Well if all that is true, then he has nothing to worry about. I wasn't trying to personally attack you Chrissie - that's the last thing I would do or want to do. I was trying to keep it generalized, but may have failed - I'm sorry you felt that way. I just think that when it comes to religion and mixing differing opinions on that in a relationship can be risky, and we were just having a half-ass discussion on it. Don't take it personally - and absolutely, I don't know your situation, and will refrain from commenting on it further. I think as a whole we should probably try and deter from the religion topic other than being mentioned in passing if necessary here.
Relationships?
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I'm glad America is finally murdering the social-right wing, but sometimes I don't think we're aware of the damage the fight against the beast has done to our ability to actually discuss religion and be mature about it.
It's a gigantic world, and it does not all look like Pat Robertson. -
I personally found that the discussion was very general. Even when people were offering MK (or me) advice, they mostly referred to Cymelion's experience when they were talking about a specific section of religious people who would use emotional pressure and manipulation in their effort to convert, or exclude. No one implied that Chrissie was part of a cult, at least in my understanding, nor were they suggesting that she would use these means to either convert MK, or leave him. Cymelion was like, 'this is what happened to me'. And remember, this whole thing started because MK (and me, again) wanted to learn from Cymelion's experience, just to see if his (or mine) was anything like that.
I understand that people are proud of their origins and culture, but this is not a witch-hunt here.
Lastly, I don't think all discussion should stop only because someone got offended about something that was not directed at them. -
@cooldud_21:
I personally found that the discussion was very general. Even when people were offering MK (or me) advice, they mostly referred to Cymelion's experience when they were talking about a specific section of religious people who would use emotional pressure and manipulation in their effort to convert, or exclude. No one implied that Chrissie was part of a cult, at least in my understanding, nor were they suggesting that she would use these means to either convert MK, or leave him. Cymelion was like, 'this is what happened to me'. And remember, this whole thing started because MK (and me, again) wanted to learn from Cymelion's experience, just to see if his (or mine) was anything like that.
I understand that people are proud of their origins and culture, but this is not a witch-hunt here.
Lastly, I don't think all discussion should stop only because someone got offended about something that was not directed at them.No she's on to something I think, though I don't blame anyone here, because I know where everyone's coming from.
America and (Australia?)'s incredibly difficuilt relationship with religion kind of discolors it's ability to talk about it sometimes. It can't be a general discussion from specific examples, what I wanted to hear was Cymelion's personal experience because of how it contrasted with mine. I wanted to see all the contrasts.
Selfish maybe, but it's nice to hear.Europe and Cyprus's relationship with religion (excepting probably parts of the deep Soviet bloc and Muslim areas) are very very different.
What Chrissie reacted to wasn't a personal experience, it was the sort of taken for granted extension of those experiences as "the way it is" regarding religion. Which isn't the way it is.I dunno how it seems to a Hindu (?) walking through this odd Abrahamic/Secular civil war zone, but you have to realize how insanely socially complex it all is even just in modern western Christian countries.
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@Monkey:
I'm glad America is finally murdering the social-right wing, but sometimes I don't think we're aware of the damage the fight against the beast has done to our ability to actually discuss religion and be mature about it.
It's a gigantic world, and it does not all look like Pat Robertson.Religion has very different connotations depending on where you are. At least in America, it was largely co-opted by the right-wingers you speak of, and it has become irrevocably intertwined with the evils perpetrated by the South. While it's understandable why those connotations exist, I think people started to forget that religion could come away from its long history with a deeper understanding, and grow.
Or maybe it was just science.
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@Monkey:
What Chrissie reacted to wasn't a personal experience, it was the sort of taken for granted extension of those experiences as "the way it is" regarding religion. Which isn't the way it is.
With all due respect, that was her perception. I've been brought up in a fairly religious household, so I've observed from pretty close quarters the good and the bad of religion. I personally came to the conclusion that organized religion is something we could do without, but I also recognize and respect the opinion of people (my parents, for instance) who do not feel so.
I followed most of this discussion pretty closely, and if there was an undercurrent of "religious people are dicks", I didn't see it. Yes, people might have said something to the tune of some religious people might be dicks, but then so are some (most?) openly atheistic people. -
@cooldud_21:
With all due respect, that was her perception. I've been brought up in a fairly religious household,
So was she, see that's what I'm not sure that you're even getting. How even just the term "religious" has a thousand complex different social definitions in common use. It does not mean just one thing even depending on who says it. So much of this is unspoken second hand cultural knowledge you get from just growing up in the States it's a bit hard to explain here.
I followed most of this discussion pretty closely, and if there was an undercurrent of "religious people are dicks", I didn't see it. Yes, people might have said something to the tune of some religious people might be dicks, but then so are some (most?) openly atheistic people.
Religious people are kooky and live in tight knit communities that judge Others.
That undercurrent was here, that's a huge undercurrent in the US and Cymelion being from Australia does not change much. That IS the Bible Belt concept. -
@Monkey:
So was she, see that's what I'm not sure that you're even getting.
I never for a moment implied that she was not. Maybe I should have written "I was brought up in a fairly religious household too".
Religious people are kooky and live in tight knit communities that judge Others.
Again, that is her (or your) perception, not the general one. My perception was:
Religious people could be kooky and live in tight knit communities that judge Others.
That IS the Bible Belt concept.
I live in the Bible belt now. Just FYI.
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@cooldud_21:
I live in the Bible belt now. Just FYI.
1. You aren't from the country though, you weren't raised here. That makes a tremendous difference.
2. You are in Atlanta lol, pretty sure that doesn't count. Even I, who went to school in Savannah for FIVE years wouldn't call myself experienced in living in the Bible Belt. -
@Monkey:
1. You aren't from the country though, you weren't raised here. That makes a tremendous difference.
2. You are in Atlanta lol, pretty sure that doesn't count. Even I, who went to school in Savannah for FIVE years wouldn't call myself experienced in living in the Bible Belt.Point taken and point taken. But you see, my difference from the locals is apparent in the colour of my skin. So I do get to see teensy glimpses of the exact exclusionary culture that you said characterizes this area.
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@cooldud_21:
I personally found that the discussion was very general. Even when people were offering MK (or me) advice, they mostly referred to Cymelion's experience when they were talking about a specific section of religious people who would use emotional pressure and manipulation in their effort to convert, or exclude. No one implied that Chrissie was part of a cult, at least in my understanding, nor were they suggesting that she would use these means to either convert MK, or leave him. Cymelion was like, 'this is what happened to me'. And remember, this whole thing started because MK (and me, again) wanted to learn from Cymelion's experience, just to see if his (or mine) was anything like that.
I understand that people are proud of their origins and culture, but this is not a witch-hunt here.
Lastly, I don't think all discussion should stop only because someone got offended about something that was not directed at them.I saw a part directed at Zephos, my other half, to beware of my family's and friends' intervention in our relationship because of his religion or lack thereof. I will clear this up now for you hun:
It's not about my religion. It's about my relationship not being affected by my religion or by my family's religion or whatever. What I was trying to make clear is this: Nobody has a say in my relationship with Zephos about anything. Only the two of us. A relationship is a matter of trust, love and respect between two people. Not two people and their entire family and friends. I came out strong perhaps on the religion part and sorry for that, because that's what it was circling around. If I developed it a bit more, it's only because I have the habit of expanding my points in detail and have had that bad habit since University. Drove my professors crazy. But my main point was and will always be what I just said. No one else but the two of us will have a say in our life be it about religion, the name of our kids, the dinner we are having, how we are spending our nights or what kind of pet we are getting. And that it's how it's supposed to be. -
I saw a part directed at Zephos, my other half, to beware of my family's and friends' intervention in our relationship because of his religion or lack thereof. I will clear this up now for you hun:
It's not about my religion. It's about my relationship not being affected by my religion or by my family's religion or whatever. What I was trying to make clear is this: Nobody has a say in my relationship with Zephos about anything. Only the two of us. A relationship is a matter of trust, love and respect between two people. Not two people and their entire family and friends. I came out strong perhaps on the religion part and sorry for that, because that's what it was circling around. If I developed it a bit more, it's only because I have the habit of expanding my points in detail and have had that bad habit since University. Drove my professors crazy. But my main point was and will always be what I just said. No one else but the two of us will have a say in our life be it about religion, the name of our kids, the dinner we are having, how we are spending our nights or what kind of pet we are getting. And that it's how it's supposed to be.See Chrissie, I totally understand your position. And please, don't for a moment assume that I meant anything to the contrary. What you do need to understand is the following: MK asked Cymelion to share his story because he saw some similarities in it. And Cymelion did. That's pretty much it. People said that there are some warning signs that MK may need to watch out for. Not that they are bound to come up. It's more like an 'if-then' statement. If A happens then B might follow. No one is implying (at least in my understanding) that A will happen in your case.
As for your point that a relationship is between two people, not their family and friends; that is true. However, a marriage, and the rest of your lives will involve both your families and friends. If they're all comfortable with each other's opinions, then your life as a couple will be smoother (please note that I'm not saying anything on the converse). Having a strong support system always helps. You'd be surprised to know how many couples fall apart each year because their respective support systems don't get along at all. Again, not implying at all that you need to be worried about these things or anything like that, really.
But yeah, at the core of any relationship is the two people in it and their love for each other. And if that is strong, nothing else matters. -
Oh God. The most amazing thing just happened. One of my fave websites, just posted this picture: http://pusheen.com/post/40951713889
Now see here: Zeph calls me cat for some reason and to retaliate I call him bear. And we are meeting in Spring. I am pretty sure I have already said out loud how I wish I could fall asleep and get up in Spring… This is beyond awesome!
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Ugh religion discussion. Just fucking kll me now
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no you're all dead
im the only one alive
it's reverse sixth sense
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I am coming out of a very long term relationship right now. We were together nearly seven and a half years. From April of 05 to November 12' (we actually seperated in October but it wasn't official until November). Its been the hardest experience of my life moving on from it. Its why i havent been on these boards much lately. Idk. No matter what happens in the future she will always be one of my greatest loves and i really have nothing in my heart for her but love. I miss her everyday. Even though i was the one that ended it. Emotionally, i have become a much more fragile man. Christmas morning was much harder then i imagined, i cried so much when i opened her letter. And every day, at least once, there will be a moment that will bring me nearly to tears - because something will remind me of her. At first I thought it was just the shock of us seperating but now i am starting to feel this new awarness of my emotions is a permanen scar destined to cling to me forever.
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I thought this thread is about relationships. Why is everyone talking about religion?
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@Foxy:
I thought this thread is about relationships. Why is everyone talking about religion?
Because someone in the thread went through a divorce when their partner (of a different religious persuasion) did not see eye to eye with them over raising kids. And someone else was interested in that story. And because people get digressed very easily. Especially when it's about politics or religion.
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Because the topic of religion ties into the discussion about relationships as in many cases religious views become a factor that needs to be taken into account and explicitly addressed. Not to mention the fact that many of the participants here have had experiences whereby religion has played a big role in their relationships.
Your attempts at being witty have been shut down, good man. Please try again elsewhere.
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Because the topic of religion ties into the discussion about relationships as in many cases religious views become a factor that needs to be taken into account and explicitly addressed. Not to mention the fact that many of the participants here have had experiences whereby religion has played a big role in their relationships.
Your attempts at being witty have been shut down, good man. Please try again elsewhere.
I wasn't trying to be witty, though…
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I haven't been in one, and I never will seeing as I'm aromantic.
I'm not sure what I would do if someone liked me and wanted to be in a relationship. I'd feel bad for turning them down.
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i was online dating someone, but i moved and now we're dating for realsies
he's basically amazing<3
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I am a 23 years old gay man. Came out to everyone that matters so i'm pretty good on that front. Had only 1 real relationship which lasted for like 2 months, but it was one of the happiest moment in my entire unworthy 23 years of life.
Now, i don't know. it's harder to find real love mate in homosexual world, i guess. those boys are scary as hell~
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Because the topic of religion ties into the discussion about relationships as in many cases religious views become a factor that needs to be taken into account and explicitly addressed. Not to mention the fact that many of the participants here have had experiences whereby religion has played a big role in their relationships.
Your attempts at being witty have been shut down, good man. Please try again elsewhere.
Yeppers - I read the thread and after Chrissy's responses I decided not to continue the subject or my part in it. Mainly because there were no direct questions related to my situation or experience, so no real reason to get into a debate over the issue.
Religion is a touchy subject on its own bringing relationships into it can make it nuclear. -
Fuck I'm lonely.
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Fuck I'm lonely.
/signed
I think I'll stay single for the rest of my life. Safer for every party involved.
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Fuck I'm lonely.
/signed
I think I'll stay single for the rest of my life. Safer for every party involved.
It's not all bad - 7 billion people in the world - that means if my maths when tired as hell is right there are 7000 people who are 1 in a million - 7 million 1 in a thousand people, thats not bad odds.
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I am coming out of a very long term relationship right now. We were together nearly seven and a half years. From April of 05 to November 12' (we actually seperated in October but it wasn't official until November). Its been the hardest experience of my life moving on from it. Its why i havent been on these boards much lately. Idk. No matter what happens in the future she will always be one of my greatest loves and i really have nothing in my heart for her but love. I miss her everyday. Even though i was the one that ended it. Emotionally, i have become a much more fragile man. Christmas morning was much harder then i imagined, i cried so much when i opened her letter. And every day, at least once, there will be a moment that will bring me nearly to tears - because something will remind me of her. At first I thought it was just the shock of us seperating but now i am starting to feel this new awarness of my emotions is a permanen scar destined to cling to me forever.
Why did you end it, then?
It seems like you didn't really wanted it to end and you sound like you'd take it back the minute you felt like you could.
There must've been some other reason? -
i was online dating someone, but i moved and now we're dating for realsies
he's basically amazing<3
He's the worst human being known to men though
He's even
! Diet Dr Pepper
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I keep spotting these perfect opportunities for asking my crush out, but don't seize them. I like to believe that I'm finally somewhat confident about myself and yet I'm still afraid of rejection. Even more so since we're in the same school and thus I see him around a lot and would constantly be reminded of it. Yeah, it wouldn't be the first time and I'd eventually get over of being turned down, but knowing these things fails to make the thought more bearable. Argh! I feel like a creepy love-sick teenager!
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Those fears always take some time to get over, but it's nothing weird to ask somebody out, and the worst that could happen is a no.
And of course, after that you'll see him in school a lot, but it's not like he's gonna look down on you for having a natural feelig that everybody has.
What COULD happen is him getting awkward around you, but that's the worst case scenario and also something that can be worked around. -
I keep spotting these perfect opportunities for asking my crush out, but don't seize them. I like to believe that I'm finally somewhat confident about myself and yet I'm still afraid of rejection. Even more so since we're in the same school and thus I see him around a lot and would constantly be reminded of it. Yeah, it wouldn't be the first time and I'd eventually get over of being turned down, but knowing these things fails to make the thought more bearable. Argh! I feel like a creepy love-sick teenager!
Just come right out and tell them. I know its hard, believe me, I know. But the sooner you say it, the sooner you can either get things going, or moving on. Dwelling on what-ifs forever with someone only screws you up inside and makes it harder in the long run. If they go with someone else, then you just end up asking yourself "Why not me?" or "what if I had done this..?" and that's even worse.
Just compliment them and tell them you like them, gauge their reaction and go from there.
Valentines day is right around the corner, abuse that as an opportunity to say something without having to be fully committed if you need to. Use the awful commercial holiday to your advantage!
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i was online dating someone, but i moved and now we're dating for realsies
he's basically amazing<3
So that's actually working out for real huh? Awesome! You two are going to have twisted fucking kids lol.
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you don't have to be.
You know what, you're right.
And that's why I'm going to Riverside this weekend for the UQ conference.
I'm gonna crash with some cute queers and just take a load off. -
Why did you end it, then?
It seems like you didn't really wanted it to end and you sound like you'd take it back the minute you felt like you could.
There must've been some other reason?And here, boys and girls, is the part of the story where I look like the asshole. Because I am. I am not the sympathetic character in my story. My beautiful ex is.
I fell for someone else.
Now, hear me out. I didn't leave my girlfriend for someone else. In am not with the girl that I fell for (though our relationship is a whole other can of worms.) But liking someone new, just the experience of those feelings scared the shit out of me. I am 23, and I had been with my girlfriend since I was 15. Thats a long time to not experience feeling for anyone new. So when it happened - idk - it was hard. You don't leave someone you love for something like that. And I didn't. But it sure added to the pile. When your with someone as long as we were together I guess it's easy to get complacent. I definitely could have been a better boyfriend at times. But honestly, there are so many reasons why I decided to end it I wouldn't even know where to begin.
You're wrong about me wanting her back. I mean, of course there is a part of me that wants her still. It will always be there. And I will always love her deeply. She actually wants us to still be together, but if I give into that I feel like I would have just put her and myself through so much heartache for nothing. Because I haven't really grown or changed yet and we would end up in the same place just a little down the road. We may end up together still. I don't claim to know the future. And at our best we are pretty amazing together. But who she is today, and who I am right now - it can't and shouldn't happen.
! one of our earlier pictures. 05'ish
! Our 7 year annaversary. April 12'
='/
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@The:
He's the worst human being known to men though
He's even
! Diet Dr Pepper
@Monkey:
So that's actually working out for real huh? Awesome! You two are going to have twisted fucking kids lol.
Ha ha yea. :) We've had two really great dates so far, and we're planning more (since there's an hour or two drive between us). he's really sweet and funny and
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You know what, you're right.
And that's why I'm going to Riverside this weekend for the UQ conference.
I'm gonna crash with some cute queers and just take a load off.sounds like a plan crystal.
Get crunk and slutty ;)
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I keep spotting these perfect opportunities for asking my crush out, but don't seize them. I like to believe that I'm finally somewhat confident about myself and yet I'm still afraid of rejection. Even more so since we're in the same school and thus I see him around a lot and would constantly be reminded of it. Yeah, it wouldn't be the first time and I'd eventually get over of being turned down, but knowing these things fails to make the thought more bearable. Argh! I feel like a creepy love-sick teenager!
I'd say go for it! What Robby said is good. I've always been afraid to be so forward >___< I feel like a love-sick teenager because I've never had any kind of romantic relationship… and I'm so afraid of that showing, even though I try to take enough care to not come off that way.
Right now I just don't want to think about jack shit. I'm not going out or being anywhere to meet anyone so I wish I could just turn it all off and relax.
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Those fears always take some time to get over, but it's nothing weird to ask somebody out, and the worst that could happen is a no.
And of course, after that you'll see him in school a lot, but it's not like he's gonna look down on you for having a natural feelig that everybody has.
What COULD happen is him getting awkward around you, but that's the worst case scenario and also something that can be worked around.Maybe I'm just being ignorant or the fact that I don't go out much is starting to show, but… It kinda is weird to ask someone out here. Especially if the girl does the asking. Or at least it feels like that to me. The couples I know mostly did their asking-out-routine in their teenage years and have been together since. There's a surprisingly small amount of single people in my class. I actually have no idea if the guy I like has a girlfriend already, nobody I've asked doesn't know. THAT would be awkward.
I do believe that he's a decent enough human being to not treat me any differently even if that was the case, however. And if all goes to shit, he specializes in cinematography and I in editing, which would make it easy for me to avoid him at school.
@RobbyBevard:
Just come right out and tell them. I know its hard, believe me, I know. But the sooner you say it, the sooner you can either get things going, or moving on. Dwelling on what-ifs forever with someone only screws you up inside and makes it harder in the long run. If they go with someone else, then you just end up asking yourself "Why not me?" or "what if I had done this..?" and that's even worse.
Just compliment them and tell them you like them, gauge their reaction and go from there.
Valentines day is right around the corner, abuse that as an opportunity to say something without having to be fully committed if you need to. Use the awful commercial holiday to your advantage!
Heh, thanks for the Valentine tip! Trust me, I fully intent to ask him out. I used to be deathly afraid of such things, but after a missed opportunity where I did the "what if…?" thing for three years straight and never made any advances, I decided: fuck it. It's better to know "okay, so this won't work out" than endlessly speculate "I wonder if it could've worked". That kind of thinking eats away at your soul, if I'm allowed to be a bit dramatic.
And I'm not even kidding when I say that the three previous guys I had a crush on started to go out with other girls. Now that sucks. Majorly. And the guy before that said yes when I asked him out, but never followed through. It makes me think that he was just being polite and didn't seriously intend on doing anything with me. That also sucks. I'd rather have someone be honest with me and say I'm not their type or whatever than to give empty promises.
I'd say go for it! What Robby said is good. I've always been afraid to be so forward >___< I feel like a love-sick teenager because I've never had any kind of romantic relationship… and I'm so afraid of that showing, even though I try to take enough care to not come off that way.
Right now I just don't want to think about jack shit. I'm not going out or being anywhere to meet anyone so I wish I could just turn it all off and relax.
Even though I just said I've come to adopt a "fuck it I'm doing this" attitude, deep down, I'm still afraid. So you're not alone! :D For me the fear is still there, but I want to get rid of the gnawing uncertainties face to face so I can immediately see their reaction. I certainly don't help my case by not really going out and having fun that often, but I'm not a complete shut-in either. I try my best to appear approachable. Despite this I've never been personally asked out, so I figured that instead of waiting I might as well take action myself. It's worked for me twice in my life so far and that's already two times more than zero!
Not thinking about jack shit is perfectly fine. You don't have to be with anyone if you feel that's not the best thing for you right now. :) If at all possible, then by all means, relax like a boss! Turn that brain off, be by yourself and love your own company!
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After a lot of careful consideration I have decided to take myself off the market so as to better commit time with my waifu Alice Margatroid
Sorry ladies!!!!!!!!!!!
shoves spoonful of Spaghettios at a hi-res picture on computer monitor
no tears
only virtue
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Oohoohooo i have a date with the girl i like tonight, wish me luck AP.
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16 chars of good luck!
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I'm back from Riverside… I accidentally fell in love...
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I'm back from Riverside… I accidentally fell in love...
Wait…so people can actually "intentionally" fall in love?
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Wait…so people can actually "intentionally" fall in love?
I don't know… But this whole thing is not what I expected at all... At least it's kind of working out. :)
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Well good for you. A little positivity goes a long way (considering how glum your previous post sounded)