Chapter 626: "The Three Neptune Brothers" Discussion
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I wonder how many times Nami the Mermaid has appeared already. That's a really sneaky spoof.
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Only one person in this thread had the same suspicions as I after reading the chapter, and he/she got ignored. I believe the Minister of the Left/catfish fishman may be the culprit, or at least involved somehow. On page 9 he looked a little too devious as if he was up to something and was no where to be found when Otohime was shot, only appearing later to question the two princes' (that were consoling Shirahoshi) actions. Please note that the Minister of the Right was seen by her side during the tragedy. Where was the catfish minister? Just my 2 cents.
I'm so surprised that only one other person noted of his possible involvement in this tragedy. After reading the chapter, I thought this tread would be riddled with suspicion, and maybe even hatred, for the Minister of the Left just because of that sinister look on his face.
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Nami the Mermaid for next nakama, foreshadowed since East Blue.
Here the full explanation why she will be next nakama:
! She is awesome
! Also the ghost of Otohime for next nakama
! Van Der Decken is so coolGoda wins
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I'm so surprised that only one other person noted of his possible involvement in this tragedy. After reading the chapter, I thought this tread would be riddled with suspicion, and maybe even hatred, for the Minister of the Left just because of that sinister look on his face.
He was normally smiling and that person didn't get ignorated since another one posted an image of this very minister crying of the death of the queen with the other minister. They are good people, everyone used to say they'd be conspirators for the way they talked with Neptune in the beggining of FI but from the flashback we can see it's non sense.
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Only one person in this thread had the same suspicions as I after reading the chapter, and he/she got ignored. I believe the Minister of the Left/catfish fishman may be the culprit, or at least involved somehow. On page 9 he looked a little too devious as if he was up to something and was no where to be found when Otohime was shot, only appearing later to question the two princes' (that were consoling Shirahoshi) actions. Please note that the Minister of the Right was seen by her side during the tragedy. Where was the catfish minister? Just my 2 cents.
I'm so surprised that only one other person noted of his possible involvement in this tragedy. After reading the chapter, I thought this tread would be riddled with suspicion, and maybe even hatred, for the Minister of the Left just because of that sinister look on his face.
He was normally smiling and that person didn't get ignorated since another one posted an image of this very minister crying of the death of the queen with the other minister. They are good people, everyone used to say they'd be conspirators for the way they talked with Neptune in the beggining of FI but from the flashback we can see it's non sense.
Yes, and here it is again:
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HEY! I'm having a thought. VDD, while searching the Ryuuguu palace for his desired treasure, will come across and open that which he joked about this chapter, Urashima's casket. He'll then turn into an old man unfit to marry a young princess. It's just so fitting in so many ways. It's happening.
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This is an arc with a lot of mystery in it's main enemy, it seems. This very flashback, it's not made completely sure who shot Otohime, and on top of it the people that could accomplish that need to meet certain requirements or just got lucky. I just love how after all the time I've spent reading this series I'm still left guessing.
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Only one person in this thread had the same suspicions as I after reading the chapter, and he/she got ignored. I believe the Minister of the Left/catfish fishman may be the culprit, or at least involved somehow. On page 9 he looked a little too devious as if he was up to something and was no where to be found when Otohime was shot, only appearing later to question the two princes' (that were consoling Shirahoshi) actions. Please note that the Minister of the Right was seen by her side during the tragedy. Where was the catfish minister? Just my 2 cents.
I'm so surprised that only one other person noted of his possible involvement in this tragedy. After reading the chapter, I thought this tread would be riddled with suspicion, and maybe even hatred, for the Minister of the Left just because of that sinister look on his face.
I thought he looked happy in the panel. Like he was content to see Otohime's efforts finally pay off.
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whoever really hated the idea of fishmen going out into the world killed the queen not vdd
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I haven't seen anyone notice VDD's rifle on the bottom of page 17. I suspect VDD to be the real assassin after all. Or it's a red herring…
I'm probably late posting this, haha.
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Yes, you're late. And he always carried that rifle in the flashback, not just this chapter. I think it's clear it wasn't him. That would mean Otohime's dying words have no meaning. Also, he's right there. There's no way he could aim, fire a rifle, and have no one see him when he that close.
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Was it coincidence or intelligent planning that lead to the queen's assassination? I'm leaning towards the latter. The fire caused her to lose focus so that she didn't detect the danger with her mantra. If a noble sent an assassin, then such planning should be within their capability. There's still a question of how the fire started and why there was no image of a shooter in the slightest. VDD seems like a red herring at best to me. I'm sort of hoping that Dofla killed some fishmen and used their corpses as puppets. The idea of it being someone from Tiger's crew makes no sense to me. A bitter fishman like Hodi is possible, but I hope not. A lot of signatures seemed to be saved.
I think VDD put in a petition with the others, but then walked away, lit a match, and then tossed it. There may be another shooter hired by the Celestial Douchebags.
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So you are saying a sniper shot her from miles away?
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When are assassinations or assassination attempts coincidence?
I speculated that possibly it was Hodi burning the leger and someone else doing the shooting but even in that scenario I'd assume the shooter either pulled the strings to have the opportunity assuming Otohime uses her CoO like everybody else we've seen who has it use it and not just for the boost in empathy. I'd say her comment of being careless hints toward it despite that being a common phrase.
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This was probably said before,but I think VDD killed the queen and started the fire on the names to start all the panic, so he could have the chance to touch shirahoshi. I don't think he would have been able to even get close to her otherwise he even had a hard time touching her and going on noticed during that.
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Random thought: The new Baratie looks as badass as the Sunny.
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@Zik:
Damn that Aladdin theory just seems to unlikely.
I don't like the look of one of Otohime's advisors.
[qimg]http://i999.mangareader.net/one-piece/626/one-piece-2347699.jpg[/qimg]Look at those sneaky eyes and creepy smile.
You're looking too deep into that. He is looking with a sympathic smile at the crowd, who finally support Otohime with her ideas. They are not sneaky eyes or a creepy smile whatsoever.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
This was probably said before,but I think VDD killed the queen and started the fire on the names to start all the panic, so he could have the chance to touch shirahoshi. I don't think he would have been able to even get close to her otherwise he even had a hard time touching her and going on noticed during that.
I agree, I think it is VDD. Or one of his crewmates. But let's just say he didn't do it, wouldn't even he be too shocked by what's happening before realising this is his chance to touch Shirahoshi? I mean, look at how natural he is walking towards her and just making small talk with her, that was planned no matter how you look at it.
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@Zik:
When are assassinations or assassination attempts coincidence?
I speculated that possibly it was Hodi burning the leger and someone else doing the shooting but even in that scenario I'd assume the shooter either pulled the strings to have the opportunity assuming Otohime uses her CoO like everybody else we've seen who has it use it and not just for the boost in empathy. I'd say her comment of being careless hints toward it despite that being a common phrase.
As has been already mentioned on this page. If one party (VDD) sets a fire as a distraction and another party (WG) manages to assassinate the queen in the panic, that would be a coincidence. It's well within the realm of possibility. I'd just prefer it if it was a planned countermeasure for mantra, along with possibly a desire to destroy her work.
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You're looking too deep into that. He is looking with a sympathic smile at the crowd, who finally support Otohime with her ideas. They are not sneaky eyes or a creepy smile whatsoever.
Probably am since he's crying when she gets shot but he does not look like he's sympathetically smiling to me but maybe that's just how I see Oda drawing that character smiling.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
As has been already mentioned on this page. If one party (VDD) sets a fire as a distraction and another party (WG) manages to assassinate the queen in the panic, that would be a coincidence. It's well within the realm of possibility. I'd just prefer it if it was a planned countermeasure for mantra, along with possibly a desire to destroy her work.
I'm not really arguing the "realm of possibility". Not to state it as fact but it'd be pretty hard for anyone to form a theory from that standpoint. Assassin just happens to be in the right place, right time when Otohime drops her guard.
If there is gonna be an unseen badguy coming to appear I think that'd all work in Oda's favor of showing us this is the main boss in the arc.
I think it's obvious Oda's put in the frame work to show that her death was planned to a degree even if the assassin isn't aware of mantra. Create panic, kill target during panic.
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Did VDD have a chance to touch Otohime before ? Could he have used his ability to kill her ? (if he is the culprit that is)
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Seriously why so many people think that VDD is the assassin… don't you think that Oda purposely let us see VDD with a gun to mislead us. And he just happen to be there along with Jinbe/Aladdin when the Queen was assassinate.
What is there to gain for VDD by killing the Queen? Even if VDD behind it, if by some chance they know the culprit is him, he can kiss the idea of marrying Shirahoshi goodbye.
Also so far VDD didn't show any hate toward the whole idea about living above the sea. Who ever behind the assassination, it mostly be the Celestial Dragon...
The Celestial Dragon properly saw that they can't just kill/capture her when she went to meet them because Jinbe was a Shichibukai back then. So they choose to assassinate her when she back on FI.
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It was Van Auger.
VAN AUGER HATES EQUALITY BETWEEN SPECIES!
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Maybe HOdi did it in anger? i know he probs loves the queen , but seeing the whole population signing the papers, he coulda thought he had to go to the extreme level to stop it; by shooting the queen
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man how manytears has been shed in the last couple chapters . man I like the neptunes brothers a little more now.they trying to help calm down they little sister.
Does anyone think that luffy is the person that will help shirohoshi control her sea king powers? -
This was probably said before,but I think VDD killed the queen and started the fire on the names to start all the panic, so he could have the chance to touch shirahoshi. I don't think he would have been able to even get close to her otherwise he even had a hard time touching her and going on noticed during that.
VDD is trying to marry Shirahoshi, shooting your future mother-in-law does not make a good impression.
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Dadan's still alive.
She was more like an aunt. ;)
@Zik:
Damn that Aladdin theory just seems to unlikely.
I don't like the look of one of Otohime's advisors.
http://i999.mangareader.net/one-piece/626/one-piece-2347699.jpgLook at those sneaky eyes and creepy smile.
Actually i would consider those panels against my old theory of both ministers being actually traitors who are guided by someone so far unkonown.
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@Sonic:
It was Van Auger.
VAN AUGER HATES EQUALITY BETWEEN SPECIES!
It was Yasopp, didn't you see that silhouette of Shanks?
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Speaking of red herrings, why bring up Otohime's CoO haki earlier in the flashback if it was never really used for storyline purposes? Seems like a Chekhov's Gun situation there.
And no, it's not a facile argument (for any Archer fans out there).
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Speaking of red herrings, why bring up Otohime's CoO haki earlier in the flashback if it was never really used for storyline purposes? Seems like a Chekhov's Gun situation there.
And no, it's not a facile argument (for any Archer fans out there).
Well, she used it to see into people's hearts, I guess. But yeah, it doesn't really seem necessary just for that.
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It was used to show how close she was to her people. By hearing the cries of their hearts, she could understand where they were coming from. Not necessarily agreeing with them (which he never ssupported the one stealing or the Sun Pirates killing the World Noble) but at least empthizing with them and increase her resolve to give fishmen and merfolk a better life.
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Yeah, The CoO was very important. It amplified her empathy and basically made her who she was…
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It was used to show how close she was to her people. By hearing the cries of their hearts, she could understand where they were coming from. Not necessarily agreeing with them (which he never ssupported the one stealing or the Sun Pirates killing the World Noble) but at least empthizing with them and increase her resolve to give fishmen and merfolk a better life.
Fair enough. I don't really like the idea of using haki as a reason for having empathy, since that's something characters should be able to do naturally, but your point makes sense in the context of the flashback.
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Haki is natural. She just has extreme empathy manifesting itself into CoO. Every normal person has empathy but haki allows her to go a step further and actually sense what they feel inside regardless of their actions or behavior.
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VDD is trying to marry Shirahoshi, shooting your future mother-in-law does not make a good impression.
Pretty sure throwing knives/axes/etc. at your potential wife for 10 years wouldn't leave a good impression either. Me thinks VDD isn't too concerned on what people think of his actions, as long as his actions are carried out.
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Shirahoshi is nowhere near as big as San Juan Wolf
No she is not, BUT you do realize that she can summon SEA KINGS.
so how big are sea kings in relation to San Juan Wolf?
and I suspect he can beat a few sea kings, but an army of them?
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If I were to have a gripe, it would be the VDD-Shirahoshi thing. Look at VDD intro: http://www.mangareader.net/one-piece/613/3
He talks like a maniac, but unless he is being sarcastic about the whole speech, then he has some , hmm, ehem, eeerrr, "feelings" for Shirahoshi.To the point of "love me or die". Ok.
Back to the last 2 chapters, he wants her because of A- Her powers, and B- Her position. No love involved (although he did say "she ain't half bad", referring to a 6 yo girl. . .).
Now, tell me, what would VDD gain from killing her? Not her power, not her position. . . His plans would make no sense.
So, will something happen to make him change his opinion? To actually make him "love" her? To the point of "you die if you don't love me"?
Or did Oda change his approach to VDD's character midway through the flashback?
Or maybe it's me, that I'm missing something here? (it wouldn't be the first time). . .
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I was worried the story will go in this direction.
What I mean with that is… that Shirahoshi will have this power and the bit where "someone will come and change the world..."
When that was added I was wondering, this is just all too sudden for me.... Where is the buildup, where we learn tens of chapters later how everything ties in together and that this power, the mermaid legend itself and all of a sudden everything is logical. It just feels to me like everything has been thrown together too fast.So as a result, did not like the chapter. Didn't like the goofy like character of Van Decken, did not like how the queen death was displayed and most of all did not like princess having this sort of power.
Even the 2 brothers cheering her sister like that, so she doesn't "flip" out, felt stange and out of place.I hope all of you, or at least majority of you have enjoyed the chapter to the fullest, which in a way I have no doubt you all have.
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If I were to have a gripe, it would be the VDD-Shirahoshi thing. Look at VDD intro: http://www.mangareader.net/one-piece/613/3
He talks like a maniac, but unless he is being sarcastic about the whole speech, then he has some , hmm, ehem, eeerrr, "feelings" for Shirahoshi.To the point of "love me or die". Ok.
Back to the last 2 chapters, he wants her because of A- Her powers, and B- Her position. No love involved (although he did say "she ain't half bad", referring to a 6 yo girl. . .).
Now, tell me, what would VDD gain from killing her? Not her power, not her position. . . His plans would make no sense.
So, will something happen to make him change his opinion? To actually make him "love" her? To the point of "you die if you don't love me"?
Or did Oda change his approach to VDD's character midway through the flashback?
Or maybe it's me, that I'm missing something here? (it wouldn't be the first time). . .
I figured that at first Decken did only want to marry Shirahoshi for her powers at first, but over time did develop a romantic obsession over her.
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What did the queen mean that she was careless ?
Honestly, I doubt the world nobles would agree to live in peace with others. Maybe during reverie, they studied her weaknesses and orchestrated her assasination. She was probably aware of that (haki) but her devotione led her to her death. Maybe the WG trusted only her in this agreement.
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What did the queen mean that she was careless ?
Most of us assume that's her referring to the fact that she was so distraught that she didn't notice the shooter through haki.
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Most of us assume that's her referring to the fact that she was so distraught that she didn't notice the shooter through haki.
YEP, similar to how haki was countered in skypiea by distractions and what not
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That's true. Her introduction showed her dodging a bullet.
However, we still don't know who caused the fire and shot her. It seems VDD did not have any reasons to do that.
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Or did Oda change his approach to VDD's character midway through the flashback?
Obviously, obsessively stalking someone for an entire decade has no effect on the person's character.
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Well, going from "I want her for a-abilites and b-power" to "Imma kill you if you don't love me!" is no mere personality change, it goes against his freaking initial plans! It's like, he's going to throw away 10 years of work by killing her. . .
That's why I said maybe there's something else to "their story".
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Well, going from "I want her for a-abilites and b-power" to "Imma kill you if you don't love me!" is no mere personality change, it goes against his freaking initial plans! It's like, he's going to throw away 10 years of work by killing her. . .
That's why I said maybe there's something else to "their story".
It's not really work if all he's done is touch her in 10 years and nothing else.
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Well, going from "I want her for a-abilites and b-power" to "Imma kill you if you don't love me!" is no mere personality change, it goes against his freaking initial plans! It's like, he's going to throw away 10 years of work by killing her. . .
That's why I said maybe there's something else to "their story".
It just means he's obsessed with her. It's pretty common among stalkers to kill their victims.
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VDD is trying to marry Shirahoshi, shooting your future mother-in-law does not make a good impression.
We already saw how twisted VDD thoughts on love are he sent constant axes/Wepons at the person he wants to marry