Wonder what happened after Galan wrecked the shit out of everyone?
! Someone wrecked the shit out of Galan. :happy:
Wonder what happened after Galan wrecked the shit out of everyone?
! Someone wrecked the shit out of Galan. :happy:
Why does fairies needs coins?
Why does fairies needs coins?
Fairies help everyone, even the monsters of the forest… They are so naive!
Spoiler of ch 136
Starus: not confirmed
Source: FKS from redhawk, available at MH
! Okay, the spoilers came out earlier than usual, and it looks like the the guy's ID is the same as the one for the other spoilers. But the problem is whether we gotta believe them or not. :/ Well, as far as I'm concerned, I'm having a serious doubt about these.
! Original link: http://hello.2ch.net/test/read.cgi/wcomic/1437219213/580
! And the translation:
"Scattering fear."
! Galan tries to go after Meliodas and get even with him, but the others hold him in.
Then Zeldris orders to make pairs and oppress all of Britannia.
Zel: "This is not a war… It is an overrunning."
Then each duo spreads out but the "older brother" and Zel stay.
The "older brother" wishes to enjoy the atmosphere after 3000 years, and Zel says he goes ro do something nearby.
And the bird that was trying to land on the "older brother"'s arm… turns into a dirty firework.
! The mustached man and the half-naked woman raid a pleasure quarter,
and the four-armed giant and the octopus girl, Byzel.
! In the end, Meliodas provoked the Ten Commandments.
And their plan is to obliterate everywhere they are deployed in order to oppress every region.
The training duos come out in an order:
Hawk grows horns and has a back like a dragon.
Arthur has a mysterious lifeform on top of his head.
Griamore has turned into an infant, and Elizabeth… accomplished nothing.
End texts: "The results of her harsh training… are zero!? Chin up, Elizabeth!! Train harder, Elizabeth!!"
"The fear is spreading!! To be able to stop the invasion of Britannia by the Ten Commandments, they are taking this training… or so they were supposed to!!"
To be continued in chapter 137 / Between you and me.
! Let's wait and see.
! –---------- second spoiler:
! Well, there's another spoilers source: http://nanatunotaizai.blog.so-net.ne.jp/2015-08-14
The text essentially says the same thing as the first spoiler, expect it's missing the bird turning into a firework. Moreover, the red-light district part probably was a joke but I don't know about that.
! So, are the spoilers legit? If they are, then the other spoilers will very probably, too. After all, according to a comment on the BBS, the guy's ID was seen on other spoilers, and it's known that he also writes FT and UQ spoilers.
But let's not jump the gun here until the chapter comes out (or at least until the new spoilers are up if there are any). Yep, I'm wary as always.
Chapter is out and birds were used as gory fireworks.
Wonder how Escanor (at noon) would stack up to Melodias now? He was stronger than Melo before his power was restored, but now?
Meliodas just instigated a genocide on several cities. King has every right to get mad at him.
It's alright they can just wish them back with the Dragonbal- Oh wait.
Hawk is even more fugly than before -_-
And whats the deal with Griamore turning into a baby?
It's interesting every commandment has a law and a curse; it seems Galan can't be lied but he can't lie neither or he will incur his curse. Maybe he'd turned into stone too if he lies…
Hawk is even more fugly than before -_-
And whats the deal with Griamore turning into a baby?
Yeap, fugly fugly.
And Slader went from fearsome gay warrior to caring babysitter… wow!
@Fire Fist:
Wonder how Escanor (at noon) would stack up to Melodias now? He was stronger than Melo before his power was restored, but now?
Merlin said Escanor at max power easily surpasses any other Sin during vampires of Edinburgh. Melidoas still had his full power back then.
http://manga.redhawkscans.com/reader/read/the_seven_deadly_sins/en/0/136/page/1
Here is the link, so people can read it, at first I thought you were still talking about the spoilers or something
What the hell Mel and Elizabeth? This is not a game you know. Cell The Comandaments are killing people!
Meliodas just instigated a genocide on several cities. King has every right to get mad at him.
No way around it. The Ten Commanded would've began rampaging through Britannia anyhow, atleast now the Sins have a fighting chance.
Mel has a point. The Sins are in no shape to take the demos all at once, this way they are buying time.
It seems like an asshole thing to do since that means lots of people are going to die but after seeing how Galan alone manhandled them there was no other choice.
That law the TC have to obey is really something, because it seems the battles could be not only about heavy blows here and there. For instance, if the TC plans an strategy Galan can be forced to reveal it, or at least you can torture him to get it :ninja:. Maybe those laws will play a big role in the future battles.
I wonder what would be the other laws. And what is the story of these laws? Because it doesn't seems Mel has a similar law ruling him now (he's not a commandment).
I wonder if the thing Zeldris need to to nearby have somethig to do with Gelda.
And whats the deal with Griamore turning into a baby?
Apparantly a power up…
And yeah Nakaba new designs are strange. What kind of creature is Hawk. A dragon ? Meliodas seems to smile when he sees him so I think he knows something.
Hawk is in the initial stage of becoming the Man Bear Pig.
No way around it. The Ten Commanded would've began rampaging through Britannia anyhow, atleast now the Sins have a fighting chance.
The off thing is how its presented.
http://bato.to/read/_/338859/nanatsu-no-taizai_ch136_by_red-hawk-neo/16
Melodias gives his reasoning, and its layed out in a big panel of him brightly smiling - and after that, no one counters it. Hawk says he's ready to go, the conversation shifts. Unless subsequent chapters have people being insanely uncomfortable with this and bringing it up again, the manga reads as a complete endorsement of Melodias act; It was a wise move, he's not the slightest bit sorry about it, lets move on to something else.
When we know how much death this will lead to, the positive framing of Melodias here inadvertedly makes him look like a callous monster. When Piccolo provoked Buu into killing humanity, he at least acted sorry about it, and promised using the Dragon Balls on them later.
Of course, Melodias has always struck me as completely sociopathic, but thats only half as weird as whenever people/the story humor him.
Say, is the smaller island from that map supossed to be Ireland?
@Daz:
The off thing is how its presented.
http://bato.to/read/_/338859/nanatsu-no-taizai_ch136_by_red-hawk-neo/16
Melodias gives his reasoning, and its layed out in a big panel of him brightly smiling - and after that, no one counters it. Hawk says he's ready to go, the conversation shifts. Unless subsequent chapters have people being insanely uncomfortable with this and bringing it up again, the manga reads as a complete endorsement of Melodias act; It was a wise move, he's not the slightest bit sorry about it, lets move on to something else.When we know how much death this will lead to, the positive framing of Melodias here inadvertedly makes him look like a callous monster. When Piccolo provoked Buu into killing humanity, he at least acted sorry about it, and promised using the Dragon Balls on them later.
Of course, Melodias has always struck me as completely sociopathic, but thats only half as weird as whenever people/the story humor him.
It doesn't bother me. It's just the least bad option argument. So he's happy to find a strategy against the TC. Otherwise it would be a hopeless situation to the humanity.
@Daz:
The off thing is how its presented.
http://bato.to/read/_/338859/nanatsu-no-taizai_ch136_by_red-hawk-neo/16
Melodias gives his reasoning, and its layed out in a big panel of him brightly smiling - and after that, no one counters it. Hawk says he's ready to go, the conversation shifts. Unless subsequent chapters have people being insanely uncomfortable with this and bringing it up again, the manga reads as a complete endorsement of Melodias act; It was a wise move, he's not the slightest bit sorry about it, lets move on to something else.When we know how much death this will lead to, the positive framing of Melodias here inadvertedly makes him look like a callous monster. When Piccolo provoked Buu into killing humanity, he at least acted sorry about it, and promised using the Dragon Balls on them later.
Of course, Melodias has always struck me as completely sociopathic, but thats only half as weird as whenever people/the story humor him.
Well the other option resulting in humanity is completely destroyed anyway, what was a good solution ?
You're completely missing my point guys. Its not about how sound the strategy is or "the needs of the many" etc, its about how Melodias is presented as he gives his strategy- brightly smiling, with not a single empathic fuck to spare for the people currently being murdered in the countryside.
"We needed to seperate the enemy, so I provoked them. I know tonnes of civilians will die because of this, but thats a sacrifice we need to make, for the greater good"
Has biggest, brightest, doofiest most carefree smile on his face as he says this
Topic of dying civilians dropped in its entirety
Well, lets suppose in the future he manages to stop the TC with, say, 10000 persons killed: what difference would it make if he smiles brightly now or not?
…It would portray him as an empathic individual the readers can better root for, as he would at least act like he acknowledges the extremely dire consequences of his actions? As opposed to being completely tone-deaf upbeat?
Picture watching a movie where the protagonist initiates a strategy, which though logically sound, is currently claiming thousands of innocent lives as its price. And while the protagonist explains said strategy, theres upbeat music, an optimistic atmosphere, and it segues directly into comic relief.
@Daz:
The off thing is how its presented.
http://bato.to/read/_/338859/nanatsu-no-taizai_ch136_by_red-hawk-neo/16
Melodias gives his reasoning, and its layed out in a big panel of him brightly smiling - and after that, no one counters it. Hawk says he's ready to go, the conversation shifts. Unless subsequent chapters have people being insanely uncomfortable with this and bringing it up again, the manga reads as a complete endorsement of Melodias act; It was a wise move, he's not the slightest bit sorry about it, lets move on to something else.When we know how much death this will lead to, the positive framing of Melodias here inadvertedly makes him look like a callous monster. When Piccolo provoked Buu into killing humanity, he at least acted sorry about it, and promised using the Dragon Balls on them later.
Of course, Melodias has always struck me as completely sociopathic, but thats only half as weird as whenever people/the story humor him.
I'm sure we will have king pointing to how messed up that is soon enough and Elizabeth just arrived. Like you said Melio has always been kind of a smiling sociopath and the sins are not really filled with virtious people(expect King, Diane).
Am I the only one worried about Arthur?
@Daz:
…It would portray him as an empathic individual the readers can better root for, as he would at least act like he acknowledges the extremely dire consequences of his actions? As opposed to being completely tone-deaf upbeat?
Picture watching a movie where the protagonist initiates a strategy, which though logically sound, is currently claiming thousands of innocent lives as its price. And while the protagonist explains said strategy, theres upbeat music, an optimistic atmosphere, and it segues directly into comic relief.
I disagree. To me, the virtue or the grace of a character lies in his/her actions, not in his gestures. Even more, ugly gestures matched with virtuosos or good actions make a character interesting to me, and more likable than standard empathic smiles doing good actions.
On the other hand, almost all action shounen naturalize murder and human death. So I think a smile or a sad face here or there won't change the fact that we like shounen action.
Melodias just initiated a plan that will result in the death of tens of thousands of civilians and instead of being rightfully chewed for it, no one even thinks to bring up what a horrifically monstrous act it was. I'd have been fine with it if the tone or framing were appropriately dour but it's treated like this big epic shonen fuck yeah moment and I'm like whuh?
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Lol, it seems Daz beat me to the point.
Nobody is treating Meliodas as an epic heroe for what he did.
Readers of shounen action complining about such a small thing amaze me, anyway.
Except the author with the framing and tone and no characters calling him out on what he just did but instead transitioning to Hawk comic relief.
Sure the author could redeem himself next chapter by actually giving the situation some gravitas but I very much doubt it given this was pretty much the moment to hammer home what a big sacrifice Melodias just made, the author seems to be pretty much unaware of what he just did.
@Daz:
…It would portray him as an empathic individual the readers can better root for, as he would at least act like he acknowledges the extremely dire consequences of his actions? As opposed to being completely tone-deaf upbeat?
Picture watching a movie where the protagonist initiates a strategy, which though logically sound, is currently claiming thousands of innocent lives as its price. And while the protagonist explains said strategy, theres upbeat music, an optimistic atmosphere, and it segues directly into comic relief.
Nakaba seems to avoid countering Mel's frequently mediocre arguments so this sort of treatment isn't really anything new. The only difference is that this time thousands of lives hang in play.
Mel's own behavior comes in the context that he thought of a plan that dramatically decreases the chance of mortality for any of his friends. Given how the vividly the Sins were massacred before, their deaths were likely at the forefront of his thoughts. Like most people, Meliodas's places a premium on the lives of his friends over the many lives of strangers, and it helps that increasing their chance of survival boosts humanity's chances as a whole.
Not saying his plan couldn't use polish. A little "well then, we'd better hurry" would go a long way.
@TLC:
Except the author with the framing and tone and no characters calling him out on what he just did but instead transitioning to Hawk comic relief.
.
That is not completely true since King and the druid girl pointed the consequence of his action.
I don’t know if it is related but Meliodas is still a demon.
Nobody is treating Meliodas as an epic heroe for what he did.
Readers of shounen action complining about such a small thing amaze me, anyway.
I don't see why. In most Shonen only the asshole would propose that solution. And it would most likely be played as necessary evil then don't sweat it's a good plan (only for the main character to try saving everyone later).
Meliodas smiling while telling them they setting a massacre to have a chance against the bad guys is not a typical Shonen thing.
That is not completely true since King and the druid girl pointed the consequence of his action.
I don’t know if it is related but Meliodas is still a demon.
That happened before Melodias's epic declaration of the reasoning behind his plans without acknowledging the collateral damage. And even their reactions were brushed off with a joke.
I don't see why. In most Shonen only the asshole would propose that solution. And it would most likely be played as necessary evil then don't sweat it's a good plan (only for the main character to try saving everyone later).
Meliodas smiling while telling them they setting a massacre to have a chance against the bad guys is not a typical Shonen thing.
Well, Mel is trying to save the humanity, as much as many shounen heroes. Not an asshole to me.
I disagree. To me, the virtue or the grace of a character lies in his/her actions, not in his gestures. Even more, ugly gestures matched with virtuosos or good actions make a character interesting to me, and more likable than standard empathic smiles doing good actions.
Nobody is treating Meliodas as an epic heroe for what he did.
Readers of shounen action complining about such a small thing amaze me, anyway.
Wait, first you say that ugly gestures + virtuous actions are interesting…does this mean you think Melodias is making an ugly gesture as he's doing good? He's making a completely empathic-looking smile, as he does this "good action", the ugliness comes from the fact that the manga never contextualizes his smiling, happy visage as off. This whole convo started because you didn't see anything wrong with how Mel was portrayed.
Now, by all means, you don't need to have characters make only problem-free decisions for happy smiley problem free fun-times; you can have them do questionable things, make tough decisions, but then you need to own up to that and frame them as such.
"Nobody treats Melodias as a hero for what he did" you say- but once he gives his explanation, no one challenges him. The Story does not challenge him, and that the big issue, because it legitimizes him, it ignores the horrible implications and frames it entirely as "Mel is a good guy, he's smart because his strategy is good and will let the good guys win, Mel is pretty great!", and it just comes across as incredibly naïve and simple minded writing.
You say Mel is "interesting" because he discards countless lives "for the greater good" and is all bizarrely blassé and happy about it, as if its no big deal, but the manga doesn't highlight him as some complex gray antihero or whatever. Theres no one going "even so captain, this is going quite far…" or "he has a point...but how can he be so calm about this!?!", theres no subtle shading or framing of Melodias as being slightly eerie or callous in his reasoning, no indication that he's putting up a facade and has internal scruples. It just segues into slapstick, and the topic is dropped, as if "Well, its no big deal anyway right?". Indeed, it not being a "big deal" seems to be a base assumption that you've bought completely into. But this isn't some bizarro dark comedy or emotionally bankrupt HxHverse, King and the others reactions tell us as much; lives as stake do matter in this story.
Its the difference between, say, Churchill laying out the D day plan, and acknowledging the unfathomable casualties it will entail with seriousness and gravitas, as opposed to
"Churchill, you're dooming countless men to death!"
"I know, but my plan is pretty great right!?"
Has biggest shit eating grin ever as he's hit by a beam of sunlight, turns to gropes sexy secretary, KYA CHURCHILL SAMA
On the other hand, almost all action shounen naturalize murder and human death. So I think a smile or a sad face here or there won't change the fact that we like shounen action.
If you cannot properly contextualize murder and death in your story, you make your characters come across as completely tone-deaf, unrelatable and emotionally alien. Or, to put it another way, theres good ways and bad ways of writing a shonen. The label is not an "Anything goes! just write whatever, its all good, its just shonen!" permission.
Sorry but you should read more carefully. You're changing my words.
@Daz:
Wait, first you say that ugly gestures + virtuous actions are interesting…does this mean you think Melodias is making an ugly gesture as he's doing good? He's making a completely empathic-looking smile, as he does this "good action", the ugliness comes from the fact that the manga never contextualizes his smiling, happy visage as off. This whole convo started because you didn't see anything wrong with how Mel was portrayed.
Now, by all means, you don't need to have characters make only problem-free decisions for happy smiley problem free fun-times; you can have them do questionable things, make tough decisions, but then you need to own up to that and frame them as such.
It's an ugly gesture for the action he's about to allow: to let the TC kill people. It's relative to the action.
"Nobody treats Melodias as a hero for what he did" you say- but once he gives his explanation, no one challenges him. The Story does not challenge him, and that the big issue, because it legitimizes him, it ignores the horrible implications and frames it entirely as "Mel is a good guy, he's smart because his strategy is good and will let the good guys win, Mel is pretty great!", and it just comes across as incredibly naïve and simple minded writing.
I didn't say "Nobody treats Melodias as a hero for what he did". I said: "Nobody treats Melodias as an epic hero for what he did". It's different. He's an hero because, we know, he'll save the humanity, but what he's doing is not the most happy way because some humans will be killed.
You say Mel is "interesting" because he discards countless lives "for the greater good" and …
Yes, he's interesting because he's pursuing the greatest good: saving the humanity (by doing an ugly thing: sacrificing some humans) and an ugly gesture smiling about it. I don't see why the ruckus about it. I'm happy with it. And i'm not going to discuss the Churchill example. Even more, I'm repeating myself, then I won't post about it again, since it doesn't add a thing.
@Daz:
contextualize murder and death in your story, you make your characters come across as completely tone-deaf, unrelatable and emotionally alien. Or, to put it another way, theres good ways and bad ways of writing a shonen. The label is not an "Anything goes! just write whatever, its all good, its just shonen!" permission.
If you can't read better I don't see a point on contextualizing anything else.
Meliodas has just come out of a recurring nightmare where he had to kill his emotions to pass the test. This is the result, he does care about the fate of the world ,he would simply flee the country and escape from the demons otherwise, but he wont hesitate to make sacrifices or show any kind of remorse, like a machine doing the job he was tasked to do. That lack of human empathy is what makes Meliodas a bit interesting, and after all every one of the Sins have serious character flaws (Gowther being the most extreme case, but not the only one)
Mel's behaviour is easy to understand (maybe not so easy to justify) but who are at fault here are his companions who while disagree with Mel are doing it in a very lighthearted way.
@TLC:
That happened before Melodias's epic declaration of the reasoning behind his plans without acknowledging the collateral damage. And even their reactions were brushed off with a joke.
They acknowledge the collateral dammage by being angry. And after Meliodas explanation it loses its purpose.
They acknowledge the collateral dammage by being angry. And after Meliodas explanation it loses its purpose.
But the anger is not taken seriously, it's treated like a gag. And his explanation explained why he was instigating a massacre but addressed nothing on the morality of his actions.
Even more, I'm repeating myself, then I won't post about it again, since it doesn't add a thing.
You're completely and utterly refusing to engage with my main point, the off-tone narrative framing of Melodias and his statement, and focusing only on the logic of the statement itself. You are unable to sepearate the fact that we as readers can rationalize the dire ramifications of Melodias actions and how ugly it makes him seem to act so happy about it, from the fact that the manga in no way itself presents this.
So yes, this does seem rather pointless.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
They acknowledge the collateral dammage by being angry. And after Meliodas explanation it loses its purpose.
It would serve the purpose of illustrating that even if Melodias explains, its still a terribly gruesome strategy worth being emotionally affected over, unless youre completely unempathic. When the story moves on to other matters and upbeat comedy following Melodias statement, its the equivalent of going "Oh well, when you put it like that, countrywide massacres are no big deal then".
Remember, melodias is a demon, and what I take from the plan he laid out with that nonchalant attitude is that because he is a demon he still has those tendencies to act like one or feel like one, it may be a reason Merlin took half of his powers away so he could be more human, he could feel and have empathy. And, now with his powers back it might have taken away that more human side of him. At least it's what I'd like to believe the author is doing.
Remember, melodias is a demon, and what I take from the plan he laid out with that nonchalant attitude is that because he is a demon he still has those tendencies to act like one or feel like one, it may be a reason Merlin took half of his powers away so he could be more human, he could feel and have empathy. And, now with his powers back it might have taken away that more human side of him. At least it's what I'd like to believe the author is doing.
That would be interesting: Mel having some dark power remaining. We don't know if the author will put that smile purpously or not; so it's kind of silly to condemn him now, beforehand.
Well, Mel is trying to save the humanity, as much as many shounen heroes. Not an asshole to me.
I'm telling you he is an asshole. I'm saying his idea is clearly not a typical Shonen protagonist.
I'm telling you he is an asshole. I'm saying his idea is clearly not a typical Shonen protagonist.
Then that should be a welcomed change, as you don't see a protagonist acting that way all the time. I don't like to make comparisons, but if Meliodas is an asshole, then what is Luffy who puts both his crew and allies in deep shit for getting ahead of himself too much, in every arc and at least two or three times.
That would be interesting: Mel having some dark power remaining. We don't know if the author will put that smile purpously or not; so it's kind of silly to condemn him now, beforehand.
we've seen him in demon mode before, an emotionless killing machine that will destroy everything in its path. They also did a cool shadow visual with Elizabeth and melodias walking and his shadow being a huge demon like creature. So I think it isn't out of the question. This is what I'm going hope for anyway.
I'm telling you he is an asshole. I'm saying his idea is clearly not a typical Shonen protagonist.
Well, I like your idea of being an asshole. :happy:
Then that should be a welcomed change, as you don't see a protagonist acting that way all the time. I don't like to make comparisons, but if Meliodas is an asshole, then what is Luffy who puts both his crew and allies in deep shit for getting ahead of himself too much, in every arc and at least two or three times.
I was on my phone. The "not" of my first sentence was lost. I certainly can't tell people how to see a character.
Not every change is welcome. I was simply pointing out that it is not a recurrent thing in manga for protagonist to make that kind of choice so it is not weird to question it after reading plenty of shonen.
First Luffy being an asshole wouldn't change anything about Meliodas being or not an ass for sacrificing innocent life to accomplish his goals. But I would like a couple of example to get what you mean. As I far as I can remember they follow their captain and he helps his friend with their problems.
@Ukimix:
Well, I like your idea of being an asshole. :happy:
I was on my phone. The "not" of my first sentence was lost. I certainly can't tell people how to see a character. I was simply saying that being a shonen reader doesn't make Meliodas decision and the way it is portrayed any less weird as it is pretty uncommon.
Sometimes you have to push your enemies hand and go with the best strategy for a chance of Victory, it was a tough call but he knows it's the only option they have, heroes make the tough choices like that, get over it.