The Great New World Discussion Thread
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..you're right..
Cause he's too busy cutting admirals in half or setting about all of a fellow supernova's subordinates.
God I love Apoo, I was so pleased with his massive bounty increase.
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Apoo is one of the most well-off Supernovas because he has something to fall back on. If being a pirate doesn't work out, he can always become a DJ in clubs.
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But he's the captain of the "On Air" Pirates for a reason! He could be a DJ for sure, but more likely for a radio station. New World Den Den Mushi Radio (DM Radio for short)?
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It would be so cool if there was a Den Den Mushi radio station.
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You people crack me up
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My personal hope is that Kaido's downfall will involve all of the Supernovas, and maybe some of their other allies too, in a war to rival the Marineford war. It'd be a great way to both prove just how much of a beast Kaido is while simultaneously proving why the worst generation was tipped to take the world by storm. Since it's Oda, I can't see a reason why such a conflict wouldn't contain room for Supernovas falling out and fighting with each other in the process.
and how long is it going to take Luffy to be strong enough to take a Yonko down by himself then, 5-6 more years?
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and how long is it going to take Luffy to be strong enough to take a Yonko down by himself then, 5-6 more years?
I don't know? Pretty sure taking out Kaido is going to require an army given that he has one himself though. Luffy might already be strong enough to take on a Yonko by himself if it's just one-on-one, but what's the point in bigging up Kaido's SMILE army if Luffy's just going to bypass it to take on Kaido himself? Luffy's crew is small, so he'll probably need help getting at Kaido. I imagine it'll be different for the other four Yonko. Heck, Shanks might just be a straight-up duel. Big Mum looks like she operates differently too, and Blackbeard has split his main crew up like Whitebeard did.
Each Yonko is going to require a different strategy and set of circumstances. It was never going to be as simple as Luffy just being strong enough to fight them personally.
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I don't know? Pretty sure taking out Kaido is going to require an army given that he has one himself though. Luffy might already be strong enough to take on a Yonko by himself if it's just one-on-one, but what's the point in bigging up Kaido's SMILE army if Luffy's just going to bypass it to take on Kaido himself? Luffy's crew is small, so he'll probably need help getting at Kaido. I imagine it'll be different for the other four Yonko. Heck, Shanks might just be a straight-up duel. Big Mum looks like she operates differently too, and Blackbeard has split his main crew up like Whitebeard did.
Each Yonko is going to require a different strategy and set of circumstances. It was never going to be as simple as Luffy just being strong enough to fight them personally.
Isn't that the entire point of having the alliance with Law and him having a plan that they still haven't fully revealed to take Kaido out? There could be other factors such as Moria or/and Kuzan being involved in the arc. You could have the entire Wano country on top of some of the allies Luffy will make during the Dressrosa arc (or they will be used for the final war only). While plans are bound to fail, Law made one specifically that gives them a 30% chance, you add the other Supernovas and you lose that tension.
No one said it was going to be easy but I don't see a scenario where Luffy needs all the top Supernovas and is somehow strong enough to take down Kaido by himself as well. Just because there's 500 devil fruit users, it doesn't mean they are all top tiers. If Luffy does take down all the Yonko, you know there's going to be 1 or 2 arcs revolving the time before they take them out on their own arc. Also the jump between needing all the top Supernovas to show what a monster Kaido is to ..
Luffy and his crew taking out the next Yonko has no equilibrium of power between the 4.
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Isn't that the entire point of having the alliance with Law and him having a plan that they still haven't fully revealed to take Kaido out? There could be other factors such as Moria or/and Kuzan being involved in the arc. You could have the entire Wano country on top of some of the allies Luffy will make during the Dressrosa arc (or they will be used for the final war only). While plans are bound to fail, Law made one specifically that gives them a 30% chance, you add the other Supernovas and you lose that tension.
No one said it was going to be easy but I don't see a scenario where Luffy needs all the top Supernovas and is somehow strong enough to take down Kaido by himself as well. Just because there's 500 devil fruit users, it doesn't mean they are all top tiers. If Luffy does take down all the Yonko, you know there's going to be 1 or 2 arcs revolving the time before they take them out on their own arc. Also the jump between needing all the top Supernovas to show what a monster Kaido is to ..
Luffy and his crew taking out the next Yonko has no equilibrium of power between the 4.
Yeah, but Law's plan isn't exactly going swimmingly, and it's been hinted at that he was just using Kaido as an excuse to get at Doflamingo anyway. It makes me wonder if his 30% estimate wasn't just something he made up to get Luffy to play along. I mean, how do you reach a figure like 30%? What kind of maths goes into that? Besides which, Kaido seems to me to be the most militant of the Yonko, so a big ol' war suits him. The Supernovas are still all very much small fish in the big New World pond. I think it'll take all of them to bring Kaido down like it took most of the Marines' strength to butt heads with all of Whitebeard's strength.
I'm not saying this is at all likely, I'm just saying it's what I hope happens. After Whitebeard, I'd be disappointed if the Luffy/Law alliance was enough to deal with Kaido on their own.
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Yeah, but Law's plan isn't exactly going swimmingly, and it's been hinted at that he was just using Kaido as an excuse to get at Doflamingo anyway. It makes me wonder if his 30% estimate wasn't just something he made up to get Luffy to play along. I mean, how do you reach a figure like 30%? What kind of maths goes into that? Besides which, Kaido seems to me to be the most militant of the Yonko, so a big ol' war suits him. The Supernovas are still all very much small fish in the big New World pond. I think it'll take all of them to bring Kaido down like it took most of the Marines' strength to butt heads with all of Whitebeard's strength.
I'm not saying this is at all likely, I'm just saying it's what I hope happens. After Whitebeard, I'd be disappointed if the Luffy/Law alliance was enough to deal with Kaido on their own.
I don't see that way at all. The guy is simply taking care of business. He wants to get revenge (Doflamingo) on top of taking out a Yonko (Kaido). When he gave the speech about turning the New World upside down and changing the new era, no one actually believes that he was talking about Doflamingo over the Yonkos. He's not that important. Who knows in regards to %, we need to see the full plan but there is some clear connection of the plan between the two players, which is why I don't believe Law's goal all this time is only Doflamingo. I also never really understood Sanji's point when he said he's focusing too much on Flamingo. Didn't it make sense that he brings Flamingo out of the island and let the SH destroy the factory, but obviously no one expected an Admiral to show up on top of Flamingo being a CD (or something along those lines).
Luffy is likely going to take down the next Yonko by himself, so why would it be a disappointment if Law and him take down one together first? You are going from one extreme to the next likely situation.
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I don't see that way at all. The guy is simply taking care of business. He wants to get revenge (Doflamingo) on top of taking out a Yonko (Kaido). When he gave the speech about turning the New World upside down and changing the new era, no one actually believes that he was talking about Doflamingo over the Yonkos. He's not that important. Who knows in regards to %, we need to see the full plan but there is some clear connection of the plan between the two players, which is why I don't believe Law's goal all this time is only Doflamingo. I also never really understood Sanji's point when he said he's focusing too much on Flamingo. Didn't it make sense that he brings Flamingo out of the island and let the SH destroy the factory, but obviously no one expected an Admiral to show up on top of Flamingo being a CD (or something along those lines).
Luffy is likely going to take down the next Yonko by himself, so why would it be a disappointment if Law and him take down one together first? You are going from one extreme to the next likely situation.
I don't believe that any of the Yonko ('cept maybe Shanks) are going down without significant contributions from people outside Luffy's crew. I think they're too big.
And Doflamingo is that important to Law, obviously. We don't know why yet, but it's clear that Doffy was a big part of Law's childhood and played a role in Law becoming a pirate in the first place. I don't think you can just dismiss that out of hand.
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I don't believe that any of the Yonko ('cept maybe Shanks) are going down without significant contributions from people outside Luffy's crew. I think they're too big.
And Doflamingo is that important to Law, obviously. We don't know why yet, but it's clear that Doffy was a big part of Law's childhood and played a role in Law becoming a pirate in the first place. I don't think you can just dismiss that out of hand.
I think he plays a massive role in Law's life. From what I've gathered and this is obviously the moment where I and many others speculate based on small fragments that we've seen, so the chance of me talking out of my ass is certainly quite a high possibility.. Doflamingo took Law under his wing when he was a kid, he clearly saw so much potential that he kept the heart seat saved for him. There was another person, likely a D, who also was a teacher to Law and likely told him quite a bit about the line of D, who Law respected more who probably worked for Doflamingo. He/She got killed by Doflamingo and Law left the crew to go on his own when he was 14 years old.
Law clearly wants revenge, but that doesn't mean he doesn't want to take down Kaido as well. His speech wasn't really directed specifically at Flamingo however, despite the importance in Law's life. What he was saying was changing New World and it wasn't just Zoro, Luffy and himself that he was mentioned. I doubt Kid and Co. are targeting Doflamingo for example, which is why I don't see that speech being made only for him. Could Law have been talking about the Yonko and Doflamingo? Possibly.
Fair enough in regards to the Yonko theory. I don't think it will come down to a group other than the first one, but to each his own.
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My personal hope is that Kaido's downfall will involve all of the Supernovas
You don't mean all of them against Kaido, do you?
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I don't see that way at all. The guy is simply taking care of business. He wants to get revenge (Doflamingo) on top of taking out a Yonko (Kaido). When he gave the speech about turning the New World upside down and changing the new era, no one actually believes that he was talking about Doflamingo over the Yonkos. He's not that important. Who knows in regards to %, we need to see the full plan but there is some clear connection of the plan between the two players, which is why I don't believe Law's goal all this time is only Doflamingo. I also never really understood Sanji's point when he said he's focusing too much on Flamingo. Didn't it make sense that he brings Flamingo out of the island and let the SH destroy the factory, but obviously no one expected an Admiral to show up on top of Flamingo being a CD (or something along those lines).
Luffy is likely going to take down the next Yonko by himself, so why would it be a disappointment if Law and him take down one together first? You are going from one extreme to the next likely situation.
Doflamingo is that important. Law even reconfirm it by saying once Doflamingo die the New World will be in chaos.
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Doflamingo is that important. Law even reconfirm it by saying once Doflamingo die the New World will be in chaos.
That doesn't confirm that the new age is all about killing Doflamingo, that sounds ridiculous. He has his cards in plenty of places which will cause trouble, which Law wants to happen for his plan to work.
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That doesn't confirm that the new age is all about killing Doflamingo, that sounds ridiculous. He has his cards in plenty of places which will cause trouble, which Law wants to happen for his plan to work.
Law was simply telling to Doflamingo that it is a bad idea for the current big names to understimate them because even the marine knows the threat they represents. It could simply be a grand speech to make Doflamingo realize how stupid it was to underestimate him and his peers.
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Law was simply telling to Doflamingo that it is a bad idea for the current big names to understimate them because even the marine knows the threat they represents. It could simply be a grand speech to make Doflamingo realize how stupid it was to underestimate him and his peers.
Yes, that's why Kid, Apoo and Hawkins have made an alliance to take down a Yonko while Law has done the same with Luffy. Doflamingo is a stepping stone to a bigger goal, but that doesn't mean that he doesn't have massive connections to the world, and obviously to Law. The way Oda has connected them together is beautiful, but this exaggeration of Doflamingo by some posters is cringeworthy.
Law already made it a point to do exactly what you said, when he says keep laughing as you always do because you are overconfident and it bit you in the ass, mocking Doflamingo a few pages back in chapter 690. It seems redundant to say the exact same thing at the end of the chapter, implying something bigger but instead repeating what he's already stated just before he cuts Vergo in two as you suggest.
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You don't mean all of them against Kaido, do you?
Yeah, I do. Do you not think a conflict on that scale would be cool? When you look at what it took to bring down Whitebeard you feel like Luffy and Law would have to really step up their game to do it by themselves, especially after what Doflamingo did to Law.
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Yeah, I do. Do you not think a conflict on that scale would be cool? When you look at what it took to bring down Whitebeard you feel like Luffy and Law would have to really step up their game to do it by themselves, especially after what Doflamingo did to Law.
It will be cool to see something like that but it will also rise a lot of question, If all of them fight Kaido at the same time it will mean that they're nowhere near a Yonkou's strength and it will take them forever to reach that level but I can see two or three of them going 3 vs 1 against Kaido while the others go against their commanders.
Law was pretty much done when he started that fight against Doflamingo since he's the 'stamina boy', so I don't count that fight as a fear one on one.
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Yes, that's why Kid, Apoo and Hawkins have made an alliance to take down a Yonko while Law has done the same with Luffy. Doflamingo is a stepping stone to a bigger goal, but that doesn't mean that he doesn't have massive connections to the world, and obviously to Law. The way Oda has connected them together is beautiful, but this exaggeration of Doflamingo by some posters is cringeworthy.
Know your feeling. Doflamingo is just the opening or the Earthquake that will start the wave that the Strawhats will surf, it all depends of his downfall.
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It will be cool to see something like that but it will also rise a lot of question, If all of them fight Kaido at the same time it will mean that they're nowhere near a Yonkou's strength and it will take them forever to reach that level but I can see two or three of them going 3 vs 1 against Kaido while the others go against their commanders.
Law was pretty much done when he started that fight against Doflamingo since he's the 'stamina boy', so I don't count that fight as a fear one on one.
Ohhhh, I think I misunderstood you. I didn't actually mean all of them against Kaido in a single fight, just generally as you suggest. The Supernovas vs. the Kaido Pirates. Please excuse my poor reading comprehension.
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Ohhhh, I think I misunderstood you. I didn't actually mean all of them against Kaido in a single fight, just generally as you suggest. The Supernovas vs. the Kaido Pirates. Please excuse my poor reading comprehension.
Ahh don't worry, I asked you because that was what I understood by your post in the first place.
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Know your feeling. Doflamingo is just the opening or the Earthquake that will start the wave that the Strawhats will surf, it all depends of his downfall.
wow thats a really cool line man i liked it
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It was a spectacular line. I nominate Shadowgreed for Nobel Peace Prize.
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@Medical:
It was a spectacular line. I nominate Shadowgreed for Nobel Peace Prize.
are being sarcastic?? if so, then i was reallly high when i posted that :ninja: .
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Nope, I was agreeing with you
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oh! right ? isnt that like a really cool line riding on the waves created by the earthquake wow! xD
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That could be a colour spread by Oda., all the SHs surfing all at once in the same waves.
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While Luffy drowns.
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@Devil:
While Luffy drowns.
Nah. Given those skills.
!
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Know your feeling. Doflamingo is just the opening or the Earthquake that will start the wave that the Strawhats will surf, it all depends of his downfall.
Well the bare minimum that the strawhats need is for Doflamingos title to be removed and nothing else needs to be done regarding him bsides factory destruction
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This post is deleted!
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I don't know? Pretty sure taking out Kaido is going to require an army given that he has one himself though. Luffy might already be strong enough to take on a Yonko by himself if it's just one-on-one, but what's the point in bigging up Kaido's SMILE army if Luffy's just going to bypass it to take on Kaido himself? Luffy's crew is small, so he'll probably need help getting at Kaido. I imagine it'll be different for the other four Yonko. Heck, Shanks might just be a straight-up duel. Big Mum looks like she operates differently too, and Blackbeard has split his main crew up like Whitebeard did.
Each Yonko is going to require a different strategy and set of circumstances. It was never going to be as simple as Luffy just being strong enough to fight them personally.
You understand that every Yonkou has a gigantic crew? You can't garner enough power to have an uneasy truce with the Wprld Government with a few crewmembers. I can assure you that taking out any of the four yonkou is/will be very difficult for Luffy or anybody for that matter. Furthermore, Luffy will never duel Ace, and he wouldn't fight without his large crew, which is large.
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@Devil:
While Luffy drowns.
If Luffy is ever about to die he'll be saved by either Sanji, Shanks, or Shusui
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This post is deleted!
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If Luffy is ever about to die he'll be saved by either Sanji, Shanks, or Shusui
What about Usopp?
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If Luffy is ever about to die he'll be saved by either Sanji, Shanks, or Shusui
Zoro's sword will spring to life and save Luffy?
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Great and here I was thinking the wave will be Kiado, Blackbeard, Akainu, Big mom, Kidd etc while Luffy will literally be surfing on 'me.
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You understand that every Yonkou has a gigantic crew? You can't garner enough power to have an uneasy truce with the Wprld Government with a few crewmembers. I can assure you that taking out any of the four yonkou is/will be very difficult for Luffy or anybody for that matter. Furthermore, Luffy will never duel Ace, and he wouldn't fight without his large crew, which is large.
This is not necessarily true. Shanks for example looks to have quite a small core crew on a single boat. I always imagined him just having lots and lots of allies and friends around the New World. I don't think we can say for certain that they all have massive crews like Whitebeard did. We know Kaido has an army, and there's hints Blackbeard has shaped his crew after Whitebeard's, but I don't think it's reasonable to make assumptions about the other two from that. The thing about the New World territories is that they work on name rather than actual present strength. You don't refrain from attacking Fishman Island because Big Mum has an actual military presence on the island - she doesn't - you avoid it because you know you'll have to pay the piper eventually and your stay in the New World becomes infinitely more uncomfortable for having drawn that attention to you.
And even if I'm wrong and Shanks has a large large crew, he still might fight Luffy one-on-one anyway because of their relationship.
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This is not necessarily true. Shanks for example looks to have quite a small core crew on a single boat. I always imagined him just having lots and lots of allies and friends around the New World. I don't think we can say for certain that they all have massive crews like Whitebeard did. We know Kaido has an army, and there's hints Blackbeard has shaped his crew after Whitebeard's, but I don't think it's reasonable to make assumptions about the other two from that. The thing about the New World territories is that they work on name rather than actual present strength. You don't refrain from attacking Fishman Island because Big Mum has an actual military presence on the island - she doesn't - you avoid it because you know you'll have to pay the piper eventually and your stay in the New World becomes infinitely more uncomfortable for having drawn that attention to you.
And even if I'm wrong and Shanks has a large large crew, he still might fight Luffy one-on-one anyway because of their relationship.
The fact that Big Mom has a full crew at DR without her even being there should hint at the huge size of her crew. Shanks crew is not WB size, but I doubt it's less than 100 members, over ten times the size of Luffy's. I can't commit to the thought of Yonkou having small crews, because if they did, the WG should have no problem in taking them out quite easily… and they can't do that. If Garp can fight evenly with Gol and WB, then throw in an Sakazuki, Borsallino, 10 VAs, and 1000 Marines, shouldn't be a probllem to eliminate a small crew. Understand what I am saying? Just my opinion on the matter I can understand if you don't agree
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Zoro's sword will spring to life and save Luffy?
Well yeah it ate a DF
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Also I can't ever imagine Shanks and Luffy fighting each other just because of their relationship, unless they have some cliche battle at the end of the series, granted Shanks hasn't been killed by BB by then, something I think is strongly foreshadowed.
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The fact that Big Mom has a full crew at DR without her even being there should hint at the huge size of her crew. Shanks crew is not WB size, but I doubt it's less than 100 members, over ten times the size of Luffy's. I can't commit to the thought of Yonkou having small crews, because if they did, the WG should have no problem in taking them out quite easily… and they can't do that. If Garp can fight evenly with Gol and WB, then throw in an Sakazuki, Borsallino, 10 VAs, and 1000 Marines, shouldn't be a probllem to eliminate a small crew. Understand what I am saying? Just my opinion on the matter I can understand if you don't agree
Also I can't ever imagine Shanks and Luffy fighting each other just because of their relationship, unless they have some cliche battle at the end of the series, granted Shanks hasn't been killed by BB by then, something I think is strongly foreshadowed.
This is just speculation on my part, but I think the singing ship is Big Mum's (excuse the pun) mothership. Just because she isn't on it right now doesn't necessarily mean she has others. We know she's currently on an island.
The New World is a pretty complicated balance, so it's not just as simple as the WG going in there in force to get a single pirate crew. By doing that they open themselves up to a variety of risks, including another Yonko stealing in and trashing Mariejois while they're gone or two of them teaming up to bring down the force they send out. Also, just because the Yonko are capable of butting heads with the marines with the outcome uncertain doesn't mean they have to. A small crew could just run away from or avoid a conflict that doesn't benefit them at all.
Also, as I mentioned, a small crew doesn't preclude them having many allies. Most of Whitebeard's army was made up of such.
As for the last, Luffy himself said he intends to take on all of the Yonko, including Shanks. It's based on that that this conversation got started in the first place. I'm not saying a duel is going to happen, or even that it's likely, I'm just saying it's possible and using that to illustrate why each Yonko's defeat will involve different measures and different circumstances.
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This is just speculation on my part, but I think the singing ship is Big Mum's (excuse the pun) mothership. Just because she isn't on it right now doesn't necessarily mean she has others. We know she's currently on an island.
The New World is a pretty complicated balance, so it's not just as simple as the WG going in there in force to get a single pirate crew. By doing that they open themselves up to a variety of risks, including another Yonko stealing in and trashing Mariejois while they're gone or two of them teaming up to bring down the force they send out. Also, just because the Yonko are capable of butting heads with the marines with the outcome uncertain doesn't mean they have to. A small crew could just run away from or avoid a conflict that doesn't benefit them at all.
Also, as I mentioned, a small crew doesn't preclude them having many allies. Most of Whitebeard's army was made up of such.
As for the last, Luffy himself said he intends to take on all of the Yonko, including Shanks. It's based on that that this conversation got started in the first place. I'm not saying a duel is going to happen, or even that it's likely, I'm just saying it's possible and using that to illustrate why each Yonko's defeat will involve different measures and different circumstances.
Not hating your take on it, your opinion, but the last bit about Luffy taking on all of the Yonkou, I took that as him not knowing that Shanks was a Yonkou…
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Not hating your take on it, your opinion, but the last bit about Luffy taking on all of the Yonkou, I took that as him not knowing that Shanks was a Yonkou…
http://mangasee.com/manga/?series=OnePiece&chapter=432&index=1&page=7
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http://mangasee.com/manga/?series=OnePiece&chapter=432&index=1&page=7
I understand that Luffy knows he is a Yonkou, I just don't think he realizes the magnitude of what he said, if that makes sense,
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I just found this on youtube, I think it is really good.
The other video on his channel are awesome too
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It's just a manga panel presentation and it already gives a more accurate feeling of the scene then the anime will in half a year.
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I just found this on youtube, I think it is really good.
The other video on his channel are awesome too
These are actually really cool, especially when you string them together. I really liked the "Sabo is Alive" video. Although I still can't wait to see Luffy's reaction in the anime.
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Does anybody think that Luffy will ever be considered a Yonkou? Or do you think he will go straight to One Piece without ever being given such a title? Oh cool prediction: BB kills Shanks, Kidd kills Big Mom, and Luffy-Law kill Kaidou. Luffy-Law-Kidd-BB Yonkous-200 chapters away.
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i am really interested in seeing how Oda is going to deal with the Yonkous after they've been defeated.
this is the first time Luffy's about to take down a villain who is a true monster in terms of both strength and influence.
I mean if Luffy defeats Kaidou, he'll still be alive, right? What's he going to do? I feel like he's the type of character who's so powerful that he could easily take back his territory.Same with Akainu and Blackbeard at the end of the series. Even if they get locked up in jail and the world is populated with good guys like Admiral Coby and Zoro and Sanji that could team up and deal with them should they escape, they're still ridiculously powerful. almost feels like the best way to truly make sure these bad guys don't come back with a vengeance is to kill them off or incapacitate them. Oda's said the reason he hasn't had Luffy kill off a villain so far is because he feels having their dreams crushed is a much more fitting punishment; yet I feel like egotistical powerhouses like Kaidou and Big Mom are far more inclined to not take no for an answer and come back to fuck Luffy's shit up
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; yet I feel like egotistical powerhouses like Kaidou and Big Mom are far more inclined to not take no for an answer and come back to fuck Luffy's shit up
isn't that called murder, rather than "justice"?
luffy is gonna kick every yonkou's ass, maybe not shanks, but he's planning on targetting all the yonkou as we've seen at punk hazard.
after the 2 years training, i can see luffy, zoro and sanji capable of "surviving" against new world's big heads, such as yonkou, shichibukai (as DD right now), admirals? and powerful bounty hunters, if ther is any:ninja:.