They don't look like they hate Tien anymore than they hate Yamcha who hasn't done anything worthwhile for about 35 years (in our time).
Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly
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They don't look like they hate Tien anymore than they hate Yamcha who hasn't done anything worthwhile for about 35 years (in our time).
Yamcha they've memed at this point into a lovable loser. He even got his own spinoff comic.
Tien is just sort of… there. ROSHI has come out and surpassed him now when a huge point before was that Roshi has been surpassed bty the young uns forever. (Really none of the humans should have been anywhere near the ToP)
Like, neither one of them is going to win an important fight, but....
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They really did go way out of their way to have the humans be in the TOP.
Such wasted opportunity to see more of Buu.
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I mean, I'm all for those characters doing STUFF, but in terms of sheer power scaling they were passed up long, looooong ago. The TOP fighters should have been able to just sneeze and take them out.
Luckily, the strongest all the universes had kind of sucked, there were actually only a handful of freaks at main protag power levels. Though had universe 6 actually put forward its Saiyan population instead of just 3 of them, and they'd had any time to train, it should have been able to just stomp basically everything.
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Yamcha they've memed at this point into a lovable loser. He even got his own spinoff comic.
Tien is just sort of… there. ROSHI has come out and surpassed him now when a huge point before was that Roshi has been surpassed bty the young uns forever. (Really none of the humans should have been anywhere near the ToP)
Like, neither one of them is going to win an important fight, but....
Tien was always the most impressive of the humans in Z I thought, mostly because of that time when he stopped semi-perfect cell from advancing towards the cyborgs with his Tri Beam, I mean he didn't really hurt him at all, but it still stopped him from progressing which was a hell of alot more than the others could do at that time
which is really depressing that's the highwater mark for human characters in the series
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Well sucks to be you because Toriyama has said Tenshinhan is NOT HUMAN. Lol.
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Well sucks to be you because Toriyama has said Tenshinhan is NOT HUMAN. Lol.
Never once stated or addressed in the manga, it doesn't count. Toriyama has also said we get female Buus eventually but it ain't there yet and subject to change.
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With Piccolo and Vegeta filling the same spot Tien did once (former bad guy turned good and to a sidekick of Goku) he sure is lost to be important anytime soon.
Especially when we still have Krillin who snatches the nostalgia.Fun Fact: When i was first time watching the tournament with Tien, i bet/hoped that Chao Zu would turn out to be the main antagonist^^
Guess i never thought that much of Tien, even when i consider his fights with Goku really great, still using techniques and skill instead of pure power leveling. -
All the non-Saiyans should just go to train with Whis for a while, so it makes more sense for them to be able to even sort of keep up with the Saiyans.
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Never once stated or addressed in the manga, it doesn't count. Toriyama has also said we get female Buus eventually but it ain't there yet and subject to change.
Guess we'll just have to settle for 21.
All the non-Saiyans should just go to train with Whis for a while, so it makes more sense for them to be able to even sort of keep up with the Saiyans.
Considering how not too easy the training was for Goku & Vegeta who are training whores that'd go about as well trying to teach cat how the bark.
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I liked the logic of krilln and roshi being in, to counter the tricky opponents, and they had kept up with that, maybe I'd believe it.
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Considering how not too easy the training was for Goku & Vegeta who are training whores that'd go about as well trying to teach cat how the bark.
I guess he'd start off easier with them.
It'd follow the established path of everyone following in Goku's footsteps. After Goku trained with Roshi, Yamcha went to train with him. After Goku trained with Korin, everyone went to climb the tower. After Goku trained with Kami, everyone else trained with Kami. After Goku trained with King Kai, all the dead people went to train with him.
I'm honestly surprised it never happened, especially prior to the Tournament of Power. It's such a simple way to explain how they can, or give them the possibility to, kinda sorta keep up.
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I'm honestly surprised it never happened, especially prior to the Tournament of Power. It's such a simple way to explain how they can, or give them the possibility to, kinda sorta keep up.
I always thought that the whole reason that Whis trained Goku and Vegeta was to be a challenge for Beerus and to be potential replacements for him. If I am right about that, then I wouldn't expect Whis to spend time training someone who has no chance of meeting either of those criteria.
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I always thought that the whole reason that Whis trained Goku and Vegeta was to be a challenge for Beerus and to be potential replacements for him. If I am right about that, then I wouldn't expect Whis to spend time training someone who has no chance of meeting either of those criteria.
Sure, but the ToP was the perfect reason to do it. And after, they should be thinking about how there are so many powerful foes there, that it'd be for the best to start getting everyone to a respectable level.
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I guess he'd start off easier with them.
It'd follow the established path of everyone following in Goku's footsteps. After Goku trained with Roshi, Yamcha went to train with him. After Goku trained with Korin, everyone went to climb the tower. After Goku trained with Kami, everyone else trained with Kami. After Goku trained with King Kai, all the dead people went to train with him.
Well let's keep in mind Goku had far better potential to become stronger because of his saiyan heritage a gap that none of the other characters were ever going to cross.
Plus Goku was doing crazy shit like training at 100x gravity and learning techniques from aliens.
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Actually a pretty touching trailer.
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After taking a look at the staff list for Stampede it becomes clear why the next Dragon Ball project was delayed: nearly all of the main staff from Dragon Ball Super: Broli worked on Stampede. I have to wonder if Toei Animation is still having issues finding animators to work on their projects even with better production schedules. Nevertheless, now that the movie is out it should be time for everyone to get back to working on the next Dragon Ball series. I'm excited to see who sticks around as a main animation supervisor and action animator for this next project.
is so insanely well down that I don't want to lose him just yet. -
A new Dragon Ball series should focus on other characters. Goten,Trunks,Caulifla,Pan,Bra,Uub. Focus on the new generation and make interesting stories with them. And of course it should be set after the ending of Z. But sadly this will never gonna happen. They will continue to stay in the 'Super' setting and focus mostly on Goku and Vegeta becoming Super Sayajin Red-Blue-Green at 6th level Mega-Instict.
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Well, if you've read the last chapter, at least it seems there's potential for someone else not named Goku or Vegeta to do "something". Not save the day, mind you, but "something".
! Moro used his third wish to liberate the prisoners of the galactic prison (yeah, kind of a weak wish, for all the mystery it tried to build) and use them as his goons. The thing is, he gives them extra power while he drains his enemies of their own. Neat, I guess. The thing is, they're supposedly going to Earth, and at least Toyotaro is giving some of these goons a distinctive design/skills. Goku and Vegeta are going to train (again), so maybe we can have the secondary cast dealing with the goons while the heroes train, then lose horribly to Moro, and then have Goku defeat him. So, Freeza's Revival arc 2. But hey, it's something!
! Buu's back to sleep, though. Sorry. -
! Was it ever explained how he made any wishes at all when that first goon killed Moori?
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Buu's back to sleep, though. Sorry.
Oh come on. Seal him up in a magic bottle or split him in half so he's powerless or something, stop going to THAT as your out every time because you're not creative enough to do anything with him.
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This post is deleted!
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As far as the newest chapter goes, yeah, I feel like the Buu thing is really old at this point.
I really liked the Ultra Instinct tease, even if I feel like the manga didn't do as good as a job introducing it as the anime.
I liked the possible promise of all the other characters getting to do something.
I've seen people make a huge deal about Meerus dodging SSJ3 and the Galactic Patrol not doing anything about all the previous threats to Universe 7 because Meerus is apparently that powerful.
People seem to be so wierdly nitpicky and selective about power level crap when it comes to this series.
Do you want fights that are more than just about powering up or not? One of the points of Goku's journey was that he would learn to use his strength efficently and smartly.
That was a point throughout Roshi's, Korin's and Popo's training. Don't waste movement (and learn to be patient). I see people complaining about how all the fights are just about powering up, but then when the story actually adheres to the ideas it started with, that's a problem.
I saw the argument that speed and strength always corrolate in this series and I feel like nah?
The Ultra Super Saiyan thing with Trunks in the Cell arc was one of my favorite things because it went back to the principles the series started with. Focusing too much on just becoming stronger made Trunks fail. The Roshi moment in the ToP arc in the manga was a similar moment I actually didn't like - great on principle, but the specific issue I had with it was that it went too far with the idea. Roshi was out of action for too long before it happened for it to feel believable for me, so when it happened it felt really jarring and odd.
Meerus was at least introduced to be competent to begin with. Meerus was established to be in charge of several sectors of the universe, so my guess is that he just never was in charge dealing with Earth/the sectors that had the big conflicts of the series happen and was much weaker back then. I feel like it's even entirely possible he's an antagonist in disguise. The story at least frames him as mysterious and shows it to be a little odd he's so competent because Goku specifically notices it. It's not about how strong Meerus is, but what skills he has - for all we know, he even could be out after 1 punch.
I liked this month's chapter if only for looping back to the idea of pure strength not mattering and in my eyes setting it up much better than the Roshi stuff in the manga's ToP arc. I feel like it's one of those chapters that'll make the story better if it delivers well enough by the end - setting up a whole bunch of plot points that need to satisfyingly come ahead.
I really feel like a lot of people who claim they understand the series really don't, though.
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There's pure strength not mattering, sure.
But from Raditz onward well… Raditz the entire thing was so fast he could attack from the front and hit them behind, and Goku and Piccollo had to take off their weighted clothes and trick adn hold him down to actually hit him.
And then the power creep just escalated from there. But Roshi, who was outclassed and retired waaaay back in the day... for him to have been secretly practicing to be good enough to even see characters that were moving fast, or be able to tank even a single hit from planet busting power scales is just... whut. That's the reason they left Yamcha out of the tourney, he's outclassed now.
Much as it sucks that Tien got completely hosed without contributing anything, that's kind of what should have happened to basically all the human competitors in the first 20 seconds of that tourney. Skill is great but when you can't even see your opponents let alone react in time to block them, that should just be an overwhelming advantage you just cant overcome.
If any of the humans had just learned freaking kaio-ken back in the day it'd be easier to buy into. "Okay, he just multipied his power by twenty for a second, at a risk." You could even eventually have had somethig like Tien making his own variant of it (like he said he was going to) and eventually get something new out of it. Kiaoken x100? Or focused just into the power of a beam? Or multiform without weaknesses? SOMETHING.
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Yeah, I said that's basically why I didn't like Roshi's moment - the story just went too far with it, even if I liked the principle of it, I thought it was too much of a stretch to feel natural.
But I'm fine with Meerus because he was established to actually be stronger/more competent than that to begin with and I feel like there are implied logical explanations as to why he didn't interfere with any of the important plot stuff.
I feel like it's fine if the character has some distance in terms of strength. Kind of like how base form Goku had a pretty easy fight with SSJ2 Caulifla and Kale in the anime because they weren't martial artists.
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Roshi being wanked to these levels isn't ok for many reasons. My biggest gripe is that he passed the baton as early as the King Piccolo saga to the point where he refused to participate in the last tournament because his students were already ahead of him…and he was totally happy with that. As a teacher, it was his mission. But of course, in terms of power levels it's also terribly unbalanced and poorly thought out. Basically him bitchslapping Tien in the anime and going as far as teasing not-Frieza (seriously, forgot that pricks name) into going mano a mano with him in the manga is...wrong, specially considering, as Robby mentioned, that as early as Raditz, Roshi was insanely out of his league, no martial arts training being enough to bridge the power/strength/speed gap. Raditz.
Now, the stuff with Meerus I don't mind, honestly. I like that he's a capable fighter through technique, finesse and the use of gadgets, not through a massive power level. The way he outmaneuvered Moro was great in terms of Choreography, and having more of that is always cool.
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A new Dragon Ball series should focus on other characters. Goten,Trunks,Caulifla,Pan,Bra,Uub
Sounds like something that could go on a channel aimed at preschoolers.
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Whatever comes next I just want them to freaking age up Trunk and Goten. I get not putting them at GT age, but Trunks is like 14 now, they should be Teen Gohan physique by now, not… still 8 year olds. Trunks is the same age his alternate reality self was in the History of Trunks.
Heck, even Goku's growth spurt happened when he was between 15 and 18. Those kids are due.
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Sounds like something that could go on a channel aimed at preschoolers.
Are you for real?? Doing "Super Sayajin 8 version Green Mega-Instict" would be something 'aimed at preschoolers'. Enjoy watching always the same thing,over and over.
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Are you for real?? Doing "Super Sayajin 8 version Green Mega-Instict" would be something 'aimed at preschoolers'. Enjoy watching always the same thing,over and over.
Well Super is doing really well and the new Broly movie is held in much better regard than any of the original 3 Broly movies that Toei turned out. In addition to FighterZ being really popular. So I like to think that most of the fanbase couldn't care less about being given more and more of the same in certain respects.
But snark aside outside of Gohan, Uub, (Future) Trunks, & I guess Pan no one really cares about the other 2nd generation characters.
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Well Super is doing really well and the new Broly movie is held in much better regard than any of the original 3 Broly movies that Toei turned out. In addition to FighterZ being really popular. So I like to think that most of the fanbase couldn't care less about being given more and more of the same in certain respects.
But snark aside outside of Gohan, Uub, (Future) Trunks, & I guess Pan no one really cares about the other 2nd generation characters.
So why you said 'aimed at preschoolers'? There was no reason to say that.
I stand by what i said. The only way to do something original with Dragon Ball is to develop the characters of the new generation and set the story after the Z ending -
So why you said 'aimed at preschoolers'? There was no reason to say that.
I stand by what i said. The only way to do something original with Dragon Ball is to develop the characters of the new generation and set the story after the Z endingIt's called GT.
No one liked it.
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Ftfy, 16 effing chars…
No one liked GT. It had a bad premise, was poorly handled, and it killed the franchise for over a decade. The American release even just skipped the first half of it initially.
The final 5 minute ending montage where Goku says goodbye was good.
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Sry to disrupt your worldview, but I liked GT.
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Sry to disrupt your worldview, but I liked GT.
You know, when someone says "no one liked" a certain thing, they don't usually mean it literally, that no one in the world liked it. They just mean it was the general reaction to a certain thing.
It's called hyperbole, which is a thing that people used to be able to do.
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I know? The fact that he has to double down on it made me do my comment. Just teasing :)
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So why you said 'aimed at preschoolers'? There was no reason to say that.
Because like half of the characters you mentioned are kids?
And the premise kind of sounds like something on par with Paw Patrol and Fresh Beat Band?
The American release even just skipped the first half of it initially.
Let's not forget the weird rap opening the english dub had that made it look even more dated than it looked.
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So why you said 'aimed at preschoolers'? There was no reason to say that.
I stand by what i said. The only way to do something original with Dragon Ball is to develop the characters of the new generation and set the story after the Z endingThen we’d get Boruto: Dragon Ball Style. Toriyama tried this with Gohan, Goten, and Trunks and it never worked out. Wanna know why? Thematic importance.
Dragon Ball is, in a nutshell, about the single-minded pursuit of a goal towards mastery while attempting to break past your former limitations. That’s Goku’s character and has always been, which is why he’s always getting everyone in fucked up situations. Vegeta’s goal has always been to surpass Kakarot and prove his bloodline’s supremacy.
But Gohan? He wants to be a scholar. Goten and Trunks just want to play. Thus, Goku’s story will always suit the narrative because he, Vegeta, and Broly are the only characters that follow a similar path. I, for one, prefer it this way. Let the characters age, but Goku’s story hasn’t finished yet.
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I Never watched GT, was it really that bad?
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I Never watched GT, was it really that bad?
Mostly it's bad in how dull and slow-paced it is. It actually does come up with some neat ideas (like the Dragon Balls manifesting into powerful dragons), but then never does anything interesting with them. Also, there were some weird decisions like making Goku a kid again for the entirety of the show.
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I personally wouldn't say it was…...but then again I didn't watch all 64 episodes thanks to my grandmother switching to DiSH which didn't have the International Channel (did read up on how the series unfolded prior to being exposed to it) and by the time Toonami got the dub I suddenly wasn't into Funimation dubs by that point.
But there is a reason as mentioned it only ran as long as it did, churned out two video games one of which was (awful) and another that was exclusively released in the U.S. because of course it'd be, and no movies.
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Always loved the design of ssj4 regardless of the series. Maybe just for the red fur…
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It's called GT.
No one liked it.
Ehhh, yes, GT was set after Z's ending…and that's about it. It NEVER developed the new generation characters, it was the single, most Goku centric endeavour ever. Even more than Super. Even more than the movies.
No one's ever attempted to really turn the story into a pass-the-baton for the new generation(s) to shine.
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Sry to disrupt your worldview, but I liked GT.
I liked it too. And i think its better than 80% of DB Super.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Ehhh, yes, GT was set after Z's ending…and that's about it. It NEVER developed the new generation characters, it was the single, most Goku centric endeavour ever. Even more than Super. Even more than the movies.
No one's ever attempted to really turn the story into a pass-the-baton for the new generation(s) to shine.
Thank you! Finally someone who gets it.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Because like half of the characters you mentioned are kids?
And the premise kind of sounds like something on par with Paw Patrol and Fresh Beat Band?
Let's not forget the weird rap opening the english dub had that made it look even more dated than it looked.
I repeat: How so? You just want to demonize my opinion. 'Young Characters' doesnt mean 'Immature story' (also,lets remember we're talking about Dragon Ball here,not Shakespeare). Also,if its set after the end of Z this means Goten and Trunks are in their 20s and Pan and Uub are teenagers. Caulifla is older than all of them. So please,stop telling no-sense only because you dont like my opinion and you just want to see Goku becoming Super Sayajin 10.
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I repeat: How so? You just want to demonize my opinion.
Which I kind of figured that's how you were taking it except that wasn't the intent. I mean your opinion is fine I just don't agree with the idea of it which you know is also fine being it's also an opinion.
'Young Characters' doesnt mean 'Immature story'
I don't think you know how most writers doing shonen stories work. Let's step back for a second and remember why certain characters like Chi-Chi, Bulma, & Trunks are named the way they are in addition to why both the american version and even the japanese version of the first anime had to be edited in some parts.
Caulifla is older than all of them.
Caulifa also isn't from the main universe and would have zero reason to be in this group.
So please,stop telling no-sense only because you dont like my opinion and you just want to see Goku becoming Super Sayajin 10.
And yet as I already mentioned Super and all the new material being churned out is substantially popular even while it gives fans (and newer audiences) more of the same from what we got from Z also in addition like I said half the 2nd generation characters are nowhere near as liked as the original generation (and never will be).
The fact that people want Lunch to just show up in Super after all this time just so a specific loose end can be tied up (or not) more than they want to see Pan,Bra, or Goten getting into hijinks should make that pretty clear.
I mean if there's anything I want to see more than anything in Super simply for the sheer emotion aspect of it It's Goku meeting Bardock but the closest I'll get to seeing that is getting a PSP and a copy of Shin Budokai Another Road or wait til Xenoverse 3 comes out if it comes out.
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No one's ever attempted to really turn the story into a pass-the-baton for the new generation(s) to shine.
Toriyama already tried that with Gohan and he backed out of it.
Thus, from that point, any future Dragon Ball material was always going to be about Goku (and Vegeta to a lesser extent).
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(and Vegeta to a lesser extent).
Hey watching Vegeta get his shit pushed in by almost every new threat is apart of the full DragonBall experience. Especially since Yamcha could no longer handle it without dying or nearly dying.
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Toriyama already tried that with Gohan and he backed out of it.
Thus, from that point, any future Dragon Ball material was always going to be about Goku (and Vegeta to a lesser extent).
If you mean "that time" Gohan was the protagonist, and he went to high school and became a super hero…yeah, he backed out of it fast. Really fast.