Don't know who Seth Meyers is but i thought this was pretty funny.
Game of Thrones (tv show thread)
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Won't link them here, but the first 3 episodes of Season 5 have turned up on torrent sites/streaming sites.
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Alright, I ain't a kid anymore. I got will power. I can resist!
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Watched first ep.
! wow, young Cercei was already a bitch. If that was there to symphatize with her.. it didn't work. Too bad knowing your future you will still ruin it yourself.
I also wonder in how many colours she's got that dress.
! Can't wait for Tyrion and Dany to meet. She will hate him, won't she.
! I liked how cool Margaery was about his brothers preferences. Yes, she probably already knew, but seeing it is a different caliber. Margaery for queen, wohoo~ -
! I was kinda…surprised with Lancel. Totally didn't see that coming with his character.:getlost:
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EP4 ending is evil.
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! Wow. Now that I've exhausted my attention span by marathoning every single episode, I gotta say they really pulled this off very well. I'm more excited to watch the next episode then I've ever been. Everything going on is just so tense and it feels like more stuff happen every episode than it has before.
! Every single scene with Bron and Jaime are completely priceless. I absolutely love their interactions, they feel like the new Arya and the Hound, but even so, more interesting. It's strange that the storyline I find least interesting is the storyline with Arya, it just doesn't seem to happen very much there and the payoff in that storyline feels very far ahead of us. But it truly bothers me that John has turned into such a tool. He can moan about his duties on the wall for the rest of eternity, fact of the matter is that as long as the North is controlled by a bunch of maniacs who are destabilizing the entire region, it doesn't matter if he guards the freaking wall or not! They are screwed as it is when Bolton hears ''oh! Check it out, there is a bastard on the wall and we have never really needed it. Let's just burn all that shit down.'' hopefully he'll come to some form of realization at some point, because just having him drumming his fingers at the wall for another season won't be interesting.
! But already now, I've noticed quite alot of issues with the source material. Mance was not supposed to die there and Barristan ( his fate is yet to be discovered ) certainly didn't die here either. Maybe George are sharing some of the final script to the directors, so they can cut loose needless characters and take the series in a new path. -
Podrick must be protected! He is a wonderful, beautiful cinnamon roll!
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Jon did the right thing
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I have more self-restraint with Game of Thrones spoilers than One Piece ones. Barely.
Gotta say, this episode was a whole lot of nothing. The only genuinely faithful stuff happened for Cersei and sort-of-not-quite for Jon. If you're going to diverge from the books you could at least try to spice things up.
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I have more self-restraint with Game of Thrones spoilers than One Piece ones. Barely.
Gotta say, this episode was a whole lot of nothing. The only genuinely faithful stuff happened for Cersei and sort-of-not-quite for Jon. If you're going to diverge from the books you could at least try to spice things up.
I heard they will be straying away from the book during the latter parts of season 5. I think people who have read the book and who will watch this season completely can probably cement few of the theories going around. I believe they have removed some of the "irrelevant" factors from the book to directly make it move towards the discussed ending too
! I am in episode 2 and they haven't actually mentioned anything about the white walkers yet. I thought the author said that we would be getting to know more about the white walkers this season. Or was that supposed to be the next season?!
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EP4 ending is evil.
So true. :( But the whole show is freaking evil. xD
Dammit, why did episodes 2-4 leaked as well. I am too weakwilled to resist the temptation so I watched them all, now I have to wait a month for episode 5. Noooooooooo!
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Dammit, why did episodes 2-4 leaked as well. I am too weakwilled to resist the temptation so I watched them all, now I have to wait a month for episode 5. Noooooooooo!
That's the main reason I refuse to watch them. I'd rather spread it out over the month than watch them all after waiting the full 10 months already.
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I'm gonna rewatch each episode week by week again, till 5 comes out, lol.
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This post is deleted!
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I'm controlling myself and only watching an episode a week instead of all 4 right now.
Same reasoning as Galaxy.
Anyway, Episode 1;
! I really wasn't impressed by this episode tbh.
! Sure, it's an episode that started setting a lot of things up, and picking up from where we left off, but even the "big" events like Mance's execution felt flat to me.
! I was particularly disappointing by the exchanges between Tyrion and Varys, which are normally some of my favourite pieces of dialog.
! While part of it can be put down to Tyrion's apparent depression, it still just didn't have that usual spark, and it was just weird to hear Varys say the word "shit".
! As sad as it is, my favorite part of the episode was seeing The Flayed Man of Bolton atop Winterfell in the intro lol -
Hey, maybe this thread can get revived now that everyone should be on the same page!
Episode 4 made me inordinately angry about the number of highly illogical or out of character actions made. I can normally separate the books and show as long ad each retains an internal consistency, but this was too much. It's like they took the events of the books and completely forgot why they happened in the first place. In short:
! The Faith Militant. Book Cersei might be more cartoonishly evil and shortsighted but at least she negotiated for a massive reduction of the crown's debts in exchange for for reinstating the Faith Militant. TV Cersei revived a dangerous 250 year old order for free just to fuck with her daughter-in-law. What's worse, the Sparrows apparently have no checks on their power and can do whatever the hell they want. Cersei literally just gave away control of her city and potentially her entire goddamned country for a grudge.
! Next, the Sand Snakes. Ignoring the stupid dramatic silence before "choosing sides," was it really necessary to torture and kill that Pentoshi trader? Poor guy comes to you to sell out the hated Lannister and you kill him for it. Real nice.
! Meereen.
First off, Barristan Selmy would never EVER leave his queen to hold court without him there to protect her. The man has outlived several kings plus Rhaegar because he couldn't protect them, and that haunts him. There is no way in hell he would let her out of his sight in public if he could help it.
! Second, that fight was horribly conceived. The Sons of the Harpy would never attack a large group of Unsullied because they would take too many casualties of their own. The show the proceeds to deeply devalue the worth of the Unsullied by having them devolve into chaos and be slaughter by two-to-one odds against largely untrained men. The fight itself was bad because it was in dark lighting and 95% of the people were wearing masks. It's literally just a fight between extras, plus Grey Worm and Barristan.
! And if Barristan is dead I will be SO. FUCKING. PISSED. I can't properly express how upset I will be. -
! The Faith Militant. Book Cersei might be more cartoonishly evil and shortsighted but at least she negotiated for a massive reduction of the crown's debts in exchange for for reinstating the Faith Militant. TV Cersei revived a dangerous 250 year old order for free just to fuck with her daughter-in-law. What's worse, the Sparrows apparently have no checks on their power and can do whatever the hell they want. Cersei literally just gave away control of her city and potentially her entire goddamned country for a grudge.
! It's not just a grudge, it's a matter of political control. What's going on is the Tyrell's are squeezing the Lannister's out, with Tywin gone especially there's a huge danger of that. Honestly it's kind of logical, especially given that the Tyrell's in fact killed Joffrey whether Cersei knows it or not. Cersei doesn't really think on any other level but dog eat dog type stuff, she's a bit uh misanthropic on top of that. This seems totally in character.
Also holding rabid wild social uprisings on a distant leash in order to cause desired chaos to pick off rivals and ursurpers is a real life thing. And yes it's risky.
I'm not sure since I haven't read the books, but exactly how much money does some sort of crazy bunch of monks who were up till Cersei acting sort of like an underground cult have? It would seem stranger for them to be rich and worth financially negotiating with. -
@Monkey:
! I'm not sure since I haven't read the books, but exactly how much money does some sort of crazy bunch of monks who were up till Cersei acting sort of like an underground cult have? It would seem stranger for them to be rich and worth financially negotiating with.
! It wasn't debt to the Faith Militant per se, the crown had debts with the Faith of the Seven itself (I believe it's mentioned that the Faith engages in usury at one point in the books, either there or in the world book.)
! The High Sparrow just brought his Sparrows along when he was installed as High Septon. Cersei is trying (key word) to use the High Sparrow to both fuck with the Tyrells and keep the crown's debt as far away as possible - these are the same reasons she sent Mace (poor bastard, he's the only competent person left now that Kevan's dropped the mic) to deal with the Iron Bank.
! It's worth noting that this isn't the first time the peasantry have turned to religious fanaticism when things get really really bad. -
@Cyan:
! It wasn't debt to the Faith Militant per se, the crown had debts with the Faith of the Seven itself (I believe it's mentioned that the Faith engages in usury at one point in the books, either there or in the world book.)
! The High Sparrow just brought his Sparrows along when he was installed as High Septon. Cersei is trying (key word) to use the High Sparrow to both fuck with the Tyrells and keep the crown's debt as far away as possible - these are the same reasons she sent Mace (poor bastard, he's the only competent person left now that Kevan's dropped the mic) to deal with the Iron Bank.
! It's worth noting that this isn't the first time the peasantry have turned to religious fanaticism when things get really really bad.! The way it was presented in the show is totally different from the book then, and Jabberwok's criticism doesn't make sense. Unless I didn't pick up on anything. Cersei didn't send some rich high fallutin' new pope into power. She allowed some weird radical cult leader on the sidelines within the religion to become the new pope, and seems to think she can control his acolytes by colluding with him. Also how is Mace competent lol, isn't the whole joke that he's a complete idiot?
Also I don't recall any mention of debts with the holy see in the show, just debts with the Iron Bank. -
@Monkey:
! It's not just a grudge, it's a matter of political control. What's going on is the Tyrell's are squeezing the Lannister's out, with Tywin gone especially there's a huge danger of that. Honestly it's kind of logical, especially given that the Tyrell's in fact killed Joffrey whether Cersei knows it or not. Cersei doesn't really think on any other level but dog eat dog type stuff, she's a bit uh misanthropic on top of that. This seems totally in character.
Also holding rabid wild social uprisings on a distant leash in order to cause desired chaos to pick off rivals and ursurpers is a real life thing. And yes it's risky.
I'm not sure since I haven't read the books, but exactly how much money does some sort of crazy bunch of monks who were up till Cersei acting sort of like an underground cult have? It would seem stranger for them to be rich and worth financially negotiating with.! Cyan's got the gist of it. The crown has debts to a number of sources, including the Faith of the Seven, the Iron Bank, the Lannisters, and a little to the Tyrells. What makes me mad is that Cersei doesn't realize what a powerful bargaining chip she has and that the debt is mentioned right before in the previous scene but then not here. Cersei should know better than to think she can control the Sparrows - they rose up on their own and deposed the previous High Septon before she ever interacted with them.
On a separate note, I'd hardly call Mace "competent," especially on the show.
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@Monkey:
! The way it was presented in the show is totally different from the book then, and Jabberwok's criticism doesn't make sense. Unless I didn't pick up on anything. Cersei didn't send some rich high fallutin' new pope into power. She allowed some weird radical cult leader on the sidelines within the religion to become the new pope, and seems to think she can control his acolytes by colluding with him. Also how is Mace competent lol, isn't the whole joke that he's a complete idiot?
Also I don't recall any mention of debts with the holy see in the show, just debts with the Iron Bank.! Huh, they didn't mention that the crown was in debt to both the Faith and the Bank? That's an odd thing to leave out - Cersei gives the debt as her "pragmatic" reasons for letting the High Sparrow do his thing (of course she doesn't really give a fuck about the debt and has been pissing of the Bank, but that's a given.)
! Weird omission, but then again the debt is rather confusingly described in the books, too. -
! Cyan's got the gist of it. The crown has debts to a number of sources, including the Faith of the Seven, the Iron Bank, the Lannisters, and a little to the Tyrells. What makes me mad is that Cersei doesn't realize what a powerful bargaining chip she has and that the debt is mentioned right before in the previous scene but then not here.
! There's zero presentation of that debt with the Holy See in the show though? I only recall Iron Bank Iron Bank Iron Bank.
Cyan was explaining the book events to me. You seem to be just assuming it's the same for no reason. Until presented it shouldn't be assumed that the details are the same between the book and the show.! Cersei should know better than to think she can control the Sparrows - they rose up on their own and deposed the previous High Septon before she ever interacted with them.
! They fucked with him, they didn't depose him. Also yeah Pakistan should have thought better about funding the Taliban to exert control on Afghanistan. Mao should have realized that his cultural revolution would wreck the Chinese economy and spread massive chaos everywhere. Prince Sihanouk should have considered that the Khmer Rouge were about a lot more then helping him regain power. Why are you expecting perfect non-risk taking chess moves in a show/book inspired heavily by real life events and peoples?
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@Monkey:
! There's zero presentation of that debt with the Holy See in the show though? I only recall Iron Bank Iron Bank Iron Bank.
Cyan was explaining the book events to me. You seem to be just assuming it's the same for no reason. Until presented it shouldn't be assumed that the details are the same between the book and the show.! They fucked with him, they didn't depose him. Also yeah Pakistan should have thought better about funding the Taliban to exert control on Afghanistan. Mao should have realized that his cultural revolution would wreck the Chinese economy and spread massive chaos everywhere. Prince Sihanouk should have considered that the Khmer Rouge were about a lot more then helping him regain power. Why are you expecting perfect non-risk taking chess moves in a show/book inspired heavily by real life events and peoples?
! Sigh, fair enough. Not having the royal family be in debt to the Faith isn't a problem in itself, I suppose. It's more a vehicle for my complaint that Cersei is getting very little in return for establishing a sanctioned military outside of the king's control. It's not mentioned in the show, but the Faith Militant was basically in a civil war against one of the old Targaryen kings before it was forcibly disbanded. Its interests have demonstrably differed from the Iron Throne's before. That's an enormous bargaining chip she's handing to a religious radical and it seems like she's doing it almost for free.
! The sequence wasn't entirely without worth. The dangers of Loras's indiscretions were foreshadowed earlier this season, and by sending Mace away to Braavos Margaery is just as isolated as Cersei. Which is to say, only moderately.
! Tangentially, Meryn Trant is accompanying Mace to Braavos. Given the number of references to him by name this season I wouldn't be surprised if Arya's climax this season involved assassinating him. -
Fuck the haters. Im gonna cry the day they kill Stannis (if they do), big respect for the guy.
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Stannis is going to die. It's just a matter of when and where. The last episode had a bit of foreshadowing with Brienne talking about her wanting to kill Stannis, and one of the videos where they explain lore stuff has Brienne talking about getting revenge on him as well. I assume this is leading more to a case where she'll have to choose between protecting Sansa and killing Sansa where I figure she'll choose the former.
….What's the policy on TV episode spoilers?
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Put TV spoilers inside of spoiler tags. Try to wait about a week for people to catch on each episode before you stop spoiler tagging.
Try not to put book spoilers in this thread. If you absolutely have to, put a warning above the spoiler tag stating that it is a book spoiler. Still, we'd prefer not to put them here.
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This post is deleted!
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! Sigh, fair enough. Not having the royal family be in debt to the Faith isn't a problem in itself, I suppose. It's more a vehicle for my complaint that Cersei is getting very little in return for establishing a sanctioned military outside of the king's control.
! The king is her gullible hormonal child who is already somewhat under the thumb of her rivals in power, the Tyrell's. Being outside the crown's control in this case is being outside the Tyrell's control. Cersei is bypassing her son and thus Tyrell's to potentially albeit riskily control a private army, or at least direct the flow of a chaotic social revolution. As has been done irl.
! It's not mentioned in the show, but the Faith Militant was basically in a civil war against one of the old Targaryen kings before it was forcibly disbanded.
! So? What's your point? That they're a risky element to try and control? Why yes it appears to be the case that they are even without that factoid.
! Its interests have demonstrably differed from the Iron Throne's before. That's an enormous bargaining chip she's handing to a religious radical and it seems like she's doing it almost for free.
! What bargaining chip? That they're more integrated into the system now by having their boss be pope? That can go both ways in that they can be tamed somewhat by being integrated into the system perhaps, or maybe it will horribly backfire as happened when they tried integrating the Nazis into the German government. Sounds like an interesting conflict we have here! But hey Cersei gets a private army she can try and puppeteer behind the scenes and bypass a system that she's quickly being locked outside of. Lots of risk and reward potential. Sounds like a really interesting and exciting plot or something.
! The sequence wasn't entirely without worth. The dangers of Loras's indiscretions were foreshadowed earlier this season, and by sending Mace away to Braavos Margaery is just as isolated as Cersei. Which is to say, only moderately.
Tangentially, Meryn Trant is accompanying Mace to Braavos. Given the number of references to him by name this season I wouldn't be surprised if Arya's climax this season involved assassinating him.! Margaery isn't as isolated, they still have their Tywin and she still has more control of the king. If anything it looks like Cersei is going to passively aggressivly use Mace as a hostage by sending him with Meryn. "Hey yer dumb puppy of a dad is traveling with my dude, would be real terrible if he fell off his horse into an arrow."
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@Monkey:
! The king is her gullible hormonal child who is already somewhat under the thumb of her rivals in power, the Tyrell's. Being outside the crown's control in this case is being outside the Tyrell's control. Cersei is bypassing her son and thus Tyrell's to potentially albeit riskily control a private army, or at least direct the flow of a chaotic social revolution. As has been done irl.
! This would be great, except that Cersei is acting as Hand and is therefore trying to control both the crown and the realm. Her goal is to undermine Margaery and the Tyrells' power, not her son and heir's. If she's undermining her own son, as she is here, Cersei needs to be sure she will be the one to fix everything. Otherwise she hurts herself just as much as the Tyrells.
@Monkey:
! So? What's your point? That they're a risky element to try and control? Why yes it appears to be the case that they are even without that factoid.
! My point is Cersei is reviving something very dangerous and unruly with only the most minimal control over it. She knows its history but is ignoring the reason it was disbanded.
@Monkey:
! What bargaining chip? That they're more integrated into the system now by having their boss be pope? That can go both ways in that they can be tamed somewhat by being integrated into the system perhaps, or maybe it will horribly backfire as happened when they tried integrating the Nazis into the German government. Sounds like an interesting conflict we have here! But hey Cersei gets a private army she can try and puppeteer behind the scenes and bypass a system that she's quickly being locked outside of. Lots of risk and reward potential. Sounds like a really interesting and exciting plot or something.
! They're not being integrated into the system in any way. It doesn't help because we're told fuck all about the Faith Militant so far in the series, but the Faith Militant changes the Sparrows from a semi-organized rabble to a trained and sanctioned order of knights and militia. Cersei hasn't integrated them into the system, she's established a new system just for them. So yeah, she's gone ahead and created a private army, but it's not hers. It takes orders from the High Sparrow, and what control or influence does she have over him? They talk a few times and then Cersei hands him this army and just assumes he'll keep listening to her. She has no control over this army whatsoever, and her reward is that it's going to cause trouble for the Tyrells? Impossibly shortsighted.
! Sure it makes for an interesting plot but that doesn't mean the move is well justified.@Monkey:
! Margaery isn't as isolated, they still have their Tywin and she still has more control of the king. If anything it looks like Cersei is going to passively aggressivly use Mace as a hostage by sending him with Meryn. "Hey yer dumb puppy of a dad is traveling with my dude, would be real terrible if he fell off his horse into an arrow."
! Do you mean Olenna? She's back in Highgarden, where her ability to influence the kingdom and react to family feuds are both more limited. With Mace away and potentially a hostage and Loras imprisoned and awaiting trial, Margaery is the only Tyrell left free to act in the capital. And in this episode she just realized that her influence over the king might not be worth that much if he's too afraid to stand up to other people. She and Cersei both feel very isolated by one another right now.
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! I'm not the biggest fan of this show as I've made clear before. However I have been enjoying this season more (mostly because of the better pacing that comes from adapting two books instead of half of one). If there's one change that really pisses me off though, it's Sansa being used by LF for the marriage with Ramsay instead of the fake Arya girl. Not only is it rehashing the Sansa/Joffrey thing which we're supposed to be past at this point where Sansa is supposed to regain some control in her life, the plan makes no sense. Why would LF trust Roose Bolton with Sansa, the man who killed his beloved Cat, why not just marry her himself like in the books? This seems like a pretty shitty way to keep Sansa main plot relevant.
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Alrihgt Im gonna continue this convo when we can stop having to spoiler everything, this is retarded to do with spoiler tags lol.
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You could always just put the entire post into a spoiler tag instead of making a different spoiler tag for each quote response.
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! So how 'bout that Barristan?
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[hide]Deader than Ned.[/hide]
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Okay, we should probably be fine posting outside of spoilers as long as the episode has happened. I mean, if someone hasn't seen the episode, I'd hope they'd avoid this thread and not get mad at people.
Honestly go for it. Just avoid book spoilers and spoiling any future episodes you might have seen or known of through leaks or such.
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Barristan is one of my three my favorite POV characters from the books, along with Jaime and Theon. I'm extremely upset that they killed him unnecessarily.
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Having not read the books, I'm really going to miss GreyWorm.
Also chalk me up as a supporter of Stannis. -
Having not read the books, I'm really going to miss GreyWorm.
I was kinda hoping at least he would pull through :/
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To be fair, we don't yet have confirmation on Grey Worm. At least, I don't think so. The preview for next week showed Barristan's body. The actor who plays Barristan already confirmed it by talking about leaving the series.
I think Grey Worm is a question mark at the moment.
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! Wait, what? they actually killed off Selmy? Ugh, his character conflict in the last book was one of the most interesting subplots. And they wasted him for ANYONE CAN DIE drama? Blegh
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Ser Barristan went out like a goddamn badass and I expected nothing less from Aerys II's Kingsguard.
None of the rulers he's served deserved him (except for Aegon V), and if he was just a little better at jousting, none of this tragedy would have happened.
Now Dany is overseeing Reconstruction without an adviser that doesn't want her for her dragons/sexy times. Meereen is even more fucked. But hey, they (mercifully) blew through most of Dany's Book 5 plot in about ten minutes, so maybe this new uncharted territory will see her plot actually move along now.
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@Cyan:
Ser Barristan went out like a goddamn badass and I expected nothing less from Aerys II's Kingsguard.
None of the rulers he's served deserved him (except for Aegon V), and if he was just a little better at jousting, none of this tragedy would have happened.
Now Dany is overseeing Reconstruction without an adviser that doesn't want her for her dragons/sexy times. Meereen is even more fucked. But hey, they (mercifully) blew through most of Dany's Book 5 plot in about ten minutes, so maybe this new uncharted territory will see her plot actually move along now.
Barristan was made a Kingsguard during the reign of Jaehaerys II, so he was never directly sworn to Egg.
Pretty sure Grey Worm's not dead. Aside from the fact that his last actions seem more like a flop of exhaustion into unconsciousness, he's also featured during the season preview in a scene next to Missandei. Because it's more important to have a romantic subplot between two tertiary characters than to flesh out a critical book POV character
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With Jorah gone and Barristan gone, Dany doesn't really have an advisor who generally advocates her to be more merciful compared to Daario wanting to kill everyone opposing her and Hidzar(?) just looking out for his own interests at the end of the day. What she really needs is a Davos.
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Well Tyrion and Varys are heading towards Dany's direction. Maybe he could knock some sense into her…maybe (I swear she has been making fatal decisions here and there. She could benefit from someone that knows what they are doing).
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The sad thing is that if Dany doesn't want to completely decimate the former slaveholding class and set up formal Freedman's Bureaus (which probably should have been her first move after taking Meereen), Harzoo zo Harzoo's idea of opening the fighting pits again is actually a decent plan.
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The really sad thing about Meereen is that as much time as we are spending there, there's no way Dany'll be able to solve even half of its problems before she inevitably has to leave for Westeros. The best case scenario is she leaves someone competent in charge after she leaves.
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Greyworm ain't considering they said he and Missandei will have a romance.
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Gross what did they do to the sand snakes. Maybe they should've done the greyjoy plotline instead. But I guess since Jaime and Bronn are now there it's more convenient.