Greg, you are in good form this morning, must have had a good night sleep
Last Two Nakamates (vol. 5)
-
-
Well, knowing already 2005 that Enel was heading for the moon it wasn`t that far fetched to think about something outer space.
-
Nobody really gets anything out of it ultimately beyond entertainment. So if my opponent wants to make up bullshit and act stupid, I don't care. In fact, I find it far more entertaining when they do. It gives me more to make fun of, and it's honestly funny to see how absurd people get
I think this is the sadist Kaizoku-Fansub board approach.
Our approach is more, if you're going to be a wanker go back to the kid's table or grow up.
Well, knowing already 2005 that Enel was heading for the moon it wasn`t that far fetched to think about something outer space.
At the time few people thought that he would ever make it and that the entire moon thing was to show how fucking crazy in the head he was. And as it turns out, the bastard was right.
Even manga physics accounted for, escape velocity in a floating broken pile of boards that travels as fast as a horse and carriage is a bitch.
-
AGOG, you make AP fun again. Thankyou.
Say what you will about the guy, he produced more pages of discussion in a few hours than the entire 3 weeks before it.
That's some serious star-power right there. Namely infamy.
UsoppSpell!
On the eve of spoilerificaiton, you will wait until you remember it's break week.
-
Saying it could happen because its possible is an idiotic arguement. Oda could go into an arc where Akainu becomes a pirate, or make Dragon end up joining the world government if he wanted. So both of those are technically possible as well. However, being possible and being likely are two ENTIRELY different things, and the chances of those things happening is near 0. An arguement on fiction like this needs to be about what is likely, not what is possible
You crave attention, so here it be…
[hide]
Argument is spelled this way, heed my advice well.So, according to your establishment, saying that "x" could happen is an idiotic argument… Therefore, all the things you call "theory" and shit like that instantly turns idiotic. All the shit you call "religion" instantly turns idiotic. Frankly speaking, a theory of you even being smart is also idiotic...
Simple things like time will tell >> idiotic.
Answers will grow >> idiotic.
Life will evolve >> idiotic.
There could be life elsewhere >> idiotic.
Man can land on moon >> idiotic.
A generation can pass >> idiotic.
An underdog can win >> idiotic.If you cannot see how fucking idiotic your statement is, where you come to assume that something being "possible" becomes impossible, then pray that one day some facility takes the time to educate your redundancies...
Well, let's continue and apply the "likely" statement.
Here's what we can already call fact... Perona is with Zoro (now) and in the future it is likely for Zoro to want to return to his crew... Preposition A: IS IT LIKELY FOR PERONA TO FOLLOW ZORO, as an expert in navigation? PREPOSITION B: Zoro needs no help. PREPOSITION C: Mihawk will instead help, leaving Perona's whereabouts unimportant... PREPOSITION D: question is not relevant.
Which is the likeliest of them all?
A: the plot device figure heading off to do what she's expected to do?
B: a left-field blast that has him learning how to navigate out of the blue?
C: the loner offering his help?
D: the retarded, yet least attractive choice?I placed my bets on the first preposition because it was and has been the one that is longest running, and the most meaningful one.
[NOTE: Forgive me for excluding the Zoro + Mihawk + Perona choice, I have my reasons…]
If you selected "A" too, then you'll have a situation where she is now in a likely confrontation with the rest of the crew, again. What will happen next?
A: nothing.
B: they talk and interact.
C: she falls out of the panel as the manga transforms from one panel to the next…
D: no comment.Again, when a character is brought into play (again), chances are likely to support that this character will talk to the other people... Especially when other options are as the ones up above.
Given that, the conversation can go in many different directions... Such as, she could befriend them. She could start some new conflict and become an antagonist once again, or even the idea that she could literally do something ELSE!!
What would be the point to re-introduce her as an antagonist once again after such a long absence? Therefore, I'd say that it would be obvious that she'd do a "Vivi" routine where she was once an enemy and the next a friend... A Robin routine/ Laki/ Heso girl from Skypiea with Shuu as her pet [name isn't coming to mind anymore…]/ etc.
So, if you are following, the likelihood of her being the tour-guide that Zoro needs could work in favor of helping establish a friendship between the SH crew and her delicate self. This would then lead to other results:
-The location that Perona will end up at,
-What she will be to the story,
-A closure to her significance up to that point in time,Once she gets on the ship, which is what they plan on doing when they get to SA, she'll be moved forward in the plan, next to them… This is also a likely chance because of the significance of her "personal belongings" that were left on the ship-- why were they left there?
If they are likely there to assist in Perona becoming a traveling companion and a comrade to the crew like Vivi was, then it would stand "complete" and likely... If not, then Perona would have had a different purpose completely, and that money will have a different significance. Nonetheless, this is all hypothetical on the likeliness of what significance Perona has to the story, and what her actions represent. If it is true, then Oda would have planned this whole entire introduction from the get-go...
However, there are other options that could come:
-Mihawk takes Zoro and Perona.This would change things to the point that the reader couldn't answer it with absolution because the reader would leave doubt, no matter...
Let's continue further,
Regardless of what you believe, the issue remains the same even though there is a time-skip; Zoro will naturally need help returning to his crew. Who will encompass him on his travels?
Two known solutions are there: Perona or Mihawk.
Many possibilities: Baboon figures out how to follow a paper, Zoro figures out how to follow a paper, Unknown character rescues the day, it is ignored like how Boa Hancock's snake lacked any reasoning or the other fishy examples in the manga.The things that are likely, though, remain the strong two points: Perona or Mihawk will assist him.
Who wins in the end?
Mihawk hates other people, courtesy of being a loner... Mihawk thinks of him as a potential rival, equal. So on and so on...
Perona isn't a native of this place, at all... She doesn't live her, at all... She doesn't belong here, at all... Etc.
The likely solution is that she who doesn't live here must go... So, we've got a likely solution to base things off of: Perona will help Zoro.
What is likely to happen after this? They have to arrive on SA, it is unlikely that they stop anywhere else because the directional/navigational device they will use doesn't point in that direction, whatsoever... Therefore, it is likely they'll reach SA in two weeks, tops.
Where will they go? This is where different opinions can exist... Perona can disembark and follow her own path, especially now that she made it to see civilization... Perona can follow Zoro. Which one is most likely? You tell me... Both "Could" happen equally, because, he's a wanted criminal and she's not... Chances are he'll need her assistance. [I'm not being factual in my casual saying that she lacks a bounty… Don't push this moot point, though.]
Therefore, she could enter into the above mentioned situation; she could face a confrontation with the Strawhat Crew… Would that be likely? Probable, yes but "likely" isn't definite.
What we have now is a stopping point because the manga doesn't have information to go beyond this: a dead end occurs. The things that are "likely" from here on, depend entirely on personal taste, not supported by the manga.
Let's not stop here... For example, Luffy will need a travel fare from his current location to Amazon Lilly's Calm Belt... This is fact. Kuja can do it in about a week, that's also a fact. Therefore, it is likely that these two will work together to reach the destination Luffy must reach... Because of the lack of a better way approach. This brings up a new situation: Hancock could meet crew, so on and so on.
What I'm getting at is that it would ultimately bring up a rowdy reunion, full of several faces... Perona is likely to be present like all the other characters are...
So, we would then think rationally, which character would be most likely to join of all of them?
Chances are, Hancock wouldn't be able to join due to her island's condition... Yes, that's the likeliest of her episode. Other characters act the same way... Then we have Perona which is likely to travel with them because the place she ends up at isn't where she "expects" to find closure. Likely situation is the treasure and belongings will be used to assist in convincing her to come aboard.
Is it likely for her to "want" her stuff that she left on their ship? Maybe... Is it likely that if she were to go that far, and see those things there, she'd decide to board on their ship? Maybe... Then, the opposition would reflect that the crew would say "no" to her; which is likely now: "her helping Zoro being a fare ticket to 'x' island" or "her being rejected and left without closure on the side?"
I'd say the latter because people from Impel Down that returned gained something from being rescued...
We are this far, right... So, let's think of what happened at ID...
People that came from there ended up fighting in the war, changing the world... They did something again.Right?
Perona was removed from plot, and is now able to come back, [which we assume is likely]… Will she be thrown to the side, and left there? Let's cite Galdino for a second, he was thrown on the side, but he wasn't left there--he appeared in the future on Buggy's crew. Mr. 1, he too followed the same situation, where he was left on the side then appeared in a different place much later.
Will Perona be left on SA just to appear much much later elsewhere with the character that she was left with? Hmmm... We've got Shakky, retired pirate. We've got Rayleigh, retired too. Then, we've got Flying Fish Riders and other minor characters...
The most likely characters to appear again would be the main cast, without any doubt... That same cast has her shit and its likely she may see it again... Furthermore, the likelihood of them finding "Moria" is fairly high in the future--which just contributes to this temporary journey becoming likely.
Do you disagree about the likeliness of this idea?
[/hide] -
AGOG, you make AP fun again. Thankyou.
Say what you will about the guy, he produced more pages of discussion in a few hours than the entire 3 weeks before it.
That's some serious star-power right there. Namely infamy.
He'll be gone later though.
And where will we be without him?
-
Discussing again and again the same stuff in an endless 5page repeat-spiral is sure an adventure on its own which keeps everyone entertained here.
-
Thats because the only time she appeared was when shit was getting fucked up,that and we barely knew anything about her.
Robin will never have a huge huge figth. She's the smart one of the group. She won't simply punch the lights out of a major enemy, she will use a skills and brain to defeat some of the enemies and support the rest of the crew.
Her job in the crew is to ultimatly get to Raftel, read the True History in the final poneglyph, understand what's wrong with the world and how it should be and start a motherfucking world revolution! -
I think this is the sadist Kaizoku-Fansub board approach.
Our approach is more, if you're going to be a wanker go back to the kid's table or grow up.
At the time few people thought that he would ever make it and that the entire moon thing was to show how fucking crazy in the head he was. And as it turns out, the bastard was right.
Even manga physics accounted for, escape velocity in a floating broken pile of boards that travels as fast as a horse and carriage is a bitch.
Wasn't there an interview that said Oda would never introduce a mode of travel that surpassed a ship, as in water vessel…?
I think that it existed before Eneru's arc was around, too. I could be wrong, though.
-
AGOG… You really have nothing else to do, right?
7hours of crap...
"Unicorns can't see into your heart. All our dumb horns can do is glow, point towards the nearest rainbow and play rave music!"
Visit my Etsy Shop: Heart'n'Skull or Tumblr
-
I think this will come in handy:
-
So, according to your establishment, saying that "x" could happen is an idiotic argument… Therefore, all the things you call "theory" and shit like that instantly turns idiotic. All the shit you call "religion" instantly turns idiotic. Frankly speaking, a theory of you even being smart is also idiotic...
Simple things like time will tell >> idiotic.
Answers will grow >> idiotic.
Life will evolve >> idiotic.
There could be life elsewhere >> idiotic.
Man can land on moon >> idiotic.
A generation can pass >> idiotic.
An underdog can win >> idiotic.If you cannot see how fucking idiotic your statement is, where you come to assume that something being "possible" becomes impossible, then pray that one day some facility takes the time to educate your redundancies...
Saying "Anything is possible" or even "This specific event is possible" is an idiotic argument, because it has no substance. "It could happen because it is possible" (which is what you quoted in your last post) is a tautology: all it says is that a possible event is possible. All of the examples you cite are different, not just because they contain assertions that amount to something, but because the arguments for them are common knowledge:
Time will tell and answers will grow, because we will have more information as time progresses.
Life will evolve, because we have evidence that it has done so previously.
There could be life elsewhere, because there are a gigantic number of planets, some of which certainly must have the physical/chemical prerequisites for life to evolve (if we're just playing the odds here).
Etc.Arguments need reasons. You seem to have plenty. Why not in this instance?When someone says, "Saying 'Anything is possible' is an idiotic argument," they're also saying, "Show us what your reasons are for thinking what you do." They're saying, "Show us why you think this possibility is more likely than any other." In this specific instance, they're asking:
Why would you prefer the explanation that Perona is a good soul corrupted by bad company who lied about her aspirations, collected zombie pets for some ulterior motive and hid her true innocence, to the simpler explanation that Perona was exactly as shallow and bad as she seemed? Is there any particular foreshadowing you'd like to point out? Is there some glimpse of her true character that's easy to miss? -
Wasn't there an interview that said Oda would never introduce a mode of travel that surpassed a ship, as in water vessel…?
I think that it existed before Eneru's arc was around, too. I could be wrong, though.
I remember him saying something about characters gaining the ability to fly because that would defeat the purpose of sailing from island to island having adventures.
Of course every rules has exceptions but that has little efect on the overall concept of the story.
-
Robin will never have a huge huge figth. She's the smart one of the group. She won't simply punch the lights out of a major enemy, she will use a skills and brain to defeat some of the enemies and support the rest of the crew.
Her job in the crew is to ultimatly get to Raftel, read the True History in the final poneglyph, understand what's wrong with the world and how it should be and start a motherfucking world revolution!This confuses me on two different levels
1.)If you say her place in the crew is not as a fighter than why are you complaining about her being nerfed?
2.)Why are you asking this in the Next Crewmate topic?
-
I don't know what I can't wait for more.. the chapter or bathing in AGOG's tears.
-
This confuses me on two different levels
1.)If you say her place in the crew is not as a fighter than why are you complaining about her being nerfed?
2.)Why are you asking this in the Next Crewmate topic?
I didn't complain or asked anything. I saw a discussion betwen you and another member, felt I had something relevant to say/add and jumped in.
-
2.)Why are you asking this in the Next Crewmate topic?
Because all the strawhats are essentially becoming new people
-
I didn't complain or asked anything. I saw a discussion betwen you and another member, felt I had something relevant to say/add and jumped in.
I mistook you for Crawl, the guy who actually did accuse Robin of being nerfed. That was my mistake and I apologise.
Because all the strawhats are essentially becoming new people
:getlost:…
-
Perona is a navigator now? You said yourself she doesn't know where she is. Navigating the oceans is hard in real life even when you know where you are. Now navigating the grandline is even harder. What makes you think Perona can reasonably do it? Honestly, I do think MIhawk is a better bet for getting Zoro back. Especially since he navigates the grandline by himself, so he must have some way of assuring his safety and direction since I don't think he just floats about aimlessly. And I find your reasoning to be highly flawed. Loner does not necessarily mean he hates people. If he hates people, why would he be training Zoro, who wants to use that training to defeat him? He also seems to have some sort of friendship with Shanks, to the point that he'd seek him out to show him Luffy's bounty. Plus, taking Zoro back would allow for more training while they sail. He also shows a lot of interest in Zoro and Luffy, such as when he went to a meeting solely because the Strawhats were on the agenda of what was being talked about.
-
He'll be gone later though.
And where will we be without him?
I don't know what I can't wait for more.. the chapter or bathing in AGOG's tears.
Slowly, gradually, I'm starting to hope that Perona joins against all odds.
Even if it´s just a tease, like that she sails on the ship just once, I would like to bathe in the mountains of butthurt it would produce. Those would be glorious weeks, even if it turns out that she doesn´t. Even though she won't.
In the immortal words of P. McCartney, Let it be.
-
Yeah.. that was pretty harsh. I'm just going to ignore it and pretend it never happened.
!
-
Why would you prefer the explanation that Perona is a good soul corrupted by bad company who lied about her aspirations, collected zombie pets for some ulterior motive and hid her true innocence, to the simpler explanation that Perona was exactly as shallow and bad as she seemed? Is there any particular foreshadowing you'd like to point out? Is there some glimpse of her true character that's easy to miss?
[hide]1: For one, my stance is to elaborate upon the idea that her character is likely to become a temporary crewmember, then, eventually, take the oath of being a full, permanent crewmember. Prior to the existence of the "length" concerning the time-skip, this was relatively simple. Upon revealing the length of the time-skip, it became a different matter: urgency and the suspense concerning the crew was lost.
In order to convince the naysayers that she "could" be a better person than others make her out to be because of the relative absence of her pre-Thriller Bark past. Given that, the answer as to why she became a child into someone that twisted ought to be found when such a thing is exposed to the public. Her homeland before she met Moria ought to be revealed to… Her history, same as her homeland. Practically everything unknown could be revealed to fully explain her character, completely. She would then become a "complete" detailed character.
A possibility is that she changed when she stood with a villain, yes. Another, she just found her natural roots. Dialogue found in the text could help to explain this better, like the few instances where her character says something comedic that elaborates on a more purely base than what a villain would say. In other words, before she met Moria, she wasn't all that bad because she shows that there is a heart inside of her through the way that she acts. Encouragement, medical assistance, and honestly some of the dialogue she was given supports this thought.
Is it likely her character is a misguided individual, you tell me.
2:
Her aspirations are only able to be true when she's coupled with Moria. Other than that, her aspirations are unlikely to even come to mind. People that traveled with Moria aspire to do things that would be a benefit of helping him accomplish his own goal. For Perona, I argue that what she means [as a misguided individual] is not to find a group of servants to obey her forever that is cute [not animal like which you stated, the condition was only "cute" and nothing concerning just animals.] but to gain something that she lacked within the void that we label her backstory as. The time of which she lived before she joined Moria's group is a time where she must have had something happen to her which would spark her to wish for the "cute zombie" brigade. Similar to how Hogback joined on account of the thought that he could bring Cindy back.She would too have to have a reason to ask Moria for "cute things turned into zombies" otherwise her character is shallow, and probably the most shallow of every other character in the manga–which is rather harsh. The author gave other characters closures that only had minor appearances in the story, completely not at the same length that her character managed to accumulate. Would he just end her story that far, and discard her? Or would he do her the same justice that he had done to the other characters?
3:
People haven't defined her character, and often dismiss her as a shallow character without any future... She was sent packing one day, then reappeared awhile later-- was that her acting shallow? We discovered new things about her, and those things have yet to be explained fully... Will Oda leave them like that, or will he continue to use her further, as he has by bringing into Zoro's storyline?When you say, "keep it simple" you basically suggest that her "mysterious past" is not important... Her origin cannot add anything to the plot, whatsoever. You eliminate her from not only getting that extra development that characters like Kalifia got, or characters like Ms. Valentine earned. It would be of similar practice to just leave Bonney there, and have her fade, forever. Will that too be done because it is "simple" and what shallow characters deserve? Bonney is also a shallow, one-dimensional character at this stage. Is she doomed to remain that?
I say "no" because I've seen Oda add on more information about other characters, despite those characters already losing their "usefulness" to the current plot. A big example is Hatchi, who managed to recreate purpose much, much later. If he hadn't been given any information, or his backstory, Rayleigh wouldn't have given the Strawhats a chance to "skip" billing, or god forbid the whole service anyway.
What example says that Perona is immune to some spectacle like this "side-character" was able to earn? Her presence doesn't eliminate the chance of such an event happening, similar to how Hatchi's wasn't diminished all because he was there. Doesn't it help her chances since she's still there, able to play a factor, whether it is small or large?
My question is where do you hold evidence to just blatantly say that the idea which suggests she, a minor character that was introduced to help Zoro, could not continue doing what she was introduced for the future to come?
[/hide]Perona is a navigator now?
When did I say that?
You said yourself she doesn't know where she is. Navigating the oceans is hard in real life even when you know where you are.
Umm, following a single direction to a certain location [what the VIVRE CARD does] does not sound wrong when you look at what Perona did to find the Straw Hat Crew, or find her fucking room/ their ship/ etc. A simple ability, which was even shown recently: find out where Zoro landed.
I'm not asking her to magically take Nami's place, just suggesting she can follow directions that a paper constantly points at– sort of like a compass.
Now navigating the grandline is even harder. What makes you think Perona can reasonably do it?
She did it many times, really…
Honestly, I do think MIhawk is a better bet for getting Zoro back.
I think they are both equally skilled at what Zoro isn't. Therefore, they could both do the same thing, but she'd be more efficient at it due to her "AP FORM" and its ability to not rely on humanly sleep, food, etc.
Especially since he navigates the grandline by himself, so he must have some way of assuring his safety and direction since I don't think he just floats about aimlessly.
Alright. He does all that as a loner though.
And I find your reasoning to be highly flawed. Loner does not necessarily mean he hates people.
You are right, loner just means he prefers to have the company of himself over the company of others; making him more so a social reject than a people-hater. Honestly, not the point…
If he hates people, why would he be training Zoro, who wants to use that training to defeat him?
For amusement maybe…
He also seems to have some sort of friendship with Shanks, to the point that he'd seek him out to show him Luffy's bounty. Plus, taking Zoro back would allow for more training while they sail.
Wouldn't he give up on Zoro after that long rather than continue helping him?
He also shows a lot of interest in Zoro and Luffy, such as when he went to a meeting solely because the Strawhats were on the agenda of what was being talked about.
That doesn't discredit the "loner" part, nor does it change much of anything… He's still a loner.
I did ask you questions, many of them, so where are the answers to them...
-
This post is deleted!
-
Yeah.. that was pretty harsh. I'm just going to ignore it and pretend it never happened.
HAHAHAHARHARHAR COUGHCOUGHHAR HAR HAR COUGH …COUGH COUGH
horohorohorohoro…...
-
When has Perona navigated on the grand line? Also, to me it often seems like much of Zoro's bad sense of direction comes from misunderstanding how they work, or anime filler (though that part could be wrong given there are many parts of the series I never read in the manga, so I may have missed some examples). If following where a piece of paper points is all it takes, I'd argue even Zoro is smart enough to be able to keep track of where he's going. It's a simple visual cue that he can always and easily check on.
-
Is that the only motive, or is it like how Nami wanted MONEY [so to speak, as others believed, or the treasure that she'd get…]. What I mean is that you shouldn't judge a character that could have a potential backstory which changes things, from what we "think" they would be.
I think Heracles has a potential backstory. He's the long lost son of Kaidou.
Plus, there's other interesting ways to dismiss that whole conversation.
:happy:
Well, there's OTHER WAYS of reading things
:happy:…
For instance, the RAW approach where you incorrectly examine words and relate them to characters, false on false… Then, the other approach where you can review what coward is and what coward does, then explore deeper into what Perona is feeling at the time that she "ran from there" like she did-- then expand upon the wording the manga used, and take it for what it is, not what you interpret it as...
:happy:
This would define her character as anything but a coward, however, we wouldn't get an answer of her, except that she's just not a coward.
I mean, clearly, CLEARLY, Perona isn't a coward. How could I have not seen that. I'm so foolish. Clearly, abandoning the man who provided you with everything due to the first sign of danger is clearly not cowardice rather a WILL TO LIVE. CLEARLY.
-
Wasn't there an interview that said Oda would never introduce a mode of travel that surpassed a ship, as in water vessel…?
I have nothing against AGOG. There's no spite or anything. It actually reminds me of my early DBZ days when I endlessly and seriously argued boring shit like which Buu was strongest.
But with this, AGOG has just reminded me of what the correct quote he was attempting to bring up was and in one swift blow, has detsroyed any possibility for Perona to join.
The quote may be found on Destination Paradise and it was that no character would fly. Oda bent his rule with having a villain that could fly.
But folks, what can Perona do?
RIP.
-
It actually reminds me of my early DBZ days when I endlessly and seriously argued boring shit like which Buu was strongest.
Was the Buu who already absorbed Gohan,Gotenks and Piccolo the strongest? Just checking because I didn't get finish DBZ. I only found out how the Buu saga ended in a video game(DBZ Budokai)
-
I have nothing against AGOG. There's no spite or anything. It actually reminds me of my early DBZ days when I endlessly and seriously argued boring shit like which Buu was strongest.
But with this, AGOG has just reminded me of what the correct quote he was attempting to bring up was and in one swift blow, has detsroyed any possibility for Perona to join.
The quote may be found on Destination Paradise and it was that no character would fly. Oda bent his rule with having a villain that could fly.
But folks, what can Perona do?
RIP.
Buu with Gohan abosorved is the strongest but little original Buu is the most dangerous because he's pure evil.
And I believe Oda was talking about a more general sense like in DB where by the end everyone could fly.
Since Arabasta he said there are 5 df capable of making a man fly. So far we've got: Bird Bird (possibly with several models), Shiki's levitation, possibly Lafitte's df and I'm not sure about Marco's. -
When has Perona navigated on the grand line? Also, to me it often seems like much of Zoro's bad sense of direction comes from misunderstanding how they work, or anime filler (though that part could be wrong given there are many parts of the series I never read in the manga, so I may have missed some examples). If following where a piece of paper points is all it takes, I'd argue even Zoro is smart enough to be able to keep track of where he's going. It's a simple visual cue that he can always and easily check on.
Why are you asking about her "navigating" when the fact remains that she was previously on two ships and she did sail on those same ships. This suggests she navigated.
Am I asking her to "navigate" independently in search of land, no. I'm asking her to follow a single direction, towards where it points to. Frankly, she's done that multiple times. One of which was on the high seas as she was forced to find the Thousand Sunny.
I did my research on what leads Zoro to fail at following "simple directions" all the time. The result was concerned about the occurrence of multiple conditions:
-Zoro boldly says, "I know what I'm doing…" in a respective way.
-Zoro then fails at the task.
-An assistant is then introduced to help Zoro find the right path.
-Zoro arrives where he needs to go.An assistant can be metaphorical, by the way.
Concerning the vivre card, the conditions have been met and Zoro is doomed to fail due to the irony of it (for him). It is not about doing it, or having the brains to do it, it is about the fictional value of it. He's just doomed to fail, it's a given.
Why? Things like, "because it happened all the time!!" work best.
-
I feel we still won't see Zoro, much less Perona, in next chapter (have a feeling it will be all Luffy…), so we will probably have to endure Perona fans for another week.
And I believe Oda was talking about a more general sense like in DB where by the end everyone could fly.
I think that too.
Since Arabasta he said there are 5 df capable of making a man fly. So far we've got: Bird Bird (possibly with several models), Shiki's levitation, possibly Lafitte's df and I'm not sure about Marco's.
Perona does not really fly. She has an astral projection; her body remains unconscious behind while she's "flying away".
So far, flight abilities confirmed were: Shiki's (I think his fruit is canon), Pell's, Marco's and Laffite's. One more to go.
-
I have nothing against AGOG. There's no spite or anything. It actually reminds me of my early DBZ days when I endlessly and seriously argued boring shit like which Buu was strongest.
But with this, AGOG has just reminded me of what the correct quote he was attempting to bring up was and in one swift blow, has detsroyed any possibility for Perona to join.
The quote may be found on Destination Paradise and it was that no character would fly. Oda bent his rule with having a villain that could fly.
But folks, what can Perona do?
RIP.
I remember that interview differently… I remember it talking about "ships" flying, and stuff like that. Not really suggesting that people wouldn't be able to fly/ etc.
Q: Is there a rule inside your work?
A: They won't fly! (laugh) Because if they fly, they won't need ships anymore. Also, they'd be able to do anything… I'm really focusing on the aspect of sailing the seas. Also, I had a sorcerer in a short story once, but I won't be using that in the series. Any preposterous situations are all created by the devil fruits. That one point is rather supernatural, but everything else is normal. -
Um, I didn't understand what you meant at all. Zoro is completely capable of following someone he's looking at. And if you're talking about humor, in a way I think it'd be funnier if he didn't get help and everyone acts surprised that he didn't get lost for once, especially since it wouldn't be as expected
-
Um, I didn't understand what you meant at all. Zoro is completely capable of following someone he's looking at.
But, he failed.
And if you're talking about humor, in a way I think it'd be funnier if he didn't get help and everyone acts surprised that he didn't get lost for once, especially since it wouldn't be as expected
He got help looking for pier 1 back at SA… Coincidence?
-
Besides, every time Zoro gets lost, his luck brings him to the exact place where he's needed most.
-
He found the place where Usopp and Nami were holding off Kuro's pirates;
-
He stumbled into the clock tower in Alabasta, despite confusing "north" for "up";
-
He ended up in the right place in Sky Piea by sheer luck (being thrown by a Giant South Bird);
-
In the Judiciary Tower of Enies Lobby, he got lost but found a way up, arriving at the top before Sanji did;
-
In Sabaody, he got the grove number wrong, but he ends up going towards the grove where the Auction House was located (and is found by Luffy in the way).
If the running gag continues, Zoro would probably stumble into Sabaody after a series of misadventures in his way.
-
-
I'm not saying he could find his way back on his own completely. That would be stupid. But how would having a bibrecard point out where to go be so different from having a person do the same thing?
-
Besides, every time Zoro gets lost, his luck brings him to the exact place where he's needed most.
- He found the place where Usopp and Nami were holding off Kuro's pirates;
This one, the gag wasn't present yet.
- He stumbled into the clock tower in Alabasta, despite confusing "north" for "up";
Again, help from something, in this case, incorrect information.
- He ended up in the right place in Sky Piea by sheer luck (being thrown by a Giant South Bird);
That was help and if you read the whole part, you can see Zoro actually being ridiculed the whole way by Oda, then, you can see him being helped by Oda's forces.
- In the Judiciary Tower of Enies Lobby, he got lost but found a way up, arriving at the top before Sanji did;
Same as before; north means up… Luffy's location was shown above.
- In Sabaody, he got the grove number wrong, but he ends up going towards the grove where the Auction House was located (and is found by Luffy in the way).
No, he stopped for directions in both anime and manga. He gets picked up along the way…
If the running gag continues, Zoro would probably stumble into Sabaody after a series of misadventures in his way.
He'll never find his way there because it'll be a repeat of how he got lost once he left his dojo. Unless Oda gives him help.
-
I'm not saying he could find his way back on his own completely. That would be stupid. But how would having a bibrecard point out where to go be so different from having a person do the same thing?
He's an idiot, after all.
I'd think he would follow the card, still lose himself the exact moment he stops looking into it, and bump into multiple people/events that would lead him towards Sabaody.
This one, the gag wasn't present yet.
Again, help from something, in this case, incorrect information.
That was help and if you read the whole part, you can see Zoro actually being ridiculed the whole way by Oda, then, you can see him being helped by Oda's forces.
Same as before; north means up… Luffy's location was shown above.
No, he stopped for directions in both anime and manga. He gets picked up along the way...
He'll never find his way there because it'll be a repeat of how he got lost once he left his dojo. Unless Oda gives him help.
Well, the point is that he eventually gets to the right place despite being an idiot. In none of those cases he needed someone guiding him all the way: misinformation, luck or something else helped him get to the right place by sheer accident.
-
I'm not saying he could find his way back on his own completely. That would be stupid. But how would having a bibrecard point out where to go be so different from having a person do the same thing?
You are suggesting that Zoro can follow it. The pieces are against him, therefore, he would need another person to lead him to the correct direction.
He needs someone to "navigate" via the usage of the Vivre Card.
-
Again AGOG, i what he needs is help from something, then doesn't the bibrecard already provide that? In which case, Perona is already made unnecessary. And what do you mean the pieces are against him? THey just start moving towards the right direction if I remeber correctly. Besides which, what makes you think Perona knows anything about bibrecards? They don't seem common at all outside the new world, and she'd have to get an explanation from Zoro or Mihawk to know how to use them. If she gets an explanation from Zoro, she'd face the same problems he would as she'd have the same level of understanding as he did. And I really can't see any reason she'd ask MIhawk, nor one where Mihawk would tell her
-
Again AGOG, i what he needs is help from something, then doesn't the bibrecard already provide that? In which case, Perona is already made unnecessary
The whole thing starts with Zoro being overconfident in using the tool. Did that happen? Yes. Zoro said, "I know how to use a VIVRE CARD to Chopper when he was given it."
What it brings up is that eventually, he will fail miserably at using such a tool… Thus, he would need "help" at using that tool just to use that tool.
-
The whole thing starts with Zoro being overconfident in using the tool. Did that happen? Yes. Zoro said, "I know how to use a VIVRE CARD to Chopper when he was given it."
What it brings up is that eventually, he will fail miserably at using such a tool… Thus, he would need "help" at using that tool just to use that tool.
If he fails at using it, he will have already left the island and Perona….
-
Well, the point is that he eventually gets to the right place despite being an idiot. In none of those cases he needed someone guiding him all the way: misinformation, luck or something else helped him get to the right place by sheer accident.
He did have a guide "all the way" in Skypiea. The whole way from the start to the finish, the South Bird helped him. Without the assistance of the South Bird, Zoro would have wandered aimlessly constantly returning to the Sacrifice Altair like he had done.
On Water 7, he couldn't escape from the place where he stood spotting Garp's ship, until Oda introduced two characters just to act as tour guides.
It's been like that since, "when Zoro is lost or at the mercy of direction, Oda introduces the solution…"
This will be the same, where Zoro is unable to leave from the island or something, and Oda is forced to introduce a solution to help him find his way.
Again AGOG, i what he needs is help from something, then doesn't the bibrecard already provide that? In which case, Perona is already made unnecessary. And what do you mean the pieces are against him? THey just start moving towards the right direction if I remeber correctly. Besides which, what makes you think Perona knows anything about bibrecards? They don't seem common at all outside the new world, and she'd have to get an explanation from Zoro or Mihawk to know how to use them. If she gets an explanation from Zoro, she'd face the same problems he would as she'd have the same level of understanding as he did. And I really can't see any reason she'd ask MIhawk, nor one where Mihawk would tell her
Or, she could have her origin confirmed being the NW. That's a possibility.
She could know how to use one, also. Possibility.
If she's told to "turn" which direction it points to, then she'd be able to do so… I hate to use an anime as an example for this, but the extended coverage the anime gave for this side arc is hinting at her helping Zoro. Honestly, there's no other example in the manga pages that show her aware of his inability to follow simple directions. So, I cannot just state anything from that. Has she seen his lack of awareness in action, we, manga readers, do not know. The anime confirms this as a fact.
It doesn't really matter what character helps him out, the point is that he shouldn't be able to do it on his very own... It would work well with either Mihawk or Perona, but I put my faith on her because it is his home and she was there first to project the plot device part.
-
When did Zoro say that? I looked at the chapter where Reyleigh gives the strawhat the vivre card and nothing of the sort is ever said. And as pointed out, if Zoro tries and gets lost, it'll be too late for Perona to help him
-
surprisingly in all cases zoro got help, an unknown new character is introduced to do so.
-
When did Zoro say that? I looked at the chapter where Reyleigh gives the strawhat the vivre card and nothing of the sort is ever said. And as pointed out, if Zoro tries and gets lost, it'll be too late for Perona to help him
It is the part where you see all the people stand there, and the eight faces are shown… There's a panel where Chopper's speech bubble says, "Let me show you how to use it, Zoro..." Angrily, Zoro shouts, "I know how to use it!!"
I'm getting the vibe that it was at the end of that chapter.
-
If it Zoro understood it was just going in the way pointed to by Vivre card, then explain why he can't do it himself with only the Vivre card's help? Also stop using "It's a possibility as an arguement" with no basis other than that. Almost anything's a possibility. If you have no proof or basis for saying Perona knows how to use a Vivre card, than you should assume she doesn't until proof presents itself, since there is evidence that she probably doesn't, in that all indications point to vivre cards being practically unknown by those who haven't gone to the new world
edit: Ok I found the line you were talking about. It still doesn't really prove anything though -
If it Zoro understood it was just going in the way pointed to by Vivre card, then explain why he can't do it himself with only the Vivre card's help? Also stop using "It's a possibility as an arguement" with no basis other than that. Almost anything's a possibility. If you have no proof or basis for saying Perona knows how to use a Vivre card, than you should assume she doesn't until proof presents itself, since there is evidence that she probably doesn't, in that all indications point to vivre cards being practically unknown by those who haven't gone to the new world
edit: Ok I found the line you were talking about. It still doesn't really prove anything thoughIt says he is doomed. The irony is he will fail.
About Perona:
There is no information of where she came from. NW is a strong, possible possibility.Furthermore, she can follow a single direction without flaw, therefore, she can use a vivre card. Physically she lacks nothing to perform what she is expected.
Instruction, she can receive or pick up from the get go.
You shouldn't assume anything about it. If you don't know the answer, it doesn't mean that there is no answer. It just means that you do not know of an answer… That's all. Can she physically follow the simplicity needed to locate a single point, in one direction? Yes. Is a vivre that? Yes. Can she use a vivre card? Yes. Does she know what it is? Not known in the manga. Does Zoro know what it is? Yes. Does it matter? No.
-
He was talking about characters.
And as far as which characters, like I said, he has bent his rules for villains and giving Robin the ability to fly….for three seconds.
But his statement was obviously about the main cast.
Whether Pell can fly or not really means jack since he's not riding a ship to begin with, doesn't it.
-
How is the New World a strong possibility? The grand line is pretty small compared to the rest of the OP world, and the New World is half that. So chances are she wouldn't be from there. Also I fail to see how Zoro could mess up the idea of traveling where the paper is moving to. Cause Vivre cards are literally drawn to the other piece, like a magnet. And if Zoro doesn't understand that concept, he can't really explain it to Perona now can he? Also, have you ever considered that patterns can be broken, or that the pattern is something of your own creation, and Oda hasn't ever thought of that? That line may have just been a joke, and nothing more. THere was once a pattern where everyone who joined the Strawhats would first have Luffy decide adamantly they would join, and they would refuse initially. Robin broke that pattern by asking Luffy though, and Brook broke it as well by accepting right away. Not to mention there have been things Luffy wants for his crew that would follow that pattern, but are completely irrelevant.
