You can use that selfsame logic to justify any fruit ability. No matter the range.
Pretty much, which is why it's such an awkward topic to even approach. We all know that it's there, but since it's something that no one really knows much about we can't really say where to draw the line. In Violet's case, though, it's just about her ability not making any logical sense at all. It's… strange because usually Oda tries to work around that somehow.
Right now, I see CP0 appearing to stop the Riku Dwarf army.
Wait a minute… How was the Riku Dwarf army allowed to plan a revolution for a whole year if Violet can see for 4000 KILOMETERS UNHINDERED?
Moreover, why isn't she telling Sanji exactly what's going on all over the island? Yes, she's telling him about the Sunny, but what about Law's defeat, Fujitora's presence, the SMILE factory, the toy house, the Riku Revolution... And isn't she able to READ the thoughts of the people she's looking at? If she can also do this at a distance of 4000 kilometers, then shouldn't the entire state of Dressrosa be under thought police? This is some Enel-level shit.
Wait a minute… How was the Riku Dwarf army allowed to plan a revolution for a whole year if Violet can see for 4000 KILOMETERS UNHINDERED?
Moreover, why isn't she telling Sanji exactly what's going on all over the island? Yes, she's telling him about the Sunny, but what about Law's defeat, Fujitora's presence, the SMILE factory, the toy house, the Riku Revolution... And isn't she able to READ the thoughts of the people she's looking at? If she can also do this at a distance of 4000 kilometers, then shouldn't the entire state of Dressrosa be under thought police? This is some Enel-level shit.
Simple. She was never loyal enough to spill the beans.
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@Toraish:
Pretty much, which is why it's such an awkward topic to even approach. We all know that it's there, but since it's something that no one really knows much about we can't really say where to draw the line. In Violet's case, though, it's just about her ability not making any logical sense at all. It's… strange because usually Oda tries to work around that somehow.
I don't see why a really long-range byakugan should be nonsensical.
Simple. She was never loyal enough to spill the beans.
Hm, well that doesn't really answer the other questions,
but it does explain why Doflamingo wasn't all-powerful on his island.
I don't see why a really long-range byakugan should be nonsensical.
She can also read people's thoughts,
transfer thoughts to other people,
and shoot whales out of her eyes.
Hm, well that doesn't really answer the other questions,
but it does explain why Doflamingo wasn't all-powerful on his island.She can also read people's thoughts,
transfer thoughts to other people,
and shoot whales out of her eyes.
All things related to eyes and eye puns. We've seen hypnotism before in the series.
All things related to eyes and eye puns. We've seen hypnotism before in the series.
What does hypnotism have to do with perfect mind x-rays.
People didn't have that problem with Kuma's fruit.
Kuma's power has a unifying principle. Violet's many powers kind of don't. Okay, farsight, x-ray vision and mind-reading I'm fine with just about all being under the 'insight' power, but where the iron tears come from is beyond me. Next thing you know, she'll be shooting lasers from her eyes . . .
@Monkey:
No they weren't.
The whole plot of Water7 was based around a long term undercover operation to retrieve ancient blueprints of a death weapon.
How is that an assassination job?
CP9 were repeatedly referred to as the Government's assassins … The one job we saw Lucci's lot do was mainly about something else (although there was some assassination on the side - kill everyone who knows about the blueprints) but Jyabra's lot's job was just assassination of revolutionaries. So yeah, one of our two missions suggests they do more expected undercover intelligence type jobs, but we get all these references to them being assassins, the idea definitely sticks that they were assassins.
Wait a minute… How was the Riku Dwarf army allowed to plan a revolution for a whole year if Violet can see for 4000 KILOMETERS UNHINDERED?
Moreover, why isn't she telling Sanji exactly what's going on all over the island? Yes, she's telling him about the Sunny, but what about Law's defeat, Fujitora's presence, the SMILE factory, the toy house, the Riku Revolution... And isn't she able to READ the thoughts of the people she's looking at? If she can also do this at a distance of 4000 kilometers, then shouldn't the entire state of Dressrosa be under thought police? This is some Enel-level shit.
It does seem her power is kind of low resolution. Like she knew Jora was attacking the Sunny but she didn't know how it was going or the outcome. She knew their was a lightning strike on the Sunny, but she didn't know it was made by Nami and just hit Jora.
And dwarfs are small :p Although, it is possible that Doflamingo knew about the planned revolution all along …
Sorry, what I meant was the whole concept of "seeing the soul through the eyes."
It would even be fine if it was like Byakugan, which in and of itself is kind of borderline BS but still commonly accepted, but since it's said to be an ability to fix your point of view to some arbitrary place within the radius it just weirds me out. Like, how on earth does that work?
In Loving Memory of Toraish, Rex Avium: http://apforums.net/showthread.php?t=40786 | 3DS Friend Code: 3196-4274-7836
I don't know why hypnotism sprung to mind lol
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@Toraish:
It would even be fine if it was like Byakugan, which in and of itself is kind of borderline BS but still commonly accepted, but since it's said to be an ability to fix your point of view to some arbitrary place within the radius it just weirds me out. Like, how on earth does that work?
Uhh… by magic?
How does Luffy chew things with rubber teeth
I just want to say:
LOL at anyone who thinks that CP0 won't be far stronger than CP9.
@Toraish:
It would even be fine if it was like Byakugan, which in and of itself is kind of borderline BS but still commonly accepted, but since it's said to be an ability to fix your point of view to some arbitrary place within the radius it just weirds me out. Like, how on earth does that work?
Duhhh, the light from point X bends and travels as necessary to Violet's eyes, thus allowing her to see as if she were at point X.
Not that that's a good explanation.
Kuma's power has a unifying principle. Violet's many powers kind of don't. Okay, farsight, x-ray vision and mind-reading I'm fine with just about all being under the 'insight' power, but where the iron tears come from is beyond me. Next thing you know, she'll be shooting lasers from her eyes . . .
The unifying principle is eyes. It's more unifying than Kuma's strange concept of pushing.
Blehh, I already talked about this whole magic is dumb thing earlier. It's just not solid writing. But whatever lol, I'll just go to sleep. It's 4am and I'm still going on about the same silly thing that I was eight hours ago.
Duhhh, the light from point X bends and travels as necessary to Violet's eyes, thus allowing her to see as if she were at point X.
Not that that's a good explanation.
LOL, that works for me. Lightbending. Goodnight o/
Wait a minute… How was the Riku Dwarf army allowed to plan a revolution for a whole year if Violet can see for 4000 KILOMETERS UNHINDERED?
Moreover, why isn't she telling Sanji exactly what's going on all over the island? Yes, she's telling him about the Sunny, but what about Law's defeat, Fujitora's presence, the SMILE factory, the toy house, the Riku Revolution... And isn't she able to READ the thoughts of the people she's looking at? If she can also do this at a distance of 4000 kilometers, then shouldn't the entire state of Dressrosa be under thought police? This is some Enel-level shit.
I don't think she can see what's underground.
About Sanji, she was probably focused on the ship. I doubt she can see everything within a radius of 4000km all the time. I also don't think she can read the thoughts of people while doing clairvoyance, or else there would be no point in her capturing Sanji.
CP9 were repeatedly referred to as the Government's assassins …
Were they ever called THE assassins? Or are you confusing one of their jobs with somehow being their only job.
This is a pointless argument to have when an entire arc revolved around a HUGE years long job that was not an assassination job.
The one job we saw Lucci's lot do was mainly about something else (although there was some assassination on the side - kill everyone who knows about the blueprints)
Lucci, Califa, Kaku, and Blueno. 4/7 of the unit, kept for literal whole years on a non-assassination job. A job focused around getting an inanimate object.
Most of those years being nothing but pure intelligence gathering and undercover identity work.
but Jyabra's lot's job was just assassination of revolutionaries.
Again, you're mistaking a thing he did, with what he does.
It's never said "Jabura only kills revolutionaries", it was said he and the other two had been on a job that involved killing a revolutionary.
Going by your logic, three of them are assassins, and four of them are inanimate object getters.
Instead of the obvious reality which is they are secret agents who specialize in all manner of secretive dirty work. Such as intelligence gathering, undercover jobs, assassination, and whatever they need to do for any given objective.
They're secret agents of an authoritarian regime.
They literally said CP0 was the strongest. Where's the debate here
umm don't see Wica anywhere, maybe she go back to her group?
@Monkey:
Were they ever called THE assassins? Or are you confusing one of their jobs with somehow being their only job.
This is a pointless argument to have when an entire arc revolved around a HUGE years long job that was not an assassination job.Lucci, Califa, Kaku, and Blueno. 4/7 of the unit, kept for literal whole years on a non-assassination job. A job focused around getting an inanimate object.
Most of those years being nothing but pure intelligence gathering and undercover identity work.Again, you're mistaking a thing he did, with what he does.
It's never said "Jabura only kills revolutionaries", it was said he and the other two had been on a job that involved killing a revolutionary.Going by your logic, three of them are assassins, and four of them are inanimate object getters.
Instead of the obvious reality which is they are secret agents who specialize in all manner of secretive dirty work. Such as intelligence gathering, undercover jobs, assassination, and whatever they need to do for any given objective.
They're secret agents of an authoritarian regime.
I wasn't saying they were assassins, I was just saying why people have the impression they are assassins :p
If I were to argue that CP9 were "just" assassins (pun not intended :S) I would point out that Lucci's lot's job was mainly orchestrated because of Spandam's desire to get Pluton's blueprints coinciding with him being director of CP9. Or else that the need to kill anyone who was aware of the blueprints' existence was the part that warranted the use of CP9 ver some other agency.
But I'm not convinced enough by that to actually argue it with you, so good night.
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umm don't see Wica anywhere, maybe she go back to her group?
Wicca is present (in Zoro's shirt) in the panel in the present on the first page, but is gone on the next page. Seems likely to be a mistake, or else Wicca actually leaves between the two panels.
Basically, you think Luffy said this:
"I can't do the thing only person 1 in my crew can do, I can't do the thing only person 2 in my crew can do, I can't do the thing that only person 3 in my crew can do, I can't do the thing only person 4 can do in my crew!"
"Then what can you do?"
"I can do the thing persons 1 and 2 in my crew can also do."
Do you not see how that makes for a really badly written moment?
That aside, you've ducked the point. Why did Oda write that speech in, in your view? What is he telling us? If you interpret big character moments in a purely in-universe way, you're either missing half of the significance, or else you just consider Oda to be such an abysmal writer as to say he cannot have been carrying any greater point.
It was clear that Sanji and especially Zoro couldn't beat Arlong because they were injured. The "message" of Oda was a lot more evident in the battle of Luffy vs Zoro in Whiskey Peak, even if power levels aren't used much in One Piece I think that made pretty clear that they were more or less equal in strength, and there is no factor that can denied this throught the entire series, even if Luffy is beating the strongest opponents.
@Toraish:
This "I can see 4000km in every direction using my DF" bullshit is even worse than Hody's water bullet traversing a 500km distance within Fishman Island that was shown to be incredibly small. Oda's grasp on basic geography is quite frankly appalling.
I guess that's what you get when a man never leaves his Office. It's only when you travel, (and not by airplane) that you realize just how far 4000km are. The distance struck me as pretty ridiculous too. You sit this woman down in Central Africa and she can watch every single place on the damn continent. She should have not seen the Strawhats coming a day ago, she should have seen them since leaving Alabasta or something…
@Toraish:
This "I can see 4000km in every direction using my DF" bullshit is even worse than Hody's water bullet traversing a 500km distance within Fishman Island that was shown to be incredibly small. Oda's grasp on basic geography is quite frankly appalling.
I guess that's what you get when a man never leaves his Office. The 4000km struck me as pretty ridiculous too. You sit this woman down in Central Africa and she can watch every single place on the damn continent. She should have not seen the Strawhat coming a day ago, she should have seen them since leaving Alabasta or something…
Geography? This just sounds like Oda has no sense at all about numbers and measurements. They're just big numbers to him.
I think he's obviously decent on geography.
@Monkey:
By this logic you shouldn't consider the Admirals monsters lollll.
This makes no sense. You argue the most losing positions around.
Why wouldn't the admiral be monsters by my logic?
For the CP9 wasn't it stated they were assassins and that's why Lucci joined them. I know they were also doing infiltration jobs and sorry if it seems I didn't acknowledge that but I remember them being there for classified work and as such all the member were trained for battle.
For CP0 nothing in them seems to point at them being fighters. So them being involve in fighting strawhats would sure surprise me. Are they strong? I suppose so. But monsters? I don't think so.
Or assume Oda meant square miles and that makes for a reasonable sized island.
@Toraish:
This "I can see 4000km in every direction using my DF" bullshit is even worse than Hody's water bullet traversing a 500km distance within Fishman Island that was shown to be incredibly small. Oda's grasp on basic geography is quite frankly appalling.
I'm guessing that though while 4k km is a ridiculous amount of distance, the fact that she says it's a bird's-eye view means that her vision is centered at one point and can see out that far to the horizon…
Why wouldn't the admiral be monsters by my logic?
For the CP9 wasn't it stated they were assassins and that's why Lucci joined them. I know they were also doing infiltration jobs and sorry if it seems I didn't acknowledge that but I remember them being there for classified work and as such all the member were trained for battle.
For CP0 nothing in them seems to point at them being fighters. So them being involve in fighting strawhats would sure surprise me. Are they strong? I suppose so. But monsters? I don't think so.
dude just stop they were already stated to to be the strongest cp when they were introduced tho I dont think theyre at monster trio level that would be too much
[http://readms.com/r/one_piece/723/2086/5
S](http://readms.com/r/one_piece/723/2086/5)econd panel.
Ha. Didn't notice that.
Cute.
Does someone know when Law could have got that hearth?
Hmm…Zoro and Kin'emon standing in front of the coliseum, arguing without the marines noticing them. It would be nice if Bastille showed up.
Wait a minute… How was the Riku Dwarf army allowed to plan a revolution for a whole year if Violet can see for 4000 KILOMETERS UNHINDERED?
Moreover, why isn't she telling Sanji exactly what's going on all over the island? Yes, she's telling him about the Sunny, but what about Law's defeat, Fujitora's presence, the SMILE factory, the toy house, the Riku Revolution... And isn't she able to READ the thoughts of the people she's looking at? If she can also do this at a distance of 4000 kilometers, then shouldn't the entire state of Dressrosa be under thought police? This is some Enel-level shit.
I think Violet is a member/part of previous ruler, and she's allowed to live/being a part of DD's group because of her ability. And she doesn't know about the plan to destroy the factory or the revolution plan.
She's able to READ the thoughts of the people by perform the technique she used at Sanji, i guess she can't use 2 technique at the same time.
I'm guessing that though while 4k km is a ridiculous amount of distance, the fact that she says it's a bird's-eye view means that her vision is centered at one point and can see out that far to the horizon…
Maybe 4k km is the distance a bird can go before … take a break?
Why wouldn't the admiral be monsters by my logic?
You're saying because CP0 is at the beck and call of the World Nobles, they must be weak.
Nevermind that this makes no sense at all, but as it applies to the Admirals too you are saying that about the Admirals.
The main point I'm making is that your logic makes no sense.
For the CP9 wasn't it stated they were assassins and that's why Lucci joined them.
No.
I know they were also doing infiltration jobs and sorry if it seems I didn't acknowledge that but I remember them being there for classified work and as such all the member were trained for battle.
What the hell covert agencies in the fictional sense of James Bond type shit AREN'T trained for combat.
For CP0 nothing in them seems to point at them being fighters.
Except common sense, basic logic, and occam's razor, as opposed to the absolute zero reasons to think they aren't.
So them being involve in fighting strawhats would sure surprise me. Are they strong? I suppose so. But monsters? I don't think so.
Yes I'm sure the WG employes people incapable of handling the New World in the New World. Sounds like a sound plan.
I guess that's what you get when a man never leaves his Office. It's only when you travel, (and not by airplane) that you realize just how far 4000km are. The distance struck me as pretty ridiculous too. You sit this woman down in Central Africa and she can watch every single place on the damn continent. She should have not seen the Strawhats coming a day ago, she should have seen them since leaving Alabasta or something…
i think you miss understood the idea behind violet ability its not like she can active it and she can see 4000 km instant her ability is similar to brook ghost mode she can use her eyes like a bird and travel 4000km in all direction so it will take time to travel 4000km by bird speed and we saw her in the panel when she explained it the sunny was far away when she got near she saw the lightning but didn't see it clearly cuz she wasn't close enough she need to travel i hope i made sense
It was clear that Sanji and especially Zoro couldn't beat Arlong because they were injured. The "message" of Oda was a lot more evident in the battle of Luffy vs Zoro in Whiskey Peak, even if power levels aren't used much in One Piece I think that made pretty clear that they were more or less equal in strength, and there is no factor that can denied this throught the entire series, even if Luffy is beating the strongest opponents.
Yes, it seems obvious that during those times Zoro was equal to Luffy in strength, but after beating someone of Crocodiles caliber his strength surpassed Zoro's. Even more so after the arcs ahead. The gap in their strength grew apart even more greatly thanks to the 3 arcs after Sabaody. But it's natural that Luffy should be on an entirely different level from his crew mates being the captain.
Hmm…Zoro and Kin'emon standing in front of the coliseum, arguing without the marines noticing them. It would be nice if Bastille showed up.
Haha, Oh, yes indeed. I would love to see that happen. It's a good situation to be in for that. Judging from the fact that they aren't trying to get over the wall through many methods that can obviously be used, I'd say this is an attempt to stall for time (oda). Luffy needs to finish that tournament after all.
Does someone know when Law could have got that hearth?
When he was running away from FujiDofla.
I think people are getting confused because they originally said CP9 was the strongest cipher pol in history and now there saying CP0 is…. I'll try to find the chapter where they say CP9 is but seeing as how the link has already been provided for CP0 there shouldn't be any doubt in anyone's mind as to whether they can fight or not
Member of Beelzebub is Freakin' Awesome Group
what I'm catching up on currently: Gintama, lone wolf & cub, Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind, and lost in poem (by our very own AP member GEPPETTOSMONSTER)
I think people are getting confused because they originally said CP9 was the strongest cipher pol in history and now there saying CP0 is….
It was stated that the specific lineup of CP9 (Lucci, Kaku, etcetera) was the strongest in history.
For the CP9 wasn't it stated they were assassins and that's why Lucci joined them. I know they were also doing infiltration jobs and sorry if it seems I didn't acknowledge that but I remember them being there for classified work and as such all the member were trained for battle.
For CP0 nothing in them seems to point at them being fighters. So them being involve in fighting strawhats would sure surprise me. Are they strong? I suppose so. But monsters? I don't think so.
CP is one of WG's organizations with main task is to supply intelligence/information. CP9 is one of the CP's agencies with privilege to kill, which makes their existences is keep secret/hidden. Most of it's member were orphan raised and trained by WG. So, for Lucci, being a CP9's member is not his choice of life, that's why he feel pity for Robin.
I dont now if anyone have pionted it out, but i find it pretty hilarious that barto who has a higher bounty than zorro is such a fanboy of him
About Violet and her clairvoyance being overpowered, illogical and bullshit! People, in REAL LIFE birds can travel 11,500 Kilometers without stop!!! Yes, without sleeping nor eating nor drinking! This is 3 times the distance of Violet clairvoyance!
Before calling something bullshit or illogical(I don't see how a supernatural power of clairvoyance of the distance of a continent is illogical or bullshit!) go search for your facts! Is a huge distance? sure it is! Is impossible to travel? Sure it isn't!
Now that I think about it, can't Robin copy Violet's ability? All Robin has to do is spawn eyes on a bird. The question now is the range she can keep her ability active.
It's even better than that. She could throw a rock, sprout a bunch of arms out of it to make wings (sure, in thriller bark she said she could fly only a short distance but that was lifting her own bodyweight) and then sprout eyes out of that.
@Monkey:
You're saying because CP0 is at the beck and call of the World Nobles, they must be weak.Nevermind that this makes no sense at all, but as it applies to the Admirals too you are saying that about the Admirals.The main point I'm making is that your logic makes no sense. No.What the hell covert agencies in the fictional sense of James Bond type shit AREN'T trained for combat.
My logic was since they already have the admirals when it comes to monsters they wouldn't need another group of monsters.Doesn't the CP9 have an island to train their recruits since childhood. Plus the thing about spending your life to learn the techniques they use.
He already had a hearth at the bridge.
That was Caesar's heart.
@•Ace•:
Now that I think about it, can't Robin copy Violet's ability? All Robin has to do is spawn eyes on a bird. The question now is the range she can keep her ability active.
She wouldn't be able to control the bird anyway.
Hasn't it been said that CP9 is the strongest cipher pol?
If that is so then that means they aren't monstrously strong.
It seems to me that their purpose in CP0 is gathering intelligence using their amazingly high level of intelligence. It would also explain why the marines have the most top notch information gathering, even figuring out that Buggy was a member of Gold Rogers crew.
No, Lucci's group was the strongest CP9.
@Monkey:
When did Franky install a fireplace in the Sunny?
I don't know. I was just wondering when Law could have meet that marine prior to green bit since I don't remember he had such time.
