ok im sorry but franky hasnt fought the most powerful guys along with sanji, zoro, and luffy and since when did chopper get leftovers?
Chapter 523 "Hell" Discussion
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I've been thinking about the same thing. I figured if Hancock stayed to help out, then Nyon's line about keeping her position of Shichibukai seems a little weak, since helping Luffy would/should definitely get her stripped….........of the title.
It's called sneaking Luffy in without notice. Hence the reason why Hancock is hiding Luffy. No one has to ever know Hancock brought Luffy. Her title will be safe.
Keep in mind I had said big defeat. I am all for Luffy getting sucker punched at the start of an arc only to come back and steal the show, but his defeat in Saboady was much different. It was a complete and utter annihilation that the crew had never seen before. (Luffy had in Alabasta, but not the crew as a whole). To see Luffy's next course of action end in another total defeat while inside the world's greatest dungeon would be…disappointing. Not to mention it would be hard to imagine successfully writing a way out of the dungeon for him. Anyways, if I got my wish, Luffy would take out a VA or something relatively smaller scale to what he has faced, and then they will ninja it out of there. Rather then a huge battle royale or something. IDK, I really don't have a wish…so I take that statement back.
How about Luffy not getting involved in the war at all?
Luffy would be like an ain't among Dragons, there's nothing he could do but die.
My wish would be we get some time away from Luffy [and any other SH's] and watch the Superstars battle it out.I agree with your last point Luffy would rescue Ace but not only Ace Jinbei too [That's totally weak that Jinbei got manhandled and thrown in prison]. Then he would ninja it out all the way with Jinbei [as the new SH pirate] and traveling back to Fishman island with him.
BTW, Luffy vs Moria was bad writing. The way Oda made Moria fight was terrible.
You would think a guy who can transform shadows into solid objects would use a SWORD or some type of blade to hurt Luffy instead of using physical blows..Which have no affect on Luffy. -
@Shaman:
ok im sorry but franky hasnt fought the most powerful guys along with sanji, zoro, and luffy and since when did chopper get leftovers?
No, he hasn't, but he's rushed into battle like them, a la Thriller Bark.
Chopper's always chosen what the others didn't choose. He's not exactly rushing into battle all the time. In Skypiea he had to wander around hopelessly before STUMBLING on a villain. In Enies Lobby, EVERYONE got a CP9, but he didn't get one of the 3 strongest. He did choose his opponent on Thiller Bark, but that's because Hogback was an insult to his profession, made worse by how Chopper looked up to him so much before.
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Yeah, Chopper isnt much of a fighter, I think he can be lumped into the same category as Usopp and Nami. All of them avoid fighting when possible, but when they do fight, the do a fantastic job.
As opposed to someone like Zoro, or Sanji, who go out seeking fights most of the time.
http://viscaria3.blogspot.com/. Best thing since Phoenix Wright!!
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I agree with your last point Luffy would rescue Ace but not only Ace Jinbei too. Then he would ninja it out all the way with Jinbei [as the new SH pirate] and traveling back to Fishman island with him.
That's so fucking terrible. I can't bring myself to say anything else.
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One thing I would love to see before this saga is over is everyone of the Strawhats getting stronger and getting their own fight. As much as I love Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji, I adore fights involving the other crew members. And I'm talking proper one on one here.
And what is with the Nami hate? Face it, she's on a ship full of idiots, that she's not grey yet is a miracle. Though she can get a bit excessive…
As for what Luffy would do when (if, this is Oda here) he reaches Imperial Down, while his default mode is "CHARGE!!!!!!!!" he does seem to be getting a little more mature and smarter (if you squint reallyreallyreallyreallyreally hard you can see it), so he may decided that this is a time for a more... tactfull method than what he's used in the past. Which should last about half a chapter before he blows it and begins rampaging around.
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Face it, beating the hell out of your own captain on a daily basis is not right, no matter how you look at it. Leave that to his enemies :sad:
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It's a gag, nothing more (not to mention it is a fairly popular shonen trope, the smart/more mature girl beating on the witless hero). If it was serious, then Nami would be one of the strongest characters in One Piece since normal punches aren't supposed to work against Luffy.
So many people in the world. And so many bullets. Lots and lots of bullets.
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Deal with the antics of a hyperactive three-year-old 24/7, and if you don't feel liek giving them a good wallop at some point, then you're…well...something else.
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Oh yeah hahahaha! A gag. Yeah, its not really funny though. But ah well, fvck it.
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@Zik:
That's so fucking terrible. I can't bring myself to say anything else.
Yeah, I said the same thing when I found out Jinbei got thrown in prison [Oda?!].
It's not as bad as your username though
Luffy getting Jinbei and riding with him out could happen. -
go and in during the chaos Mr. 2 will pretend to be Ace and divert the attention of the Marines setting up the perfect escape and allowing Luffy and Ace to stow away on the Marine ship/steal if momogoa chaces after Mr. 2 thinking that it's Ace and Boa charms his crew.
I thought about the same thing and posted here.
Mr.2 turning into either Ace or Boa…but apparently some thought it would make things way too easy if that actually happens... -
It's a gag, nothing more (not to mention it is a fairly popular shonen trope, the smart/more mature girl beating on the witless hero). If it was serious, then Nami would be one of the strongest characters in One Piece since normal punches aren't supposed to work against Luffy.
Nami IS one of the strongest characters in OP. Owned Luffy & Zoro a couple of times.
And apart from Luffy who was immune to his power, she was the one who survived Ener for the biggest amount of time.I don't understand why everyone says she belongs to the same category as Usopp, I honestly think she's the fourth most valuable fighter in the team. Or the third, since she could beat the crap out of Sanji anytimes
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She's probably the second most important member of the crew in terms of overall whatnots, but don't kid yourself about her usefulness in a fight. Gag beatdowns and real fights are two completely different things.
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BTW, Luffy vs Moria was bad writing. The way Oda made Moria fight was terrible.
You would think a guy who can transform shadows into solid objects would use a SWORD or some type of blade to hurt Luffy instead of using physical blows..Which have no affect on Luffy.I think Luffy vs Moria happened at the right time.
If Moria brings Oz to the scenery… i think there would be a real slight chance of Ace actually being rescued -
I think Luffy vs Moria happened at the right time.
If Moria brings Oz to the scenery… i think there would be a real slight chance of Ace actually being rescuedLast edited by johnjkim15 : November 24th, 2008 at 11:18 PM. Reason: oops. i actually talked about totally different stuff
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You still are
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He still knew there was a huge chance Whitey could move before the execution though.
All the more reason he should be on the defense even if he was watching out for his actions.
Yeah. Same thing applies though. As far as Sengoku was concerned, he had all eyes on Whitebeard and was either prepared for Whitebeard to attack Marineford once Ace arrived – to which Hancock had plenty of time to reach, pit stop at ID or no -- or Whitebeard makes a move elsewhere but Sengoku knows about the move because he had his eyes and ears on him. The major change in that scene takes place when he realizes that their eyes and ears are out of the picture and that Whitebeard could do anything at any place at any time. So either way it shouldn't be a big deal if she makes a pit stop.
It just rubs me the wrong way. The weight of what's going down is something that's going to change the world. And even though we know that as readers, the players involved must also know what's at stake. All the more reason he should be anal retentive about getting everyone exactly where they need to be well in advance.
To which Tsuchi originally replied, Boa has plenty of weight on her side thanks to that very circumstance, "I want to go here or fuck you."
And yet, you'd think while they'd allow it, THEY'D BE AS SUSPICIOUS AS FUCK not to mention wary of such a possible weak link.
As a leader you have to give and take but the whole thing reaks to me. Oda could pull a whole, "There's really an X under the armband!", flashback routine explaining later but…I just dunno. It remains that as it stands it's a weak storyline. If he addresses it, bitchin'.
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And yet, you'd think while they'd allow it, THEY'D BE AS SUSPICIOUS AS FUCK not to mention wary of such a possible weak link.
Who's to say they're not? I would suggest perhaps you wait a few chapters for things to shape up a bit before you pass judgement like that. I had the exact same thought (what reason could she possibly have told them for wanting to go there?), but I expect all will be revealed in time.
As for the link, Hancock is well known for having a deep-seated hatred of men. As far as I know, the World Government is only expecting menfolk to attack them and would have no reason to believe that Hancock would/could possibly be in league with a man.
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They should be suspicious as f*ck, but as you can see, Sengoku's eyes are rivetted on Whitebeard! He doesn't care about ID overflowing with prisoners, or the conditions of Hancock's agreement. As far as he's concerned, though Hancock is strong, she wouldn't defy WG on her own in any way. Why would he suspect that? He was pi$$ed with Jinbei - he expected obedience from him, so I don't see why he wouldn't expect the same from the rest of the Shichibukai. I believe they announced the execution date to force the confrontation around Marineford, but looking at the convergences on ID (Luffy, Hancock, Jinbei, Garp, Ace) it is likely that Whitebeard saw through this and that they are jumping the gun and making an attempt on ID. From a Marines perspective, ID is probably the most fortified location they have, so I doubt they ever expect attacks there, and why should they. It is a terror to pirates, a place they avoid.
Can't wait for the next chapter(s)!
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to denimjo: but she is in league with the government which is basicly mostly men and worst yet allows the slave trade to continue
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@Shaman:
to denimjo: but she is in league with the government which is basicly mostly men and worst yet allows the slave trade to continue
There's no evidence the WG even knows about her slave history.
Also, there's a difference between cooperating with men in order to gain something (in her case, the Shichibukai title and the benefits it bestows) and actively assisting a man to outright defy the WG as a whole by sabotaging them from within.
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It's a gag, nothing more (not to mention it is a fairly popular shonen trope, the smart/more mature girl beating on the witless hero). If it was serious, then Nami would be one of the strongest characters in One Piece since normal punches aren't supposed to work against Luffy.
lol this sounds far-fetched…but maybe Nami possesses a super strong haki, which is only released when either she gets annoyed at a person's stupidness or when she gets worked up about money...i dunno but it is a possibility, and cud explain y she can hit luffy just like garp can hit him...
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All the more reason he should be on the defense even if he was watching out for his actions.
It just rubs me the wrong way. The weight of what's going down is something that's going to change the world. And even though we know that as readers, the players involved must also know what's at stake. All the more reason he should be anal retentive about getting everyone exactly where they need to be well in advance.
To which Tsuchi originally replied, Boa has plenty of weight on her side thanks to that very circumstance, "I want to go here or fuck you."
And yet, you'd think while they'd allow it, THEY'D BE AS SUSPICIOUS AS FUCK not to mention wary of such a possible weak link.
As a leader you have to give and take but the whole thing reaks to me. Oda could pull a whole, "There's really an X under the armband!", flashback routine explaining later but…I just dunno. It remains that as it stands it's a weak storyline. If he addresses it, bitchin'.
That's why maybe Vice Admiral Momonga is lying about getting permission. He has everything to gain, yet risking it all because he was hell bent on getting Boa back with him. Imagine if he is desperate enough, that any condition by Boa, if he can do, then he would agree to it because his mission was to get Boa back at all cost. So, what is a little detour to Impel Down to him, then to fail his mission or get Boa back a day or two too late for the war against Whitebeard?
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Yeah, it was crap writing.
& D@me are you a puppy? all you do is follow me around.:wassat:Funny that you claim to be such an expert considering how you guzzle down all the shit Kishimoto writes.
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I can't believe there are people actually considering that old shonen cliche 'girls punching stupid guys" gag as a sign of strenght, Haki and shit. Is this serious? Jesus Christ.
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I can't believe there are people actually considering that old shonen cliche 'girls punching stupid guys" gag as a sign of strenght, Haki and shit. Is this serious? Jesus Christ.
Considering that oda has joked about it enough times in the SBSs and explained how… The weakest members of the crew, according to Oda are still Nami, Usopp and Chopper. The strongest are still Luffy, Zoro and Sanji. Everyone else is in the middle.
Its pointless fans arguing when the Mangaka has established this long ago. What do we need to recap in TB where it was stated or something?
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It's a gag, nothing more (not to mention it is a fairly popular shonen trope, the smart/more mature girl beating on the witless hero). If it was serious, then Nami would be one of the strongest characters in One Piece since normal punches aren't supposed to work against Luffy.
Nami's punches are punches of LOVE! Luffy only get big bumps and stuff on his head from people who punches and loves him. Just like how Garp gave him many bumps on his forehead when he went to wake him up after the Enes Lobby arc!
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Will we have a chapter this week?
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Will we have a chapter this week?
Most likely. Otherwise, we would've been informed that there won't be a chapter this week beforehand.
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Will we have a chapter this week?
It's only Tuesday..we got lucky last week. Patience is the key
I'm looking into tomorrow for some info. -
@bongstazor:
Nami's punches are punches of LOVE! Luffy only get big bumps and stuff on his head from people who punches and loves him. Just like how Garp gave him many bumps on his forehead when he went to wake him up after the Enes Lobby arc!
Love isn't haki.
Punches of love, punches for the sake of punches, whatever it is, it's just comic relief. ^^;
-waits for someone to argue that love is indeed haki-
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It's only Tuesday..we got lucky last week. Patience is the key
I'm looking into tomorrow for some info.No it's ok!I just wanted to be sure!
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@bongstazor:
Nami's punches are punches of LOVE! Luffy only get big bumps and stuff on his head from people who punches and loves him. Just like how Garp gave him many bumps on his forehead when he went to wake him up after the Enes Lobby arc!
it's "punches from the heart" in namis case and has nothing to do with love (love for money at most).
the punches that garp threw at luffy were out of love but i also consider him strong enough to give him bumps even without putting a 'lil love in his fists :)
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… ... ... ... ... ... ... ...it's the mucus that bites us! 
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Greg, I'm thinking that its just intense incompetence on the part of Sengoku and his band of merry idiots. I mean, look at the track record of the Marines throughout the entire series; it doesn't inspire much confidence. (Truth be told, the entire organization needs a purging of corrupt officials and assclowns, but that's for a different thread.)
The devil is in the details and right now Sengoku is too busy focusing on macro-issues of the upcoming war with WB (Shichibukai/Jinbei, Admirals, where he's going to attack) to pay attention to weird travel requests.
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it's "punches from the heart" in namis case and has nothing to do with love (love for money at most).
the punches that garp threw at luffy were out of love but i also consider him strong enough to give him bumps even without putting a 'lil love in his fists :)
I get it now!!!
Nami's love of money and tangerines is actually a form of haki that gives her the power to predict the weather which is also a form of haki that giver her the power to give punches from the heart which is also an form of haki and haki, heart and love are all connected therefore she must love Luffy!!!!
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It just rubs me the wrong way. The weight of what's going down is something that's going to change the world. All the more reason he should be anal retentive about getting everyone exactly where they need to be well in advance.
I agree for the most part. I mean ultimately we can assume that Hancock was able to give them the "either, or" statement as leverage to get the permission; her "conditions". Momonga makes it fairly clear that getting the WG to agree to the terms was a little bit painful*, and states that even with permission they won't have much time. Now, if you think about the greater need here, we can conclude that the greater need would be to have Hancock join the WG after a short stop at Impel Down rather than Hancock not joining at all because the WG demanded that she come straight to Marineford. It works out ok, because like I said, if Whitebeard plans to attack Marineford at all, it wont be until Ace arrives there. Attacking there at any other time would be pointless, as Whitebeard would end up capturing a city for no reason while the WG just wouldn't bring Ace. So while I agree that, given the weight of the situation, they should be anal about getting everyone there and ready, Oda made it clear that Hancock had special permission – due to the need of getting her on board the war front -- that was wrangled free and only for a short amount of time.
The later news about Whitebeard attacking from anywhere doesn't change this. Now that Sengoku knows Whitebeard could attack from anywhere it only makes her location even more convenient since she might be able to "help" if there was an early attack on Impel Down. So, personally, I feel that Oda covered his bases well. In the end though, I would still like to see her reasons – if any, outside a spoiled demand -- for wanting to stop, and I think there is a good chance it will be stated when she arrives. Without a valid reason given (from Hancock), I completely agree that the WG should be extremely suspicious of her desire to stop. Due to that reason, however, I think she must have given them a decent excuse for wanting to stop by, and I think it will be addressed by Momonga again between here and Impel Down. If it isn't stated, and the WG isn't shown to be suspicious, then I will be disappointed. Not as thoroughly as if Oda didn't point out what he did this chapter (everything I have presented), but disappointed all the same.
- Here is the quote:
@Stephen's:
Momonga: "If you're still looking to stop by the prison Impel Down, then I managed to wrangle permission from above. Normally, pirates like the Seven Armed Seas aren't allowed anywhere near the place, but I got special clearance for now. We can't stay long, however."
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I get it now!!!
Nami's love of money and tangerines is actually a form of haki that gives her the power to predict the weather which is also a form of haki that giver her the power to give punches from the heart which is also an form of haki and haki, heart and love are all connected therefore she must love Luffy!!!!
Absolutely. Now excuse me while I bake some Haki cupcakes as a reward for that brilliant observation. You've totally changed my life; I no longer want to be a migrant worker ex-con now that I've seen the light and come back to the almighty Haki.
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Considering that oda has joked about it enough times in the SBSs and explained how… The weakest members of the crew, according to Oda are still Nami, Usopp and Chopper. The strongest are still Luffy, Zoro and Sanji. Everyone else is in the middle.
Its pointless fans arguing when the Mangaka has established this long ago. What do we need to recap in TB where it was stated or something?
im sorry things like this bothers the shit out of but since when did he ever talk about the strength of the crew members from top to bottom except for certain individuals.i believe he never created or talked about a tier or whatever you call it for the crew and in my opinion i dont think he cares who he makes stronger and again for certain individuals.
if you have cant post a link cause i really dont remember.wait since when was this stated in thriller bark
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The later news about Whitebeard attacking from anywhere doesn't change this. Now that Sengoku knows Whitebeard could attack from anywhere it only makes her location even more convenient since she might be able to "help" if there was an early attack on Impel Down. So, personally, I feel that Oda covered his bases well. In the end though, I would still like to see her reasons – if any, outside a spoiled demand -- for wanting to stop, and I think there is a good chance it will be stated when she arrives. Without a valid reason given (from Hancock), I completely agree that the WG should be extremely suspicious of her desire to stop. Due to that reason, however, I think she must have given them a decent excuse for wanting to stop by, and I think it will be addressed by Momonga again between here and Impel Down. If it isn't stated, and the WG isn't shown to be suspicious, then I will be disappointed. Not as thoroughly as if Oda didn't point out what he did this chapter (everything I have presented), but disappointed all the same.
I definitely see where your coming from Brennen. One thing I find interesting is that when Sengoku is informed that Boa gave in…the marine mentioned that they are heading there (to where Sengoku is) not to Impel Down.......why wasn't this mentioned? Wouldn't Sengoku already know where she is headed?
Makes me think that the timelines are switched and MAYBE Momonga was given the okay AFTER the Marines realize that WB could be attacking Impel Down....I am not too sure about this but it is a theory....
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@Pirate_King_Sage:
One thing I find interesting is that when Sengoku is informed that Boa gave in…the marine mentioned that they are heading there (to where Sengoku is) not to Impel Down.
Very true. I didn't really consider that. I would just assume that when Momonga said "from above", he wasn't necessarily referring to Sengoku. Just "someone" higher up on the ladder.
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I know Nami is considered weak and all, but if she learns anything from these weather folk, she could be a real weather witch. I just hope Dance Powder does not have some sort of connection here….
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Come on guys. Take Moria and your other arguments elsewhere. We don't want the thread closed because of your little disputes.
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Meh, it's not like there's anything else to talk about. Might as well have a healthy debate while we're at it.
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I for one don't want to read a boring argument that has nothing to do with this thread. You can't take it to PMs?
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@Luffy Batter: I disagree. Push too much and the thread will get locked. I myself have a post that I expect will get a response from the person I quoted. I know there are others. Discussion isn't completely dead, and even if it were that wouldn't warrant off-topic and outdated arguments. If you must though, pick a thread:
- Official Shichibukai Thread
- Crocodile and Moria Respect Thread
- Oz + Moria: The Greatest Combination
- The future of Moria, Absolom, and Hogback
- Geck Moria: A tragic character at heart
- Dude, It's the Moria-Kaidou-Luffy Thread
- Gecko Moria: Luffy's first true rival
- Any Chapter Thread that had Moria in it
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