I'll take multi chapters of Luffy vs Katakuri over the crew STILL running away.
oh wait
Chapter 896: The Last Request
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Had a bad week.
But honestly. I'm at a point in my personal One Piece fan-career (fuck is that even a thing? I dunno) where I am kind of done with the usual routine. This arc started out great, but it feels like Oda is treading water now, and this fight, while visually superb has gone on way too long and has had no real development beside of telling us what we already knew about Haki.
I've been following this shit for almost ten years now. I'm here for the long term payoffs, and when short-term stuff like this drags the story down It annoys me. Doflamingo vs Luffy is a long-term payoff, Luffy vs Katakuri is a short-term annoyance.
But that's MY hangup. about a series that is not in ANY way written to suit MY interests and needs. I'm reading a teenagers comic book. Gotta take the good with the bad because that's life.
And if you think my "anger" is directed at anyone here, then get your head out of your ass. I don't waste my time personally attacking people on the internet.
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Not surprising enough I found the Mango fight like an annoyance to get over with. While this just confirms what I suspected about Luffy's standing in the world.
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This post is deleted!
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Personally, I rather enjoyed the fight.
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@S.C.:
Personally, I rather enjoyed the fight.
Me too. Some people are freaking out about for some reason but I don't get it. Some people are saying Luffy too way too much damage, but I distinctly remember Luffy taking several of Lucci's secret technique and still getting up.
Purely coincidence
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Excited to see how the rest of the world reacts to the straw hats screw over big mom's crew. With only half of their crew. They stole the poneglyphs, took out a top contender AND WILL escape.
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Excited to see how the rest of the world reacts to the straw hats screw over big mom's crew. With only half of their crew. They stole the poneglyphs, took out a top contender AND WILL escape.
I think the details will be blurred a bit. The headline will be "STRAWHATS WREAK HAVOC THROUGH BIG MOM'S TERRITORY AND GET AWAY WITH IT".
Purely coincidence
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Hello I also posted it in the arc thread, just in case. Here is the compilation of Luffy and Katakuri's entire fight.
Monkey D Luffy vs Charlotte Katakuri
Nyhohoho!
My sig is a character from Tokyo Ghoul but the quote is from Zenyatta, an Overwatch hero.Thank! I knew the art was familiar :) I watched the anime and will someday read the manga.
I'll check out the fights compilation as well:wub:
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The fight in his entirety was a boring one. The previous chapter however was pretty good(kind of reminded me hajime no ippo at the start). The ending was ok. So overall I don't consider it one of the best match of One Piece or at least I hope it is not.
As for luffy being able to outlast Dogtooth I was pretty meh about it. People just have different stats with Dogtooth not being to resistant. Or too good a puncher. My take on the whole thing was that his usual tactic is to avoid and beat you to a pulp until you eventually can't go anymore. Sadly Luffy could punch him so he fell first.
The chapter was ok. I wonder what is Sanji's plan to get Luffy out of there.
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I think the details will be blurred a bit. The headline will be "STRAWHATS WREAK HAVOC THROUGH BIG MOM'S TERRITORY AND GET AWAY WITH IT".
I agree with you. It won't specify any details or what actually occurred. Just the main points. I expect akainu to take some kind of action towards these developments. I'm also hoping to see a shanks reaction, been awhile since we've had one of those
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Me too. Some people are freaking out about for some reason but I don't get it. Some people are saying Luffy too way too much damage, but I distinctly remember Luffy taking several of Lucci's secret technique and still getting up.
I think he actually was put more through the ringer with Cracker, truth be told. The fight lasted longer, he had Nami to help him and Cracker almost cut his arm off.
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Katakuri fans
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Katakuri better remember to return that hat after he becomes a great pirate.
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By the way, if Katakuri had hit Luffy with Diced Mochi, shouldn't Luffy had been stickied to it?
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Me too. Some people are freaking out about for some reason but I don't get it. Some people are saying Luffy too way too much damage, but I distinctly remember Luffy taking several of Lucci's secret technique and still getting up.
Nope, Luffy was deflecting majority of the attacks due to the rubber, and the fight took like 1 hour(probably less), and it wasn't a beat down, but an even fight, where luffy was getting the edge until the Rokugan. And Luffy only endured 3 Rokugan attacks and with much help from Ussop, and after that he couldn't even move.
You Have:
- Rubber Deflects attacks
- 1 hour fight
- Even fight
- endured 3 Rokugan
- Stamina ended after that fight
That is Lucci, now Katakuri
- No Rubber deflection due to Armament Haki, not even in Gear 4th
- at least 8 hours fighting
- Beat Down all throughout the fight. And Luffy basically couldn't even hit Katakuri for most of the fight. The times he hit Katakuri can almost be counted by 2 hands.
- Endured, being beat for 8 hours, at least 2 times being buried alive with mochi, taking Multiple Advanced Armament Haki Donut Attacks, Getting 1/4th of his stomach taken, at least 2 Grilled Mochis, 2 Miced Mochis.
- Still got up and walked after the fight
How you can think is the same thing, is like you thinking 100 dollars is the same as 1000.000 dollars given the fact that both are many multiples of 1 dollar.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Good Books for Katakuri:
- The Art of Honour: Why family treason is not honorable
- How to end your enemy in less than 8 hours, for dummies.
- What to do when your opponent is a auto-Phoenix-down Hack?
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Luffy has always pulled off ridiculous feats of endurance. Remember when he had to climb a vertical mountain for hours on end with his fingertips while carrying two of his friends in freezing temperatures in shorts and a vest? The Katakuri fight isn't nearly as ridiculous as that. At least he had breaks there.
Purely coincidence
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@Long:
Found this on reddit and though I dont believe its a reference the explanation of it makes enough sense, katakuri was on the offensive for much of itand was clearly getting more tired as it went on
Only difference is that this isn't boxing, and fighters don't have limitation of what they can do to their opponents, nor rest time, nor rounds, nor rather "martial art" style that they have to use. But Okay, is "just like" boxing, but without everything that makes boxing a sport.
This wasn't even a freestyle martial arts fight, a like Dragon Ball Tenkaichi Budokai, but for some reason you believe the same strategy makes sense.
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People are forgetting that this fight has technically been two fights, and that Luffy and Katakuri had time to rest off most of their damage after Luffy escaped to nuts Island. Once he came back, the second fight wasn't as one sided as the first one.
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Yeeeaah I can't really get behind any argument that this battle was unnecessary. Its benefits for Luffy aside, it would have been a disservice to all of Katakuri's actions during and beyond the wedding for him to go out without this much effort from Luffy.
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@No:
Katakuri better remember to return that hat after he becomes a great pirate.
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Only difference is that this isn't boxing, and fighters don't have limitation of what they can do to their opponents, nor rest time, nor rounds, nor rather "martial art" style that they have to use. But Okay, is "just like" boxing, but without everything that makes boxing a sport.
This wasn't even a freestyle martial arts fight, a like Dragon Ball Tenkaichi Budokai, but for some reason you believe the same strategy makes sense.
Even if there arent rules here, the thing still makes sense since katakuri was basically attacking him and spamming observation haki and CoO while luffy dodged him while he could and absorbed the blows when he couldn't. I'm not even saying it was a strategy but if you dont think exhaustion played a role here I dont know how to continue on.
Chapter 437 Discussion after franky decides to join the Strawhats:
So who think Usopp is inside that duffelbag?
H x H Chimera Ant Arc / OP Manga Spoiler
Spoiler:
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Luffy has always pulled off ridiculous feats of endurance. Remember when he had to climb a vertical mountain for hours on end with his fingertips while carrying two of his friends in freezing temperatures in shorts and a vest? The Katakuri fight isn't nearly as ridiculous as that. At least he had breaks there.
Where did you took the "hours", and since when carrying two people and climbing with Luffy Strength is that hard? Also are you forgetting that he is Rubber?
The major problems were the frezzing and the fact that he almost left them fall and scraped his fingers pretty badly.While this is bad, I don't understand why you think being Buried alive 2 times, cut 1/4 of his stomach, being powned for hours without end, is the exact same thing, or comparable.
Ah, and remember that after that climb, luffy passed out, and was gonna die if not treated. Against Katakuri he waited 7 minutes and got up like nothing happened.
Again, treating endurance feats like they are the same, even though one is 10 to 1000000 times harder, just because they are both endurance feats. This is not how things work!
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Only difference is that this isn't boxing, and fighters don't have limitation of what they can do to their opponents, nor rest time, nor rounds, nor rather "martial art" style that they have to use. But Okay, is "just like" boxing, but without everything that makes boxing a sport.
This wasn't even a freestyle martial arts fight, a like Dragon Ball Tenkaichi Budokai, but for some reason you believe the same strategy makes sense.
wait… wut?
this is a physical fight.. not chess.. I don't even like the outcome but the analogy is pretty much spot on. -
@Long:
Even if there arent rules here, the thing still makes sense since katakuri was basically attacking him and spamming observation haki and CoO while luffy dodged him while he could and absorbed the blows when he couldn't. I'm not even saying it was a strategy but if you dont think exhaustion played a role here I dont know how to continue on.
Again, here he doesn't have a referee to stop the one beating, from keeping to pummeling the other. Also they have rest time, where they get water and all kinds of treatment. Also the way of attack has to be the same even if it isn't effective, because you can't do anything outside of boxing.
The situations are totally different, this strategy only work in "real life" if the guy stronger is a total incompetent.
I don't even know if, and don't believe ever happened, one would be able to simulate that "strategy" in a MMA fight, where the rules are just a "little" more lax than Boxing.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
wait… wut?
this is a physical fight.. not chess.. I don't even like the outcome but the analogy is pretty much spot on.wait… wut?
They are both physical fights? So is the exact same thing? And total equivalent? So Boxing and Wrestling are pretty much spot on analogies?
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Nope, Luffy was deflecting majority of the attacks due to the rubber, and the fight took like 1 hour(probably less), and it wasn't a beat down, but an even fight, where luffy was getting the edge until the Rokugan. And Luffy only endured 3 Rokugan attacks and with much help from Ussop, and after that he couldn't even move.
You Have:
- Rubber Deflects attacks
- 1 hour fight
- Even fight
- endured 3 Rokugan
- Stamina ended after that fight
That is Lucci, now Katakuri
- No Rubber deflection due to Armament Haki, not even in Gear 4th
- at least 8 hours fighting
- Beat Down all throughout the fight. And Luffy basically couldn't even hit Katakuri for most of the fight. The times he hit Katakuri can almost be counted by 2 hands.
- Endured, being beat for 8 hours, at least 2 times being buried alive with mochi, taking Multiple Advanced Armament Haki Donut Attacks, Getting 1/4th of his stomach taken, at least 2 Grilled Mochis, 2 Miced Mochis.
- Still got up and walked after the fight
How you can think is the same thing, is like you thinking 100 dollars is the same as 1000.000 dollars given the fact that both are many multiples of 1 dollar.
What do you know about what happened in the countless hours of off panel? The fact that Katrakuri realised Luffy couldn't dodge at one particular moment, he was extremely surprised at how stupid of a mistake Luffy made but then said to Luffy after many hours of fighting that Luffy is not someone below his level.
Not to mention do you guys skip when Katakuri is huffing and puffing?
Sure there are some stats like Armament Haki is stronger, but in the overall scheme Luffy won.
Also in gear fourth, he does have rubber deflection lol;
The hits that Luffy did were, umm, I'm not sure if you can remember but this is Luffys normal punch in Gear 4.
Also that was Luffy pre time-skip. If you want to compare the training and fights he had been through during and before Lucci, then I'm afraid you need to catch up with the story.
People think Luffy's stamina can't be improved..
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By the way, if Katakuri had hit Luffy with Diced Mochi, shouldn't Luffy had been stickied to it?
It did hit, the only reason people are saying it didn't is because the spoiler provider mistook it so. Otherwise no one would be getting that impression from the chapter.
As for the sticking, maybe Katakuri went full solid this time for max damage.
@K.:
Not surprising enough I found the Mango fight like an annoyance to get over with.
Oh god, yes. Doflamingo is one of my top favorite characters in OP but god damn that fight was a bore. I don't care if the stakes were much higher there, I found this one infinitely more appealing.
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@Kaido:
I do think the complaints of Luffy having plot armor are rather silly; he's taken much worse abuse over the span of the series. However, I think the fight would've been greatly improved if Luffy had used some more creative ways to take on Katakuri's attacks than just dodging/tanking them - like eating the mochi, for example, or using the twists and turns of the Mirro-World to his advantage. Luffy outlasting Katakuri did make sense, but it felt a lot like a foregone conclusion and the journey to get there just didn't feel all that interesting. Katakuri displayed a ton of creativity in his attacks, but Luffy's methods of dealing with that weren't so much.
I think Oda is definitely improving when it comes to drawing longer battles, it's certainly a lot better than what the Cracker fight ended up being and while the Gear Fourth recharge moment was still a bit clunky it thankfully wasn't given a ton of focus. Here's hoping Oda continues on an upward swing here.
He will. You can tell he's back in his writer's flow. Plus the awesome near-endgame and endgame stuff of One Piece is near impossible to flub, and Oda's too adept at writing to mess it up.
Croc or Enel would never.Wanna see the "ancient civilization destroyed" thing done really well? FFXIV did a great take on it. The bar's high for One Piece to beat.
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Where did you took the "hours", and since when carrying two people and climbing with Luffy Strength is that hard? Also are you forgetting that he is Rubber?
The major problems were the frezzing and the fact that he almost left them fall and scraped his fingers pretty badly.While this is bad, I don't understand why you think being Buried alive 2 times, cut 1/4 of his stomach, being powned for hours without end, is the exact same thing, or comparable.
Luffy was never powend for hours on end, people need to read the fight again, and if you compare it to Lucci, it's pretty much the same, Luffy is figuring out how to beat him and get around him.
Ah, and remember that after that climb, luffy passed out, and was gonna die if not treated. Against Katakuri he waited 7 minutes and got up like nothing happened.
Yea, Luffy got up like nooothing happened. That's why he's crawling pulling himself with one arm.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Only difference is that this isn't boxing, and fighters don't have limitation of what they can do to their opponents, nor rest time, nor rounds, nor rather "martial art" style that they have to use. But Okay, is "just like" boxing, but without everything that makes boxing a sport.
This wasn't even a freestyle martial arts fight, a like Dragon Ball Tenkaichi Budokai, but for some reason you believe the same strategy makes sense.
Dude this isn't a Luffy VS Katakuri fight was like boxing comparison.
The point is one guy that's smaller took many hits well, where as his opponent got tired and then he took out the bigger and stronger guy with a punch.
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Where did you took the "hours", and since when carrying two people and climbing with Luffy Strength is that hard? Also are you forgetting that he is Rubber?
The major problems were the frezzing and the fact that he almost left them fall and scraped his fingers pretty badly.While this is bad, I don't understand why you think being Buried alive 2 times, cut 1/4 of his stomach, being powned for hours without end, is the exact same thing, or comparable.
Ah, and remember that after that climb, luffy passed out, and was gonna die if not treated. Against Katakuri he waited 7 minutes and got up like nothing happened.
Again, treating endurance feats like they are the same, even though one is 10 to 1000000 times harder, just because they are both endurance feats. This is not how things work!
Are you sure about that?
IF YOU DIE, I'LL KILL YOU….
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BMP incompetence is getting to staggering levels, none of them smoke a cigarette, are they telling me no one could smell Sanji's cigarette? Better, someone to sense him?
IF YOU DIE, I'LL KILL YOU….
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@Kaido:
I'm not too big of a fan of the lack of impact in the final blows, but Luffy and Katakuri's final exchange was pleasant.
After re-reading the chapter a couple of times, yeah, me neither. I don't really get why Oda had to make the final blows ambiguous.
Also that was Luffy pre time-skip. If you want to compare the training and fights he had been through during and before Lucci, then I'm afraid you need to catch up with the story.
People think Luffy's stamina can't be improved..
Thanks, was about to say this myself. Some people think present Luffy is physically the same as his old self, which is a huge problem - Luffy trained under RAYLEIGH, the Pirate King's right hand, for TWO YEARS. Once again, some people are underestimating Luffy way too much.
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BMP incompetence is getting to staggering levels, none of them smoke a cigarette, are they telling me no one could smell Sanji's cigarette? Better, someone to sense him?
This is a very good point.
This in no way is meant to defend it in-universe, but out-of-universe I see Sanji's cigarettes as a stylistic choice. Again, in-universe they should detect him, but I'm willing to sort of suspend my disbelief because Oda's probably just doing it because he likes drawing cigarette smoke (like a lot of authors).
But yes they should totally be able to catch him based off of that.
Croc or Enel would never.Wanna see the "ancient civilization destroyed" thing done really well? FFXIV did a great take on it. The bar's high for One Piece to beat.
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Where did you took the "hours"
From the Odabox that said "3 hours later" after he started climbing, and then after that, the panels of snow falling long enough that it almost completely cover a tree.
Again, treating endurance feats like they are the same, even though one is 10 to 1000000 times harder, just because they are both endurance feats. This is not how things work!
I'm not saying they're the same, I'm saying that the stuff on Drum was harder than the Katakuri fight. Luffy with pre-TS strength climbing the Drum rockies required more of his strength. Also, I guarantee that he's barely standing now. He's running on willpower alone. On Drum his will went towards the goal of "get to the top" that's when he passed out, here, his will is going towards "get back to the sunny", that's when he'll crumble.
BMP incompetence is getting to staggering levels, none of them smoke a cigarette, are they telling me no one could smell Sanji's cigarette? Better, someone to sense him?
What? Was it started somewhere that none of the BMP smoked? Bege was a BMP and he smokes constantly. They have tens of thousands of troops here, there must be a few smokers between them.
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Have anybody mentioned that Katakuri is going to wear that hat after he wakes up? I wonder how he is going to change since this fight is over.
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Are you sure about that?
you have a chapter that is 2 hours of the fight, you havent being paying attention. After those 2 hours they fought 1 more hour, and Before all that they were fighting already around 5 hours. So yes they have been fighting for a lot of houra, and in all of them, Luffy taking a beaten, even in the gear 4th Snakemen phase.
The second phase of the fight, was worst. In the first Katakuri was only showing is superiority by matching Luffy attacks and making them stronger, by the 2nd fight Katakuri was using, and beaying luffy, with the Donuts advanced haki arms, the onrs that totally plummeted tankman gear 4th, and this time with Luffy base
Form. And all of his attacks were from here forth advanced haki attacks.Ok, tou think that climbing a mountain is harder than being beaten massively for almost 3 times the amount of the climb. I guess than, Crocodile, Enel, Lucci, Moria, Magelian, Ace,… More easily would take the beating than climb.
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Good thing about ending of this fight is anime can't end it with pushing contest
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I'm glad Katakuri didn't really lose. Otherwise OnePiece would have become like FairyTail. I'm good about powering-up during the fight, but doing so and eventually beating the guy that was 100times stronger at the outset would be ridiculous
I think the details will be blurred a bit. The headline will be "STRAWHATS WREAK HAVOC THROUGH BIG MOM'S TERRITORY AND GET AWAY WITH IT".
lol, I hope Morgan doesn't work for a tabloïd
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What do you know about what happened in the countless hours of off panel? The fact that Katrakuri realised Luffy couldn't dodge at one particular moment, he was extremely surprised at how stupid of a mistake Luffy made but then said to Luffy after many hours of fighting that Luffy is not someone below his level.
Not to mention do you guys skip when Katakuri is huffing and puffing?
Sure there are some stats like Armament Haki is stronger, but in the overall scheme Luffy won.
Also in gear fourth, he does have rubber deflection lol;
The hits that Luffy did were, umm, I'm not sure if you can remember but this is Luffys normal punch in Gear 4.
Also that was Luffy pre time-skip. If you want to compare the training and fights he had been through during and before Lucci, then I'm afraid you need to catch up with the story.
People think Luffy's stamina can't be improved..
I'm sure they were taking tea during the offscreen portion of the fight.
Katakuri -> Thought this, Said this, do this. If had though or said that Luffy was stronger than him, and let Luffy beat him, would that make it automatically so?
He was beating Luffy pretty badly and he came with the "now we are equal", it made no sense, so much that Luffy got a big boost with gear 4th Snakemen, and Katakuri was still embarrassingly beating Luffy. But of course they are "equal" because Katakuri said so.Lol, you totally don't know how armament haki works, even after this long in the series, and after showing Katakuri punching Luffy gear 4th and he taking all the attack, and the clatch of both their fists and Luffy felling hurt with that, and so many actual showing during the fight. But of course, Doflamingo wasn't able to pass Luffy rubber deflection while he was in gear 4th, so this means Katakuri couldn't either.
Again using Luffy example against Doflamingo. You also forgot that in snakemen he didn't do a Kong Gun, but Culverin, that Doflamingo took and didn't fly anywhere.
With Katakuri Luffy Gear 4th Tankman attacks that hit him: 2 Kong Guns and 1 Rhino Scheiner didn't had such a destructive effect, Katakuri didn't even fall down by them. Against Gear Snakeman, Luffy hit him with 4-5 Culverins, yep in the entire fight,that did practically nothing, and with a King Cobra.
In fact Katakuri had an clatch of fist against Luffy Snakeman, luffy Culvering against Katakuri advanced haki, and Luffy Lost. So his attacks do more damage. If you arguing that Luffy attacks are highly destructive, you just have that Katakuri ones are moreso.Who used pretimeskip for anything? You're talking of the climb Drum kingdom example the other poster used? Well, with our without training, climbing a mountain like Luffy did is easier than what happened in this fight. For one people in real life do things similar, even though in a huge degree than what Luffy did. But it just doesn't happen for the fight. In real life those fight take seconds, and short minutes if the strong guy is showing his supermacy first.
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I can't empathize with the people crying asspull or plot armor over Luffy beating Katakuri. Like people have been saying that Katakuri is near Admiral level. Like what? What kind of a joke is that. People also claim that Luffy had no business beating Katakuri because he struggled with Doffy… Like, is it impossible that Doffy was, in fact, stronger than Katakuri? Just because he's a warlord doesn't mean otherwise - to make that claim is no different than saying Luffy is half the bounty as Katakuri and that's why he shouldn't have won. The positions that these people have aren't indicative of their power levels, and One Piece in particular has always been special in that the lines of power are blurry as they are in real life. This is all to say nothing that the themes of Katakuri's fight with Luffy, their mutual respect, the battle for image of perfection, Katakuri's own demons and the parallels between him and Pudding. Like, did that whole thing completely go over the heads of most readers? In my mind it's possible that Katakuri may have given Luffy a huge advantage in this fight and even let him power up and assimilate a lot of future sight Haki... But it doesn't really change anything about the story. I think it makes total sense that Luffy could have beaten two Yonkou subordinates at this stage in the story.
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you have a chapter that is 2 hours of the fight, you havent being paying attention. After those 2 hours they fought 1 more hour, and Before all that they were fighting already around 5 hours. So yes they have been fighting for a lot of houra, and in all of them, Luffy taking a beaten, even in the gear 4th Snakemen phase.
The second phase of the fight, was worst. In the first Katakuri was only showing is superiority by matching Luffy attacks and making them stronger, by the 2nd fight Katakuri was using, and beaying luffy, with the Donuts advanced haki arms, the onrs that totally plummeted tankman gear 4th, and this time with Luffy base
Form. And all of his attacks were from here forth advanced haki attacks.Ok, tou think that climbing a mountain is harder than being beaten massively for almost 3 times the amount of the climb. I guess than, Crocodile, Enel, Lucci, Moria, Magelian, Ace,… More easily would take the beating than climb.
You all can't analyze fight for shit. Luffy took attacks he wanted to, he tanked some by choice, took some with Haki (which reduce the damage intake) and dodged a lot. He made one mistake the entire fight, when flampe interfered. Some of Katakuri attacks were stupidly pointless, like the diced mochi body slam, yeah body slam Luffy till next week, it has no effect. The only meaningful part of the attack was when the spikes hit Luffy.
1st phase of the fight, Luffy went head on with Katakuri and Luffy saw it was pointless. He stopped attacking and continue to watch Katakuri, looking for a loophole, there was a small window Luffy took unnecessary damage, when he was worried about his crew. He found a loophole in chapter 883 and ran 3 solid attacks into Katakuri. Boundman is very powerful, Katakuri was wheezing by the 3rd attack.
2nd phase, Luffy came back looking for another way to bridge Katakuri's CoO. It seems CoO has never been an interest for Luffy and was shocked and amazed when he saw how powerful CoO can be. He decided to use the chance to study Katakuri and level up his CoO as well. As his CoO improves, Katakuri showed him it was more than CoO. Luffy started dodging and attacking at the same time, this was when Luffy took most damage because he was more vulnerable. 893/894
3rd phase, Snakeman. Sawyermage on youtube analyze the snakeman technique based on martial arts. I will employ you listen to it. At this point, Katakuri was very tired and also suffering from the self inflicted damage. If you are attacking all they long and the opponent keeps blocking and not fall, you are bound to get very tired. This method is use in boxing a lot.
Yes Katakuri was more powerful, yes he did most of the attacking, but he got tired the most. And that don't fall to the ground thing took a lot out of him, it takes a lot of energy by insisting on staying on his feet. Luffy kept his patience and attacked when the time was right.
Luffy was not pummeled as much as you may think.
IF YOU DIE, I'LL KILL YOU….
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I'm sure they were taking tea during the offscreen portion of the fight.
Katakuri -> Thought this, Said this, do this. If had though or said that Luffy was stronger than him, and let Luffy beat him, would that make it automatically so?
He was beating Luffy pretty badly and he came with the "now we are equal", it made no sense, so much that Luffy got a big boost with gear 4th Snakemen, and Katakuri was still embarrassingly beating Luffy. But of course they are "equal" because Katakuri said so.Lol, you totally don't know how armament haki works, even after this long in the series, and after showing Katakuri punching Luffy gear 4th and he taking all the attack, and the clatch of both their fists and Luffy felling hurt with that, and so many actual showing during the fight. But of course, Doflamingo wasn't able to pass Luffy rubber deflection while he was in gear 4th, so this means Katakuri couldn't either.
Again using Luffy example against Doflamingo. You also forgot that in snakemen he didn't do a Kong Gun, but Culverin, that Doflamingo took and didn't fly anywhere.
With Katakuri Luffy Gear 4th Tankman attacks that hit him: 2 Kong Guns and 1 Rhino Scheiner didn't had such a destructive effect, Katakuri didn't even fall down by them. Against Gear Snakeman, Luffy hit him with 4-5 Culverins, yep in the entire fight,that did practically nothing, and with a King Cobra.
In fact Katakuri had an clatch of fist against Luffy Snakeman, luffy Culvering against Katakuri advanced haki, and Luffy Lost. So his attacks do more damage. If you arguing that Luffy attacks are highly destructive, you just have that Katakuri ones are moreso.Who used pretimeskip for anything? You're talking of the climb Drum kingdom example the other poster used? Well, with our without training, climbing a mountain like Luffy did is easier than what happened in this fight. For one people in real life do things similar, even though in a huge degree than what Luffy did. But it just doesn't happen for the fight. In real life those fight take seconds, and short minutes if the strong guy is showing his supermacy first.
First off, I never talked about Drum. Read my post properly.
You're comparing boundman culverin vs Snakeman culverin. Theres your first mistake. Did you perhaps miss the "Jet" Culverin? Oh and wait Katakuri was already flying.
If you read the Japanese, Katakuris Haki is called super hard armoured defense. It's just harder, like me punching into a brick wall. Its the same pain,. This wasnt a you cant cut through my haki battle.
Luffys still remains rubbery when he's under Haki, or don't you get it?
Also, Luffys gear 4 boundman > Katakuris super hard armoured defense. Luffy shredded through that and also said G4 won't lose to that.
Katakuri spent hours fighting Luffy and then after he landed his spear hit and then said "That was the deciding factor in the match" he said "Just as I began to Acknwoledge you, you dissapoint me", which means in that time Luffy proved his worth as a fighter actually on his level.
Once he realised he didnt get Luffy because of his own skill, he was pissed. Luffy would NOT have been hit if it wasnt for flambe, he had been dodging for several hours and fighting back.Katakuri has said things about Luffy here and there like "I'm getting twice as beat too, people don't normally dodge my attacks".
So to say it's out of nowhere is wrong.
Luffy has been beaten by the villain or shown he doesn't have the upperhand at the start of fight a million times in the series.–- Update From New Post Merge ---
While the last blow is Ambiguous, it might be a hint that Luffy and Katakuri saw the same future and landed their big attacks. Thus meaning Luffys CoO has definetely improved since he saw the same future as Katakuri.
I like how we can now view CoO as an ACTUAL real game changer of an ability to have. Up until now people thought CoO was just non exisistent, and what an amazing Character to showcase it with.
I hope we can actually see it in effect in fights in the future, like when Luffy saw Katakuris gattling coming. Probably one of my most favourite pages.
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You all can't analyze fight for shit. Luffy took attacks he wanted to, he tanked some by choice, took some with Haki (which reduce the damage intake) and dodged a lot. He made one mistake the entire fight, when flampe interfered. Some of Katakuri attacks were stupidly pointless, like the diced mochi body slam, yeah body slam Luffy till next week, it has no effect. The only meaningful part of the attack was when the spikes hit Luffy.
1st phase of the fight, Luffy went head on with Katakuri and Luffy saw it was pointless. He stopped attacking and continue to watch Katakuri, looking for a loophole, there was a small window Luffy took unnecessary damage, when he was worried about his crew. He found a loophole in chapter 883 and ran 3 solid attacks into Katakuri. Boundman is very powerful, Katakuri was wheezing by the 3rd attack.
2nd phase, Luffy came back looking for another way to bridge Katakuri's CoO. It seems CoO has never been an interest for Luffy and was shocked and amazed when he saw how powerful CoO can be. He decided to use the chance to study Katakuri and level up his CoO as well. As his CoO improves, Katakuri showed him it was more than CoO. Luffy started dodging and attacking at the same time, this was when Luffy took most damage because he was more vulnerable. 893/894
3rd phase, Snakeman. Sawyermage on youtube analyze the snakeman technique based on martial arts. I will employ you listen to it. At this point, Katakuri was very tired and also suffering from the self inflicted damage. If you are attacking all they long and the opponent keeps blocking and not fall, you are bound to get very tired. This method is use in boxing a lot.
Yes Katakuri was more powerful, yes he did most of the attacking, but he got tired the most. And that don't fall to the ground thing took a lot out of him, it takes a lot of energy by insisting on staying on his feet. Luffy kept his patience and attacked when the time was right.
Luffy was not pummeled as much as you may think.
Lol, the person that don't know how to analyse a fight telling others they can't. I would say that other people here have been more right than you in their analyses and I still think they are wrong.
Again with the stupid boxing example. Boxing has so many restrictions, conditions and specificities that you can't just do a direct comparison with unregulated fights. In fact you can't even make a very good comparison with freestyle martial arts, a la Dragon Ball tenkaichi budokai, and hardly even can make a direct comparison with other sport martial arts like judo, karate, taekwondo.
Is like saying that if you limit A, B, C, D, … then after that you obviously can make a situation like it. Well, none of those conditions so it really doesn't count.
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
First off, I never talked about Drum. Read my post properly.
You're comparing boundman culverin vs Snakeman culverin. Theres your first mistake. Did you perhaps miss the "Jet" Culverin? Oh and wait Katakuri was already flying.
If you read the Japanese, Katakuris Haki is called super hard armoured defense. It's just harder, like me punching into a brick wall. Its the same pain,. This wasnt a you cant cut through my haki battle.
Luffys still remains rubbery when he's under Haki, or don't you get it?
Also, Luffys gear 4 boundman > Katakuris super hard armoured defense. Luffy shredded through that and also said G4 won't lose to that.
Katakuri spent hours fighting Luffy and then after he landed his spear hit and then said "That was the deciding factor in the match" he said "Just as I began to Acknwoledge you, you dissapoint me", which means in that time Luffy proved his worth as a fighter actually on his level.
Once he realised he didnt get Luffy because of his own skill, he was pissed. Luffy would NOT have been hit if it wasnt for flambe, he had been dodging for several hours and fighting back.Katakuri has said things about Luffy here and there like "I'm getting twice as beat too, people don't normally dodge my attacks".
So to say it's out of nowhere is wrong.
Luffy has been beaten by the villain or shown he doesn't have the upperhand at the start of fight a million times in the series.–- Update From New Post Merge ---
While the last blow is Ambiguous, it might be a hint that Luffy and Katakuri saw the same future and landed their big attacks. Thus meaning Luffys CoO has definetely improved since he saw the same future as Katakuri.
I like how we can now view CoO as an ACTUAL real game changer of an ability to have. Up until now people thought CoO was just non exisistent, and what an amazing Character to showcase it with.
I hope we can actually see it in effect in fights in the future, like when Luffy saw Katakuris gattling coming. Probably one of my most favourite pages.
So if you didn't talk about Drum, why did you talked about pre-timeskip. Doing a Strawman?
Lol, with me bad comparing culverins, but you're not bad by not only comparing two different attacks(Kong Gun and Culverin), but the use in different opponents.
Lol, you added another thing that Katakuri talked, that changes everything. :sarcasm
Again the, he did x(beaten, doesn't have the upperhand at the start) before. The only difference is that before it was 10x and now is 1000000x, but it really doesn't matter because is x. And I never said that x didn't happen before, but saying that a poor guy with 10 dollars, is just like a Millionaire is ludicrous. Oh, they both have money XD.
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If you absolutely want to analyze a shonen fight, which sounds pretty pointless in my opinion cause those were made to be enjoyed without second thoughts rather than analyzed, you must stay focused on what you are doing.
You may analyze it by comparing it to other famous mangas. Like some compared a certain panel of Katakuri to Guts from Berserk.
Or if you have insight on Oda's inspiration, you may discuss it. In SBS Oda told that he loves Tarantino or Burton. You can definitely argue that the latter inspired him for Brook character design.But right now what are we talking about ? "This method is used in boxing a lot" ? What is the correlation between boxing and One Piece and/or Oda's intent and inspirations ?
You may be right, maybe Oda loves boxing (I don't remember every SBS). But if that's the case you need to remind us before using boxing as an argument. Otherwise Oda didn't think about boxing at all while drawing and your analysis is about boxing and not about Oda's intent.I love sawyer7mage, but he starts pointing out martial arts references in the fight without precising that Oda is actually versed in martial arts. Is he ? I don't remember. You need to established those things clearly. Or you are just saying whatever comes to your mind with no evidence that it came through Oda's.
The only boxing champion we've seen in One Piece started off with a dropkick… and he was from Karate Island.
Fights can be smart, filled with strategies and very technique, I'd recommend watching Hunter x Hunter if you want to analyze stuff. Or Hajime no Ippou if you want to discuss boxing.
One Piece has very straightforward fights : they punched a lot, one had more stamina, the end.
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Lol, the person that don't know how to analyse a fight telling others they can't. I would say that other people here have been more right than you in their analyses and I still think they are wrong.
Again with the stupid boxing example. Boxing has so many restrictions, conditions and specificities that you can't just do a direct comparison with unregulated fights. In fact you can't even make a very good comparison with freestyle martial arts, a la Dragon Ball tenkaichi budokai, and hardly even can make a direct comparison with other sport martial arts like judo, karate, taekwondo.
Is like saying that if you limit A, B, C, D, … then after that you obviously can make a situation like it. Well, none of those conditions so it really doesn't count.
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
So if you didn't talk about Drum, why did you talked about pre-timeskip. Doing a Strawman?
Lol, with me bad comparing culverins, but you're not bad by not only comparing two different attacks(Kong Gun and Culverin), but the use in different opponents.
Lol, you added another thing that Katakuri talked, that changes everything. :sarcasm
Again the, he did x(beaten, doesn't have the upperhand at the start) before. The only difference is that before it was 10x and now is 1000000x, but it really doesn't matter because is x. And I never said that x didn't happen before, but saying that a poor guy with 10 dollars, is just like a Millionaire is ludicrous. Oh, they both have money XD.
I'm not pulling a strawman. You tried to compare Luffys endurance vs Katakuri vs Luffu vs Lucci which is before any training and any past experiences wirh opponents Luffys had after that.
If you honestly think Luffy hasn't gotten any more durable or stronger since timeskip, you're a lost cause
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Nope, Luffy was deflecting majority of the attacks due to the rubber, and the fight took like 1 hour(probably less), and it wasn't a beat down, but an even fight, where luffy was getting the edge until the Rokugan. And Luffy only endured 3 Rokugan attacks and with much help from Ussop, and after that he couldn't even move.
You Have:
- Rubber Deflects attacks
- 1 hour fight
- Even fight
- endured 3 Rokugan
- Stamina ended after that fight
That is Lucci, now Katakuri
- No Rubber deflection due to Armament Haki, not even in Gear 4th
- at least 8 hours fighting
- Beat Down all throughout the fight. And Luffy basically couldn't even hit Katakuri for most of the fight. The times he hit Katakuri can almost be counted by 2 hands.
- Endured, being beat for 8 hours, at least 2 times being buried alive with mochi, taking Multiple Advanced Armament Haki Donut Attacks, Getting 1/4th of his stomach taken, at least 2 Grilled Mochis, 2 Miced Mochis.
- Still got up and walked after the fight
You're an absolute meme. You called me pulling a strawman when i replied to the stupid arguement you made here.
"Luffy vs Lucci pre time skip and no training
Vs
Luffy vs New world after time skip.
If you're trying to explain how strong Luffys become, you've made a good point.
But you're trying to justify his endurance vs a time when he was a lot weaker, a time where the entire strawhat crew couldnt even take out a pacisifta, then Luffy coming back and 1 hitting it with a jet pistol after timeskip.
Listen buddy, Luffy is getting stronger and stronger, hes getting closer to ranks of Admirals and Yonkous. If he cant last 24 hours in a fight, how would compare to Kuzan and Sakazuki fighting for 10 DAYS!
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
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One Piece has very straightforward fights : they punched a lot, one had more stamina, the end.I lost it on this line bahaha
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Good thing about ending of this fight is anime can't end it with pushing contest
From Toei to you…
They will find a way to stretch out those precious seconds! Just watch…
Check out my channel!! "Yeah I'm Awesome like that!!!"
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Guys do you think that ,this fight was unbalanced? Art , paneling and creativity was superb, however it is hard to believe that after 15 chapters of
Merciless beating luffy won in one chapter of exchange of punches. I know that luffys durability is off the charts , but this is new level. Even in snakeman luffys punches
Weaker. What do you think what broke katas will to fight? Chapters ago he was telling luffy to endure and get up , but when he falls he can't fight anymore.
I feel like there is one chapter missing in this fight between 885 AND 886. Something feels off and because of that I could not feel emotions after the fight.It felt like fairy tale.
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This post is deleted!
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I never felt any sort of emotions after the end of any fight in any manga, really.
