@King:
They're all pirates. They're all against the WG by default.
Hell, even Drake is, considering SWORD seems to be the antithesis to CP-0 AIGIS (Shield).
Edit: Oh, you mean Worst Generation. Well, I wouldn't say they are diverse since they're all doing outrageous stuff for their own purposes. There's a new era coming and the manga keeps saying those guys are at the helm, with Blackbeard and Luffy as the frontrunners. It's likely they all seek the same as Luffy: freedom to do what they want.
Attacking Kizaru at Sabaody while he was busy with the other Supernova.
He had no actual reason to get involved (he was observing everything from a roof), but did anyway.
Killer doesn't seem really mad at Zoro for the whole Kamazo incident.
Also, it's funny that Kid needs to forgive Apoo in order for him to join forces. Kid may threaten to kill Apoo in the spot, but we're likely to see a facefault and someone more reasonable holding him back.
Reminder that Caribou got forgiven with no fanfare, despite the whole Shirahoshi kidnapping thing. He could very well just join up with Luffy and ignore Kid. Luffy is already naive.
Really?
Punk Hazard-Dressrosa -> Luffy joins forces with Law to take down Doflamingo.
Whole Cake - Luffy joins forces with Bege to kill Big Mom and save Sanji.
Wano (now) -> Luffy, Law and Kid are joining forces to defeat Kaido. Drake is undercover, but assisted Law at one point.
And then there's the possibility of Bonney having joined forces with Sabo (Luffy's brother) at the Levely, since they had the common objective of rescuing Kuma.
Hawkins has already mentioned this one card that seemingly grants amazing power, setting up a Chekhov's Gun that will come in handy later. Depending on what his cards say, he has a good chance of turning.
Apoo is present. It's true that we don't know much about him, but we know he was not afraid of cheap shotting an Admiral even with the risks involved. He's a courageous coward, if that makes sense.
Yep, but who claimed everyone of the new era has to do the exact same thing. And obviously, there are going to be winners and losers of the new era as well, depending on which side they choose, and it´s not just going to be the Yonkou.
Roger and Whitebeard crystallized themselves out of countless pirates as well after all.
You are trying to push a narrative of two distinct sides which is not supported.
That´s not opportunistic, but overly curious. He literally knew he could not take him out, he just wanted to see his powers.
Why should Killer be mad at him? They fought earnestly, especially when Killer had adopted the Kamazou thing.
Zoro is not the cause of his demise, he never betrayed him, and his actions never led to Orochi feeding him a SMILE.
Completely distinct circumstances and situations, you know this is thin.
Caribou´s actions did not lead to anything though, Killer literally suffers the consequences.
Yes really, because you try to force what happened with other characters onto characters who have not shown any inkling of doing the same or any interest of doing so.
Apoo thought he could get away, that´s not being courageous.
And once again, if Hawkins is only interested by acting due to the likelihood of events happening, he is not going to join the alliance, you are contradicting yourself here.
â- Update From New Post Merge ---
@RomanceDawn:
Jabra thatâs a way of looking at it that I havenât fully considered. Though I donât put Jimbei up there with likes of Jozu, Katakuri and Marco, not yet at least. From the moment we saw Jimbei chained up to the moment Law demonstrated his powers to Smoker I always had the sense he was on the lower end of what a War Lord could be. In large part to add him to the crew without it seeming like the crew was getting a haxed individual on the team.
As Iâve said I believe the higher end Commanders are capable of handling Admirals. Oda seems to like this Big 3 thing outside of the Captain and that seems to be whatâs going on most of the time. So Iâm guessing in each Emperor crew you have at least 3 or 4 guys who could really do some damage to an Admiral.
That is to say that I donât think Commanders can or will necessarily defeat them just that itâs possible. For the balance of the story I donât see any Admiral suffering the way Akainu did in front of White Beard or the way Aokiji may have in their private duel. Their full defeats are going to be spectacular-story is almost done stuff- that very well may be at the hands of a Straw Hat. Seeing the crew that was closest to One Piece fall one by one to Admirals just allows our heroes to do what they couldnât.
My perspective is that âCommandersâ including Marco, Zoro, Sanji, Katakuri, Jimbei, Beckman and Rayleigh were always and will always be underdogs to the admirals. However great or slight that might be. That is until they start their own crew of course and become captain, lol. But like Luffy up against Lucci or Katakuri these commander types could go in almost completely outclassed and somehow come through.
I suppose when I read my own statement like that saying Admiral level is not very accurate. What ever the proper term ends up being by the invisible hand of the fandom Admirals donât face the Jozuâs without extreme precaution.
When Marco pushed aside Kizaru giving some chess metaphor about taking kings too early I was under the immediate impression that some day that is going to be Zoro or Sanji. It told me that the biggest guys in an Emperors crew could manage some of the biggest threats the marines have.
Canât believe Iâm saying this again but kind of like the way the anime openings depict Zoro fighting Fujitora, Sanji fighting Kizaru and then Luffy fighting Akainu. It just feels like a thought Oda has careful planted in our heads throughout the years.
My phone is acting weird, sorry if itâs all jumbled in some weird format.
Jinbe has the portrayal of being crucial for the battle at Marineford(Sengoku), has feats of stopping Akainu´s attack one-handedly (Ace literally had to throw his body into it), could stop a sword of BM with bare skin and Haki (when Luffy can not even stop Hody´s piercing attacks with Haki) and is directly coveted by Big Mom as significantly important part of her crew. Having no hax is not a negation of being super strong. Jozu barely hurt Crocodile, Jinbe took out roided Moria (much later opponent of Luffy) with one attack. Seems like a superficial impression rather than something thought through to be honest, no offense intended.
Second, lumping Jozu with Marco/Katakuri together is the second mistake, Oda made a clear distinction with the right-hand-man and the rest of the commanders, we have to wait whether that´s going to hold for King as well, but yeah (Jozu was humiliated by Doflamingo, someone Luffy already beat, Jozu could not free himself from Aokiji´s ice, Doflamingo couldâŚ), but even then, Marco, like i said, has had 3 cheap shots, he did 0 damage even with cheap shots, meaning in a direct confrontation, he is doing nothing to them. What made him special is his regeneration, he can literally throw his body into powerful attacks and come out unscathed for a while (Oda confirmed there is a limit, and consequently, he was shown with wounds and bandages at the end of the war), but that´s literally stalling, nothing more, something Jabra accurately described.
Also still forgetting the distinction between Akainu and Kizaru/Aokiji at the war, when an Admiral got serious and was motivated, the entire Whitebeard Pirates including Marco and Vista, and additionally Ivankov, Crocodile and so on, felt the need to stand against one Admiral, and Aokiji at least (when he got serious as well, Jinbe mentions this in Fishman Island) has fought the most extreme battle we know of in the manga against Akainu.
Ultimately Whitebeard suffered more than Akainu did from a cheapshot.
"The crew that was closest to One Piece", this is just a rumor based on Whitebeard´s strength alone, they were nowhere near the One Piece.
Putting Rayleigh together with the other commanders is the third mistake, he has a clear distinction, he is the Vice Captain and partner of Roger, Garp literally put Rayleigh together with Whitebeard himself as well, which does not mean Rayleigh was a fourth guy on the level of Roger/WB/Garp of that era, but someone even they had to take seriously within context.
And what did come out of that Marco vs Kizaru scene, this is what Jabra literally emphasized, what comes out in the end, Kizaru was completely unhurt, it´s pretty much like Luffy vs Kaidou, who tossed Kaidou around like nothing (who is physically stronger than Kizaru definitely), in the end Luffy got taken out rather quickly.
So yeah, i think Jabra pretty much summarized in his post how you came to your opinion looking at the answer.
I think it also has to do something with expectations. We had already met 2 Admirals before the Marineford war, and they were completely untouchable (literally) and incredibly powerful beings, hence the protagonists having no chance against them, so that when we finally saw people not immediately getting pushed over by them, the association was, "wow, they are equal", when the end of the war drew a completely different picture, at which point people had already formed their opinion faulty though.
Edit: Oh and btw, i think this Zoro vs Sanji thing is pretty disingenious to be honest.