@Vanessa:
Read chapter 434.
Whitebeard: …heheh...
Gurarararara!!
The little snot-nosed boy has learned to talk like a man!
His crime is the most unforgivable on a pirate ship.
"Mate-killing"!! He has broken the cast-iron law.
Even the biggest fool on my ships is still my son.
And where will that poor murdered son's soul go without retribution...?!
You can't be allowed to go your own way in this world,
without a sense of dignity, and humanity.
Now is it MY responsibility
to show Teach how that works...!!!
Now WB didn't said he wants BB dead. He wants to teach him a lesson. And he wants to show him what it means to live without any sense of dignitiy and humanity. And if teach was killed by BB what was the point of that speach? Do WB believe that after death BBS soul will aknowledge that what he did was wrong and will try to become a better soul in dimension alpha xy? :) Not a good argument i say…
Plenty of people in One Piece have died in the past. Now when exactly did these fights between the Roger and Whitebeard Pirates occur?
The past.
And even with that logic you can't be sure. So the best answer is "we don't know!".
Either way, by the reasoning above are you gonna include characters like Garp then?
Garp indeed supports all that and close his eyes to the abominations happening in the world where he clearly can do something about it. I hope he will say something about it soon or later. I can understand that a man alone can't go against such a system but you can still quit like Saul. But garp isn't the worst. He didn't leave to fight rayleigh alone which somehow helped the SHs. On the other hand he had no problems in killing the whole SH crew with that giant ball. If you want to blame some people in the marines the absolute justice followers are the one who have not problems in killing innocent people just to get rid of some pirates or people the WG doesn't like.
You might argument that the world government may directly be responsible to what happens inside ID and that the guards and officers are just controlled by the WG. If yes why is ID so proud that they don't let the marines help them when they're in trouble. I mean it seems like they handle their shit alone and don't want anyone to get involved with what they do in there. I'm here saying that they have their own way of dealing with their problems so they decide who gets in and who not. The marines give them prisoners they keep them "safe" in ID and unless the marines need these prisoners later ID can do whatever they want with them.
@wolfwood:
But on the other hand i can see the view point where all life is holy as valid and absolutly the most desireable. But when dealing with the likes of Croc i dont see respecting them and hoping they respond in kind as a valid way of getting things done. When you show any kind of weakness or let your guard down they will strike.
You got my point. But i go even further by saying that killing and torturing is among the worst thing you can do. They are all humans regardless of what they did. Do you think that people who torture really don't like doing it? If they don't like doing it why are they even doing it? Here i quote iSheep.
@iSheep:
I wonder why Impel Down even tortures prisoners. Where is the point? If they did so terrible things that they deserve such a heavy punishment, just kill them. It isn't like this helps anyone. The only thing a prison should be responsible for is keeping his prisoners locked.
Exactly. If they don't like doing evil things just for the sake of it they will not do it. If they value human lifes they will not end in torturing and killing prisoners. And the ultimative question remains wolfwood: What do you gain from killing the one who murdered a lot of people? It doesn't bring back anyone. And croc for example. Do you think he will beg for life if he is sentenced to death? Do you think he suffers pain from the torture? Do you think that it made him a good guy at the end? No. He is the same as back then at alabasta. So torture is inefficient. There is no excuse for such a pointless thing. And right now ID as great as it is will certainly be crushed. So what was the point of all this?
Nah i think he just blisterd of a couple of pieces of their skin with his nerve toxin, yknow the one that can be cured.
My question. Why do they need to cure prisoners who are already at level 6 which is a level they're on to be forgotten. You argued that they deserve what they get at ID. So why even care if they die? Do you also think ID has so much anti poison to cure the prisoners that were poisoned by magellan in the "escape chapters" lately?
@V-time:
Both of your arguement have points but i think you forget just a tiny little thing : One Piece does in no way represent the modern day society we live in. It rather is comparable to maybe 15th - 16th century Earth where to be frank torture was more or less accepted. After this little tidbit lets get into the arguement.
First thing are the guards in ID evil (especially concerning Hannyabel) :
In this case i have to agree with Vanessa and Wolfwood that i would not consider Hannyabel evil. First the whole torture point is mood if you take the point of view back to 15th century onwards instead of looking it from a moder day society point of view since it was accepted in the time OP plays in.
Torture is evil now in the 21th century but if i do it in the 15th century it is ok… Are you serious? They're messing with lives here. It doesn't matter if you are in the 10th or the 42th century. There is no point in doing it. How can you use the "it was normal back then" to excuse it? Does it makes torture better when you know that many people do it in your town?
Next point is that there might be innocents who gets the short-end of the stick. I can only say here that it is not the guards duty to check whether some are innocent or not and its not likely Hannyabel ever met an innocent prisoner face to face so he might doubt his actions. And again if you move the timeline accordingly getting tortured was like normal business back then (whether this is horrible or not doesn´t matter since it was the custom back then and thus has nothing to do with a guard being evil) so it is not worse than someone being in prison for crimes he didn´t commit in these days.
It pauls Dad and Mom used to kill people by raping and burning them so why should little paul feel guilty why should he even question this… You can't be serious.
On your last point that he (Hannyabal) commands the likes of and Saldeath. honestly i haven´t seen once in the manga yet where they did torture anyone who wasn´t in line for it and even if they did i doubt Hannyabel or any officer back then would have bat an eyeleash for some of the worst prisoners. And yet again torture was custom back then .
See above. You can't get away with the excuse "i thought it is normal to burn people"
Also are you serious about suggestion to create a new system? Do you think they have the power to do that without the approval of the government? And also how should he know whats going on in the world? His only link outside is probably a direct line to the WG to announce new prisoners coming in and/or feeding them their story of incedents that happened not a very reliable source i guess. Its not like you are able to acces any news that didn´t come from the WG without chatting with either a pirate/villager/revolutionary and i doubt you have such a coloumn in the papers back then. Also you wouldn´t listen to convicted people either would you ( in a sense of fully believing them)?
So your argument is that they believing the WGs propaganda and know nothing else so they can get away with it? What is about the innocent lifes they might end? Just a little side effect, i guess, by your argumentation. You can't say you just followed the system and get away with it when you are responsible for killing people. It's not like Hannyabal and Magellan are idiots.
In short what i want to say that the WG acts more along the lines of protecting themselves rather than protecting the people they should protect. This is meant for the general course of the WG so Garp/Aokiji/Coby/Smoker/Coby etc. are kinda exceptions to this.
The whole thing about Robin shows this the best. They smoke her island because they can read some ancient language. They give her a bounty with some fake reason because she can read a language that might be dangerous for them. And they threaten her friends to make herself a sacrifce and to lock her up (or worse) without any trial because she is able to read a goddamn language. This has nothing to do with protecting the people at all this is pure self-presavation. If you think about it a minute how the hell do they know what the porneglyphs are saying or whether they pose a threat at all. Hell they even allow slaves just not to piss of the World Nobles and to preserve their ass.
I completely agree.
This window was open for at least two hours 8D <-procrastinating much?</w<;>
