually do the whole donor process and quit after three calls lol. -
According to a Washington Post poll, Trump has startlingly high negatives, being viewed unfavorably by 77 percent of women, 89 percent of Hispanics and 94 percent of African-Americans.
It's actually pretty amazing that its even possible to alienate that huge a percentage of entire ethnicities and genders.
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For a lot of independents, it's probably just the ability to feel superior to the sheep that belong to the two main parties while still allowing them to block vote for the candidates from those two parties.
For me, it's the freedom to vote for the candidate I want regardless of party. I do see a TON of people feeling smug and superior about being loyal to one specific party though, usually accompanied by attempts to label the other major party evil and the accusation of "if you're not with us, you're against us."
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For me, it's the freedom to vote for the candidate I want regardless of party. I do see a TON of people feeling smug and superior about being loyal to one specific party though, usually accompanied by attempts to label the other major party evil and the accusation of "if you're not with us, you're against us."
The overwhelming majority of self-identified independents really do just vote for either of the two parties though and always have, which is why third parties aren't viable in the current system. The only third party runs in the history of this country that actually altered an election have come at the expense of one of the two major parties of that time period, whether in 1860, 1912, or 2000. In all of those cases and the cases where they didn't alter the election (like 1948), those voters largely went right back to their main party within the next two elections.
True independents are practically non-existent in our political system, which is a real shame, but that's how it is.
Complicating things since 2009.
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I have to say it's good to see (according to taboo's source) that there is not the same insane amount of money wasted, as both partys did during the 2012 election campaigning.
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