First thread, sorry if his has been done before
what i'm asking is do you think that the shichibukai vary in there strength or are they all roughly the same level of strength.
Shichibukai strength
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Crocs-Mid Tier
Moria by himself-Mid tier
Moria with Oz-High tier
Moria Asagard-High tierKuma-Top tier
Mihawk- Top tier
Doflamingo-Top tier
Blackbeard Top tier
Jinibea and Missing warlord =Top tiers prbly. -
To answer the question: They more than likely vary in a large degree. Kuma, for instance, is seemingly much more powerful than Moria and Croc. Blackbeard could very well be the strongest of them all. Mihawk…etc....who knows about the rest.
Probably would have been better to post this in a thread relating to Shichibukai that already exists. Next time, use the search function at the top. Otherwise, no worries I think. Here is the thread you wanted: General Shichibukai Thread
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^Kuma could probably rape Blackbeard.
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I'd be more impressed with Kuma if most of his combat showings didn't involve him beatimg up weakened or vastly inferior opponents.
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In the Battledome Kuma could rape every one in Narutoverse and Rape all Mid to Low tiers in Bleach. Plus Kuma could prbly rape most of the One piece verse. If this isn't powerful then you guys are retarded.
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Well it defiantly doesn't seem that there on the same level, i think in ranking of strength it goes like
–-Strongest---
Blackbeard
Dracule "Hawk-Eye" Mihawk
Donquixote Doflamingo
Bartholomew Kuma
Gecko Moria
Sir crocodile
---Weakest---and I don't know anything about the other two besides Jinbei's name and the fact that he's a fishman
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Well it defiantly doesn't seem that there on the same level, i think in ranking of strength it goes like
–-Strongest---
Blackbeard
Dracule "Hawk-Eye" Mihawk
Donquixote Doflamingo
Bartholomew Kuma
Gecko Moria
Sir crocodile
---Weakest---and I don't know anything about the other two besides Jinbei's name and the fact that he's a fishman
Ummmmmmmmmmm, we never saw Mihawk or Doflamingo in action, so how the heck do you know whos stronger????????
^Kuma could probably rape Blackbeard.
Highly doubt this, he jacked up Shanks remember to the point where Shanks was telling WB to deal with BB himself, and to stop Ace! BB is most likely on Yonkou level!
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Why the hell do people think Crocodile's one of the weakest?! He can kill people by touching them, casually summon catastrophic tornadoes of sand ffrom the palm of his hand, instantly kill everyone in a several mile radius, can't be hurt by anything that's not wet, half of his attacks are instant death attacks, etc. Hell, he had to be slammed through an entire city's worth of bedrock just to be knocked out. Everything else just pissed him off. And he doesn't even seem to be finished, what with his mysterious final appearance.
Honestly, I think they're mostly even, and at the top of the OP world. The Emperors may be hyped to be so legendary and amazing, but the SHichibukai are just packing these absurdly broken abilities. Just look at the ridiculous circumstances that were required just to barely defeat two of them!
And the fact that they're all excellent characters in their own rights doesn't hurt, either.
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Originally Posted by Buccaneer
Celine Dion post in the MK thread. I wish I could neg you.
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Why the hell do people think Crocodile's one of the weakest?! He can kill people by touching them, casually summon catastrophic tornadoes of sand ffrom the palm of his hand, instantly kill everyone in a several mile radius, can't be hurt by anything that's not wet, half of his attacks are instant death attacks, etc. Hell, he had to be slammed through an entire city's worth of bedrock just to be knocked out. Everything else just pissed him off. And he doesn't even seem to be finished, what with his mysterious final appearance.
Honestly, I think they're mostly even, and at the top of the OP world. The Emperors may be hyped to be so legendary and amazing, but the SHichibukai are just packing these absurdly broken abilities. Just look at the ridiculous circumstances that were required just to barely defeat two of them!
And the fact that they're all excellent characters in their own rights doesn't hurt, either.
Truth, Croc could suck the moisture outta everything, I think that makes him pretty damn dangerous, and look what else he could do, he really is no joke!
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Conceptual Logia > Conceptual Paramecia > Elemental Logia > Substance Paramecia = Object Paramecia > Property Paramecia ~ Ancient Zoan > Modern Zoan
So,
Blackbeard
Kuma/Moria
Sir CrocodileNot enough info to place de Flamingo or Hawkeye yet. And yes I put Kuma and Moria as equal in strength.
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Conceptual Logia > Conceptual Paramecia > Elemental Logia > Substance Paramecia = Object Paramecia > Property Paramecia ~ Ancient Zoan > Modern Zoan
So,
Blackbeard
Kuma/Moria
Sir CrocodileNot enough info to place de Flamingo or Hawkeye yet. And yes I put Kuma and Moria as equal in strength.
You really thought that out, didn't you?:wassat:
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Now that I think about it, if you really look at it, Blackbeard may be the one Shichibukai who's be completely screwed if he fought any of the others. I know half this forum has a hard on for the guy, but think of it this way; he's WEAKER to damage than most, due to his power. Look at his fight with Ace, where he was hit several times by Ace's attacks. Yes, he was tough enough to take it, but what if he were hit by a Desert Spada? Not hard to imagine what would happen to him. And being hit by an Ursa Shock with increased vulnerability?! Ouch…
And a guy with power over Darkness fighting a man who draws his power from shadows? Potentially one-sided.
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You really thought that out, didn't you?:wassat:
I did a long time ago, nobody remembers though.
And a guy with power over Darkness fighting a man who draws his power from shadows? Potentially one-sided.
Ubiq's said this before, but Blackbeard's dominion isn't just normal dark, it's void, gravity, and everything associated with "withdrawal" and "emptiness". His power is both literal and abstract, and something Oda has continually hammered down is that "abstract" Devil Fruit powers are the most dangerous, because they can be applied in tons of new ways.
He's the only Logia thus far like that, even his counterpart Kizaru has yet to show abilities on Blackbeard's level.
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Why the hell do people think Crocodile's one of the weakest?! He can kill people by touching them, casually summon catastrophic tornadoes of sand ffrom the palm of his hand, instantly kill everyone in a several mile radius, can't be hurt by anything that's not wet, half of his attacks are instant death attacks, etc. Hell, he had to be slammed through an entire city's worth of bedrock just to be knocked out. Everything else just pissed him off. And he doesn't even seem to be finished, what with his mysterious final appearance.
Honestly, I think they're mostly even, and at the top of the OP world. The Emperors may be hyped to be so legendary and amazing, but the SHichibukai are just packing these absurdly broken abilities. Just look at the ridiculous circumstances that were required just to barely defeat two of them!
And the fact that they're all excellent characters in their own rights doesn't hurt, either.
PPL have subjective opinions on defeated shichibukai, Croc especially since he was defeated first by Luffy.
If you think about it there fight was extremely flawed. Okay Luffy's sweat/blood allowed him to hit Croc but what is ignores is they're not only fighting underground but the whole foundation of the place is SAND! I dunno if Croc lost his cool and got caught up in trying to beat Luffy one on one but all he had to do was create a huge area of quicksand. He was gonna kill everyone down there with him anyway. Hell he could've turned in to sand and simply pulled Luffy down and then suffocated him. No amount of moisture then would've stopped Croc from killing Luffy but I do understand main protagonist must prevail.
As for the shichi I'll go out on a limb and say the unknown is the strongest. I really don't care for or favor any of these guys particularly save Jimbei cuz he has not shown up yet but I must say Croc has portrayed the most villainous nature. BB is as well but I need to know more about his master plan.
BB does seem to be the strongest since he appears to be the final enemy.
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i am personally under the belief there all even, but there different abilty's make it seem like some are stronger than others, like kuma he's a very unique person to fight, he can repel anything with his hands and he has extremly durabel body, most people don't have a strategy to fight a person like that same with crocodile when Luffy first met him he didn't know how to fight him because of he didn't know how to deal with Logia abilty's. I don't know why people keep putting Crocodile and Moria at the bottom just because they've been beaten, There were unique circumstances that lead to luffy beating them.
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If you remember, in the final battle, Croc purposely fought without using his sand powers ("as a pirate", as he put it. Hence the use of the poisoned hook) until the end, which was an act of blind desperation. Croc's objective was more to put Luffy in his place than kill him.
It kinda makes sense that Oda did it that way, though; we saw how broekn Croc's powers are. Luffy tried dousing himself before, in round 2, to which Croc just grabbed him and dried him again.
So far, he seems to be the one Logia fully capable of countering his natural weakness.
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@Zik:
PPL have subjective opinions on defeated shichibukai, Croc especially since he was defeated first by Luffy.
Personally, I feel Croc was very strong and was originally envisioned as one of the strongest pirates in the series, but as Oda has gone along he's had to continually bring in new opponents that dwarf Croc, or else there wouldn't be any point to later fights in the series.
Croc was capable of creating fissures, sandstorms and killing through osmotic diffusion, Ener could vaporize islands and teleport. Lucci could create swords and bullets out of air, and now Kizaru shoots lasers from his legs.
Each opponent has to have a more outrageous power, or the series would get boring very quickly. Look at how many people hated DBF, something that wasn't quite as formulaic in structure as other arcs.
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I disagree. Newer characters in OP seem to get more unique and creative, but the power ladder is nowhere near as purely vertical as in other shonen series (i.e. Dragonball). There seems to be a class of the top people, wherein things get "rock-paper-scissors"-ish, and a fuckton of "non-broken" characters. Honestly, only the CP9 and East Blue villains have been dwarfed (though the CP9 were pretty dwarfed by the two villains that preceeded them).
That's what makes OP so interesting; the power scale isn't vertical. There's a wide variety of people with interestign and varied abilities. Kinda like a fighting game, in a way.
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Originally Posted by Buccaneer
Celine Dion post in the MK thread. I wish I could neg you.
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Ubiq's said this before, but Blackbeard's dominion isn't just normal dark, it's void, gravity, and everything associated with "withdrawal" and "emptiness". His power is both literal and abstract, and something Oda has continually hammered down is that "abstract" Devil Fruit powers are the most dangerous, because they can be applied in tons of new ways.
He's the only Logia thus far like that, even his counterpart Kizaru has yet to show abilities on Blackbeard's level.
I don't understand what you mean when you say his power is literal and abstract, can you explain it to me?
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People read too much into Blackbeard's power, to be honest. His power is darkness. Specifically, black holes, gravity, absorption (i.e. the aforementioned black holes, and possibly how the color black absorbs sunlight), that kind of thing. Nothing else has been shown, and honestly, that's probably the realm it'll stay in. Logia powers in OP usually stick to one theme, and then, if the user masters it, they get a "related" power (i.e. Enel generating heat to reshape metals, Crocodile absorbing moisture, etc.).
People need to remember that Oda may be a clever guy, but he won't be throwing in quantum physics into his shonen manga anytime soon. Blackbeard's a powerful guy, no doubt, and he's definately going to be a big-time saga villain, but OP's all-evil he ain't.
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I think its safe to say that mihawk is on the same level as the emperors… what with him being shanks' sparing partner and all, and i think its normal to think that as the time passed, he only grew stronger and notweaker....
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Ummmmmmmmmmm, we never saw Mihawk or Doflamingo in action, so how the heck do you know whos stronger????????
Highly doubt this, he jacked up Shanks remember to the point where Shanks was telling WB to deal with BB himself, and to stop Ace! BB is most likely on Yonkou level!
It was just a guess. I figured it would be like this because I thought that Blackbeard, mihawk, Doflamingo would end up facing the SH monster 3 (luffy, zoro, sanji) , similar to how Sir crocodile, Mr. 1, and Mr. 2 Bon Clay faced them (or Rob Lucci, Kaku, and Jyabura)
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And a guy with power over Darkness fighting a man who draws his power from shadows? Potentially one-sided.
You do mean for BB right? You can't create a shadow if your surrounded by Darkness.
If you remember, in the final battle, Croc purposely fought without using his sand powers ("as a pirate", as he put it. Hence the use of the poisoned hook) until the end, which was an act of blind desperation. Croc's objective was more to put Luffy in his place than kill him.
Well like I said main protagonist or main character luck. I'm not saying Oda did a bad job in the defeat of Croc but if Croc didn't lose himself in his own ego or pride or w/e it was to lead him to not fight to kill, Luffy would be dead.
I think its safe to say that Mihawk is on the same level as the emperors… what with him being shanks' sparing partner and all, and i think its normal to think that as the time passed, he only grew stronger and notweaker....
I wouldn't assume that. For all we know Shanks is the weakest of the four yonkou or when they dueled each other Shanks was not a yonkou at that time but just on the rise. I do recognize Mihawk as being greatest with a sword but that's just it.
I remember when Luffy told him he'd be PK and Mihawk laughed and said that means he'd have to be stronger than him. I believe there's a handful of guys stronger than Mihawk if not more, some possibly in the shichibukai.
Mihawk also is a little flawed, I mean with Oda not introducing any other ppl who want to be the best swordsman in the world or a little more info on Mihawk I just see him as the guy destined to lose to Zoro. Unless Oda is so unpredictable and bold enough to make Zoro fail lol.
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@Herr:
what i'm asking is do you think that the shichibukai vary in there strength or are they all roughly the same level of strength.
They all have different levels of fighting power, if they where all equals in fighting power, then Luffy who beat Croc should be able to walk all over the other shichibukai, but thats not the case.
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I just realized how ineffective most of Kuma's attacks would be on Blackbeard because the second he touched BB, his powers would be nullified. He'd basically just become a smart, teleporting capable pacifista
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You forget, Kuma can bust a Paw Cap in his a$$.
but at the end of the day black would catch his A$$.
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Conceptual Logia > Conceptual Paramecia > Elemental Logia > Substance Paramecia = Object Paramecia > Property Paramecia ~ Ancient Zoan > Modern Zoan
So,
Blackbeard
Kuma/Moria
Sir CrocodileNot enough info to place de Flamingo or Hawkeye yet. And yes I put Kuma and Moria as equal in strength.
I would have to disagree we saw BB and Kuma fight.BB can fall to damage we haven't seen anyone lay a finger on kuma. Factor in that huge explosion thing. I could easily see Kuma > BB unless kuma punches are strong enough to put a dent in kuma
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They all have different levels of fighting power, if they where all equals in fighting power, then Luffy who beat Croc should be able to walk all over the other shichibukai, but thats not the case.
Except for the fact that Luffy barely defeated Crocodile, under numerous circumstances that put things in Luffy's favor, including Croc not using his powers.
Things aren't as simple as "Luffy beat such-and-such, so Luffy is automatically stronger." Hell, Luffy would've DIED after that fight, had it not been for being given the antidote. Luffy beat an opponent on a much higher level than him because of extreme luck (surviving rounds 1 and 2), his opponent's confidence (same as before, and winning round 3), among many other things.
As for BB v. Kuma, Malcom has a point.
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They all have different levels of fighting power, if they where all equals in fighting power, then Luffy who beat Croc should be able to walk all over the other shichibukai, but thats not the case.
I really don't think you can be that black and white about it, if luffy hadn't found out his weakness he would have lost to crocodile,Crocodile only lost becuse he didn't use his power until the end of the fight, besides crocodile beat luffy twice somthing moria didn't do
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I think all the Shichibukai are strong one way or another, so far we've seen all of them except two and by the looks of it, all were very powerful. Crocodile wasn't weak by any means, it was just his bad luck that he had to be confronted by a very formidable opponent that wouldn't stay down despite two prior losses. Also his weakness was found and from there, it was just Luffy who proved to be the one with the most will to be victorious. It took perseverance and luck along with Luffy's desire to actually win.
I think all of the Shichibukai while being stronger in some areas might fail to be so in others, or else they would be flawless. Like Kuma, while he has shown to be a monster, there has to be something that while doesn't ensure his defeat can atleast give someone a chance if even minimal of winning.
I don't think there's some who are miles ahead of another, but who knows maybe there are. I think the ability to confront and actually challenge with the possibility of winning against a Shichibukai depends on the situation and the scenario presented and of course if the opposition is also capable of defeating him.
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Let's not forget Croc was also one of only two opponents Luffy was completely and utterly defeated by (not counting Kuma, since he just teleported Luffy away, and showed up when everyone was weakened. Not a real fight).
Not to mention he has what I consider to be the most ridiculously broken attack in the series, though he only used it once; the nameless "dry everyone inside it to death" sandstorm he used on the pig pirates.
I don't think there's some who are miles ahead of another, but who knows maybe there are. I think the ability to confront and actually challenge with the possibility of winning against a Shichibukai depends on the situation and the scenario presented and of course if the opposition is also capable of defeating him.
Well said! Agreed muchly!
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That's what makes OP so interesting; the power scale isn't vertical. There's a wide variety of people with interestign and varied abilities. Kinda like a fighting game, in a way.
OP's power scale is misleading, it's always been somewhat vertical even before the stupid "douriki" idea. Bounties were an indirect measure, but other reference points like massive destruction were just as well. Arlong could destroy a building, his henchman could sink ships. Things just got bigger from there.
DB was much the same, but by the time we got to DBZ the reference points didn't exist anymore. Power levels didn't exist past Freiza either. Vegeta and Piccolo could destroy planetary bodies before anyone went to Namek, Freiza could as well and we're supposed to be impressed at Kid Buu when he blows up four or five?
The reference points became the main characters themselves, and whenever I see the main characters in OP winded after a tough fight, that reminds me of the power scale.
I agree, OP's scale isn't as blatant as DB (or Negima really…better example imv) but it's still very much there.
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@Herr:
I really don't think you can be that black and white about it, if luffy hadn't found out his weakness he would have lost to crocodile,Crocodile only lost becuse he didn't use his power until the end of the fight, besides crocodile beat luffy twice somthing moria didn't do
I was just say that the Shichibukai don't have the same level of strength/fighting power, Crco was just an example. Tho I agree that he beat Luffy twice, but the 3rd match was a draw, coz Luffy would have died if it was not for Robin and her Antidote.
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The series does have somewhat of a visible scale, but it's not completely vertical, because OP's a bit more down-to-earth on how one wields devastating power, the reprocussions, etc. Plus, one's "power level" may also be effect by WHAT they can do, not just how far down the series' run they are. Enel and Crocodile, for instance, would still be devastating today, due to the powers they had, and what they could do with them. And, though I hate to admit it because I friggin' hate this bitch, Perona's probably got one of the most dangerous abilities in the series.
Again, I like that about the series. It makes things more interesting, and doesn't make past characters seem almost insignificant.
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OP's power scale is misleading, it's always been somewhat vertical even before the stupid "douriki" idea. Bounties were an indirect measure, but other reference points like massive destruction were just as well. Arlong could destroy a building, his henchman could sink ships. Things just got bigger from there.
DB was much the same, but by the time we got to DBZ the reference points didn't exist anymore. Power levels didn't exist past Freiza either. Vegeta and Piccolo could destroy planetary bodies before anyone went to Namek, Freiza could as well and we're supposed to be impressed at Kid Buu when he blows up four or five?
The reference points became the main characters themselves, and whenever I see the main characters in OP winded after a tough fight, that reminds me of the power scale.
I agree, OP's scale isn't as blatant as DB (or Negima really…better example imv) but it's still very much there.
I have to argue for my man Kid Buu. He fucking blew up earth dumb fast. No talking no gloating no nothing just blew the shit up. All the villains brag and shit this lil motha fucker was all action.
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Shichibukai… they are all pirates. And pirates of oldtimes... so. They are all own kind of powerful. BUT, Kuma is in diffrent class... just because super paw paw powers + super body material + power of servos... and that wierd movement of lighting. I bet that is faster than Kizaru. And can he paw paw logias too? That would be too much maybe.
Oh yeah, and i always think that Mihawk not even closes to be strongest... he is just best sword user in world. He is mastered sword fighting and all fucking everything what belongs swords. But then... then is that huge motherfucking black blade it sword. It cut whatever he wants... when he wants. But otherwise it's strenght what moves it... fuck i don't know what was my replys point... bad memory, bad.
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@Zik:
You do mean for BB right? You can't create a shadow if your surrounded by Darkness.
Well like I said main protagonist or main character luck. I'm not saying Oda did a bad job in the defeat of Croc but if Croc didn't lose himself in his own ego or pride or w/e it was to lead him to not fight to kill, Luffy would be dead.
I wouldn't assume that. For all we know Shanks is the weakest of the four yonkou or when they dueled each other Shanks was not a yonkou at that time but just on the rise. I do recognize Mihawk as being greatest with a sword but that's just it.
I remember when Luffy told him he'd be PK and Mihawk laughed and said that means he'd have to be stronger than him. I believe there's a handful of guys stronger than Mihawk if not more, some possibly in the shichibukai.
Mihawk also is a little flawed, I mean with Oda not introducing any other ppl who want to be the best swordsman in the world or a little more info on Mihawk I just see him as the guy destined to lose to Zoro. Unless Oda is so unpredictable and bold enough to make Zoro fail lol.
Maybe you know… If Shanks would be weaker did you think he would attack WB?
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This post is deleted!
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i agree with kishido. Its hard to see the weakest yonkou boldly attacking a yonkou who's supposedly stronger. And all alone aboard their ship too.
But yeah its all Oda's call.
And are we stil arguing about which shichibukai is strongest/weakest?
Come on now, haven't you guys played Pokemon before?
Its all about the pokemon's element (his strength and weakness). One Pokemon might be stronget than the other but another is bound to be stronger than him… unless its a psychic pokemon O_o. So yeah, Oda's gonna reveal that the real villain is hiding somewhere with some psychic abilities.....
On a side note, if Enel ever go down the newworld, he could probably easily defeat 2 out of 7 shichibukais at the same time.
im playin, but yeah, you guys get the point -
well if silver can harm logias with a sword with no df or seastone mihawk must be classed as the strongest shichibaki
bb wouldn't have joined them if he knew he was the strongest guy arrived
Mihawk
Flamigo
BB
Kuma
Moria
Crocno clue oon jembei but im sure hes stronger than moria
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What makes people think that BB is more powerful than Kuma?
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What makes people think that BB is more powerful than Kuma?
nulify fruits thats why i put him above kuma
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nulify fruits thats why i put him above kuma
Who cares… Kuma is the man! Sadly he will "die" and we ain't see him again =(((
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I just realized how ineffective most of Kuma's attacks would be on Blackbeard because the second he touched BB, his powers would be nullified. He'd basically just become a smart, teleporting capable pacifista
Dude Kuma has lazers. They could even melt steel man.
Tick tick tick
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Who cares… Kuma is the man! Sadly he will "die" and we ain't see him again =(((
did i miss something
y is he going to die
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Wait what ? Wasnt that just the pascifistas that had lasers.
kuma shoots lasers from his mouth
did u forget zoros fight with kuma?
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wasnt there a shichibaki that was mermand?
