There were no time-limits for Jinbro and Camie as well, but it became evident they were not competing on equal ground either.
Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 9 - Yamato vs. The World)
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There were no time-limits for Jinbro and Camie as well, but it became evident they were not competing on equal ground either.
I don’t see how Camie would have potentially had greater purpose with Luffy as opposed to staying behind, in contrast to Jinbe’s dream of a solid friendship between humans and fish men.
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Things can be held for a bit while the arc is still going. But Carrot's arc is NOT still going.
This isn't quite true though. Carrot has obviously been quite snuffed this arc with the Perospero stuff not really going anywhere and having minor involvement in act 2 but these weren't the reason why people thought she could be a crew memeber. It was Pedro's words to her and his believe that the Straw Hats needed to be that dawn, and her inheriting his will and seeing it through. That was the hook for her and that hasn't concluded yet. Maybe it will result in a 'all the Mink's inherit Pedro's will and join the grand fleet' but right now Carrot is still the only one to have seemingly done anything towards it.
We won't know until the arc is done how that goes. If she goes with them, she goes with them and that's her reason. If she doesn't go with them then it becomes a collective mink thing.
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This isn't quite true though. Carrot has obviously been quite snuffed this arc with the Perospero stuff not really going anywhere and having minor involvement in act 2 but these weren't the reason why people thought she could be a crew memeber. It was Pedro's words to her and his believe that the Straw Hats needed to be that dawn, and her inheriting his will and seeing it through. That was the hook for her and that hasn't concluded yet. Maybe it will result in a 'all the Mink's inherit Pedro's will and join the grand fleet' but right now Carrot is still the only one to have seemingly done anything towards it.
We won't know until the arc is done how that goes. If she goes with them, she goes with them and that's her reason. If she doesn't go with them then it becomes a collective mink thing.
Even if just speaking for what's going on right now in the arc, I still don't feel that Carrot has potential greater purpose to go with Luffy as a crewmate to Laugh Tale. That could always change of course, but that's just how I feel right now in speaking for myself.
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At this point, and considering the on-going cover story, there are plausible chances that Pedro will show up.
Carrot's only interest was vengeance, and that's been fullfilled, there's also no point in keeping him dead, when even BM has been defeated already.
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At this point, and considering the on-going cover story, there are plausible chances that Pedro will show up.
Carrot's only interest was vengeance, and that's been fullfilled, there's also no point in keeping him dead, when even BM has been defeated already.
Of course there's the plot detail of what Carrot's relevance is with the Dawn, which aren't exactly two concepts that feel particularly close to me despite what Pedro said and did, but as always, I'm willing to be shown to the contrary.
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So, at what point did Carrot actually show interest in the Dawn aside from the fact Pedro died? She hasn't asked any follow up questions or had moments to stew on it or…
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I hope we get to see Pekoms hybrid form at some point, even better would be him in Suulong form in his hybrid form, that would be insane
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My thoughts still reside in what I held 13 months ago regarding Carrot:
@Syphin:The problem many have with Carrot or at least what I have is Oda has not handled Carrot like a "main character".
[…]
It's not like the majority of the Carrot-nonbelievers dislike Carrot, Oda just hasn't given those readers much reason to like her as a main character. From the perspective of a secondary character, Carrot is a very developed one but as a main character, she is extremely lacking. Carrot has yet to fully embrace Pedro's will of helping to bring about the Dawn because as of yet she does not understand what that means. Carrot has yet to even express any interest in learning about what the Straw Hat Pirates are fighting for and the larger story in play (nothing shown so far two weeks after Pedro's "death").
[…]
There is also the lack of focus Carrot has had during the Wano Kuni Arc which has began 96 chapters ago and is the most significant arc in the New World story so far (battle against two Yonko with at least one being defeated). Carrot's coverage in the arc is also against one of the characters on Onigashima that is the least connected to the Wano Kuni story. Due to such "non-main character-like" focus and treatment by Oda, is it that hard to believe why many don't see Carrot as the likely next Straw Hat Pirate? Others may have a different opinion than me and that is fine, I am not saying they are wrong but this is just how I feel based on my interpretation of what I have read.
Nothing has changed since then.
Carrot is still a reactive character within the current largest and most important arc in One Piece. She is not actively part of the Wano story even with her being present in the middle of the war. At this point Oda has written Carrot to be largely forgettable. She has minimal focus, her relevance is handled in the background, and Oda has detached her from Wano's story.
Carrot hasn't even shown a deep interest in wanting to protect Wano conveyed by how she chose following Pedro and fighting him over a role more encapsulating for Wano's future. A nation that will be paramount in guiding the world to the Dawn. Carrot hasn't even interacted with Momonosuke or Kin'emon in any meaningful way to understand why the Mink and the Kozuki clan would be so connected which is a relationship that heavily ties into the story of the Dawn - something Pedro is passionate about. If Oda was interested in moving Carrot forward and tying her to the core plot of One Piece, more effort would have been made to incorporate Carrot into Wano's story but after 135 chapters in Wano, Carrot is still treated as a background character.
The lack of Oda having Carrot fully inherit Pedro's will and personally be interested in the Dawn (understanding what it means) is very telling to me. Why has he avoided such a development for so long and chosen not to spare some panel time earlier to progress it?
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Honestly I don't feel like anyone else should join at this point. Oda said earlier that with Wano arc One Piece would be accelerating towards it's conclusion and it really feels like that over the past year.
Not saying nobody will join but anybody that does will probably feel not quite satisfying.
We still have the fleet of Marine ships outside of Wano so maybe that'll give us some opportunities for new crew dynamics but my mind has changed since the start of Wano. I don't want anyone else joining.
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Seeing as how Yamato was chained and trapped from much of her life and hates to see others like the Wano people suffer the same fate, I’d suppose that she’d go on to have the post-Wano dream to free all the all the slaves in the world. Luffy is about freedom, so even though his goal is just being Pirate King in the first place, I think it would make for a nice complimentary dream to him and perhaps even go on to actively support that regardless, and perhaps it may become more relevant depending on what happens with the Joy Boy subplot as well.
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The inclusion of Yamato is what will allow the Straw Hat Pirates to exceed the accomplishments of the Roger Pirates.
Since the introduction of Tenryuubito, the injustice presiding within the world and Joy Boy's existence, the story of One Piece has evolved from a crew of pirates sailing toward a certain destination for the romance of it. Reaching Laugh Tale has become subservient to the story of completing the unfulfilled will of Joy Boy. The endgame isn't Laugh Tale but the story that presides beyond it.
I have said this before and I'll keep repeating myself but none of the other Straw Hat Pirates currently in the crew outside of Luffy has a story tied to Joy Boy and his role. Robin never knew about Joy Boy before visiting Fish-Man Island after the timeskip. The only character in the world who can read the Ancient Language and decipher the Poneglyphs never discovered anything relating to Joy Boy before that point. And since that moment, Oda has held any further information on Joy Boy back until he got to Wano and began to focus on Yamato's story (includes Oden's flashback). Real focus on Joy Boy only began AFTER he introduced Yamato. It is apparent to see what Oda intends to do with Yamato and how the story of Joy Boy will be supported within the Straw Hat Pirates.
It would be a different matter if Oda scripted Luffy to be the hero who wholeheartedly intends to save the world. But Luffy isn't concerned about some overarching destiny that spans over 800 years and the complexities involved in wishing to end racism or liberating the world from injustice. No, this is why Oda has introduced other characters like Otohime, Jinbe, Dragon, Sabo, Mjosgard to serve such a purpose. Yamato has been introduced by Oda to fill a role and Oda has gone out of his way to develop Yamato into a ally of Luffy's that is currently most involved in Joy Boy's story.
Oda has written Yamato to be necessary to the Straw Hat Pirates. Oda has written Yamato to be necessary for Luffy. And everything so far from Yamato's introduction, to his connection to Kaido, Oden, Ace, Wano, Momonosuke, Joy Boy, to his dreams of sailing the sea and going on adventures, to his expression of wanting to leave Wano with Luffy, to his current belief in Luffy, to his alignment with the New Generation, everything Oda has written has been consistent with tying Yamato to the future story of One Piece and seemingly the Straw Hat Pirates. At no point has Oda introduced any conflicting elements to Yamato's intentions. None. Yamato is aware of Momonosuke's importance and still chooses Luffy. Yamato admires the Samurai and is aware of the importance Wano serves but still expresses to Kaido that after liberating Wano, he will leave with Luffy. Not even Wano's safety has been written to be an issue by Oda now that he has had the World Government be more concerned with Luffy than Momonosuke. When the Straw Hat Pirates leave Wano, the World Government won't priortise Wano over them. Going forward the World Government will focus their attention on Luffy and the Straw Hat Pirates who has been written to be their number one threat in continuing to exist as the power they are (even more than the Revolutionary Army). All the World Governments main resources will be dispatched toward stopping the Straw Hat Pirates. And this is why Yamato being included in the Straw Hat Pirates is necessary. He possess knowledge and skills that will be invaluable in combating the coming threats of the World Government. And for any resources the World Government has spare to use against Wano who will oppose their rule once Momonosuke becomes Shogun, Oda has brought Zunesha, the Minks, the SMILE users, the Numbers and many other Beast Pirates into the fold alongside the Samurai who fight for Wano. Plus Wano also possess factories to develop top of the line weaponry due to Kaido's intentions over the past 20 years. And lets not forget that Wano Kuni also possesses Kairoseki. It is also possible at this point for Izo and Marco to remain in Wano Kuni. Yamato not remaining in Wano Kuni has been written to be a non-issue by Oda.
Yamato has been intentionally aligned with the most important story thread of One Piece. All this heavy lifting by Oda isn't for nothing. It isn't to introduce some character who will be removed from focus after the crew depart Wano Kuni. No, Oda's writing conveys an intention of scripting Yamato to be a character to develop and focus on moving forward. Even now, Yamato is being treated as a main character and not some arc only character. With each chapter it becomes more evident.
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The inclusion of Yamato is what will allow the Straw Hat Pirates to exceed the accomplishments of the Roger Pirates.
Since the introduction of Tenryuubito, the injustice presiding within the world and Joy Boy's existence, the story of One Piece has evolved from a crew of pirates sailing toward a certain destination for the romance of it. Reaching Laugh Tale has become subservient to the story of completing the unfulfilled will of Joy Boy. The endgame isn't Laugh Tale but the story that presides beyond it.
I have said this before and I'll keep repeating myself but none of the other Straw Hat Pirates currently in the crew outside of Luffy has a story tied to Joy Boy and his role. Robin never knew about Joy Boy before visiting Fish-Man Island after the timeskip. The only character in the world who can read the Ancient Language and decipher the Poneglyphs never discovered anything relating to Joy Boy before that point. And since that moment, Oda has held any further information on Joy Boy back until he got to Wano and began to focus on Yamato's story (includes Oden's flashback). Real focus on Joy Boy only began AFTER he introduced Yamato. It is apparent to see what Oda intends to do with Yamato and how the story of Joy Boy will be supported within the Straw Hat Pirates.
It would be a different matter if Oda scripted Luffy to be the hero who wholeheartedly intends to save the world. But Luffy isn't concerned about some overarching destiny that spans over 800 years and the complexities involved in wishing to end racism or liberating the world from injustice. No, this is why Oda has introduced other characters like Otohime, Jinbe, Dragon, Sabo, Mjosgard to serve such a purpose. Yamato has been introduced by Oda to fill a role and Oda has gone out of his way to develop Yamato into a ally of Luffy's that is currently most involved in Joy Boy's story.
Oda has written Yamato to be necessary to the Straw Hat Pirates. Oda has written Yamato to be necessary for Luffy. And everything so far from Yamato's introduction, to his connection to Kaido, Oden, Ace, Wano, Momonosuke, Joy Boy, to his dreams of sailing the sea and going on adventures, to his expression of wanting to leave Wano with Luffy, to his current belief in Luffy, to his alignment with the New Generation, everything Oda has written has been consistent with tying Yamato to the future story of One Piece and seemingly the Straw Hat Pirates. At no point has Oda introduced any conflicting elements to Yamato's intentions. None. Yamato is aware of Momonosuke's importance and still chooses Luffy. Yamato admires the Samurai and is aware of the importance Wano serves but still expresses to Kaido that after liberating Wano, he will leave with Luffy. Not even Wano's safety has been written to be an issue by Oda now that he has had the World Government be more concerned with Luffy than Momonosuke. When the Straw Hat Pirates leave Wano, the World Government won't priortise Wano over them. Going forward the World Government will focus their attention on Luffy and the Straw Hat Pirates who has been written to be their number one threat in continuing to exist as the power they are (even more than the Revolutionary Army). All the World Governments main resources will be dispatched toward stopping the Straw Hat Pirates. And this is why Yamato being included in the Straw Hat Pirates is necessary. He possess knowledge and skills that will be invaluable in combating the coming threats of the World Government. And for any resources the World Government has spare to use against Wano who will oppose their rule once Momonosuke becomes Shogun, Oda has brought Zunesha, the Minks, the SMILE users, the Numbers and many other Beast Pirates into the fold alongside the Samurai who fight for Wano. Plus Wano also possess factories to develop top of the line weaponry due to Kaido's intentions over the past 20 years. And lets not forget that Wano Kuni also possesses Kairoseki. It is also possible at this point for Izo and Marco to remain in Wano Kuni. Yamato not remaining in Wano Kuni has been written to be a non-issue by Oda.
Yamato has been intentionally aligned with the most important story thread of One Piece. All this heavy lifting by Oda isn't for nothing. It isn't to introduce some character who will be removed from focus after the crew depart Wano Kuni. No, Oda's writing conveys an intention of scripting Yamato to be a character to develop and focus on moving forward. Even now, Yamato is being treated as a main character and not some arc only character. With each chapter it becomes more evident.
Really does boggle my mind how people can assume Oda will pull a fakeout on Yamato repeating her wanting to escape Wano like 100 times only to throw that away, as if they want it to turn out our time hearing all that was wasted in favor of babying a kid who ultimately wants to be the shogun Wano deserves.
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Imo one thing that causes disagreement on Yamato is that one one hand, they are the best strawhat candidate we have gotten since Jinbe, no competition. On the other hand, they are still below what we are used for strawhats, in terms of character arc, a well developed motivation and interaction with the crew and even with Luffy.
I think what is hard for people to grasp is just how high the bar for someone to join the main cast of this story is. The fact Yamato is closer to the bar than the other options doesn't mean they have cleared it. it just means options like Carrot are so ridiculously far from clearing the bar they make Yamato look good.
However, there goes the sentence I say in most of those discussions: the arc is not over. There is still plenty of time for Yamato's character arc to develop. And looking at the story from outside, it seems painfully obvious Oda wants them to join, so chances are that arc will happen. I mean, Yamato said they want to join the crew, how often does that happen? It seems more likely to me Oda will do a lousy job at developing Yamato but still let them in, than not letting them in, at this point.
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That is fine. Disagreement is natural (for those that do).
For female characters Oda usually develops them AFTER they join the Straw Hat Pirates. If he follows how he handled Nami and Robin, he could develop a third female character in a similar fashion. Nami and Robin did not that their story arcs which established the finer details of their motivation and interactions with the crew until after they had their arcs. We did though have ideas on how their stories could move forward before those characters received their arcs which isn't something a lot of candidates have going for them. With Yamato, he has immense potential and there is a clear idea on how his story can move forward. Another thing to take into account is Oda using Oden as a foundation to build Yamato. Oden himself only met and befriended Roger before joining the Roger Pirates. I see a similar setting happening with Yamato. If there is one character that can get away with limited Straw Hat Pirate interactions outside of Luffy, it is Yamato.
Additionally, Yamato's character arc isn't limited to the Wano Kuni Arc. The readers will not get a resolution to their story within this arc.
It is obvious Yamato's arc extends beyond it. Plot points Oda scripted for Yamato have yet get resolution and follow up. For example, Yamato visiting Ace's grave to share a cup of sake, or Yamato being an Oni who as a race appear to not think highly of humans going by Kaido's actions and dialogue (Oni are likely connected to Ancient Giants), or Yamato being saved by Shimotsuki Ushimaru who Zoro bears a striking resemblance too, or Yamato being included as part of the New Generation, or Yamato wanting to help the figure Oden was waiting for (Luffy), or Yamato wanting to sail the seas or Yamato expressing to Luffy they wish to board his ship. Oda isn't nearly done with Yamato's story, it is just the beginning.
Personally, I feel Oda has done a great job at developing Yamato. He is an inspiring character with an immense potential to enhance how the story can move forward. I have long thought Yamato has cleared this "bar".
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I don't think Nami and Robin got late development just because they were female, I think that happened because of their character type: secretive, roguish people who are used to infiltrating organizations and betraying them. Which means both had arcs later where Luffy and the other strawhats got to show how they actually cared despite a recent betrayal and prove their friendship.
I feel like it happened to both females because Oda isn't super fond of giving women combat roles, so he designed both of them with thieving and infiltration roles.
But Yamato is a huge oni who fights with a club, says everything they are thinking and openly challenges their yonko father. They are actually a pretty refreshing character since they are the first female strawhat (or female a birth, depending on your gender stance) designed for a combat role. And they don't feel like someone who is holding big secrets or planning to later betray the strawhats, because their personality is very straightforward. So the kind of plot used for Nami and Robin would be harder to apply here.
The thing is, most strawhats get further developments after their joining arc, but aside from Nami and Robin, all of them have a full story in their joining arc where Luffy helps them heal somehow, by defeating someone or something who was holding them back and offering a chance to finally pursue their dreams by joining Luffy. So the pattern is that Yamato needs that kind of resolution, and unless Oda finds a different way to do it later (and that way has to be very satisfying, possibly warranting another full arc), I think it's hard to pull off. It's more likely Oda is still doing it in Wano.
(and before you say, well he's beating Kaido. Yes, that's part of it, but it still needs to be a heavy character moment for Yamato)
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I don't think Nami and Robin got late development just because they were female, I think that happened because of their character type: secretive, roguish people who are used to infiltrating organizations and betraying them. Which means both had arcs later where Luffy and the other strawhats got to show how they actually cared despite a recent betrayal and prove their friendship.
I feel like it happened to both females because Oda isn't super fond of giving women combat roles, so he designed both of them with thieving and infiltration roles.
But Yamato is a huge oni who fights with a club, says everything they are thinking and openly challenges their yonko father. They are actually a pretty refreshing character since they are the first female strawhat (or female a birth, depending on your gender stance) designed for a combat role. And they don't feel like someone who is holding big secrets or planning to later betray the strawhats, because their personality is very straightforward. So the kind of plot used for Nami and Robin would be harder to apply here.
The thing is, most strawhats get further developments after their joining arc, but aside from Nami and Robin, all of them have a full story in their joining arc where Luffy helps them heal somehow, by defeating someone or something who was holding them back and offering a chance to finally pursue their dreams by joining Luffy. So the pattern is that Yamato needs that kind of resolution, and unless Oda finds a different way to do it later (and that way has to be very satisfying, possibly warranting another full arc), I think it's hard to pull off. It's more likely Oda is still doing it in Wano.
(and before you say, well he's beating Kaido. Yes, that's part of it, but it still needs to be a heavy character moment for Yamato)
It was made apparent from the start that Yamato was trying to take on the identity of Oden as a way to carry on his will after he got boiled and killed and then seeing less hope to defeat her abusive dad. I’ve no doubt that Yamato embracing her own identity as opposed to someone else’s is something she’ll have to come to terms with after Kaido is defeated then.
It reminds me of when Chopper used to want to be a human because he was attacked for being a blue nose reindeer monster, but then learned to embrace who he is for himself at heart, not just wanting to help Luffy, but also gaining the confidence of being genuinely fine with who he really is.
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I think at this point in the story, Oda can't afford to have any new additions to the Straw Hats get their real development later on like he did with Nami and Robin. A new member is already going to feel slightly out of place because of how long we have been without a new member to the crew (excl. Jinbei who was at least introduced a decade+ ago so we've had lots of time to get to know him). So any new member either needs to be someone we've known for a while (like Vivi) or someone who doesn't need a lot of development or can have it mostly front-loaded.
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I think at this point in the story, Oda can't afford to have any new additions to the Straw Hats get their real development later on like he did with Nami and Robin. A new member is already going to feel slightly out of place because of how long we have been without a new member to the crew (excl. Jinbei who was at least introduced a decade+ ago so we've had lots of time to get to know him). So any new member either needs to be someone we've known for a while (like Vivi) or someone who doesn't need a lot of development or can have it mostly front-loaded.
At the same time, I think it would be unique to have a member who didn’t meet Luffy before the timeskip. Some people might want that close-knit in the know sort of vibe, like with 3D2Y, but I’d suppose that a new member who’s not necessarily all in the know, but still be able to bond with Luffy would still be special in its own way.
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The brilliant thing with how Oda scripted Yamato is that no new arc needs to be incorporated within the manga to develop and push forward their story. Every single major story thread that the readers expect to feature within the future of One Piece has been made so Yamato heavily ties into it. When you think about it, the extent to how Yamato has been crafted to seamlessly fit into the future story of One Piece, you can't help but wonder what Oda's intentions for Yamato truly are. So much effort and care has been taken to establish a character that would have no problem existing within the future story alongside Luffy.
The Island where Ace's grave is which Luffy is destined to visit after he defeats Kaido in order to share a cup of sake? Oda established the necessity for also having Yamato visit the grave through flashbacks and the title of chapter 999 - "The Sake I Brewed to Drink With You". Additional memories of Ace and how Yamato reacted when he found out Ace died can also feature within this moment further substantiating Yamato's emotional bond with Ace and Luffy (and indirectly Sabo).
Vegapunk and the research he has been conducting? Yamato is the child of the "creature" the World Government has conducted significant research on who even has an Artificial Devil Fruit created from his DNA by Vegapunk. Kaido was caught several by the Marines and imprisoned and likely during each capture, further research was done. When Kaido met King and broke out from Punk Hazard, Vegapunk was not working in the facility yet as he had not joined the Marines at that time. Only during a subsequent capture at a later time would Vegapunk have the opportunity to begin researching Kaido's DNA. I was right about Kaido and King being prisoners of Punk Hazard in the past (Kaido was likely betrayed by Rocks on Gods Valley) and I also suspect that beyond the Artificial Devil Fruit, further research and experiments were done using Kaido's DNA. The Blood of Oni theory. Yamato has the same blood as Kaido and will have direct relevance to any research the World Government/Marines conducted on Kaido which I suspect is a lot. I believe Kaido was a massive part of Vegapunk's research.
[…]
Kaido’s Lineage Factor/Bloodline Element has become a substantial aspect to the research conducted by Vegapunk and the Marine Scientists. The CP-0 have already confirmed that when Kaido was captured by the Marines he was experimented on with his Bloodline Element being used by Vegapunk to create the Artificial Devil Fruit that Momonosuke has consumed. Beyond the Artificial Devil Fruit there are also connections with Kaido’s Bloodline Element being used to experiment on the Numbers. The connections they share with Kaido are too substantial to ignore as separate. Additionally, the Dragons Vegapunk developed also appear to be based on his research into Kaido’s Bloodline Element. Further, there may have been other subjects that were used in the research into Kaido’s Bloodline Element, specifically, the Jailer Beasts of Impel Down. The blood Kaido possess has become an incredibly valuable component in the Marines research in creating “weapons” that can strengthen their forces and I find myself curious as to how else the Marine Scientists (and Vegapunk) have weaponized Kaido’s Bloodline Element. Will Kaido’s blood and ancestry become a core story thread going forward as the secrets of the past hidden away by the World Government are uncovered?
[…]
During the arc dealing with Vegapunk and the Marines research, Yamato may come to find out more about his Oni ancestry and why the Oni loath humans (going by Kaido's attitude and feelings). Reconciling the Oni past and his current feelings could be where the Straw Hat Pirates come in.
Elbaf and the Giants? Yamato is an Oni, a race that seemingly is related to the Ancient Giants Oars and Oars Jr. are a part of. The Oni race could be a variant of the Ancient Giants but more likely than not there is a intimate connection between the two races. The history of the Ancient Giants and the Oni could be explored when Elbaf comes into focus and the story of Giants take center stage. We know that there are other Giants beyond Elbaf ones so they too could feature within this coming arc. Hajrudin and his crew could potentially regroup with Luffy and become a focus within the arc centered around Giants. Hajrudin's dream isn't to become King of Elbaf but to become King of ALL Giants, so for Harjudin's story arc to develop toward such an end, an overarching narrative of ALL Giants will need to take place. Jaguar D. Saul also belonged to a different Giant race and considering his importance as a member of the D and Robin's savior, Oda may choose to also feature the Giant clan Saul belonged to. With this Giant story Arc, I also suspect Urouge to feature heavily (Bonney will likely be focused on in the Vegapunk arc that delves into Kuma's story). The Giant story may not just be limited to Elbaf, it could also incorporate the massive tree existing on Elbaf that extends into the sky and to the Sky Islands. Oda has hinted at Oni looking Giants existing on Sky Island before, so it wouldn't be surprising for more Giants or a Giant Clan to be living on a Sky Island. An arc that also includes Sky Islands would be great for Urouge to also feature in to help have his story expanded on.
It is curious that Oda did not have Oden travel to Elbaf. I suspect is it because this Island contains information on the Ancients Giants and Oni and rather than Yamato learn about the history of Oni from a book, Oda is choosing to have Yamato learn about it firsthand by traveling there.
[…]
It will be interesting to see how the story tied to Elbaf links to the history of the Ancient Civilisation (was Joy Boy a Giant?) and to the story of the other Giant races (the Giant race Jaguar D. Saul belonged to, the Ancient Giants whom are possibly the ancestors of Oni, Rock and Scotch's Giant race and whatever Giant race Sanjuan Wolf is). Considering Hajrudin's dream is to be King of ALL Giants (not just Elbaf) and that Oda has made him a Captain of the Straw Hat Pirate Grand Fleet, there should be some story to explore there. It may be largely off-screened but I suspect varying Giant races will come into play at some point. Such a union may culminate during the Elbaf Island Arc story. Giants also having such long lives means that the history available in Elbaf and from other Giants would be more etched into their culture opposed to normal human races where life is more transitory and as such more dispersed in their history. Considering this and the fact that "D" is also associated with Giants, it makes sense why their story is being saved for the latter parts of One Piece - because history will be more applicable through them.
I also wonder if Yamato will come to learn more about the Oni from Elbaf as it does not appear Yamato will get much more time to talk to Kaido during this arc. The Oni race weren't just simply introduced by Oda without further exploration. And a possible place the Oni race will get a deeper dive into could be Elbaf, if not through Kaido. It would also be fascinating to find out if there is an ancient connection between Wano and the Giants. Elbaf when whatever issue plagues them is dealt with can join Wano in their opposition to the World Government going forward. There are one of the few nations that aren't aligned with the World Government and a reason for why may relate back to Joy Boy.
[…]
Gods Valley? This is where the Rocks Pirates were defeated and Kaido's life as the man he currently is began. In order to understand his own place in the world (as an Oni), it would benefit Yamato and his story to understand the story of his father and what happened during the God Valley incident. Oda is saving the details of this event for a future moment.
Laugh Tale? Yamato has treated Oden's journal as his bible. The information Oden left out about Laugh Tale would be something Yamato, who also possesses a heart of romance, would be dying to learn.
Shanks? Yamato has inherited Oden's will. Shanks will obviously be interested in Yamato.
Blackbeard? There is an apparent connection between Teach and Rocks, whom Kaido used to follow and admire. Depending on what happened between Rocks and Kaido on Gods Valley, there could be a story to tell about Yamato learning more about his father and the past he lived. Also, Teach is the one who fought Ace and gifted him to the Marines which ultimately led to Ace's execution.
Beyond Laugh Tale? That is what Yamato is currently fighting for. To help Luffy/Joy Boy achieve what Oden and Roger could not.
Even when the Straw Hat Pirates revisit Fish-Man Island, Yamato could hold significant relevance. Yamato and Fish-Man Island theory.
Similar to how Oden learned about the Kozuki history through his journey, Yamato will learn about his family's history through his journey (possibly when the Giant and Vegapunk Arcs are dealt with). Yamato's story has been set-up by Oda to extend beyond Wano. Yamato is unique in how relevant and how much potential they have to develop going forward. And the beauty of it is that no new arc needs to be featured to achieve such an end. All of Yamato's story can take place within arcs that are already guaranteed to feature. If there was a future Straw Hat Pirate that would be introduced that didn't further bloat the manga, it would be in the manner Oda has crafted Yamato in.
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At the same time, I think it would be unique to have a member who didn’t meet Luffy before the timeskip. Some people might want that close-knit in the know sort of vibe, like with 3D2Y, but I’d suppose that a new member who’s not necessarily all in the know, but still be able to bond with Luffy would still be special in its own way.
That's fine, it's just that if we are going to get that I think most of their development needs to be frontloaded or it needs to be simple. We aren't going to get arcs like Enies Lobby that give us new insight and ways to look at the Straw Hats this late in the game, when Oda should be wrapping up all the world building and overarching story beats. It would feel like a tangent.
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This last chapter basically destroyed the number theory once and for all.
It's most likely that Oda was surprised by the 2.9 fruit suggestion because he planned to reveal Luffy as "nika" (which fits 2.9).
However, by doing so, it means we now don't have the "gomu" (5.6) anymore, and we just got a repeated "hito" (1.10) in our hands.
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On a smaller, less important, note, if zoan fruits have a mind of their own, and they choose their wielders, it reinforces Yamato's role as "Wano's guardian".
Also, so much for the expectation of Yamato joining forces with other characters to hold off Kaido until Luffy reengages him.
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I wouldnt expect much of a follow up about DF's having will on their own, its either just part of Oda's terrible handling of excuses to not make the Gorosei look as total clowns, but they still ended looking just like ones, or it is actually something super important about DF's origins and the next time we'learn anything more about it will be years and years in the future.
Yamato being aware of Luffy being JoyBoy and Hiyori proving why she will not be sidelined as the mature woman ruling Wano besides Momo, are some real solid points in this chapter.
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The death of the number theory is a great thing to see.
No longer need to see that dumb argument as a reason Yamato won't join.
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@Zik:
The death of the number theory is a great thing to see.
No longer need to see that dumb argument as a reason Yamamoto won't join.
Don't worry, it's already replaced by the Dog Dog Fruit: Model Okuchi no Makami having its own will as Wano's singular Guardian Deity.
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Uh, weird. Both Law's and Hancock's VAs are recording for either Film Red of the tie-in filler episodes that lead to it.
I've always said that Law was a quasi-crewmate (like a protagonist, but not really) and that Hancock would either become a crewmate or something like Law later.
After her appearing in Episode 1,000 opening for no reason, this is yet another sign that maybe at least the later may happen.
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@Zik:
The death of the number theory is a great thing to see.
No longer need to see that dumb argument as a reason Yamamoto won't join.
Also, if Yamato is meant to stay on Wano since she’s a Wano deity, is Luffy meant to stay on the sun now that he has fully awakened as a Sun deity?
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However, by doing so, it means we now don't have the "gomu" (5.6) anymore, and we just got a repeated "hito" (1.10) in our hands.
The fruit is still called Gomu Gomu as the fruit has two names. And that makes sense, because the names are just man-made anyway.
Obviously, the objective taxonomy of the fruit is Zoan with the Nika aspect of it… but the 5.6 numbers still apply due to naming conventions. And Luffy will still call his attacks 'Gomu Gomu'.
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Also, if Yamato is meant to stay on Wano since she’s a Wano deity, is Luffy meant to stay on the sun now that he has fully awakened as a Sun deity?
You're equating a DF that is specific to a place to a DF that is related to freedom and liberation. It has nothing to do with the actual sun.
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The fruit is still called Gomu Gomu as the fruit has two names. And that makes sense, because the names are just man-made anyway.
Obviously, the objective taxonomy of the fruit is Zoan with the Nika aspect of it… but the 5.6 numbers still apply due to naming conventions. And Luffy will still call his attacks 'Gomu Gomu'.
Good luck if you still expect a 2.9 fruit to join. To me, the number theory was always unlikely at best, and now it's gone. No matter how Luffy still calls his fruit or attacks, it's true name is Hito Hito, and the number theory was entirely about fruit numbers not overlapping. That's how people arrived at the missing 2.9 DF.
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Good luck if you still expect a 2.9 fruit to join. To me, the number theory was always unlikely at best, and now it's gone. No matter how Luffy still calls his fruit or attacks, it's true name is Hito Hito, and the number theory was entirely about fruit numbers not overlapping. That's how people arrived at the missing 2.9 DF.
Oh, I don't care about the number theory. I was just saying that it's still valid to say that Luffy ate the Gomu Gomu for people who care about it.
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Shame Chopper has to leave the crew now. Can’t have two Human Devil Fruit Users :ninja:
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Can people kill the number theory now and understand that storytelling isn't going to be chained by arbitrary patterns like it? I'm not saying that if Oda notices stuff like that and he has ideas to lean into it he'd do it for kicks and giggles but it's pretty silly to assume that he'll bend over whatever plans he has just to make something fit some obscure number pattern.
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Let's make Nika to 2.9. and let Enel join the Strawhats… there we have our 5.6.... :ninja:
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Can people kill the number theory now and understand that storytelling isn't going to be chained by arbitrary patterns like it? I'm not saying that if Oda notices stuff like that and he has ideas to lean into it he'd do it for kicks and giggles but it's pretty silly to assume that he'll bend over whatever plans he has just to make something fit some obscure number pattern.
I think the numbers adding up to Su-ni-go is too impossible to be an accident, especially given how he incorporates the numbers into spreads… but at the same time readers noticed over a decade ago and Oda even published it. And he certainly did teases like Kinemon's number fitting the pattern.
So I think maybe he had the idea a long time ago, but then grew tired of it because it would be predictable the same way he stopped doing "The X Person" chapters. It was an idea he had, but he wasn't going to handcuff major story elements to a one off gag either.
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I think the numbers adding up to Su-ni-go is too impossible to be an accident, especially given how he incorporates the numbers into spreads… but at the same time readers noticed over a decade ago and Oda even published it. And he certainly did teases like Kinemon's number fitting the pattern.
So I think maybe he had the idea a long time ago, but then grew tired of it because it would be predictable the same way he stopped doing "The X Person" chapters. It was an idea he had, but he wasn't going to handcuff major story elements to a one off gag either.
Well, it became 110 + 110 + 87 + 43 = 350
So, it's over already. Unless you start toying with the numbers, like saying that for Luffy it's 29 based on nika rather than hito, but that breaks the pattern as well. In that case, we need a new 5.6, which is pretty ironic.
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You're equating a DF that is specific to a place to a DF that is related to freedom and liberation. It has nothing to do with the actual sun.
That doesn't change how Luffy is sun deity though. :<)
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Can people kill the number theory now and understand that storytelling isn't going to be chained by arbitrary patterns like it? I'm not saying that if Oda notices stuff like that and he has ideas to lean into it he'd do it for kicks and giggles but it's pretty silly to assume that he'll bend over whatever plans he has just to make something fit some obscure number pattern.
And that people who claim that Yamato will stay on Wano for the rest of her life should be willing to consider how Luffy should stay on the sun for being a sun deity.
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I think it's already kind of hasty to imply Yamato who for all intents and purposes was introduced during the middle beginning of the end of Wano can be considered underdeveloped.
In my opinion, he did it. Oda pulled it off, he introduced a character so out of left field that you completely forgo all preconceived notions how it concerns how this arc would go and who would be leaving with the crew. Because whether you think she'll join or not, the audience is invested in the Yamato character that exceeds the investment of a side character. Her backstory and character would be designed in such an intricate way that what very little we have received seems like a lot already.
Abused by her depressive warmongering Father since adolescence, the secluded Daughter of a Yonko who idolized his mortal enemy so much so she wants to be a Man, desires to break the confines of her against her own will imprisonment to go out to Sea explore the world and fulfill whatever ambitious endeavour her idol never got to complete due to the occupation of his home Country which she's never left. Inspired by the next generation of Pirates because of good apples like Ace so she rather explore the world with his younger but more ambitious baby brother.
That's a Strawhat backstory through and through. I used to think Oda laid things a little on thick with how much he did to tie Robin, Brook and Jinbe to the crew's journey out of necessity but he seems to be doubled down here with Yamato concerning pretense. For instance whatever assumptions or reservations we have about what the dawn of the world means and who will be our window into this mystery is just as much prevalent with Yamato as it was purposed to be with the minks Carrot and Pedro. Here we have a character who was closer to the tragedies in a way that it made her empathize and idolize Oden and what he stood for, this transitioned into chasing what he was chasing. That's verbatim every other Strawhat's story that segagaway into why they decided to set sail with Luffy in the first place.
Their ambitions and dreams are shaped by their own tragedies and those who inspired them. Yamato just reached the conclusions sooner that all the others came to eventually because she's already aware of the stakes but has been held in bondage to Onigashima, all she could do is wait and prepare. So yea she already knows Luffy is amazing, and the crew by extension, she doesn't need convincing and maybe that does seem different but it makes sense with what Oda has revealed about the character's backstory through her interactions with Ace, Kaido and Oden's ghost in his Journal and legacy.
One could argue the only questions are what the role will be on the Sunny as of right now and IF another flashback is even necessary.
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I think it's already kind of hasty to imply Yamato who for all intents and purposes was introduced during the middle beginning of the end of Wano can be considered underdeveloped.
In my opinion, he did it. Oda pulled it off, he introduced a character so out of left field that you completely forgo all preconceived notions how it concerns how this arc would go and who would be leaving with the crew. Because whether you think she'll join or not, the audience is invested in the Yamato character that exceeds the investment of a side character. Her backstory and character would be designed in such an intricate way that what very little we have received seems like a lot already.
The fact that the story seemed to go out of its way to have Yamato be abused and have a lack of friends, and have the friends that she did have all die, in addition to still wanting to go out to sea even after defending and hyping Momo up as the Dawn, really made me wonder. As if one thing she's ultimately wanting is to be in a place with others who would be ready to accept and back her up at any time.
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Don't worry, it's already replaced by the Dog Dog Fruit: Model Okuchi no Makami having its own will as Wano's singular Guardian Deity.
I see who is backing that and I'm not surprised. Its dumb and wont hold up.
Making up specific theories for why Yamato wont join is just a waste of time. Kinda shows how some just don't get it.
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That doesn't change how Luffy is sun deity though. :<)
And that people who claim that Yamato will stay on Wano for the rest of her life should be willing to consider how Luffy should stay on the sun for being a sun deity.
They aren't even the same thing, though. Yamato has "The Guardian Spirit of Wano" DF. Luffy does not have "The Guardian Spirit of the Sun" DF. Surely you understand the difference and will stop making this leap, right? Right? :wassat:
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By that logic Luffy should be more concerned with freeing slaves like Tiger because he's Nika, or overthrowing the World Government like his Dad.
Come on guys we are in mental gymnastics territory now.
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The irony lol….
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I see people are still choosing to ignore that Yamato is not THE Guardian Deity of Wano and that anyone can become one if they put the effort in
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By that logic Luffy should be more concerned with freeing slaves like Tiger because he's Nika, or overthrowing the World Government like his Dad.
Come on guys we are in mental gymnastics territory now.
Right, I guess we should expect Luffy to give up on being Pirate King in order to focus more on freeing all the slaves in the world, even though he has voiced his desire to be Pirate King many times previously. I suppose we should also expect another crewmate to replace him then, perhaps Zoro, unless he gets too busy with being King of Hell of course.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
TLuffy does not have "The Guardian Spirit of the Sun" DF.
Makes me wonder what the implications of what was said before are then.
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Makes me wonder what the implications of what was said before are then.
A guardian deity is not the same as a "guardian deity of Wano." Pell and Chaka are considered guardian deities of Arabasta, so they would be considered "guardian deities" as well. And this comment isn't about you, but I like how people are conveniently overlooking a major development in the chapter regarding zoan DFs having a will of their own, but casually ignoring it because that would mean that Yamato's DF chose her/him for a reason. And rather than question why that would be or what that means, we've got people disregarding it outright like there's nothing to even consider.
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A guardian deity is not the same as a "guardian deity of Wano."
So basically, a guardian deity is not the same as a guardian deity, right? I guess we'll have to wait for Hyogoro to explain.
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By that logic Luffy should be more concerned with freeing slaves like Tiger because he's Nika, or overthrowing the World Government like his Dad.
Come on guys we are in mental gymnastics territory now.
Yeah it's not like Luffy has been freeing islands from opression over and over for one thousand chapters and 25 years, and he definitely didn't declare war against the most opressive government on Earth.
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They aren't even the same thing, though. Yamato has "The Guardian Spirit of Wano" DF. Luffy does not have "The Guardian Spirit of the Sun" DF. Surely you understand the difference and will stop making this leap, right? Right? :wassat:
That's Kaido's opinion, not the actual name of Yamato's fruit.
I'm thinking this info will be important, but it'll be unaccounted for a long period of time, or at least until we meet Vegapunk and explains a lit bit more on DF's.
But straught up believing some inner voices will tell Yamato to stop being so wishful about going out and do what Kaido says.
You guys are awfully pushing yourselves, stop it.