Dadan is butch lol Ivankov too
Next Strawhat Crewmate (Vol. 6)
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Can anybody explain to me what constitutes a woman being called "butch" in a way that isn't completely sexist?
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Whatever name we are using to classify their types of characters (I joined the discussion but I still don't get what we were actually discussing), Belle-mere feels exactly like what kind of character I would love to see Carrot growing into in an eventual epilogue.
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@Below:
Can anybody explain to me what constitutes a woman being called "butch" in a way that isn't completely sexist?
Nobody is evaluating the morality and accuracy of stereotypes and archetypes. Any kind of generic label is a misconception when applied to individuals… and some of them can become a stigma, so that's a problem.
Nonetheless, it's possible to organize characters under stereotypes and archetypes in order to understand fiction and even to understand what a given culture defines as different types of behaviour. This even performs some kind of social role in making people identify themselves into a social group, since our brains tend to perceive the world in patterns. Sometimes even stereotypes that initially had a stigma in them become flags of pride for a social group that wants acceptance inside society. In that sense, we have the "butch", an stereotype of women that have a behaviour socially associated to men. It's a very inconsistent concept, but as an archetype it has its own characteristics that can be applied into reality, even if it's a little too narrow for modern society. Anyway, the moral evaluation of the concept happens only afterwards its definition, that only tries to compile social traits.
Bellemere fits in the stereotype of a butch/tomboy, for the reasons already exposed. That's not to say that she's not a proper woman, or that she's a man, or that she's a lesbian (already a misconception of butch), or that this is an insult, or that she can't have traits beyond the label. Ultimately, Bellemere is just Bellemere.
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Personally, if I was going to categorize Carrot as anything, she'd be the id to Nami's ego and Robin's superego. Like Luffy, Carrot is very impulsive and instinctual, still has a lot to learn about the world but is eager and uninhibited and goes after what she wants. She's not afraid to get her hands dirty, basically. Nami also has desires and goes after them, but she's always been one of the most realistic members of the crew and thinks about consequences (except when it comes to bilking money, I suppose.) Robin has a lot of worldly experience and thinks about things on a pretty deep level, and while she's not so judgmental about others, she has often been so toward herself.
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There's the dictionary definition of a thing.
And then there's the actual common use version that is actually used.
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How many different interpretations of 'tomboy' are we going through right now?
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How many different interpretations of 'tomboy' are we going through right now?
How many breads have you eaten in your life?
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So, seeing how half the strawhats died, the remaining ones need to find new members to fill out the roles.
First of, I think, seeing how close the Heart Pirates and the Straw Hats are, these two should fuse. I don't see Zoro as the captain type. He has not the ambition to become anything other other than the best swordsman in the world. He doesn't care for treasure or the title pirate king. So Law would be the de fact captain of the new crew. Let's call them the Strawhearts.
The original doctor is dead, but Law is still a doctor, so we don't need another doctor. Bepo is also a navigator, so no replacement for Nami needed as well.
Now what's lacking is a proper Chef and a proper Musician. Sanji learned cooking from the Okamas, so maybe an Okama nakama? Who could be the replacement of Brook though?I assume Jimbe survived, because he can swim, maybe him and his former crew swim to Wano? And the Strawhearts take Jimbe as the Helmsman and Praline as the singer?
Also Caesar should definitely join, as the guy making the medicine/weapons.
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When Perona joins the new Strawhats as led by Zoro, do we have to unban AGOG?
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@Cyan:
When Perona joins the new Strawhats as led by Zoro, do we have to unban AGOG?
Nah. The bet was just the signed contract. He'd probably be gone at this point regardless given his behavior.
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We will De-Stalinize Rehabilitate him.
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With all this talk of bellemere, maybe zoro and his new crew can break her outta that dungeon in arlong park and she can become the cook.
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so how many more members of the grand fleet do they need to make 8000??? they have more than 5000 right now I think, right?
plus once elbaf arc happens the giant army will probably increase from 5 to a whole lot more
so how many more crews can they really take in?
the minks, the samurai, the fishman….
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Three Eyed tribe and Long necks
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so how many more members of the grand fleet do they need to make 8000??? they have more than 5000 right now I think, right?
plus once elbaf arc happens the giant army will probably increase from 5 to a whole lot more
so how many more crews can they really take in?
the minks, the samurai, the fishman….
They have 5600 right now, so they need 2400 more.
The Fishmen pirates seem like they have ~80 members (Wadatsumi only counts as one), the new Nox pirates might have ~150 members if the two dukes back the effort. The samurai might be numerous, but given that its an isolated country, they probably don't have too many ships or sailors. I put them at another ~150 members. Add a few additional members that the other captains might gain and we can round all of that to ~400 additional members.
The Germa is probably where the numbers will come from. I forget how big they were to begin with, but after everything that happened and that will happen to them this arc, they could conceivably be reduced to 2000 members, or only have 2000 members to spare.
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so how many more members of the grand fleet do they need to make 8000??? they have more than 5000 right now I think, right?
plus once elbaf arc happens the giant army will probably increase from 5 to a whole lot more
so how many more crews can they really take in?
the minks, the samurai, the fishman….
Well you've got the crews of every place the Straw Hats have been to and become friends with. Places like Usopp's village and the place that had Mayor Boodle don't really count since nobody there really knows they weren't bad pirates except for a handful of people (even the Marines under Captain Morgan were grateful to him for liberating them from his tyranny but they can't publicly admit it).
All the beasts and Broggy and Dorry from Little Garden. The Drum Kingdom (not the Dark one that Wapol built after) army under Dalton. The Alabasta army (potentially having excavated Pluton). The Skypiea tribes. Water 7's entire populace and the Franky Family. Sabaody's liberated slaves, Rayleigh and Shakky. All of Fishman Island, not just the Sun Pirates. Every shadow-recovered victim of Moria's. The Punk Hazard animal-hybrid people (jailbreak time!) And Dressrosa already did come to their aid in helping them get out before Fujitora trapped them. I'd say 8000 would be an understatement when all the allies they can count on gather together, including the ones we haven't yet met.
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I think there is going to be a clear distinction between allies and the pseudo fleet. The allies would involve the Franky Family (Water 7), Dadan, Vivi, while the pseudo fleet are the ones presented at Dressrosa and future pirate captain.
The pseudo fleet is going to be comprised of pirates. While the allies will be everyone else we have met throughout Luffy's travels.
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The Fishmen pirates seem like they have ~80 members (Wadatsumi only counts as one), the new Nox pirates might have ~150 members if the two dukes back the effort. The samurai might be numerous, but given that its an isolated country, they probably don't have too many ships or sailors. I put them at another ~150 members. Add a few additional members that the other captains might gain and we can round all of that to ~400 additional members.
.where on earth are you pulling these arbitrary numbers from
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where on earth are you pulling these arbitrary numbers from
My ass.
Choperman was asking what it would take to get the strawhat fleet to 8000 members. I was just saying how it could conceivably happen.
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Insert Christopher Walken Pulp Fiction clip here. XD
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@K.:
I think there is going to be a clear distinction between allies and the pseudo fleet. The allies would involve the Franky Family (Water 7), Dadan, Vivi, while the pseudo fleet are the ones presented at Dressrosa and future pirate captain.
The pseudo fleet is going to be comprised of pirates. While the allies will be everyone else we have met throughout Luffy's travels.
Let me see if I grasp how you're differentiating them; so Vivi, because she traveled with and fought alongside them on a personal level, she'd be considered an ally, but her Alabasta soldiers like Pell and Chaka and Kohza and the army grunts will be part of the fleet? Or is it just that everyone with a name we've met is an ally, and any of their unnamed associates who'll still want to support the Straw Hats are part of the fleet? For example, the few named people in the Franky family and the workers of Galley-La would be allies and the rest of Water 7 would be the fleet? Just trying to see where the divide is. I'd probably be more selective with those I'd consider genuine allies and lump in more of them with general fleet members. Think what an amazing chapter that'll be when they all do show up to help during the biggest conflict of the series, I bet there'll be so many two-page spreads.
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Let me see if I grasp how you're differentiating them; so Vivi, because she traveled with and fought alongside them on a personal level, she'd be considered an ally, but her Alabasta soldiers like Pell and Chaka and Kohza and the army grunts will be part of the fleet? Or is it just that everyone with a name we've met is an ally, and any of their unnamed associates who'll still want to support the Straw Hats are part of the fleet? For example, the few named people in the Franky family and the workers of Galley-La would be allies and the rest of Water 7 would be the fleet? Just trying to see where the divide is. I'd probably be more selective with those I'd consider genuine allies and lump in more of them with general fleet members. Think what an amazing chapter that'll be when they all do show up to help during the biggest conflict of the series, I bet there'll be so many two-page spreads.
I think the main difference is the Grand Fleet are all pirate crews and the allies are not
EDIT: I seriously hope that when Usopp does the eveuntal, "I have 8000 troops behind me" he does it totally not knowing that the entire Grand Fleet is actually right behind him and thinking he's lying lol
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Let me see if I grasp how you're differentiating them; so Vivi, because she traveled with and fought alongside them on a personal level, she'd be considered an ally, but her Alabasta soldiers like Pell and Chaka and Kohza and the army grunts will be part of the fleet? Or is it just that everyone with a name we've met is an ally, and any of their unnamed associates who'll still want to support the Straw Hats are part of the fleet? For example, the few named people in the Franky family and the workers of Galley-La would be allies and the rest of Water 7 would be the fleet? Just trying to see where the divide is. I'd probably be more selective with those I'd consider genuine allies and lump in more of them with general fleet members. Think what an amazing chapter that'll be when they all do show up to help during the biggest conflict of the series, I bet there'll be so many two-page spreads.
The divide is that the fleet captains pledged their loyalty to Luffy and fly his flag, while the allies are just friends and they don't fly Luffy's flag.
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Hm. I know Vivi's a friend but her army can surely fly both Alabasta's and the Straw Hats' flag if they're called upon. Makes me wonder, then, how things are going to shake out when the Revolutionaries make their big move. There have to be nations openly hostile to the status quo and wanting to reform so they'll certainly side with Dragon, as will Luffy most likely, but apart from the Marines are there other nations that will fight to keep things as is, like the Dark Drum Empire? I wonder if anyone else will join Blackbeard's crew (or has joined since the time-skip) that will give us a clue about who might join the Straw Hats. I get the feeling we'll get a glimpse of them after this arc has resolved so maybe we'll have more to work with.
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It pains me that we still know next to nothing about the level 6 prisoners who joined BB, and not much more about the rest.
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Blackbeard's early adventures deserve their own novel instead of Ace.
I'm sure we'll get to see more of them once Blackbeard finally shows up and has his crew meet Luffy's. Whether that is Wano Country to Elbaf. But I hope Oda makes those interactions and the panel time for Teach's crewmates memorable. I want them to be more than the usual cocky antagonist lackeys.
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I wonder if anyone else will join Blackbeard's crew (or has joined since the time-skip) that will give us a clue about who might join the Straw Hats.
Well we know that Blackbeard has his "10 titanic captains" and last we saw he only had 9 members (I don't think Doc Q's horse would be called one of BB's captains) so it's likely that he recruited somebody during the timeskip. And we also know that Aokiji has allied himself with Blackbeard. Who knows where that plot point is going to go.
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This actually leads into a theory I had about Catarina Devon. I don't know if anybody discussed this before, but I had this thought the other day:
Everybody pretty much knows that the strawhats are likely to have 1v1 fights against the BB pirates at the end of the series. Van Augur v Usopp, Doc Q v Chopper, etc... So if Carrot joins the crew, who would she fight?
Catarina Devon's epithet is "the crescent moon hunter". If we take this to be somewhat literal, why would someone be hunting during a crescent moon? Maybe it's because they want night visibility, but they also want to hunt as far away from the full moon as possible. What prey do we know that is best faught as far away from the full moon as possible? That's right: Minks.
I think Catarina Devon is a mink poacher, and she wears an outfit made entirely out of Mink fur. The literal only thing we know about her is that, after getting out of Impel Down, her focus was on getting new clothes, so I don't think that's too wild of a guess. Also we had a class full of children die in Dressrosa, and we had cannibalism in WCI, so I don't think the concept of skinning sentient beings is too dark for One Piece. I think she hunts Minks for their fur and that would make a perfect Blackbeard counterpart for Carrot if she joins.
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If Carrot HAD to join the crew… I kind of like the idea that Catarina is One Piece's Cruella de Vil. Although I'm still certain we're getting witch vs. witch with Nami.
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@Count:
Although I'm still certain we're getting witch vs. witch with Nami.
Catarina isn't much of a witch, she's just an ugly woman. She fights with a spear and that's not very magical.
If anybody on BB's crew fits the motif of magic, its Lafite, with his top hat, his dove fruit, and his hypnotism. Hell, he's also the Blackbeards' navigator. He's a way better match for Nami.
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Catarina isn't much of a witch, she's just an ugly woman. She fights with a spear. If anybody on BB's crew fits the motif of magic, its Lafite, with his top hat, his dove fruit, and his hypnotism. Hell, he's also the Blackbeards' navigator. He's a way better match for Nami.
Top hat, fruit that I am at least 80% sure is a Siren Mythical Zoan because of his hypnosis, his cane and tap dancing shoes, and Tim Burton design aesthetic has him pegged for Brook's opponent in my eyes.
Catarina's ugly, but the long nose and epithet sounds witchy to me. I also remember her concept art looking very Nami-face esque with hair bow that looked like black cat ears. And her spear still works as a pole weapon, which is also what the Clima-Tact can be classified as.
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@Count:
Top hat, fruit that I am at least 80% sure is a Siren Mythical Zoan because of his hypnosis, his cane and tap dancing shoes, and Tim Burton design aesthetic has him pegged for Brook's opponent in my eyes.
Lafitte is way too prominent of a character to end up fighting Brook. He's the person we've seen the most of in the BB pirates (besides Teach himself) by far. Also hypnotism isn't that rare of a power for non DF powered people in One Piece, so it doesn't have to be tied in with his fruit.
Catarina's ugly, but the long nose and epithet sounds witchy to me. I also remember her concept art looking very Nami-face esque with hair bow that looked like black cat ears. And her spear still works as a pole weapon, which is also what the Clima-Tact can be classified as.
…So you're saying Oda drew a woman.
Actually though, looking at that concept art just now made me more confident in my theory.
[HIDE][/HIDE]
Look at her clothes, she's wearing a leopard print suit (Mink?). To me, the cat ears with those clothes are meant to give the impression a hunting animal more so than indicate any kind of association with magic. The "hunter" motif is just much stronger than the "witch" motif.
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Crescent moon is also associated with witchcraft. So her title could also just mean: Witch Hunter.
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@Count:
Top hat, fruit that I am at least 80% sure is a Siren Mythical Zoan because of his hypnosis, his cane and tap dancing shoes, and Tim Burton design aesthetic has him pegged for Brook's opponent in my eyes.
That's an interesting take.
On the other hand, he just might be not as terrible in hypnotism as Jango. I don't remember seeing anything that could be used as hypnosis tool on him, though.
I'd still bet more on some fast bird zoan. Because of how he got to Mariejois without being detected. Must mean he flew quite high and then descended sharply.
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@K.:
Crescent moon is also associated with witchcraft. So her title could also just mean: Witch Hunter.
That seems pretty tenuous. "Crescent moon" and "witch" aren't interchangeable terms. And its less the crescent moon specifically that is associated with witchcraft, rather, its the moon in general. The crescent moon is just the easiest visual shorthand for the moon.
Her main weapon is a spear and as we see in the concept art, her initial design is evocative of a panther or a jaguar. That doesn't really imply that she hunts people with magical powers. Oda already showed us his idea of what someone who fights the forces of evil looks like with Usopp in Thriller Bark.
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I don't remember seeing anything that could be used as hypnosis tool on him, though.
Django used a pendulum, Vivi used a dance and a circular shirt, and Ms Goldenweek used coloured paint.
There's no real rule here, so really Lafitte could use anything. The sound of his voice, the rhythmic tabbing of his shoes, the twirling of his cane.
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That seems pretty tenuous.
I don't think that is a fair statement. You just presented a draft design for your view. If her current design had anything related to the minks it would be something. Not to mention that leopard(felines) are also associated with witchcraft. And instead of having a pearl necklace she could have easily had Mink teeth around her neck.
"Crescent moon" and "witch" aren't interchangeable terms.
So? Moons are associated with witches, thus their phases as well. You are going two degrees of reasoning to say that: it could allude to the Minks and further by saying that her title comes from "hunting the Minks during the furthest phase away from the full moon" Which is not correct either way as the furthest cycle would be the New Moon.
That is without mentioning that going through with that logic, Caterina becomes the least threatening character out of the Blackbeard Pirates. She specializes in hunting Minks, but not when they are at their strongest, meaning that any sort of confrontation against them has no suspension of disbelief as we only need to wait for Carrot to transform to get it over with.
If Devon has the title: Hunter of the Full Moon. Then that would be different.
And its less the crescent moon specifically that is associated with witchcraft, rather, its the moon in general. The crescent moon is just the easiest visual shorthand for the moon.
Not really. I mean this is witchcraft, so what is a reliable source of information: but this is the second "article" that specifically talks about the Crescent Moon, and less so other phases, having an influence on spells.
http://www.witchipedia.com/planet:moon
[hide]The Moon in MagicSpell Timing by the Moon
Many witches choose to time their spells based on moon phase. Generally, spells for gain or increase are done during the waxing moon while spells for banishing or decrease are done during the waning moon.
Some witches also choose to cast their spells based on the zodiac sign through which the moon is traveling. One might choose to do a spell associated with lunar energy when the moon was in the zodiac sign ruled by the moon, Cancer.
See Spell Timing for more information.
Monday is the day of the Moon.[/hide]
Of course it also mentions what type of Magick is focused on during the full moon. The point being, that the Moon and its phases are all related to witchcraft. So the implication from Devon's title to witchcraft only needs one degree of reasoning, rather than her being a Mink hunter. Given that her current design had nothing pointing to that and the notion of her hunting them while they cannot transform is speculative upon the first notion.
Her main weapon is a spear and as we see in the concept art, her initial design is evocative of a panther or a jaguar. That doesn't really imply that she hunts people with magical powers.
I'd rather not bring her concept art into play, but her current design. What is a weapon that would imply a witch hunter? Most of the things I found are: water, salt, iron. Her spear could be made of iron.
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I like the idea of a mink hunter character. But if we ever get one, I hope it is one that targets the mink in their Sulong form instead of avoiding it (it would make the hunter a badass + would make sense based on how their fur seem to be of a much better quality in that form). Having fur trade as part of the race's background would also be interesting and would explain why Oda chose "mink" as its name.
As for Catalina's epithet suggesting she is a mink huntress… I don't think it works. If it was "Full moon hunter", it would make sense. But her getting a epithet based on "hunting but not during the full moon" seems weird (why hunt at the crescent moon specifically if any other phase would work just as well? Or hunting during the day - probably the best assuming the mink have a better night vision than a human...).
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Lafitte is way too prominent of a character to end up fighting Brook. He's the person we've seen the most of in the BB pirates (besides Teach himself) by far. Also hypnotism isn't that rare of a power for non DF powered people in One Piece, so it doesn't have to be tied in with his fruit.
Brook has his underworld/kinda demonic theme, while Laffitte cane grow angel like wings which sets a great contrast visually.
Brook used to be a guardsman from a kingdom in the Westblue, while Laffitte was a sheriff in the Westblue. I woudn't even be suprised if we found out that both came from the same island, looking who their clothing styles (pre-timeskip) were kinda similar.
Both have limited mind control abilities and Lafittes cane being a shikomizue, which was the typical weapon for gouverment agents like policeman during the meji period, seems likely.
I am always suprised how often Lafitte is paired with Nami for little reason. It seems so obvious to me that he fits Brook so well, almost as much as Usopp/Auger and Chopper/Doc Q.Nami imo seems more likely to end up with Devon
- Oda has always paired Nami with other women
- Nami uses a staff, Devon a Spear.
- Devon could very well be a reference to the devonian period in geology, hinting at rock/earth based powers which would perfectly contrast Nami with her weather manipulation. (Sky versus earth)
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Let me see if I grasp how you're differentiating them; so Vivi, because she traveled with and fought alongside them on a personal level, she'd be considered an ally, but her Alabasta soldiers like Pell and Chaka and Kohza and the army grunts will be part of the fleet?
Not at all. Vivi and her soldiers both would be part of the ally faction.
Or is it just that everyone with a name we've met is an ally, and any of their unnamed associates who'll still want to support the Straw Hats are part of the fleet?
It is easier to say that EVERYONE we have met and are going to meet will be or are Straw Hats allies. It just so happens that from all the allies they have amassed during their travels. Some of them will go a step further and become pirates to fly under the Straw Hat flag.
For example, the few named people in the Franky family and the workers of Galley-La would be allies and the rest of Water 7 would be the fleet? Just trying to see where the divide is. I'd probably be more selective with those I'd consider genuine allies and lump in more of them with general fleet members. Think what an amazing chapter that'll be when they all do show up to help during the biggest conflict of the series, I bet there'll be so many two-page spreads.
When talking about the context/scenario these two factions will be used, for simplicity I try to see what their roles during the Final War would be. I believe that there will be two locations which will have focus. I use two, but literally it would be more.
The first location would be: The final battleground where Luffy, Blackbeard and the Government will all fight to decide the fate of the world. It will be here where the pseudo fleet will show up to support the Straw Hats.
The second location: This would be everywhere else around the world. As we approach the finale of the series, I think the government will attempt to replicate what they achieved during the Void Century. Wipe off another 100 years and call it a day. Blackbeard would probably be okay with it, but he wants to be on top when it happens, while Luffy, well he just wants to prevent it. The way I see the government attempting to pacify any insurgency would be the Paccifistas, which would be deployed around the world. It is here where the ally faction comes in. They would secure their hometowns, while protecting the citizens. So for example Garp would be in East Blue, the Germa could ironically become the "heroes of North Blue", etc, etc.
So by identifying where or what they will do when both the allies and the fleet take action, gives us a better idea of which characters belong to which.
Another difference would be that the fleet will have Luffy's vivre card. Giving them an organic reason to show up with the Straw Hats.
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Django used a pendulum, Vivi used a dance and a circular shirt, and Ms Goldenweek used coloured paint.
There's no real rule here, so really Lafitte could use anything. The sound of his voice, the rhythmic tabbing of his shoes, the twirling of his cane.
Well thanks for the tip.¯_(ツ)_/¯
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Lafitte is way too prominent of a character to end up fighting Brook. He's the person we've seen the most of in the BB pirates (besides Teach himself) by far. Also hypnotism isn't that rare of a power for non DF powered people in One Piece, so it doesn't have to be tied in with his fruit.
I would argue that Burgess is now the crewmate we've seen the most in Teach's crew. And I doubt that any of Teach's crewmates are going to be hyped up more than Shiryu. Whatever the case is though, I don't think crewmate prominence is going to play into who fights who at all. And Oda's been foreshadowing a musician since day one and had a skeleton crew member always on his mind.
Hypnotism is not that rare, but it still makes sense to tie it in with his Devil Fruit. Most characters with Devil Fruits tend to rely on just that Devil Fruit. There are obviously exceptions like Brook, Cracker, and Katakuri, but those examples are complementary. Those sword/spear weapons are only for physical attacks. They don't add a whole new power on their own, they are imbued with Devil Fruit abilities at most like Brook's ice, Cracker's biscuit clones, and Katakuri twisting his arm to make his trident spin like a drill. Having Lafitte go "I can spawn wings like a bird AND use this random doohickey or technique to hypnotize people" is very random on a thematic level. And Sirens are a well known Greek myth concept I can definitely see Oda using at some point. And Lafitte is special since he can spawn JUST those wings instead of also changing his human appearance, so I am betting on it being Mythical.
…So you're saying Oda drew a woman.
That wording gives Oda too much credit in my book lol.
Actually though, looking at that concept art just now made me more confident in my theory.
[HIDE]https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/onepiece/images/7/7a/Early_Devon.png/revision/latest?cb=20110301115239[/HIDE]
Look at her clothes, she's wearing a leopard print suit (Mink?). To me, the cat ears with those clothes are meant to give the impression a hunting animal more so than indicate any kind of association with magic. The "hunter" motif is just much stronger than the "witch" motif.
A leopard print is possible, but I wouldn't automatically jump to that. Oda can still switch up the colors to whatever he wants. Regardless, there is a fine line between sexy leopard print clothes (similar to how Nami's epithet is Cat Burglar) and literally wearing an animal's skin.
Also, Nami only fights women. Miss Doublefinger, Califa, Brulee, it's always women.For some reason. I would love for her to fight a man, but the closest she got is finishing off a battered post-Sanji fight Absalom. Robin fought Yama over a decade ago, sure, but Oda seems really keen on pairing Nami up with women. Again, don't know why.
As Kira said, I don't find either of these motifs to be particularly strong given how little we have seen of her. The divergence in opinion seems to be based on… you guessed it, whether or not Carrot will join the crew.
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This post is deleted!
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Well we know that Blackbeard has his "10 titanic captains" and last we saw he only had 9 members (I don't think Doc Q's horse would be called one of BB's captains) so it's likely that he recruited somebody during the timeskip. And we also know that Aokiji has allied himself with Blackbeard. Who knows where that plot point is going to go.
Okay, so I don't remember either of those two things (probably because it was one panel on one page over 200 chapters ago or something.) Really, really weirded out by the Aokiji thing, how the hell does that even work? You'd think he'd have gone with the Revolutionaries and not guys who are pure evil. I guess if there is a new peep on BB's roster they'll probably be some out-of-left-field weirdo like Weevil being the last, unknown-for-the-longest-time Shichibukai. Or Aokiji could be working as a double-agent. The way I figure the CP9 dudes who are now in CP0 are also being double-agents.
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This actually leads into a theory I had about Catarina Devon. I don't know if anybody discussed this before, but I had this thought the other day:
Everybody pretty much knows that the strawhats are likely to have 1v1 fights against the BB pirates at the end of the series. Van Augur v Usopp, Doc Q v Chopper, etc... So if Carrot joins the crew, who would she fight?
Catarina Devon's epithet is "the crescent moon hunter". If we take this to be somewhat literal, why would someone be hunting during a crescent moon? Maybe it's because they want night visibility, but they also want to hunt as far away from the full moon as possible. What prey do we know that is best fought as far away from the full moon as possible? That's right: Minks.
I think Catarina Devon is a mink poacher, and she wears an outfit made entirely out of Mink fur. The literal only thing we know about her is that, after getting out of Impel Down, her focus was on getting new clothes, so I don't think that's too wild of a guess. Also we had a class full of children die in Dressrosa, and we had cannibalism in WCI, so I don't think the concept of skinning sentient beings is too dark for One Piece. I think she hunts Minks for their fur and that would make a perfect Blackbeard counterpart for Carrot if she joins.
Interesting idea. Although that could work with literally any Mink so Carrot need not be the only candidate. Although rabbit fur is incredibly luxurious to wear and therefore highly desirable…
@K.:
Another difference would be that the fleet will have Luffy's vivre card. Giving them an organic reason to show up with the Straw Hats.
Wouldn't that only happen if his Vivre card was smoking or on fire or something? Or is there a way he can trigger it like a beacon without being in peril? Besides which, he didn't cotton to the idea of having a fleet so even if he needed help, wouldn't he not want to call on them or something? I have to admit I did hate him a little for being such a dork about it when he rebuffed them.
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@uniaka:
Not that I think Laffite has mythical, since only 2 people have that and it's the capatin of whitebear pirates and former fleet admiral. But if he is for brook, I think he has angel fruit. He is pretty much the grim reaper, so it fits more.
I'm actually thinking he'll have multiple mythicals on the crew, Lafitte included (what I mean is, while I think it's probably most likely that the wings are a result of a mythical DF, like Hito Hito no Mi, Model: Angel; he could be hiding a halo beneath that top hat unless he's been seen without it), but I'm open to speculating that he may have some other means of creating those wings, like a device from a sky island (since they all have those decorative wings, what if he mechanized them?) I'm also thinking Stronger will even have some kind of DF to make up for his sickly weaknesses. Even if Doc Q had a lich-like DF I don't see how it could spread to others effectively, so he and stronger will probably have a tag-team set of DFs that complement each other. Not that I think it helps Carrot's chances but it would be appropriate for two animal-people to take on a steed and its mount, and she does seem most connected to Chopper so if he's going to have a partner in it, she'd be the one. But I think Chopper's going to demolish Doc Q and Stronger single-handedly anyway.
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@K.:
Not to mention that leopard(felines) are also associated with witchcraft.
Leopards are most certainly not associated with witchcraft. Its specifically black housecats that are associated with witches.
Not really. I mean this is witchcraft, so what is a reliable source of information: but this is the second "article" that specifically talks about the Crescent Moon, and less so other phases, having an influence on spells.
http://www.witchipedia.com/planet:moon
[hide]The Moon in MagicSpell Timing by the Moon
Many witches choose to time their spells based on moon phase. Generally, spells for gain or increase are done during the waxing moon while spells for banishing or decrease are done during the waning moon.
Some witches also choose to cast their spells based on the zodiac sign through which the moon is traveling. One might choose to do a spell associated with lunar energy when the moon was in the zodiac sign ruled by the moon, Cancer.
See Spell Timing for more information.
Monday is the day of the Moon.[/hide]
I'm seeing exactly zero specific mentions of a crescent moon in either your link, or the quoted text. I think you're confusing "waxing" and "waning" to mean crescent moons specifically, but those terms apply to quarter moons and gibbous moons as well. Also, both terms are given equal importance, just different purposes.
I'd rather not bring her concept art into play, but her current design. What is a weapon that would imply a witch hunter? Most of the things I found are: water, salt, iron. Her spear could be made of iron.
Fire. Burning witches at the stake is a time-honored tradition. Also crosses.
@K.:
That is without mentioning that going through with that logic, Caterina becomes the least threatening character out of the Blackbeard Pirates. She specializes in hunting Minks, but not when they are at their strongest,
@.access:
I like the idea of a mink hunter character. But if we ever get one, I hope it is one that targets the mink in their Sulong form instead of avoiding it
Except that all we've seen from the blackbeard pirates so far indicates that they're backstabbing, suckerpunching, cowards.
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A cat's a cat c'mon now
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Okay, so I don't remember either of those two things (probably because it was one panel on one page over 200 chapters ago or something.) Really, really weirded out by the Aokiji thing, how the hell does that even work? You'd think he'd have gone with the Revolutionaries and not guys who are pure evil. I guess if there is a new peep on BB's roster they'll probably be some out-of-left-field weirdo like Weevil being the last, unknown-for-the-longest-time Shichibukai. Or Aokiji could be working as a double-agent. The way I figure the CP9 dudes who are now in CP0 are also being double-agents.
Here you go:
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[/HIDE]
Interesting idea. Although that could work with literally any Mink so Carrot need not be the only candidate. Although rabbit fur is incredibly luxurious to wear and therefore highly desirable…
Any mink that joined the strawhats. Carrot is the only mink who's even in the running for that. Van Auger isn't specifically designed to fight Usopp either, any sniper would do, but we can still infer that the two will fight in the end.
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A cat's a cat c'mon now
Not even close. The implications of both animals are completely different in pop culture.
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I don't like Kuzan being a Marine double agent because it underplays the clear tension between him and Akainu that caused them to fight over the Fleet Admiral position. He can work with the Revolutionaries though.
Usopp, Yasopp, and Van Augur are the only snipers in the entire series. Not the only marksmen, but still the only ones emphasized to shoot accurately from long ranges who identify themselves as snipers or sharpshooters. The Kuja archers also exist, but their long-ranged prowess is hardly focused on or praised at all.
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Leopards are most certainly not associated with witchcraft. Its specifically black housecats that are associated with witches.
Maybe in western civilization.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zanzibar_leopard
"Rural Zanzibaris’ descriptions of the leopard and its habits are characterized by the widespread belief that a large number of these carnivores are kept by witches and sent by them to harm or otherwise harass villagers."
I'm seeing exactly zero specific mentions of a crescent moon in either your link, or the quoted text. I think you're confusing "waxing" and "waning" to mean crescent moons specifically, but those terms apply to quarter moons and gibbous moons as well. Also, both terms are given equal importance, just different purposes.
Ah, yeah I was responding on my phone earlier, and I took "Waxing/Waning Crescent" to be their technical term. Waxing and waning just describe the illumination, though. Gibbous moons do not apply to this conversation as their definition is the mirror opposite than a crescent moon, much less quarter or full moons.
The point is, Moons and all of their phases have an attribution to witchcraft. Some "sources" give more importance to the crescent moon than others. Either way, I am not arguing that crescent moons are the only ones attributed to witchcraft, but that it is given its association with the moon. If you want specifics though.
https://exemplore.com/wicca-witchcraft/How-to-Cast-Spells-Magical-Timing-with-Moon-Phases (quick glance: it divides each phase with the type of magic)
http://www.cyberwitchcraft.com/witchcraft-symbols.html:
"The Crescent Moon is a Witchcraft symbol of the Goddess, and therefore usually worn only by women. It is shown in its waxing phase, and worn by young women of birthing age. The word Crescent comes from the Latin creare which means to create. This is a symbol of female fertility, and the ability of women to create life."
Fire. Burning witches at the stake is a time-honored tradition. Also crosses.
Aw, now I wish she had the heat-heat fruit. So she could imbue her weapon with fire.
Except that all we've seen from the blackbeard pirates so far indicates that they're backstabbing, suckerpunching, cowards.
I am not sure I would call them cowards.
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Here you go:
[HIDE][qimg]https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/4/47703/3640291-untitled-2.jpg[/qimg]
[qimg]https://opforum.net/attachments/2117/[/qimg][/HIDE]
Any mink that joined the strawhats. Carrot is the only mink who's even in the running for that. Van Auger isn't specifically designed to fight Usopp either, any sniper would do, but we can still infer that the two will fight in the end.
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Not even close. The implications of both animals are completely different in pop culture.
[HIDE][qimg]https://static.wixstatic.com/media/e5f11b_0312278c4eac4f749591178831d96e78~mv2.png/v1/fill/w_784,h_458,al_c,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01/e5f11b_0312278c4eac4f749591178831d96e78~mv2.png[/qimg]
[qimg]https://cdn7.bigcommerce.com/s-91397/images/stencil/1024x1024/products/574/5352/22366400_10157260698944616_2352818541764804109_n__66552.1507950406.jpg?c=2[/qimg][/HIDE]Of course, but there's being predictable and there's taking some creative license. A black cat is very typical, so shake things up with a leopard to counter the cat thief. It's a step up from an overused cliche and keeps with the cat fight theme.
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It makes no sense trying to decode Catalina's role in the story and what her epithet means based on her discarded concept. You are assuming her looks were the only thing Oda discarded while keeping the same purpose for the character, but it could be the "Nekotalina" was a completely different character from the one he ended up deciding to go with.
Specially if the whole purpose of this discussion is to ultimately say she is going to fight Carrot. Remember many of the CP9 members were supposed to fight against different people when they were first conceived, so the same could have happened to her.
And to be honest, I don't quite get what is written in the text next to her concept, but I think Oda is mentioning the discarded swordswoman concept of catalina actually could end up connecting with Zoro.
! 初期設定画には、黒ひげ海賊団に美女の姿があった!!ワノ国っぽい衣装の女剣士が候補だったが、結局採用には至らず・・・。
美女が姿を消し、黒ひげ海賊団の紅一点は美女にはほど遠いカタリーナ・デボンに決定。
採用されていればゾロの好敵手になったかもしれない。