Can we call mods to show the first option voter.?
Which is Worse For a Parent?
-
-
@JERK:
You never went to school with any gay dudes did you.
Sorry I'm not on AP 24/7 and this is old but I gotta reply to your idiocy Zephos.
One of my friends through high school and best friend through college was a closet gay. We lived in NY, you know that big liberal state out East. He grew up in Brooklyn.
He went through hell with coming out, he pretended to be straight and would go out with girls just to fool his friends and his parents. All the while he started taking drugs and heavy alcohol to get past it. His parents, after finding out kicked him out of the house, and even divorced. This kid was a 3.7 GPA, DOUBLE MAJOR in fucking psychology and biology, he was studying to be a psychiatrist to get past his own shit. I had slept in the same bed as this kid, both wasted and he had never ever disrespected his straight friends, and he was always BOSS when it came to hooking us up with girls.
And, he is fine now, he moved to Jersey with his boyfriend.
But don't fucking tell me "I don't know" in your little chair with one hand on your dick and the other on your mouse. There's a reason I posted my vote with reasoning, instead of leaving it at that.
Porno in Greece are one of the best jobs, most real actresses have done soft-core "artsy-films" anyway, and most of the young Paris hilton-wannabee's are doing it hardcore.
-
Before anyone jumps down Refii's throat, I would like to point out that the stigma attached to both Pornography and Homosexuality is almost entirely caused by religion, and I do wonder how this poll would've turned out if porn stars had a better lobbying force.
After all, how many of us actually know a porn star in person? -
but Robo, there are many religions who actually are more a sex cultus than a religion.
like those who are dancing and screaming in a hall half naked for the Lord:wassat: -
Porno in Greece are one of the best jobs, most real actresses have done soft-core "artsy-films" anyway, and most of the young Paris hilton-wannabee's are doing it hardcore.
Οοοοοο Σουλτααααν~ Και η Σαμπάνια της Τζούλιας χμμ? =Ρ
Doesn't matter if it's soft-core or hardcore though. If it's done in Greece or Cyprus you know it's gonna come out at the end one way or another. Especially in Cyprus that is still a quite closed society. Eh, now that I think about being gay would also be quite bad for a kid depending on the school. In my old High School there would be no problems for a homosexual (at least there weren't any for this guy from my year that was one) but in several others, it would be quite horrible. =/
-
-
Ye Chrissie, as funny as it may seem, Julia Alexandratou amidst the political and economic turmoil released a sex tape that made everyone in Greece forget about the economy. Aside from the 2 million she was given on the spot, the million she got from interviews, and whatever other money she got under the table to release it during the media frenzy of the EU kicking us out of Europe, she made a lot of money.
Is she any better for it? No, Is she any worse than if she hadn't made one? No, no one respected her anyway, everyone considers her dirty and ask ANY man pre-sex tape, they all would say, no I wouldn't sleep with her. What was the end-result, couple of million in her pocket for her cocaine.
Her father got a mansion, what does the homosexual's father get aside from having to protect his son from bullies, assholes, and worse yet, other parents telling their kids "no he can't sleep over" or something like that.. Imagine being the parent of a child who's best friend's parents would say NO, your kid cannot stay in my son's bedroom.
This is again, all based on the parent's perspective, if you had asked would you rather be a bukake female porn-star or gay, it would be a different story.
Long story short, a parent has to live with his gay child from birth to death. A parent has to live with his daughter being a porn star when she's an adult, at that point, the parent's job is more or less done, you (parent) failed, move on.
-
lol 18 nazis and counting
-
I'm gonna just point out that the title asks which is subjectively "worse," not what is bad. I consider neither as negatives for my children, I consider being being gay the worse of the two.
If you want, you can go crucify the maker for classifying "gay" in a negative connotation.
-
Don't think a homosexual son is something bad … so the pornstar daughter.
I'd worry that I did something wrong in education if my daughter would f**k for her living :D
-
Ye Chrissie, as funny as it may seem, Julia Alexandratou amidst the political and economic turmoil released a sex tape that made everyone in Greece forget about the economy. Aside from the 2 million she was given on the spot, the million she got from interviews, and whatever other money she got under the table to release it during the media frenzy of the EU kicking us out of Europe, she made a lot of money.
Is she any better for it? No, Is she any worse than if she hadn't made one? No, no one respected her anyway, everyone considers her dirty and ask ANY man pre-sex tape, they all would say, no I wouldn't sleep with her. What was the end-result, couple of million in her pocket for her cocaine.
Her father got a mansion, what does the homosexual's father get aside from having to protect his son from bullies, assholes, and worse yet, other parents telling their kids "no he can't sleep over" or something like that.. Imagine being the parent of a child who's best friend's parents would say NO, your kid cannot stay in my son's bedroom.
This is again, all based on the parent's perspective, if you had asked would you rather be a bukake female porn-star or gay, it would be a different story.
I know how much Julia made with that tape of hers. I haven't watched it yet but from what I hear from friends that have done so, I will be rolling on the floor laughing for a while when I do.
Thing is Julia Alexandratou, like you said, had NOTHING to lose from making that tape. She was already pretty dirty. What's getting a bit more mud on her shoes gonna do to her? But a girl who ends up doing something like that for one reason or another and then wants to lead a normal life, how is she to do so with that above her head? Lets say I end up doing a porn-movie and it eventually gets out. Apart from being ridiculed by the part of my family that are not close to me and for some reason I cannot comprehend despise me, do you really think I would be able to find a Greek-Cypriot man to marry me later on? Would I even be hired in any school or be allowed to make my own one after something like that being found out? I also live in a town where 90% of the people know my family. Not to mention all the other people from other towns that do so too. Imagine the ridicule my parents and siblings will go through and the fingers pointed at their backs. I can move the hell out of Cyprus in the case the news that I made a movie like that come out, but what about them?
I personally find it more risky for the society I live in, to have a daughter that did an adult movie than to have a son that is homosexual.
-
I wouldnt really care either way, as long as he/she is happy with her life.
-
Lets say I end up doing a porn-movie and it eventually gets out. Apart from being ridiculed by the part of my family that are not close to me and for some reason I cannot comprehend despise me, do you really think I would be able to find a Greek-Cypriot man to marry me later on? Would I even be hired in any school or be allowed to make my own one after something like that being found out?
And bingo, there's the reason I picked option number two. I have always lived in very liberal parts of the world, where homosexuality is accepted as something that isn't bad or shameful. And as long as you live in one of the more tolerant corners of the world, it's only going to get better. We just have to look at how far we've come in the last 30-40 years.
There might be some prejudice, but that's always going to be there and many countries already have legislation in place that makes discrimination in the work place based on sexual orientation illegal. Being in an adult film however, especially if you're female, still carries a whole other kind of perception with it (being a slut, unprofessional, etc.). Chances are, if a woman is in any sort of respectable position and something "dirty" from her past is discovered, she's not going to be in that job much longer.
Of course, if my kid does a pornographic movie or turns out gay it really won't matter to me. I might smack her over the head for doing something so monumentally stupid and tell my son to be careful who he reveals his orientation to, but they're still going to be my kid. Nothing is going to change my feelings for them. In that sense, neither option is better or worse for me, I'm just worried how either one is going to affect them. So in the end I'm just going to agree with wolfwood here:
@wolfwood:I wouldnt really care either way, as long as he/she is happy with her life.
-
I'm gonna just point out that the title asks which is subjectively "worse," not what is bad. I consider neither as negatives for my children, I consider being being gay the worse of the two.
If you want, you can go crucify the maker for classifying "gay" in a negative connotation.
the worst option is choosing the first option instead of kicking your son's enemy's teeth
-
I did vote for the porn star daughter, but this is my view on the other issue:
I honestly don't see why it is wrong for people to not like having a gay son.
Sure, it's pretty cruel and heartless to hate or disown your own child just for disagreeing with your views, but every parent, no every human being has the right to have their views, as skewed and fucked up as they may be. It's not yours or anyone else's place to judge them, just as you feel you shouldn't be judged on your preferences.
If someone wants to disagree, or even hate, homosexuality, that is their choice. Homosexuals aren't entitled to anything, they have to work and push and protest and make their own change to win over the majority and get their rights. And it doesn't apply to just homosexuals, it applies to every bit of change we want in our world. It's run by a bunch of people stuck in their ways, it is up to the people who WANT change to MAKE change. They have to earn it and win it, it will not be handed to anyone on a silver platter.
I typed up some more but that was starting to get a little too personal. My point is homosexuals should respect the opinions of those who disagree with them JUST AS MUCH as those who disagree should still respect the opinions of those whom they disagree with. There is no excuse, you can't throw Christianity into this because the bible says to Love one another, love thy enemy, respect others, etc. Jesus didn't go around condemning people to hell right and left. All the people who are using religion as an excuse to act nasty are dumbasses, and shouldn't even be considered in an argument. Respect is a great thing that transcends all boundaries.
-
If someone wants to disagree, or even hate, homosexuality, that is their choice. Homosexuals aren't entitled to anything, they have to work and push and protest and make their own change to win over the majority and get their rights.
I will have to disagree with you there. While I can accept that everyone is entitled to their own opinion, I will not accept people being bigoted and infringing on other peoples rights. If you think Christianity is stupid, or being gay is wrong, that's your choice. But the minute that belief starts to manifest itself in any action that puts any slice of the population at a disadvantage or forces to deny what they are, that opinion becomes unacceptable.
Nobody should have to work for a level playing field. Now if we were talking about gays trying to institutionalize some sort of unfair advantage in, lets say the tax code, I would be right there on the barriers with you. But if they are being put at a disadvantage, or harassed, or disowned by their loved ones just for loving a person of their own gender then I refuse to allow other people their belief that being gay is wrong. To allow people to discriminate is the same as condoning it or actively taking part in it.
-
Sure, it's pretty cruel and heartless to hate or disown your own child just for disagreeing with your views,
yep
but every parent, no every human being has the right to have their views,
yep
as skewed and fucked up as they may be.
no
-
I think we're looking at this the wrong way: what's so bad about having a straight actress daughter? You guys are casting some bigoted stereotypes on the "straight actress" community that I can't just stand around and ignore. Those poor rich actresses struggle to get through every day without being harassed and called names like "beautiful" and "inspiring."
You people make me sick.
-
I will have to disagree with you there. While I can accept that everyone is entitled to their own opinion, I will not accept people being bigoted and infringing on other peoples rights. If you think Christianity is stupid, or being gay is wrong, that's your choice. But the minute that belief starts to manifest itself in any action that puts any slice of the population at a disadvantage or forces to deny what they are, that opinion becomes unacceptable.
Nobody should have to work for a level playing field. Now if we were talking about gays trying to institutionalize some sort of unfair advantage in, lets say the tax code, I would be right there on the barriers with you. But if they are being put at a disadvantage, or harassed, or disowned by their loved ones just for loving a person of their own gender then I refuse to allow other people their belief that being gay is wrong. To allow people to discriminate is the same as condoning it or actively taking part in it.
I don't agree with discrimination, but there is nothing you can do to force that to stop unless you overpower the hateful majority. That is the point I was making. I get very offended and upset when I hear people say homosexuals are lesser beings, they're stupid, or they're going to hell. No one has the right to say these things or to judge people, that is what I am more angry about.
Unfortunately the playing field is not level, and it's not going to change unless people force it to change. Sorry, but the ideal world of equality and fairness is still a ways off, the war of equal civil rights for all is far from over.
And what I bolded is exactly what I was trying say. No, you do not have the "right" to force anyone to stop doing anything or to change their beliefs. You can have your opinion, you can say your peace, you can protest, you can lobby for change, you can take action if someone is criminally harassing you, but you have no right to force someone to change because they disagree with you.
no
You cannot change other people directly, you have to change yourself and work and hope and pray you get others to see the light and err of their ways.
My family, especially my grandma, can be really unreasonable and hateful at times, like toddlers. There is nothing I can do to change this, no matter how many times I tell them they're wrong for doing what they do. I have to be the bigger person and set a better example, that's all I can do. That is the point I am trying to make:
You lead by EXAMPLE.
I think the people going around saying "You are wrong and bad for saying homosexuality is wrong" are just as bad as the people saying "You are bad for being homosexual"
You have to lead by example, you need to be the BIGGER PERSON to get the change you want to see in the world. All it has been in the past is a big pissing match. The majority is stubborn as hell and unchanging, this is why change has taken WARS to happen. But calling them bad people for not believing the way you do is not going to get change to happen. That just makes them more resolute to not change their ways.
The people that DID lead to change in the world (Martin Luther King Jr, is a wonderful example of this) are the people who didn't put down the majority, but reached out to them to understand and relate to the people they were putting down, who were human beings just as deserving of rights and love as they were.
I'm sorry but most of the "religious" people are stubborn/dumb. They're not open-minded. But most of them are GROSSLY misled on what the bible actually teaches. I honestly think most of our problems would be solved if there was away to get into people's heads that many of them have been greatly mislead about the bible and their actions, but this is something that has gone on since the dawn of organized religion, it's not something that's going to magically happen but yeah, that is the problem. People have been lead to beleive they should be closeminded and hateful of all things that appear to disagree with their faith, while ignoring the numerous parts and examples of Christs respectful and loving nature to those who disagreed, but I will not go into that any more because that's not the topic of this, I'm just stating this is where the real problem lies with why people are as stupid as they are.
-
No one has the right to say these things or to judge people, that is what I am more angry about.
You had me at the first part…
I think the people going around saying "You are wrong and bad for saying homosexuality is wrong" are just as bad as the people saying "You are bad for being homosexual"
…and then you lost me at the second one.
So what you're saying is that you think that no one has the right to discriminate against other people, but you're still going to allow it?
The thing is, what I bolded is exactly what has to be at the center of the message that campaigners who want to get gay people to get equal rights have to send. It has to be hammered it into everybody's head that being gay isn't wrong. And the thing is, those to sentences that you posted are not equally bad. Being attracted to members of your own sex is not something you choose or change. Your attitude towards gay people is.
Now I'm all for advocating free speech and all. However, being a an advocate of free speech and equal rights also means that you will have to be willing to go against those that threaten those ideals. It's the dichotomy of free speech that in being willing to protect it, you will have to subvert it to protect it.
My family, especially my grandma, can be really unreasonable and hateful at times, like toddlers. There is nothing I can do to change this, no matter how many times I tell them they're wrong for doing what they do. I have to be the bigger person and set a better example, that's all I can do. That is the point I am trying to make:
You lead by EXAMPLE.
All right, good plan practicing what you preach. However, nobody who is discriminating against a group of the population is going to look at the tolerant guy at the end of the table and think to himself "Hmm, the tolerant guy is not being turned gay/smitten by God/attempting to overthrow the nation. I think I will go and see what gay people are really like."
You have to confront these people, show them the error of their ways and really work on changing their opinion. I can appreciate that dealing with ones family members, especially grandparents who might be very set in their ways, is difficult. But really, everybody should work on seriously engaging and confronting those that espouse racist or homophobic or any other discriminating views. Leading by example is simply not enough. -
Well tbh i voted Gay son only because i thought that a daughter actress wouldnt really bew with her family that often, also i didnt notice the word "Adult" actress at first i just assumed actress.
When i think about it both seem pretty tame, but having an adult actress probably wouldnt be as hard since still you probably never would be with them because they are doing films. Adult films. But to be honest there isnt really a big deal/problem with either one. Its choice i guess.
-
You have to confront these people, show them the error of their ways and really work on changing their opinion. I can appreciate that dealing with ones family members, especially grandparents who might be very set in their ways, is difficult. But really, everybody should work on seriously engaging and confronting those that espouse racist or homophobic or any other discriminating views. Leading by example is simply not enough.
The problem is, confrontation will never work for an established view. Ever.
I personally hate bleach, and am disgusted with the direction it has taken. Now, if I approach a bleach fan on the forum and say "Bleach sucks and you suck for liking it, here's why…" will that make ANY difference in how he/she thinks?
I have to accept the fact that people do enjoy bleach, and move on. Maybe someday this particular fan will become bored with the series, as I did, and come to agree with my views, but this will never happen as a direct result of me confronting him/her.
If you need a more real-life example, look at the partisanship between democrats and republicans. -
But liking a series is different from hating on an entire group of people for no reason at all.
Personally I will not tolerate it.
-
The problem is, confrontation will never work for an established view. Ever.
….
If you need a more real-life example, look at the partisanship between democrats and republicans.I guess that's your opinion on the matter. Now despite what you think, I believe that you can change established views. It's difficult, yes, I won't deny that. But I think I just haven't yet become so cynical about people as you have. Who knows, maybe I'm just naive right now and in 10 years time I will arrive at the same opinion as you have. Until I do however, I will at least try to change people for the better. At worst I will have wasted a couple of hours of my life on futile attempts to change some stubborn bigots.
But imagine if I manage to convince somebody. Even if I just manage to make 1 out of the 100 people I talk to see the other side of the argument, I will have managed to improve the world a tiny bit. And I think that's worth all the sometimes fruitless discussion.
-
You shouldn't tolerate it, but it will do no good to openly harass people.
@S7evin:But imagine if I manage to convince somebody. Even if I just manage to make 1 out of the 100 people I talk to see the other side of the argument, I will have managed to improve the world a tiny bit. And I think that's worth all the sometimes fruitless discussion.
You could do that, but it's much more productive to focus on people who haven't closed their minds on the issue. In the time it would take to convince an extreme homophobe that gays shouldn't be killed on sight, you could probably enlighten several hundred uneducated but nonextremist people on the subject.
-
Trying to force your views on people just leads to them clinging even more stubbornly to their own, be it right or wrong.
-
I do believe that given time people will start to see the error in their ways, especially if they have really extreme views.
I used to be 100% Pro Life/Anti Abortion but rational arguments were able to get through to me.
-
Think of it this way: when people protest in front of an abortion clinic, they have no intention of convincing the people inside that they are wrong. They're trying to convince regular, nonpartisan people who happen to be around. A woman confident in her right to have an abortion will walk right past them, but a woman who isn't so confident in her beliefs may be swayed and decide not to abort.
@Envy:I do believe that given time people will start to see the error in their ways, especially if they have really extreme views.
I used to be 100% Pro Life/Anti Abortion but rational arguments were able to get through to me.
Who got through to you though?
Was it some random stranger, or was it someone you knew and trusted? -
It was actually just an internet forum. lol
The funny thing is that it was during a time where I was very stupid and wouldn't listen to a word that a lot of people would say to me, as well.
But I never completely changed my view, I just realized that there were specific cases where it was (sadly) the best thing to do. I can't ever see myself siding with Pro Choice, though. I still think that's very extreme.
-
It has to be hammered it into everybody's head that being gay isn't wrong.
But it's against the religious beliefs of some to agree with that.
You have to have respect both ways. The people who DO beleive it's wrong DON'T have the right to discriminate against on matters outside of their faith system (an example would be if a gay rights supporter walks into a church and starts telling everyone you are WRONG for not supporting homosexuality, they don't have the right do to that, just as much as a religious person doesn't have the right to run into, lets say a homosexual wedding, and tell them they are going to hell for what they're doing. That was the example I was trying to set, both of those things are wrong and discriminating).
I would not stand for a homosexual walking into my church telling us we were wrong for believing like we do just like I won't stand for someone walking up to a homosexual and being hateful towards them. Both things are unacceptable.
Reverse-discrimination is STILL discrimination. I don't give 2 craps about what anyone else says about it, it's just as bad.
However, nobody who is discriminating against a group of the population is going to look at the tolerant guy at the end of the table and think to himself "Hmm, the tolerant guy is not being turned gay/smitten by God/attempting to overthrow the nation. I think I will go and see what gay people are really like."
You have to confront these people, show them the error of their ways and really work on changing their opinion. I can appreciate that dealing with ones family members, especially grandparents who might be very set in their ways, is difficult. But really, everybody should work on seriously engaging and confronting those that espouse racist or homophobic or any other discriminating views. Leading by example is simply not enough.Well obviously, some of them in the past had to have done this or we would have never ended slavery or gained more rights for minorities/women/etc. And a lot of the hardcore people will not change their ways, but most of them are old and will be dead soon anyway XDDD
Though in all serious, the US is actually full of quite moderate, tolerant people, but many of them are unsure which way to sway because there is nastiness on both sides they don't really agree with. That's where setting examples with respect and tolerance come in. We change the world by changing ourselves firstly, and setting examples for our friends/family/communities. One step at a time.
And honestly I think we should drop homosexuality as a religious issue and look at it as a legal, civil rights issue.
America is a nation of many different religions and cutural beliefs, that do coexist and are allowed to do so by the majority. Marriage licenses are run through the state, an entity that is supposed to be seperate from church. Only marriage ceremonies are religiously (or not) influenced. The problem lies in the fact that of course, the laws and practice of marriage in the US was originally centered around christian beliefs and people beleive that Christian rules should be over all marriage unions, and that all marriage unions are religious in nature (because they are in christianity), but that violates separation of church and state, therefore the church SHOULD have no authority over who gains a marriage license through the state. If people would look like it like it was another religion (not saying homosexuality IS a religion, as most of them I know aren't religious, but it can be treated as such for the sake of this arguement), then I don't see why there is a legal issue.
Obviously there are laws around marriage for a reason, but I don't see why under this constitution, two adults, no matter their preference, can't be married legally. It's really silly.
Personally I don't feel a great animosity towards a lot of the close minded people, as I see where they come from (stubbornly traditional small town America). As someone who was from a small town, but mostly grew up in a larger, more urban area but who was frequently back and dealing with people in said small town (stayed with my grandparents a lot) and saw both ends of the scale, I can sympathize with both sides. Instead of seeing them as close minded bigots I see a challenge, a clean slate, somewhere to plant seeds of change. I don't agree that ignorance is an excuse, but it is a major factor.
I had friends who came out of the closet back home and it wasn't a big deal, while my step brother came out of the closet back in that small town, and it was the town gossip/extremely shameful.
So instead of writing off the ignorant masses, why is it so hard to get in there are educate them, without making them feel threatened, and to see the other side of the coin?
But therein lies the problem. I'm glad I got into this because I just realized this myself XDD
The reason this is not moving along faster/not happening, is because the two sides can't relate to each other! I think I'm really starting to understand better how to go about this now XD
Ok I better stop before I go into a million more things that are totally off topic XD
-
The problem is, confrontation will never work for an established view. Ever.
I personally hate bleach, and am disgusted with the direction it has taken. Now, if I approach a bleach fan on the forum and say "Bleach sucks and you suck for liking it, here's why…" will that make ANY difference in how he/she thinks?
I have to accept the fact that people do enjoy bleach, and move on. Maybe someday this particular fan will become bored with the series, as I did, and come to agree with my views, but this will never happen as a direct result of me confronting him/her.
If you need a more real-life example, look at the partisanship between democrats and republicans.^ This was the point I was trying to make, Thanks Robo~
Confrontation and forcing/threatening is NOT going to make the religious majority budge an inch.
-
But it's against the religious beliefs of some to agree with that.
"Religious belief"? I will never buy into that.
I really still think that for a lot of them it's just an excuse. The Bible does not give an excuse for anywhere near the amount of homophobia that we have around right now.
I think it's about time we stop giving in to "It's a religious belief" mentality. They've done it with slavery, and they've done it with woman's rights. We can't fall for it this time. It's personal prejudices hiding behind the Bible. And I'm sick of it, personally.
-
I guess that's your opinion on the matter. Now despite what you think, I believe that you can change established views. It's difficult, yes, I won't deny that. But I think I just haven't yet become so cynical about people as you have. Who knows, maybe I'm just naive right now and in 10 years time I will arrive at the same opinion as you have. Until I do however, I will at least try to change people for the better. At worst I will have wasted a couple of hours of my life on futile attempts to change some stubborn bigots.
But imagine if I manage to convince somebody. Even if I just manage to make 1 out of the 100 people I talk to see the other side of the argument, I will have managed to improve the world a tiny bit. And I think that's worth all the sometimes fruitless discussion.
I've worked in politics and been embroiled in the center of it since 2003, and I can tell you that RoboBlue hit it on the nose. There are people out there who will never, ever change their minds. These are the stubborn people that exist on both sides of the aisle and have, for better or worse, planted themselves so deeply into an ideal that there is no way that they can leave. It's almost psychological at this point. "I have loved Bleach since its started. I've made an investment. I've fought the hard fight against those idiotic One Piece and Naruto fans for years and years and years. I can't give in now, this is MY fight." I believe a lot of people feel this way when it comes to issues like abortion, homosexuality, health care, and the economy. Whether or not they believe what they say isn't the issue. It's the fact that they represent a cause, the fact that they believe themselves to be against a certain party or ideal (like the Tea Partiers opinions against Obama and the Democrats), the fact that they grew up in a home that believed this to be true, the fact that they invested their time, their money, their soul into a cause.
This happens on both sides and it's what is causing the rift in this country and has been swelling up even more in the last few decades. Partisanship causes more partisanship. Discrimination causes more discrimination. When you go to someone and say "you're wrong, I'm right, change your mind or else I will no longer respect you" you don't help your cause, you hurt it. The crazies on both sides take this and say: "these people look down on us. These people don't understand what I believe so I will rise up against what they believe!" This is the kind of politicking that's been happening, and frankly a lot of the politicking (for better or worse) that I see in this thread.
In order to ensure a future that you want, you have to reach out to those who disagree and converse. You have to understand why they think the way they do. You have to make sure they understand why you think the way you do. Sure, you may not sway them, but if you have an open dialogue with someone it's always possible to bring out the side of them that's telling them: "maybe I'm wrong."
-
I think your post was a little too long, arei. :P
-
Chose the second option, there's no problem with a homosexual son for me, but the thought that there's footage of my daughter around for everyone to see, would make me feel really bad. Of course I'd still love her, but I'm just not that open to deal with a situation like that, and probably wouldn't know how to cope with it.
@Zach:
I think we're looking at this the wrong way: what's so bad about having a straight actress daughter? You guys are casting some bigoted stereotypes on the "straight actress" community that I can't just stand around and ignore. Those poor rich actresses struggle to get through every day without being harassed and called names like "beautiful" and "inspiring."
You people make me sick.
Stop protecting them. I know one in real life so I know what I'm talking about. She actually tried to sign me an autograph one evening and then she even wanted to show me her Oscar when we were alone. Can you believe it? No shame at all!
-
@Zach:
I think we're looking at this the wrong way: what's so bad about having a straight actress daughter? You guys are casting some bigoted stereotypes on the "straight actress" community that I can't just stand around and ignore. Those poor rich actresses struggle to get through every day without being harassed and called names like "beautiful" and "inspiring."
You people make me sick.
Ehhh… out of all posts, you're the only one that confused me.
Are you thinking of "actresses" that kiss random dudes on the big screens?... or... "actresses" that have sex with random dudes on computer screens? :wassat:
-
Ehhh… out of all posts, you're the only that confused me.
Are you thinking of "actresses" that kiss random dudes on the big screens?... or... "actresses" that have sex with random dudes on computer screens? :wassat:
I didn't see the word "adult" so my sarcastic joke doesn't work all that well.
-
I do kind of agree with you Zach.
It's not the best idea to blatantly attack these people. What I'm thinking is that over time if you have a lot of rational debates (without any attacks on your side) with them maybe they'll see the light.
-
Fixed the poll so it's much clearer.
-
I do kind of agree with you Zach.
It's not the best idea to blatantly attack these people. What I'm thinking is that over time if you have a lot of rational debates with them maybe they'll see the light.
It's possible, but very unlikely. Remember, theyre always trying to do the same thing to you.
-
I think your post was a little too long, arei. :P
I am not master of the text wall for nothing ;D
I apologize, I'm in no way a TL;DR person, I've got too much to say XD
"Religious belief"? I will never buy into that.
I really still think that for a lot of them it's just an excuse. The Bible does not give an excuse for anywhere near the amount of homophobia that we have around right now.
I think it's about time we stop giving in to "It's a religious belief" mentality. They've done it with slavery, and they've done it with woman's rights. We can't fall for it this time. It's personal prejudices hiding behind the Bible. And I'm sick of it, personally.
Homophobia is not promoted in the bible.
Homosexuality is listed as a sin in the bible, it is also among the things of no-nos that "will not receive the gift of the kingdom of heaven".
But there is NOTHING in the bible that says you should treat people who sin or don't agree with you poorly or hateful, you are to be respectful and loving to all. You are to try to convert and KINDLY, without hatefulness or coercion, explain why you beleive as you do is right, not to torment and kill/torture/harass the masses who don't beleive you as you do. NONE of that is condoned in the bible. None of it. Do not think people like that are "good" religious people that will get into heaven because they WON'T. Not everyone who cries out "Lord, Lord" will be saved, nor is everyone who claims to be a christian, is really truly and scriptually a christian.
The twisting around and abuse of religion has been around for ever. It is not the faith that's wrong, it's not God that's wrong, it's the twisted minds of people who twist the word around to fit their wants, who lead the blind masses into doing the same. This is not unique to modern times, this has been going on since the beginning.
So yes, "religious beliefs" is a valid and genuine excuse for not agreeing with something, but it is not condoned or even suggested you treat people who beleive differently poorly. That is something conceived by humans, the superiority complex of human nature.
I would say people who don't truly understand how Christianity is SUPPOSED to be should STFU, but honestly a lot of the people who claim to be christians really don't know it either, making that point extremely moot, which is why we have a problem in this day and age.
I know many people who are homosexual who know all about the bible, and just fundamentally disagree with it on a personal level. And I can totally respect that. That is all fine and dandy, we can agree to disagree, but no one has the right to slander someone else's beliefs.
-
Knowing that a billion guys are porking my daughter, and it's being videotaped and sent around for others to jack off to, that would without a doubt be the worst. The other option, hm. A friend from high school who was gay, he was a fun guy but when I got to know him better I learned about his many suicide attempts over this, and him telling me about his feeling of "the big void in his head", not pretty. I'm not sure if this is that common though.
That said, I'm one of the 19 "homosexual son" voters, when I saw yesterday that many people were getting on their high horse over it, I had to.
-
Homophobia is not promoted in the bible.
Homosexuality is listed as a sin in the bible, it is also among the things of no-nos that "will not receive the gift of the kingdom of heaven".
But there is NOTHING in the bible that says you should treat people who sin or don't agree with you poorly or hateful, you are to be respectful and loving to all. You are to try to convert and KINDLY, without hatefulness or coercion, explain why you beleive as you do is right, not to torment and kill/torture/harass the masses who don't beleive you as you do. NONE of that is condoned in the bible. None of it. Do not think people like that are "good" religious people that will get into heaven because they WON'T. Not everyone who cries out "Lord, Lord" will be saved, nor is everyone who claims to be a christian, is really truly and scriptually a christian.
The twisting around and abuse of religion has been around for ever. It is not the faith that's wrong, it's not God that's wrong, it's the twisted minds of people who twist the word around to fit their wants, who lead the blind masses into doing the same. This is not unique to modern times, this has been going on since the beginning.
So yes, "religious beliefs" is a valid and genuine excuse for not agreeing with something, but it is not condoned or even suggested you treat people who beleive differently poorly. That is something conceived by humans, the superiority complex of human nature.
I would say people who don't truly understand how Christianity is SUPPOSED to be should STFU, but honestly a lot of the people who claim to be christians really don't know it either, making that point extremely moot, which is why we have a problem in this day and age.
I know many people who are homosexual who know all about the bible, and just fundamentally disagree with it on a personal level. And I can totally respect that. That is all fine and dandy, we can agree to disagree, but no one has the right to slander someone else's beliefs.
Really looking into the Bible and the terminology, and things like that takes away a lot of the supposed "homosexuality is wrong" verses, though.
Maybe the Bible does not promote homophobia itself, really. Which is not something I was arguing. I was arguing that people take those verses (and oftentimes blatant mistranslations of them) and act like they are an excuse to be against homosexuality and deny all of the rights to them.
I know that homophobia is natural, as it's in human nature to hate on what is different. And to me that's evidence enough for the reason that people are ignoring what many verses say, but leaving the homosexuality ones as ones to follow.
There's just too much picking and choosing going on, and it's very suspicious to me. It's just very suspicious to me how homosexuals are told they're going to hell but that other sins are completely ignored.
What also bothers me is how a country like America, that was founded so clearly on the Separation of Church and State, is letting these verses control who has rights and who does not.
-
Can I say I'd rather have a lesbian daughter than a straight daughter (men are scumbags)? I'd also rather have a straight son than a gay son, or if he were gay I'd like them both (he and his husband) to keep my last name since our surname would only have that one opportunity to propagate.
-
@Zach:
Can I say I'd rather have a lesbian daughter than a straight daughter (men are scumbags)? I'd also rather have a straight son than a gay son,
No Zach…
-
Homophobia is not promoted in the bible.
Homosexuality is listed as a sin in the bible, it is also among the things of no-nos that "will not receive the gift of the kingdom of heaven".
So… "Homosexuals aren't evil, but they're going to Hell anyway"?
I hate when Religious people tell me that... A lot of them try to act like they're not discriminating against me, they're just trying to "Save" me from "Burning in Hell".
It's still hurtful and wrong.
-
No Zach…
Fine, fine, no double standards then I guess…:getlost:
No one gets to have sex now.
-
You guys please… don't bring religion in my thread... :getlost:
-
@Zach:
Can I say I'd rather have a lesbian daughter than a straight daughter (men are scumbags)?
I'm going to open Pandora's box and ask: Why?
Please don't let it be the answer "It's hot", cause it's your hypothetical daughter we're talking about here afterall! LOLYou guys please… don't bring religion in my thread... :getlost:
It's all cool. Do what Jesus would do, Sarus.
-
I'm going to open Pandora's box and ask: Why?
Please don't let it be the answer "It's hot", cause it's your hypothetical daughter we're talking about here afterall!:ninja: LOLSEE: Parenthesized area.