It's the anime. Almost everything looks weaker. Heck… Even Daible Jamble does not explode into a flaming star.
A Study of One Piece Animation
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Seems to me that they just go all out on certain scenes then just kind of…die.
Were the current episodes produced/animated back when movie 10 was still in production? I certainly hope that's the case, because it would be nice seeing some drastic improvement now that they have more money (both from finishing the movie and from the massive fortune it brought in).
Also, did anyone who watched that Cam-rip of the movie catch who (all) the animators were?
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WTF people? That Jet Gattling was a basic move used to remove an opponent out of the way in a nonchalant manner. It can't be compared to to a final all or nothing attack. Animators always put in the effort to important finishers. This is standard stuff almost every animation company does unless they're super loaded in the budget and can afford to make every frame a masterpiece (ex. Afro Samurai), why are people being stupid and expecting more from Toei than what most companies would even provide?
The answer is - animators think they know story and stuff better than author. Thats why they fail when differ.
The anime nowadays looks like cheap amateur performance. And I'm sure that if animation was being made by fans quality would have been skyhigh awesome. And then give it to seiyus. One Piece attracts enough people of all profiles to rapidly create animated cartoon good enough to be called One Piece anime. Fuck!The animators are extremely faithful to Oda. To the point that they go and change Luffy's colour of the vest at the last minute and animate practically every single thing to the most accurate degree including Buggy and Mr.3's thinking session and those little one panel power explanation thingys.You want cheap amateur performance, go look at the Fairy Tail anime. And I'd like to see what kind of high quality the fans can make with the amount of budget the producers have. Seriously, your entire post reeks of bull-propagandist, uninformed-shit.
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People were complaining about the Jet Gatling not looking powerful enough when that chapter first came out. Funny how short/selective their memories seem.
~Stargazer~, ~Distance~ original stories.
3DS Friend Code: 2234-8294-8917
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People were complaining about the Jet Gatling not looking powerful enough when that chapter first came out. Funny how short/selective their memories seem.
This.
Thinking about it, Luffy pummeling Hannyabal aggressively like the anime did with Lucci would look hilariously exaggerated.
@Thousand:
The animators are extremely faithful to Oda. To the point that they go and change Luffy's colour of the vest at last minute and animate practically every single thing to the most accurate degree including Buggy and Mr.3's thinking session and those little one panel power explanation thingys.
You know what, i doubt any other anime series out there has a staff as much in touch with the original author as Toei and Oda seem to be.
To the point of small details like Hannyabal's elephant boxers from the last SBS showing up in an episode. -
@Thousand:
You want cheap amateur performance, go look at the Fairy Tail anime. And I'd like to see what kind of high quality the fans can make with the amount of budget the producers have. Seriously, your entire post reeks of bull propagandist, uninformed shit.
Thank you very much.
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To the point of small details like Hannyabal's elephant boxers from the last SBS showing up in an episode.
This, the animators put more detail into episodes than you think.
Also I thought the animation for the last episode was pretty decent.
Is it mind blowing movie-level animation…..no.
But you are a moron if you think a weekly series has the budget for that level of animation every episode.When Luffy used the Jet Gatting on Lucci and on Oars, they were extremely high budget episodes.
Why on earth would Toei spend all their cash on Luffy vs Hannyabal, when the war arc is just round the corner.Having said all that, I still think it looked decent, the Jet Stamp looked quite cool.
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But you are a moron if you think a weekly series has the budget for that level of animation every episode.
what really bugs me that Bleach is a weakly series too, and with pretty low ratings…
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I take it you're not familiar with the fact that Bleach is pretty infamous for low-quality visuals half the time. To say nothing of it's incredibly poor pacing, but that's a different subject entirely.
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I actually don't know what do you mean by "low-quality visuals" :ninja: -
Then you have not watched enough Bleach.
~Stargazer~, ~Distance~ original stories.
3DS Friend Code: 2234-8294-8917
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@Thousand:
WTF people? That Jet Gattling was a basic move used to remove an opponent out of the way in a nonchalant manner. It can't be compared to to a final all or nothing attack. Animators always put in the effort to important finishers. This is standard stuff almost every animation company does unless they're super loaded in the budget and can afford to make every frame a masterpiece (ex. Afro Samurai), why are people being stupid and expecting more from Toei than what most companies would even provide?
The animators are extremely faithful to Oda. To the point that they go and change Luffy's colour of the vest at the last minute and animate practically every single thing to the most accurate degree including Buggy and Mr.3's thinking session and those little one panel power explanation thingys.You want cheap amateur performance, go look at the Fairy Tail anime. And I'd like to see what kind of high quality the fans can make with the amount of budget the producers have. Seriously, your entire post reeks of bull-propagandist, uninformed-shit.
It's scary when I agree with Thousand Lion-Chan, but I do, though in a slightly less inflammatory way. One Piece has been doing a pretty good job in keeping good faith with the manga. As well as a series can do this far down the road. Of course ten years later things are going to look different, but if it looked the same I bet you'd all be complaining a lot more. One Piece looks a shitload better now then it did in the East Blue Saga, and though it may be more inconsistent it's kind of cool to get different perspectives on Oda's work each week. Tate, for example, probably strays furthest from the pack, but he produces the best product. Take the good with the bad and enjoy the damn series.
Host and Founder The One Piece Podcast The views expressed are solely my own.
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Then you have not watched enough Bleach.
Not to mention the fact that Bleach isn't even produced in HD, which helps to mask its flaws.
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When Luffy used the Jet Gatting on Lucci and on Oars, they were extremely high budget episodes.
Why on earth would Toei spend all their cash on Luffy vs Hannyabal, when the war arc is just round the corner.Having said all that, I still think it looked decent, the Jet Stamp looked quite cool.
I don't really see the budget being an isssue. Jet Gattling or Luffy's Jets in general are supposed to look like fast gunshots with quick reload. Punches and kicks so fast, you can't see. That does not really require much "animation" at all to simplify (the one used on the last ep was just a few punch to face. maybe 12 ot 15 in under a second).
Then agian… I'm sure most animators do not even know how gears work. Most of the time it just looks like Luffy going with no gears.
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I don't really see the budget being an isssue. Jet Gattling or Luffy's Jets in general are supposed to look like fast gunshots with quick reload. Punches and kicks so fast, you can't see. That does not really require much "animation" at all to simplify (the one used on the last ep was just a few punch to face. maybe 12 ot 15 in under a second).
Then agian… I'm sure most animators do not even know how gears work. Most of the time it just looks like Luffy going with no gears.
Actually, they're supposed to be the speed of sound, hence the word "jet" and the fact that Oda only draws the actual impact which looks a lot like a sound wave.
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I don't really see the budget being an isssue. Jet Gattling or Luffy's Jets in general are supposed to look like fast gunshots with quick reload. Punches and kicks so fast, you can't see. That does not really require much "animation" at all to simplify (the one used on the last ep was just a few punch to face. maybe 12 ot 15 in under a second).
Then agian… I'm sure most animators do not even know how gears work. Most of the time it just looks like Luffy going with no gears.
You have a point here. I can't see how not drawing the arms and just let the sfx team do a few shockwaves would eat up more budget than accutaly drawing the arms for a couple of panels. This particual scene may have been treaded so badly because the director didn't knew what he was doing. Sadly that still leaves us with all the other badly animated scenes we got lately. Most of them are really lacking budged.
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@Zach:
It's scary when I agree with Thousand Lion-Chan, but I do, though in a slightly less inflammatory way. One Piece has been doing a pretty good job in keeping good faith with the manga. As well as a series can do this far down the road. Of course ten years later things are going to look different, but if it looked the same I bet you'd all be complaining a lot more. One Piece looks a shitload better now then it did in the East Blue Saga, and though it may be more inconsistent it's kind of cool to get different perspectives on Oda's work each week. Tate, for example, probably strays furthest from the pack, but he produces the best product. Take the good with the bad and enjoy the damn series.
There's nothing wrong with a little insult here and there to spice up the post and give some entertainment to the readers.
And yeah, agree with you wholeheartedly on the consistency thing. If there's one thing the anime lacks currently that had in the past is consistency. The trade-off though is that the peak episodes like this week's are incredibly good.
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I don't really see the budget being an isssue. Jet Gattling or Luffy's Jets in general are supposed to look like fast gunshots with quick reload. Punches and kicks so fast, you can't see. That does not really require much "animation" at all to simplify (the one used on the last ep was just a few punch to face. maybe 12 ot 15 in under a second).
Then agian… I'm sure most animators do not even know how gears work. Most of the time it just looks like Luffy going with no gears.
If you're basically talking about how the Jet Gattling was performed, then no, the budget probably wouldn't have been an issue.
It seems that there are certain ways to animate Luffy's moves that are just better than others. When we're referring to just one move though, the show sure would be ridiculously repetitive if one of his moves was animated/directed the same way each and every time. Not only does its narrative effect not change, but it'd probably take up more time and move too in to trying to impress fans in the episode than most people watching it would like. If we were talking about how Luffy was animated throughout a whole scene however, then this argument most likely wouldn't stand.
GearThird-sized thumb down to whoever said that OP's permanent animation would sky rocket if fans animated it. No idea what kind of shiz animators go through.
And yes, Bleach's animation really jumps out a plane, forgets its parachute, and lands in a vat full of unimaginative and long-faced soup sometimes.
- Credit to: LilithSchlangenauge on DA - -
And yes, Bleach's animation really jumps out a plane, forgets its parachute, and lands in a vat full of unimaginative and long-faced soup sometimes.
This made me almost choke on my water! What's "long-faced soup"? Lol
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Why there is even a discussion over a Jet Gattling which was done by a poor supervisor? I mean seriously, what did you expect from Deguchi?
One Piece lacks skilled animators. Most of Toei's animators are old who are used to shooting lasers from DB.
I hate to say this but I kinda hope One Piece TV ratings go down. That's the only reason they are going to start pumping money into the show. Just like how it was from Thriller Bark.
Toei handling of the animators:
Last One Piece episode: Kenji Kuroyanagi (And he is no way close to the level of the other two)
Last Heartcatch Precure episode: Yoshihiko Umakoshi and SushioGoogle the names if you have no idea about them. Precure gets the best of Japan animators while One Piece is the total opposite.
Precure>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>One Piece, that's what Toei thinks.
I'm still keeping my final judgment on Toei until the War arc starts.
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If you guys want to be really really picky about it.
This doesn't even look like Jet Gatting in the manga, it looks like Jet Bazooka!http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/543/11/
I can't see any evidence of multiple punches, at all. I suppose you could say its too fast to see, but it looks like the Jet Bazooka pose to me.
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Why there is even a discussion over a Jet Gattling which was done by a poor supervisor? I mean seriously, what did you expect from Deguchi?
One Piece lacks skilled animators. Most of Toei's animators are old who are used to shooting lasers from DB.
I hate to say this but I kinda hope One Piece TV ratings go down. That's the only reason they are going to start pumping money into the show. Just like how it was from Thriller Bark.
I'm still keeping my final judgment on Toei until the War arc starts.
You're not going to get your wish anytime soon.
Still, I think you're going to extremes on the whole deal with One Piece's animation stuff. From Day 1 One Piece has never tried to compete with the eye candy fests of Naruto and Bleach because it had different standards.
One Piece is never going to look like the guys who did the Naruto openings and the Sasuke vs. Killer Bee fight and the closest we got to that was the end of Thriller Bark.
But I would like to emphasize that One Piece has hardly ever dropped the ball on any moments in the manga that are a big "DON!" Even during Enies Lobby which the animation was at it's most questionable we still got a lot of good scenes out of it like the reunion with Robin on the roof of Enies Lobby, Robin's flashback, the Going Merry's reappearance and funeral just to name a few. Even more recently we got Luffy punching the Celestial Dragon, episode 405, and Luffy's first obvious use of Haki.
Impel Down has been overall decent but even when reading the manga there was nothing that screamed "This should have epic animation!" but once they hit Marineford it will be a different story.
I see no reason to divorce myself from the series just because it's in a minor animation slump. Shoot Naruto had an 82 episode barf fest and even when they began Shippuden how many episodes did it take before the animation was awesome again? Long running series all go through this, especially ones that seem determined to break the Dragonball franchise's episode count.
So I don't freak if I have a season (13-26 episodes) of meh animation, we got through Skypiea that way.
O-chan
Check out my artwork and my musings here:
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You're not going to get your wish anytime soon.
Still, I think you're going to extremes on the whole deal with One Piece's animation stuff. From Day 1 One Piece has never tried to compete with the eye candy fests of Naruto and Bleach because it had different standards.
One Piece is never going to look like the guys who did the Naruto openings and the Sasuke vs. Killer Bee fight and the closest we got to that was the end of Thriller Bark.
But I would like to emphasize that One Piece has hardly ever dropped the ball on any moments in the manga that are a big "DON!" Even during Enies Lobby which the animation was at it's most questionable we still got a lot of good scenes out of it like the reunion with Robin on the roof of Enies Lobby, Robin's flashback, the Going Merry's reappearance and funeral just to name a few. Even more recently we got Luffy punching the Celestial Dragon, episode 405, and Luffy's first obvious use of Haki.
Impel Down has been overall decent but even when reading the manga there was nothing that screamed "This should have epic animation!" but once they hit Marineford it will be a different story.
I see no reason to divorce myself from the series just because it's in a minor animation slump. Shoot Naruto had an 82 episode barf fest and even when they began Shippuden how many episodes did it take before the animation was awesome again? Long running series all go through this, especially ones that seem determined to break the Dragonball franchise's episode count.
So I don't freak if I have a season (13-26 episodes) of meh animation, we got through Skypiea that way.
O-chan
I highly anticipate Ace's death. I believe it's going to be the greatest thing the anime will ever deliver.
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I agree, I'd rather Impel Down get the shitty pacing and animation and have Marineford kick all types of ass. Though I would have rather had Amazon Lily and the filler have crappy animation, but hey, can't always get your way I guess.
Host and Founder The One Piece Podcast The views expressed are solely my own.
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If you guys want to be really really picky about it.
This doesn't even look like Jet Gatting in the manga, it looks like Jet Bazooka!http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/543/11/
I can't see any evidence of multiple punches, at all. I suppose you could say its too fast to see, but it looks like the Jet Bazooka pose to me.
There's multiple hits to the face, plus multiple sound effects. There's your evidence. Jet Bazooka is one huge hit with one big sound effect.
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@Zach:
I agree, I'd rather Impel Down get the shitty pacing and animation and have Marineford kick all types of ass. Though I would have rather had Amazon Lily and the filler have crappy animation, but hey, can't always get your way I guess.
I think what XmuradX was going on about is how Toei has "lost their touch" but the truth is if you look at the history of all their major long running properties the animation declined right before a big surge of excellent animation. I'll bring two of Toei's money makers into example: Dragonball (as a whole) and Sailor Moon.
Dragonball:
Pilaf arc (good animation)>Tournement Saga (okay animation)>Red Ribbon (inconsistent animation)>2nd Tournement Saga (okay to great animation)> Demon King Piccolo Saga (great to excellent animation)>3rd Tournament Saga (great animation)Dragonball Z
Saiyan Arc (good to great animation)>Freeza Arc (mediocre to good animation)> Cell Arc (good to excellent animation)>Buu Arc (great to excellent animation)Sailor Moon Classic (poor to good animation)
Sailor Moon R (good to great to mediocre)
Sailor Moon S (consistently good)
Sailor Moon SuperS (great animation)
Sailor Moon Stars (great to excellent)Maybe this is simplifying it, but if people look into the post I have provided throughout the thread (if you tube didn't already delete the clips) Toei's series have had their ups and downs but Toei has always shown to know when to deliver the good animation where it counts.
Another thing that I would like to bring into light is that we're not children. Think about all the series we watched as kids and seemed to be cool but these days seem kind of bleh. One Piece, Naruto, Bleach are still leagues ahead of the anime series that aired during the late 80's and majority of the 90's. I think to be honest we all got a little spoiled in today's anime trends and now we expect OAV to theatrical quality on a weekly basis.
I know that XmuradX keeps citing Pretty Cure but I have to question, is that series and ongoing series that has chalked up close to 500 episodes? I know Pretty Cure (and it a later sense Doremi) have had long runs but has it always been consistently animated on a weekly basis that way? Even Digimon Tamers (the third Digimon series) was only animated well for the length of its run.
Pierrot (Naruto and Bleach studio) is not perfect all the time. Look at Fushigi Yugi and GTO. They're popular series but they didn't get consistently great animation but that didn't stop them from getting a lot of praise among anime fans.
Overall, I think we're expecting way to much out of One Piece and setting the bar so high that there's no way it can be met unless you want the series canceled and just continued as an OAV series (ala Tsubasa and xxxHolic).
O-chan
Check out my artwork and my musings here:
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Dragonball Z
Saiyan Arc (good to great animation)>Freeza Arc (mediocre to good animation)> Cell Arc (good to excellent animation)>Buu Arc (great to excellent animation)You're forgetting "triangle man" (a la They Might Be Giants) who came in every couple of episodes throughout the entirety of Dragonball Z to mess things up and draw things unnaturally into the story line. So while the majority of animation may fit those qualifications, Dragonball Z had some of the most inconsistent animation I've seen in a long-running Shonen anime. I think most can agree that One Piece has done a far better job keeping a high to medium consistency in the animation in it's 400+ episode run thusfar. Dragonball Z ran half that and had much less consistency.
On the general thrust of your argument, I agree. All long-running series are bound to go through these kind of inconsistencies. Either way, One Piece I believe has been treated far better than some of its predecessors and even successors.
Host and Founder The One Piece Podcast The views expressed are solely my own.
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As someone who's been following Dragon Ball Kai, is it just me, or did the art suddenly get much more inconsistent than before immediately after Goku goes Super Saiyan?
And yeah, One Piece has been largely pretty good about this sort of thing, and anyone who disagrees can go drink motor oil.
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@Zach:
You're forgetting "triangle man" (a la They Might Be Giants) who came in every couple of episodes throughout the entirety of Dragonball Z to mess things up and draw things unnaturally into the story line.
"Every couple of episodes" is kinda exaggerated. I can't remember his name right now, but that guy was the necessary low budget animation director that used to show up after a regular rotation of 6-8 directors.
Besides, when he worked in an episode with some important scene, he used to have the help of a better animator. For instance, watch episode 135 (Vegeta vs 18) and see the art/animation change drastically for the last couple of minutes, you'll know what i mean..
As someone who's been following Dragon Ball Kai, is it just me, or did the art suddenly get much more inconsistent than before immediately after Goku goes Super Saiyan?
I'm not watching Kai, but i know that the first episode after SSJ was indeed bad. Then it goes up and down a lot until the fight ends. Although the last episode of the arc, when people resurrect and stuff, was awesome.
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I'm not watching Kai, but i know that the first episode after SSJ was indeed bad. Then it goes up and down a lot until the fight ends. Although the last episode of the arc, when people resurrect and stuff, was awesome.
I think that may have been (at least part of) the episode that just aired (had everyone on Earth again and ended with Frieza getting bisected with the energy disks). It was indeed pretty nice. There was also another guy that I liked who had kind of a sharpish style and used thinner lines. He did the episode where Vegeta killed Jeese, but I didn't see anything from him after that.
~Stargazer~, ~Distance~ original stories.
3DS Friend Code: 2234-8294-8917
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Okay, a quick lesson on who's who as far as DB/DBZ animators go. The series has a total of like 8 animation supervisors with a few guest ones that pop in from time to time. There are three animation directors that stick out the most when fans refer to Dragonball Z. The first is Maeda Minoru who is responsible for most of the best looking episodes of DBZ and also responsible for the look of the first 3 DBZ movies. The second is Yukio Ebisawa who tends to give characters a more stretched out and elongated look but stays a little on model. The animator that simplifies and makes everyone look angular is Uchiyama Masayuki, who's the DBZ equivalent of our Yokoyama.
I highly recommend you guys take a peak at the Kanzentai website episode guide as they list the animation credits for ALL of Dragonball through the Saiyan arc of DBZ. After that it becomes pretty easy to figure out who's who.
O-chan
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Luckily with Kai, because they are condensing the horrendous pace of the original episodes.
When you get a dodgy animation director he's probably only there for about half an episode or less. -
Sorry for the late reply, I was out of town.
That's some great news, nothing makes me happier than seeing OP in the top. Kinda make me regret what I said before. But I hope One Piece gets better attention from Toei.
Still, I think you're going to extremes on the whole deal with One Piece's animation stuff. From Day 1 One Piece has never tried to compete with the eye candy fests of Naruto and Bleach because it had different standards.
No, Not really. It's just that Toei was a poor animation studio. And they have improved lately. The magical girls series is a good example of how good is Toei at the moment, Compared to the old series they produced like Sailor Moon.
Naruto was nothing special, and on the level of One Piece up to the end of the Zabuza arc, the animation started to get amazing.
Even the old One Piece compared to the current One Piece show us only how poor was studio Toei. And don't say that was 1999. Cause HxH had amazing animation and it was a 1999 anime as well.
Old One Piece<<<<<current one="" piece<br="">But it needs more attention from Toei.
Again, I'm talking about animation quality here. Only.
One Piece is never going to look like the guys who did the Naruto openings and the Sasuke vs. Killer Bee fight and the closest we got to that was the end of Thriller Bark.
Doesn't that mean One Piece is getting less than it deserves? One Piece is clearly more popular and makes more money than Naruto.
Anyway, Tate is doing a pretty good job, but he just needs some skilled animators under him. Just like movie 9. But that's not really a complain. Tate is always satisfying.
The only problem lately is Tate doing nothing of significant importance in Impel Down. Last important episodes for him were 404 and 396.
But I would like to emphasize that One Piece has hardly ever dropped the ball on any moments in the manga that are a big "DON!" Even during Enies Lobby which the animation was at it's most questionable we still got a lot of good scenes out of it like the reunion with Robin on the roof of Enies Lobby, Robin's flashback, the Going Merry's reappearance and funeral just to name a few. Even more recently we got Luffy punching the Celestial Dragon, episode 405, and Luffy's first obvious use of Haki.
Yeah I agree on this, But I'm sure this is the same case with Naruto and Bleach. Still, this have nothing with what I'm trying to say.
And the second half of Enies Lobby had some of shittiest animated episodes ever.
Impel Down has been overall decent but even when reading the manga there was nothing that screamed "This should have epic animation!" but once they hit Marineford it will be a different story.
I think the same about Impel Down. And there was a lot of stuff that screamed "This should have great animation!" (Not Epic), but that is subjective to tastes. Anyway, that's why I'm reserving my final thoughts on Toei handling of this saga until the Whitebeard arc is done. And I hope we don't get another Enies Lobby.
I see no reason to divorce myself from the series just because it's in a minor animation slump. Shoot Naruto had an 82 episode barf fest and even when they began Shippuden how many episodes did it take before the animation was awesome again? Long running series all go through this, especially ones that seem determined to break the Dragonball franchise's episode count.
You are getting the wrong impression from me. I just criticize the animation. I don't have a problem with anything else, even the slow pacing doesn't really annoy me.
I would have dropped One Piece long time ago, If this was the case.
But again, people seem to forget that we are just discussing only animation in this thread. The other qualities of One Piece and specially the story, characters, voice acting, etc, which make up for the poor animation sometimes is not part of this thread, and I never criticize them, cause they are always good.Naruto went through the filler hell for almost 2 years, which destroyed it's popularity, ratings and lost many viewers.
So the beginning of Shippuuden was shitty for a reason. But from the immortals arc and onwards they have done a really great job. And there have been many amazingly animated special episodes and the overall art even for the bad Teams is being touched up by the good supervisors, even for the non-important episodes.
Not to forget Naruto is less popular than One Piece.Heck, as much as I hate the story of the second part of Naruto, which made me drop Naruto manga. But the anime is still keeping me interested in watching the fights because they are greatly animated and nicely done. Even though I dropped Naruto since the arc with Pain attacking Konoho, yet I just want to watch this upcoming arc because I'm sure it will be greatly animated in the anime.
So I don't freak if I have a season (13-26 episodes) of meh animation, we got through Skypiea that way.
Me expressing my opinion on the animation and wishing it to be better =/= Freaking.
Again, I think you are getting the wrong picture here. This is what I thought of ID which is an okay animated arc, IMHO.
422= 8/10
423= 9/10
424= 9/10
425= 9/10
430= 8/10
431= 10/10
432= 10/10
433= 10/10
434= 8/10
435= 6/10
436= 10/10
437= 9/10
438= 9/10
439= 10/10
440= 10/10
441= 9/10
442= 10/10
443= 9/10
444= 8/10
445= 6/10
446= 9/10The next 2 episode are automatic 10/10, for me.
Reference in case you think I'm making this up: http://forums.narutofan.com/search.php?searchid=7661356
Does this sound like someone who is freaking out over the series because it have some poorly animated episodes?
I know that I'm a bit harsh when I criticize the animation, but that's because I take it seriously because I adore and appreciate the great animation and I know what it takes to make one amazing scene, It's just I'm being a bit greedy for wanting One Piece to get what it deserves. Which I think it should considering it's doing well in generating profits for Toei.
I think what XmuradX was going on about is how Toei has "lost their touch" but the truth is if you look at the history of all their major long running properties the animation declined right before a big surge of excellent animation.
How did they lose their touch if they didn't have it in the first place?
Toei have improved a lot lately. But Toei are not using their talented people on One Piece neither they are bringing anyone special from outside. And that's the only thing I nitpick about.
Either you have missed my point or you are not getting me at all from the beginning. I'm not asking for all the episodes to be amazing, I'm sure that I have never implied so. I'm fully aware of the budget limits.
My last post…
Toei handling of the animators:Last One Piece episode: Kenji Kuroyanagi (And he is no way close to the level of the other two)
Last Heartcatch Precure episode: Yoshihiko Umakoshi and SushioPrecure series have great staff most of the time. It doesn't have anything to do with it being a short series compared to One Piece. It's just One Piece gets good staff in the movies only. And almost rarely for the episodes.
It's just Toei are not trying to give the normal OP episodes the level of a movie quality. And I'm sure as hell there was some episodes that deserved so.
Like Luffy Vs. Crocodile.Toei started to use some great animators like Tomita, Shida and Ryou since Thriller Bark. I love their works, and they are movie quality, IMO. But that was during Thriller Bark and Shabondy.
I know that XmuradX keeps citing Pretty Cure but I have to question, is that series and ongoing series that has chalked up close to 500 episodes? I know Pretty Cure (and it a later sense Doremi) have had long runs but has it always been consistently animated on a weekly basis that way? Even Digimon Tamers (the third Digimon series) was only animated well for the length of its run.
Pierrot (Naruto and Bleach studio) is not perfect all the time. Look at Fushigi Yugi and GTO. They're popular series but they didn't get consistently great animation but that didn't stop them from getting a lot of praise among anime fans.
Overall, I think we're expecting way to much out of One Piece and setting the bar so high that there's no way it can be met unless you want the series canceled and just continued as an OAV series (ala Tsubasa and xxxHolic).
Again, I've never said that I want the whole series to be amazingly animated. I said there should be at least some episodes which is done by special animators for any major fight, and I'm pretty sure Toei is capable of doing so, but they never want to bring the best people to work on One Piece, just for the OP movies and pretty cure only only.
A couple of great episodes won't really cancel the show, Bleach and Naruto have many amazing episodes and they do poorly compared to One Piece. So this is not really an excuse. It's just Toei are just cheap.</current>
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Art and animation wise, surely Naruto got way better right after Asuma's death (the show was becoming basically unwatchable), i guess in a desperate move to try and save the ratings - ok, it's failing miserably, probably because it's still a damn boring series to watch. Anyway..
I think the same about Impel Down. And there was a lot of stuff that screamed "This should have great animation!" (Not Epic), but that is subjective to tastes.
I'm with o-chan here, Impel Down didn't have any scene where i thought "this better get great animation" while reading the manga. Maybe, maybe, the latter half of Luffy vs Magellan, but Shingaki did a nice work and that was dramatic enough. Probably the best-directed episode in ID so far.
422= 8/10
423= 9/10
424= 9/10
425= 9/10
430= 8/10
431= 10/10
432= 10/10
433= 10/10
434= 8/10
435= 6/10
436= 10/10
437= 9/10
438= 9/10
439= 10/10
440= 10/10
441= 9/10
442= 10/10
443= 9/10
444= 8/10
445= 6/10
446= 9/10I've been rewatching ID this week and i agree with most of your ratings, although i would rate 438 lower. That, 435 and 445 were the few episodes that really bothered me and i'd call BAD upon a second viewing. 445 is perhaps the worst Takeo Ide episode ever, i don't know what happened there.
Precure series have great staff most of the time.
Really? I could understand if it was only for Heartcatch, given it's a new series and all, still trying to get more viewers. Although i doubt little girls do mind about animation.
On a (un)related note, i've just found that my favorite DBZ animation director,
, works as a key animator under Mamoru Hosoda, including OP movie 6. That's pretty awesome. -
Art and animation wise, surely Naruto got way better right after Asuma's death (the show was becoming basically unwatchable), i guess in a desperate move to try and save the ratings - ok, it's failing miserably, probably because it's still a damn boring series to watch. Anyway..
The story went downhill after the immortals arc. There was some good parts, but overall it's indeed have become very boring to watch. I find myself skipping episodes even though I hate to do that.
I'm with o-chan here, Impel Down didn't have any scene where i thought "this better get great animation" while reading the manga. Maybe, maybe, the latter half of Luffy vs Magellan, but Shingaki did a nice work and that was dramatic enough. Probably the best-directed episode in ID so far.
Main stuff I wanted great animation for are Luffy Vs. Blackbeard, and I'm sure Katsumi won't disappoint.
! the final stuff at the end with Jimbey, Magellan Vs. Luffy re-match.
436 was really well done for a half chapter. And the art was great. The animation was overall good.
But yeah, nothing in ID that needs movie quality animation, since the fights are really short here.
I've been rewatching ID this week and i agree with most of your ratings, although i would rate 438 lower. That, 435 and 445 were the few episodes that really bothered me and i'd call BAD upon a second viewing. 445 is perhaps the worst Takeo Ide episode ever, i don't know what happened there.
I rate the episode upon the enjoyment of first viewing. And I enjoyed the episode since the pacing was good. And had many stuff happening, one of them is my favorite scene which is the Haki balst(even though it was done poorly, I still enjoyed it) . But yeah, On second viewing it deserves a 7.
Well, mainly due to the content in 435 and 445, the episodes were meh. I guess it have something to do with the pacing. And the directing of the episodes was bad. Not to forget the bad filler.
Really? I could understand if it was only for Heartcatch, given it's a new series and all, still trying to get more viewers. Although i doubt little girls do mind about animation.
I'm not entirely sure, but these three have many big regular animators.
HeartCatch PreCure!
Fresh Pretty Cure!
Futari wa Pretty Cure Max HeartSome of them are very familiar like (Tomita and Shida). Other big names include Yuki Hayashi and Hiroki Tanaka. It always bothered me why Toei never used Tanaka for One Piece. Yet they let him do lots of scenes for Precure series. There is a lot more great animators.
The new season have really great animation.
Flashy and lively animation makes the series more fun to watch. Even though I don't follow this series, I just follow any important people that are being used on the show. Or any great scenes that are done by the great animators.
On a (un)related note, i've just found that my favorite DBZ animation director,
, works as a key animator under Mamoru Hosoda, including OP movie 6. That's pretty awesome.Yeah, he is a well known Sakuga.
http://www18.atwiki.jp/sakuga/pages/438.html -
Not just after Enies Lobby, I think the animation started to suck right after Skipiea Arc.
If you're going on a trip… where would you like to go?
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Not just after Enies Lobby, I think the animation started to suck right after Skipiea Arc.
G8 Arc which is directly after Skypea, is one of the best animated One Piece arcs, IMO.
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The arcs 'right after Skypiea' were much better animated than Skypiea itself if you ask me.
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Well, according to Bamind in the Movie 10 thread, Shingaki was the animation director for the chapter 0 OVA. Maybe that's part of the reason why he hasn't done many episodes since Impel Down started.
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I dont have a problem with it
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Every Shingaki episode should look like the OVA. It was great.
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To the average eye, someone who doesn't know basically anything about animation, AKA me, Shabondy was my personal favorite animated arc
All the colors they used and the way they did Kizaru's attack was just awesome in my opinion
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Shingaki have done a fantastic job on the OVA.
Tate worked on the OVA as well, explains why he didn't work in his latest episode. I guess we won't be seeing anything from him anytime soon.
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Shingaki did only 2 episodes in each arc since Sabaody. Maybe that's why Episode 0 is really AWESOME. He had all the time of the world to work on it.
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@Sean:
Shingaki did only 2 episodes in each arc since Sabaody. Maybe that's why Episode 0 is really AWESOME. He had all the time of the world to work on it.
Last episode he did was 436. He just skipped one episode from the current rota. I expect to see him again, around 453-456.
Don't forget Great animators like Tate and many others worked with him. Hence the HQ.
The only thing I thought was different from his usual episodes was the feel of The OVA. The Lighting, and special effects were really good, and most of the characters had soft shading in the close-up shots (Like they used to do before the widescreen shift, although it was purple before). Although I don't think it's because of Shingaki.
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451: Megumi Yamashita [Might be the final episode of ID]
452: Toshio Deguchi
453: Takeo Ide
454: Atsuko KawamuraI'm glad they are using the normal teams in the beginning. So the starting of the action will be great.
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They might be strawhat separation eps.
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So looks like Yamashita's doing the last Impel Down episode… You know what? I approve. She's pretty decent, middle-of-the-ground type.
Hm, if these are more Straw Hat episodes, looks like I might have to take some Straw Hat caps for Kawamura. Assuming they go in the same order as last time, then that'll be Robin and Usopp's episode. That is, if Robin's story doesn't take up 97% of the episode again.
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eat stuff -> become fat will probably be less then half the episode.
Unless Toei isn't able to give up much information about the revolutionaries and thus have to cut robin's short. I assume from Sanji's they are getting some kind of directions from Oda though.
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I'm betting my money on Strawhat filler too.
And Deguchi can do chapter 449. It had nothing of interest in it anyway.
