So how did kanjuro write and send all those letters to orochi ever since he meets oden and none of the scabbards ever noticed anything? Like the birds or whatever he draws to send the letters.
Chapter 974: Onward to Onigashima!
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@uniaka:
So how did kanjuro write and send all those letters to orochi ever since he meets oden and none of the scabbards ever noticed anything? Like the birds or whatever he draws to send the letters.
He was discreet, maybe? It's not like people were suspicious of him and I doubt he did in front of everyone. It's not hard to have hidden private conversations when people are not carefully watching your moves.
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Nice chatper to me, but, just now, 20 years later, Kaido doesn't want the samurais dead to get some info? Why? Any ideas someone? …
Anyway, that seems to makes a considerable part of the flashback to be about the clash between a not so smart but cool/good Oden and a not so smart evil villian Kaido. At least they throw good punches.
Starting out, we get a resolution to Hyori and Denjiro faked Komurasaki's death and it's… kinda unsatisfying. Blood bags under her clothes? Really? How did that not get discovered? During that one big feast in volumes 92 and 93 we see that Orochi isn't shy about putting his arms around her and pulling her close, and neither Hyori nor Denjiro take any drastic steps to enforce a hands-off policy.
https://i.imgur.com/bQ2UAgi.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/lTz0cnC.png
Even under all those layers, it would be hard for her to be sure he wouldn't feel or hear a big bag of blood sloshing around. It's a super risky contingency to have committed to. And I don't want to get too deep into the debate about whether or not a woman in Hyori's position with her title would realistically be sleeping with her clients, but if any part of her job does involve taking her clothes off, this scheme gets twice as hard to conceal all over again! I would have preferred Denjiro to have picked up a devil fruit to facilitate the ruse or using a trick sword with a blunt edge and pump connected to a blood bag on his far less likely to be touched body.
Underwhelming, but not the end of the world.
This seems to be more like an aesthetic preference on your part, that makes you feel unconfortable about Hiyori, Captain. To me that's not the case. The thing is: how lovely can a prostitute be? I think it's quite possible, (I remember some movies about men falling in love of a lovely human beings who happened to be prostitutes), and in fact I find her as lovely as believable as character. She lost her parents due to a massive tragedy, and had to love their killer only on the basis that she would have her revenge and would be able to meet the only family she has 20 years in the future. The image of she playing the chamise under the mask to hide her tears depicts clearly both her tragedy and her deep strong will. That's how I see her (not talking as a fanboy).
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There's a lot more weird stuff surrounding Kanjuro all the way back to his introduction, which one can catch on a quick reread.
- He "accidentally" let some Dressrosians climb up the King's Plateau.
- He doesn't hate dragons like how Kin'emon does, enough to draw one.
- He was the only one aside from Brook that knew Nami, Robin and Shinobu were in the bathhouse, when it was raided by Drake and Hawkins.
- Jack somehow knows "only" Raizo was at Zou, something only Kinemon and Kanjuro would be aware of.
I know that all but still the left hand Stift is hilarious
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Don't forget that when Doula Mongo gave the local rewards, Kin'emon got one but Kanjuro didnt.
Still, feels a bit poor that Oda is fixing everything around this arc by adding a 'Kurozomi' on his characters.
So either way, he didnt want to get all political with a conflict between pro-open borders vs pro-isolationistsOr, we're heading straight towards to Kurozomi O-tama, in which we re-learn that the son doesn't have to pay for the crimes of the father.
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File me into the group of people that believed it was possible for him to be a traitor but liked him so much they chose not to believe it. Honestly I liked his art style and the whole dragon on Zou moment made me be like no this sweet man and his sweet drawings must be innocent! It was all lies !!! The fact that he can actually draw perfectly is such a nice touch. He will redeem himself. There is no way he won't.
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Kanjuro noted how his drawings dissolve when they come in contact with water, and his drawn cat while climbing Zunisha did dissolve. However, in this chapter his drawn clone could ride through a storm on a small boat just fine.
So did he dismiss the cat on his own and the water was just an excuse?
Yeah, he commanded it. The dragon was just as tired and disappeared.
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Don't forget that when Doula Mongo gave the local rewards, Kin'emon got one but Kanjuro didnt.
Kanjuro was not introduced at that point, hence why he didn't get a bounty.
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tooo lazy to double check, but I seem to recall, the rewards only came after Sugar was downed, at which point Kanjuro was already introduced.
Unless I'm forgetting something, Ch. 746 introduced the stars/bounties, while Ch. 954 formally introduced Kanjuro, who was still stuck underground.
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There's a lot more weird stuff surrounding Kanjuro all the way back to his introduction, which one can catch on a quick reread.
- He "accidentally" let some Dressrosians climb up the King's Plateau.
- He doesn't hate dragons like how Kin'emon does, enough to draw one.
- He was the only one aside from Brook that knew Nami, Robin and Shinobu were in the bathhouse, when it was raided by Drake and Hawkins.
- Jack somehow knows "only" Raizo was at Zou, something only Kinemon and Kanjuro would be aware of.
IIRC, in the manga panel showing our time travelers having just arrived 20 years in the future, you can see Kanjuro's "birds" flying high overhead.
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Kanjuro noted how his drawings dissolve when they come in contact with water, and his drawn cat while climbing Zunisha did dissolve. However, in this chapter his drawn clone could ride through a storm on a small boat just fine.
So did he dismiss the cat on his own and the water was just an excuse?
It may depend on the amount of water.
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Am I the only one who thought of the Kandra from the Mist born series when they showed a blob who perfectly acts his role as a spy
Now that you say it, it kinda fits.
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Nice chatper to me, but, just now, 20 years later, Kaido doesn't want the samurais dead to get some info? Why? Any ideas someone? …
Probably something related to Ponegliffs.
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Nice chatper to me, but, just now, 20 years later, Kaido doesn't want the samurais dead to get some info? Why? Any ideas someone? …
He's decided he has an interest in the One Piece or some other aspect of Roger's life, and knowing that the samurai's leader was part of Roger's crew, he thinks they might have been told something important. This was laid out all the way back on Zou.
This seems to be more like an aesthetic preference on your part, that makes you feel unconfortable about Hiyori, Captain. To me that's not the case. The thing is: how lovely can a prostitute be? I think it's quite possible, (I remember some movies about men falling in love of a lovely human beings who happened to be prostitutes), and in fact I find her as lovely as believable as character. She lost her parents due to a massive tragedy, and had to love their killer only on the basis that she would have her revenge and would be able to meet the only family she has 20 years in the future. The image of she playing the chamise under the mask to hide her tears depicts clearly both her tragedy and her deep strong will. That's how I see her (not talking as a fanboy).
I never said I was uncomfortable, only that I don't want to get into it. Few of the discussions I've seen on the topic have been particularly kind to sex workers. I don't think Hyori would be devalued as a person if it turned out she was sleeping with her clients. I also know that while he is writing for essentially a YA audience and has some limits related to that, Oda isn't the kind of author who thinks his heroines have to be totally chaste to be good people (Viola is an especially good example of this).
But on the other hand, it seems realistic Denjiro would shelter her a little, and, to reiterate the point I was making, doing that kind of thing would make it very hard to keep a blood bag hidden at all times.
I've seen people cite different sources saying an oiran would and wouldn't be having sex as part of the job historically. I'm not invested enough to have really done my own research.
So yeah, I didn't want to get into a debate over it because there's strong points for both sides and I wouldn't have a problem with either outcome being locked in. And I could also totally see Oda going either way (slyly, like with Viola if he does confirm it) or just dodging the question if it comes up in an SBS.
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:) I really just meant that realism shouldn't be something to even get bothered with. It's a fantasy story, written for kids: it should mostly be fun, original, engaging and possibly educative (i.e. teach some sort of values), but it doesn't need to be realistic. That's what I meant when I said "enjoy it as it is narrated".
I would say my issue isn't with realism but with believability. Something like changing your face through anger or performing plastic surgery with a kick isn't at all realistic but is doesn't contradict anything else established in the story, nor does it create issues with characterisation or require characters to deny their own senses. For hidden blood bags, it boggles the mind that they could carry enough blood to be useful and not be felt or seen at any point in Hyori's very interpersonal line of work. It's a missed moment for attention to detail when that kind of tactile thing is overlooked.
I love One Piece's fantastical elements, and one reveal not measuring up to the rest isn't going to change that.
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Which isn't really contradicting anything though. Even by your own logic, the thing was never really established, touched on or commented by characters in order for it to contradict anything.
Like you would've had a point if Orochi say, for example, actually commented that he or his staff "searched" Hiyori and didn't find anything only for the blood-bags to be just hidden….in air and were used only seconds later then yeah, that would be a contradiction.
But in this case, the blood-bag is just mentioned in this way as a quick way to answer how Kyoshiro "faked" Hiyori's death. I would've preferred it if Oda didn't answer that as it was pretty straightforward and this just comes across as a pointless reveal (though it matches up with Hiyori's entire character so far; pointless) but I wouldn't go as far as to say that it was somehow contradicting anything.
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I thougth one possibility to explain Hiyori's apparent dead was that she was a fruit user. That's not now, but maybe she is a fruir user after all.
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Was this posted explaining the poor paintings by Kanjuro?
He seems to be right handed but all shit paintings he has done with his left hand LOL
https://i.ibb.co/QQyzBD1/8030s.jpgI had missed your post earlier, that's a brilliant catch. Oda foreshadowing at his best and hiding the truth all along under our very noses.
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No, many of us suspected Kanjuro as being up to something since he didn’t get a Doffy-issued bounty.
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@Gecko:
No, many of us suspected Kanjuro as being up to something since he didn’t get a Doffy-issued bounty.
Again, that is because he was formally introduced after the chapter where everyone got their bounties/stars.
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Which isn't really contradicting anything though. Even by your own logic, the thing was never really established, touched on or commented by characters in order for it to contradict anything.
Like you would've had a point if Orochi say, for example, actually commented that he or his staff "searched" Hiyori and didn't find anything only for the blood-bags to be just hidden….in air and were used only seconds later then yeah, that would be a contradiction.
But in this case, the blood-bag is just mentioned in this way as a quick way to answer how Kyoshiro "faked" Hiyori's death. I would've preferred it if Oda didn't answer that as it was pretty straightforward and this just comes across as a pointless reveal (though it matches up with Hiyori's entire character so far; pointless) but I wouldn't go as far as to say that it was somehow contradicting anything.
I mean you can see him putting his arm around her and pulling her in close during the banquet scene. It looks close enough to me that I think I'd struggle to hide even a hot water bottle sized bag of blood from someone who didn't know it was there, or at least be constantly paranoid about him putting his hands just wrong to get a feel of it. The contradiction is against the visuals/my understanding of how human senses works, which is a whole different game to magical stuff and impossible physical feats. It's not a plot hole or worldbuilding type of contradiction, it's just a thing that doesn't cognitively gel for me.
But yeah, I agree that it's a pretty inconsequential reveal that Oda obviously felt justified taking the quick and easy way out of. It's really not the end of the world.
I thougth one possibility to explain Hiyori's apparent dead was that she was a fruit user. That's not now, but maybe she is a fruir user after all.
I would have liked this option (or Denjiro being the fruit user instead) a lot more than what we got.
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@Gecko:
No, many of us suspected Kanjuro as being up to something since he didn’t get a Doffy-issued bounty.
Oh, I didn't mean that in the sense he wasn't considered a potential traitor. There was quite a bit of suspicion around Kanjuro indeed, including some people who mentioned he could be really gifted at painting but faking.
The sleight of (left) hand however, no-one noticed before as far as I can tell and that's the kind of detail I love in One Piece.Regardless, I don't think Doflamingo was ever in the know about Kanjuro being a traitor. I even doubt Kaido knew his real identity until recently : we only ever see Orochi confirming to him that there is a spy among the scabbards, not who he is. All Kaido would have needed to tell Doffy is "2 samurais and a kid made land on Dressrosa, capture them alive".
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Now i'm picturing Kanjuro having some drinks in the pool with Doffy in Dressrosa while Kinemon and Momo were meeting with the Strawhats in Punk Hazard
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I mean you can see him putting his arm around her and pulling her in close during the banquet scene. It looks close enough to me that I think I'd struggle to hide even a hot water bottle sized bag of blood from someone who didn't know it was there, or at least be constantly paranoid about him putting his hands just wrong to get a feel of it. The contradiction is against the visuals/my understanding of how human senses works, which is a whole different game to magical stuff and impossible physical feats. It's not a plot hole or worldbuilding type of contradiction, it's just a thing that doesn't cognitively gel for me.
Personally, the idea didn't feel contrived at all to me. Maybe I feel like this because it is a very standard for fiction to have this kind of shenanigan, so I'm biased by the vissitudes of narrative media.
Anyway, even after thinking about it, it doesn't look as unlikely as you argue. A bag of blood for such a situation doesn't need to be big, not something that should cover your entire belly. A small container is enough, and you can hide it inside your kimono in many different ways. One nice idea would be sew it up in a hidden pocket inside the fabric of the kimono, so you can move freely and even undress without worrying.
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I mean you can see him putting his arm around her and pulling her in close during the banquet scene. It looks close enough to me that I think I'd struggle to hide even a hot water bottle sized bag of blood from someone who didn't know it was there, or at least be constantly paranoid about him putting his hands just wrong to get a feel of it. The contradiction is against the visuals/my understanding of how human senses works, which is a whole different game to magical stuff and impossible physical feats. It's not a plot hole or worldbuilding type of contradiction, it's just a thing that doesn't cognitively gel for me.
If it helps, I am pretty sure that kind of kimono Komurasaki wears has like 5 layers or so of clothing, so hiding something in there shouldn't be a problem.
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Anyone know which site releases the new One Piece chapters the fastest?
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Now i'm picturing Kanjuro having some drinks in the pool with Doffy in Dressrosa while Kinemon and Momo were meeting with the Strawhats in Punk Hazard
Unlikely since he was still playing his role as a real Kouzuki. I doubt he even know about Doffy, since the contact method was one sided. Just Kan sending info or so I understood.
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Anyone know which site releases the new One Piece chapters the fastest?
http://mangaplus.shueisha.co.jp/ They're simultaneous with the official japanese release and available even in remote corners of the world where Viz isn't present Such as France.
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You know, seeing Orochi show unquestionable trust in Kanjuro words makes really weird how in chapter 955 he immediately regarded his report on Udon as false and brushed it off calling him an "untrustworthy fool" for that just because someone on the phone said "nah, everything is fine here".
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That was Babanuki no? I guess Kanjuro just didn't know about Tama.
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Everybody knows Babanuki can't tell a lie.
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That was Babanuki no? I guess Kanjuro just didn't know about Tama.
Yes, it was probably him. What I am saying is that in 974 we saw Orochi vow his full trust on Kanjuro words, but 20 chapters ago we saw him instantly disregard his report about Udon and casually call him untrustworthy just because someone (probably Babanuki) by the phone said the info didn't check.
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Yeah but if Kanjuro just said something like; "Udon has been taken over" and Orochi calls and is told by the warden; "No. It's all good here". I understand.
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Funny that everyone makes fun of Orochi being paranoid but his undoing is gonna be not being paranoid enough.
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Still can't get over the fact that he left them a small boat to try and reach Onigashima with, just to sink them later in the middle of the sea.
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@.access:
Yes, it was probably him. What I am saying is that in 974 we saw Orochi vow his full trust on Kanjuro words, but 20 chapters ago we saw him instantly disregard his report about Udon and casually call him untrustworthy just because someone (probably Babanuki) by the phone said the info didn't check.
You mean that panel in 955 ? I read that as the opposite. Guy on the phone reports that everything is fine in Udon ; However Orochi knows better thanks to his trusted informer, and thus dismisses the phone call as untrustworthy.
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You mean that panel in 955 ? I read that as the opposite. Guy on the phone reports that everything is fine in Udon ; However Orochi knows better thanks to his trusted informer, and thus dismisses the phone call as untrustworthy.
Yeah, ace just got that part kind of wrong
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You mean that panel in 955 ? I read that as the opposite. Guy on the phone reports that everything is fine in Udon ; However Orochi knows better thanks to his trusted informer, and thus dismisses the phone call as untrustworthy.
I don't think so, immediately before that line he even questions himself "hmm. was it a bad report?". And the fact he instantly brushes off the entire Udon matter makes clear he sided with the "everything is fine" information and ultimately disregarded Kanjuro's report.
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I think that if you consider that they never found Raizo in Zou and the Prision in Udon have been Holocausting people uninterruptedly for 20 years without mayor issues, it does makes the report a bit hard to believe in the eyes of Orochi
