http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-610/page008.html - The pannel where M.Shirley says "What a vulgar child…" I get that Oda is trying to be funny, but she looked just a bit too evil there. She than immediately sends Keimi and the Strawhats away, almost like she was planning something. She than proceeds to "look into the future" and cries out to the town to "send him out of this nation" (the boy with the ripped straw hat). To me this seems way too much of a coincedence. Granted that Luffy tends to bring with him destruction, who is to say she just doesn't want him gone because she knows she doesn't stand a chance? I understand that is purely assumption and I can't back it up yet. The last thing I want to mention, is probably the biggest stretch, Arlong-Sawshark fishman, Hodi Jones-Great White fishman, Jinbe- Whaleshark (former Shicibukai), M.Shirley-Makoshark mermaid. Anyone else notice how every shark fishman is or was a bad-guy at one point? Hell, even Princess Shirahoshi's pet shark Megalo wore a "Criminal" shirt.
Theories That Don't Deserve Their Own Thread v.2
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Trivia:
it took two years in the manga publish for the straw hat pirates to be united again
Chapter 513: I Couldn't Even printed September 2008
Chapter 598: 2 Years Later printed October 2010
maybe that is why oda made it a two years time skip
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Another Bonney theory.
Bonney can change other people's ages, right? Then she can probably change her own age too and can make herself young again and again. My theory is that Bonney is actually hundreds or thousands of years old and knows about the blank century, how and why the World Government was founded and all that stuff. -
Another Bonney theory.
Bonney can change other people's ages, right? Then she can probably change her own age too and can make herself young again and again. My theory is that Bonney is actually hundreds or thousands of years old and knows about the blank century, how and why the World Government was founded and all that stuff.I could see why people might go for that, due to her fruit powers. But I think its much more simpler than that. She could simply be in-relation to a high ranking marine officer. If you were right in terms of she has had this fruit for centuries, I don't see why she would be referred as a "supernova" as her powers are clearly known by the World Government, so even if she changed her age/looks, the Marines would still know it is "bonney". Also if she was thaaaaaaaat old, and is a pirate, I would really assume she would have AT LEAST got through the new world by now instead of being on par with the SH's. I highly doubt her current crew is that bad ass, that she went back to GL and got them together and once again decided to go on her journey. etc, etc, etc.
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I could see why people might go for that, due to her fruit powers. But I think its much more simpler than that. She could simply be in-relation to a high ranking marine officer. If you were right in terms of she has had this fruit for centuries, I don't see why she would be referred as a "supernova" as her powers are clearly known by the World Government, so even if she changed her age/looks, the Marines would still know it is "bonney". Also if she was thaaaaaaaat old, and is a pirate, I would really assume she would have AT LEAST got through the new world by now instead of being on par with the SH's. I highly doubt her current crew is that bad ass, that she went back to GL and got them together and once again decided to go on her journey. etc, etc, etc.
Well first off she may have been on the run from the government for all this time, hiding on a remote island in say the North Blue is better than gaining attention by becoming a pirate. Assuming with agencies such as Cipher Pole that gather information (Including some info on Ace's heritage if I remember correctly) she probably moved around a lot. Probably decided to become a pirate for whatever reason under a different name(I don't think she'd keep the name when running from the government) and when she turned the Marines at Saboady into children that's when the Marines found out. We know that(While not as reckless as Luffy or Zoro) She has a bit of a temper, and used her powers before she ran, but considering there was an Admiral on the way to the archipelago, she needed to haul ass, and not worry about her identity.
If it wasn't for Blackbeard she's probably be in the New World right now.
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Another Bonney theory.
Bonney can change other people's ages, right? Then she can probably change her own age too and can make herself young again and again. My theory is that Bonney is actually hundreds or thousands of years old and knows about the blank century, how and why the World Government was founded and all that stuff.Zoro thought she was a kid when she tackled him. I have a feeling that she may actually be younger than she appears, and makes herself older so that she isn't as weak.
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Also I'm sure it means nothing, but why can't Bonney's fruit effect cloths? When the Marines became younger their cloths were to big for them. Every Devil Fruit we've seen before works with cloths(Just as it's easier for Oda than cloths ripping) Like Choppers hat grew in Monster Point, Luffys sandal grew in Gear Third, all the Logia's, but not Bonney's
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I guess the power affects the clothes of the user. Bonneys own clothes shrunk when she used it on herself.
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Lola's mom is Big Mam.
has this been discussed?
anything on this? i thought this was pretty interesting. I mean, she looks similar to what we've seen of Big Mam, (who used to be Big MOM). Lola said her mom was a powerful pirate in the New World. There can't be that many more pirates that are female and powerful in comparison to the SHs.
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anything on this? i thought this was pretty interesting. I mean, she looks similar to what we've seen of Big Mam, (who used to be Big MOM). Lola said her mom was a powerful pirate in the New World. There can't be that many more pirates that are female and powerful in comparison to the SHs.
That theory has been pounded so far into the ground that it's starting to come back up on the other side. People are simply bored of it.
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That theory has been pounded so far into the ground that it's starting to come back up on the other side. People are simply bored of it.
gotcha. that's why i asked.
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anything on this? i thought this was pretty interesting. I mean, she looks similar to what we've seen of Big Mam, (who used to be Big MOM). Lola said her mom was a powerful pirate in the New World. There can't be that many more pirates that are female and powerful in comparison to the SHs.
Elmy says hello. Could never see her again but the SH being friends with 3 out of 4 of the Yonkou would be the worst development ever.
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Elmy says hello. Could never see her again but the SH being friends with 3 out of 4 of the Yonkou would be the worst development ever.
3 out of the 4 Yonkou? Whitebeard is dead, man. And Blackbeard is probably one of the Yonkou now. So it would be 2 out of 4, Shanks and Big Mam.
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Elmy says hello. Could never see her again but the SH being friends with 3 out of 4 of the Yonkou would be the worst development ever.
Scratch 1 Yonkou out, they only have 1 as of current date.
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Zoro thought she was a kid when she tackled him. I have a feeling that she may actually be younger than she appears, and makes herself older so that she isn't as weak.
This, I agree with. Could be why she only eats junk food? Or the fact she was crying when epicbeard died? (obviously more to the crying part…) Not much I know, but I do think she is younger than what she seems, otherwise with the ability of her food, I'd say her bounty is far too low of a threat and I also refuse to believe that, it was her 1st time using the ability in SA as some1 suggested.
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How is WB being dead mean he was not Luffy's friend/ally? Didn't say anything about 3 out of 4 Yonkou currently assisting them though WB technically will through Marco and the remaining WB pirates.
Telling me Shanks, Big Mam, Marco, Garp&Aokiji, Rayleigh, the Revolutionaries, and the remaining WBs isn't a shitload of support? If BM is Lola mom that means they were always guaranteed a free pass through part of the New World since TB.
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How is WB being dead mean he was not Luffy's friend/ally? Didn't say anything about 3 out of 4 Yonkou currently assisting them though WB technically will through Marco and the remaining WB pirates.
Telling me Shanks, Big Mam, Marco, Garp&Aokiji, Rayleigh, the Revolutionaries, and the remaining WBs isn't a shitload of support? If BM is Lola mom that means they were always guaranteed a free pass through part of the New World.
Maybe if a whole bunch of the new world has been taken over by the Supernova's and the Blackbeard pirates? Or the Yonkou are at war with the latter. So most islands near the area the Strawhats land might be in conflict?
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I have two things i want to mention.
While re-reading the whole FI-arc so far i thought about two things:
1)VDD is the ancestor of previous VDDs from which the first one was cursed.
We know that the curse was a DF, so could it be that VDD-family know how to pass the DF-ability to the next generation after dieing.(just like BB transfered WB`s ability into him) Or else each new VDD ate a new DF?2)About mermaids which split their tails.
We don`t have a reason so far why this happens at the age of 30 and then just only for the mermaids, but here i already had a few predictions.
Just bringing it into the context of fishman\merman living on land…maybe that they get legs(split fins) is another indicator that they were actually meaned to be on land from the start by nature.Unrevealed: Loki/Rocks/the man marked by flames/Im-san
Island: Elbaf/Raftel/GodValley
Unresolved: Weevil´s plan/Joy-Boy/Zunisha´s story/Rocks flashback/Void Century/Rioponeglyph/Uranus/the D.clan
DFWind/Metal/Acid/Liquid/Time-Stop
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Yeah, the fact about them getting legs is really wierd. I wonder if it'll be explained.
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@Don:
I have two things i want to mention.
While re-reading the whole FI-arc so far i thought about two things:
1)VDD is the ancestor of previous VDDs from which the first one was cursed.
We know that the curse was a DF, so could it be that VDD-family know how to pass the DF-ability to the next generation after dieing.(just like BB transfered WB`s ability into him) Or else each new VDD ate a new DF?Doubtful. VDD was never said to have the same curse as VDDXI. The fact that our current Decken has a fruit is unlikely to have to do with anything with the original Decken. It's just considered a curse by fishmen since he no longer has the ability to swim, which is very damaging to fishmen and merfolk.
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Doubtful. VDD was never said to have the same curse as VDDIX. The fact that our current Decken has a fruit is unlikely to have to do with anything with the original Decken. It's just considered a curse by fishmen since he no longer has the ability to swim, which is very damaging to fishmen and merfolk.
fixed
16 chars
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I have a feeling that Kong didn't get stationed at Mariejoa until after Fisher Tiger invaded. Before then, they may not have felt that such a guard was necessary. It would also help to explain how a 200 million level individual would be able to succeed there on his own.
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I hope by "200 million level", you don't think Fisher Tiger is only as strong as other characters with similar bounties.
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If you want to believe that bounties aren't a vague representation of strength you're welcome to it. However, someone who got through a pan fleet admiral would earn a bounty of more than that either way.
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That is what I think bounties are but Fisher's 230 million is a starting bounty. You make sound like it indicates he was only around current Jinbe's level or weaker when he attacked Mariejoas. Starting bounties cannot accurately portray someones real potential because its not like the person who gave out the bounty knows how much effort was used in the crime. Luffy and Arlong were always much stronger than people with similarly small bounties.
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The bounty came AFTER Mariejoa. It doesn't make a dime's bit of difference whether he had a bounty before then or not. 11 supernovas had a 0% chance against an admiral, so to assume that someone got only a similar bounty after defeating someone even higher up the chain is crazy to me.
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The bounty came AFTER Mariejoa. It doesn't make a dime's bit of difference whether he had a bounty before then or not. 11 supernovas had a 0% chance against an admiral, so to assume that someone got only a similar bounty after defeating someone even higher up the chain is crazy to me.
There has probably been an economic inflation since then so a 230 million bounty then is about 1 billion bera bounty now.
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So you're suggesting that Brook is actually somewhere in the 1.5-2 billion range, then?
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So you're suggesting that Brook is actually somewhere in the 1.5-2 billion range, then?
You know that price doesnt go with the economy if people cant claim it for 50 years. You need supply to go with inflation.
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You know that price doesnt go with the economy if people cant claim it for 50 years. You need supply to go with inflation.
Well, good job at avoiding the point, I suppose. By your math, 30 million to people 50 years ago is like a couple billion to people in the current day, which is all that I was saying. Robin has apparently become far less dangerous in the last 20 years as well, since her bounty only went up by 1 million in that span.
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Wow… Inflation in One Piece: that's a priceless discussion. heh
I don't think Tiger defeated the Commander-in-Chief. Most probably, he attacked by surprise, caused a lot of chaos, set in flames everywhere and fled before someone strong enough could arrive and locate him.
He is strong. At least strong enough to defeat a Rear Admiral, like we've seen in chapter 622. But I don't think he's in the Admiral league, and the government could be pretty confident that someone really strong could capture him afterwards.
Also, this is his starting bounty. Which is the highest starting bounty ever in One Piece. His act caught everyone surprised and was considered an attack against the very foundations of the world, so I think the government gave his bounty based only on his acts and not considering his strength. Kinda like Robin's bounty.
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Well, good job at avoiding the point, I suppose. By your math, 30 million to people 50 years ago is like a couple billion to people in the current day, which is all that I was saying. Robin has apparently become far less dangerous in the last 20 years as well, since her bounty only went up by 1 million in that span.
Ok. Going against your earlir thoughts. The first bounty is just put to figure the strength of Fisher tiger. The strength of the marjoia guard is clearly not that powerful and the first bounty is put to assess his strength.
I have always thought of the bounty as a danger level they have rather than strength level. To show how much the government want to catch you or how much risk you are to the environment.
Economy clearly isnt connected to the bounty I just thought it as an interesting approach to the bounty discussion, as we clearly don't know how they assess the bounty price. Strength is of course an indicator, but not the best one I believe. -
Ok. Going against your earlir thoughts. The first bounty is just put to figure the strength of Fisher tiger. The strength of the marjoia guard is clearly not that powerful and the first bounty is put to assess his strength.
I have always thought of the bounty as a danger level they have rather than strength level. To show how much the government want to catch you or how much risk you are to the environment.
Economy clearly isnt connected to the bounty I just thought it as an interesting approach to the bounty discussion, as we clearly don't know how they assess the bounty price. Strength is of course an indicator, but not the best one I believe.There's really only two options you can take. Either Tiger's bounty is reflective of his strength, which is the simple and obvious option. Or Tiger's bounty EXCEEDS his strength, because there are other factors making it higher, which is also a perfectly acceptable argument. What isn't an option, then, is only the idea that Tiger's bounty doesn't do his strength justice. It's not an argument I've seen anyone try to make, fortunately, so it can be ignored.
Now, after removing the third option we can conclude that Tiger's bounty is either greater than or equal to his strength, at least for as much as they can be compared, and I would hope that we can agree on this. Well, the way he smacked around a Rear Admiral, like Drake (200+ mil), is reason to believe that his strength is worthy of his bounty total. If that's the case, then within error it may as well be equal. It's just not a very precise system of measurement (lots of room for error).
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There's really only two options you can take. Either Tiger's bounty is reflective of his strength, which is the simple and obvious option. Or Tiger's bounty EXCEEDS his strength, because there are other factors making it higher, which is also a perfectly acceptable argument. What isn't an option, then, is only the idea that Tiger's bounty doesn't do his strength justice. It's not an argument I've seen anyone try to make, fortunately, so it can be ignored.
Now, after removing the third option we can conclude that Tiger's bounty is either greater than or equal to his strength, at least for as much as they can be compared, and I would hope that we can agree on this. Well, the way he smacked around a Rear Admiral, like Drake (200+ mil), is reason to believe that his strength is worthy of his bounty total. If that's the case, then within error it may as well be equal. It's just not a very precise system of measurement (lots of room for error).
Also in situations like Tiger's and Luffy's, they've done things no one else has done, and damaged the reputation of the Government. People were complaining Luffy's bounty was only raised by 100 Million. Well now the entire world knows he entered the war to save Ace, and is the son of Dragon. There is no point in doubling his bounty, or adding an extremely high number to it for that reason. The bounty says "We will pay you 400 Million berries if you catch this criminal." Everyone knows Tiger went and succeeded in freeing the slaves. He accomplished this amazing feat, the government obviously hunted him after this, and the bounty was just to record his strength.
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What isn't an option, then, is only the idea that Tiger's bounty doesn't do his strength justice. It's not an argument I've seen anyone try to make, fortunately, so it can be ignored.
Actually… that was my option:
I don't think Tiger defeated the Commander-in-Chief. Most probably, he attacked by surprise, caused a lot of chaos, set in flames everywhere and fled before someone strong enough could arrive and locate him.
He is strong. At least strong enough to defeat a Rear Admiral, like we've seen in chapter 622. But I don't think he's in the Admiral league, and the government could be pretty confident that someone really strong could capture him afterwards.
Also, this is his starting bounty. Which is the highest starting bounty ever in One Piece. His act caught everyone surprised and was considered an attack against the very foundations of the world, so I think the government gave his bounty based only on his acts and not considering his strength. Kinda like Robin's bounty.
Since we have no flashback of Tiger rampaging through Marijois, it's hard to say exactly what he did there. But I do think he used the chaos in his favor and didn't fight any major defenders.
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The bounty came AFTER Mariejoa. It doesn't make a dime's bit of difference whether he had a bounty before then or not. 11 supernovas had a 0% chance against an admiral, so to assume that someone got only a similar bounty after defeating someone even higher up the chain is crazy to me.
There's really only two options you can take. Either Tiger's bounty is reflective of his strength, which is the simple and obvious option. Or Tiger's bounty EXCEEDS his strength, because there are other factors making it higher, which is also a perfectly acceptable argument. What isn't an option, then, is only the idea that Tiger's bounty doesn't do his strength justice. It's not an argument I've seen anyone try to make, fortunately, so it can be ignored.
Think Kong was still the Fleet Admiral since Borsalino is still a VA. Even if Kong or someone else was Commander-in-Chief back then it looks like its partially an administrative role and the boss would only move as a last resort. Just like Sengoku during the War or the VA at EL.
Luffy only received a 100 million bounty for defeating Crocodile despite Croc being much stronger than other 100 million figures. Fisher stained the governments rep but Luffy actually messed up the Governments operations with Croc's defeat. 100 million just doesn't do either Luffy's power or his actions any justice.
What of Hancock who was asked to be a Warlord despite her crimes only deserving a 80 million bounty? Obviously they must have acknowledged her strength was well beyond that of any 80 million bounty head. You think Donflomingo, Jinbei, and Moriah were only around Kidd and Luffys strength when they got their invites? You think Coribou is considered just as threatening as Fisher Tiger due to the number of people he's killed? How many people does it take to equal a few beat up Tenryubiito and logically hundreds of millions of berries worth of slaves?
What did Urouge do to only receive a bounty slightly higher than somebody who took down a warlord? A couple of small increases doesn't make sense. If you think its because he defeated somebody with a similar bounty to Croc then you admit Luffy 100 mil was the government being conservative. You agreed bounties are vague indications of power yet are now being pretty specific on what they can and cannot indicate. There is a big story behind every bounty and knocking off any possibility of their meaning is entirely brash. Lastly do you really think Fisher Tiger's final battle will be one sided against a strong foe or against somebody relatively weak like on a Pacifista's level. 200 million is a Urouge, Drake, Kidds, Laws, Killer, Zoro, Rob Lucci and Croc level fighter. 300 millions don't even do Jinbe, Kuma, Moriah, and Ace justice yet your argument is basically that 230 million puts Tiger towards the SN end of the scale.
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300 millions don't even do Jinbe, Kuma, Moriah, and Ace justice yet your argument is basically that 230 million puts Tiger towards the SN end of the scale.
^^ I'm on his side.
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There's really only two options you can take. Either Tiger's bounty is reflective of his strength, which is the simple and obvious option. Or Tiger's bounty EXCEEDS his strength, because there are other factors making it higher, which is also a perfectly acceptable argument. What isn't an option, then, is only the idea that Tiger's bounty doesn't do his strength justice. It's not an argument I've seen anyone try to make, fortunately, so it can be ignored.
Now, after removing the third option we can conclude that Tiger's bounty is either greater than or equal to his strength, at least for as much as they can be compared, and I would hope that we can agree on this. Well, the way he smacked around a Rear Admiral, like Drake (200+ mil), is reason to believe that his strength is worthy of his bounty total. If that's the case, then within error it may as well be equal. It's just not a very precise system of measurement (lots of room for error).
The bounty of Jinbei does though imply that he fisher tiger got higher bounty when becoming shichibukai (250 million or around that). And that they at least survived saving slaves three more years after they got their initial bounty which must mean they got more bounty increases after that.
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Actually… that was my option:
Since we have no flashback of Tiger rampaging through Marijois, it's hard to say exactly what he did there. But I do think he used the chaos in his favor and didn't fight any major defenders.
No, you're saying that they lacked proper information. That's different than intentionally giving a bounty that's below their strength.
Think Kong was still the Fleet Admiral since Borsalino is still a VA. Even if Kong or someone else was Commander-in-Chief back then it looks like its partially an administrative role and the boss would only move as a last resort. Just like Sengoku during the War or the VA at EL.
You're saying that there was someone capable of stopping him in the marines who was… just not doing that for some reason? I mean, Sengoku and the VA's had reasons for their actions. But we've seen that when someone fucks with a noble, hardcore marines drop everything to fuck with them.
Luffy only received a 100 million bounty for defeating Crocodile despite Croc being much stronger than other 100 million figures. Fisher stained the governments rep but Luffy actually messed up the Governments operations with Croc's defeat. 100 million just doesn't do either Luffy's power or his actions any justice.
What of Hancock who was asked to be a Warlord despite her crimes only deserving a 80 million bounty? Obviously they must have acknowledged her strength was well beyond that of any 80 million bounty head. You think Donflomingo, Jinbei, and Moriah were only around Kidd and Luffys strength when they got their invites? You think Coribou is considered just as threatening as Fisher Tiger due to the number of people he's killed? How many people does it take to equal a few beat up Tenryubiito and logically hundreds of millions of berries worth of slaves?
What did Urouge do to only receive a bounty slightly higher than somebody who took down a warlord? A couple of small increases doesn't make sense. If you think its because he defeated somebody with a similar bounty to Croc then you admit Luffy 100 mil was the government being conservative. You agreed bounties are vague indications of power yet are now being pretty specific on what they can and cannot indicate. Their is a big story behind every bounty and knocking off any possibility of their meaning is entirely brash. Lastly do you really think Fisher Tiger's final battle will be one sided or against somebody relatively weak like on a Pacifista's level. 200 million is a Urouge, Drake, Kidds, Laws, Killer, Zoro, Rob Lucci and Croc's level. 300 millions don't even do Jinbe, Kuma, Moriah, and Ace justice yet your argument is basically that 230 million puts Tiger towards the SN end of the scale.
Very good points, and I'll concede that there are cases in which a person's gauged strength exceeds their bounty totals. However, I think it's safe to say that someone who attacked the world nobles wouldn't get that type of treatment, which is the situation that we're looking at specifically.
The bounty of Jinbei does though imply that he fisher tiger got higher bounty when becoming shichibukai (250 million or around that). And that they at least survived saving slaves three more years after they got their initial bounty which must mean they got more bounty increases after that.
Sure, Tiger's bounty could easily have gone up at some point.
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I think the giant deep hole in the center of the waterfalls in Ennies Lobby leads to the New World, but only a few know about it because only a handful have reached that far.
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I'm wondering if anyone else thinks this to be the case.
The name of the ancient civilization was D and everyone carrying that initial is its descendants. My friends and I pretty much accepted that to be the case after Clover's speech, it seems to be the only way so many disparate plot threads can come together: will of D, ancient civilization, rio poneglyph, void century, government cover up.
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I've actually thought that for quite a while, and Whitebeard's speech right before he died seemed to allude pretty heavily towards that possibility.
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The blueprints for pluton revealed where one piece was, now that its burnt no one will find it.
at raftel theres a not that says.. "you have the pluton blueprints right?"–- Update From New Post Merge ---
The name of the ancient civilization was D and everyone carrying that initial is its descendants.
So there were giants in this civilisation as well? or wait was saul a half giant
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The blueprints for pluton revealed where one piece was, now that its burnt no one will find it.
at raftel theres a not that says.. "you have the pluton blueprints right?"–- Update From New Post Merge ---
So there were giants in this civilisation as well? or wait was saul a half giant
If I remember correctly, pluton was only a counter weapon for whatever power the ancient civilizations had.
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So there were giants in this civilisation as well? or wait was saul a half giant
Considering that fishmen can breed with giants (big pan), humans can breed with mermaids and fishmen (chimney, decken), etc. it's pretty clear that humans can have children with giants. Saul probably descended from a D. human, just like Van der Decken descended from a human. As seen with Chimney, it only takes two generations for the physical traits of the grandparent to completely disappear. A human in the D. line could have married into a giant family and society hundreds of years ago and the descendants would display no traits whatsoever.
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I guess it's have to be a really big human and pretty small giant for that to work.
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@S.C.:
I guess it's have to be a really big human and pretty small giant for that to work.
Untrue. Look at Otohime and Neptune. They made it work somehow, and I'm pretty sure they breed the same way fishmen and humans do.
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I like this theory. Very much.
As for exactly how man and giant can breed, it's one of those things that work because the author says so. Suspend your disbelief a little, this is a universe where the main character's body is made of rubber.
