This is probably going to bring up a shitload of controversy and eventual pointless flaming, so mods, lock it if it gets out of hand
personally, i don't
discuss
This is probably going to bring up a shitload of controversy and eventual pointless flaming, so mods, lock it if it gets out of hand
personally, i don't
discuss
Which one ?
I believe there is a "god", but I don't believe in the gods that are discussed in religions or anything like that.
Lol, I don't either.
Dicuss.
Sort of.
I don't know if he exists or not, but I pray and hope he does exist and treat him as if he does.
Which one ?
LOOOOOOL this was the greatest quote by joseph campbell!
but as for me I stick with earnest hemmingway when he said "all thinking men are atheist"
I myself was raised a roman catholic. but latter on I had a sort of awakening when I saw george carlin bash religion. Then I began questioning religion as a whole.
Now I'm a strong advocate for the destruction of organized religion. However seeing as this is almost impossible I have since taken up the cause to gte religion completly removed for our american goverment and enforce the seperation of church and state.
I respect those who believe in a god but i personally feel that if there was no religion in the world we would be better off.
I don't think matter had a designer, because where would the designer come from? Also I think to say that this "designer" has guidlines for it's creations sounds like bullshit.
I've got two reasons for thinking this.
1. Why would he/she concern themself
2. The designer wouldv'e made it so that the creations couldn't defy thier will
@The:
Now I'm a strong advocate for the destruction of organized religion.
Yeah, uh, why?
Because it spawns fanatics?
You can find fanatics in any subject that has a following, like professional sports or politics. Religion isn't married to fanaticism and frankly in a church like the RCC where religion isn't even that strong anyway, the act of bringing a community together on Sundays for an hour or so does wonders for everyone involved.
@The:
LOOOOOOL this was the greatest quote by joseph campbell!
but as for me I stick with earnest hemmingway when he said "all thinking men are atheist"
I myself was raised a roman catholic. but latter on I had a sort of awakening when I saw george carlin bash religion. Then I began questioning religion as a whole.
Now I'm a strong advocate for the destruction of organized religion. However seeing as this is almost impossible I have since taken up the cause to gte religion completly removed for our american goverment and enforce the seperation of church and state.
I respect those who believe in a god but i personally feel that if there was no religion in the world we would be better off.
WOW….smh, this is sad!
Well, this is gonna be one hell of a thread, I'll try not to post in here again!
This is gonna be a tough one.
Oh, by the way, YES, I do believe!
sports fans don't kill people who go for different teams
Yes I do.
@The:
I myself was raised a roman catholic. but latter on I had a sort of awakening when I saw george carlin bash religion. Then I began questioning religion as a whole.
Now I'm a strong advocate for the destruction of organized religion. However seeing as this is almost impossible I have since taken up the cause to gte religion completly removed for our american goverment and enforce the seperation of church and state.
If a comedian's ranting was supposedly what caused you to "see the light" then it isn't really you questioning religion as much as it is being easily swayed.
You probably weren't a devout Catholic anyway so no harm done.
@Melee128:
sports fans don't kill people who go for different teams
ya some do 2 words soccer hooligans type it in youtube and see what i mean
or read this link http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/02/04/sports/fans.php
some soccer hooligans killed a police officer just so their team wouldn't lose
@Kaizoku's:
ya some do 2 words soccer hooligans type it in youtube and see what i mean
I don't think something like that will sway it. Even if there was a historical war between sports fans, at least they killed themselves over something they can see.
@Melee128:
sports fans don't kill people who go for different teams
You wanna bet money on that?
I don't deny the possibility that there could be a god. There's lots of unexplained things in this world and things we could never hope to understand. But if there is a god I don't think we've found it yet. So, that pretty much makes me agnostic.
I believe in a higher power. I don't believe it has strong control over the actions of the world and especially not individuals unless it effects the universe as a whole. I don't follow any organized religion because I pull beliefs from several religions. I respect anyone's beliefs as long as they don't shove them down my throat or try to change mine. I've given a lot of thought on what I believe and honestly, I'm comfortable with them. If I'm wrong, oh well.
Yes I do.
If a comedian's ranting was supposedly what caused you to "see the light" then it isn't really you questioning religion as much as it is being easily swayed.
You probably weren't a devout Catholic anyway so no harm done.
NO.
I was a devout catholic before that. Seeing George carlin rant awakened me to the oppistion againist religion. it made me aware of those who were agianist religion. What really did me in was when I was watching a documentry about the first people. There was this scene where it had a cave women being struck done by lightening and dying there. Now as a devout catholic I was raised to believe that only those who belive in God go to heaven and those who don't go to hell. So my mind began to ponder the fate of all those who died before jesus came and who were banished to hell for not believing in something they couldn't belive in because it wasn't around for them. After that I spent weeks getting little to no sleep over this and eventually I began studying the three major religions and their views. and after a while I realized that the religions were created to explain the unexplainable to the bronze age people. After that I decided to denounce my faith and began immersing myself into the study of those who belive in a god and those who don't. During those studies I became an atheist. So yes george Carlins rants did awaken me but what really did it in for me was the history channel.
Of course I do.
Just not from the whole Fundamentalist/Puritan/Dark Ages view that everyone likes to make fun of.
Nah, I'm pretty sure God's got a good sense of humor and be the kind of person who would enjoy grilling burgers and having a beer on a nice Sunday afternoon. (And hey, if we're created in his image….)
You wanna bet money on that?
I don't mind betting on the long odds [sarcasm]
as to the thread topic
No.
I'm skeptical of religion, more than dieties, but primarily from an accuracy sense. How do you know that your particular prophet's vision is the right one?
We spend days debating tiny points of translation for a comic released days ago.
Trying to keep accuracy on a subtle, morality-based document of high value issued thousands of years ago– I don't think it's necessarily going to work.
I'm also a little suspicious of how religion seems to line up in such a way as to be beneficial for keeping social order-- it makes an excellent enforcer if you can make people fear an eternal wrath to prevent them from knocking over your wealth and power
Well, no I personally do not believe in any kind of god, but at the same time I don't think whether or not god exists is particularly useful information. There's no way of verifying it one way or the other so I don't bother, I just prefer to think that the world goes on as it does simply because it can… I mean, it makes sense.
As for religion, I feel like that's another topic entirely. I know why it exists and the kind of good and bad it can do but I can't help but think that the institution is somewhat outdated, or at least has become something quite different over time. In any case, I like to think that I can decide for myself how to be a good person without worrying about being rewarded or punished in another life by an all powerful deity (no offense, I'm pretty sure that doesn't apply to the moral logic of every or most believers).
I believe that religion brings great help to people that are in need.
I believe that humans can warp religion to their own purposes.
I believe most religions at their base are aimed at creating working, inhabitable and thriving communities.
I believe many religions can take advantage of people who are suffering.
I believe anyone who rubs off religion as being harmful has closed their eyes to the good it can do.
I believe anyone who only sees how humans can do good with religion have closed their eyes to what suffering it has caused when abused or misiniterpreted.
I believe anyone who interprets the Christian Bible literally is a fool.
I believe anyone who casts it away without understanding much of what it tries to explain via stories is an even bigger fool.
I believe anyone who thinks all religion is bad should consider that religion has culminated in creating you and the world you currently live in.
I believe anyone who thinks religion is good should consider that many standards it once held are greatly outdated.
I believe that there are many strange and different interpretations of God of gods or deities or beings greater than ourselves.
I believe that by far the strangest belief is that there is nothing greater than yourself.
Yes, I believe in God.
I've never gone to church, and I still have yet to finish reading the entire bible, but I do believe in God.
My Grandma was very religious (not the psycho kind, though), my Dad and Grandpa were both Catholic, and I grew up with many bibles for me to flip through.
I don't believe any humans know God, I think the Bible and whatever spawned it is utter fictional bullshit which was an attempt for a writer to get the #1 spot in highest selling books of all time list.
I believe there's a God, I don't believe in serving God tho. Cause if God intended us to serve God, we would have had that built into our bodies, and thus I wouldn't be rejecting that idea right now. Whatever God is doing, God's doing a fine job, and that's what matters. We are all still here, ain't we?
Someone's looking after our dumbasses.
hay guyz nice thread
But yeah, I believe in God. And I agree with most of Greg's post. From my experiences of over 10 years of God/religion forum topics on entertainment forums, I know that the discussion probably won't get anywhere beyond that.
Yes I believe in God.
I live in a Bible belt and yeah there's a few crazies around here. It makes for some pretty hilarious but sad letters to the editor sections in the local newspaper.
Wow I hit the quote button when I meant to hit the edit button…where's mod powers when I need them :)
I do not believe in any type of god.
I do believe in God.
I've gotten a lot of flack for it, but I've enjoyed the experience overall and am proud of my beliefs.
I do, however, detest religious fanatics (because sometimes those people are incredibly dangerous, but then again so is a fanatic of any kind.)
I also don't like those who would manipulate religious people for their own personal gain. Most religions are formed on the basis of helping people, not just helping yourself.
And I also agree about the George Carlin comment BTW, don't let Hollywood sway your opinions/beliefs on things.
I don't deny the possibility that there could be a god. There's lots of unexplained things in this world and things we could never hope to understand. But if there is a god I don't think we've found it yet. So, that pretty much makes me agnostic.
This is pretty much me as well.
Yes I do.I'm a Muslim.
I don't really get why people debate it.
It's really not a big deal.
If he exists, you know, great. Seeing as how there isn't overt evidence (otherwise we'd probably all believe), then he probably doesn't exert too much influence on this world. So, thanks for making us all and everything, but I don't really see a need to worship.
it's 3 in the morning, i hope this is coherent.
I think Greg pretty much hit the nail on the head here.
I'm agnostic. If God appeared to me tomorrow, I'd believe it. But for now, I think the very notion of our minds being capable of understanding something as grand as God (when most of science is still foreign to us) to sound incredibly ignorant and far fetched.
Not to say it's impossible, just a bit… You know. Silly.
I believe anyone who casts it away without understanding much of what it tries to explain via stories is an even bigger fool.
Crap, so Greg thinks I'm a big fool? ;_;
If you think the Bible is just some book with bat-shit-insane stories you are a fool. If you think some dude walked on water you`re as big a fool.
The stories provided within it, when studied or examined even briefly in context of our world, are extremely useful blueprints for life.
I say this as a Christian who gasp doesn`t believe in the Resurrection.
The human race needs something to believe in. For thousand of years people have always believed in a god/gods. Another interesting point is that we tend to see things that we cannot understand now (because we don't have the technology to investigate it etc…) as something related to a mighty god. I guess that we could'nt survive if we don't believe in something. The anti-regligious guys may believe in science etc... Well i personaly don't believe there is a god out there. There might be other life forms in this universe but i don't believe in something that holds everything in his hands. Religion is ok cause it helps people that don't have any ideas of what they should do with their life to focus on something positive. The kernel (oh yeah tron is coming) of every religion is basically the same. Don't lie don't kill etc do good stuff etc... So at the end if many people follow these rules it's good for the collective (borgs?) or the community. But i thought about it and i came to the conclusion that if you want to guide a weak spirit in a specific direction (so that the person don't become a criminal or an outlaw or a person without perspectives etc) you need to manipulate them. That's what the religions do. They tell you to believe in something mighty (that only people have seen that are already dead) that will punish you if you don't follow the rules.
I personaly don't like it. I can perfectly think for myself and don't need a god to do the right things in this world or to be on the right path :) But it's ok for the others.
Greg, I agree with some of your points.
The Bible does have many historically significant & accurate things documented within it, and also good lessons to live by. But there's also a lot about it which doesn't fly. Especially when you consider the fact that the original written scrolls have been passed down from kingdoms, from rulers, from translations, from generations. There's a lot of aspects that more than likely been embellished, exaggerated, or outright changed/removed.
But the Bible does have many historically significant & accurate things documented within it, and provides some moral backbones, life lessons and teachings to live by and improve the lives of yourself and others. It's just that the most original format is probably vastly different from what "The Bible" is considered to be today.
And this is also coming from a Christian with a strong belief in God, and I don't believe in every little thing the "modern" churches/sects would tell you.
EDIT:
Actually, .. I won't make that post, it'll just get me into trouble =P
I'll just say I don't believe in the Christian god.
see religion as something which could bring you hope and strength(but also a lot of pain and sadness to a higher amount)…
but dont see it as something every1 needs and don
t put the words on a golden scale cause you than forget to think by yourself.....
I pretty much agree with everything Greg said. There are so many people that like to bash religion without giving it a second though.
Example.
I can't believe there are people that actually think the reason for aids spreading in Africa is religion. Because the pope seems to forbid the use of condoms.. But those same anti-religion fanatics seem to forget that the same pope preaches monogamy. So it should be impossible the spread aids in the first place.
Personally i don't believe in the cristian god. I do believe that people can learn alot from the bible. I believe everyone has a soul and i believe in live-after-death. But i think that we can't comprehend what happens we die. It's beyond us, and we'll only fully understand what happens then, after we die. I refuse to believe that everything ends after we die and everything was ultimately for nothing.. That's my personal reason to believe there is more.
All praise e1n. god of the internet!
ya, this thread is going to go nowhere, so I might as well get brownie points.
I do believe though, that anti-religion fanatics are just as annoying as the religious ones.
and as usual, great post greg.
I believe that religion brings great help to people that are in need.
Example please.
I believe that humans can warp religion to their own purposes.
So true. But the, wasn't religion created by the people in the first place?
I believe most religions at their base are aimed at creating working, inhabitable and thriving communities.
Within one community, in most cases.
I believe anyone who rubs off religion as being harmful has closed their eyes to the good it can do.
It has done equal, if not more harm as good. While the good that comes off religion is normally based on morality, rather than divinity.
I believe anyone who thinks all religion is bad should consider that religion has culminated in creating you and the world you currently live in.
Might not be necessarily a good thing. Could have been better, or worse without religion. We do not know.
I believe anyone who thinks religion is good should consider that many standards it once held are greatly outdated.
Varies from culture to culture.
I believe that there are many strange and different interpretations of God of gods or deities or beings greater than ourselves.
Are not all interpretation strange and weird? In the very least, all of them are very abstract.
I believe that by far the strangest belief is that there is nothing greater than yourself.
If there does exist a God, what would He be thinking?
wow. did I call it or what.
I don't think we're meant to know if there is or is not a god, and honestly I think it's a waste of time to try and sort out the incredible mess that human religions have made of things. As far as "going to heaven or hell" is concerned, if you do your best to do what you think is right (because there's sometimes no clear answer), then you have nothing to worry about. If there is a god and it's going to be unfair about things, there's nothing you could have done anyway.
Personally, I dislike the whole concept of "beliefs" and "faith". It's just an excuse to believe in something that you have no way of backing up, and most people don't even have the slightest inkling of a reason to "believe" in anything. For those of you who do have a reason (maybe some sort of personal experience with god, although these are open to interpretation), I commend you for making some sort of rational decision, and not just following the herd.
Nope. God is just myth, so no thx. If there is evidence maybe then, but not before that.
@Melee128:
I don't think matter had a designer, because where would the designer come from?
I have a better question. Let's agree for a while that there was, in the beginning, only God (be that the Biblical God, or the Muslim Allah, or the Hindu Trinity) existed. Then God creates the universe, and everything in it. But, if in the beginning there was nothing but God, where and from what did God create everything? What was the raw material?
One might argue that God created everything from Himself. In fact, many religions have it that everything came from God and god is present in everything. However, if everything did come from God, then every property of every substance must also ome from God. So, every evil, every blemish present in the universe must be present in God Himself. But then, God by definition is pure and good and merciful. Herein lies the phallacy of the Genesis theories of pretty much all cultures (and pretty much all religions have it similar).
hmmm, religion is a dangerous thing to discuss, things can turn into quite the turmoil but the question at hand, believing in God is a though one. I myself don't see myself as a believer of god and actually an atheist but questions do arise. If in the beginning there was nothing and evidently at some point this must have been the case, where did everything come from, what was the big bang and what caused it and even it it where an other dimension that exploded, creating our world, where did that come from then??? The universe also keeps expanding because a the gigantic blow that occured so many billions of years ago but shouldn't a shockwave, because that is actually the movement of the universe, stop at some point? I mean, if you throw a rock in water, there will be rinkles expanding but if you throw it in a big lake or something the rinkles on the water will not go over the entire surface and what will happen when it stops expanding and. . . .
So I just think that there must've been something that caused our universe to start from scratch, perhaps an other universe that imploded creating o time bend or a white hole that spit everything to here because you can't get something from nothing (unless there really would be a god)…... perhaps I read to much science fiction :D
In the beginning I wrote "there must have been nothing" but perhaps thi might not be the case since we have so little knowledge about the concept of space and time that there simply doens't exist a nothing just the startpoint of time or something????
SO many questions... AAAHHHRRGGGG, where's my pills....
I do believe in Eneru though :D
I believe religion represents hope and nothing more.
@Xai:
I have a better question. Let's agree for a while that there was, in the beginning, only God (be that the Biblical God, or the Muslim Allah, or the Hindu Trinity) existed. Then God creates the universe, and everything in it. But, if in the beginning there was nothing but God, where and from what did God create everything? What was the raw material?
:blink: It's the same thing with the big bang. Nothing suddenly started to explode and became something.. And when did it start? It has to start somewhere.. But the problem is. it can't. Time is endless so it couldn't have started. It just doesnt make any sense.