Chapter 680: "Captain of the Marine's G-5, Kichiku no Vergo"

[nonectra]

@Cyclone_Baroness:

I thought only CP9 knew all forms of that martial art? I'm sorta hoping Vergo only has a couple aspects mastered. Don't really need a Lucci part 2. I almost feel that Sanji would not learn a slashing move purely out of not having anything to overlap into Zoro's territory.

Personally I'd rank Usopp as being the trickiest since he's not really a up close and personal fighter like Sanji lol.

I also think that this fight will get interrupted since CC is planning on letting in more gas anyways.

Nah, CP9's thing is that they've mastered Rokushiki to ridiculous levels where you have bizarre customized variations on it, like Lucchi doing Rankyaku with his tail and Kaku doing Shigan with his ginormous Giraffe nose. They basically trained and trained and trained in just that. It's never said that nobody else knows all six forms. For Vice-Admirals, I think it's more of a… thing they pick up once they're physically strong enough in certain categories. I kind of doubt Vergo has the ability to do Shigan with that Bamboo Staff thinger, but I could see him having other abilities.

[Aohige_AP]

Seems T's ok. He never said anything yesterday, looks like he was really busy at work.
It's kinda demanding considering those hours are smack middle of his work time, it happens.

[ponx]

I see Oda tries to put Sanji somewhere in betweer Zoro and Ussopp, which is to say in between cool badass and comic relief. And I'm actually fine with that, he has always been my favorite of the bunch. He has his moments of ridicule and badassery, and it's at the point I'm quite comfortable with. I'm even okay with him being dumped in Okama-land, he was, afterall, the only one in the bunch facing his worst nightmare for 2 whole years.

And the whole Sanji-Vergo thing is pretty tricky here, Smoker has marked Vergo as his target and Vergo has just made Tashigi cried, which means he's not going to get away with it. My guess would be the same as with FI, Sanji will probably team up with Smoker and both of them deal with Vergo. That or Sanji takes care of Vergo but before he deals the final blow, Vergo escaped (easy to manage I think, since their fight has a time limit set to it). And just before Vergo manages to get out from Punk Hazzard, Smoker appears and takes care of him

[igetownd]

@nodensuke:

If Oda didn't care how it was spelled in English he wouldn't have gone out of the way to clearly spell it out for us.

Oh did he? Interesting, so by misspelling his characters names, I would be offending the author, who has a very limited sense of English, and who occasionally misspells the English translations of his names, and that would do what exactly? Make more weird-sounding foreign names that are pronounced poorly in Japanese, with the L's and R's interchangeable so that puns and comical references can be made? I should do that more often then!

Besides, most translation readers miss the Japanese puns and references entirely because they don't know what the Japanese meanings are. I'll call Zoro Zolo from now on, because you're so anal about the "official" spelling. Zololololololo.

[SantoryuUser7]

I have to say, I found it SO funny when Zoro, with such a serious face, said that "it couldn't be helped" and that they were too tired to run. Pure. Gold.

@Jabra:

Ehm, what? So far nothing indicates that Vergo is extraordinary strong, seems basic Vice-Admiral level judging from his skills shown so far and that the G5 Marines put him in the same ballpark as Smoker (who got dominated by Law).

He is the perfect opponent for Sanji, finally a moment to measure where he (and indirectly Zoro) stand at the moment. This fight has great potential, I just fear that Oda wastes Sanji to hype up Vergo.

Why do so many people consider Law to have "dominated" that fight? I seem to recall that they were fairly even until Law ended up using his ability to pull earth up between him and Smoker and then when Smoker was left defenseless in that position, Law "pushed" Smoker's heart out from his body from behind the rock, which for some reason weakened Smoker immensely. And to not forgot, Smoker was also at a disadvantage since he couldn't even anticipate Law's attack if he couldn't see what Law was doing from behind the earth. Smoker was caught in a very defenseless position, which does not qualify to me as being "dominated".

[Hisoga]

@nonectra:

You don't really get sexism, huh? Let's put it down like this - yes, One Piece is sexist. When you think about it, it's pretty obvious why. Think of all the higher ranked marines - say Captain-rank and higher? How many are females? Three. How many are guys? Like a billion of them. How about the Warlords? There's six guys to one girl. And the Emperors? And the Supernova? See a trend? There's a lack of female representation in the manga in general and of the character that are most important and powerful in the world, only one or two are female. That's discrimination based on gender at the most basic level in media.

Like CCC said, you can enjoy the manga regardless. Trying to dismiss it is a pretty silly thing to do, though.

actually trying to tied thing only on black and white is stupid too..
its overused to say that "you'll only see want you want to see" but i have to.. why everything must be equal or if not then it is broken?
no black man in the main casts of a movie, its a racist movie..
not enough women in the main casts of a movie, its a racist movie..

i mean if this is more than 30 or 40 years ago, it is pretty much the case but for today, i think it is silly.. our mouth said no to those things but deep down in our heart, they are still exist.. realizing it or not we still hold to that bad memory so tied that we lost and failed to see that the world have change.. good or bad..
some are too sensitive and even if those thing were not the case in some scenario, we still see it like that..

in my faculty, there far more men than women… is my faculty is sexist?
in another some faculty there are more women than men.. they are "sexist"?
another faculty basically have balanced between men and women.. they are perfect?

if everything must be equal between man and woman, this world will be destroyed.. for example must have equal representative even if one of them doesn't suitable for the job or scenario, so even if one doesn't have a qualification but for the sake of "not sexist", one is hired..

please don't just look something on the surface and judge it easily black and white.. sexism is if there is a clearly bias, unfairly treated, injustice another along the line.. if just because numbers doesn't match or asking for help and another HUMANLY behavior, i think it is silly to simply label it as sexism or racism etc..

some people talk about realistic story bla bla bla..
sexist this sexist that bla bla bla..
not enough women in OP..
nami asking luffy for help is sexist..
Strawhats saving Robin is sexist..
tashigi cried and asked for help is sexist..
but did they realized that they disregard and ignoring whatever hard-work and awesome deed that Nami and Robin did just by saying that Nami and Robin is a damsel in distress and that is unfair to those characters..
or Tashigi behavior is a humanly logical and normal.. not because she is woman but because she is human.. isn't that realistic?
Pirating is always full of men.. but i never heard that pirating is illegal because of lack of women..

[igetownd]

I think the reason Oda doesn't have many prominent strong women is because he finds all warrior women to be exotic. Oda is not a feminist. He's not advocating that women should have equivalent strength, authority, and power as men. He just doesn't want the power structure to be exclusively men, so he inserts women here and there. That's why the Strawhats have only 2 women right now. If he wanted 1 more girl, he'd have to add more guys to the crew to match his balance.

Alternatively, Oda is not sexist. He doesn't believe that men are always better than women, or that men are always right. We pay attention to the attractive women he draws and point out that he draws all the women the same way. We ignore his variations. When we see attractive men, we point out the variety in which men are drawn, but ignore that the teen heart-throbs are all drawn much the same way.

Anyway, my argument is that Oda is simply simulating actual society in its modern culture within his own world. He's not advocating any revolutionary movements, or trying to portray an agenda. He simply draws as he sees fit.

[Densuke]

@igetownd:

Oh did he? Interesting, so by misspelling his characters names, I would be offending the author, who has a very limited sense of English, and who occasionally misspells the English translations of his names, and that would do what exactly? Make more weird-sounding foreign names that are pronounced poorly in Japanese, with the L's and R's interchangeable so that puns and comical references can be made? I should do that more often then!

Besides, most translation readers miss the Japanese puns and references entirely because they don't know what the Japanese meanings are. I'll call Zoro Zolo from now on, because you're so anal about the "official" spelling. Zololololololo.

Sounds good, Ruffy.

[igetownd]

@nodensuke:

Sounds good, Ruffy.

Right on, Chaser. or perhaps Nebra.

[Luffyfan]

The only way Smoker V.S Vergo is going to happen is if some thing gets in the way of the Sanji V.S Vergo fight or Smoker saves Sanji some how and I honestly hope its the first option. I'd like to see how both would do without being made look bad.

I can't wait till Dof comes into the picture, after some thing big happens at the end of the arc I'm sure.
I could see the Island sink at the end of Luffy V.S Cc fight getting his attention.

[Autumncomet]

(Isn't he Ruffy in the German dub?)

@Hisoga: I think you might have skipped over a page of the thread. No one argued any of those things. Besides, just because gender issues aren't _as_​ terrible as they used to be doesn't mean there still aren't issues. No one argued for making everything 50/50, only for giving more women in OP a chance.

Why do so many people consider Law to have "dominated" that fight? I seem to recall that they were fairly even until Law ended up using his ability to pull earth up between him and Smoker and then when Smoker was left defenseless in that position, Law "pushed" Smoker's heart out from his body from behind the rock, which for some reason weakened Smoker immensely. And to not forgot, Smoker was also at a disadvantage since he couldn't even anticipate Law's attack if he couldn't see what Law was doing from behind the earth. Smoker was caught in a very defenseless position, which does not qualify to me as being "dominated".
I am curious why Smoker didn't predict what Law was going to do. Is his observation haki not that strong or was he distracted trying to protect Tashigi and the rest of G5?

[igetownd]

@Autumncomet:

(Isn't he Ruffy in the German dub?)

@Hisoga: I think you might have skipped over a page of the thread. No one argued any of those things. Besides, just because gender issues aren't _as_​ terrible as they used to be doesn't mean there still aren't issues. No one argued for making everything 50/50, only for giving more women in OP a chance.

I am curious why Smoker didn't predict what Law was going to do. Is his observation haki not that strong or was he distracted trying to protect Tashigi and the rest of G5?

How about Law's observation was better than Smoker's? Smoker seems to be the person who gets angry and charges into a fight, rather than keep cool and strategize.

Do I have to club some "logics" into the Haki thread again?

[Autumncomet]

He seemed cooler-headed than Tashigi, at any rate, but I guess that's not really saying much. But would Law use observation haki when throwing up an obstacle and getting Smoker's heart? Law may just have been faster…

Haki debate or feminism derail?

[Kishido]

Well even if I agree with the people who think Sanji will lose… I would have liked to see Zoro being the one in this situation. Would people still say... I hope Zoro will lsoe cuz Vergo is dat strong and Smoker/Law should fight him?

[Sick_Fool]

Let me just say this: As long as it's not "strip-naked-because-you-lost" offensive, I'm fine with Oda's decent to good portrayal of his female characters. I guess…

@minor_runes:

I am just one of those fans that is very happy with the manga being as it is.

:)

@igetownd:

I think the reason Oda doesn't have many prominent strong women is because he finds all warrior women to be exotic. Oda is not a feminist. He's not advocating that women should have equivalent strength, authority, and power as men. He just doesn't want the power structure to be exclusively men, so he inserts women here and there. That's why the Strawhats have only 2 women right now. If he wanted 1 more girl, he'd have to add more guys to the crew to match his balance.

Alternatively, Oda is not sexist. He doesn't believe that men are always better than women, or that men are always right. We pay attention to the attractive women he draws and point out that he draws all the women the same way. We ignore his variations. When we see attractive men, we point out the variety in which men are drawn, but ignore that the teen heart-throbs are all drawn much the same way.

Anyway, my argument is that Oda is simply simulating actual society in its modern culture within his own world. He's not advocating any revolutionary movements, or trying to portray an agenda. He simply draws as he sees fit.

Yup, sounds about right.

@onemoment:

Also, there's complaining about Sanji's personality for the past few arcs? Do Sanji fans not have a sense of humor? Instead of complaining about how he was made to dress like a girl and bleed to death every few minutes, you should worship the character for putting himself through that to entertain you. I don't see much wrong with the guy.

Apparently most of them don't. I can understand their grief and annoyance, being a huge Sanji fan myself. I did enjoy the nosebleed humor at first but you gotta admit it became overplayed. Didn;t hate it though, just ultimately didn't bother with the gag at the point to get myself riled up. It's just a gag afterall.

@SantoryuUser7:

I have to say, I found it SO funny when Zoro, with such a serious face, said that "it couldn't be helped" and that they were too tired to run. Pure. Gold.

Pure gold indeed. First page in and my sides already hurt.

Loved everything in this chapter but those Brown-beard bus scenes were the ones I enjoyed the most.

Why do so many people consider Law to have "dominated" that fight? I seem to recall that they were fairly even until Law ended up using his ability to pull earth up between him and Smoker and then when Smoker was left defenseless in that position, Law "pushed" Smoker's heart out from his body from behind the rock, which for some reason weakened Smoker immensely. And to not forgot, Smoker was also at a disadvantage since he couldn't even anticipate Law's attack if he couldn't see what Law was doing from behind the earth. Smoker was caught in a very defenseless position, which does not qualify to me as being "dominated".

Yayyy an ally.

Fans may accuse Oda of downplaying his characters, but it's clearly the fans who fail to read properly do.

Anyway I've said my piece about this whole "fodderized Smoker" issue that I don't want to go back at it again. Had enough of the bitching in NF.

@Autumncomet:

(Isn't he Ruffy in the German dub?)I am curious why Smoker didn't predict what Law was going to do. Is his observation haki not that strong or was he distracted trying to protect Tashigi and the rest of G5?

Either he doesn't have observation haki (I was wondering why you assumed he has because he hasn't shown any signs so far) or that the ordeal happened too fast for him to get out of harm's way as quickly as possible.

[Aohige_AP]

I don't really give a rat's ass how you prefer to spell a name, but when you start mouthing off about "I'm right Oda's wrong" and be an ass about it, I think you cross a line into douchebaggery. Be careful where you tread.

[igetownd]

I play with douche bags. They're fun to squeeze.

Anyway, I guess I should extinguish my arrogance. The whole Vergo's name debate is my waste of other people's time. Maybe you could have met new people. Maybe you could have learned something useful. Ugh, I'm turning into my old self. annoying prick.

Let's look at the chapter again, and enjoy it's splendor again.

Edit: a new bit of advice: if you want enjoyable discussions, avoid discourse with unhappy members. I've been kind of crabby today, so I ended posting acrid stuff. I suggest talking about fun things or making jokes out of idiots like me who think I'm cool when I'm actually lame.

Yeah, well, I'll start off with how awesome Zoro and Kinemon are on the Brownbeard wagon. And how Sanji is still a badass at heart.

[Hallwacker]

@Jabra:

16 chars of fixed.

I've already commented on how bad the fanart on mangapanda was earlier in the thread. I felt I had to comment again on how bad the Monet fanart was.

[Roronoa Zacho]

Good refreshing chapter. The flashback of Vergo + Tashgi gave more depth to Vergo. I bet his ill sister truely is dofla who he reports to regularly.

The Brownbeard bus jokes were kinda simple and plain, but they also did their job distracting from all the "run, run, run"-scenario. Also I c a "Brownbeard's bus transportation service" as a possible cover story material.

Now it seems like Vergo is up against Sanji, but I still wouldn't write that into stone (cause I hope Smoker might interfere in this fight and we'll have a "triple-threat").

Luffy fights CC, but with Smoker around there could be also a "Luffy vs CC vs Smoker"-triple threat with two "gas-related" Logia user which could also get interesting.

I wonder who takes on the dragon. The musketeers? Zoro already killed a dragon, but like we heard, the newer dragons are more dangerous than the old ones.

This chap was good, better than last week's. On the other hand, Oda can't drop a plot-bomb every single week so we should be ok with buildup chaps like last week's between the mindblasting chaps every now and then.

[Hallwacker]

This post is deleted!

[Jhon_Salchichon]

its not the first time we ve seen Vergo use that black thing as seen clearly here: http://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/672/4
It could just be haki or it could be related to a devil fruit (an ability may be also related to the food sticked on his face xD)

[Igosuki]

Vergo has the food food ability making him an effective food plate. Which is why the spoon and steak stick to him.

[Roronoa Zacho]

@Aohige_AP:

I don't really give a rat's ass how you prefer to spell a name, but when you start mouthing off about "I'm right Oda's wrong" and be an ass about it, I think you cross a line into douchebaggery. Be careful where you tread.

I guess this is about how Vergo's name is spelled correctly (I didn't read the first few pages and posts here).
If it's bout Vergo's name: wasn't his name romanized during his first introduction in the background (like with the SNs' intros in ch. 498)? IDK which chapter exactly his name was shown in the BG, but IIRC it was romanized. This should clarify the debate.

Normally there are a lot of misunderstandings regarding the correct spelling of char-names (or even bounties*), because sum translators do a rather bad job ("80 Cool Bros.", anyone remember. By bad trans, I don't mean u, Ao or CCC, just to make that clear). But people also read wrong translations and take them for granted cause they don't know it better by themselves.
But claiming "Oda is wrong, I am right" sure is pure stoopidness.

*) one time there was a bounty of Caribou who said 2.1 billion in a trans, so we see how heavy a trans-mistake can grow.

[Igosuki]

@igetownd:

I think the reason Oda doesn't have many prominent strong women is because he finds all warrior women to be exotic. Oda is not a feminist. He's not advocating that women should have equivalent strength, authority, and power as men. He just doesn't want the power structure to be exclusively men, so he inserts women here and there. That's why the Strawhats have only 2 women right now. If he wanted 1 more girl, he'd have to add more guys to the crew to match his balance.
Alternatively, Oda is not sexist. He doesn't believe that men are always better than women, or that men are always right. We pay attention to the attractive women he draws and point out that he draws all the women the same way. We ignore his variations. When we see attractive men, we point out the variety in which men are drawn, but ignore that the teen heart-throbs are all drawn much the same way.
Anyway, my argument is that Oda is simply simulating actual society in its modern culture within his own world. He's not advocating any revolutionary movements, or trying to portray an agenda. He simply draws as he sees fit.

[offtopic]Being a feminist is not about having equal rights, but about dominating men. Feminists are never satisfied, Oda draws women with a drive and with power, it's not enough for you.
Well guess what there are mangas out there where girls are the heroins and guys are depicted as being weak and undecisive, should I go there and bitch about equality ?
Stop using sensitive topics to give yourself importance or be a troll please. [/offtopic]

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

! @Hisoga:
! > actually trying to tied thing only on black and white is stupid too..
its overused to say that "you'll only see want you want to see" but i have to.. why everything must be equal or if not then it is broken?
no black man in the main casts of a movie, its a racist movie..
not enough women in the main casts of a movie, its a racist movie..

i mean if this is more than 30 or 40 years ago, it is pretty much the case but for today, i think it is silly.. our mouth said no to those things but deep down in our heart, they are still exist.. realizing it or not we still hold to that bad memory so tied that we lost and failed to see that the world have change.. good or bad..
some are too sensitive and even if those thing were not the case in some scenario, we still see it like that..

in my faculty, there far more men than women… is my faculty is sexist?
in another some faculty there are more women than men.. they are "sexist"?
another faculty basically have balanced between men and women.. they are perfect?

if everything must be equal between man and woman, this world will be destroyed.. for example must have equal representative even if one of them doesn't suitable for the job or scenario, so even if one doesn't have a qualification but for the sake of "not sexist", one is hired..

please don't just look something on the surface and judge it easily black and white.. sexism is if there is a clearly bias, unfairly treated, injustice another along the line.. if just because numbers doesn't match or asking for help and another HUMANLY behavior, i think it is silly to simply label it as sexism or racism etc..

some people talk about realistic story bla bla bla..
sexist this sexist that bla bla bla..
not enough women in OP..
nami asking luffy for help is sexist..
Strawhats saving Robin is sexist..
tashigi cried and asked for help is sexist..
but did they realized that they disregard and ignoring whatever hard-work and awesome deed that Nami and Robin did just by saying that Nami and Robin is a damsel in distress and that is unfair to those characters..
or Tashigi behavior is a humanly logical and normal.. not because she is woman but because she is human.. isn't that realistic?
Pirating is always full of men.. but i never heard that pirating is illegal because of lack of women..

You nailed it mate.

[Roronoa Zacho]

IDK if Vergo's "stickiness" is DF-related (remember Louie-Louie, did he have a "strand-of-hair"-DF?), but imo his blackened arm and bamboo stick both scream "CoA-haki!".
If Vergo's sticky face is by a DF, it'd be the opposite fruit of Albida (everything slips away from her). A teflon-DF is outta the question though Teflon is black the most times (cause nothing sticks to Teflon).

[Hisoga]

@Autumncomet:

(Isn't he Ruffy in the German dub?)

@Hisoga: I think you might have skipped over a page of the thread. No one argued any of those things. Besides, just because gender issues aren't _as_​ terrible as they used to be doesn't mean there still aren't issues. No one argued for making everything 50/50, only for giving more women in OP a chance.

I am curious why Smoker didn't predict what Law was going to do. Is his observation haki not that strong or was he distracted trying to protect Tashigi and the rest of G5?

! not really.. i read all of that… but this kind of things is silly for me.. so that is why i am trying to joint the discussion about it.. i am just commenting on a general thing that related to it.. and i already said don't look things on the surface only. my post is not good and lack of good point but doesn't mean it you can just give a conclusion like that.. its not about just 50/50(i don't know where this coming from) or black and white only. but still look at all of the "point" when there are "sexism" discussions in this thread and another how many threads in this forum.
i don't want to derail this so lets stop here.
i think he was distract by that stone Law lifted/raised from the ground.. it was a very smart strategy from Law.. and also it looks like Smoker doesn't have an experience against Law df power..

[zachri]

@scandiacus:

To me, it looks more like he's luring them somewhere. Maybe to some big, underwater creature that's gonna eat their ship.

Them vs Kraken Round 2

[Roronoa Zacho]

@Luffyfan:

The only way Smoker V.S Vergo is going to happen is if some thing gets in the way of the Sanji V.S Vergo fight or Smoker saves Sanji some how and I honestly hope its the first option. I'd like to see how both would do without being made look bad.

Your prayers have been answered: CC wants to let gas into the area where Sanji and Vergo currently are. It'll force them to go further into the lab where Smoker could cross their way.
@Luffyfan:

I can't wait till Dof comes into the picture, after some thing big happens at the end of the arc I'm sure.
I could see the Island sink at the end of Luffy V.S Cc fight getting his attention.

I doubt he'll show up @ PH in the end like Kuma did on TB though it's good to have Dofla finally in the main plot.
I really see this like on Whiskey Peak and Croc back then: The main villain is only mentioned but doesn't appear personally. The arc bout Dofla being the main villain will take place on more than just one island if u ask me.
It's long ago since we had such a situation like with Croc (yeah, there is BM, but I wonder who the SHs will meet first: her or Dofla).

[CCC]

@Roronoa:

I guess this is about how Vergo's name is spelled correctly (I didn't read the first few pages and posts here).
If it's bout Vergo's name: wasn't his name romanized during his first introduction in the background (like with the SNs' intros in ch. 498)? IDK which chapter exactly his name was shown in the BG, but IIRC it was romanized. This should clarify the debate.

The apparently still-existing confusion is because it wasn't actually romanized during his first named appearance. We spent a week speculating before seeing it as Vergo in the next chapter.

…And feminism is absolutely the desire for equal rights. A contingency made up of butch, man-hating, let's-go-live-on-Lesbos-and-develop-a-virus-to-wipe-out-all-men straw[wo]men doesn't actually exist in reality, as fun an idea as that may be. Not that that has much to do with a debate about the portrayal of female characters in a Japanese comic at any rate.

@Unrequited:

Lol seriously though, don't let people catch you posting that in General. Won't end well.

But but but that would be so fun… T_T

[Unrequited]

@Igosuki

Lol seriously though, don't let people catch you posting that in General. Won't end well.

[flandrian15]

what a great chapter this was. I surely didn't see Vergo Vs. Sanji coming :D

"I came because I heard the teardrop of a woman fall" => could it be that Sanji has a natural talent for CoO because of his love for the ladies? Than LOL
If Sanji were to defeat Vergo, who is doing nothing wrong according to the government, I could see a type of arabasta situation where Smoker gets credit for defeating CC and Vergo and for revealing the Doflamingo / Vergo / CC connection while the SH's actual involvement is not spoken of but they might get a bounty increase because defeating a vice admiral and a genius logia scientist makes their strength quite obvious and makes them all the more dangerous to the WG. Luffy was just a small fry at the marineford war but if he can defeat a haki user his danger lvl will rise expoentially and surelySanji's will as well. I can(t get my head around what Zoro is going to do. I mean, that dragon, surely it has to be defeated by a Wano samurai right. Just like in the legend of Ryuuma. He would be dishonored if Zoro were to lend assistance but I can't see any other worthy opponents either… Someone has any ideas?

[Aohige_AP]

@CCC:

The apparently still-existing confusion is because it wasn't actually romanized during his first named appearance. We spent a week speculating before seeing it as Vergo in the next chapter.

Can I gloat that I guessed it right the first time? No? k.

[zachri]

Pft. I bet they'll arrest Vergo and then Doflamingo will come along like 'NOPE.' and save his ass and perhaps either run off with Law or attempt to kill him @__@

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Igosuki:

Vergo has the food food ability making him an effective food plate. Which is why the spoon and steak stick to him.

A part of me wants to see this happening… really...
if he used his ability then I think the only one who could 'withstand' his 'attacks' would be Luffy.
...I'm choosing my words carefully here with this. Trust me.

[flandrian15]

wouldn't it be fun if the SH's took the dragon with them after their Punk Hazard adventure and that they meet Vegapunk along the way who is overly happy to see his favorite pet again because he had to leave it on PH because of the government?
For shame the dragon probably won't live to see they day OR they defeat it and it gets calm again so that luffy can CoC tame it.

[Roronoa Zacho]

Offtopic:
[hide]Bout this sexism-discussion: IDK what u are concerned about. First of: this is a Shonen. Girls often are portrayed physically weak here.
And this is a man's romance phantasy: they don't want girls to be weak so they can "step" on them, further they want them weak so a man can care for them to feel useful and needed. If a girl for example is afraid of spiders its almost a pleasure for men to get rid of those spiders so they feel more needed than usual.
And girls being physically weaker than men isn't very far fetched, cause there are hardly any female paramedics out there (to point out an example) cause sum patients are really heavy and sumtimes not even the male medics can carry them.

Second: the girls in OP often are portrayed smarter than the guys. In reality I often see that girls can organize things better than boys which would make them better managers than their male colleagues. On the other hand the physical "advantage" of men would make them the better cleaners (more strength in an arm gets rid of stains faster).

Women still can complain that they don't earn as lot as money as the men in the very same job. If I was in charge, I'd fix that immediately.

But then there are enuff girls out there who act like stereotypical "Barbies" and men who act like macho-A-holes.
As a parent u can buy your child a Barbie-doll or Lego-monstertrucks, but in the end the kid decides what he/she wants to play with. We will never reach complete equality, because most men have other interests than most women (to view an example: boys like action movies whereas girls like love-stories, of course, there are exceptions, but the majority looks like this). [/hide]

[BinSquarr]

I think this can be a win-win for Sanji's redemption and a storyline where Vergo actually poses a threat. The man thinks he can take out the G-5, a Shichibukai, another VA, and the SH. How you gonna' say that he's gonna' flat-out lose against Sanji? That'd be sick as fxck, but I don't think it's gonna' happen like that.

Yeah, Sanji needs his redemption. We need that quick-thinking, ass-kicking Prince back on board. However, Vergo's not gonna' go down like that. And the gas is coming. All Sanji's gotta' do is beat Vergo down, save Tashigi and then plot can continue. The plot being - Vergo vs. Everybody else. Without Vergo, the PH defensive forces look weak as fxck. The is the NW guys, don't expect pieces of shxt like CC to pose as a major physical threat against the Strawheart-5 alliance.

Also, Vergo's played a secret role in the Marine for time now, how can you say that he's not secretly concealed his strength from them too. This guy could honestly be so mad.

I hope and think that Vergo's no DF user though and think that's a good thing.

[MiyamotoMusashi]

@BinSquarr: Wouldn´t be the first time that a villain overestimates himself. Besides, he should have at least Law´s heart and maybe even Smoker´s heart since he was also looking for him, so him assuming that he can beat all of them isn´t too exaggerated. Besides, the SHs weren´t in the news for 2 years, it´s possible that he doesn´t see them as a threat at all.

[Jabra]

@SantoryuUser7:

Why do so many people consider Law to have "dominated" that fight?

Look, Smoker wasn't fodder to Law in the sense of "he was like the next fodder marine in front of him". Of course not. But no one can tell me that Oda didn't use Smoker as a sacrifice there to let Law shine. People always bring up that he nearly managed to pin him down, I can't see it. To me Law knew exactly what he was doing during the whole fight. From immediatly feeling the presence of See Stone to using replacement no jutsu to avoid it. The rest of the fight was absolutely pathetic, I mean getting distracted because Law simply summoned a stone in front of him? One-shotted after?
What makes matters worse is that Smoker acted like a smartass who apparently knows everything about his Devil Fruit. Really, no excuses can be made for this fight.
And now don't tell me I'm biased. If at all, I'm pissed that Oda threw the idea of Smoker being Luffy's Nemesis out of the window. There is a reason why people feel that Smoker needs to redeem himself by defeating CC or Vergo, which would be at least something. Because as it is, I can't see him being a threat to Luffy, at all.

So, as it stands Smoker is added to the list of Vice Admirals who were used as a means to make other people look immensely powerful, something I would have never predicted. I always thought Smoker was special and treasured by Oda, with him being the next Garp and all. But I guess I was wrong there.

[Roronoa Zacho]

@CCC:

The apparently still-existing confusion is because it wasn't actually romanized during his first named appearance. We spent a week speculating before seeing it as Vergo in the next chapter.
(…)

http://www.mangareader.net/one-piece/673/15
There. This page was what I meant.
When I first saw Sanji vs. Vergo, I was like "seriously!?", but now I'm OK with it. That'd really be an improvement for Sanji if he can keep up with an enemy at that lvl. And against Law, Vergo was overpowered of course, cause he had Law's heart obviously.

[flandrian15]

Don't know if Vergo has a DF or not but what I do know is that he was holding a piece of bamboo and it turned black. Now some might say this is CoA but we have seen CoA a couple of times now, sentamarou hitting Luffy at Sabaody, Rayleigh taking down giant elephant, arrows at the isle of women, Vista and Marco attacking Akainu at marineford,…, and in none of those instances did CoA turn anything black. So I was thinking this was specific to Luffy because of the vulcanization of his ruber body. So chances are pretty high on Vergo having a DF. Also, those things sticking to his face might be an indication as well.

[Jabra]

@Roronoa:

http://www.mangareader.net/one-piece/673/15
That'd really be an improvement for Sanji if he can keep up with an enemy at that lvl. And against Law, Vergo was overpowered of course, cause he had Law's heart obviously.

I'm actually not bothered if Sanji looses or wins this fight. I prefer the latter, but both options seem okay. What is really important for me is his facial expression. His rage attitude really annoyed me so far, even more than the nosebleeds. Now a woman is attacked, the worst crime, and he keeps his cool. I really hope this is a turning point for him.

[BinSquarr]

@MiyamotoMusashi:

@BinSquarr: Wouldn´t be the first time that a villain overestimates himself. Besides, he should have at least Law´s heart and maybe even Smoker´s heart since he was also looking for him, so him assuming that he can beat all of them isn´t too exaggerated. Besides, the SHs weren´t in the news for 2 years, it´s possible that he doesn´t see them as a threat at all.

Yeah, I'm sure of it, however, the SH're still one of the most notorious crews out there, and now they're back from the dead.

Vergo's Doflamingo's right-hand-man in the Marine. He's gotta' be fxcking tough. He might not be able to take on all of them at once, but against Sanji, I don't think he'll lose. Most likely, the gas'll arrive and those 2'll hafta' scatter. Sanji'll save Tashigi, though, and knock Vergo about a bit.

EDIT:

@flandrian15:

Don't know if Vergo has a DF or not but what I do know is that he was holding a piece of bamboo and it turned black. Now some might say this is CoA but we have seen CoA a couple of times now, sentamarou hitting Luffy at Sabaody, Rayleigh taking down giant elephant, arrows at the isle of women, Vista and Marco attacking Akainu at marineford,…, and in none of those instances did CoA turn anything black. So I was thinking this was specific to Luffy because of the vulcanization of his ruber body. So chances are pretty high on Vergo having a DF. Also, those things sticking to his face might be an indication as well.

Yeah, I feel that, but maybe it's just a variation of haki, like CP9 had variations of the 6 forms. Is that not a possibility?

[Kishido]

As I asked before… it would be really interesting to see if people would be "OK" with it, if Zoro would be there for a lose to hype Vergo for a non main character as Smoker

[RadicalPanda]

I find it interesting that some poeple think it'd be okay if Sanji lost to Vergo. It would be totally different if it was Zoro, with him promising to never lose again at Baratie and all that

[Jabra]

@RadicalPanda:

I find it interesting that some poeple think it'd be okay if Sanji lost to Vergo. It would be totally different if it was Zoro, with him promising to never lose again at Baratie and all that

It doesn't matter to me because the level of each Straw Hat (except Luffy for plot relevance) doesn't matter all that much. It is crystall clear that Sanji and Zoro will be absolute top tier by the end of the series, it simply comes with the whole Pirate King crew business. If he is able to beat a Vice Admiral now or in one year isn't important, he will get there eventually. People worry that they won't be able to take down the unknown emporor if he doesn't, but who says that it won't be a pirate alliance battle against Big Mum, with the captains battling the top commanders?
The Straw Hats evolve by defeating the mid tiers, which helps them grow to take on the remaining 2 Yonkou (as a standalone crew this time).

Both ways work.

[Kishido]

@RadicalPanda:

I find it interesting that some poeple think it'd be okay if Sanji lost to Vergo. It would be totally different if it was Zoro, with him promising to never lose again at Baratie and all that

No and because cuz he is Zoro and can't lose against an opponent Smoker, not a main character, wants to fight…

On a serious topic... I seriously doubt most Zoro fans would find it OK that he is used to hype Vergo for Smoker or Law.

BTW the I will never lose again quote has ended in Skypia were he lost against Enel, like evertyone else... I think it can be taken seriously only vs swordsmen

[goty]

@KiShiDo:

As I asked before… it would be really interesting to see if people would be "OK" with it, if Zoro would be there for a lose to hype Vergo for a non main character as Smoker

I think people who follow this series for long enough are aware that the odds of Oda using Sanji to lose and make room for a minor character like Smoker are…lower than zero. There's gotta be a lot of wishful thinking involved to expect that.

@RadicalPanda:

I find it interesting that some poeple think it'd be okay if Sanji lost to Vergo. It would be totally different if it was Zoro, with him promising to never lose again at Baratie and all that

Although he did lose many times afterwards. Just not to swordsmen.

[The Laughing Man]

I'm confused about the fight pairings in this arc.

I mean… Let's just say Sanji WILL be fighting Vergo until conclusion, and of course, Luffy will more than likely fight CC to conclusion. What about the others? I mean...Punk Hazard has a rather large 'friendly party' going on, but I don't see enough opponents to push their skills properly. The only 'villains' I see on Punk Hazard are CC and Vergo.

I'm pretty sure Monet won't fight, instead fleeing back to Doflamingo or joining up with Law (or something).

[BigLuffy559]

^I wouldn't get your hopes up that everyone will get a one on one match-up. And I wouldn't expect everyone to get one on one matches in (every)future arcs either. It will probably feel a little disappointing, but I've been readying myself for this since Nami didn't get anyone at Fishman Island and Sanji had to share his fight with Jinbe. It's kind of the reason why I don't want another crew mate. It's already hard enough to think up 10 villains per arc, choreograph their fights, and then draw them all.

[Kishido]

@BigLuffy559:

^I wouldn't get your hopes up that everyone will get a one on one match-up. And I wouldn't expect everyone to get one on one matches in (every)future arcs either. It will probably feel a little disappointing, but I've been readying myself for this since Nami didn't get anyone at Fishman Island and Sanji had to share his fight with Jinbe. It's kind of the reason why I don't want another crew mate. It's already hard enough to think up 10 villains per arc, choreograph their fights, and then draw them all.

This + we are probably going to Wano where Zoro can shine more than Sanji