If that is actually true i might drop OP for a while.
The sheer laziness of it all blows my mind.
It says that he's "a" chief commander of CP9. If the us of a instead of the is intentional (not sure how it would translate), then that heavily implies that there are more chief commanders.
If that is actually true i might drop OP for a while.
The sheer laziness of it all blows my mind.
If he was that highly ranked, we would have known something about it by now in the actual canon manga - yet its never once stated he's Chief commander or anything like that. So that can safely just be ignored.
Aside from the chief commander bit I find it hilarious to use Film Gold to judge Lucci's postion in CP0. He and Sabo were in the movie for a grand total of five minutes, had no impact on the plot, and were only there for promotional hype.
Not to mention that in the TV special preceding Film Gold the main villain overpowered one of the masked CP0 agents.
Spoiler:
@Kaido:
Aside from the chief commander bit I find it hilarious to use Film Gold to judge Lucci's postion in CP0. He and Sabo were in the movie for a grand total of five minutes, had no impact on the plot, and were only there for promotional hype.
Not to mention that in the TV special preceding Film Gold the main villain overpowered one of the masked CP0 agents.
I agree that movie promo should be taken with a ton of salt, but I wouldn't dismiss it completely either.
Lucci is a popular character and Oda knows that. He's like a mini-Trafalgar Law.
I mean the stupid Sabo vs. Lucci clash has over 5 million views on Youtube. A 2 minute video where pretty much nothing happens.
The comment section is funny though.
My bet is that Lucci is among the top 3 of the CP0, with one super CP0 figure at the top. The New World Mega Lucci.
Spandam blamed CP9 for the fall of Enies Lobby, yeah. Which lead to Lucci threatening Spandam over phone.
I can see it go two ways:
Spandine offered Lucci the promotion to make amends for Spandam's incompetence. Part of the deal was Spandam working under him from then on, if at all. Sounds like the best option when a group of Assassins is on your back for revenge.
Lucci was reinstalled by someone with more power than Spandine / Spandam. In the SBS Uniaka linked there is talk about Spandine being sick, which prevents him from pulling the strings for his son in some manner.
They are professionals. Letting the situation escalate would just prevent them from gathering more information about Wano. Keep in mind that with the latest translation, this is the first visit of the WG. You can always send more troops once you have a rough idea of the enemy forces.
I completely forgot that Spandam's dad was an actual character in the series, with apparent enough clout to get his incompetent son still working for the WG. Huh, one of the rare forgettable One Piece characters and I still remember goddamn Pagaya.
Wasn't it implied that they'd met before and Orochi had asked for Battle ships or something before? (Well Doflamingo could have acted as a mediator in that scenario)
HOW COME LUFFY NEVER KILLS AN ENEMY?
ODA:ITS BECAUSE IN THAT ERA EVERYONE USES THEIR LIVES TO FIGHT FOR THEIR DREAMS. FOR AN ENEMY WHEN THEIR DREAM HAS BEEN SHATTERED,IT IS AS PAINFUL AS DEATH,I BELIEVE FOR A PIRATE NOT TO KILL AN ENEMY , IT'S GIVING THEM A SECOND CHANCE TO FIGHT FOR THEIR DREAMS.
Because you don't seem to know what that word means lol, it's perfectly fine if you didn't care for the chapter.
Words evolve over time. There are two definitions of filler.
1. Content that is anime only, not in the source material.
2. When the source material does something that contributes little to nothing to the overall storyline (essentially superfluous). (like the foxy arc, or this chapter)
A meeting between Orochi and CP0 contributes little to nothing to the overall storyline?
X Drake going to do a hit job on Sanji contributes little to nothing to the overall storyline?
Franky getting a lead about the Onigashima blueprints contributes little to nothing to the overall storyline?
Nothing is going to come out of Zoro's wandering around?
If we had to spend time watching Zoro gamble like Yasu was talking about, or we had to see Drake and Page One being directly contacted to find the soba stand owner, or Franky's blueprint search had no comedic value, then I would say it was a waste of time. But as it is now I wouldn't say that at all.
I completely forgot that Spandam's dad was an actual character in the series, with apparent enough clout to get his incompetent son still working for the WG. Huh, one of the rare forgettable One Piece characters and I still remember goddamn Pagaya.
Wasn't it implied that they'd met before and Orochi had asked for Battle ships or something before? (Well Doflamingo could have acted as a mediator in that scenario)
MS has Orochi say that battleships were fine last time and he wants Vegapunk this time, but JB and VIZ instead have him say that he wants battleships this time but he must have Vegapunk next time I knew the Bellisario stuff would still be useful!
As I understand, it, the Battleships were just for meeting him for the first time, or at best for a regular deal (whatever the deal looks like, probs seastone gear or something)
Words evolve over time. There are two definitions of filler.
1. Content that is anime only, not in the source material.
2. When the source material does something that contributes little to nothing to the overall storyline (essentially superfluous). (like the foxy arc, or this chapter)
I agree that words can evolve, as clearly the word "filler" for a lot of people now means "thing I don't like". 
But, once again I repeat, even when using your own definitions, this chapter objectively does not fit either of them, as others have also pointed out. Not much else to say.
However, this does raise the question as to why the CP-0 agents in this chapter seemed passive when dealing with Orochi. If they are the WG top guys, them flexing on Orochi is the equivalent of the WG flexing. So I don't quite understand why they seem to be seemingly demure. It doesn't gel with the WG we know.
Storytelling reasons. CP0s presence is there to build hype for Orochis introduction. Orochi is a new character and the audience hasnt a clue what to expect of this guy, whether he is a threat or a fool. Now the first time we officially see him he's negotiating with CP0 and talking down to them, so we make the connection that he has power and iinfluence (even if he may be full of himself). This has nothing to do with CP0 and how they should act because they are purely there for association. We know from how Orochu talks to CP0 that he doesnt view the world government as a threat whatsoever and he leans on his alliance with Kaido to get his way.
Same with first time we see Whitebeard, he is talking down to Rockstar of the Redhair pirates even though WB looks like he is on life support. You can make assumptions why Shanks didnt go himself or why he didnt send a better messenger but thats besides the point, the point is we see how Whitebeard views rookies and that will tie in to how he may view Luffy once they meet. It sets our expectations. It doesnt have anything to do with Shanks motivations or who Rockstar is, its all about Whitebeard character building.
Words evolve over time. There are two definitions of filler.
1. Content that is anime only, not in the source material.
2. When the source material does something that contributes little to nothing to the overall storyline (essentially superfluous). (like the foxy arc, or this chapter)
Neither the foxy arc, nor this chapter would be filler then …
This discussion makes me wonder something. CP0 works for the celestial dragons, correct ? A common guess is that they want to trade seastone with Wano. But why would celestial dragons need seastone for ?
2. When the source material does something that contributes little to nothing to the overall storyline (essentially superfluous). (like the foxy arc, or this chapter)
We learned that the WG is negotiating directly with Orochi through CP-0 for weapons and he is demanding to have Vegapunk for the next deal. Did you miss that?
We learned that X.Drake is one of the 6 strongest headliners. Did you miss that?
Aokiji was introduced on Foxy arc. Did you miss that?
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
This discussion makes me wonder something. CP0 works for the celestial dragons, correct ? A common guess is that they want to trade seastone with Wano. But why would celestial dragons need seastone for ?
Seastones? I mean, I guess Orochi can throw a few seastones in there, but wasn't the main thing they want weapons to fight pirates?
Since gorosei are CDs and control WG, they send CP0 to negotiate in marines name too, doubt they would send marines for the seastone they need and CP0 only to negotiate for the seastone CDs need. Marines are not that independent from WG.
But Luffy and co are mining this Liquor iron ore, don't they? I'm sure there is also seastone in those mines, but the majority of Kaidou's weapons are made from Liquor iron ore iirc.
But Luffy and co are mining this Liquor iron ore, don't they?
They never told us what they are mining.
@uniaka:
Since gorosei are CDs and control WG, they send CP0 to negotiate in marines name too, doubt they would send marines for the seastone they need and CP0 only to negotiate for the seastone CDs need. Marines are not that independent from WG.
Again, CP-0 are an intelligence/spy organization, they are there under the radar. You can't send Marines - they are the military arm of the W.G they do not get involved in matters like negotiating with criminals and leaders of nations for things.
Why are you making stuff up? They didn't react to it at all.
Not only does this take completely ignore the context of the situation CP0 is in (they're not going to fight the Shogun when they want to make a deal with him, jesus), but now you weirdly assume that they're all non-combatants, despite us knowing since Dressrosa that they are flatout stated to be stronger than CP9. Also Rob Lucci, Kaku, and Stussy's feats make this clearly contradict this assumption.
Why are you ignoring the fact that I stated that Stussy and Lucchi are clearly very capable agents of CP0? I'm just saying the masked dudes who have yet to be identified haven't yet shown they're anything other than figureheads on the level of Spandam. Even if they are, they're not remotely strategic about how they utilize said skills or even go about negotiating if they're merely diplomats. An overreaction to the demand for Vegapunk is not a sign of strategic professionalism, even if what Orochi was asking for was like a declaration of war. So apart from being incompetent at the non-combat-related aspect of their job, they also didn't take the opportunity to flee if they were sensing any danger which they probably can't either. If you're negotiating with someone like Orochi you have to speak his language, and they neither understand that nor have the courage to actually do so when called for. Hopefully more capable agents ARE there and just haven't shown themselves yet. These guys will probably end up like that one undercover Marine guy who was trying to infiltrate the gladiator arena and got knocked out by Bartolomeo, and let the real agents of actual substance clean up their mess.
Why are you ignoring the fact that I stated that Stussy and Lucchi are clearly very capable agents of CP0? I'm just saying the masked dudes who have yet to be identified haven't yet shown they're anything other than figureheads on the level of Spandam. Even if they are, they're not remotely strategic about how they utilize said skills or even go about negotiating if they're merely diplomats. An overreaction to the demand for Vegapunk is not a sign of strategic professionalism, even if what Orochi was asking for was like a declaration of war. So apart from being incompetent at the non-combat-related aspect of their job, they also didn't take the opportunity to flee if they were sensing any danger which they probably can't either. If you're negotiating with someone like Orochi you have to speak his language, and they neither understand that nor have the courage to actually do so when called for. Hopefully more capable agents ARE there and just haven't shown themselves yet. These guys will probably end up like that one undercover Marine guy who was trying to infiltrate the gladiator arena and got knocked out by Bartolomeo, and let the real agents of actual substance clean up their mess.
We are going to have to agree to disagree…
In what sense of the word was saying that it's an unfeasible demand an overreaction?
And it's not like Oro-dude had any means to harm three literal supermen.
Let the blowhard blow off some steam, it's not like a bullet even harms 'em.
We are going to have to agree to disagree…
Fair enough.
In what sense of the word was saying that it's an unfeasible demand an overreaction?
It looked like their masks changed facial expressions, they lost their cool so bad with their shock. Losing one's composure like that doesn't make them seem like the cream of the crop as far as negotiators. When you're dealing with someone like that, you don't show weakness. They showed weakness. That's bad.
And it's not like Oro-dude had any means to harm three literal supermen.
Well now, even the people I was arguing with won't agree with that. He clearly has a side to him we haven't seen so whatever kind of Zoan monster he turns into, we have no idea what level of power it affords him, not to mention his armies and enforcers and Kaido's thugs. I'm not convinced those three are supermen but if they felt threatened I'd expect them to flee, and if they were strong enough to make a show of their power, they'd have seen the bullet coming and caught it with their bare hands or blocked it with Haki. They did neither so I don't know what to make of it other than that they're just not that bright, either.
Let the blowhard blow off some steam, it's not like a bullet even harms 'em.
Oh, him shooting them like that was one of the highlights of the chapter, he's like Doflamingo if he never lost his status as a Celestial Dragon and grew up without having to go out pirating. He's probably a little too big for his britches, though, unless he's asking for Vegapunk on behalf of Kaido. If Kaido wasn't a bonehead he'd make sure nobody working under him was attempting to amass enough power for a potential coup against him or at least make sure he had someone keeping an eye on anyone in a position to do so. If trying to get Vegapunk really was a power grab on Orochi's part, it would be interesting to see the entire arc culminate into a Straw Hat alliance/Kaido loyalists/Orochi's Wano three-way battle.
But I'm still rooting for Uber Nightmare Luffy to stand against Kaido in the end. We've got half a dozen of the Supernovas present (Luffy, Zoro, Kidd, Hawkins, Law and X Drake) and I'm betting Killer won't be far behind, nor Apoo. If that number holds, it'll probably be a 'lucky seven' that gets their shadows added to Luffy if Moria makes an appearance looking for some payback and is still more pissed off at Kaido than at Luffy.
Well now, even the people I was arguing with won't agree with that. He clearly has a side to him we haven't seen so whatever kind of Zoan monster he turns into, we have no idea what level of power it affords him, not to mention his armies and enforcers and Kaido's thugs. I'm not convinced those three are supermen but if they felt threatened I'd expect them to flee, and if they were strong enough to make a show of their power, they'd have seen the bullet coming and caught it with their bare hands or blocked it with Haki. They did neither so I don't know what to make of it other than that they're just not that bright, either.
Ever notice how Luffy often just lets normal people take a poke at him because it literally doesn't even register to him as an act meant to harm him? This is that. To even move a muscle against a fricking flintlock pistol that just bounces of your skin is a supreme waste of effort. You want them to bounce around and flail about for something that we just saw doesn't even register to them as an attack. He literally sits there without moving a muscle in total indifference. It's like tossing a pebble at a tank. You were expecting the tank to reverse and try to avoid the pebble?
Ever notice how Luffy often just lets normal people take a poke at him because it literally doesn't even register to him as an act meant to harm him? This is that. To even move a muscle against a fricking flintlock pistol that just bounces of your skin is a supreme waste of effort. You want them to bounce around and flail about for something that we just saw doesn't even register to them as an attack. He literally sits there without moving a muscle in total indifference. It's like tossing a pebble at a tank. You were expecting the tank to reverse and try to avoid the pebble?
We KNOW Luffy's a moron. I expect better from agents of their rank and position. Making a statement with one's show of power overtly is more effective than being passive. Like I said, they need to speak his language, and someone who overtly shows off his flagrant attitude needs to be communicated with in similar fashion. How these guys with such poor ability to read others like that and yet have been commissioned as diplomats is beyond stupid. Nixon understood this about the Chinese when he was over there farting during meals as a sign that he was enjoying the food. These CP0 dorks have their cheeks clenched shut.
It's one thing if they just stopped reacting after already having lost their cool but they already blew it by doing that. The goal of negotiating is to hold the power and they blew it with that display. But Orochi might have known he could do that by asking for Vegapunk and did it on purpose to elicit that reaction from them. He might have better observation haki than all three of them if that's the case. In any case, he's holding all the cards now and rightly punished them for letting him get one over on them. He might be a bigger threat for the majority of this arc than Kaido. Actually now that I think about it, he's more like a Wapol who actually has enough smarts and power to be a legitimate threat.
I don't really see what conclusions can be made about CP-0 from this chapter. I highly doubt the top lackeys of the most protected class in the entire world aren't competent enough to handle themselves when necessary. But they're not going to flex on a guy they need resources from when said guy has no reason to be scared of them. Orochi damn well knows he's not the one in over his head here.
I agree that words can evolve, as clearly the word "filler" for a lot of people now means "thing I don't like".
But, once again I repeat, even when using your own definitions, this chapter objectively does not fit either of them, as others have also pointed out. Not much else to say.
Okay, except I wasnt merely saying I disliked it. Everything in this chapter was minor things that added very little. Too vague to be contributions to the overall plot
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
We learned that the WG is negotiating directly with Orochi through CP-0 for weapons and he is demanding to have Vegapunk for the next deal. Did you miss that?
We learned that X.Drake is one of the 6 strongest headliners. Did you miss that?
Aokiji was introduced on Foxy arc. Did you miss that?
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Seastones? I mean, I guess Orochi can throw a few seastones in there, but wasn't the main thing they want weapons to fight pirates?
It was in between arcs, Aoikiji had nothing to do with the Foxy arc itself. You can skip everything in the arc itself and go straight to Aoikiji and miss nothing.
X Drake being one of the strongest is something I DID miss, it seemed to only vaguely say he was one…not that he was one of the strongest. I guess I missed that.
As for CP0 making deals with wano? I guess thats big, yeah. I forgot that part, but didnt miss it. I rembered CP0 was in this chapter though. Still very vague on what they even are
As for CP0 making deals with wano? I guess thats big, yeah. I forgot that part, but didnt miss it. I rembered CP0 was in this chapter though. Still very vague on what they even are
The strongest intelligence division that only answers from the Gorousei?
The strongest intelligence division that only answers from the Gorousei?
Wasnt CP9 supposed to already be that though?
Wasnt CP9 supposed to already be that though?
https://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/705/12
"Who said the Cipher Pol went from 1 to 9?!"
https://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/705/12
"Who said the Cipher Pol went from 1 to 9?!"
Wheres the quote you said from? Also, irrelvant. CP9 were the Top. CP0 is an asspull.
Wheres the quote you said from?
It's a Bleach Reference.
Also, irrelvant. CP9 were the Top. CP0 is an asspull.
Why?
