Chapter 842: The Power of Fullness
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This chapter was partly about Sanji explaining where he got his sexist habits from, so it's not like it's even derailing from the discussion of the chapter.
"How dare you treat me like a lady!"
"A weaker vessel!!"
"Feminist power u caveman"
BAM!!! SMACK!!!!
"How dare you hit a woman?!!"
National outrage!Cue the "no more" commercials
The Hypocrisy is lit! -
People throwing around these stupid buzzwords on the Internet. Just stop already, lol. You're not doing anything special. Does anyone seriously look at the characters behaving the way they do towards the opposite gender and feel bad about it? Why even bring it up then. Is Nami sexist for punching male characters on the brain, or any of the other female characters sexist for KICKING GUYS IN THE NUTS? That's more like sexual harassment and/or cruel and unusual punishment. If everything's so sexist, I say it's sexist to even bring it up as sexist which just keeps the ball rolling in the court of sexism, a constant reminder that "it even matters." On that note, I think it's pretty racist when a group decides to KILL someone over their ethnicity, not all this minor stuff which is actually just stereotyping (so call it stereotyping, not racism…). Why do people keep bringing up racism when all that does is remind people of actual heinous acts such as genocide against a "race" (even though there's only one human race---so calling anything "racism" other than acts of atrocity against the whole/any of the species is incorrect etymology)? Should be ashamed for not being able to think for yourself. So Sanji going into a frenzy and offering a girl a gift is supposed to produce icky feelings for some reason, wow. Those pretty girls should really be left alone and give everyone peace of mind! But everyone is basically Kalifa, a character who is supposed to be comically oversensitive. Go cure yourself or something. Now, go ahead and agree with me, but then have some irredeemable urge to post how I'm wrong, anyway.
I think there's no chapter this week, right?
It's basically reached the point where if you like girls and try to do things for them, it's sexist.
I only like females because they're you know females. "That's sexist, how dare you be attracted to someone only because of their gender". -
"How dare you treat me like a lady!"
"A weaker vessel!!"
"Feminist power u caveman"
BAM!!! SMACK!!!!
"How dare you hit a woman?!!"
National outrage!Que the "No more" commercials!!!!
The whole thread can come together on the matter of your posts being turds.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
People throwing around these stupid buzzwords on the Internet.
Buzzwords such as:
Do you even know what complaint you're trying to make? Or are you parroting stuff you've heard people complain about without understanding it.
Just stop already, lol. You're not doing anything special. Does anyone seriously look at the characters behaving the way they do towards the opposite gender and feel bad about it?
Yeah man, its not like One Piece has asked us to care about racism, classism or anything similar before.
If everything's so sexist, I say it's sexist to even bring it up as sexist which just keeps the ball rolling in the court of sexism,
Did you think when you made this post, or did you like down a couple shots of vodka and just let nature take its course?
On that note, I think it's pretty racist when a group decides to KILL someone over their ethnicity, not all this minor stuff which is actually just stereotyping (so call it stereotyping, not racism…).
Its all racism. Racism is a big theme, not a specific thing you dingus.
There's wildly varying extremes. No shit.Why do people keep bringing up racism when all that does is remind people of actual heinous acts such as genocide against a "race"
why do people bring up assault when murder exists??!1/1/?!/1???? i no get it!!!????
Also no, most people think of basic discrimination when racism is mentioned, not genocide. Genocide doesn't have to be about race either, in fact it rarely ever has. Most genocides occurr between people who look basically the exact same and just belong to different cultural groups/religions.(even though there's only one human race–-so calling anything "racism" other than acts of atrocity against the whole/any of the species is incorrect etymology)?
Humans are a species, race refers to visually based categories people split themselves up into.
No one gives a flying fuck about etymology, because etymology is entirely irrelevant to how actual human society uses words.Should be ashamed for not being able to think for yourself.
"Thinking for yourself" in this instance being some sort of weird spergy shut in approach to the topic I guess? No thanks.
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It's okay to criticise Oda for sexist stuff. But let's not kid ourselves and pretend that this is the first time that this discussion has popped up, and frankly at this point it's like beating the dead horse over and over and over again and somehow expecting a different result. Yes Oda has sexist stuff in his manga, yes he has written stupid shit, and yes it's worth discussing. But the discussion has already happened, and everyone and their mother's have given their opinion on the subject.
As Monkey King once said,"It comes with the shitty territory". Accept it and move on.
It's certainly cultural, as well. Japanese society isn't at the same point we are in reflecting on our views on sexism.
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Hi, Monkey King. How are you? I'm Audity. Pleased to meet you! I've been around for a long time. I see you have been around for quite some time as well. Well, glad to have met your acquaintance. I'm not a very active on the forum on a consistent level except in short bursts; and I admit almost everyone here has a better back-and-forth conversational record than I do. (I often come in here and say one thing and then leave.) Maybe now that can change, since I see that you have very unfavorable responses to my post, and I am finally interested in replying in a meaningful way after years of not. I do tend to appear as a "spergy shut-in" because of all these reasons.
I would pick apart your replies in the same negative manner that you have, repeating the cycle, but I don't see how that would be wise; for the point of cordiality was not met first hand prior to your replies to mine. Sorry we could not have gotten off on better footing.
That said, I will try to reply from a more sophisticated standing.
• "Buzzwords such as: " Does this imply that I should have stated all the buzz words I was thinking of, in clear form? I thought my post was clear what I was referring to (sexism being the only thing talked about, in this thread).
• "Parroting" is the opposite of what I was trying to achieve. I've thought long and hard about certain aspects of these topics, mostly how they are politically charged. If anything I feel the youth of this generation have a very big problem of doing the parroting compared to me, at the behest of some left/right agenda, that is the true opposite of level-/clear-headed thinking.
• I did jump too soon into talking about murder and so on instead of building up to it.
• One of my main points is that people should consider a wider variety of words, and I even said what those words were: ethnicity/species/race/stereotypes/racism/sexism (also prejudice/bigotry can fit there, too, even tribalism perhaps).
• People get far too offended over little things, and that's one of the most destructive reactions to repeat ad nauseum.
• All my thoughts are from purely my own head. It's actually hard to think like that all the time, but I attempt to do it 100% of the time (though one of my biggest downfalls is mixing up the meaning of words based on similar sounding words, ironically enough).• "Even though there is a broad scientific agreement that essentialist and typological conceptualizations of race are untenable, scientists around the world continue to conceptualize race in widely differing ways, some of which have essentialist implications.[16] While some researchers sometimes use the concept of race to make distinctions among fuzzy sets of traits, others in the scientific community suggest that the idea of race often is used in a naive[11] or simplistic way,[17] and argue that, among humans, race has no taxonomic significance by pointing out that all living humans belong to the same species, Homo sapiens, and subspecies, Homo sapiens sapiens.[18][19]" —Wikipedia
• Fish"men" (hehe) in One Piece are a completely different species from humans (though feature human-like traits). In this way, that arc's species-ist themes is far beyond anything human's history can ever feel anything about. In reality, a majority of human history's problem has been dealing with problems of simple ethnic prejudice, not even racism (though that exists, too, unfortunately), which is all the more pathetic that people can't solve their differences.Humans are a species, race refers to visually based categories people split themselves up into.
No one gives a flying fuck about etymology, because etymology is entirely irrelevant to how actual human society uses words.Couldn't really disagree more. That's what I believe is the parroting by society as a whole. I refuse to participate in a society of the human race, homo sapiens species, where the majority lives in a fake reality, parroting what "actual human society" agrees upon as what words mean. If anything if I was a spergy shut in (maybe I am, maybe not), that would be a good thing. Unless the true purpose of living is to socialize and procreate based on the predicate of being a nincompoop.
I dislike vodka.
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…So Sanji going into a frenzy and offering a girl a gift is supposed to produce icky feelings for some reason, wow...
Yeah nobody said that. Nice collection of straw mans you got there btw.
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Well this thread should be a good distraction today haha. This whole Sanji backstory and the reveals along with it definitely are lighting some fires.
Personally I still find even after being given an explanation for his behavior it's not really changing my opinion of him that Sanji is an idiot for adhering to such a strict code for such a seemingly lame reason. Would Zeff prefer that Sanji let his friend's die or be carted off to max prison? Or would he want him to do everything possible to save them?
Sanji's inability to kick a woman really should have come from something more extreme to warrant his past behaviors.
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No chapter this week? I'm so pissed :/
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Luffy is sexist he punched Alvida
and Sanji too is sexist because he doesn't hit girls (well is what I red so far on this forum ;)
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Sanji's inability to kick a woman really should have come from something more extreme to warrant his past behaviors.
Well you might not care much about it, but to me the scene had real significance due to how Sanji truly realized that Zeff was a parent he never had, and so that particular lesson stuck with him to an extreme degree. It's all about context.
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I put it in the notions thread, but more than anything, it was him drinking tea with her that upsets me the most. I guess the fact that Zoro said: "Losing id a waste of time, so by any means win, even if it cost you your life." I guess Sanji just gave up his life and forgot the winning part.
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The Straw Hats are a close knit family, they would do anything for another when push comes to shove.
Except for Sanji. He's special.
It's okay when he refuses to safe the life of his nakama. He has a good reason to let them die.
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Did Sogeking stutter when Luffy told him to burn the flag? Did he have his usual coward/freaked out characteristic? "Roger" all I saw. That's why he is at 200m, first time he shows up, burns the governments flag, saved Robin and gave Franky enough time, bullets already couldn't reach his range. Second time, he succesfully dispelled Doffy's plan, the latter even targetted him at 500m. I guess Sanji got his punishment with that stupid first wanted poster.
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@Kaido:
Well you might not care much about it, but to me the scene had real significance due to how Sanji truly realized that Zeff was a parent he never had, and so that particular lesson stuck with him to an extreme degree. It's all about context.
The part where Zeff's lesson stuck with Sanji because he looks up to him is fine. The part where Sanji sticks to it pathologically is too much. But he's ok with fighting men who think of themselves as women?
Zeff should have taught him that there's an exception to every rule.
No, the author can't just get away with such simplifications after introducing the themes himself. Ok, Oda is most likely not visiting these threads, so I/we are limited to other readers who are fine with it. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
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The part where Zeff's lesson stuck with Sanji because he looks up to him is fine. The part where Sanji sticks to it pathologically is too much. But he's ok with fighting men who think of themselves as women?
Zeff should have taught him that there's an exception to every rule.
No, the author can't just get away with such simplifications after introducing the themes himself. Ok, Oda is most likely not visiting these threads, so I/we are limited to other readers who are fine with it. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Thing is though that Zeff isn't gonna have Sanji consider every situation that might befall him; I highly doubt Sanji becoming a pirate was on his mind at all. And given the effect Zeff's presence had on Sanji as a child, I'm not really surprised that he stuck to it pathologically.
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Yeah nobody said that. Nice collection of straw mans you got there btw.
I'm pretty sure nobody really said anything except for a generalization that Sanji has sexist tendencies, so I gave a general response based on what people's "generalities" implied. It's what I had to work with, so I dished out anything that could've fallen into a category of "Sanji has character traits in One Piece" and "A person or two on this Arlong Park message board said that the manga finally showed where Sanji's sexist behavior [inferred to be toward women] came from via flashback." Nice straw man against my "straw men/mans," though. Feel free to point out all of them specifically so I can respond to them in a perfect rebuttal manner just like I did this one. I did go a bit off topic (not necessarily straw man), so whatever.
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The Straw Hats are a close knit family, they would do anything for another when push comes to shove.
Except for Sanji. He's special.
It's okay when he refuses to safe the life of his nakama. He has a good reason to let them die.
Except he went on to beat… Jabra. And close the gates of justice, thus destroying the Buster Call and being one of the 2 things (the other one is Merry showing up) that allowed the Straw Hats to escape certain death after beating CP9 and rescuing Robin. I know he fucked up against Kalifa, but people could stop treating him as if that was the only thing he did in the entire saga.
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Except he went on to beat… Jabra. And close the gates of justice, thus destroying the Buster Call and being one of the 2 things (the other one is Merry showing up) that allowed the Straw Hats to escape certain death after beating CP9 and rescuing Robin. I know he fucked up against Kalifa, but people could stop treating him as if that was the only thing he did in the entire saga.
But he fucked up first before redeeming himself by beating Jabra and closing the Gates. He fucked up due to his women handicap. His women handicap wasn't what allowed him to beat Jabra and close the Gates. And we are talking about his handicap now.
He could have beaten Kalifa with ease and still move on to Jabra and closing the Gates. Nobody is trying to demean Sanji. Most of these complaints are addressed to the way Oda envisioned the origins of such a character defining trait.
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Can't we all just agree that part of Sanji's character is idiotic and move on?
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I think it's a fun quirk of Sanji and don't get the problem with it.
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• "Even though there is a broad scientific agreement that essentialist and typological conceptualizations of race are untenable, scientists around the world continue to conceptualize race in widely differing ways, some of which have essentialist implications.[16] While some researchers sometimes use the concept of race to make distinctions among fuzzy sets of traits, others in the scientific community suggest that the idea of race often is used in a naive[11] or simplistic way,[17] and argue that, among humans, race has no taxonomic significance by pointing out that all living humans belong to the same species, Homo sapiens, and subspecies, Homo sapiens sapiens.[18][19]" —Wikipedia
• Fish"men" (hehe) in One Piece are a completely different species from humans (though feature human-like traits). In this way, that arc's species-ist themes is far beyond anything human's history can ever feel anything about. In reality, a majority of human history's problem has been dealing with problems of simple ethnic prejudice, not even racism (though that exists, too, unfortunately), which is all the more pathetic that people can't solve their differences.I dislike vodka.
I'm happy that the mix betwen human race and human species got correct. That always bothers me.
But fishmen are not a different species of humans. They are a sub-species of the homo genus.
You can transfuse blood betwen them and create offsprings of mixed ancestry.
If you still call humans in OP Homo Sapiens Sapiens you'd call the fish men something along Homo Sapiens Ictius.If you've only ever tried vodka in a pure form, I'd recommend trying it in a fruit cocktail or something of the sorts. Much smoother.
The part where Zeff's lesson stuck with Sanji because he looks up to him is fine. The part where Sanji sticks to it pathologically is too much. But he's ok with fighting men who think of themselves as women?
Zeff should have taught him that there's an exception to every rule.
No, the author can't just get away with such simplifications after introducing the themes himself. Ok, Oda is most likely not visiting these threads, so I/we are limited to other readers who are fine with it. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Sanji was in every sense of the way rejected by his family (except for his mother who died somewhere along the way).
Not only did his brothers attack him every change they could, his father said out loud to his face "I reject you as a part of me". Sanji was all alone in the world because he was thrown out.Then Zeff comes, sacrifices his leg for a kid he had never met and the calls him his son and takes all the time in the world to teach everything he can to Sanji. Exactly the opposite of what Judge did.
So I don't think it's wierd that Sanji sticks too much to it.I do think Sanji sticks to much to it. There should be a breaking point where he saw something as more important than that at the time.
Like Luffy, whose most valuable thing is is crew and who had made a promise to Ace about them being free and independent pirates and when Ace was to be exectuted Luffy couldn't sit still and wait for it to happen even though he had to reunite with his crew and was breaking a promise.It's wierd that Sanji really doesn't have a breaking point but it's not wierd that a traumatized kid adheres so much to the rules he was taught when he was saved.
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But he fucked up first before redeeming himself by beating Jabra and closing the Gates. He fucked up due to his women handicap. His women handicap wasn't what allowed him to beat Jabra and close the Gates. And we are talking about his handicap now.
He could have beaten Kalifa with ease and still move on to Jabra and closing the Gates. Nobody is trying to demean Sanji. Most of these complaints are addressed to the way Oda envisioned the origins of such a character defining trait.
Exactly. And he basically caused Nami to get beat up. She wouldn't have encountered Kalifa if Sanji had taken her out first. If Kalifa had not just been using her DF and toying with Nami she would have been borked even worse.
All in all that whole fight was terrible lol.
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The Straw Hats are a close knit family, they would do anything for another when push comes to shove.
Except for Sanji. He's special.
It's okay when he refuses to safe the life of his nakama. He has a good reason to let them die.
so If oda wanted to portray sanji's situation as being heavily ingrained into his psyche like a mental block not unlike PTSD because of his fear of killing Zeff indirectly…it was mishandled because if this was his intention from the jump, he mishandled that part. I get the feeling we were supposed to feel sorry fpr him but the tonal shift was pretty jarring and he didnt explain it well enough at the time.
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I think it's a fun quirk of Sanji and don't get the problem with it.
You are not talking about the whole "I'd rather die (and even let my crewmates die if necessary) than ever hitting a woman", are you?
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All in all that whole fight was terrible lol.
Realistically having Sanji struggle with his female opponent (drive to save Robin vs. personal ideals) while she six-powered him could've been super intense.
Cuz realistically, Kalifa should've shut down Nami pretty hard if she didn't screw around with bubbles. :3
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Kalifa vs Nami…...... Ah i forgot that super terrible fight even existed. And to think that people want Oda to draw more female fights.....
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But he fucked up first before redeeming himself by beating Jabra and closing the Gates. He fucked up due to his women handicap. His women handicap wasn't what allowed him to beat Jabra and close the Gates. And we are talking about his handicap now.
He could have beaten Kalifa with ease and still move on to Jabra and closing the Gates. Nobody is trying to demean Sanji. Most of these complaints are addressed to the way Oda envisioned the origins of such a character defining trait.
Yeah, I get that. But Sanji has this ingrained in him. He told Usopp later in that arc: I do what you can and you do what I cannot. Sanji can't kick women and we were shown the reason why. The thing is that the discussion isn't even centering in how strong of a reason it is, it's just going back to an arc that happened a decade ago and criticizing the same thing people have been criticizing for 10 years. Sanji is an idiot with a quirk that holds him back in this regard. Now we know why, because that moment is associated in his mind with Zeff delaring that he was his father and that he'd never forgive him if he fucked up as a man (by hurting a woman). Sanji blew that out of proportion and then ended up in that pathetic situation against Kalifa. It's not that he didn't want to beat her, his body just wasn't able to do so. We've known this for a long time. (I just hate discussions about sexism in OP, they're the worst. Yes, Oda has sexist tendencies. It's a shame, but it's what it is.)
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Kalifa vs Nami…...... Ah i forgot that super terrible fight even existed. And to think that people want Oda to draw more female fights.....
Robin vs the priest guy back in Skypiea is one of the coolest fights still, and Nami vs Miss Doublefinger was also pretty good. Just because one of them was bad doesn't mean Oda can do'em right.
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They were before Enies Lobby.
And Oda did get more fanservicy over time. So whose to say the female fights won't consist of fanservice battles similar to FT?
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They were before Enies Lobby.
And Oda did get more fanservicy over time. So whose to say the female fights won't consist of fanservice battles similar to FT?
For one, he's not Hiro Mashima.
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All i am saying is that Oda has said multiple times that he writes the series for teens. And his fanservice has grown over the years. So it wouldn't be far-fetched to say that if Oda was going to draw a female fight then it would consist of lot of fanservice, and we got our first taste of that in Enies Lobby.
Granted Oda hasn't tried anything like Enies Lobby anywhere so maybe i am just off-my-rocks here, and completely wrong about my speculation.
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I like how Burgess is builded up during New World arc to be Sanjis enemy in Blackbeard Pirates vs Strawhats future fight..
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You are not talking about the whole "I'd rather die (and even let my crewmates die if necessary) than ever hitting a woman", are you?
As if this would ever happen.
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As if this would ever happen.
I actually don't know if you are joking, but just in case, it did happen in Enies Lobby. Do you remember his "fight" with Kalifa?
Which was pretty much the topic of discussion the last couple of pages–- Update From New Post Merge ---
All i am saying is that Oda has said multiple times that he writes the series for teens. And his fanservice has grown over the years. So it wouldn't be far-fetched to say that if Oda was going to draw a female fight then it would consist of lot of fanservice, and we got our first taste of that in Enies Lobby.
Granted Oda hasn't tried anything like Enies Lobby anywhere so maybe i am just off-my-rocks here, and completely wrong about my speculation.
I like to think he's better than this. Comparing him to Mashima is just insulting.
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I actually don't know if you are joking, but just in case, it did happen in Enies Lobby. Do you remember his "fight" with Kalifa?
Which was pretty much the topic of discussion the last couple of pages–- Update From New Post Merge ---
I like to think he's better than this. Comparing him to Mashima is just insulting.
Can't remember his crewmates dieing.
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They didn't die, but Robin was going to die if they didn't defeat the CP9 members. And yet he refused to fight back.
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They didn't die, but Robin was going to die if they didn't defeat the CP9 members. And yet he refused to fight back.
But that didn't happen. So I still don't get the problem here. There will always be someone from the crew taking care of female enemies for him. As there will always be someone showing Zoro the direction, or helping the future pirate king doing pirate stuff like sailing, etc. Funny quirks that work with characters supporting each other's.
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I like to think he's better than this. Comparing him to Mashima is just insulting.
God knows i would never ever bring Oda to Hiro Mashima's level.
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But that didn't happen. So I still don't get the problem here. There will always be someone from the crew taking care of female enemies for him. As there will always be someone showing Zoro the direction, or helping the future pirate king doing pirate stuff like sailing, etc. Funny quirks that work with characters supporting each other's.
"Funny quirk" that might just cost his life. Of course we all know everything will work out just fine because it's a manga, and they are the protagonists, but refusing to attack back someone that might just kill you just because some old crook said he would slit his own throat in case he ever done that is still retarded, and not something that could be defined as a "funny quirk".
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Always the same debate. The next chapter can't come any sooner.
I wanted to write a long post detailing my previous post in this thread to explain why I'm fine with Sanji's chivalry but it won't lead anywhere in this so called debate.So instead, I'll just say that the flashback is even better in my eyes with Stephen's translation. It really seems that I'm the only one who was really moved by Zeff saying out loud that he's Sanji's parent.
Anyway, I hope we'll get to see Jinbe next chapter. I still don't see what his role will be in this arc.
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I'd prefer if Nami's fights were more like the one against the twins in Skypeia. She got knocked around a little but still managed to protect her crew. It wasn't completely one sided or fan servicey.
Just as long as we never get a Khalifa type fight again lol.
Sanji isn't a favorite of mine but I do hope this mini arc gives me something to really like about him. Or to at least negate his annoying traits.
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(though that exists, too, unfortunately),
I've been reading so much of the word sexist, I read "exists" as in the word sexists. I was trying to understand the typo.
What has been done to me :ninja:
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God knows i would never ever bring Oda to Hiro Mashima's level.
Still, Mashima is at least better at drawing different types of women. More variety wouldn't hurt OP. Yeah, there are plenty of different women in OP, but 90% of attractive women look nearly identical.
Of course, if I have to choose between bland female models and rich and complex story and female variety and shit plot…
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You are not talking about the whole "I'd rather die (and even let my crewmates die if necessary) than ever hitting a woman", are you?
This series is fictional and the author can account for a characters "handicap".
People look past Luffy's I don't care I'm gonna punch a celestial dragon attitude in Sabaody which could have had is crew killed or caught by Kizaru and the marines. Oda waved his wand, the characters escaped from Luffy's "F you attitude" attitude.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
They didn't die, but Robin was going to die if they didn't defeat the CP9 members. And yet he refused to fight back.
Yes and Zoro was going to die in Sabaody, who's fault was it that an Admiral came to the island?
The point is, it's the characters personality and beliefs. It's accounted for in the series e.g. Nami vs Khalifa, Rayleigh/Kuma.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
"Funny quirk" that might just cost his life. Of course we all know everything will work out just fine because it's a manga, and they are the protagonists, but refusing to attack back someone that might just kill you just because some old crook said he would slit his own throat in case he ever done that is still retarded, and not something that could be defined as a "funny quirk".
That "old crook" was the first father figure to take in and love Sanji and he loved him back. He had the biggest respect for him and would have taken his beliefs seriously. The emotions/ideals Sanji has have very realistic trigger roots.
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I understand what people are saying about Sanji's chivalry and how it is stupid but there could just as easily be a situation where Zoro could get lost and then someone would die because he didn't get there in time. Luffy has knowingly put the crew into dangerous situations and no one cares. Obviously that is due to his confidence in himself and his crew but he does it on a arc basis almost. I'm actually more annoyed by Zoro's lack of direction than Sanji's chivalry. Are they both idiots for doing what they do absolutely but that is literally OP. Everyone has something about them that is just like why? If there is a quirk that you want to be mad about Ace's is easily the dumbest cause he actually died. Sanji will most likely always have someone to help him in that situation and considering the lack of strong female characters in the series anyway Sanji will likely never have to.
What I want to see is Nami not necessarily in a 1 on 1 fight but doing stuff like she did with Luffy vs Cracker. She may not be physically strong but she is pretty dang clever and I want to see a battle of wits more than anything. The best way for her to show that is in a fight where someone else is taking he punches and she sits back and figures it out. Really that is what she has done in her previous fights against Kalifa, and Miss Doublefinger. Got knocked around until she figured something out then made her move. That is how she fights and I want to see that more in anyway possible even if she is not the one that is initially taking the beating.
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So instead, I'll just say that the flashback is even better in my eyes with Stephen's translation. It really seems that I'm the only one who was really moved by Zeff saying out loud that he's Sanji's parent.
I'll agree to that. Not to mention, when Sanji was leaving the Baratie and giving his farewells to Zeff, I couldn't stop my tears. But now that we know Sanji's entire past and how he was treated by his family as a kid and how he was never loved, not even by his own dad, to have some ordinary pirate save him, sacrifice his leg and call Sanji his son, it adds so much more emotional depth to an already emotional scene.
Anyway, I hope we'll get to see Jinbe next chapter. I still don't see what his role will be in this arc.
You and me both, man.
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Still, Mashima is at least better at drawing different types of women. More variety wouldn't hurt OP. Yeah, there are plenty of different women in OP, but 90% of attractive women look nearly identical.
Of course, if I have to choose between bland female models and rich and complex story and female variety and shit plot…
Yea Oda is lazy when it comes to female designs. But he can definitely draw more varied designs than Hiro from what we saw on Amazon Lily. I don't know why he doesn't do that more often.
Though Hiro designs in general are pretty lazy.
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I'm pretty sure nobody really said anything except for a generalization that Sanji has sexist tendencies, so I gave a general response based on what people's "generalities" implied. It's what I had to work with, so I dished out anything that could've fallen into a category of "Sanji has character traits in One Piece" and "A person or two on this Arlong Park message board said that the manga finally showed where Sanji's sexist behavior [inferred to be toward women] came from via flashback." Nice straw man against my "straw men/mans," though. Feel free to point out all of them specifically so I can respond to them in a perfect rebuttal manner just like I did this one. I did go a bit off topic (not necessarily straw man), so whatever.
We did, it just gets lost between posters being upset at the people that are mad at those that are angry about Sanji's quirk. I even gave the example of the tea part. Which at best I got a: It is Sanjis Quirk, which I compared to Ussop's cowardice quirk and how it did not seem to be a problem when shooting down the flag. Something that normally would make him freak out.
So instead, I'll just say that the flashback is even better in my eyes with Stephen's translation. It really seems that I'm the only one who was really moved by Zeff saying out loud that he's Sanji's parent.
I enjoyed what Zeff did, and brings a nice circle to Sanji's past with him, and how he ended getting a family that cared. I have said that, I can even look past Sanji's thingy because of it. It is still hard to swallow the fact he was drinking tea with Kalifa "for the quirky lulz".
Anyway, I hope we'll get to see Jinbe next chapter. I still don't see what his role will be in this arc.
Jimbe needs to come in with Pekoms and strike a pose.
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I understand what people are saying about Sanji's chivalry and how it is stupid but there could just as easily be a situation where Zoro could get lost and then someone would die because he didn't get there in time. Luffy has knowingly put the crew into dangerous situations and no one cares. Obviously that is due to his confidence in himself and his crew but he does it on a arc basis almost. I'm actually more annoyed by Zoro's lack of direction than Sanji's chivalry. Are they both idiots for doing what they do absolutely but that is literally OP. Everyone has something about them that is just like why? If there is a quirk that you want to be mad about Ace's is easily the dumbest cause he actually died.
Zoro has a bad sense of direction, it's a flaw he can't do anything about. He isn't intentionally choosing the wrong path, his brain simply can't keep up. It's a legitimate weakness.
And yeah you are right, Luffy intentionally put the crew in danger on Saobody by punching Charlos. But do you also remember what happened after? He realized that he was biting off more than he could chew, which lead to tons of tears and a freaking 2 year timeskip. And that timeskip didn't only make him much more powerful, but also a lot more level-headed compared to his Paradise self.
It's pretty much what some people wanted to see for Sanji as well. Either an extreme explanation why he has such a hardcore stance towards not hitting women, or SOME sort of development, similar to Luffy being a tad more cautious when it comes to picking fights (like trying to not fight Big Mum right now) or Usopp showing courage not only when it comes to his nakama, but also to outsiders like the Dwarves.
Sanji will most likely always have someone to help him in that situation and considering the lack of strong female characters in the series anyway Sanji will likely never have to.
Thankfully the arc isn't over yet, there is still a chance for Sanji to emanzipate himself from Zeff (at least to a certain degree), but if this should be all Oda has to add when it comes to Sanji's chivalry then he practically established him as a second-rate Straw Hat. Someone who puts his (or Zeff's) principles over the life of his friends - something no other Straw Hat does. They would all go through hell for each other, no matter the situation. No ifs and buts.