Poor Brook… :I
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Tony Tony Chopper vs. Sanji
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Sanji used to be my favorite Straw Hat. Chopper? Eh, middle of the pack. Nowhere near the top.
Chopper, IMO, was the most improved character since the timeskip. He's dialed back a bit but his growth in Fishman Island was the best (only) thing about that arc.
Sanji on the other hand has fallen on his face. No sign at all of the great Mr. Prince or Hunter, but now he's a love drunk pervert who doesn't even use cook metaphors as often as he should. All of his suave badassery has been drained away in favor of obnoxious chivalry and sheer perversion.
I love Chopper because he and I have grown together. Chopper's acceptance of himself came right when I decided to accept myself as well so I feel this love for Chopper that's very tough to explain without getting personal or sappy.
Bottom line is, Chopper is actually my favorite character now and will continue to remain as such. And I will vote for him unconditionally.
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[[Concerto di Ali: The Battle of Solocima]](showthread.php?t=33896 "Arlong Park Forums - Thread 33896") - [[Spirit Wolf]](showthread.php?t=33362 "Arlong Park Forums - Thread 33362")
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Chopper, IMO, was the most improved character since the timeskip. He's dialed back a bit but his growth in Fishman Island was the best (only) thing about that arc.
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Brook!!
Why does everyone forget Brook's awesome moment haha
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You just shot an arrow through Brook's heart.
Ah, but he doesn't have a heart!
recalls scene as SHs descended to Fishman Island where Chopper stole Brook's punchline
Haha, yeah, Brook's actually been very decent indeed, and so has Franky with his new level-headed style.
It's just that I don't really want to count either of those things as character development because they've both more or less been like that before (or at least they should have been), they just didn't get almost any screen time prior to the timeskip. Franky was with the crew at TB, but he didn't really do all that much, and the only real showing Brook ever had was, well, the short period of time he spent with the crew from the end of TB to when Kuma scattered them all; neither one really had the chance to be themselves as a part of the crew.
They both more or less had an established personality before the timeskip, and the only thing the timeskip did to them was providing both with a chance to hone their skills and to start thinking of themselves as a part of the crew more than before (as 1 > 0) - something that I think we should come to expect from any crewmate of any crew from the moment of their joining. That's why I don't want to think of them as having been developed. They might be more well-rounded right now, but they've only really reached a level they should have been on earlier but that they simply didn't have the opportunity to display.
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sob
did you READ Fishman Island?
did you???
cries self to sleep
Oh my! You're trying, you're trying so hard, and yet you can't get me to care.
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Brook did have an awesome moment… right after Chopper's several.
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Vote for Chopper -
I guess I'll be voting for-
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Vote for a pirate with class.
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When was the last time you saw a pirate in a suit? :ninja:
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Vote for Chopper!
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Oh my! You're trying, you're trying so hard, and yet you can't get me to care.
I'm not 100% sure what you're saying but
A One Piece reader who doesn't care about what happened on FI.
That's something impressive.
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I liked Sanji until Enies Lobby, then the fact that he was pretty much willing to let Robin die because he didn't want to fight Califa just made me hate him.
Chopper has been likeable for the entire series, even if he was screwed over in favour of Law in Punk Hazard
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I'm not 100% sure what you're saying but
A One Piece reader who doesn't care about what happened on FI.
That's something impressive.
I just can't shake off that feeling that your posts hold some hidden hostility. Might just be my imagination though… anyway, point is that Sanji's nosebleed gag wasn't as horrible as many make it out to be.
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Sanji genuinely has the worst life in One Piece
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I just can't shake off that feeling that your posts hold some hidden hostility. Might just be my imagination though… anyway, point is that Sanji's nosebleed gag wasn't as horrible as many make it out to be.
There was that thing you know where it somehow bridged the gap between gag and serious plot element in a totally ridiculous way.
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Putting all other problems about current sanji aside, i don't see what's wrong with gags being used as plot devices, I don't remember so much fuss about happening the same to zoro's orientation and sanji's bounty poster. it seems to me it's only a problem if you don't find the gag to be funny.
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Chopper it is. His flashback made my eyes burst its sweat.
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Putting all other problems about current sanji aside, i don't see what's wrong with gags being used as plot devices, I don't remember so much fuss about happening the same to zoro's orientation and sanji's bounty poster. it seems to me it's only a problem if you don't find the gag to be funny.
It's one thing to use realistic and believable gags as plot devices (even though that's still something that can be debated; I personally would stand on the side that finds it contrived and, in most cases, downright bad) but quite the other to use something that is both distasteful to many and utterly unrealistic in every sense of the word.
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Putting all other problems about current sanji aside, i don't see what's wrong with gags being used as plot devices, I don't remember so much fuss about happening the same to zoro's orientation and sanji's bounty poster. it seems to me it's only a problem if you don't find the gag to be funny.
But the blood thing was a problem because of the "we can't give blood to humans" which was part of THE central theme of the arc.
And Duval's anger doesn't really constitute a serious plot element.
And I fail to remember when Zoro's poor sense of direction was actually anything more than a gag.
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@Lef:
I guess I'll be voting for-
http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2010/289/3/a/sanji__s_eyebrows_by_cosmojames-d30wtfg.jpg
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Chopper hasn't really been great since he first appeared all those years ago and really showed off his transformations and his initial backstory.
On the other hand Sanji's "I won't fight women" thing went to an extremely bad place when it threatened Robin's life… his "I will take wounds to keep Nami's dress from being stained" was more annoying than "cool", and the nosebleed gag and hating of trannies since the timeskip has been actively annoying and detrimental to his once great character and he really hasn't done anything yet to make up for that crap.
So... Chopper who hasn't been good in a while... or Sanji who has been actively annoying.
Chopper it is.
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There was that thing you know where it somehow bridged the gap between gag and serious plot element in a totally ridiculous way.
The gag managed to lead into the plot, and also fit it. Racism was a big deal in the FI arc and Sanji's gag more or less leading into the main problem wasn't bad. The nosebleed thing fulfilled both its roles as a gag and a plot device and would've been really annoying had it not led to the latter.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
@RobbyBevard:
Chopper hasn't really been great since he first appeared all those years ago… on the other hand Sanji's nosebleed gag and hating of trannies has been actively annoying and detrimental to his once great character and he really hasn't done anything yet to make up for that crap.
Chopper it is.
You can hardly expect him to love them after those two years, now can you?
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But the blood thing was a problem because of the "we can't give blood to humans" which was part of THE central theme of the arc.
So? Oda simply used the gag as an excuse to explain the deal with the blood and move luffy & co to another place, and solved the issue with another gag. it's not like the nosebleed had lead to a jinbe path toward the sun moment.
And Duval's anger doesn't really constitute a serious plot element.
Everything from the strawhats finding camie to them reaching sabaody is caused by sanji's bounty poster.
And I fail to remember when Zoro's poor sense of direction was actually anything more than a gag.
It's used to put Zoro wherever oda needs him to be, see albarna for example, minor I know.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
It's one thing to use realistic and believable gags as plot devices (even though that's still something that can be debated; I personally would stand on the side that finds it contrived and, in most cases, downright bad) but quite the other to use something that is both distasteful to many and utterly unrealistic in every sense of the word.
If you find the gag to be "distasteful to many and utterly unrealistic in every sense of the word" that just means you didn't like it for those reasons.
The problem is with the gag itself, not whether it served as a plot device.Anyways still undecided about who to vote but I'm liking most of choppers campaigns
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[hide]
Who says Chopper is just a reindeer?
Why, the whole animal kingdom is his domain!
VOTE FOR CHOPPER!
[/hide]
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"Being in the lead doesn't make me happy, idiots."~~
Vote for Chopper
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no comment~
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So? Oda simply used the gag as an excuse to explain the deal with the blood and move luffy & co to another place, and solved the issue with another gag. it's not like the nosebleed had lead to a jinbe path toward the sun moment.
Yeah this is the thing. A large part of the power of Jinbe's moment is derived from the reluctance of others to give blood, and especially the contrast to the previous time we'd had this problem.
And in turn that power leeches away because of the ridiculousness of how it occurred in the first place.
Everything from the strawhats finding camie to them reaching sabaody is caused by sanji's bounty poster.
Well … basically, it's down to Duval. And Duval is like ... a gag character, really. It's minor. And Duval doesn't feel significant as a result.
It's used to put Zoro wherever oda needs him to be, see albarna for example, minor I know.
But this is the thing. For me, it was terrible how Sanji's gag evolved into something of genuinely major importance. And just because it was resolved as a crisis individually, it doesn't mean it's less important. It was still core to this theme of racism via blood, which was opened with Sanji's crisis, carried through by the flashback and concluded with Jinbe.
Like, for example, Bellamy was resolved there and then on Jaya, but the significance of the whole sequence - the theme of dreams and conviction - came back in Skypiea and was a part of the power of the ringing of the Bell.
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People saying that Sanji needs to redeem himself…
:ninja: -
Easy vote for Sanji, Chopper has been kinda lame for quite a while now.
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Luffy, Zoro, Sanji = Monster Trio
But Luffy, Usopp, Chopper = Reaction Trio
VOTE FOR CHOPPER!
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A Vote for Chopper is a vote for doctors!
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vs!
:ninja: -
Yeah this is the thing. A large part of the power of Jinbe's moment is derived from the reluctance of others to give blood, and especially the contrast to the previous time we'd had this problem.
And in turn that power leeches away because of the ridiculousness of how it occurred in the first place.
But this is the thing. For me, it was terrible how Sanji's gag evolved into something of genuinely major importance. And just because it was resolved as a crisis individually, it doesn't mean it's less important. It was still core to this theme of racism via blood, which was opened with Sanji's crisis, carried through by the flashback and concluded with Jinbe.
The problem is when thinking of previous times the problem has happened you shouldn't be thinking of sanji but of hody's gang KKK moments, Sanji's part is just very minor and not really a part of the core but a hint towards it, you're focusing too much on it, giving it way more importance than it holds.
The intention of the scene is not for you to feel sad about sanji but to think 2this donation of blood thing is going to be quite important on this arc"
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The problem is when thinking of previous times the problem has happened you shouldn't be thinking of sanji but of hody's gang KKK moments, Sanji's part is just very minor and not really a part of the core but a hint towards it, you're focusing too much on it, giving it way more importance than it holds.
The intention of the scene is not for you to feel sad about sanji but to think 2this donation of blood thing is going to be quite important on this arc"
Yeah I get that. In that moment, when it's happening, it's a set-up and a gag.
But irrespective of your feelings about it as a gag …
Most arcs have those climactic moments which are really built upon all this stuff in the arc. And maybe I'm being too harsh by considering this (that's the impression I get from this discussion), but when Jinbe has his moment, I feel like that could have been a stronger moment, and that it suffers by having a 'light-hearted' contrast.
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
A Vote for Chopper is a vote for doctors!
http://24.media.tumblr.com/d4ae7c9e2e2d2b49837ef781d76efa89/tumblr_mnxt5nohKn1stl95oo1_500.jpg
Ahahahaha, this is great.
I was trying to read the DF poster adn because of the Pacifista next to it, I was reading it as "A Kuma … " something and was like WHAT DOES IT SAYYY hahaha
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Just think, how many times did Chopper save the crew and how many times did Sanji/Mr.Prince save the crew.
Convinces the main bad guy that the crew is dead, gets said bad guy to start trying to kill his own henchmen, and then finds an eternal log that saves the crew from its horrible fate of waiting 1 year for their log to set. This guy is just the cook?
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I have to leave soon so I will leave you with this.
The truely amazing, loyal friend and doctor: Tony Tony Chopper
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This post is deleted!
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Just think, how many times did Chopper save the crew and how many times did Sanji/Mr.Prince save the crew.
Convinces the main bad guy that the crew is dead, gets said bad guy to start trying to kill his own henchmen, and then finds an eternal log that saves the crew from its horrible fate of waiting 1 year for their log to set. This guy is just the cook?
wow. do you even realize that if it weren't for Chopper and Kureha, Sanji wouldn't have been there to do those things because Nami would have died and they'd never have reached Alabasta? They're completely fucked without a navigator. Chopper is their doctor, and even though he's a bit of a spazz, he does his job. He's helped save Nami, and he saved Zoro. He's always treating people's wounds. Mocha too. He has overcome his self-doubt and loathing about being a monster, all to help Luffy become the Pirate King. He fought against three Priests in Skypiea and lived to tell the tale. He has destructive power that he's learned to control, is cute and gullible, but knows how to kick ass. Oh and he sort of saved Nami from getting crushed by rubble, as well as Paulie and Iceburg from a burning building. so you can take that attitude and shove it up your ass because Sanji's not the only one who's proven his courage and audacity.
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I'm stil undecided so just gonna take advantage of that.
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vs! 
I want to believe too big guy3ds code friend:0404-6254-1866new "new"3ds code friend:0791-4253-7110 (monster hunter)
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Never before have I seen so many blocks of text in just a few hours of match-time :blink:
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Really?
I thought Chopper and you would be on the same wavelength.! http://www.davidslife.com/anime/reviews/images/op_86_1.jpg
I wanted to give campaigners a little time but oh well Chopper the doctor it his.
and i was having fun posting crossovers -
Have to agree with akagami7 on most of his points. The nosebleed as a plot device never annoyed me. In fact, it made me more appreciative of the gag since it had some significance. What annoyed me was how much Oda was overusing the joke at that point in the story (and admittedly the anime exacerbated it).
There's that and Sanji's view of chivalry. Not hitting women just because they're women may not be something I agree with, but I completely respect it as a character trait. What's annoying is when it causes Sanji to leave Robin in danger or when he basically lets himself get beaten up (see Violet).
On the whole, he has gotten better over the past 2 arcs. But he needs to get better-er. Just my opinion.
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Yeah, Sanji is a role model gone wrong. Unlike Chopper!
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Chopper for many, many reasons.
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Chopper doesn't get enough love. While I think about it, Sanji gets too much hate, too - but at least he gets reactions. Chopper, it seems, gets none whatsoever from most people (at least that's what it seems like), so I'm supporting him.
(And yes, I like Sanji a lot, and I don't even mind his nosebleed-jokes - I find them funny, even now.)
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Chopper this and Chopper that but …
All things considered, Sanji is one of the characters (along with Usopp) that got me to stick with this series in the first place.
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Sticking with Sanji.
