I kinda want the chapter with the subtitle of Sleeping Beauty lol.
Chapter 734: "Rommel's Whirlwind"
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Technically speaking I would say Doflamingo underestimated the Strawhats 'competency'. Simply, the strawhats are doing precisely what he thought they couldn't do , they exceeded Flamingos expectations.
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https://cdn.anonfiles.com/1375301409786.gif
What does that have to do with anything?
She's boring. Her backstory was uninteresting, it being over so quick also didn't help for us to feel with her. Her fighting style is really dumb and going in a tournament with "I'm going to ignore and push you all out of the ring" was cringeworthy. The only thing worse was King Riku's flashback. It's such a ridiculous thing that Oda had to get by far the strongest guy in the group to beat everyone that had a name in the round for her, then fall asleep. He could have just attacked her again from his sleep, but the poor plot device had to be activated. Nice coincidence that her helmet is the reason she's saved and Cavendish didn't hit her elsewhere. At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if it's some free for all and they all knock each other out and she wins by doing nothing again. Or they slip last second and she wins. Hopefully if that's the case, it's a free for all with those 4 and then she has to fight one of the cards rather than her winning outright and getting the Mera Mera no mi. She seems to have a good sense of speed thanks to her father that's far more interesting, on top of having solid CoO.
People should understand that some people don't enjoy how the female characters in the OP world are written, which is more than fair. Of the last 3 shounen animes I've seen, there isn't a single female character at the moment that irritates me while in One Piece my question revolves on whether Nami #231312 will be slightly more appealing than her predecessors. HxH unfortunately has too few female characters, but the point still stands.
aaaand now it's official you didn't even read the chapter
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https://cdn.anonfiles.com/1375301409786.gif
What does that have to do with anything?
She's boring. Her backstory was uninteresting, it being over so quick also didn't help for us to feel with her. Her fighting style is really dumb and going in a tournament with "I'm going to ignore and push you all out of the ring" was cringeworthy. The only thing worse was King Riku's flashback. It's such a ridiculous thing that Oda had to get by far the strongest guy in the group to beat everyone that had a name in the round for her, then fall asleep. He could have just attacked her again from his sleep, but the poor plot device had to be activated. Nice coincidence that her helmet is the reason she's saved and Cavendish didn't hit her elsewhere. At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if it's some free for all and they all knock each other out and she wins by doing nothing again. Or they slip last second and she wins. Hopefully if that's the case, it's a free for all with those 4 and then she has to fight one of the cards rather than her winning outright and getting the Mera Mera no mi. She seems to have a good sense of speed thanks to her father that's far more interesting, on top of having solid CoO.
People should understand that some people don't enjoy how the female characters in the OP world are written, which is more than fair. Of the last 3 shounen animes I've seen, there isn't a single female character at the moment that irritates me while in One Piece my question revolves on whether Nami #231312 will be slightly more appealing than her predecessors. HxH unfortunately has too few female characters, but the point still stands.
The thing is that her style isn't to be a strong fighter, it's about skill. Not only did she use her skills to keep up with Hakuba, she withstood a hit(adjusting herself) and managed to get up again. The boring flashback you talk about built up to this. At least what she's said to be good at, she's shown to be good at and that's why she's a completely fine character. This just proves that people only want dumb power-level fights and not unique fighting styles clashing.
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Kitsune's clearly being sarcastic to go against all the Rebecca haters..Wonder how strong Hakuba is though in an actual fight against someone strong
KITSUNE? From Love Hina?!? :o
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Yes, that's who I am.
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@The:
Doflamingo headed back to the palace because he was confident that it was impossible for Luffy to escape the Coliseum.
It wasn't.
= Doflamingo underestimated Luffy.Doflamingo has no idea where Usopp and Robin are, but he assume they are of no consequence. He also assumes his underground is impossible to reach.
Usopp and Robin have currently infiltrated the underground.
= He underestimated them.Doflamingo is being careless. Yeah he "doesn't know all the facts" but when your empire lies in ruins because of someone you dismissed as clearly inferior, thats just a sad excuse.
HE HEADED BACK to the palace so to talk to fujitora. Which is more important because if an admiral is on your side, hell breaks loose. HE IS NOT COMFIDENT WITH LUFFY IN GENERAL, because he had a conversation with luffy and planned out to let luffy join the contest so he will be separated with his crew. And no one escapes the coliseum because the tournament is ongoing. HE DIDNT KNOW THAT LUFFY BEING LUCY HAS ANOTHER LUCY IN LUCY. WHICH ALL OF US DIDNT KNOW WHO THAT IS, (YEAH IT IS SABO
) and is willing to help luffy get his hands job-free of the mera mera fruit.I never said he didnt underestimated other sh crew. HE IS NOT CARELESS BEFORE THE ARC HE PLANNED EVERYTHING OUT EVEN FAKING THE SHICHIBUKAI TITLE AND SEEING WHO HIS OPPONENTS ARE.
WHAT WE ARE SEEING NOW, AS IN RIGHT NOW, IS A CLEAR PICTURE OF DOFFY BEING A GOOD PLANNER WHEN IN FACT EVERYTHING IS A MESS. YEAH YOU CAN SAY HE IS UNDERESTIMATING LUFFY WHEN ODA SHOWS US PICTURE SAYING "i underestimated you straw hat". BUT! BUT UNTIL THEN!!! DOFFY DIDNT UNDERESTIMATED STRAW HAT. HE EVEN ACKNOWLEDGED HIM SAYING HE IS SOME GREAT MAN 2 yrs ago. (Idk the exact words)
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Yes, I am also her.
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I was quite impressed with Rebecca's defense. That girl just can't be touched can she.
London island was fun, more real world islands please Oda.
And now it looks like we'll finally get to see Jesus in action…...After five chapters of other stuff of course
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@CCC:
Sabo and Bastille flat-out explained this. It wasn't luck that saved Rebecca. Hakuba was on a timer (Bastille says), dashing around and giving everyone enough hits to take them down, but Rebecca was the only one able to keep up with his movements (Sabo says), so she shifted her position so that her helmet took the hit.
It's possible that Cav subconsciously wanted to spare her, but the evidence from the exposition-dealers goes against that idea.
That wasn
t the point^^. I am able to understand such simple dialogues such as sabos^^. I am talking about the weird feeling i had, reading this chapter. In short, why fell cavendish asleep in the middle of a fight and fell asleep again after hitting rebecca. Also, the way cavendish fell asleep, the first time, he looked like he is in trance or he prepared for the hakubo action. Its weird and i can`t really discribe it with my bad english^^sorry
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Technically speaking I would say Doflamingo underestimated the Strawhats 'competency'. Simply, the strawhats are doing precisly what he thought they couldn't , they exceeded Flamingos expectations.
he's being myopic
Strawhat is in front of his eyes and there is no free route into the factory/port. Therefore he ahs no need to worry.
When Sugar goes down, he is finished. He cant contend with 500 dwarves, all of the townspeople, a ton of super strong colisseum contestants, the revolutionary army, Kanjuro, the remnants of the strawhat pirates and the eventual wielder of the mera mera no mi (presuming an ally gets it)
Even if he could he would not have the time. Luffy, Zoro and Kinemon are about to show up with a woman who can tell the future. If she's betting on them, then he's in trouble
Fujitora is a wildcard, but once he finds out about doflamingo's dirty dealings it's game over. Presuming Kaido doesn't get to him first
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was rebecca using observation haki to avoid the attacks?
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Yeah, we know this. What makes you think Doffy does, and what makes you think he should know that they would decide to attack this very day?
again, you are equating being completley unaware (to our knowledge) with underestimating.Why not just destroy Green Pit then. It serves no point other than a confirmed base for the dwarves
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However, it would be refreshing to see a strong female fighter eventually. I have high hopes for Wano.
Given Kinemon's cultural view of women I imagine your hopes will be dashed.
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Cavendish disappears when his "snot bubble" bursts and reappears when another one forms again. :ninja:
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Maybe Oda let Rebecca through to the finals for contrast? A reasonably 'strong' fighter like her in the ring with the infamous Bart, arguably Flamingos strongest family leader, a revolutionary comander and a yonko commander. The difference in strength would allow more appreciation for the desparity in power?
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Why has no one drawn Rebecca in MC Hammer pants yet?
Also Cavendish just shot up my favourite character list. -
Doflamingo's problem is not that he is underestimating the Straw Hats.
It's that he is underestimating everybody else. Violet, the Dwarves, Bellamy, Fujitora…
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Next fight is the defensive minded Rebecca against the entirely defensive barrier man.
Should be amusing lol
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Given Kinemon's cultural view of women I imagine your hopes will be dashed.
That's the thing though. I imagine we will get to see a woman who refused to wear kimono and make tee. Instead she wanted to become a swordswoman!
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https://cdn.anonfiles.com/1375301409786.gif
People should understand that some people don't enjoy how the female characters in the OP world are written, which is more than fair. Of the last 3 shounen animes I've seen, there isn't a single female character at the moment that irritates me while in One Piece my question revolves on whether Nami #231312 will be slightly more appealing than her predecessors. HxH unfortunately has too few female characters, but the point still stands.
Fair point. But id like to point out that Oda used to be pretty good at this. Oldschool nami was fun, and Robin has always been great.
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Dofla's not underestimating the SH's. Aside from the X factor of the dwarves which he has no way of knowing about, he's been betrayed by both Violet and Bellamy, and Luffy has a stand in with Sabo. Aside from those he's taken plenty of precautions and moved around his big guys in advance to protect his most valuable assets, currently has maneuvered to get Law back under his thumb (And break their alliance) AND gotten an admiral working for him.
So he's taken out one of their key guys already, he knows half the crew is off and gone, and thinks he knows where the powerhouses all are. He's in a pretty good spot right now honestly. He's not underestimating the strawhats… he just doesn't know about Sabo, the dwarves, or two of his most loyal servants betraying him. X factors that aren't really related to the Strawhats.
On a side note... sigh I hate to throw out crewmate disscussion since there's already an awful, awful thread for exactly that, but....
I think it's interesting is Kinemon being counted among the strawhats. While I've been tossing him off as a Vivi for the longest time, with no chance of joining due to Momo, two other swordsman, and his samurai bit being similar to Zoro AND Jinbe (I know Jinbe is a mafioso) him being actually mentioned as a strawhat knocks up his joining chances considerably in my book. That may just be Oda shorthanding to make the dialogue fit the space... but... Oda is careful about saying things like that generally.
So, that's more about Oda and his methods and subtleties than anything about Kinemon himself.
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"There's something satisfying about Donflamingo acknowledging Sogeking as a threat. I love it!" [BadAdvices]
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wasn't there a long haired swordswoman when they showed the underworld brokers?
There was indeed =D
I totally forgot about that. Well, it may have been a man, we don't know for sure. -
@CCC:
It's just the usual messages from each author in Jump.
But it's like Sandman says. Oda's appearance at JF last year will have been his last.
All the excitement probably isn't good for his health or something.Oda has met Greg, his life is fulfilled now :ninja:
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@RobbyBevard:
Dofla's not underestimating the SH's. Aside from the X factor of the dwarves which he has no way of knowing about, he's been betrayed by both Violet and Bellamy, and Luffy has a stand in with Sabo. Aside from those he's taken plenty of precautions and moved around his big guys in advance to protect his most valuable assets, currently has maneuvered to get Law back under his thumb (And break their alliance) AND gotten an admiral working for him.
So he's taken out one of their key guys already, he knows half the crew is off and gone, and thinks he knows where the powerhouses all are. He's in a pretty good spot right now honestly. He's not underestimating the strawhats… he just doesn't know about Sabo, the dwarves, or two of his most loyal servants betraying him. X factors that aren't really related to the Strawhats.
On a side note... sigh I hate to throw out crewmate disscussion since there's already an awful, awful thread for exactly that, but....
I think it's interesting is Kinemon being counted among the strawhats. While I've been tossing him off as a Vivi for the longest time, with no chance of joining due to Momo, two other swordsman, and his samurai bit being similar to Zoro AND Jinbe (I know Jinbe is a mafioso) him being actually mentioned as a strawhat knocks up his joining chances considerably in my book. That may just be Oda shorthanding to make the dialogue fit the space... but... Oda is careful about saying things like that generally.
So, that's more about Oda and his methods and subtleties than anything about Kinemon himself.
I totally agree with you. It's just useless to argue with someone who is close minded of the facts in front of them.
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Tries to be a strong female presence that can create change in her way and ends up being a pathetic loser begging for people to stop fighting by the end of the arc. Vivi (and Rebecca) deserve every bit of hate they get.
What the fuck kind of idiot reads the ending scenes of the Alubarna and thinks "duh huh huh Vivi is pathetic".
She's done everything anyone could possibly do including every single Strawhat barring Luffy to stop the war. But civil wars don't fucking stop that easily.
When she's yelling that out it's tragic, it's like she's lost her mind with despair and is just hopelessly yelling.
The rebels aren't even about to stop when Luffy takes out Crocodile. It takes tons of different factors coming together to stop it.
Pell stops it by getting the bomb out of there, Cobra stops it with his words, Kohza stops it with his words, Smoker stops it by capturing the Dance Powder ship, Igaram stops it by bringing the kid, the Strawhats stop it by taking out BW, and Vivi stops it by organizing the Strawhats in the first place.
But independently none of these would stop the war.Way to fuck up reading Alabasta or whatever you did.
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lol
I assure you I am quite serious. I posted my review without reading the thread at all, so this all comes as a shock.
Though the Rebecca hate in here is an absolute travesty. I'd back up why Rebecca is amazing, but I just don't have the time to deal with opinions I find extra hard to entertain.
If I were an asshole, I'd say you like her because she looks like Nami.
Good thing I'm such a lovely person.~
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That's the thing though. I imagine we will get to see a woman who refused to wear kimono and make tee. Instead she wanted to become a swordswoman!
That would be interesting, but given Oda's track-record I feel like even in that scenario she will not be the female powerhouse we're hoping for. I have learned to give up on hope in this regard to be honest.
Ed Balls
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wasn't there a long haired swordswoman when they showed the underworld brokers?
It's cool when people whove never read samurai mangas for some reason think long hair means women.
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or probably is the other personality who forced him into sleeping to "come out to play"
"it" seemed to enjoy the carnage@RobbyBevard:
Dofla's not underestimating the SH's. Aside from the X factor of the dwarves which he has no way of knowing about, he's been betrayed by both Violet and Bellamy, and Luffy has a stand in with Sabo. Aside from those he's taken plenty of precautions and moved around his big guys in advance to protect his most valuable assets, currently has maneuvered to get Law back under his thumb (And break their alliance) AND gotten an admiral working for him.
So he's taken out one of their key guys already, he knows half the crew is off and gone, and thinks he knows where the powerhouses all are. He's in a pretty good spot right now honestly. He's not underestimating the strawhats… he just doesn't know about Sabo, the dwarves, or two of his most loyal servants betraying him. X factors that aren't really related to the Strawhats.
On a side note... sigh I hate to throw out crewmate disscussion since there's already an awful, awful thread for exactly that, but....
I think it's interesting is Kinemon being counted among the strawhats. While I've been tossing him off as a Vivi for the longest time, with no chance of joining due to Momo, two other swordsman, and his samurai bit being similar to Zoro AND Jinbe (I know Jinbe is a mafioso) him being actually mentioned as a strawhat knocks up his joining chances considerably in my book. That may just be Oda shorthanding to make the dialogue fit the space... but... Oda is careful about saying things like that generally.
So, that's more about Oda and his methods and subtleties than anything about Kinemon himself.
True, but doesnt that still constitute the act of underestimating? By failing to predict the outcome, haveing estimated below what could be accomplished and could be accomplished? Most of what you described denotes 'underestimation'
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If I were an asshole, I'd say you like her because she looks like Nami.
Good thing I'm such a lovely person.~
You're not supposed to make passive-agressiveness so obvious, grasshopper.
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@Monkey:
What the fuck kind of idiot reads the ending scenes of the Alubarna and thinks "duh huh huh Vivi is pathetic".
See here is where she done fucked up. What she should've done was to unleash her massive haki
And then stand there, eight feet tall, rippling with muscles and mustaches and told them to fight her if they wanted to fight.
Maybe punched a wall and grunted a bit too. Also she needs to have a sword, preferably lots of swords. And bushido.
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That would be interesting, but given Oda's track-record I feel like even in that scenario she will not be the female powerhouse we're hoping for. I have learned to give up on hope in this regard to be honest.
what's wrong with the female powerhouse that is boa hancock?
she is yet to lose in a fight,humiliated a VA and finished the marineford war without a scratch.
ok,she is annoyingly in love with luffy but that doesn't make her less powerful,nor less confident,it's just part of her strange personality,much like barto is a luffy fanboy or cavendish is an attention whorehigher than her with only the top,yonkous,some of the shichibukai probably and the admirals
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True, but desnt that still constitute the act of underestimating? By failing to predict the outcome, haveing estimated below what could be accomplished and could be accomplished? Most of what you described denotes 'underestimation'
Doffy got one of the trump cards of sh-law alliance. HOW CAN YOU SAY IT IS UNDERESTIMATION. And his plan with luffy being in the coliseum is successful. HOW CAN YOU SAY IT IS UNDERESTIMATION.
Doffy expected to win because of his plan which is now shown to us as a mess. -
@RobbyBevard:
I think it's interesting is Kinemon being counted among the strawhats. While I've been tossing him off as a Vivi for the longest time, with no chance of joining due to Momo, two other swordsman, and his samurai bit being similar to Zoro AND Jinbe (I know Jinbe is a mafioso) him being actually mentioned as a strawhat knocks up his joining chances considerably in my book. That may just be Oda shorthanding to make the dialogue fit the space… but... Oda is careful about saying things like that generally.
So, that's more about Oda and his methods and subtleties than anything about Kinemon himself.
I'm thinking that might have been done just for convenience.
There's no point in Oda making Dofla single Kin'emon out when Kin is clearly helping the SH.
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I think Trebol ate the Glue-Glue Fruit. Wow that split-persona that Cavendish has when he falls sleep is cool; if I were him, I would just keep a drink with sleeping pills on me constantly. On a related note, I still think Rebecca is boring and the never hurting the enemy style is bullshit; yet, here being the only one fast enough to react to Hakuba just shot here coolness points up a few notches.
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Marines are definitely crazy. They should warned people of how dangerous Cavendsh really is because of his other personality.
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zoro vs hakuba. get hype
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Fair point. But id like to point out that Oda used to be pretty good at this. Oldschool nami was fun, and Robin has always been great.
Nami and Robin used to be some of my favorite characters. Notice the words used to be. :sad:
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what's wrong with the female powerhouse that is boa hancock?
she is yet to lose in a fight,humiliated a VA and finished the marineford war without a scratch.
ok,she is annoyingly in love with luffy but that doesn't make her less powerful,nor less confident,it's just part of her strange personality,much like barto is a luffy fanboy or cavendish is an attention whorehigher than her with only the top,yonkous,some of the shichibukai probably and the admirals
I do like Hancock, but she makes one. Big Mum makes two. And they are hardly main characters. The main hope is for a physically strong female character who will join the Strawhats. Even just a character of passing strength to match those just below the M3. I get that it's a shounen manga and a gender disparity is inevitable, but the disparity in One Piece is massive, and it's a flaw in what is otherwise a great manga, so it bugs me a lot more than it would in a lesser manga.
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Oda did it again! Even a common storytelling device like personality split was brought up to the unexpected character, with a possible foreshadowing :ninja:
!
Hakuba's face also reminds me of Night Baron from Detective Conan, this manga is inspired by Sherlock Holmes and has many shout outs to London. A detective there's also named Hakuba.!
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True, but doesnt that still constitute the act of underestimating? By failing to predict the outcome, haveing estimated below what could be accomplished and could be accomplished? Most of what you described denotes 'underestimation'
there's understimation and there's not having a crystal ball to predict the future (actually,he kinda had one but she betrayed him)
much like crocodile couldn't had predict mr 3 surviving a bananawani with a dela ball,that same bananawani eating the false key thus making itself recognizable by smoker and then mr 3 helping sanji opening and indestructible karouseki cage croco still had the key to.
at the same time predicting the dwarfs being able to make a tunnel directly to the underground port,befriend the strawhats giving them all kinds of informations,bellamy escaping dellinger thanks to barto intervention (eve bellamy said he actually had no good reason to save him) and then helping luffy finding the exit of the colosseum,while the revolutionaries come in town,one of them being the almost-brother of luffy that everybody thought was dead years ago and switching places with luffy so that every kind of surveillance on him at the colosseum is now useless.predict all that was impossible.
and even with all these things "not going accordingly with the plan",doflamingo is probably still in a position of advantage,and still has all his assets in the right place,near each other and movable between the various "fronts" without much effort.
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Since Burgess said the finals then it will probably be one match to determine who fights Diamente. A 4 person battle royale. This can also leave ambiguity on who would actually win in a one on one battle between the remaining contestants especially if people team up. Rebecca can't win(unless she is the last one standing because everyone else took each other out)…she can't beat Diamente in a fight especially if Diamente beat Kyros. Bartolomeo may make a sacrifice in the match against Burgess knowing that Luffy wants Sabo to have the Mera Mera no Mi.
By the way, how did Diamente become champion anyways? Wouldn't he have had to beat the previous champion first which was Kyros, right? Thunder Soldier who is Kyros(probably) taught Rebecca enough to be able to dodge Hakuba's attack. Is Rebecca even stronger than Kyros in his Thunder Soldier toy form? I'm wondering if Diamente is actually stronger than Kyros or that Diamente cheated in some way for the victory. Maybe Doflamingo made a deal with Kyros to protect Rebecca. Cost him his leg to make sure that the deal was legit.
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True, but doesnt that still constitute the act of underestimating? By failing to predict the outcome, haveing estimated below what could be accomplished and could be accomplished? Most of what you described denotes 'underestimation'
Nope. He's countered all the strawhats, already taken out one of he absolute strongest members (Law), had no trouble beating one of their top 3 (Sanji… who he knows is no longer on the island anyway) defended his priorities with his strongest minions, guarded all the weak points on his base, knows more or less where everyone is, and all his plans are working. He thinks.
That there are crazy X factors that he doesn't even know exist aren't underestimating. If he knew about the secret tunnels, he clearly would have those covered as well. If he knew about Luffy switching places, he'd cover that. If he knew about two of his loyal minions betraying him... well, he'd probably kill them. But when Violet has been loyal to him for a decade, how could he imagine she'd fall for Sanji in about 8 seconds... or that Bellamy would betray him at this point after how SUPER loyal he's been? And how could ANYONE suspect there'd be another Luffy strength level fighter ready to switch places with him on the island? Even Luffy didn't know Sabo was alive.
He's not in any way underestimating them. He's covered every single thing he knows about and taken precautions.
I'm thinking that might have been done just for convenience.
There's no point in Oda making Dofla single Kin'emon out when Kin is clearly helping the SH.
Right. I'm not saying it means anything. And there's still a TON against Kinemon. I'm just saying, in Oda terms, phrasing it that way can be a subtle starting setup.
He could have said "Zoro, Robin, Sogeking, and that samurai they're traveling with." Instead, he included him first in the group, by name and moniker, completely associated as a Strawhat piece and a known quantity. I have zero conviction about Kinemon joining in the long runand currently don't see any reason for him to do so… but if in two years and two arcs from now he does... this is the exact moment I point to as Oda starting to set that up. Oda chose to phrase it that way, not Doflamingo.
Again, its an Oda thing, not anything to do with Kinemon himself.
