Yeah, guys. How can you not understand that Amatsu's Italian?
It's so blatantly obvious. I know because I'm Italian also.
Yeah, guys. How can you not understand that Amatsu's Italian?
It's so blatantly obvious. I know because I'm Italian also.
Sry, i have real life. We can talk now. ^^
Then start addressing my points son. Check the last couple of pages and answer 'em.
Shirahoshi crys (defeaning) for no reason like many Characters in One Piece whensoever. Naruto and Sakura cry for a good reason. Because they to lose the best friend/the man she loving. It's Narutos biggest target in his life because he spoke it 100% (Naruto: I will bring Sasuke back! It's a promise). It's normal if he crys if his biggest friend twindle away and his promise and biggest target fails again. Naruto is a dramatically, [white-knuckle and sweeping Manga, if you Understand it.
But this is not the right Thread!](http://www.dict.cc/englisch-deutsch/white+knuckle.html)
As Urouge pointed out, Shirahoshi has every reason to cry. She is incredibly sheltered and vulnerable.
You haven't explained why Tiger crying was bad. The man was on his (self-induced due to lack of blood transfusion) deathbed recounting his deepest regrets. This is not a sign of weakness.
And Many say that Naruto is a emo Manga (joke xp…..................... oO). But i meand Shirahoshi more and not the Main Characters, sorry.
Shirahoshi is more cheerful than Sasuke has ever been. You don't get to make this comparison.
My opinion is easy, i'm disappointing because Fishmans are so weak and 10 times so as strong as Humans customarily but there is not one really strong Fishman ( anything except Jinbey maybe)
If you bothered to read my one of my former posts to you (that you still gotta answer) you'd know you aren't giving any sort of proof to your statements. How/Why are fishmen weak? As I said last time, you're completely disregarding the entire fishmen race and their naturally high strength just because of our human protagonists being unnaturally strong. It's not even a fair comparison.
and Many think Tiger is strong too (Shirahoshi level?) but now he is not…this is Truth and i could say much more (Arlong ect.).
Did you seriously just try to compare strength levels of Tiger, who again would've survived a rain of bullets had it been for a blood transfusion, who broke himself and hundreds of slaves out of Mariejois, to Shirahoshi the mermaid princess who has never been in combat?
What.
Geht what?? I#m not GER. Reported you btw.
Yeah how dare we call you out on your bullshit.
Also the report button goes to the mods. And they ain't helping you.
You cast out the line, now reel it back in.
Start talking.
And Many say that Naruto is a emo Manga (joke xp…..................... oO). But i meand Shirahoshi more and not the Main Characters, sorry. But this is not the thing. My opinion is easy, i'm disappointing because Fishmans are so weak and 10 times so as strong as Humans customarily but there is not one really strong Fishman ( anything except Jinbey maybe) and Many think Tiger is strong too (Shirahoshi level?) but now he is not...this is Truth and i could say much more (Arlong ect.).
Buht you see, fishmens are rly not as week as you think they ahr. Yhou could say much more? Iht's a gewd thing u didn#t, becuz yourea rgument would fall Apart. Fishmanz are phisically 10x strongar than Humans….......................oO Yes, physicly, but taht does not exlcude them from being defeeted by alternate meenz.............................................................................. xp Kuroobi was defated by beign deprived of oxygin.... Chew was dafeated by sneeky methods.... Hatchan was defeated becuz, while he is 10x strongar himslef, Zoro is a freekin monstar like you said urself in another thread.... Nd Arlawng was defeeted becuz Luffy is a monster himself, treined in teh junglez, and was enraged becuz he found about Nami doing her drawingz, and he also had teh froot of teh sea.... Nd Jinbe has shown himslef to be a pritty strawng fishmanz.... He took a blow frum Akainu!
reported u btw
If you bothered to read my one of my former posts to you (that you still gotta answer) you'd know you aren't giving any sort of proof to your statements. How/Why are fishmen weak? As I said last time, you're completely disregarding the entire fishmen race and their naturally high strength just because of our human protagonists being unnaturally strong. It's not even a fair comparison.
Jinbei is the only really Strong (with this Whitebeard Fishman - maybe), this is fact now. Hordy pills. 1 Crew CAN kill all Fishmans and Strawhats are not top tier like Admirals, Whitebeard, Shanks, Doflamingo, Mihawk, Aka Inu ect… still. Fact. ^^ But they are naturally 10 times as strong as humans if born also they SHOULD be more strong Fisihis if you think consequential… still. they have it easyier then humans to be strong. i'm not say Oda is a Fail, i say Fishmans are. It's only my opin. I Wish they are stronger and not crying ever, because i like the Race, but it is annoying that they are so weak. I don't understand this. Not epic, if you know what i mean. They are maybe strong Fishmans too with Jinbei but we must wait and see. I don't belive this.
Did you seriously just try to compare strength levels of Tiger, who again would've survived a rain of bullets had it been for a blood transfusion, who broke himself and hundreds of slaves out of Mariejois, to Shirahoshi the mermaid princess who has never been in combat?
I meand Shishibukai. XD sry.
What.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
@Badass:
You're right. You are disappointing.
Why are all rude to me…?
Ich würde dir ja gerne in der deutschen Sprache antworten, aber ich habe das Gefühl, dass du nicht einmal das verstehen würdest. Um es dennoch zusammenzufassen: Du kommst in eins der größten, wenn nicht das größte, OP-Foren und wagst es, den Manga schlecht zu machen, während du nebenbei diesen Müll namens Naruto anbetest. Und da wunderst du dich wirklich, dass die User entsprechend reagieren?
Just summed everything up for amatsu in the hope that he then might actually understand what's going on. It's nonetheless entertaining as hell to follow this whole conversation. :happy:
To be honest I'd love to go into detail regarding his post about fishmen and his so called 'facts' but my arm's broken and it takes a lot of time to type with just one hand. Therefore I'm looking forward to read your answer Jay.
Why is everyone rude to you, amatsu? Perhaps because you're not even trying to hide being a troll.
If, by some insane chance, you aren't, then fix up the spelling/grammar (I'm sorry if English isn't your first language but plenty in the same boat make more readable posts than yours), make less godawful arguments, and make yourself have an image via your posting that lets people see beyond the Naruto part 2 avatar. Don't equate crying with weakness while loving a series with more meaningless/illogically reasoned crying than OP (in part 2), don't worship Naruto without even visiting the thread here (#1 sign you're a troll using a now shitty manga to provoke a reaction)… The list goes on and on but you've done practically everything imaginable to paint yourself a troll. Even falling back on "but its my opin why r u gaiz so meen? report" sound trollish from you right now.
amatsu: With all this syntax and spelling errors and use of words you just looked up you're automatically taken less seriously. You should be able to form a coherent structure in your post to participate in an argument.
I suggest to let go for a while and learn English. I mean with you linking to a dictionary, writing all nouns capitalized and so on it is pretty clear that you would get such a reaction from people.
Why are all rude to me…?
There's a passage I got memorized. Ezekiel 25:17.
"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of the darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy My brothers. And you will know I am the Lord when I lay My vengeance upon you."
Now… I been sayin' that shit for years. And if you ever heard it, that meant your ass. You'd be dead right now. I never gave much thought to what it meant. I just thought it was a cold-blooded thing to say to a motherfucker before I popped a cap in his ass.
But I saw some shit this mornin' made me think twice. See, now I'm thinking: maybe it means you're the evil man. And I'm the righteous man. And Mr. 9mm here... he's the shepherd protecting my righteous ass in the valley of darkness. Or it could mean you're the righteous man and I'm the shepherd and it's the world that's evil and selfish. And I'd like that. But that shit ain't the truth.
The truth is you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men. But I'm tryin', Ringo. I'm tryin' real hard to be the shepherd.
We’re fucking switching. I’m washing the windows, and you picking up this nigga's skull
Pulp Fiction's such an awesome movie.
Oh, I shot Marvin in the face…
Buht you see, fishmens are rly not as week as you think they ahr. Yhou could say much more? Iht's a gewd thing u didn#t, becuz yourea rgument would fall Apart. Fishmanz are phisically 10x strongar than Humans….......................oO Yes, physicly, but taht does not exlcude them from being defeeted by alternate meenz.............................................................................. xp Kuroobi was defated by beign deprived of oxygin.... Chew was dafeated by sneeky methods.... Hatchan was defeated becuz, while he is 10x strongar himslef, Zoro is a freekin monstar like you said urself in another thread.... Nd Arlawng was defeeted becuz Luffy is a monster himself, treined in teh junglez, and was enraged becuz he found about Nami doing her drawingz, and he also had teh froot of teh sea.... Nd Jinbe has shown himslef to be a pritty strawng fishmanz.... He took a blow frum Akainu!
reported u btw
Wow, how much extra time did it take you to write that?
Jinbei is the only really Strong (with this Whitebeard Fishman - maybe), this is fact now. Hordy pills. 1 Crew CAN kill all Fishmans and Strawhats are not top tier like Admirals, Whitebeard, Shanks, Doflamingo, Mihawk, Aka Inu ect… still. Fact. ^^ But they are naturally 10 times as strong as humans if born also they SHOULD be more strong Fisihis if you think consequential… still. they have it easyier then humans to be strong. i'm not say Oda is a Fail, i say Fishmans are. It's only my opin. I Wish they are stronger and not crying ever, because i like the Race, but it is annoying that they are so weak. I don't understand this. Not epic, if you know what i mean. They are maybe strong Fishmans too with Jinbei but we must wait and see. I don't belive this.
I'll respond to this one thing. Fishmen are greatly outnumbered by humans. The top 0.01% of fishmen covers about 500 of them. In contrast, the top 0.01% of humans likely covers more along the lines of 500,000 of them. So there are going to be far more unnaturally strong humans than there will be unnaturally strong fishmen. It should be no surprise, given the numbers and the existence of ridiculously strong devil fruits, that most of the strongest beings in the world are humans. Lucci is 400x as strong as the average marine, and when you start getting up to that level it really doesn't matter anymore if you started with a 10x advantage.
Despite that, we have seen a few very strong fishmen. Tiger stomped a rear admiral into the ground, Jinbe is clearly very strong, and Hyouzo showed that he's clearly very strong as well. Not only did Hyouzo block Luffy's jet pistol, but he injected deadly poison into him at the same time. One of Whitebeard's division commanders was also a fishman.
The number of unnaturally strong fishmen in the story is about right, given the population size.
I feel like a lot of people's problems with strong fishmen is that there doesn't seem to be any true _top-_tier fishmen. Because definitions can vary I'll specify that I'm talking about people like the Admirals, the Emperors, Marco, Sengoku and so forth. People had high expectations for Tiger since raiding Mariejois sounded like a badass enough feat to be one, but that didn't happen. Now Jimbei, he's certainly strong but it's clear enough that he can't dance with those guys, and neither should anyone else currently seen in this arc. You'd think that there'd be someone who went all the way and became strong enough to compete at THE highest level, even though fishmen are far fewer than humans.
Though if you take Urouge's angle on it above it actually makes sense. The number of "top-tiers" amongst humans is very, very small, I'm not sure there are even twenty of them currently introduced. And to be fair, we don't know if there might be a fishman in the crews of Big Mam and Kaidou who could be the one to fulfill people's wishes. And there's still the Dojo to be seen. Knowing how much Oda likes his old guard, there might just be someone there, although I wouldn't place my bets on it.
But still. Urouge does cover it pretty thoroughly, and I will also say that while Jimbei couldn't compete with Akainu in a full-on fight, or do half the things Akainu could, he still did stop one of his magma fists with just one hand. That seems pretty respectable for one of the strongest fishmen out there to accomplish in a dry environment (though yes, I know he can control water particles in the air). And in the latest chapter he delivered a punch with an amount of force that our ridiculously superhuman main character needed to speed up his blood flow (G2, in case it's somehow not obvious) to match. Not too shabby either.
Jinbei is the only really Strong (with this Whitebeard Fishman - maybe), this is fact now. Hordy pills. 1 Crew CAN kill all Fishmans and Strawhats are not top tier like Admirals, Whitebeard, Shanks, Doflamingo, Mihawk, Aka Inu ect… still. Fact. ^^ But they are naturally 10 times as strong as humans if born also they SHOULD be more strong Fisihis if you think consequential
Well Urouge kind of already said it before I got a chance to, but again I have to reiterate you're completely disregarding the entire fishman race.
And that's just it really, as we were told in the Saobondy arc Fishmen are very few in number compared to the large amount of humans in One Piece's world. You're unfairly comparing the unnaturally strong humans we've seen to the very few fishmen we've been shown.
Besides we haven't really been shown much of what some of these current fishmen antagonists can do. We can't really have a fair strength comparison when all we've been shown is Hyouzou's impressive sword skills and Hordy with a few Energy Steroids.
As for non-antagonistic Fishmen it's obvious both Jinbe and Tiger are monsterously strong even for their race.
Wish they are stronger and not crying ever, because i like the Race, but it is annoying that they are so weak.
Again I keep bringing this up and I keep getting no reply. Explain please to all of us why crying is a negative trait.
I feel like a lot of people's problems with strong fishmen is that there doesn't seem to be any true _top-_tier fishmen. Because definitions can vary I'll specify that I'm talking about people like the Admirals, the Emperors, Marco, Sengoku and so forth … You'd think that there'd be someone who went all the way and became strong enough to compete at THE highest level, even though fishmen are far fewer than humans.
There's Namur, the Commander in the Whitebeard pirates.
I don't think Namur was on the level of an Akainu or a Marco :s Though I don't doubt he's very strong and it was a cool move on Oda's part to include a fishman amongst the division commanders.
I don't think Namur was on the level of an Akainu or a Marco :s
We haven't seen his fighting abilities, but four Whitebeard Commanders have at least faced a Whitebeard Commander and didn't get beat down (Marco, Joz, Ace, and Rakuyou/Dreadlocks Chainchomp). And there wasn't anything shown to say that the Whitebeard Commanders vary in strength greatly. That seems to be the best of the best by your definition if you include Marco on that level.
Well Namur was one of a group of seven commanders who all attacked Kizaru at once. If they were all basically at a similar level as Marco who could compete with the Admirals 1v1, I'd imagine Kizaru would've been killed dead in that moment, but he was just his classic sarcastic self and unharmed. Atmos was controlled by Doflamingo and made to kill his own crewmates while he was helpless to hinder it, and apparently Moria could do decently vs. Curiel. I don't think those guys were on a level with Marco and Jozu who took on the Admirals in single combat.
I thought it was pretty clear that Marco, Jozu and Vista were the strongest commanders and the rest were strong and all but not on the level of the Admirals etc. At least nothing made it come off that way. Oda said that they aren't ranked in the order of their strength, which tells us that there is such an order, and it seemed pretty obvious to me roughly what it was. But if you still disagree, I don't have much more to offer.
I think the strenght of a Yonku is not soly on individual strenght but more on team work.
I remember how WB had absolute faith (did not move a muscle and smiled like it was nothing) in Marco and Jozu when Kizaru and Mihawk attacked.
…........ i'm not say Oda is a Fail, i say Fishmans are. It's only my opin. I Wish they are stronger and not crying ever, because i like the Race, but it is annoying that they are so weak. I don't understand this. Not epic, if you know what i mean. They are maybe strong Fishmans too with Jinbei but we must wait and see. I don't belive this.
So basically you're saying that Fishmen, as a race, is a fail. And your way of fixing this is making them stronger (to Son Goku levels prolly), and not making them cry (because obviously crying is a sign of weakness or character flaw :wassat:).
And now Oda, having told his tale of Fishmen superiority (Arlong's arc), is showing the Fishmen as a race thats been subjected to prejudice; severe racialism; and forced to live in the depth of the sea out of fear. Now, with the arrival of Luffy & Co, their comfort zone is bound to be drastically changed.
And all those facts above doesn't intrigue you one bit?
All you see is Tiger crying on his death bed, defeated by humans. Shirahoshi being a crybaby. Hody cheating with his pills. And while we're at it, why not add Otohime being severely weak. Neptune doing nothing while his wife is taken away by a Tenryuubito.
And all I see is u being a guy/girl who just like seeing cool-guy poses, mass-spamming of techniques and explosions. And think its awesome, or Epic as u might put it….
Might I recommend reading Bleach?
I think the strenght of a Yonku is not soly on individual strenght but more on team work.
I remember how WB had absolute faith (did not move a muscle and smiled like it was nothing) in Marco and Jozu when Kizaru and Mihawk attacked.
That might be more of an indication of how the Whitebeard pirates work, not the Yonkou as a whole.
I mean if Oda's setting up one of the Yonkou to be a future big bad (and he probably will) then I can't see one of their primary characteristics being teamwork.
I think what he might've meant is more along the lines of the strength of the crew, rather than teamwork in a fight. Like even while Kaidou (I guess it would be him) is the most fearsome man in his crew, the fact that he's got a couple guys with him that are almost as dangerous ups his total "Emperor" strength by a lot.
Well yeah, obviously strong people attract strong people to work under them. But that's been the case with pretty much every major pirate crew we've seen.
Well Namur was one of a group of seven commanders who all attacked Kizaru at once. If they were all basically at a similar level as Marco who could compete with the Admirals 1v1, I'd imagine Kizaru would've been killed dead in that moment, but he was just his classic sarcastic self and unharmed. Atmos was controlled by Doflamingo and made to kill his own crewmates while he was helpless to hinder it, and apparently Moria could do decently vs. Curiel. I don't think those guys were on a level with Marco and Jozu who took on the Admirals in single combat.
I thought it was pretty clear that Marco, Jozu and Vista were the strongest commanders and the rest were strong and all but not on the level of the Admirals etc. At least nothing made it come off that way. Oda said that they aren't ranked in the order of their strength, which tells us that there is such an order, and it seemed pretty obvious to me roughly what it was. But if you still disagree, I don't have much more to offer.
Those seven commanders weren't shown to attack Kizaru or shown charging at Kizaru. They just passed Luffy and one of them mentioned that Luffy shouldn't be held back by just a single Admiral. That sentence alone should point out that the Commanders are pretty strong/cocky.
What happened with Atamos also happened with Joz. Doflamingo didn't seem to struggle holding him back from attacking Crocodile.
And it's funny that you pointed out that the commanders weren't ranked in terms of strength when you have Commanders 1, 3, and 5 on the top list. They could be the strongest but the war only showed them extensively so it's hard to pinpoint the other's strength.
They said "We'll attack together! No Admiral can stop us!" and Kizaru replied with his usual sarcastic face and comments. And it isn't like Kizaru doesn't know when he should step carefully despite his easy-going demeanor (Rayleigh, Beckman).
Not quite. Jozu was off-guard (though I guess you can say it wasn't very smart of him to be so) and Doflamingo only immobilized him. Atmos was facing Doflamingo head-on, and was enraged at him for attacking Oars, but he was simply snatched up as easily as anything and started executing his friends. There's also Moria and Curiel, as I mentioned.
The fact that Oda chose these particular ones to be shown in the war, and to take on top-caliber individuals single-handedly, is most assuredly because they are the strongest. I don't think they're the strongest because they're #1, #3 and #5 (I think #2 was weaker than them, for reference) but because they were the ones that got the focus and the feats. He had no time to show them all, so the most important ones got the panel time. If there were any other ones that were that powerful, he should have hinted at it, but most of them were really "just there".
@ultimateclima:
Those seven commanders weren't shown to attack Kizaru or shown charging at Kizaru. They just passed Luffy and one of them mentioned that Luffy shouldn't be held back by just a single Admiral. That sentence alone should point out that the Commanders are pretty strong/cocky.
What happened with Atamos also happened with Joz. Doflamingo didn't seem to struggle holding him back from attacking Crocodile.
And it's funny that you pointed out that the commanders weren't ranked in terms of strength when you have Commanders 1, 3, and 5 on the top list. They could be the strongest but the war only showed them extensively so it's hard to pinpoint the other's strength.
It was only heavily implied and we see them repeatedly fail to injure admirals.
He also didn't use Jozu to destroy his crewmates. Either because he couldn't do more than hold Jozu back or he didn't want too. I'm going to go with the former since Donflomingo needs limits. Somebody confirmed above Jinbei's strength seems a likely limit to his puppet powers.
Yes but Oda gave us names and impressive feats from certains members so they would stand out. Its no coincidence that the ones shown to do well versus Shichibukai and Admirals also happened to be the highest numbers. The others weren't portrayed as very strong for a reason and it wouldn't be left to interpretation how high they rank in the world. If they were all remotely as strong as Vista, Ace, and Jozu Moria and Akainu would be dead now.
They said "We'll attack together! No Admiral can stop us!" and Kizaru replied with his usual sarcastic face and comments. And it isn't like Kizaru doesn't know when he should step carefully despite his easy-going demeanor (Rayleigh, Beckman).
Izo from the chapter: You can't let yourself get held up by a single Admiral!! Come with us!!! // With the Marine infantry retreating, this is our chance!! / We're gonna break through their ranks!!!
And that's from c-net's translations. Kizaru's comments against them were the same against every other strong opponent he faced.
And Beckman showing up didn't mean anything since he ended up spamming the seas with laser beams anyways.
Not quite. Jozu was off-guard (though I guess you can say it wasn't very smart of him to be so) and Doflamingo only immobilized him. Atmos was facing Doflamingo head-on, and was enraged at him for attacking Oars, but he was simply snatched up as easily as anything and started executing his friends. There's also Moria and Curiel, as I mentioned.
You could say the same thing about Aokiji when Joz "hurt" him. And in the end Joz ended up frozen.
And what about Moria and Curiel? They faced each other. We didn't see their fight we saw Curiel was going to launch a shot against Moria. Curiel was also the Commander shown hurt against Akainu when they were in a large group. This only shows that Curiel wasn't able to defeat him.
The fact that Oda chose these particular ones to be shown in the war, and to take on top-caliber individuals single-handedly, is most assuredly because they are the strongest. I don't think they're the strongest because they're #1, #3 and #5 (I think #2 was weaker than them, for reference) but because they were the ones that got the focus and the feats. He had no time to show them all, so the most important ones got the panel time. If there were any other ones that were that powerful, he should have hinted at it, but most of them were really "just there".
If they weren't on that level then there'd be no need to have them as Whitebeard Commanders. Even if they were as strong as say Ace that'd still put them on Admiral level by default.
Buht you see, fishmens are rly not as week as you think they ahr. Yhou could say much more? Iht's a gewd thing u didn#t, becuz yourea rgument would fall Apart. Fishmanz are phisically 10x strongar than Humans….......................oO Yes, physicly, but taht does not exlcude them from being defeeted by alternate meenz.............................................................................. xp Kuroobi was defated by beign deprived of oxygin.... Chew was dafeated by sneeky methods.... Hatchan was defeated becuz, while he is 10x strongar himslef, Zoro is a freekin monstar like you said urself in another thread.... Nd Arlawng was defeeted becuz Luffy is a monster himself, treined in teh junglez, and was enraged becuz he found about Nami doing her drawingz, and he also had teh froot of teh sea.... Nd Jinbe has shown himslef to be a pritty strawng fishmanz.... He took a blow frum Akainu!
reported u btw
The "…...............oO" ,"reported u" & "grammerz"finished me off. You & Gliblord (15 crewmates imitation post in the DP thread)team up from now on
It was only heavily implied and we see them repeatedly fail to injure admirals.
Their objective wasn't to beat up the Admirals. It was to save Ace. Quote above shows they were trying to get to the platform. And by repeated you mean that one time by rakuyou.
He also didn't use Jozu to destroy his crewmates. Either because he couldn't do more than hold Jozu back or he didn't want too. I'm going to go with the former since Donflomingo needs limits. Somebody confirmed above Jinbei's strength seems a likely limit to his puppet powers.
No. You might want to recheck that scene. He held Joz back so he can talk to Crocodile. And once their conversation was over Crocodile blew them all away with a sandstorm.
Yes but Oda gave us names and impressive feats from certains members so they would stand out. Its no coincidence that the ones shown to do well versus Shichibukai and Admirals also happened to be the highest numbers. The others weren't portrayed as very strong for a reason and it wouldn't be left to interpretation how high they rank in the world. If they were all remotely as strong as Vista, Ace, and Jozu Moria and Akainu would be dead now.
I forgot the only way to show you're part of the best of the best is if you curbstomp and kill the best of the best in battle.
They pretty obviously threatened Kizaru. It's not as if they were saying or implying "if he won't move, we'll just have to retreat!!". And Kizaru in turn clearly gave Beckman and Rayleigh more respect than them in my eyes. I don't think this is insignificant.
Say the same about what when? Atmos faced Doflamingo head-on, and was made a mockery of. Jozu faced him off-guard and was caught but not controlled. Then Jozu attacked Aokiji while the Admiral was off-guard, made him bleed, they fought off-panel and it seemed that Jozu only lost when he was distracted. In the end Jozu looks like a guy that can compete with an Admiral and Atmos looks like a guy who had no chance at all against Doflamingo. What about Curiel and Moria? Curiel attacked after Moria mocked Whitebeard, and Moria was later fine. Don't you think someone on level with an Admiral would've made short work of his lazy ass?
What do you mean no need? A crew doesn't "need" 16 fighters all on level with the Admirals, that actually sounds more than a bit ridiculous, and nor were they ever portrayed to be as powerful as that. They are still very strong and highly respected individuals but only Marco, Jozu and Vista and to an extent or another Rakoyu and Ace were portrayed as being able to fight them 1v1 and do well.
They pretty obviously threatened Kizaru. It's not as if they were saying or implying "if he won't move, we'll just have to retreat!!". And Kizaru in turn clearly gave Beckman and Rayleigh more respect than them in my eyes. I don't think this is insignificant.
Where in that quote does it say they threatened Kizaru?
And can you stop bringing up Beckman? Kizaru ended up spamming the submarine in the end anyways and Beckman did nothing to stop it. His "response" was the same response he has shown everybody, including those Commanders.
Say the same about what when? Atmos faced Doflamingo head-on, and was made a mockery of. Jozu faced him off-guard and was caught but not controlled. Then Jozu attacked Aokiji while the Admiral was off-guard, made him bleed, they fought off-panel and it seemed that Jozu only lost when he was distracted. In the end Jozu looks like a guy that can compete with an Admiral and Atmos looks like a guy who had no chance at all against Doflamingo. What about Curiel and Moria? Curiel attacked after Moria mocked Whitebeard, and Moria was later fine. Don't you think someone on level with an Admiral would've made short work of his lazy ass?
Since that's the only time Doflamingo faces any of the Commanders there's no reason to suspect he couldn't do that to the rest if he wanted to. In fact, until Doflamingo's powers are explained then he's pretty much the most "powerful" in that respect.
And the problem is that the Moria and Curiel scene was like every other fight in the war. For all we know Joz and Aokiji didn't even fight after Joz knocked him off guard (it's not very likely given the context but still possible) Every confrontation wasn't a duel to the death. If nothing else, then that just proves Curiel isn't at the same level as them.
What do you mean no need? A crew doesn't "need" 16 fighters all on level with the Admirals, that actually sounds more than a bit ridiculous, and nor were they ever portrayed to be as powerful as that. They are still very strong and highly respected individuals but only Marco, Jozu and Vista and to an extent or another Rakoyu and Ace were portrayed as being able to fight them 1v1 and do well.
That's the thing. We don't know they're abilities at all. You're assuming the rest of them are all lower than the best while I don't. I'm basing it on the fact that they were given Whitebeard commander titles so they are that strong and you're basing it on how they weren't shown on screen so they're weaker.
What else do you think they were doing? Honestly now. It's either that they threatened him or that they were going to meekly retreat if he went after them. Kizaru stopped what he was doing and put his hands up when Beckman appeared and pointed a rifle at him. He called his bluff after a while but that doesn't mean he was not threatened. Do you think Oda would make someone as badass as Ben Beckman doing something as badass as that if he was actually useless and wasn't a threat? That would just make him look dumb.
That's definitely not how it works. We know for a fact he can't do it to anyone, since he couldn't beat Whitebeard. There is a limit to his power. Atmos wasn't strong enough to avoid getting caught, you can't just jump from there to that he can do it to every commander. As it happens he did use his power on Jozu, and Oda made it happen when Jozu was off-guard and he did not have Doflamingo control him. It is very likely that he did that because he couldn't have done the same thing to him as to Atmos. I know the war was chaotic but that doesn't mean we can assume Oda didn't do what he did for a reason. You say Rakoyu was shown taking on Kizaru, I agree it means something. I say Curiel was shown taking on Moria and Atmos be toyed with by Doflamingo, and it would be hypocritical to let it mean something when it suits you and claim the war chaos card when it doesn't.
But are you even asking why? Did you think it was mere coincidence that guys #1 #3 and #5 command respect from the Admirals and Mihawk while the rest were never shown to do so to that extent at all? Happenstance that it was Marco and Jozu that were shown here and here, or Marco and Vista here? You can't actually believe that. Those things happened the way they did because Marco, Jozu and Vista were the strongest of the commanders.
Ich würde dir ja gerne in der deutschen Sprache antworten, aber ich habe das Gefühl, dass du nicht einmal das verstehen würdest. Um es dennoch zusammenzufassen: Du kommst in eins der größten, wenn nicht das größte, OP-Foren und wagst es, den Manga schlecht zu machen, während du nebenbei diesen Müll namens Naruto anbetest. Und da wunderst du dich wirklich, dass die User entsprechend reagieren?
OmG… der Thread heißt Most Disappointing Thing in One Piece und ich sage hier MEINE Meinung. Nerv nicht, Kind... Und ich bete Naruto nicht an, ich finde es nur besser, aber da gehört nicht hierher.
I feel like a lot of people's problems with strong fishmen is that there doesn't seem to be any true _top-_tier fishmen. Because definitions can vary I'll specify that I'm talking about people like the Admirals, the Emperors, Marco, Sengoku and so forth. People had high expectations for Tiger since raiding Mariejois sounded like a badass enough feat to be one, but that didn't happen. Now Jimbei, he's certainly strong but it's clear enough that he can't dance with those guys, and neither should anyone else currently seen in this arc. You'd think that there'd be someone who went all the way and became strong enough to compete at THE highest level, even though fishmen are far fewer than humans.
THIS! It is only my opinion. I would love only ONE top tier level.
is that you, you look like dave chapelle, which is very fitting
No, it's not me. It's BlackbusterCritic, a guy on YouTube.
His expression perfectly fits this situation.
Translation(I think)- Amatsu:
OmG … The thread is the Most Disappointing Thing in One Piece and I'm saying my opinion. Not annoying, child ... And I pray not to Naruto, I think it's just better, but that does not belong here.
we all have to look like celebrities, i look like a young bob geldof with better hair
I've never seen any celebrities that remotely resemble me.
If I ever did, I would probably do the whole Prince and the Pauper thing.
Alright, he doesn't even get it if told in German. And as I thought his argumentation is pretty much cliché for some german kids (no offense against Germans but I've played a german online MMORPG some years ago and amatsu's as dumb as the majority of the players there). Which means that he's stuck to his opinion and keeps telling his crap.
Alright, he doesn't even get it if told in German.
Was soll ich nicht verstanden haben? Kann es sein, dass du selbst dumm bist? xDD Oder zumindest nicht weißt, was du geschrieben hast… Ich wiederhole es halt: OmG... der Thread heißt Most Disappointing Thing in One Piece und ich sage hier MEINE Meinung. Nerv nicht, Kind... Und ich bete Naruto nicht an, ich finde es nur besser, aber da gehört nicht hierher. Brauchst jetzt auch nicht mit den andern in Englisch über mich lästern, nur weil du nicht normal auf Deutsch antworten kannst, obwohl du selbst damit angefangen hast. Eierkopf. xD Können ja auch italienisch reden...
:getlost: Sorry.
Was soll ich nicht verstanden haben? Kann es sein, dass du selbst dumm bist? xDD Oder zumindest nicht weißt, was du geschrieben hast… Ich wiederhole es halt: OmG... der Thread heißt Most Disappointing Thing in One Piece und ich sage hier MEINE Meinung. Nerv nicht, Kind... Und ich bete Naruto nicht an, ich finde es nur besser, aber da gehört nicht hierher. Brauchst jetzt auch nicht mit den andern in Englisch über mich lästern, nur weil du nicht normal auf Deutsch antworten kannst, obwohl du selbst damit angefangen hast. Eierkopf. xD Können ja auch italienisch reden...
:getlost: Sorry.
Dann eben noch einmal, son. Kapierst du denn nicht, dass du nicht nur deine Meinung sagst, sondern auch One Piece in einem One Piece Forum schlecht machst? Wegen diesem Grund und auch der Tatsache, dass du weder Deutsch noch Englisch richtig beherrscht, sieht man dich hier nur als amüsanten Zeitvertreib an. Und mehr bist du für mich ebenfalls nicht, weshalb ich deine restlichen 'Argumente' mit einem Schmunzeln lesen werde und mir nicht extra die Mühe mache, sie zu kommentieren.
Well enough German for now. My bad guys but I guess that's the only language he somehow understands. :happy:
@ultimateclima:
Where in that quote does it say they threatened Kizaru?
And can you stop bringing up Beckman? Kizaru ended up spamming the submarine in the end anyways and Beckman did nothing to stop it. His "response" was the same response he has shown everybody, including those Commanders.
So now you're going to downplay the significance of the only man who made an Admiral hesitate? Kizaru moves at the speed of light and realized Shanks didn't want the fighting to escalate so made his move. Very easy for the light man to try again while his enemy has his guard down when he suspects they actually have no intention to fight.
They clearly rushed Kizaru and he didn't care. It doesn't matter what Kizaru did later against Ben Beckman. For the panel where he stopped his attack he clearly felt the need to be careful. No so for the commanders.
Since that's the only time Doflamingo faces any of the Commanders there's no reason to suspect he couldn't do that to the rest if he wanted to. In fact, until Doflamingo's powers are explained then he's pretty much the most "powerful" in that respect.
That is nonsense. You don't just assume somebodies powers have no limits just because none is shown.That is the very definition of a no limits fallacy.
And the problem is that the Moria and Curiel scene was like every other fight in the war. For all we know Joz and Aokiji didn't even fight after Joz knocked him off guard (it's not very likely given the context but still possible) Every confrontation wasn't a duel to the death. If nothing else, then that just proves Curiel isn't at the same level as them.
If you acknowledge its unlikely why even bring it up? They fought off-camera. There is absolutely no reason to assume otherwise.
That's the thing. We don't know they're abilities at all. You're assuming the rest of them are all lower than the best while I don't. I'm basing it on the fact that they were given Whitebeard commander titles so they are that strong and you're basing it on how they weren't shown on screen so they're weaker.
We're basing it on how they are portrayed which is very important for figuring out how they stand amongst confirmed big shots. You're argument is just to assume what you want until they are fully revealed. Inazuma has a comparable rank in the Revolutionaries as WB's DC? Inazuma is clearly much weaker than Kuma or Iva or are you going to argue that its too early to judge his strength despite how he is portrayed? Or is the argument going to be its OK to for a Revolutionary commander to be portrayed as only above average in strength but a Yonkou, or just WB's crew, should be held to a higher caliber? If you think either I'd like to know why?
OmG… der Thread heißt Most Disappointing Thing in One Piece und ich sage hier MEINE Meinung. Nerv nicht, Kind... Und ich bete Naruto nicht an, ich finde es nur besser, aber da gehört nicht hierher.
THIS! It is only my opinion. I would love only ONE top tier level.
Oh hey you're posting.
You know what might be a good thing to post? Responses to me.
Get on it:
http://apforums.net/showthread.php?t=27758&p=2286063&viewfull=1#post2286063
The most disappointing thing in One Piece is Robin managing to clone her clothes. Damn you Oda, you ruined all my hopes. I always thought Robin never uses her fullbody clones because she can't clone her clothes… but Oda thought otherwise.... Damn you Oda.
Oh hey you're posting.
You know what might be a good thing to post? Responses to me.
Get on it:
http://apforums.net/showthread.php?t=27758&p=2286063&viewfull=1#post2286063
No? I don't like endless discussions like you, because i have RL, sorry… I said all i wanted? and read my first post this Site, Coruscation is right, imo. He can talk better and said my opinion.
Dann eben noch einmal, son. Kapierst du denn nicht, dass du nicht nur deine Meinung sagst, sondern auch One Piece in einem One Piece Forum schlecht machst? Wegen diesem Grund und auch der Tatsache, dass du weder Deutsch noch Englisch richtig beherrscht, sieht man dich hier nur als amüsanten Zeitvertreib an. Und mehr bist du für mich ebenfalls nicht, weshalb ich deine restlichen 'Argumente' mit einem Schmunzeln lesen werde und mir nicht extra die Mühe mache, sie zu kommentieren.
Inwiefern mache ich One Piece schlecht, wenn ich meine Meinung sage (und ich habe ja wohl oft genug gesagt, dass es nur meine Meinung ist) und sie, weil die Leute es so wollen, versuche halbwegs zu begründen??? Darum geht es hier halt. Du bist wirklich nicht so schlau, oder? Aber reg dich nicht zu sehr auf jetzt. :wassat:
Well enough German for now. My bad guys but I guess that's the only language he somehow understands. :happy:
I understand 4 Languages and amodicum of JAP, also pls stop it… This is annoying. I only said that i don't like it that there are not many really strong Fishmans and that they cry mucha jugle cat in the bathroom, just calm down Just calm down now, let's stop the Fight. ome pants on Only my opinon.
"And I pray not to Naruto."
What's wrong with praying to the Almighty Savior of the ninja world?
Ah the good old "No I have a life" excuse. You know sometimes that actually works but here I'd say it doesn't. Here it feels like you just not wanting to debate with someone far more capable than you and trying to cover it up with "I have better things to do". Which I'm not necessarily saying you don't but I really feel you were just making excuses with the "RL" thing.
I really would like to hear why you think "Naruto>>>OP" just because it has always been interesting to look at opinions that differ greatly from my own. For all I know you could have perfectly legitimate reasons for why you think that. Though I kind of doubt it somehow but regardless I'd like to hear.
No? I don't like endless discussions like you, because i have RL, sorry… I said all i wanted? and read my first post this Site, Coruscation is right, imo. He can talk better and said my opinion.
Lol I always love the "I can't do this I got A LIFE" excuse for not responding.
So basically you're not responding to me because you can't respond to any of my points. That's because all your points are dead wrong.
Just as long we've gotten that out of the way.