Chapter 734: "Rommel's Whirlwind"

[Monquito]

@Maju:

she reacted to the attack and moved so that the attack would hit her on the helm,the part that was protected,instead than on thebody like with everybody else.

sleeping is the condition for hakuba to come out,you say you can't count a character without his fruit,but at the same way you can ignore the fact that him felling asleep was part of the power

for luffy,look back at water 7,when he is stuck between two buildings and just destroy them both without his fruit to free himself.

she didn'd moved to be punched in the helmet, she tried her best to avoid the total atack and failed. her CoO isn't that good.
and I'm not ignoring Cavendish's sleep condition, I'm actually saying that was too ridiculous froim Oda to make Becca win.

and Luffy's power are all the time activated, he's a gum gum guy, when he smashes something while using Kairouseki then you can say he can destroy buildings without his power.

[O baba]

@Monquito:

this isn't pokemon and Barto's block was Barto>Elizabelo>fodders

or who's that incredible man who could surpass barto's barrier and defeat him?? I didn't see him nowhere.

Bellamy was going to beat Barto because he passed the barrier and grabbed barto

[DARK_RITUAL]

@King:

Sabo's comment implies that he can't, or else he wouldn't be that impressed by Hakuba.

And Burgess doesn't really scream speedster. I guess he just tanks everything, so he has no reason to be fast.

Sabo comment implies that Hakuba is real fast, not if he can or can't move as fast as Hakuba.

[O baba]

@Kaizoku_Ou:

Saying it now! Trébol has the Mercury(quicksilver) Mercury no mi, a logia-class :ninja:
lol but it could be glue or mucus(yicks)

I think it obvious he is the snot logia , why do you mention mercury? He doens't behave like mercury at all…

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Spam286:

But would he have won without the king punch? Can't really say. Would Rebecca have won without Hakuba? Can't really say.

yes Barto would've won without king punch, well to me. Every guy who came close to him got an asswhop(Hack, Bellamy)

[RamistaR]

@Monquito:

she didn'd moved to be punched in the helmet, she tried her best to avoid the total atack and failed. her CoO isn't that good.
and I'm not ignoring Cavendish's sleep condition, I'm actually saying that was too ridiculous froim Oda to make Becca win.

and Luffy's power are all the time activated, he's a gum gum guy, when he smashes something while using Kairouseki then you can say he can destroy buildings without his power.

Gum gum guy or not, being made of rubber doesn't strengthen you.

[moud]

@Maju:

nobody said she was the strongest.
that doesn't make her less of a winner.
in a battle royale is the one who survives that takes the victory,not the strongest

exactly , that's why they call it luck

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Myu:

The reason Burgess is 1st Division Commander is he is the only fighter in BB's four people core. I don't know how strong he will be at the end of the series but I think right now Shiliew could give him a run for his money. I would say Diamante and Burgess is at the same level as a fighter. That makes Burgess strong but he isn't such a beast that would succeed beating Luffy or Sabo. Considering Sabo is as strong as Luffy if still not stronger.

maybe he's 1st Division Commander because he was BB first crewmate or must trustworthy mate. Burgess, I see him as Franky opponent when they clash with Strawhats.

[Schabrak]

@Monquito:

she didn'd moved to be punched in the helmet, she tried her best to avoid the total atack and failed. her CoO isn't that good.

Or she simply wasn't fast enough. It doesn't need to have anything to do with a "bad" CoO skill, which she was praised for like half a dozen times already.

@moud:

exactly , that's why they call it luck

Does it have to be one of the two? Can't it simply be both skill and a bit of luck?

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Monquito:

she didn't avoid Hakuba's atack at all, and after being punched in the face felt almost unconscious while the one who did everything advantageously for her felt asleep and did't wake up until Gatz declare Becca as the offical winner, her victory can't be more forced than that.

and Luffy always use his gum gum power to destroy buildings, even in Arlong Park uses his fruit. when he loses his power he bleed pretty much easy.

If Luffy loses his Devilfruit then the only thing he will lose if stretching and immunity to blunt pain.

[Monquito]

@Maju:

she reacted to the attack and moved so that the attack would hit her on the helm,the part that was protected,instead than on thebody like with everybody else.

sleeping is the condition for hakuba to come out,you say you can't count a character without his fruit,but at the same way you can ignore the fact that him felling asleep was part of the power

for luffy,look back at water 7,when he is stuck between two buildings and just destroy them both without his fruit to free himself.

Oh look it's a psycho killer!!! I can avoid it with my CoO but I'm gonna leave him punch me in the face, that be fun!!
it that your logic??? woww

And noope, his power are ALL THE TIME activated, he used his gum gum powers to free himself.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@O:

Bellamy was going to beat Barto because he passed the barrier and grabbed barto

the guy who was already bleeding from all over his body?? yeaah, he's awsome.

[DARK_RITUAL]

@O:

Bellamy was going to beat Barto because he passed the barrier and grabbed barto

No! Bellamy only figured how to pass Barto barrier, that doesn't mean he would've been able to beat Barto.

[Monquito]

@RamistaR:

Gum gum guy or not, being made of rubber doesn't strengthen you.

it does in shonen, it even makes you faster(second gear)

[Maju]

@Monquito:

she didn'd moved to be punched in the helmet, she tried her best to avoid the total atack and failed. her CoO isn't that good.
and I'm not ignoring Cavendish's sleep condition, I'm actually saying that was too ridiculous froim Oda to make Becca win.

and Luffy's power are all the time activated, he's a gum gum guy, when he smashes something while using Kairouseki then you can say he can destroy buildings without his power.

sabo said she saw the attack and reacted.
i prefer to believe what the character says in the manga ,and sabo clearly said that she wasn't lucky

about luffy…every increase to his physical strenght comes from elasticity or gears, being rubber doesn't make him any stronger by itself..and in that moment he didn't stretch,and gears were not yet introduced...so that was pure physical strenght with nothing to do with his fruit.

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

@DARK_RITUAL:

No! Bellamy only figured how to pass Barto barrier, that doesn't mean he would've been able to beat Barto.

but it's possible..he was ready to start his counterattack when the king punch arrived

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Monquito:

Oh look it's a psycho killer!!! I can avoid it with my CoO but I'm gonna leave him punch me in the face, that be fun!!
it that your logic??? woww

And noope, his power are ALL THE TIME activated, he used his gum gum powers to free himself.

nope,her logic was "i can't move fast enough to completely avoid him,but i can barely move to get hit in a place where i'm protected".doens't see to me that difficult to understand

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Monquito:

Oh look it's a psycho killer!!! I can avoid it with my CoO but I'm gonna leave him punch me in the face, that be fun!!
it that your logic??? woww

And noope, his power are ALL THE TIME activated, he used his gum gum powers to free himself.

like guy above said, gum gum fruit doesn't give strength and Luffy used strength to pull the buildings apart.

[RamistaR]

@Monquito:

Oh look it's a psycho killer!!! I can avoid it with my CoO but I'm gonna leave him punch me in the face, that be fun!!
it that your logic??? woww

And noope, his power are ALL THE TIME activated, he used his gum gum powers to free himself.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

the guy who was already bleeding from all over his body?? yeaah, he's awsome.

"Bellamy being awesome" has been definitively enough discussed.

it does in shonen, it even makes you faster(second gear)

Maybe I get it wrong, but I think that being a rubber man only prevents his veins from exploding when he increases the speed of his blood flow

[Maju]

@moud:

exactly , that's why they call it luck

except it was not,and it's even stated in this chapter.
physical strenght it's not the only quality someone may possess

[Monquito]

@Maju:

sabo said she saw the attack and reacted.
i prefer to believe what the character says in the manga ,and sabo clearly said that she wasn't lucky

about luffy…every increase to his physical strenght comes from elasticity or gears, being rubber doesn't make him any stronger by itself..and in that moment he didn't stretch,and gears were not yet introduced...so that was pure physical strenght with nothing to do with his fruit.

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

but it's possible..he was ready to start his counterattack when the king punch arrived

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

nope,her logic was "i can't move fast enough to completely avoid him,but i can barely move to get hit in a place where i'm protected.doens't see to me that difficult to understand

yeah she saw it and reacted, but she wasn't faster enough to avoid it. and Dofla says she was lucky, I'm going to believe what a character in the manga says too.

and nope nope and nope, he doesn't need to strecht to punch anyone, we saw that in Jaya agains Bellamy and he still beat him with his gum gum body.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@RamistaR:

"Bellamy being awesome" has been definitively enough discussed.

obvious sarcasm is obvious.

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Maju:

but it's possible..he was ready to start his counterattack when the king punch arrived

Well the possibility is there(50/50) but to me there was no possibility of Bellamy beating Barto if there was no king punch. Bellamy was already bleeding and in pain, and he can't beat Barto by grabbing him, he would still need to add more force to throw a punch or kick which Barto will just block again.

[moud]

@Schabrak:

Does it have to be one of the two? Can't it simply be both skill and a bit of luck?

it's as you said , still she won't have that bit of luck every fight specially at the final

@Maju:

except it was not,and it's even stated in this chapter.
physical strenght it's not the only quality someone may possess

i agree , but will she win like that every time ?! if not , then that was luck

[Maju]

@Monquito:

yeah she saw it and reacted, but she wasn't faster enough to avoid it. and Dofla says she was lucky, I'm going to believe what a character in the manga says too.

yeah,let's believe to the one is clearly mocking king riku about his grandaughter and not the one who had no reason to not say it was luck if that was the case

and nope nope and nope, he doesn't need to strecht to punch anyone, we saw that in Jaya agains Bellamy and he still beat him with his gum gum body.
.

what are you talking about?:wassat:

i repeat what i said since it seems you didn't understand.

the gomu-gomu no mi doens't make you stronger,it's clearly stated in the manga

still,luffy can use it to increase the power of his attacks,either by stretching himself,using the elastic propeperties of rubber to accellerate his fists ,aumenting the strenght of the attacks,or by using gears to basically use doping .

at that time, gears were not yet introduced,and he didn't stretch since he wasn't in the position to do so..so when he destroyed those two buildings,that was just his physical strenght,something he would have even without his fruit.

it's the same reason why i say that luffy may be the worst opponent for teach…at long rage he can still attack and move much faster that blackbeard using the gears and stretching..and at close range,even without his powers luffy can still dig a knuckle in teach's face (like he did with bellamy as you already said,or caesar too)

[DARK_RITUAL]

@moud:

exactly , that's why they call it luck

If you talking about Rebecca then NO it wasn't luck that she won. Sabo specifically said it wasn't luck.

[Maju]

@moud:

i agree , but will she win like that every time ?! if not , then that was luck

barto would probably not win if there's a rematch and people know about his power in advance.

[Hudell]

The coliseum will fall apart and Rebecca will be the only one standing on what is left of it

[Maju]

@DARK_RITUAL:

Well the possibility is there(50/50) but to me there was no possibility of Bellamy beating Barto if there was no king punch. Bellamy was already bleeding and in pain, and he can't beat Barto by grabbing him, he would still need to add more force to throw a punch or kick which Barto will just block again.

well bellamy has the power of springs..suddenly increase speed and force of impact it's what his fruit is made for

[Mostnamed]

oh lol, re-reading chapters is fun.
http://img.batoto.net/comics/2013/08/02/o/read51fc01c0e0bbf/img000017.png

didn't realize what he meant when he said "That" person.

Oh and seems like his barrier is really strong.
when it resisted elizabelos punch, luffy commented about the strength of the punch saying that he has never seen a punch as powerful as that.

[moud]

@DARK_RITUAL:

If you talking about Rebecca then NO it wasn't luck that she won. Sabo specifically said it wasn't luck.

well i disagree with sabo , if he doesn't mind

@Maju:

barto would probably not win if there's a rematch and people know about his power in advance.

how did you come up with this conclusion ?

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Maju:

barto would probably not win if there's a rematch and people know about his power in advance.

He will definitely win again. What can they do? Gang on him then grab and throw him off? Or start a sumo wrestling with him?

See, from what we've seen or atleast Oda have shown us so far, to pass Barto barrier you don't need to use force(ex: Bellamy casually grabbing him) but if you don't use force that means you can't beat him, you get it?

[wolfwood]

Sure was incredibly lucky that she was skilled, experienced and capable enough to see and dodge his attacks.

[RamistaR]

@DARK_RITUAL:

If you talking about Rebecca then NO it wasn't luck that she won. Sabo specifically said it wasn't luck.

Exactly! Anyway we shall have all the time to gauge her strength and luck when she will be in the crew…Or not! Yeeaaah!

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Maju:

well bellamy has the power of springs..suddenly increase speed and force of impact it's what his fruit is made for

Force of impact? Won't Barto just block it again? In fact Bellamy fruit seems to be the worst to use against Barto fruit since Bellamy is not rubber/immune to blunt damage.

[Maju]

@moud:

how did you come up with this conclusion ?

pretty much whoever was beated by barto didn't know about his power and din't know how to attack him,damaging themelves as thhey tried to attack barto..then when finally bellamy found an opening,the king punch arrived…
also,elizabello's "army" would probably gang up against barto since he was the only one capable to survive the king punch

[Monquito]

@Maju:

yeah,let's believe to the one is clearly mocking king riku about his grandaughter and not the one who had no reason to not say it was luck if that was the case
what are you talking about?:wassat:

i repeat what i said since it seems you didn't understand.

the gomu-gomu no mi doens't make you stronger,it's clearly stated in the manga

still,luffy can use it to increase the power of his attacks,either by stretching himself,using the elastic propeperties of rubber to accellerate his fists ,aumenting the strenght of the attacks,or by using gears to basically use doping .

at that time, gears were not yet introduced,and he didn't stretch since he wasn't in the position to do so..so when he destroyed those two buildings,that was just his physical strenght,something he would have even without his fruit.

it's the same reason why i say that luffy may be the worst opponent for teach…at long rage he can still attack and move much faster that blackbeard using the gears and stretching..and at close range,even without his powers luffy can still dig a knuckle in teach's face (like he did with bellamy as you already said,or caesar too)

Hakuba's atack happened in less than 2 seconds, she coulnd't figure out all that stuff about being punched in the helm could save her since she saw how ricky get his helm all cracked by a simple kick. she tried to completly avoid Hakuba's atack and failed.

and Luffy is made of rubber aaaaaaallllllllll the time, put a block then put a rubber on it and then smash the rubber with another block, is not like the rubber's gonna "break" or anything, Luffy totally used his rubber condition to get out of there.
Luffy without his rubber condition could get all of his organs messed up with being stuck in there. ​is just that simple.

[DARK_RITUAL]

@moud:

well i disagree with sabo , if he doesn't mind

Sabo = Oda at that moment, so you disagree with the writer. Umm ok!

[Maju]

@DARK_RITUAL:

He will definitely win again. What can they do? Gang on him then grab and throw him off? Or start a sumo wrestling with him?

See, from what we've seen or atleast Oda have shown us so far, to pass Barto barrier you don't need to use force(ex: Bellamy casually grabbing him) but if you don't use force that means you can't beat him, you get it?

actually,i just think that bellamy just bassed around the barrier..his barrier is just like a glass panel in fron on him,if you take him from the side,you can attack him without problems..at least if he can only set up one barrier at the time..at the moment we don't know how many he can create.

[DARK_RITUAL]

@RamistaR:

Exactly! Anyway we shall have all the time to gauge her strength and luck when she will be in the crew…Or not! Yeeaaah!

She not joining the crew. Rebecca may not have the strength but she definitely has the speed/reflex.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@Monquito:

Luffy without his rubber condition could get all of his organs messed up with being stuck in there. ​is just that simple.

Luffy without his rubber body/condition would've never gotten stuck in there in the first place.

[RamistaR]

@DARK_RITUAL:

Sabo = Oda at that moment, so you disagree with the writer. Umm ok!

Know one doe's disagree with you on this point. The whole issue is about Luffy being strong without devil fruit, just as Zoro and Sanji.

Luffy without his rubber body/condition would've never gotten stuck in there in the first place.

Damn you were faster than me on this one.

[wolfwood]

This is entirely the same kind of stupidity that followed Sanji vs Doffy and Zoro vs purple guy.

Two almost identical scenes, that follow the same formula, that get treated like they were night and day.

Fan wank at it's finest, one does not need to worry about the actual manga, or the authors intent. Fan wank trumps all right guys?

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Maju:

actually,i just think that bellamy just bassed around the barrier..his barrier is just like a glass panel in fron on him,if you take him from the side,you can attack him without problems..at least if he can only set up one barrier at the time..at the moment we don't know how many he can create.

Barto just threw a barrier at King Elizabeth, so I'm sure Barto can dissolve and create another barrier at any angle.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@RamistaR:

Know one doe's disagree with you on this point. The whole issue is about Luffy being strong without devil fruit, just as Zoro and Sanji.

Luffy would just be another and even better Garp.

Damn you were faster than me on this one.

you gotta keep up bro. Lol

[Maju]

@Monquito:

Hakuba's atack happened in less than 2 seconds, she coulnd't figure out all that stuff about being punched in the helm could save her since she saw how ricky get his helm all cracked by a simple kick. she tried to completly avoid Hakuba's atack and failed.

that's exactly what makes her victory not just luck…
sure,she is not strong physically,but she is extremely good and what she trained to do,dodge attacks..so good that she managed to do what every other fighter in the arena could not.

and Luffy is made of rubber aaaaaaallllllllll the time, put a block then put a rubber on it and then smash the rubber with another block, is not like the rubber's gonna "break" or anything, Luffy totally used his rubber condition to get out of there.

what this has to do with anything?it was luffy who destroyed the buildings,not the buildings that tried to squash luffy XD
**> Luffy without his rubber condition could get all of his organs messed up with being stuck in there. ​is just that simple.

even if true (to me it seemed like there was barely the space for one normal personn there,it's not likeluffy was being squashed by the buildings,he was just stuck…...what has this to do with the fact that he destroyed the buildings?ò_ò

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

@DARK_RITUAL:

Barto just threw a barrier at King Elizabeth, so I'm sure Barto can dissolve and create another barrier at any angel.

but it's a battle royale..what if two guys attack him from two different sides?**

[DARK_RITUAL]

@wolfwood:

This is entirely the same kind of stupidity that followed Sanji vs Doffy and Zoro vs purple guy.

Two almost identical scenes, that follow the same formula, that get treated like they were night and day.

Fan wank at it's finest, one does not need to worry about the actual manga, or the authors intent. Fan wank trumps all right guys?

Why not? no way their favorite character can be that inferior.

[Monquito]

@DARK_RITUAL:

She not joining the crew. Rebecca may not have the strength but she definitely has the speed/reflex.

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

Luffy without his rubber body/condition would've never gotten stuck in there in the first place.

So I'm right in the end, Luffy with his rubber condition could get stuck basically everywhere and then get out of there with it.

without it he could even die for not getting enough air for his lungs.

[moud]

@Maju:

pretty much whoever was beated by barto didn't know about his power and din't know how to attack him,damaging themelves as thhey tried to attack barto..then when finally bellamy found an opening,the king punch arrived…
also,elizabello's "army" would probably gang up against barto since he was the only one capable to survive the king punch

these are all assumptions based on nothing may or may not happen also you're forgetting that he won with no effort
we still don't know what he can really do .. she on the other hand fall to the ground by one hit from hakuba
and could barely stand up !! come on , there's no comparison

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Maju:

but it's a battle royale..what if two guys attack him from two different sides?

Exactly, it's a battle royal full of pirates and bunch of New world crooks, they will never work together unless you gonna pay 'em.

[Maju]

@DARK_RITUAL:

Force of impact? Won't Barto just block it again? In fact Bellamy fruit seems to be the worst to use against Barto fruit since Bellamy is not rubber/immune to blunt damage.

bellamy already had him in his grasp..any other barrier is useless..

[Monquito]

@Maju:

that's exactly what makes her victory not just luck…
sure,she is not strong physically,but she is extremely good and what she trained to do,dodge attacks..so good that she managed to do what every other fighter in the arena could not.

Nope, she didn't dodge it, she tried but failed.

[RamistaR]

@Monquito:

So I'm right in the end, Luffy with his rubber condition could get stuck basically everywhere and then get out of there with it.

without it he could even die for not getting enough air for his lungs.

And there is no question about that! Since he did not lose his power in the process, you can indeed say that Luffy got out of there with it.

[Maju]

@moud:

these are all assumptions based on nothing may or may not happen also you're forgetting that he won with no effort
we still don't know what he can really do .. she on the other hand fall to the ground by one hit from hakuba
and could barely stand up !! come on , there's no comparison

isn't that kinda the point ò_ò
we are talking about what would have happened if the fighters knew in advance about barto's powers..of course we are talking about assumptions

[DARK_RITUAL]

@Monquito:

So I'm right in the end, Luffy with his rubber condition could get stuck basically everywhere and then get out of there with it.

Luffy got stuck in-between those buildings because of his rubber body but he couldn't come out even with his rubber body, that's when he used physical strength which has nothing to do with his rubber body.

without it he could even die for not getting enough air for his lungs.

Still missing the point, he would've never gotten stuck in there without being rubber and with the force he used to flew there.

[Maju]

@Monquito:

So I'm right in the end, Luffy with his rubber condition could get stuck basically everywhere and then get out of there with it.

without it he could even die for not getting enough air for his lungs.

and what this has anything to do with the fact that we said that luffy is strong even without his fruit exactly? ò_ò

–- Update From New Post Merge ---

@DARK_RITUAL:

Exactly, it's a battle royal full of pirates and bunch of New world crooks, they will never work together unless you gonna pay 'em.

actually there was a team protecting elizabello..so here you have your collaboration.the power of money