The Four emperors battle begins.
The Great New World Discussion Thread
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Oh man… I don't know if I feel happy or sad 'bout this.
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The Four emperors battle begins.
why would anyone take Jump's previews seriously? And you don't need that to know the story involving Yonko already started with Zou arc.
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That is an incredibly sinister-looking Shanks there.
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The Four emperors battle begins.
Typical ANN…...
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Typical ANN…...
typical Jump you mean…"let's make a fake announcement, we will use Oda's previous drawings and make a collage to make it look official, let's come up with a lame new arc name as well our readers will love this".
And this is how you get idiots talking about "vs Yonko" arc and manga ending soon.
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Jump does that all the time,no big deal;but to report it as a news….
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Then why did Vegapunk leave it there? If it was a success then would't they want to test it and improve on it? I mean as a scientist if you made something groundbreaking and the 1st of its kind you wouldn't grab it?
because of caesar's gas they had to leave or die and he might have thought it was destroyed.
you seem to forgot that vegapunk never said it was a failure caesar clown his rival that was trying to make better fake devil fruits said that.
its no different than the president race in the us going on at the moment where people running say stuff that is not true about their rivals so that people will vote for them instead they even do when the person challenging them is from the same party lol.vegapunks fruit is the only one shown to do a full transformation caesar's fake fruits cannot do a full transformation and vegapunk the expert on devil fruits not caesar plus vega punks fruit turned into a mythical zoan while caesar's fruits are just boring normal animals lol.
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@sanji''s_dad:
you seem to forgot that vegapunk never said it was a failure caesar clown his rival that was trying to make better fake devil fruits said that.
CC also never said it was a failure. One of his henchmen said he heard it was a failure. Chapter 685. It might have come from CC or it might have not. We don't know.
Unless I completely forgot about CC himself repeating it later or something.
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@sanji''s_dad:
because of caesar's gas they had to leave or die and he might have thought it was destroyed.
I was just thinking that if he really thought it was a success that he might have made it a priority in the evacuation…..
Yeah Ceaser could have just been lying outright.
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If CC lied about it (btw still waiting for that link where he himself claims it), why didn't he try selling it to someone? If he lied, it would mean he has a perfectly good devil fruit. Why leave it in a derelict lab, instead of putting it in a safe at least. Not to mention he fooled BM because he needed more money. Couldn't he at least earned a couple million B with an online auction of Vegapunk made artificial dragon devil fruit?
If he lied, anything makes more sense than leaving it as it is, because CC is an opportunist.
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If CC lied about it (btw still waiting for that link where he himself claims it), why didn't he try selling it to someone? If he lied, it would mean he has a perfectly good devil fruit. Why leave it in a derelict lab, instead of putting it in a safe at least. Not to mention he fooled BM because he needed more money. Couldn't he at least earned a couple million B with an online auction of Vegapunk made artificial dragon devil fruit?
If he lied, anything makes more sense than leaving it as it is, because CC is an opportunist.
Maybe he was researching it in secret to try and copy its capabilities.
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Maybe he was researching it in secret to try and copy its capabilities.
And he kept it in an abandoned part of the facility why?
Wasn't really protected well. A child wandered there and broke its container with a scabbard.
Besides, he wouldn't really need the fruit itself if he worked with Vegapunk and had the research data.
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The best hiding strategy is in plain sight.
I dunno man, been ages since I read PH and I never thought too much of the DF issue. I'm on a reread of the whole thing right now so I'll get there eventually.
Speaking of the data, though, someone said earlier that when the lab was blown up, Vegapunk evacuated without taking the fruit, and someone objected by saying the fruit would be the first thing he'd take with him. But if he had research data it seems logical he would have taken that before taking the product, since he can use it to make new copies. So this could explain (a) why the fruit was left there and (b) why Caesar doesn't have Vegapunk's notes to work with. As for whether Caesar did not sell it because he was using it, I can't tell right now whether or not that is a logical assumption based on its position in the lab.
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The best hiding strategy is in plain sight.
I dunno man, been ages since I read PH and I never thought too much of the DF issue. I'm on a reread of the whole thing right now so I'll get there eventually.
Speaking of the data, though, someone said earlier that when the lab was blown up, Vegapunk evacuated without taking the fruit, and someone objected by saying the fruit would be the first thing he'd take with him. But if he had research data it seems logical he would have taken that before taking the product, since he can use it to make new copies. So this could explain (a) why the fruit was left there and (b) why Caesar doesn't have Vegapunk's notes to work with. As for whether Caesar did not sell it because he was using it, I can't tell right now whether or not that is a logical assumption based on its position in the lab.
You don't hide stuff in plain sight by making them stand out from everything else in the sight.
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About Vegapunk's fruit, just the look of it tells me that there's something wrong with it.
My guess is that - aside from Caesar being salty as well - Vegapunk classified it as a failure regarding some criteria we don't know yet which may be something minor or even something more crucial.
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@Bartholemew:
About Vegapunk's fruit, just the look of it tells me that there's something wrong with it.
My guess is that - aside from Caesar being salty as well - Vegapunk classified it as a failure regarding some criteria we don't know yet which may be something minor or even something more crucial.
Just like I said on the last page. An invention can work well and still be called a failure by the inventor if it wasn't 100% success. And Vegapunk might easily be a perfectionist.
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Theoretically, that little flaw even might be something that'll actually benefit its user.
What if this fruit emulates DF power but without actually being possessed by a devil and therefore the difference is that the user doesn't have the weaknesses. Vegapunk might have being afraid of thinking about someone like Akainu without the weaknesses (with great powers comes great responsibility) and was terrified of the result. Did we see Momo in a situation where he showcased the weakness in a way that it is undisputable really attributed to the fruit? (I know there's chapter 795, but what if Momo just cannot swim.)
Or because of the devil missing it's stackable with another fruit.
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Inreplicable? Hard to transform? Not the dragon that they were looking for? Shortening lifespawn? no hybrid forms? Vegapunk doesn't like the color pink?
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Maybe because it doesn't have the full power of the actual dragon DF.
Like, the actual dragon fruit can also spit fire, but momo can't.
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@Bartholemew:
Theoretically, that little flaw even might be something that'll actually benefit its user.
What if this fruit emulates DF power but without actually being possessed by a devil and therefore the difference is that the user doesn't have the weaknesses. Vegapunk might have being afraid of thinking about someone like Akainu without the weaknesses (with great powers comes great responsibility) and was terrified of the result. Did we see Momo in a situation where he showcased the weakness in a way that it is undisputable really attributed to the fruit? (I know there's chapter 795, but what if Momo just cannot swim.)
Or because of the devil missing it's stackable with another fruit.
Devils from inside the devil fruits possessing users is a superstitious myth. It was Jabra's explanation, one that Blueno or Lucci (can't remember which now) quickly dismissed.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
@uniaka:
Maybe because it doesn't have the full power of the actual dragon DF.
Like, the actual dragon fruit can also spit fire, but momo can't.
There seems to be more than one type of dragon in OP world. Eastern type and western type, to put it simply. Vega managed to create western dragon robots, who can breathe flames. Their appearance was close to the dragon Ryuuma killed in Wanted. Then there's Momo's eastern type, which looks completely different and also has a different ability.
For all we know, Vegapunk might have flipped just because the fruit had dots instead of swirls…
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@uniaka:
Maybe because it doesn't have the full power of the actual dragon DF.
Like, the actual dragon fruit can also spit fire, but momo can't.
But how would he know that it didn't have the same power if it hadn't been eaten yet?
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Um, why is everyone saying that it's a fake announcement by Jump? I'm pretty sure it's legit.
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But how would he know that it didn't have the same power if it hadn't been eaten yet?
Maybe he could tell if it was satisfactory or not by oberving it's surface through microscope or something.
And I know it may have looked like a joke, but maybe he did consider it a failure because it didn't have swirls.
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Um, why is everyone saying that it's a fake announcement by Jump? I'm pretty sure it's legit.
I think what people mean is that it's not actually "news". It's just kind of saying what a lot of people already knew: that confrontations with the Emperors are coming up soon. Considering that the Straw Hats are about to fight a top subordinate of one, then head to some kind of encounter/confrontation with another, then will pretty much end up in a war with the first one, a third one is probably the Big Bad of the entire series, and Luffy promised to defeat and surpass the fourth one, we basically already knew that Luffy against the Four Emperors is a thing. The announcement is pretty much just confirming that it officially starts this week. (With, presumably, vs. Jack.)
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I think what people mean is that it's not actually "news". It's just kind of saying what a lot of people already knew: that confrontations with the Emperors are coming up soon. Considering that the Straw Hats are about to fight a top subordinate of one, then head to some kind of encounter/confrontation with another, then will pretty much end up in a war with the first one, a third one is probably the Big Bad of the entire series, and Luffy promised to defeat and surpass the fourth one, we basically already knew that Luffy against the Four Emperors is a thing. The announcement is pretty much just confirming that it officially starts this week. (With, presumably, vs. Jack.)
True, but still it IS a new saga.
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True, but still it IS a new saga.
What? No it isn't. How can you start a new saga in the middle of an arc? And where is the clear break in themes and goals that warrant the classification as a new saga? What began in Punk Hazard has continued up until Zou and will go on for another while. Only Fishman Island can be considered to be a different saga since the timeskip, so far. And even that arc/saga has major breadcrumbs that are still being followed now. Caribou, Jinbe, Poseidon, Luffy destroying the island, etc.
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Wow okay, it's not my problem if you guys can't clearly read what's there. It literally says that they're on their way to get Sanji meaning that it will probably happen in tomorrow's chapter. It could very well mean that the actions that take place in this week's chapter are the ones that start the VS Emperors arc in next week's chapter.
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Wow okay, it's not my problem if you guys can't clearly read what's there. It literally says that they're on their way to get Sanji meaning that it will probably happen in tomorrow's chapter. It could very well mean that the actions that take place in this week's chapter are the ones that start the VS Emperors arc in next week's chapter.
I posted this on another thread, but whatever, I'll put it here too…
It actually says, "Facing towards Sanji's rescue, Luffy's group is...!!" Which is what we already knew from the end of last time. Luffy's group was planning to go to his rescue, but the "...!!" is likely meant to represent a "problem" or "issue" in doing so (Jack showing up).
The Four Emperors "arc" is almost certainly not one arc, but multiple; in fact, if it builds off of and involves the same alliances that the Straw Hats have made so far, then it's probably not actually its own saga, either, but just the next phase of the Pirate Alliance saga. Similar to how Sabaody Archipelago and Amazon Lily (and sometimes Thriller Bark, depending on whom you talk to) are part of the Paramount War saga, but are definitely their own "piece" or "phase" within it that's separate from the actual war phase (and that war phase--Impel Down, Marineford, and Post-War--are sometimes informally referred to as the "war arc"). The first half of the Pirate Alliance saga (Punk Hazard, Dressrosa, and Zou) could very well be the phase where they make/gain the allies, with the Heart Pirates in Punk Hazard, the Grand Fleet in Dressrosa, and the Minks and samurai in Zou. The upcoming second part, then–"vs. the Four Emperors"--is the part where that new alliance begins to take on their enemies. Which is, indeed, what they'll be doing starting this week, when the skirmish with Jack is likely to begin.
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Wow okay, it's not my problem if you guys can't clearly read what's there. It literally says that they're on their way to get Sanji meaning that it will probably happen in tomorrow's chapter. It could very well mean that the actions that take place in this week's chapter are the ones that start the VS Emperors arc in next week's chapter.
And he's saying that in actual non-robot storytelling terms we've already been in that plot for a good long while. It's the same plot as Law's plan.
That and Jump announcements and things like that aren't written by Oda, and are often kind of vague exagerrative and semi meaningless hype. Oda has never really shown he divides things into arcs.
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@Monkey:
And he's saying that in actual non-robot storytelling terms we've already been in that plot for a good long while. It's the same plot as Law's plan.
That and Jump announcements and things like that aren't written by Oda, and are often kind of vague exagerrative and semi meaningless hype. Oda has never really shown he divides things into arcs.
I believe that the only thing about dividing the series in different sagas or arcs that has come from Oda himself (and I'm not sure about this) is from the One Piece Ten (Exhibition) that happened a few years ago, when the story was divided in 2 sagas (basically, before and after the timeskip): "Sea of Survival: Super Rookies Saga" and "The Final Sea: New World Saga".
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Don't really understand how anyone would think that that silly clickbaitsh proclamation is somehow going to affect the natural course of the plot.
There's also that one weird trick that professionals hate and the hot new workout everyone is talking about…
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I like to think of Arcs as basically Islands almost. I do consider Water 7 and Enies Lobby two separate Arcs so it still fits..
I like to think of Sagas as having a goal and then achieving it i.e Alabaster Sage incorporated Whiskey Peak all the way to Alabaster as the goal never really changed. Punk Hazard, Dressrosa and Zou are all part of the Pirate Alliance Saga and we will remain in this Saga until either Kaido is defeated or the alliance disbands and stops going after Kaido. I think the Whole Cake arc will be included in this Saga even though it will be about Sanji mostly
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Are there any theories on Law betraying Luffy in regards to the Yonkou takedown?
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Are there any theories on Law betraying Luffy in regards to the Yonkou takedown?
I could see something like it happening eventually, but Luffy maybe even taking it well with some "Well we're competitors!" where you can tell he doesn't see it as a betrayal of friendship.
Of course that depends what form such a betrayal would take… -
Are there any theories on Law betraying Luffy in regards to the Yonkou takedown?
Eh, I can see him refusing to take down any others (Big Mom, Shanks, Blackbeard) since he doesn't have any beef with them that we know of, but I doubt he'll try to bail out of fighting Kaido. I don't even know if he can, since Kaido must know by now that their whole alliance–Luffy and Law, and others–were responsible for Doflamingo's arrest and him losing his SMILEs, so Kaido surely wants to kill all of them by now. Betraying Luffy and running away won't change that. Law's also shown signs of being interested in fighting Kaido (even if that wasn't really his main goal), and no signs at all (that I can remember, anyway) that he wants to bail.
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Are there any theories on Law betraying Luffy in regards to the Yonkou takedown?
I think that eventually he will become a fleet captain or at least a very strong ally. Even if he does betray Luffy I don't think that Luffy will hold it against him. At the least I think that a WB Gol Roger relationship is the least it will turn out to be. If not almost nakama material… Keep in mind this is not me saying he will join the crew just that he will be like a Vivi almost. I guess more like a poor mans Vivi in terms of the relationship.
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I think that eventually he will become a fleet captain or at least a very strong ally. Even if he does betray Luffy I don't think that Luffy will hold it against him. At the least I think that a WB Gol Roger relationship is the least it will turn out to be. If not almost nakama material… Keep in mind this is not me saying he will join the crew just that he will be like a Vivi almost. I guess more like a poor mans Vivi in terms of the relationship.
Yeah,i too get the same vibe from them.
Roger and WB may had joint adventure themselves like Luffy and Law;Rayleigh's tear at WB's death shows that they had been very close over their long career as pirates. -
Are there any theories on Law betraying Luffy in regards to the Yonkou takedown?
That already happened with the kid-hawkins-apoo alliance also it would make more sense that Law and Luffy fighting over who the leader of their alliance will be since that way they could use the alliance to become the pirate king.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
It seems that we have two places in the new world with the coating bubbles like on sa and fishman island one of them is at the new marineford in the new world and the other is at the island that bonney was attack when doflamingo was defeated which is most likely under big mom's control now since they can use it to get to fishman island and was most likely used by the whitebeard pirates to travel under the water with a coated ship.
The panel where bonney is talking and the one where they talking at marineford in chapter 700.
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@Bartholemew:
About Vegapunk's fruit, just the look of it tells me that there's something wrong with it.
My guess is that - aside from Caesar being salty as well - Vegapunk classified it as a failure regarding some criteria we don't know yet which may be something minor or even something more crucial.
Vegapunk was just in a rush to get out because of caesar's gas so him leaving it behind does not mean its a failure plus its been better than caesar's smile fruits since it can do a full transformation unlike caesar's fruits and it would be a mythical fake fruit unlike caesar''s fruits that are just normal animals so its a lot better than caesar's fruits so if any fake fruits are failures it would be caesar's since none of them have been shown to do a full beast transformation but momo has been shown to turn into his full dragon form.
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Are there any theories on Law betraying Luffy in regards to the Yonkou takedown?
Possible but highly unlikely (since he sort of owes Luffy a huge debt). More like he will try to bail out after beating Kaido, or compete for the Pirate King title.
There's this popular comparison of
Luffy=Roger
Law=Whitebeard
Kidd=Shiki(?)If the betrayal in terms of I am going to backstab you and eliminate you muahahahaha type, I don't see it. Law is actually full of… heart...
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Law is a D, and at given time will sacrifice himself to save luffy, wether it's eternal life operation or something else, he was ready to die even before knowing him just to defeat doflamingo. now that corazon is avenged at some point he'll realize he want to defeat WG because of what happened to his parents and because of the d clan. everything will pan out for luffy to become PK, cause the only thing clear by now is the he is strong but not strong enough to win it all and become PK without the help of somebody else (elephants included)
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Are there any theories on Law betraying Luffy in regards to the Yonkou takedown?
It's a theory I've met several times.
I personally don't think that this will ever happen, because Luffy saved Law's life several times and defeated Doflamingo for him. Plus, the Straw Hats already have tons of enemies to take care of. -
If the doffy thing wasn't so personal, if we didn't get to meet corasan, if law wasn't that self sacrificing during the fights, maybe. But no chance now.
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If the doffy thing wasn't so personal, if we didn't get to meet corasan, if law wasn't that self sacrificing during the fights, maybe. But no chance now.
Also, the D connection. It's almost like they're cousins.
What's more Law might even die to save Luffy or someone else by the end. That Perennial Youth Operation ability smells like Chekhov's Gun to me.
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Law will never betray Luffy, defeating Doffy was way to important for Law.
Also after being shown as a guy who ripped 100 hearts out, we might have suggested that he could betray someone like Luffy, but after the flashback we know he is a good one and it would be horrible for his character development to back stab Luffy after all that.
What would it accomplish?
It´s way more likely that after the Kaidou threat isn´t any longer there, they will split their ways to accomplish their goals while being allies.
Backstabbing Luffy could only happen imo, when something drastic happens to Law, so that he has to do so for a greater good, but the backstabbing theme could be used way more efficient by another character later in the story. (like Kidd after showing some sympathy, to establish him as an antagonist) -
Yeah, I agree with all of the above. In addition to the logical reasons that Law has to not betray Luffy, he has some hella strong personal reasons not to as well. I also consider him dying thanks to his Devil Fruit's power to be a strong possibility, though I'd love it if he didn't and survived the series.
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@Don:
Law will never betray Luffy, defeating Doffy was way to important for Law.
Also after being shown as a guy who ripped 100 hearts out, we might have suggested that he could betray someone like Luffy, but after the flashback we know he is a good one and it would be horrible for his character development to back stab Luffy after all that.
What would it accomplish?
It´s way more likely that after the Kaidou threat isn´t any longer there, they will split their ways to accomplish their goals while being allies.
Backstabbing Luffy could only happen imo, when something drastic happens to Law, so that he has to do so for a greater good, but the backstabbing theme could be used way more efficient by another character later in the story. (like Kidd after showing some sympathy, to establish him as an antagonist)He is interested in One Piece and he has the information on Raftel now, once they acquire all the road polyglyphs, he "may" try to beat Luffy to Raftel. Maybe sabotage their ship or do something weird.
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He is interested in One Piece and he has the information on Raftel now, once they acquire all the road polyglyphs, he "may" try to beat Luffy to Raftel. Maybe sabotage their ship or do something weird.
Perhaps, but I get the impression that he doesn't really care about being Pirate King. He's never expressed interest in that, not even once. And even with One Piece, he only showed interest the one time (chapter 595), and just said "It's not going anywhere." I'm inclined to think that if he does want to find it, it's for reasons other than being Pirate King (especially since finding One Piece and being PK are not necessarily synonymous), in which case he could instead end up wanting to tag along with them to Raftel and wouldn't even need to betray them.
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Are people still clinging to "Law's gonna betray Luffy' theory?
Brings back memories, like the one of Law switched Luffy's heart with a bomb when he saved him at end of the war at Marineford. -
Brings back memories, like the one of Law switched Luffy's heart with a bomb when he saved him at end of the war at Marineford.
Lol didn't know that was a thing.
Yeah I don't see Law betraying Luffy, especially not now.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
He is interested in One Piece and he has the information on Raftel now, once they acquire all the road polyglyphs, he "may" try to beat Luffy to Raftel. Maybe sabotage their ship or do something weird.
I think the alliance could split before that point. I'm not exactly sure if Law will tag along past Wano, just saying.
His personal goal was to take down DD, so whether he really wants to take down the Yonko and become PK is still unclear imo.