Chapter 924 : Ha*
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It Oden is alive it doesn't mean the throne has to go to him. He will be the best proof that Momo is his true son and successor to the throne. After that Oda can do whatever he likes with his fate/story.
Vivi hasn't taken over Cobra's place as the monarch of Arabasta, neither did Rebbeca. So why does Momo, who absolutely has no training whatsoever, has to take over the country right away? He's an 8 year old child who's been transported 20 years into the future. While Oden was absent from the country supposedly for the same duration of time, it's least people still know him and his capabilities.
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@uniaka:
Could it be that kaidou is not even CoC user? Like he is no conqueror, he just forced people to join him, unlike luffy. Then again, it seems also like what BM is doing.
What he is doing now on kid and luffy is maybe how he got jack to join.
While that is kind of what a conqueror is, I've been thinking the same thing. Like maybe he has this complex regarding COC that causes him to want to break those who have it
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It's not unheard of for underage heirs to the throne to be declared king or queen, literally at the age of two weeks in one case. Although this is factor in my negative opinion of royalty, an intermediate obviously calls the shots until the royal is of age.
But I hope that's not the case here.
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Whoever mentioned it earlier in the topic, I'm starting to think just maybe Oden is still alive…and that is him in the jail cell.
It doesn't make sense Kaido would kill the 1 person in the world that could read the Poneglyphs...perhaps he wanted to get Momo so he could use him as leverage to get the information he wants...Plus if the current Shogun is brought down, who is going to replace him? It'd have to be someone that was loyal to Oden or part of that clan i.e Oden himself
Just a theory but i was thinking on it since i read that other comment the other day... i guess time will tell..
Oden being alive kinda makes no sense considering that he seemingly already passed his will to his son and retainers. "Open the borders of Wano" were his final words.
Plus, it undermines a lot of the tragedy that drives the character of Momonosuke and the retainers, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi included.
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One reason Kaido is changing his mind (killing and recruit Luffy) is because he seems to be a really emotional guy.
Second: he is drunk most of the time. And Luffys attack sobered him out.Btw… I have an interesting theory, that could fit into the big plot.
What if Kaidos secret is that the former Ope-ope no mi users self-sacrifice made Kaido immortal?
To make a bigger twist, the person was either Kaidos good friend, IF not lover...
That could be the reason why Kaido soaks his brain in alcohol, and trying to commit suicide whenever he can...This could even explain why Law is the key element of this arc too.
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One reason Kaido is changing his mind (killing and recruit Luffy) is because he seems to be a really emotional guy.
Second: he is drunk most of the time. And Luffys attack sobered him out.Btw… I have an interesting theory, that could fit into the big plot.
What if Kaidos secret is that the former Ope-ope no mi users self-sacrifice made Kaido immortal?
To make a bigger twist, the person was either Kaidos good friend, IF not lover...
That could be the reason why Kaido soaks his brain in alcohol, and trying to commit suicide whenever he can...This could even explain why Law is the key element of this arc too.
Law's immortality operation is actually more about anti-aging going by the Japanese wording. Nothing to do with immunity to injuries and so on.
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Since Kaido said he didn't need that many conqueror's haki users. I guess he's gonna force Luffy and Kidd to a deathmatch or something
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Oden being alive kinda makes no sense considering that he seemingly already passed his will to his son and retainers. "Open the borders of Wano" were his final words.
I remember the time I began to read apforums. This was about 2005/2006. There was some talk then about the possibility of Tom being still alive, since we never saw his death or a corpse or something oike that. He might be alive in some cell in Enies Lobby and will be discovered.
This Oden thing reminds me of this a little bit. It's just a general feeling and I don't claim to have much the big arguments, but I doubt that oda would put all that with regards to Oden's death (and he will be a flashback character! Those actually die even in One Piece) and than let him live just for shock value.
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Oden being alive kinda makes no sense considering that he seemingly already passed his will to his son and retainers. "Open the borders of Wano" were his final words.
Plus, it undermines a lot of the tragedy that drives the character of Momonosuke and the retainers, Inuarashi and Nekomamushi included.
Not to mention that Kaido and his crew have been searching for Kinemon and the others all this time due to suspecting that he shared that information with them. If Oden was alive, then then they wouldn't be needed. Also… they saw him die.
Since Kaido said he didn't need that many conqueror's haki users. I guess he's gonna force Luffy and Kidd to a deathmatch or something
That's not what he meant. Pretty sure the "we" is referring to the world/New World in general.
Also that interpretation doesn't make any sense if he just lets him live.
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Since Kaido said he didn't need that many conqueror's haki users. I guess he's gonna force Luffy and Kidd to a deathmatch or something
Meh.. he doesn't need one coz he's the Conqueror himself. But he do fonds himself of strong military power.
And this talk about the rarity of HK, I don't mind the increasing number of characters that has it..
but what irks me is the absence of such feat on the Admirals.. I guess, one still has to be born with it and then hone it.
It can't be developed no matter how strong you get. -
"Not needing any more of these" is just an expression of being sick of something. Kaido hates that extra steps must be taken to mentally enslave a conquerer-at-heart, same as any talentless hack who hates the talented.
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I would like if Kaido don't have conqueror. Proving you don't need it to succeed.
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That's just it: it's already been established that he has worked very hard in not needing haki for conquest, but all that effort is just bully-tactics and slavery. I advise seeking inspirational achievements elsewhere.
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Hawkins probably got spirit-broken, him acting so loyal to Kaido after two years of navigating the NW and effectively oppising the Yonkos and now being just a puppy to master Kaido.
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I would like if Kaido don't have conqueror. Proving you don't need it to succeed.
I think its the other way around. If you are strong enough to succeed, you have the will of a conqueror.
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So, very good chapter. First, I think this is a perfect opportunity for Luffy to gain 'training' through actual prison labor. I don't expect him to escape anytime soon, what I hope for is something similar to Gohan's initial development, when he was fending for himself. I don't think Luffy would really train in a similar manner himself. He might try to gain new techniques and such, just not physical training. I could be wrong, since he did do some sort of training with Ace and Sabo. I loved the 'HUH!?' reactions. I enjoyed the moment Luffy glared at Kaido and how Luffy made the grunts faint. Still enjoying how Shuutenmaru is just chilling with no fucks given about Kaido. Btw, I'm impressed with him as much as I was with Bege. I can't seem to remember anything at the top of my head.
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@HTC:
The next Luffy evolution will have him incorporate Elizabello's King Punch in all of his attacks, from the gomu gomu no Pistol all the way to gomu gomu Kong Organ, plus whatever other attacks Oda gives him.
Why else would Oda show us Luffy's reaction to Elizabello's punch? Obviously, Luffy won't need the "one hour preparation time", or can just use the "light version" for his more basic attacks and the "full version" for the more heavy hitting ones.
Besides, this punch is "supposed to take out a Yonko … if it connects", right? @ least that's what Elizabello's tactician Dagama said, right?
I lol'd, that would be something Luffy would take holy shit.
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Hawkins probably got spirit-broken, him acting so loyal to Kaido after two years of navigating the NW and effectively oppising the Yonkos and now being just a puppy to master Kaido.
It's implied that he let Law get away, so he might be plotting something.
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So real talk though. Is the prisoner kawa whatever or den something?
Which powerful Wano retainer dude is it gonna be.
Either that or one of Roger's retired crew mates that Joyboy theorized about I think.
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I think its the other way around. If you are strong enough to succeed, you have the will of a conqueror.
Pretty sure Ray mentioned you're born with it.
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I would like if Kaido don't have conqueror. Proving you don't need it to succeed.
Well…he won't succeed, so ¯_(ツ)_/¯
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I've got a question/possible inconsistency.
Kaidou wants to recruit Shutenmaru into his crew, as stated a couple of chapters ago. In this chapter, it's shown that he's willing to capture people and force them to join him. So why hasn't he done the same thing to Shutenmaru? It's not like Shuten escaped like Law did, he was standing right out in the open, right in front of Kaidou.
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Kaido is gonna have conquerors haki to knock out conquerors. Luffy is gonna follow in ace's footsteps and Kaido will be his new captain because he's the father he never knew. :ninja:
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I've got a question/possible inconsistency.
Kaidou wants to recruit Shutenmaru into his crew, as stated a couple of chapters ago. In this chapter, it's shown that he's willing to capture people and force them to join him. So why hasn't he done the same thing to Shutenmaru? It's not like Shuten escaped like Law did, he was standing right out in the open, right in front of Kaidou.
The Beasts Pirates weren't able to locate Shutenmaru until Jack found him. Then Kaido lost interest in doing work after Luffy made him sober. And Jack was held up by caretakers so he probably lost track of him.
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@Kaido:
The Beasts Pirates weren't able to locate Shutenmaru until Jack found him. Then Kaido lost interest in doing work after Luffy made him sober
That's still a bit hard for me to accept since they're only like 30 feet away from each other (on page 7 for both JB and MS), but I gueeeeess that sort of makes sense.
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Pretty sure Ray mentioned you're born with it.
Yeah, but I'm saying its more accurate to say that you were born with the potential for greatness and this power manifests because of that, not that you achieve greatness because you were born with this power.
Its a bit of a chicken/egg scenario.
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@Kaido:
Well…he won't succeed, so ¯_(ツ)_/¯
I think we are supposed to consider the emperors to be great figures of this world. They are part of the world order after all.
He won't be the most successful (Luffy was basically born and bred with every shonen advantage to win) but he among the most important leaders.
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It's not like Shuten escaped like Law did, he was standing right out in the open, right in front of Kaidou.
Yeah, but he was drunk and acting playful. If he hadn't been distracted by Hawkins, its possible he would have eventually gotten tired and captured Shutenmaru.
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I've got a question/possible inconsistency.
Kaidou wants to recruit Shutenmaru into his crew, as stated a couple of chapters ago. In this chapter, it's shown that he's willing to capture people and force them to join him. So why hasn't he done the same thing to Shutenmaru? It's not like Shuten escaped like Law did, he was standing right out in the open, right in front of Kaidou.
He was distracted by Luffy attack. And I expect that the one in the cage is the one we see fighting with Shuten in the flashback.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Yeah, but I'm saying its more accurate to say that you were born with the potential for greatness and this power manifests because of that, not that you achieve greatness because you were born with this power.
Its a bit of a chicken/egg scenario.
That you don't have to be born with that potential and you can just work and achieve as much without it is what I would like to see.
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You're assuming Fujitora and Ryokugyu should know if Vegapunk was missing, which doesn't have to be the case. Needlessly snide, much? ^^;
Not to mention condescending.
What if Vegapunk went on an excursion alone and left his robot clone or something? Then messed up bad and got jailed? What if there's more background with him and Kaido than we're aware of?
And who says it has to be a stealthy operation. Might have happened only after Fujitora's visit. Since our heroes left Dressrosa, Kaido has lost his onlt source of devil fruits. Maybe he thought he could do something about it? There are options.
If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. But at least I'm not an ass.
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Too many assumptions in that sentence. We don't know how long he's been there, nor do we know if any of those guards ever saw him up close.
I’m not assuming that the guard literally says he also doesn’t know what’s in the cage. The one guard who call the other guard a newbie says himself that he doesn’t know what’s in there… So what do you think that mean
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As far as we know, Urouge could have it too, for example. Considering how he barged into BM's territory, beat the shit out of one of the executives and still managed to escape from BM.
Wonder what's with Killer and the rest of Kid' crew, btw.
Your correct my theory is bit shotty considering that CoC is still unexplored, its hyped to be a dangerous thing yet all it does is knocked out fodder so like CoO that has a high lvl(future sight"). I assume that CoC has some high level aspect of it as well, but i also think that well explore how CoC is connected to the story thematiclly and why certain characters have it and others dont.
Uroge could have it but his character is largely unexplored yet so will see
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Your correct my theory is bit shotty considering that CoC is still unexplored, its hyped to be a dangerous thing yet all it does is knocked out fodder so like CoO that has a high lvl(future sight"). I assume that CoC has some high level aspect of it as well, but i also think that well explore how CoC is connected to the story thematiclly and why certain characters have it and others dont.
Uroge could have it but his character is largely unexplored yet so will see
Well Big Mom literally made some missles disintegrate, so who knows what a specialist (likely Shanks) could do with it. That said, it's not hyped what we've seen because it's a dangerous ability, but more that the people that have it are basically guaranteed to be a real pain in the ass if left unchecked.
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That you don't have to be born with that potential and you can just work and achieve as much without it is what I would like to see.
Yeah, but that's what I'm saying: The type of person who would work to achieve that much will be born with that power. Haki is the manifestation of someone's willpower. Some people are just born with a stronger will than others.
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Yeah, but that's what I'm saying: The type of person who would work to achieve that much will be born with that power. Haki is the manifestation of someone's willpower. Some people are just born with a stronger will than others.
And I would like that those that acquired that will later could also be successful. Or that it wasn't decided since birth.
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And I would like that those that acquired that will later could also be successful.
For those people, the power was simply in them all along. Ace used it at 9, but Luffy didn't show it until he was 17. Both were born with it.
Or that it wasn't decided since birth.
Well that's just arguing with reality. Lots of things are determined at birth.
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For those people, the power was simply in them all along. Ace used it at 9, but Luffy didn't show it until he was 17. Both were born with it.
So it's not what I am hoping. Both were born with the potential of greatness. If Kaido made it without it it's different.
I mean the manga doesn't have to be this way. It's just something I would like.
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Fair to say Kid and Luffy will be going head to head with Kaido while others provide support. I can feel the pain of Kid when he decided to take on Kaido and his so called alliance surrendered meekly.
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Your correct my theory is bit shotty considering that CoC is still unexplored, its hyped to be a dangerous thing yet all it does is knocked out fodder so like CoO that has a high lvl(future sight"). I assume that CoC has some high level aspect of it as well, but i also think that well explore how CoC is connected to the story thematiclly and why certain characters have it and others dont.
Uroge could have it but his character is largely unexplored yet so will see
I hope it does too I have thought about that.
So it's not what I am hoping. Both were born with the potential of greatness. If Kaido made it without it it's different.
I mean the manga doesn't have to be this way. It's just something I would like.
It makes some people seem special so I'm fine with it. Chosen by fate and all that. Sure it can be interesting for someone without it to try to fight it, in Rock Lee style. Also, even with it, it's obviously nothing overpowered either. It didn't help Luffy at all against Kaido here, who does not seem to have it. I think people still have to work pretty hard regardless of the ability either way. What matters is that it is balanced.
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I don't see how this chapter implies Kaido doesn't have it. If anything, it's the opposite.
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@Neo:
It makes some people seem special so I'm fine with it. Chosen by fate and all that. Sure it can be interesting for someone without it to try to fight it, in Rock Lee style. Also, even with it, it's obviously nothing overpowered either. It didn't help Luffy at all against Kaido here, who does not seem to have it. I think people still have to work pretty hard regardless of the ability either way. What matters is that it is balanced.
Didn't Rock Lee constantly fail? Mighty Guy would be a better example.
I don't expect expect everyone to not have it. Just a couple people to say there's more than one way to the top and that being special isn't your only choice.
We don't know if Kaido has it yet.
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Didn't Rock Lee constantly fail? Mighty Guy would be a better example.
I don't expect expect everyone to not have it. Just a couple people to say there's more than one way to the top and that being special isn't your only choice.
We don't know if Kaido has it yet.
I understand your wish but to me, it would go a bit against the story. Blame it to Oda' choice to have made it a born ability.
Conqueror's haki is sufficciently bad already. If Kaidou would not have it, it would make even it even worse -
So is CoC going to have anything beyond fodder removal? At this point, CoA and CoO feel way more special because that is the way to fight non fodders and beasts like yonkou commanders or yonkou.
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@uniaka:
So is CoC going to have anything beyond fodder removal? At this point, CoA and CoO feel way more special because that is the way to fight non fodders and beasts like yonkou commanders or yonkou.
It's already the way to know that you become something great in life. I don't think it needs to do more.
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I understand your wish but to me, it would go a bit against the story. Blame it to Oda' choice to have made it a born ability. Conqueror's haki is sufficciently bad already.
I know. I was waiting for Big Mom but at this point I expect the top dog pirates to have it. It's like devil fruits. I don't like how they are handle but I accept it.
If Kaidou would not have it, it would make even it even worse
Why would it be worse for you. Not trying to start a debate just genuinely curious.
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@uniaka:
So is CoC going to have anything beyond fodder removal? At this point, CoA and CoO feel way more special because that is the way to fight non fodders and beasts like yonkou commanders or yonkou.
I remember it cracking up Whitebeard´s ship
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I haven't really thought of Conqueror's Haki as a born with it ability but rather a "can't be taught" ability, which is sliiiightly different. We've seen that all the Conqueror's Haki users shown so far have or have been natural leaders, and leadership itself is an ability that can be difficult to teach. Several CoC users have set themselves apart from other leaders by having unusually lofty ideals, that shake up the world order. Conqueror's Haki is simply an extension of that skill and those aspirations, and is a way of demonstrating the potential to achieve those aspirations. It's why Doffy's executives decided to follow him, and why Trebol was so excited when Luffy and Doffy clashed - their CoC Haki didn't give them any specific advantage in their battle, but it did symbolize a clash of huge conflicting wills that would shape history.
Whether or not Kaido has it will come down to one thing, imo: if he can actually pull off his wish to start an earth-shaking war. If he does or gets close to it, then I fully expect him to have it. If it all falls apart on him, then who knows.
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Why would it be worse for you. Not trying to start a debate just genuinely curious.
Because it would make little sense that someone who has conquered 1/4th of the new world does not have it.
If someone as unsignificant has cone-head from the coloseum has it, i expect the big names to have it. But maybe Blackbeard will answer your wish since he is of the treacherous kind -
@uniaka:
So is CoC going to have anything beyond fodder removal? At this point, CoA and CoO feel way more special because that is the way to fight non fodders and beasts like yonkou commanders or yonkou.
I think that a Coa Clash between a CoC user and a normal user results in the CoC users win. Remember that when Doflamingo tried to step on Law and Luffy blocked it it was a CoC clash as stated by the Earwax guy or how hes named.
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I can't wait for Luffy become better friends with Kidd than he is to Law because Law can't use CoC.
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I can't wait for Luffy become better friends with Kidd than he is to Law because Law can't use CoC.
But Law is a D. 16 chars.
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Because it would make little sense that someone who has conquered 1/4th of the new world does not have it.
If someone as unsignificant has cone-head from the coloseum has it, i expect the big names to have it. But maybe Blackbeard will answer your wish since he is of the treacherous kindConsidering that I consider Blackbeard to be shit it would not.