Chapter 0 "Strong World" Discussion

[loledinmypants]

@Greg:

You'll have to forgive me. Movie 7 has forever fucked with my brain but aren't those robots from the same island Franky is on right now?

Huh, I was thinking it was a warmer island from what I recalled of the coverstory, but the Spaceys were made on Karakuri Island and that's where Franky is now… Funny enough, the one piece wikia says karakuri island hasn't been explored yet, but yet we've seen it from Franky's coverstory/whereabout chapter pages. Unless there are two "karakuri jima"s... the plot thickens...

[Sea]

@rizu:

So it is roger who stuck that ship steering on Shiki's head.. I think it was his hair when i saw the first theatrical trailer.

The problem is, why didn't Shiji chop that steer wheel? He could chop the part that didn't get into his head. It's obviously a serious weakness, if someone hits it properly, he may die.
The reason:
[hide]Shiki thinks he looks more awesome with that steer wheel. And, yeah "I'm awesome. Why would I fear anyone hit it? I'm Shiki after all."

Yes, that is probaly the answer Oda will give if someone asks him. One Piece is about crazy guys like that.[/hide]

[Greg]

the one piece wikia says

One Piece Wikia can suck it. It's biased and has copied my work without credit.

[pwnobi]

@Greg:

One Piece Wikia can suck it. It's biased and has copied my work without credit.

I wouldn't necessarily blame the wiki for stealing things without credit, because it could just be somebody submitting things from your site without reference, and they're none the wiser!

[FireFistAce 0]

@loledinmypants:

Huh, I was thinking it was a warmer island from what I recalled of the coverstory, but the Spaceys were made on Karakuri Island and that's where Franky is now… Funny enough, the one piece wikia says karakuri island hasn't been explored yet, but yet we've seen it from Franky's coverstory/whereabout chapter pages. Unless there are two "karakuri jima"s... the plot thickens...

well, the one in the coverstory was a Summer Island. The one where Franky is happens to be a Winter Island. Unless this is the only island in the Grand Line that actually has seasons…

[Fortysix2]

Slightly off topic but has anyone noticed that Mugiwara crew members were brought up(or related) by people who had great history except Zoro!! Isnt it fishy??

1.Luffy-Shanks, Dadan, Garp
2.Sanji-Zeff
3.Franky-Tom
4.Chopper-Kureha,Hiluluk
5.Robin-Clover
6.Brooke-He is old so lets leave him
7.Nami-Bellemere
8.Usopp-Yasopp (he left when he was young, but you know what I mean)

All of them were shown to be badass in their peak time. But what about Zoro?

9.Zoro-Koshiro (whose history isnt known at all)

I seriously doubt if Koshiro is a normal guy. I wouldn be surprised if Oda suddenly links him to a great swordsman. So the point is who could that "Link" guy be if what I am saying is even remotely right!!

If you look at Koshiro's dress, there is a symbol of "two swords crossing each other" which is shown a number of times in the manga. Could that reveal something about his history?? To me, it reminds me of a "Jolly Roger" without a skull!!

What do you think guys??

[Ivotas]

@Fire Fist:

That said, there has to be something to tie Eneru in with the story. Obviously, with Maxim destroyed, he's trapped on the moon with the Spaceys, but I seriously doubt Oda's just going to end his story there. Considering, chronologically, his Cover Arc is the next one to have some sort of relevance, I have a feeling he and the Spaceys will be making an appearance soon.

Where did you get the idea from that Maxim is destroyed? We didn't see anything of that sort happening.

The only thing that doesn't fit is that in the Eneru mini-arc, it's a Summer Island. In Franky's mini-arc, it's a Winter Island. Unless there's two different islands named Karakuri.

Well I'd expect that even winter islands have some days with clear skies. As to why we didn't see any snow on Tsukimi's island, well I expect those geniuses to be able to develop some sort of heating devices in order to make the living easier for them.

@Greg:

You'll have to forgive me. Movie 7 has forever fucked with my brain but aren't those robots from the same island Franky is on right now?

It most certainly looks that way. Both islands, the one where Franky is now and where Spacey comes from have been refered to as Machine Island. As far as the lack of snow in the Spacey flashback is concerned, it might either be of reasons I've stated in my previous paragraph OR the term Winter Island is a faulty translation and it says something along the lines of "winter on an island". But then again, the Grand Line Islands tend to have only one fix season so that can't be it either. How about the scientists messing with nature?

@Fortysix2:

Slightly off topic but has anyone noticed that Mugiwara crew members were brought up by people who had great history except Zoro!! Isnt it fishy??

1.Luffy-Shanks, Dadan, Garp
2.Sanji-Zeff
3.Franky-Tom
4.Chopper-Kureha,Hiluluk
5.Robin-Clover
6.Brooke-He is old so lets leave him
7.Nami-Bellemere

Where's Usopp?

[Hiroy]

Wasn't it blown to bits in this?

http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/443/01/

[masterMD112]

usopp dad left him and his mum die, so he raised himself….... when i say himself i mean his alter ego, which is SogeKing. He was raise by yours truly! the sniper King :D

[SunWuKong]

@Fortysix2:

Slightly off topic but has anyone noticed that Mugiwara crew members were brought up(or related) by people who had great history except Zoro!! Isnt it fishy??

1.Luffy-Shanks, Dadan, Garp
2.Sanji-Zeff
3.Franky-Tom
4.Chopper-Kureha,Hiluluk
5.Robin-Clover
6.Brooke-He is old so lets leave him
7.Nami-Bellemere
8.Usopp-Yasopp (he left when he was young, but you know what I mean)

All of them were shown to be badass in their peak time. But what about Zoro?

9.Zoro-Koshiro (whose history isnt known at all)

I seriously doubt if Koshiro is a normal guy. I wouldn be surprised if Oda suddenly links him to a great swordsman. So the point is who could that "Link" guy be if what I am saying is even remotely right!!

If you look at Koshiro's dress, there is a symbol of "two swords crossing each other" which is shown a number of times in the manga. Could that reveal something about his history?? To me, it reminds me of a "Jolly Roger" without a skull!!

What do you think guys??

I don't consider bellemere as a character with great history, but except for that i totally agree.
Also i think that there are at least 2 hints about koshiro not being an ordinary swordsman.

First, he's the one with the who originally owned the legendary sword that now zoro has
second he can cut metal, which seems to be something like a myth among ordinary people.

also he seems to be very wise and thoughtful, which is a rare characteristic for oda's characters, even for the important ones.

[Hekti]

@SunWuKong:

second he can cut metal, which seems to be something like a myth among ordinary people.

He knows about it for sure but we can't say that he can cut metal.

[Greg]

I wouldn't necessarily blame the wiki for stealing things without credit, because it could just be somebody submitting things from your site without reference, and they're none the wiser!

Over this internet this might sound condescending but I don't mean it to. Wiki isn't some super computer, it's made by people. People that plagiarize the living daylights out of teh intranets and are extremely biased adding only information they agree with and not information that makes logical sense or is actually useful. They throw in a few SAT vocab words and holy ding-dong, it's a 'credible' source. Hence, OPWiki as a collective of numbskull fans can suck it.

[raj]

This post is deleted!

[huron]

@Greg:

Over this internet this might sound condescending but I don't mean it to. Wiki isn't some super computer, it's made by people. People that plagiarize the living daylights out of teh intranets and are extremely biased adding only information they agree with and not information that makes logical sense or is actually useful. They throw in a few SAT vocab words and holy ding-dong, it's a 'credible' source. Hence, OPWiki as a collective of numbskull fans can suck it.

dont be so hard.there i always find priceless infos like this:

http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/Greg_Ayres

[Ivotas]

@Hiroy:

Wasn't it blown to bits in this?

http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/443/01/

Oh, now I get it. You (respectively FFA) think that this was Maxim. Never even considered this possibility, since the very next installment had Enel say "my Verse" instead of "my ship". So I figured the Space Pirates were randomly blowing up the moon. But now that I think about it, it could just as well be Maxim that was blown up.

[Sea]

Edd war, Ed War, Ed Wor, how should it be translated?
What is your opinion, Greg?

[pwnobi]

@The:

Edd war, Ed War, Ed Wor, how should it be translated?
What is your opinion, Greg?

I know I'm not Greg, but I think it should be "Ed War."
Just sayin.

[Greg]

@huron:

dont be so hard.there i always find priceless infos like this:

That was a joke right?

Edd war, Ed War, Ed Wor, how should it be translated?
What is your opinion, Greg?

I usually don't weigh in on location or character name translations until I spend a few hours leeching the life out of Google and other resources but off the top of my head, I instantly read it as Edd Woe.

That's without even confirming with any Japanese individuals that it might ring a bell with so it's not something I'd rely on.

[Don Quichotte De Flamingo]

@Ivotas:

Oh, now I get it. You (respectively FFA) think that this was Maxim. Never even considered this possibility, since the very next installment had Enel say "my Verse" instead of "my ship". So I figured the Space Pirates were randomly blowing up the moon. But now that I think about it, it could just as well be Maxim that was blown up.

lol, also never noticed that…they blow up his maxim!:blink:damn
thats why enel is so pissed

[Angel emfrbl]

@pwnobi:

I wouldn't necessarily blame the wiki for stealing things without credit, because it could just be somebody submitting things from your site without reference, and they're none the wiser!

We give credit when its known.

And besides, you can point out the stolen goods and prove it to us (don't forget to submit to forum somewhere) and we'll take it down. When we know theres a credit to be had, we linkie, but the trouble is not everyone who edits is taking their images and text from honest sources and so forth. I've told off peeps before when I've caught them doing it (we had one editor who kept taking images from, I think it was, a german site before).

We can't do ANYTHING until you shout out. There are tons of OP sites out there… Who can track them all?

The eaiest thing to keep off the site is fanart, that we're pretty good on keeping off, but I have much respect for fanartists since I've been a fan artist myself in the past for another anime... And I've WITNESSED a clash between Japanese fanartists and western fans before. :wassat:

[Refii]

It's not Greg's responsibility to track down who's stealing his work.
If you consider yourself the voice of One Piece wikia, you should take the responsibility of removing it.

We give credit when its known.

So many things wrong in that quote, knowing what a tool you are, I doubt you will do your job and enforce credit on articles.

[Ivotas]

@Don:

lol, also never noticed that…they blow up his maxim!:blink:damn
thats why enel is so pissed

Well, the text in the next installment doesn't say "my Maxim" but "my Verse/Vearth" so the possibility that he is simply pissed because they are randomly blowing up his Fairy Verse is still there.

[Sea]

It would be cool if you translate One Piece, Greg. I mean, like Stephen, you can help the reader understand One Piece more exactly. I know you read One Piece when it's released in Japan, so you don't need to compete with other translators. Just for further understanding. You have wide knowledge about Japan and One Piece.
But I also know you have your own life to worry. So, just a suggestion.

[Angel emfrbl]

@Refii:

It's not Greg's responsibility to track down who's stealing his work.
If you consider yourself the voice of One Piece wikia, you should take the responsibility of removing it.

So many things wrong in that quote, knowing what a tool you are, I doubt you will do your job and enforce credit on articles.

Excuse me, but I'm just a OP fan like anyone else here, I'm no more a tool then you are. The only difference is I work at the wikia editing. Before that, I was at wikipedia. Wikipedia forced us to opent he wikia.

And yes, when the credit IS known, we DO credit, or do I have to show you proof we do that now? :wassat:

What I don't have time to do is go around and investigate 5,000+ websites to see what we have and haven't got up there that belongs to others. I have a life, and though I do edit the wikia, I only do so when I have time. Now either I edit the wikia or I look at the 5,000+ fanasite (who many of which steal from other sites every day and get away with it, even as far as FANART), I haven't the time to split between both.

A lot of people have the tendacey in this forum to just open their mouth and talk about the wikia. Of those that shoot their mouth off, half of them only know it exists and that it has articles with things on… The other half don't edit or take us seriously enough to care to investigate. The few of us who visit other forums do so because we ARE FANS like anyone else.

Take for what you like, we're no different to any other fansite out there in the long run. In fact we're "just another site" in that context.

Edit:
Even if I did find the stuff, I can't punish anyone, I have no admin powers, I'm literally just an editor. ^_-

[kirei_lanford]

well i agree with you…

wikia's editor also human with their human's brain and all.. so it's the originator's job's to do the credit reminder when they find it.. or just leave it like that... it's nothing too elaborate to think..

just wishing that there would be a second chapter that prelude SW... but i think it won't be happening remembering the last line on the chapter...

[sgn15]

well, lets stop this OP wiki shit discussion:

Question: Did Shiki just literally visited WB or he has some proposals of them joining together?

because it doesnt make sense for me that he recognizes its WB's era after roger's death but he didnt try to team up with WB who is the next best powerhouse to roger or even challenge him to a duel?

the logic of beating or teaming with the strongest existing person doesnt apply to Shiki? or he was just gay-obssessed with roger? if he was really after world domination and power, WB is the next best thing after Roger, right?

[Benjaman]

@sgn15:

well, lets stop this OP wiki shit discussion:

Question: Did Shiki just literally visited WB or he has some proposals of them joining together?

because it doesnt make sense for me that he recognizes its WB's era after roger's death but he didnt try to team up with WB who is the next best powerhouse to roger or even challenge him to a duel?

the logic of beating or teaming with the strongest existing person doesnt apply to Shiki? or he was just gay-obssessed with roger? if he was really after world domination and power, WB is the next best thing after Roger, right?

I think that after being so disappointed on Roger, he came with his plan of just conquering the world without anyone´s help. So he just was passing by on the Moby Dick to say something like "enjoy ur era Whitebeard, ill be back". That´s what i take of that ending.

[kirei_lanford]

i think this shiki guy is so hard to tell…

what is it that he really wanted?? he wanted to dominate the world..?? when the word "dominate" occurs, it wouldn't make sense if roger should also a part of shiki's future plan... "dominate" is something you usually pass to "a single entity".. and that would mean, it's been fishy in the 1st place for shiki to say those kinda lines to roger.. if domination is truly his goal :getlost:

i would say.. what shiki means is that he wanted pirates and noone but them who rule the ocean.. and that would only mean, to destroy the marines, in the name of WG.. and that's why he needed roger.. but roger refused.. as it seems that even though he was indeed an enemy of the government, it's not really roger's objective to make WG suffer... i could only guess that in his mind, it wouldn't be fun if pirates are around without marines.. or at least that's what my crazy mind told me..

what an interesting fellow... gold roger...

on the contrary, shiki, a guy obsessed with WG destruction, really focused his energy in developing a strength that could defeat WG.. so he choose to stay behind mist and wait till he finished all the preparations needed.. and by seeing the SW preview,... it seems that not only that the great experiment of combining animal and plant succeed, he also has succeeded in gathering all the manpower he needed, just like the old days... a terrifying person for WG, indeed...

[pwnobi]

@kirei_lanford:

i think this shiki guy is so hard to tell…

what is it that he really wanted?? he wanted to dominate the world..?? when the word "dominate" occurs, it wouldn't make sense if roger should also a part of shiki's future plan... "dominate" is something you usually pass to "a single entity".. and that would mean, it's been fishy in the 1st place for shiki to say those kinda lines to roger.. if domination is truly his goal :getlost:

i would say.. what shiki means is that he wanted pirates and noone but them who rule the ocean.. and that would only mean, to destroy the marines, in the name of WG.. and that's why he needed roger.. but roger refused.. as it seems that even though he was indeed an enemy of the government, it's not really roger's objective to make WG suffer… i could only guess that in his mind, it wouldn't be fun if pirates are around without marines.. or at least that's what my crazy mind told me..

what an interesting fellow... gold roger...

on the contrary, shiki, a guy obsessed with WG destruction, really focused his energy in developing a strength that could defeat WG.. so he choose to stay behind mist and wait till he finished all the preparations needed.. and by seeing the SW preview,... it seems that not only that the great experiment of combining animal and plant succeed, he also has succeeded in gathering all the manpower he needed, just like the old days... a terrifying person for WG, indeed...

Or maybe he just needed Roger to complete his plans, so he had to make the sacrifice of ruling the world with one other person. He needed the knowledge Roger had about the location of the weapon.

http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/565.5/00/

However, I agree that people like Shiki that aspire for world domination are usually not content with anyone even being on their level, so instead of theorizing that he only meant pirates, I think a better theory would be that he would have just betrayed Roger after acquiring the knowledge of the location of the weapon.

[NANLIT]

Well Shiki did say that he wanted Roger as his right hand man. Saying that Roger would be a subordinate to Shiki.
http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-000/page006.html

[pwnobi]

@NANLIT:

Well Shiki did say that he wanted Roger as his right hand man. Saying that Roger would be a subordinate to Shiki.
http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-000/page006.html

lol we linked the same page, but yeah he did used the term "right hand man," reserving the position of utmost power to Shiki.

[Greg]

And yes, when the credit IS known, we DO credit, or do I have to show you proof we do that now?

I'm not really concerned that individuals who edit the OP wiki steal my work or ideas, I'm used to that from my DBZ days. My main problem with it is simply how biased it is. This was proven with the 'Oz' article that regardless of how much proof existed that it wasn't 'Oz', they refused to change the article name just because it's what they liked.
shrugs

What I don't have time to do is go around and investigate 5,000+ websites

Are there really 5,000 respectable and reliable English language OP information sites that have a history?

[kirei_lanford]

So, you mean he only needed roger's knowledge, and then after he know it.. He would eliminate roger?! Also after he get his hand on the ship, he would use it as a tool to world domination..

That if he was really that low..

But, i doubted that.. Considering how much he respected roger..

I said, his goal was to defeat the enemy read: WG a.k.a marines.. And make the pirates rule the ocean and fight without any limitation they previously had. I didn't say he didn't need roger in his version of the future.

[pwnobi]

@kirei_lanford:

So, you mean he only needed roger's knowledge, and then after he know it.. He would eliminate roger?! Also after he get his hand on the ship, he would use it as a tool to world domination..

That if he was really that low..

But, i doubted that.. Considering how much he respected roger..

I said, his goal was to defeat the enemy read: WG a.k.a marines.. And make the pirates rule the ocean and fight without any limitation they previously had. I didn't say he didn't need roger in his version of the future.

I think his goal was just to rule the world, and as NANLIT pointed out, it's for feasible he didn't plan to kill him, merely have him as an underling.

[kirei_lanford]

Okay.. So im just defending shiki.. >.

I'm just hoping that he isn't that simple…

So, what he wanted was just some comfort above the throne seat and have all the pirates obey his order.. Shogun of the ocean?? Plus WG inexistence, of course..

But that would be so boring...

OR?! Just dive back to the bottom and bingo!! The answer we get is a simple two-word phrase..

One Piece ;)

[Greg]

I think his goal was just to rule the world, and as NANLIT pointed out, it's for feasible he didn't plan to kill him, merely have him as an underling.

Takenaka said that Shiki has a dream. The name of the film is 'Strong World'. We know that Shiki is screwing around with potions. We've seen that Nami has turned a strange color. We know there are otherwise normal people who show animal-like traits.

All evidence points to Shiki having a goal in mind and not just Akatsuki 'teh wurld dominashun'.

[pwnobi]

@Greg:

Takenaka said that Shiki has a dream. The name of the film is 'Strong World'. We know that Shiki is screwing around with potions. We've seen that Nami has turned a strange color. We know there are otherwise normal people who show animal-like traits.

All evidence points to Shiki having a goal in mind and not just Akatsuki 'teh wurld dominashun'.

I always thought all that stuff was just his plan in order to achieve his goal, just my personal opinion, I'll wait for more info to come into play.

[Angel emfrbl]

@Greg:

I'm not really concerned that individuals who edit the OP wiki steal my work or ideas, I'm used to that from my DBZ days. My main problem with it is simply how biased it is. This was proven with the 'Oz' article that regardless of how much proof existed that it wasn't 'Oz', they refused to change the article name just because it's what they liked.
shrugs

Are there really 5,000 respectable and reliable English language OP information sites that have a history?

I remember the explaination I gave everyone to the Oz thing and you're still choosing to ignore the fact we changed it once a certain chapter came out. Plus, we knew from the start Oz was incorrect, but then again, all the other names people were using were also incorrect there you go.

I was exhauggerating, to prove a point, what I was trying to say, its a LONG task and it would take all day. Plus, I've included in this non-english sites (which still count) in the workings and I know I can't for sure check out beyond the german ones.

Can we drop the discussion, we've been asked already once not to discuss things, and I don't want to discuss the wikia outside of the wikia because here nothing is resolved. Heck, I can't even run a vote for names here on the wikia. Plus, we're going to annoy people, so lets leave things alone okay? Theres a time and place for discussing the wikia and I wish you guys would stop bring us up on AP forums. We don't go on about the problems AP has and we don't expect you to go on about us. Its a sign of respect, we only mention AP at all when you've mentioned us and we've spotted it.

So without furtehr ado, lets end that here okay?

And back on topic please, I honestly don't know how to make this post go on topic. I just want to remind Greg this isn't the topic of this discussion.

Edit:
Oh I found one.

I think of all the younger versions, Mihawk's is the cutest. <3

But overall a lot of the other characters don't tell us much about them in those days… Cricket's is... Unhelpful for example.

For me, regarding those characters, it was a wasted chance for them.

[Greg]

I always thought all that stuff was just his plan in order to achieve his goal, just my personal opinion, I'll wait for more info to come into play.

I think the point of it is he doesn't just want to 'rule teh wurld', it's that he wants to do something with it.

Plus, we knew from the start Oz was incorrect, but then again, all the other names people were using were also incorrect there you go.

And the name you chose was based on the least justified information.

For that matter, any and every romanization we use in the series is as you described, incorrect until written out by Oda. But at least reliable sources strive for what is most accurate, and the origin of the name is still as such, and not a stubborn belief based on personal bias.

And might I add, no one's blaming you that OPW steals stuff. It's just how it is.

It's like Conis v2.0

a small voice in some corner of the world

"null might not provide the best possible scanlation."

Conis: How can you possibly say anything like that! Do you know how hard we wo-

three paragraphs later

-and the horse you rode in on!

If you're really interested in leaving the discussion and not simply getting the last word in public, I invite you to discuss it with me via PM.

[pwnobi]

@Greg:

I think the point of it is he doesn't just want to 'rule teh wurld', it's that he wants to do something with it.

I'll be interested to see how it plays out.

[Greg]

I'll be interested to see how it plays out.

Me too :) I think it could just as easily play out as you've proposed but I don't think Oda's willing to let a project this big ride on that. Remember, he already completely scrapped an idea he had for the movie and started over from scratch which may very well be the reason for the delay. Since he's taken the story so seriously, I find it hard to believe he'd be satisfied with such shallow motivation, but we'll see!

[pwnobi]

@Greg:

Me too :) I think it could just as easily play out as you've proposed but I don't think Oda's willing to let a project this big ride on that. Remember, he already completely scrapped an idea he had for the movie and started over from scratch which may very well be the reason for the delay. Since he's taken the story so seriously, I find it hard to believe he'd be satisfied with such shallow motivation, but we'll see!

Well the main reason I think of it that way, is because it's not so much about the goal, it's about how he gets there, the plan. For example, Blackbeard. Blackbeard's goal is most likely just to be the pirate king, you can make that sound stupid or simple just like "taking over the world." However, as we've seen Blackbeard obviously has a more intricate plan at work that makes his character and goal more complex, that's the reasoning I apply to Shiki's dream/goal. I also don't think he will actually achieve his goal, or else the story would kind of fizzle… so all we really are going to get to see is the way he executes his plan. However, I also admit it could easily be just as you said, it could even be more likely to play out that way, this is just how I see it so far.

Let's celebrate the differences!

[Greg]

Blackbeard's goal is most likely just to be the pirate king

But to what end?

Being the PK isn't just obtaining OP. It means knowing information about the world, and wanting to do something about it or at least, the journey along the way will reveal that information.

Now Luffy? He could care less. But BB, he knows something. He seems to know what's up and he has a purpose.

When it comes down to it, I believe the biggest, and perhaps even the only, difference between the two, is BB has a purpose, and Luffy just wants to be free.

I think BB actually wants to accomplish something humane by becoming PK (that is to say, obtaining information and a certain power) as a means to accomplish something that may very well be in humanity's best interest, however he's willing to do whatever it takes to do that even if it means suffering of others.

So yes, while I agree his goal is to be PK, I think that's only one step towards accomplishing what he really wants.

Buuuuuuuut of course Oda could come along and make him say some shit like, "I wish to return the world to darkness BUWaHAHAAHAHHA."

At which point I'd break down and cry.

[pwnobi]

@Greg:

But to what end?

Being the PK isn't just obtaining OP. It means knowing information about the world, and wanting to do something about it or at least, the journey along the way will reveal that information.

Now Luffy? He could care less. But BB, he knows something. He seems to know what's up and he has a purpose.

When it comes down to it, I believe the biggest, and perhaps even the only, difference between the two, is BB has a purpose, and Luffy just wants to be free.

I think BB actually wants to accomplish something humane by becoming PK (that is to say, obtaining information and a certain power) as a means to accomplish something that may very well be in humanity's best interest, however he's willing to do whatever it takes to do that even if it means suffering of others.

So yes, while I agree his goal is to be PK, I think that's only one step towards accomplishing what he really wants.

Buuuuuuuut of course Oda could come along and make him say some shit like, "I wish to return the world to darkness BUWaHAHAAHAHHA."

At which point I'd break down and cry.

I guess that's the difference, I think BB wants to accomplish things to become the pirate king, not become the pirate king to accomplish things.

Also, I don't mean any offense but it bothers me when people do this
"Now Luffy? He could care less"
couldn't*

[Greg]

I guess that's the difference, I think BB wants to accomplish things to become the pirate king, not become the pirate king to accomplish things.

Knowing what we do about Oda and his inability to fall into the traditional mold, I can't believe that's what he's aiming for.

I mean just look at Croc.

We once could have suggested he was simply motivated by 'teh wurld dominshun' but thanks to recent events, it seems that he had visions beyond just obtaining Pluton and making a Eutopia.

Also, I don't mean any offense but it bothers me when people do this
"Now Luffy? He could care less"
couldn't*

That's what we say in Jersey.

Fuggedaboudit.

[pwnobi]

@Greg:

That's what we say in Jersey.

Fuggedaboudit.

Yeah people say it like that in California, and Florida also, they're just wrong.

[Greg]

Yeah people say it like that in California, and Florida also, they're just wrong.

Hmm, that was kind of my point with my thick New Jersey ignorant accent. ^_^;

[pwnobi]

@Greg:

Hmm, that was kind of my point with my thick New Jersey ignorant accent. ^_^;

Hahaha my apologies, I didn't pick up on that. :happy:

[El Chupa Negro]

I mean it seemed to me Shiki had a stronger crew and could have beaten roger if it wasn't for that storm.

[Greg]

That's a great question. But before we consider their strength, who knows for certain whether or not the storm was just 'luck'.

I seem to recall another character on the verge of death who was also saved by a storm.

Was it luck?

Or something…else?

Now since the narrator tells us this information, it's tough to think they would lie to us, but if there was something else involved, they haven't lied as so much told a half truth.

Now lets consider that Shiki's massive crew wasn't set upon by a storm.

Shiki, although a bit insane, seems to fight with some form of honor if not simply respect for strength (strong world?) I wonder if even WITHOUT the storm, whether he would have unleashed his full power if he lost directly to Roger.

All interesting things to think about.