Chapter 717: "The Forgotten of Dressrosa"

[nonectra]

@choperman:

Doflamingo and his crew alone could probably do nothing, but Dofla is the center king pin of all the Criminal underworld, all the brokers

if you think of Luffy, Law and their crews fighting alone of course they'd lose
but if you add

the Kid, Killer, Apoo, and Hawkings alliance
Doflamingo and his entire crew
plus the entire criminal underworld which seems to have people like CP9, Gecko Moria (at least he looks that way to me) and tons of other brokers we've only seen silhouettes of
and Big Mom is part of the underworld

my guess is that's his play, If doflamingo is forced to fight with the entire underworld by his side, Big Mom might join in the battle with the odds in her favor of defeating Kaidou with all these new allies

and then Law's plan will get shot to shit when she opens that treasure box and that Bomb goes off

then they go from, having the entire underworld and another Yonkou at there side = Sure win
To, Having two Yonkou that utterly despise them = extremely fucked

and then of course Oda would do his magic and I won't even attempt to think that far ahead in Oda's brain

I'm not really convinced that Law's big move is to use Doflamingo to force various Brokers to team up and fight Kaido. Based on what he says to Doflamino when they're initially negotiating and on his actions at Green Bit, he seemed to be hoping for the Navy to interfere in the situation and, unless Law is confident he can take down an admiral, I don't see how he would expect Doflamingo to be free to direct his crew and various other brokers to fall in step with Law and Luffy. It's true that Law has stated that dealing with a Yonkou with a small number of people is impossible, but bolstering his forces in that manner seems like a really absurd plan. And not to mention, if Big Mam has brokers, chances are that Kaidou has a few as well and all it takes is one leak and Kaidou's aware of what's coming for him.

[Tainted Gene]

@Enlighten:

Fair enough you got me there. I honestly forgot that scene. I still think that thematically speaking depicting weakness in the case of those 2 fruits is hard and filled with potential pitfalls. And in that scene Chopper doesn't speak and there are no thought bubbles so I think my questions still stand. Though this is fairly off topic so I will drop this. I still think you haven't proved me wrong on this yet. Mind you if I'm proven wrong it would hardly be the first time.

To also be fair… in that panel we don't see the "middle part" where chopper unconscious and is pulled from the water. But in the anime episode, Chopper had a few seconds of consciousness and was remarking on not being able to help the Sky Knight and recognizing that Pierre was a DF user. So going by the anime (which many have argued is not canon and shouldn't be used for evidence in a manga discussion) Chopper was in full control of his facilities just before losing all his strength. He was thinking, he was rationalizing (Pierre thing), and he was still mental and physically the same person... just that he was losing strength.

But since this was in the anime... the value from this from a plot prospective is limited.

ps: As a manga reader and anime watcher of several shows... I have been of the opinion that though the anime has filler and filler-like content, it has credible ties to the manga since I believe the mangaka will sometimes "purposely" leave an easter egg within in the anime that may turn up later on in the manga.

[Monkey King]

@choperman:

but Dofla is the center king pin of all the Criminal underworld, all the brokers

Wow, you really don't understand the concept of the criminal underworld at all huh.

Remember when the strongest figure in the American mafia had an enemy? And due to being the strongest figure all the other criminal groups fell in line behind him to help him?
Yeah neither do I, because that's completely goddamn hilarious.

if you think of Luffy, Law and their crews fighting alone of course they'd lose
but if you add

What makes you think they're going to fight Kaidou themselves to bring him down? Or that this is part of the plan?

the Kid, Killer, Apoo, and Hawkings alliance
Doflamingo and his entire crew

Dofla's crew is not joining them loll.

plus the entire criminal underworld which seems to have people like CP9, Gecko Moria (at least he looks that way to me) and tons of other brokers we've only seen silhouettes of
and Big Mom is part of the underworld

And I repeat, you literally must have never heard of or read about criminal underworlds until One Piece because lolll
What the fuck do you think they are, an ethnic group?

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Tainted:

To also be fair… in that panel we don't see the "middle part" where chopper unconscious and is pulled from the water. But in the anime episode,

Wait a minute, why do we care about what happens in the anime? I'm pretty sure we don't!

Chopper had a few seconds of consciousness and was remarking on not being able to help the Sky Knight and recognizing that Pierre was a DF user. So going by the anime (which many have argued is not canon and shouldn't be used for evidence in a manga discussion)

Uh no, it's not a controversy. It's a fact. Anime is not canon. Don't use the anime to argue about the plot.

ps: As a manga reader and anime watcher of several shows… I have been of the opinion that though the anime has filler and filler-like content, it has credible ties to the manga since I believe the mangaka will sometimes "purposely" leave an easter egg within in the anime that may turn up later on in the manga.

That's a cute and worthless fantasy, thanks for sharing.
Maybe you could try to understand several things.
1. What canon is.
2. How the system of adaptation works.
3. Oda's involvement.

And seriously what the fuck kind of easter egg is that. Easter Eggs are things like the Kochi-Kame character showing up in Enies Lobby and Pandaman. Not random slightly confusing details that no one but overanalytical internet debaters would even care about.

[sonnet]

There will be a new chapter this week?

[Kornflayx]

Dude, it's in the opening post….

[sonnet]

Sorry, and thanks.
Actually I never read teh first page of every thread about chaptes and start from the second (usually it's with comments like "finally" or "I'll read it later" and so on)

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Tainted:

To also be fair… in that panel we don't see the "middle part" where chopper unconscious and is pulled from the water. But in the anime episode, Chopper had a few seconds of consciousness and was remarking on not being able to help the Sky Knight and recognizing that Pierre was a DF user. So going by the anime (which many have argued is not canon and shouldn't be used for evidence in a manga discussion) Chopper was in full control of his facilities just before losing all his strength. He was thinking, he was rationalizing (Pierre thing), and he was still mental and physically the same person… just that he was losing strength.

But since this was in the anime... the value from this from a plot prospective is limited.

ps: As a manga reader and anime watcher of several shows... I have been of the opinion that though the anime has filler and filler-like content, it has credible ties to the manga since I believe the mangaka will sometimes "purposely" leave an easter egg within in the anime that may turn up later on in the manga.

Even Oda said, sometimes the anime team adds/puts stuff he couldn't or have room to draw/put in the manga, so half the things people call non-canon is probably canon… Oh yeah in Viz last 2 weeks Oda mentioned he went to a party with the anime team so yeah he close to them.

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

@choperman:

Doflamingo and his crew alone could probably do nothing, but Dofla is the center king pin of all the Criminal underworld, all the brokers

if you think of Luffy, Law and their crews fighting alone of course they'd lose
but if you add

the Kid, Killer, Apoo, and Hawkings alliance
Doflamingo and his entire crew
plus the entire criminal underworld which seems to have people like CP9, Gecko Moria (at least he looks that way to me) and tons of other brokers we've only seen silhouettes of
and Big Mom is part of the underworld

my guess is that's his play, If doflamingo is forced to fight with the entire underworld by his side, Big Mom might join in the battle with the odds in her favor of defeating Kaidou with all these new allies

and then Law's plan will get shot to shit when she opens that treasure box and that Bomb goes off

then they go from, having the entire underworld and another Yonkou at there side = Sure win
To, Having two Yonkou that utterly despise them = extremely fucked

and then of course Oda would do his magic and I won't even attempt to think that far ahead in Oda's brain

Lmao I'm sure none of the brokers gives a damn about Dofla, if Dofla stops supplying em then just like Kaido might, the other brokers will try to pay Dofla back(as in beat him up) or erase him…. You might aswell add Fujitora as an ally.

[Monkey King]

@DARK_RITUAL:

Even Oda said, sometimes the anime team adds/puts stuff he couldn't or have room to draw/put in the manga, so half the things people call non-canon is probably canon… Oh yeah in Viz last 2 weeks Oda mentioned he went to a party with the anime team so yeah he close to them.

Oda is working nonstop unless on doctor's orders to make a weekly serial comic that's been going on for 11 years, and because he once or twice went to a company convention or party with voice actors, you think he has behind the scenes control over the major studio system adaptation beyond basic orders and occasional messages they send him about filler devil fruits. Like directorial and scripting control. Wow.
That's the dumbest thing I ever heard.

[knceng]

forgot where i read it, but it's said that oda only ask the anime team to consult him about DF they gonna use….

[darkmninya]

@knceng:

forgot where i read it, but it's said that oda only ask the anime team to consult him about DF they gonna use….

No, he gets asked more

[knceng]

@darkmninya:

No, he gets asked more

I read that a long time ago, I don't know about the new one, care to share?

[Monkey King]

@darkmninya:

No, he gets asked more

Such as down to the detail depictions of Chopper falling in water lolllll

RINGGG
"Oda-san, I know this is the three hundred and sixteenth time we've called today, but we just need to know precisely how long Chopper can retain conscious when falling in water!"

[Silverblade]

@Monkey:

a weekly serial comic that's been going on for 11 years

16 years.

@Monkey:

once or twice went to a party with voice actors

Oda does an annual takoyaki party with the anime voice actors. They seem to very good friends.

[Monkey King]

@Silverblade:

Oda does an annual takoyaki party with the anime voice actors. They seem to very good friends.

You misquoted me. Once or twice convention. Parties with voice actors meaning he shadow directs the anime is it's own absurdity no matter how many times.

[poque]

That Moment when you come back from vacation and still haven't read the actual chapter So, bye folks, I'm off reading it now.

[Quincyee]

Oda has stated in an SBS that all devil fruits originating from the anime team are screened through him first in case he is planning on using the filler fruit. Technically doesn't mean they're canon (the fruits). If anything it just means the fruits had no business in the canon originally. Maybe that's what he was talking about.

[Silverblade]

@Monkey:

You misquoted me. Once or twice convention. Parties with voice actors meaning he shadow directs the anime is it's own absurdity no matter how many times.

Just sharing trivia, not trying to argue an obviously ridiculous rumour.

[MasterKingJC]

It probably goes something like:

"Hey, Oda-san. Can we use this devil fruit in an upcoming filler arc?"

"Ummm, okay. Sure."

"Alright, bye."

The entire process probably takes less than 5 minutes.

[Monkey King]

@Silverblade:

Just sharing trivia, not trying to argue an obviously ridiculous rumour.

I know, I'm genuinely embarrassed on randomly putting 11 years lol.

[Hinscher]

There a holiday in Japan this week or something. I don't see anything today and usually there is a ton of manga to read for me when I wake up.

[Luis20]

@Hinscher:

There a holiday in Japan this week or something. I don't see anything today and usually there is a ton of manga to read for me when I wake up.

Yeah, it's Obon festival in Japan.

[apologized]

@Hinscher:

There a holiday in Japan this week or something. I don't see anything today and usually there is a ton of manga to read for me when I wake up.

it's OBON …...

[STP_PS]

Thank god we are having this break. Its giving me some time to find some hidden jewels among other manga.

[Tainted Gene]

@Monkey:

! Wait a minute, why do we care about what happens in the anime? I'm pretty sure we don't!
! Uh no, it's not a controversy. It's a fact. Anime is not canon. Don't use the anime to argue about the plot.
! That's a cute and worthless fantasy, thanks for sharing.
Maybe you could try to understand several things.
1. What canon is.
2. How the system of adaptation works.
3. Oda's involvement.
! And seriously what the fuck kind of easter egg is that. Easter Eggs are things like the Kochi-Kame character showing up in Enies Lobby and Pandaman. Not random slightly confusing details that no one but overanalytical internet debaters would even care about.

Then what you say then if for example, the events in the Rainbow Mist Arc are mirrored later on in the manga series when the events of the Ancient Kingdom/Void Century is revealed???? Basically, what if the WG did the same thing that the pirates in the Rainbow Mist Arc did….. that conquered and destroyed a city and THEN became its "legitimate" rulers.

The premise has already been practically spelled out giving the fact that the WG blanked out an entire century.

So if all this comes to fruition, are you going to be pissed off at Oda-san for going that route??? Because IF HE DOES (again I say IF) then it can be said that it was foreshadowed LONG ago and therefore makes sense. But if he doesn't go that route….FINE; I would love it no matter what direction he took the story. But to just completely shut your mind off to even a HINT of a possibility that there may be some chance of foreshadowing/Easter egg/etc. in the anime/filler is VERY closed minded.

Its like looking at a physically ill person and saying there is NO shot of him/her winning the race. Granted that is a fair assumption, giving the circumstances, but to completely and utterly refute the tiniest possibility that there may be SOME chance for the person to win is very small minded.

I am NOT saying the physically ill person is going to win the race…. I'm just saying to consider the possibility.

Every true strategist, from war to politics, ALWAYS considers EVERY possibility….. every account..... every option; no matter the odds.

"The general who wins the battle makes many calculations in his temple before the battle is fought. The general who loses makes but few calculations beforehand." - Sun Tzu

This doesn't even need to be taking literally, and I am not comparing going to battle to reading ONE Piece…. all I am saying is to be open minded. I think that is more than a reasonable enough opinion to have than to say "NO"

[Monkey King]

@Tainted:

Then what you say then if for example, the events in the Rainbow Mist Arc are mirrored later on in the manga series when the events of the Ancient Kingdom/Void Century is revealed????

I've never watched filler as I'm not really a masochist, you'll have to explain what the heck you're talking about.
And yeah I'm sure Oda leaked his biggest secrets to the staff for the purposes of that most worthless of things,filler.

Basically, what if the WG did the same thing that the pirates in the Rainbow Mist Arc did….. that conquered and destroyed a city and THEN became its "legitimate" rulers.

You mean….conquering and destroying something and then ruling it??? Wow! Surely that concept isn't as old as humankind and not braindead simple, and is soley introduced in a filler arc of the adaptation of a rubber pirate comic book!!!

No seriously, please tell me there's more to what you're saying than this.

The premise has already been practically spelled out giving the fact that the WG blanked out an entire century.

This premise is called History. You should have learned about it in school.

So if all this comes to fruition, are you going to be pissed off at Oda-san for going that route??? Because IF HE DOES (again I say IF) then it can be said that it was foreshadowed LONG ago and therefore makes sense.

How the fuck is that foreshadowing. It's an incredibly vanilla concept. With the vaguest of non-connections. You see it fucking everywhere aside from History. Hell it was the central plot of Star Wars. The old good government was destroyed by the bad people, who now RULE the same place!
Clover basically already even told us this was the case, so why are you talking in future tense.

But to just completely shut your mind off to even a HINT of a possibility that there may be some chance of foreshadowing/Easter egg/etc. in the anime/filler is VERY closed minded.

Close minded could also refer to being utterly clueless about the entire studio animation process.

Also save the ridiculously stupid metaphors for a time when you've brought a halfway good potential example up and not retarded crap about Chopper drowning and ancient concepts of rule transfer.

[Tainted Gene]

@Monkey:

! I've never watched filler as I'm not really a masochist, you'll have to explain what the heck you're talking about.
And yeah I'm sure Oda leaked his biggest secrets to the staff for the purposes of that most worthless of things,filler.
! You mean….conquering and destroying something and then ruling it??? Wow! Surely that concept isn't as old as humankind and not braindead simple, and is soley introduced in a filler arc of the adaptation of a rubber pirate comic book!!!
! No seriously, please tell me there's more to what you're saying than this.
! This premise is called History. You should have learned about it in school.
! How the fuck is that foreshadowing. It's an incredibly vanilla concept. With the vaguest of non-connections. You see it fucking everywhere aside from History. Hell it was the central plot of Star Wars. The old good government was destroyed by the bad people, who now RULE the same place!
Clover basically already even told us this was the case, so why are you talking in future tense.
! Close minded could also refer to being utterly clueless about the entire studio animation process.
! Also save the ridiculously stupid metaphors for a time when you've brought a halfway good potential example up and not retarded crap about Chopper drowning and ancient concepts of rule transfer.

Nice insults….. very commendable.

I already mentioned that I only see the possibilities in all things... racial, religious opinions, gender, politics, etc. I WON'T just shut down the other side because I think he/she/they are wrong. Further... I already acknowledged that this example or any example that makes ties to the anime as evidence is NOT strong enough for manga debate; I even stated that in my earlier posts to Enlighten in our Chopper discussion. I didn't impose my WILL on him and belittled his opinion/theory/concepts on the series.

I have little faith that the Void Century is going to follow a "vanilla" concept.... I am not arrogant enough to assume I know Oda-san's mind. I expect for him to have a complex and very intricate plot that ties so many things from the beginning of the story all the way to the end. So I myself admit that the "vanilla" concept of the Void Century is unlikely.

BUT

I won't shut my mind off to that "vanilla" concept or any other concept just because I (or others) happen to think its completely wrong. Seeing the possibility in something is NOT a bad thing.... no matter the case.

[wolfwood]

The anime filler is so unbelivably cruddy that i refuse to believe Oda was ever anywhere near it

If he was it should've improved by sheer proximity

[Monkey King]

@Tainted:

Nice insults….. very commendable.

I already mentioned that I only see the possibilities in all things… racial, religious opinions, gender, politics, etc. I WON'T just shut down the other side because I think he/she/they are wrong.

Wow, how commendable. A guy who WON'T shut down a neo-nazi calling black people animals. A hero for our times.

You know, you had the …"moral" upper hand before, not that I cared. But bringing up things like these and talking about what a chill dude you are to consider the feelings of racists and sexists and what have you just makes me look good. Don't know how you managed that.

Further… I already acknowledged that this example or any example that makes ties to the anime as evidence is NOT strong enough for manga debate; I even stated that in my earlier posts to Enlighten in our Chopper discussion. I didn't impose my WILL on him and belittled his opinion/theory/concepts on the series.

How exactly am I imposing my will on you lol.

I won't shut my mind off that that "vanilla" concept or any other concept just because I (or others) happen to think its completely wrong. Seeing the possibility in something is NOT a bad thing…. no matter the case.

At some point, you get nowhere unless you commit to something.
And no I would definitely say seeing the possibility that other races are inferior beings is a bad thing.

[Tainted Gene]

@Monkey:

Wow, how commendable. A guy who WON'T shut down a neo-nazi calling black people animals. A hero for our times.

You know, you had the …"moral" upper hand before, not that I cared. But bringing up things like these and talking about what a chill dude you are to consider the feelings of racists and sexists and what have you just makes me look good. Don't know how you managed that.

How exactly am I imposing my will on you lol.

At some point, you get nowhere unless you commit to something.
And no I would definitely say seeing the possibility that other races are inferior beings is a bad thing.

lol

nice way to turn a phrase.

I am not taking any moral ground that needs (or even deserves) to be praised…. I just posted my OWN opinion on the matter of manga and anime relations. ONE Piece is a complex story. It has readers all over the world reading, analyzing and finding different ways to interpret the events depicted in the story.

People are going to have opinons, predictions, and assumptions on the story Oda-san has been so kind enough to share with us. Some theories are going to be wrong, some predictions are going to be on the money..... others will fall flat.

But its only fair to take in ALL the opinions and read/see them for there own merits and not compared to our respective "ideals" on what a story/plot should be.

Oda-san is unpredictable... so any attempt to understand the end result of all of it (the story) is already a daunting task.

But it doesn't mean we should stop doing it. Hence the existence of this and MANY other forums across the world/internet/etc.

[Smiley]

I miss Smiley.
So how many chapters do you think the Caribou cover story can go?(I'm still tired of him)

[valiantt]

@Tainted:

Oda-san is unpredictable… so any attempt to understand the end result of all of it (the story) is already a daunting task.

I swear…every time someone says this, Nami's breasts get bigger.

[wolfwood]

It would be nice if every instance of -san would automatically be changed to mr or sir

And every post valiant made was inexplicably linked to some sort of fluffy pet

[STP_PS]

@valiantt:

I swear…every time someone says this, Nami's breasts get bigger.

Why valiantt…. WHY.. sob... did you take the pomeranian away:cwy::cwy:.

! BRING IT BACK PWEASE!!!

[Slack]

@wolfwoof:

The anime filler is so unbelivably cruddy that i refuse to believe Oda was ever anywhere near it

If he was it should've improved by sheer proximity

I used to think this way but the exception is the G-8 filler arc. It's so surprisingly good I feel like it has to be a scrapped story line. It's really tense and has the one piece feel. Personally I think it would be much better if it were canon and replaced the god awful foxy arc.

[Unrequited]

Hody having an anime backstory in which he's attacked by humans shows how far removed Oda is from the show.

[WarshipArc]

Are you serious?
Toei actually did that!?

[apologized]

@Smiley:

I miss Smiley.
So how many chapters do you think the Caribou cover story can go?(I'm still tired of him)

i think it's ended last week

[Jawad5]

@valiantt:

I swear…every time someone says this, Nami's breasts get bigger.

she might use her new found powers to repel canon balls, luffy get out!

[DARK_RITUAL]

Trying to argue is pointless, I'm 100% sure I read somewhere Oda let's the anime team add stuff he couldn't draw in a chapter. I forgotten where from but if Sandman was here he probably knows, he knows most this Info's.

[Game And Guy]

I haven't visited this forum much for the past few days.

And I return to a circle-jerk.

Good to be back.

@apologized:

i think it's ended last week

…no it didn't?

First of all no Cover Story so far ended on a note like that.

And secondly all Cover Stories end with a "Final Volume." Never has a cover story ended without referring to it as the final one.

[Greenmane]

@Monkey:

Oda is working nonstop unless on doctor's orders to make a weekly serial comic that's been going on for 11 years, and because he once or twice went to a company convention or party with voice actors, you think he has behind the scenes control over the major studio system adaptation beyond basic orders and occasional messages they send him about filler devil fruits. Like directorial and scripting control. Wow.
That's the dumbest thing I ever heard.

well… considering the fact that there was a scene in film Z that showed how usopp actually keeps growing pop greens (which Oda confirmes is cannon in SBS 68) i'd say that he does have influence over things in the anime and movies.

proving that there are some things(easter eggs) that oda can't fit in the manga that he chooses to show in animated form.

[STP_PS]

@Jawad5:

she might use her new found powers to repel canon balls, luffy get out!

nami nami no Bouncing boobs!!!:wub:

[Shadowgreed]

You people had a clown around here but good everything is over now and what's up with people changing fonts and making them size 1

[Densuke]

@Greenmane:

well… considering the fact that there was a scene in film Z that showed how usopp actually keeps growing pop greens (which Oda confirmes is cannon in SBS 68) i'd say that he does have influence over things in the anime and movies.

proving that there are some things(easter eggs) that oda can't fit in the manga that he chooses to show in animated form.

Of course he has influence over it, it's his series. But that doesn't mean he does anything more than consult on a few things when needed, unlike Film Z where he was actually quite involved.

[knceng]

@Unrequited:

Hody having an anime backstory in which he's attacked by humans shows how far removed Oda is from the show.

really? they made hody got the reason for his unreasonable bottomless hatred?

[kevo_koma]

@Maromi:

know this dude got banned but was he trying to be a cliche anime villain or some shit?

I think he was trying to go for some kind of gimmick account. Where he'd be whatever it was he was trying to do. The best example I can come up with is a wrestling persona where he would be a heel or something.

[Taco]

@400MillionBelis:

I haven't visited this forum much for the past few days.

And I return to a circle-jerk.

Good to be back.

…no it didn't?

First of all no Cover Story so far ended on a note like that.

And secondly all Cover Stories end with a "Final Volume." Never has a cover story ended without referring to it as the final one.

Speaking of the cover stories, I hope the next one we get one that doesn't involve a fodder character as the main role.

Anyone remember the Ace's Great Blackbeard Search one? That was actually fun watching the progression, clearly the best IMHO.

[kevo_koma]

@Enlighten:

I see you your question and raise you another. What would happen if Brook gets tied with sea stone or falls into the sea? Does he just get weak or does he ascend to the great amphitheater in the sky? Does Chopper lose his intelligence if tied with sea stone cuffs? I personally think Oda purposefully avoids these situations and we will never get an answer. Your questions included. Let's hope I'm wrong because I'd love to know.

When Luffy was thrown into the lake in arlong park, Nojiko was still able to stretch his neck so that he could breath. So Brook would still be alive and Chopper would still have human traits but they wouldn't be able to do anything until they slowly drowned to death.

Which actually raises an interesting question. Why isn't CC using his abilities weakened as they are, especially the suffocating trick to make a break for it. Plus he's been pretty spry, especially if we consider that Luffy always seemed to nearly pass out whenever he came into contact with the things. Oda perhaps forgeting?

Hmm, You raise a good point about Blackbeard being far too dangerous to Brook and Chopper. As to Fishman Island the water levels were a total mess. But if I remember correctly Brook was never fully submerged. As to Luffy stretching underwater either passively or when partially submerged. That is precisely my point with Luffy's fruit depicting loss of control would be easy. It would be much harder with Chopper and Brook where their respective fruits affect their personality and very being. It's just the kind of thing that creates plot holes and inconsistencies. If I were writing the story I would, perhaps cowardly, avoid it at all costs. That doesn't say much about what Oda would do. And I have given this much thought so I'm definitely interested but I have resigned myself to probably never knowing. Both Chopper and Brook have been fully submerged and rescued but always off screen. I hate to make such a bold statement since this is quite a long manga but I don't think they were ever shown in the actual act of drowning. Even in Enies Lobby Chopper was already unconscious when they were in the tunnel and saved by Kokoro and it was a gag that he was affected by her … looks.

Luffy doesn't lose control of his ability, he simply becomes extremely weakened to the point where he can't move a muscle. I'm assuming the same thing happens to every other Devil fruit user, except apparently CC.

So when Brook or Chopper fall into the ocean or whatever, they'll simply become weak and pass out. The sea will not take away their ability and therefore Brook will still be alive and Chopper will still be human just passed out and soon to be dead

[Kingdomkey]

@Smiley:

I miss Smiley.
So how many chapters do you think the Caribou cover story can go?(I'm still tired of him)

My guess would be 5-10 more installments.

[Enlighten]

@kevo_koma:

When Luffy was thrown into the lake in arlong park, Nojiko was still able to stretch his neck so that he could breath. So Brook would still be alive and Chopper would still have human traits but they wouldn't be able to do anything until they slowly drowned to death.

Which actually raises an interesting question. Why isn't CC using his abilities weakened as they are, especially the suffocating trick to make a break for it. Plus he's been pretty spry, especially if we consider that Luffy always seemed to nearly pass out whenever he came into contact with the things. Oda perhaps forgeting?

Luffy doesn't lose control of his ability, he simply becomes extremely weakened to the point where he can't move a muscle. I'm assuming the same thing happens to every other Devil fruit user, except apparently CC.

So when Brook or Chopper fall into the ocean or whatever, they'll simply become weak and pass out. The sea will not take away their ability and therefore Brook will still be alive and Chopper will still be human just passed out and soon to be dead

Common, I just said I'm dropping this topic and you're not raising any new points. Let this topic die peacefully. A few guys got their asses kicked over a mere musing of mine. I kinda feel responsible.