Chapter 820: Dog and Cat have a history
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Is Jack stronger than Marco?
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@Galaxy:
Zoro could've taken down several past opponents that the Straw Hats have faced, including Hody, Caesar, Mr. 3, Wapol, Bellamy, etc. They're always regulated to Luffy because they're the main antagonist of the arc, no exceptions.
Who said anything about taking down Jack? We don't know if Oda is saving his defeat for Wano or not.
No exeptions?
Zoro actually did defeat Hody. He also defeated Morgan.
He also fought Buggy, Arlong, Enel, and Moriah(sort of). All main antagonists.This isn't a matter of trust. Luffy is going to be the one to say "I'm going to handle this, then go save Sanji".
This didn't have anything to do with what I said.
Luffy almost certainly wasn't the only one on Dressrosa capable of taking down Doflamingo, or the only one capable on Punk Hazard of taking down Caesar, or the only one on Fishman Island capable of taking down Hody, and etc.
Everyone was trapped on Dressrosa. They all also had their hands full & decided to leave everything to Luffy. That's not the case here.
Zou is a country with nothing but seasoned warriors who have nothing to do.He really didn't have to though. The plot just demanded for it.
That's not what Luffy said.
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Luffy's character also demanded he stay. He was going to hault his entire journey for a year just to pay zeff back even though he didn't want to.
Okay? The point is that he didn't leave an in progress conflict to deal with something that was probably more urgent for the crew. He stuck around to deal with Krieg, then departed.
Again, Luffy's journey to become pirate king was more important than all of that yet he still postponed it to repay zeff.
He did not stick around just to defeat Krieg. According to Luffy himself, he couldn't leave because he had to repay zeff.
He didn't just leave. He offered to repay his debt by defeating krieg.There is a huge difference between "we're going to do it this way" and "you're going to take us somewhere". Pekoms' only promise was that he wouldn't take anybody, and even though it was technically broken, he still has no obligation to take them at this time.
How do you envision this scenario going down? "Hey Pekoms, Jack is attacking the island… but we're going to leave because Zoro can handle it!". No way Pekoms goes for it. He'll say "Okay okay, if you guys help me fend this guy off, I'll take you."
Pekoms didn't promise a thing.
You're purposely interpreting the scene that way to fit your own narrative.I'm not sure what Pekoms reaction will be. Neither of us are.
While true, he still isn't going to leave his homeland when we know he has something against Jack.
The drama of "but I didn't fulfill my prior promise" hasn't really come up. That could've been something we heard in the original conversation.
We shall see.
It's his homeland. He isn't going to not try to defend it, especially since he's mad at Jack.
That may or may not be the case. All we know is that he won't be able to accomplish anything significant in his current state.
What are you responding to here? You said the party was comic relief, and now it's not being played for laughs?
Right before Jack attacked.
Luffy was comically about to attend the banquet the Minks are throwing before Nami had to remind him what his objective was and that they had to leave.Sanji couldn't fight her. That was practically the entire point of that exchange.
Not at the beginning.
He was comically seduced by her and was about to forget what he was even there for.
,No? It's the same as the crew talking about facing Crocodile, or CP9, or any other individual/group. He was talking about dealing with all of Kaidou's forces, including allies and underlings.
Zoro only mentioned Kaido & Jack specifically in the VIZ version of the chapter. Nothing else.
So he's going to clash with him and then stop because Zoro shows up?
Dunno.
Just to be clear here, I'm not saying that Zoro will be jack's opponent or his only opponent. I'm saying a confrontation involving the two is not out of the realm of possibility.All of the Straw Hats were friends with Nami. Luffy was still the one to face Arlong from the get go.
Zoro never really wanted to save Nami to begin with and Sanji didn't really even know her.
Even before the fight, Nami specifically asked for Luffy's help.
Zoro and Sanji actually did end up fighting Arlong though so I don't know what you're getting at here.Not from what we've seen. Luffy has built up an incredible bond with the Minks in the past day.
And if you believe this, why would the Curlyhats leave? They're on Luffy's team for the Big Mom infiltration.
C'mon Galaxy.
Luffy did not grow a stronger bond with the minks within a single night most of which he probably slept away.
The Curly hats were the ones who saved them and have been with them nursing them back to health for 11 days. We saw the bond between them grow on-panel.I could see them leaving because everyone there could take care of themselves.
They also left Dressrosa despite the battle there. They could have went back after they ditched the big mom pirates if the really wanted.The word fodder does not mean what you think it means.
Nameless goons are fodder fam. The only named characters w/ jack are Ginrummy & sheepshead. Both weaksauce.
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Is Jack stronger than Marco?
Stronger? Maybe. Can Marco's fruit handle anything Jack can throw at him? Likely.
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Frankly, the certainty in their ideas that the debaters of "Zoro or Luffy vs Jack" are showing amazes me to no end.
Sure, I have an idea or two of how things may roll, but 15+ years of One piece reading tells me that I'm probably wrong.
People here talks like they have a gun pointed to Oda's head and dictate how the history must go. -
Yeah, he and his men are attacking, so all of the people present are going to fight against them. But there's only one Jack, so when you're deciding who fights him specifically, the reasoning of "he's an enemy and he's attacking" no longer works because it applies to everyone. So, you use additional reasons to determine it. Luffy, Inu & Neko, and Law all have more of those reasons than Zoro does.
Don't why you added Luffy to that.
Luffy has no distinctive reason to fight Jack.
"I don't like what I heard about him" does not count.It doesn't matter if it appiles to everyone. You said that Zoro was the least likely to fight him because of the personal & practical reasons of other characters.
I'm saying that has never stopped two characters from clashing.
On most islands, the main antagonist always has a slew of people who have personal & practical reasons to fight them so why does Luffy always get to fight them despite have little to no connection to them?
Using your argument, Luffy would have never fought them.Zoro's in charge when Luffy's not around when it's just the Straw Hats (and their Friends of the Arc). Now that they're in this giant-ass alliance, one of its other leaders–Law (see below) and/or the two Mink kings--will be in charge.
Nope.
Oda has referred to the strawhats w/ Law as Zoro's group.!
Throughout the entirety of One Piece, someone hurting Luffy's friends is always personal to him, and it's always enough for him to have a grudge and kick their asses.
Luffy was there to experience whatever you listed.
Jack doing something to a country unrelated to Luffy in the past isn't something personal.
Luffy was sympathetic towards the minks.
He didn't become their friend until they made the alliance.Wait, wait, wait a minute. "Nothing indicates" that Law, one of the captains/co-leaders of the alliance, is higher in "the pecking order" than Zoro, someone who's just a crewmember in that alliance (and who, officially, is only "the swordsman" and not "the first mate" or "the vice-captain")?
Being a leader in an alliance does not make you higher on the "pecking order". Law only has control over his own crew. An alliance is a group of people who have agreed to work together. Nothing more.
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One thing about the BB pirates vs Marco pirates. Who beat Diamond Jozu? Burgesss???
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I'm thinking maybe another possibility is that the minks will be the ones to get revenge for what Jack did to them. They are yet to use whatever wildcard they have up their sleeves. They'll be like "No, Mugiwara, let us handle that POS." (MS version, of course). And then when they use that again in Wano, it will be totally ineffective against Kaido, showing just how strong the suicidal Yonkou is.
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@uniaka:
One thing about the BB pirates vs Marco pirates. Who beat Diamond Jozu? Burgesss???
That would be disappointing given what he shows in Dressrosa.
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That would be disappointing given what he shows in Dressrosa.
Still, considering cutting diamond seems a big deal, and maybe Zoro's final material that he cuts, Who in their crew has such a power. With the exception of BB that can cancel his power with his first fruit.
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I’m no really obsessed with this cuting diamond thing. And certainly not about Zoro cuting diamond. With haki, seastone and Blacbeard fruit there are plenty of possibilities to counter it.
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That would be disappointing given what he shows in Dressrosa.
blackbeard just needs to touch jozu for him to lose his powers then they could have easily ganged up and killed them quickly since he only has one arm lol.
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@uniaka:
One thing about the BB pirates vs Marco pirates. Who beat Diamond Jozu? Burgesss???
That would be disappointing given what he shows in Dressrosa.
Shiryu according to the "Shiryu gets Diamond DF so Zoro can cut diamond and officially surpass Mihawk" theory.
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Seastone is as hard as diamond, according to Fukuro, so all Zoro has to do is cut seastone.
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Guys, it is not like the only way to cut diamond is through Jozu's devil fruit. If an opponent wears a diamond armor, and Zoro cuts that armor, he will have cut diamond.
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Guys, it is not like the only way to cut diamond is through Jozu's devil fruit. If an opponent wears a diamond armor, and Zoro cuts that armor, he will have cut diamond.
Or you know Zoro cuts seastone.
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So you guys came to the conclusion that Mihawk can't cut diamond, based on a single 1 handed flying slash?
And diamond might be as hard as season, but it's not unbreakable. Diamond can break if it's hit hard enough in the right place. -
So you guys came to the conclusion that Mihawk can't cut diamond, based on a single 1 handed flying slash?
And diamond might be as hard as seastone, but it's not unbreakable. Diamond can break if it's hit hard enough in the right place.Or freeze it before you break it like Aokiji/Kuzan.
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Or freeze it before you break it like Aokiji/Kuzan.
Jozu wasn't in his diamond mode when Kuzan froze him.
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So there's a shot of some dude in the new one piece gold film trailer, about 25 seconds in of a guy with long green wavy hair and has that thematic look that admirals usually have. It might be Ryokugyu (green bull) maybe, maybe not but I thought I'd throw it out there.
Don't go making questions that have no answer.
Actually, most questions asked on forums have no answer, it just creates discussion and people share their opinions. Some, of course, pass off their opinions like they're facts or something.
I wanted to get an idea of what people thought of Marco now that he's suffered a defeat, is he still OP or is Blackbeard simply the strongest pirate right now?
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So there's a shot of some dude in the new one piece gold film trailer, about 25 seconds in of a guy with long green wavy hair and has that thematic look that admirals usually have. It might be Ryokugyu (green bull) maybe, maybe not but I thought I'd throw it out there.
I think you are talking about the Legendary Gambler Raise Max that happens to be a Revolutionary.
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I think you are talking about the Legendary Gambler Raise Max that happens to be a Revolutionary.
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Actually, most questions asked on forums have no answer, it just creates discussion and people share their opinions. Some, of course, pass off their opinions like they're facts or something.
I wanted to get an idea of what people thought of Marco now that he's suffered a defeat, is he still OP or is Blackbeard simply the strongest pirate right now?
Well, I don't know if he's stronger then the veteran yonkous, but his DF sure gives him the advantage because it stops other DFs from working, at least time limited.
Marco didn't show much besides his hax healing. BB just had to stop his DF from working then a few quake punches to beat him. It would seem fair to say that Jack can be stronger, since his mammoth should give more strength boost then a bird, and he is also the beefcake type. Marco would compensate in a battle with Jack with his healing.
Marco didn't hit me as very strong in the war, just as hax healer.
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It doesn't matter if it appiles to everyone. You said that Zoro was the least likely to fight him because of the personal & practical reasons of other characters.
I'm saying that has never stopped two characters from clashing.
On most islands, the main antagonist always has a slew of people who have personal & practical reasons to fight them so why does Luffy always get to fight them despite have little to no connection to them?
Using your argument, Luffy would have never fought them.No, Luffy always had a reason to fight, every single time, even if it seems small. Robin even said it in Dressrosa: Luffy doesn't fight if he doesn't have a reason to. I could literally go through and list his reason to fight every single main antagonist he's ever fought, but who would want to read that wall of text? And what gives Luffy priority over those other people who also have motives to fight? A very important practical reason that others don't have: he was the one who was strong enough to actually do it. That's why, on my original list of options here, I didn't include somebody like Nami or Wanda: because it doesn't matter what their reasons are, they can't beat him. People who actually have reasons and the strength to fight Jack are likely to "call dibs" on him, so to speak, and Zoro doesn't have enough motive to make a case for why it should be him over them. And even if Zoro is also strong enough to take the main bad guy, he's never taken the fight away from Luffy when Luffy wanted it and could finish it. He beat Morgan because Luffy was the only one who could save Coby, and he had to do so right then and there, and couldn't do both at the same time (and no, that is not the same as Sanji's situation). He beat Hody the first time when Luffy wasn't there but left Hody to him the second time when he was there. So if Luffy wants this fight with Jack, Zoro not standing in his way is a long-established pattern.
Being a leader in an alliance does not make you higher on the "pecking order". Law only has control over his own crew. An alliance is a group of people who have agreed to work together. Nothing more.
Nope.
Oda has referred to the strawhats w/ Law as Zoro's group.! [https://cdn.opbforums.com/manga/One Piece/806/6.png](https://cdn.opbforums.com/manga/One Piece/806/6.png)
Yeah, when nobody was actually in charge of the group. Regardless of whose name Oda-sensei used, it was just a placeholder to mean "The group that's not with Luffy." It could have said Usopp, or Law, or Robin, and it would have made literally no difference. Zoro, Law, none of them were "in charge" of anything at the time. They were just exploring the area together. That's a little different than when you leave half your crew under somebody else's care, on someone else's ship, which is what Luffy is doing with the Straw Hats who aren't accompanying him to Whole Cake. (It was mentioned that they'll be using Law's sub to get to Wano, and Robin said she'll "take a look at Kaido's poneglyph in Wano" (paraphrased), so it's heavily implied that those Straw Hats are going with him.) But really, this part of the discussion is pointless, because it's also gonna depend on how you view the whole "alliance" thing. So let's just agree to disagree there.
Don't why you added Luffy to that.
Luffy has no distinctive reason to fight Jack.
"I don't like what I heard about him" does not count.Luffy was there to experience whatever you listed.
Jack doing something to a country unrelated to Luffy in the past isn't something personal.
Luffy was sympathetic towards the minks.
He didn't become their friend until they made the alliance.He wasn't there for any of what Arlong did to Nami, and never even heard the details about what he did to her, unlike with the Minks where he knows all the horrible details. He just saw the effects: Nami crying over it. (For comparison, he also saw Wanda crying over what Jack did.) And you keep trying to say that it isn't something personal for Luffy, but Luffy himself is shown to be mad at Jack about it and wants to beat him up for what he did, and promised to do so. (And when Luffy gives a promise of his own accord and isn't forced into it, he takes it very seriously and does everything he can to keep it.) So yes, he does have a distinctive reason to fight Jack. None of the the other Straw Hats have made any sort of promise like that to them. You're trying to deny something that has actually been seen in the story.
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Luffy was sympathetic towards the minks.
He didn't become their friend until they made the alliance.He partied with them twice, and there's the whole "minkship" aspect we saw way before this alliance formed.
Luffy, for all intents and purposes, has more than enough reasons to stay and fight. More even than Doula at Dressrosa if I may argue.
- Luffy had constant curiosity about Jack.
- Luffy has made friends with all the relevant minks: Inuarashi, Nekomamushi, Wanda.
- Luffy may be able to fix Inuarashi and Nekomamushi's relationship. He tends to be very good at this.
- Luffy has still not fully convinced Pekoms into leaving with him. Beating Jack would be enough for that.
- Luffy might talk with Zunisha or whatever voice that belongs, further cementing his stay.
- Luffy is not in a hurry for Sanji.
- Nami, Chopper and Brook wouldn't leave the Minks in the current state they are. Chopper especially, as he is the only one with the antidote for Koro.
- Luffy is interested in Raizou's promise.
- Luffy downright stated his interest in beating Jack.
Almost every arc has Luffy being invested in someone's peril and then fighting the arc's main villain. Here's a list from the top of my head.
- Coby
- Rika and Zoro
- Chouchou and Mayor Boodle
- Usopp
- Sanji and Zeff
- Nami
- Dorry & Brogy
- Chopper
- Vivi
- Montblanc Cricket
- The whole of Skypiea
- Tonjit and Shelly
- Robin
- Brook, Lola and the Rolling Pirates
- Keimi and Hatchan
- Ace
- The whole of Fishman Island, but especially Shirahoshi
- Brownbeard
- Rebecca and Kyros
- Mink Tribe
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
I could see them leaving because everyone there could take care of themselves.
What part of "the minks are still too hurt" you didn't get?"
Did you forget the biggest reason why Sanji and co. didn't engage in combat with Bege?
Heck, Inuarashi just woke up from a coma yesterday. And Nekomamushi's wounds keep reopening. And that's not even counting the missing limbs.
Even a random mook from Jack's crew knows this. He's making more sense about this than you.
It's funny how you use the "Pekoms will be too hurt to do anything" argument, but doesn't apply it to the other minks who are far from being 100% themselves.
They also left Dressrosa despite the battle there. They could have went back after they ditched the big mom pirates if the really wanted.
Except leaving Dressrosa directly clashed with Doula's plans, so they had a good reason to leave. Taking Caesar with them effectively killed Doula's business with Kaidou.
No such thing here. Leaving for Sanji won't delay or stop Jack.
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Who said anything about taking down Jack? We don't know if Oda is saving his defeat for Wano or not.
What we do know is that Jack coming back makes him the main antagonist of the arc. Whether he'll be down for good is the questionable part, but he's being defeated here in some form.
A returning antagonist has precedent. Mr. 3 at Alabasta, Mr. 5 & Miss Valentine at Little Garden, and Buggy at Loguetown, so I'm willing to bet that he'll be back at Wano for some sort of clash.
Zoro actually did defeat Hody.
And then Hody got right back up with steroids and overwhelmed them underwater. That's not really a complete and utter defeat.
He also defeated Morgan.
This is the only real exception of the bunch, but that fight was pretty much Luffy & Zoro working together.
He also fought Buggy, Arlong, Enel, and Moriah(sort of). All main antagonists.
He was tricked by Buggy, and powerless in front of the middle two. Moriah was mostly a team effort. If you consider those first three actual fights, Robin also "fought" Enel, Nami also "fought" Buggy, and Usopp also "fought" Arlong. What all of these have in common is that they get destroyed by the antagonist, except for the Moriah/Oars situation, but they still needed Luffy to help finish the job there. He came in with Nightmare Luffy, and then had to break down Oars with the help of the whole crew. Then he had to take on Moriah. The point here is that Luffy is always the one to finish the main antagonist off and have the real extended fight.
This didn't have anything to do with what I said.
Why not? Zoro is not going to say that, because why would he expect Luffy to leave the island now that it's actually under attack?
Zou is a country with nothing but seasoned warriors who have nothing to do.
They're still injured/scarred from the conflict a week ago. They'll be overwhelmed without all the help they can get.
The Baratie stuff was hypothetical. I really don't want to go into all that.
Pekoms didn't promise a thing.
Now you're just contradicting yourself. He said he wouldn't capture them as a repayment. That was his promise at first.
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Just for comparison, cnet's translation:
Pekoms: We do have orders from Mama. Aside from capturing Caesar… / ...we have other business here as well. Business that might result in your entire crew’s destruction.
Sanji: ?!!
Pekoms: But forget about that!! That mission is a failure!! // Just hand over Caesar!! We’ll tell Mama that the Straw Hat Pirates got away! // I’ll come up with a believable excuse…I'm not sure what Pekoms reaction will be. Neither of us are.
We know that he is mad at Jack, and that he loves his homeland. With that, we can safely assume he won't want to leave.
That may or may not be the case. All we know is that he won't be able to accomplish anything significant in his current state.
Yes, probably not. But that doesn't mean he won't try.
We have a history of weakened characters in this series targeting the big bad even when they probably don't have a chance. Why would it be any different here?
Right before Jack attacked.
Luffy was comically about to attend the banquet the Minks are throwing before Nami had to remind him what his objective was and that they had to leave.It must not be so urgent to to Luffy if he's willing to attend yet another banquet. Nami reminding him here is besides the point.
Zoro only mentioned Kaido & Jack specifically in the VIZ version of the chapter. Nothing else.
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"The fight ahead" and a "confrontation with Kaido" is referring to a confrontation with him and all of his forces coming up.
Just to be clear here, I'm not saying that Zoro will be jack's opponent or his only opponent. I'm saying a confrontation involving the two is not out of the realm of possibility.
I can see them clashing for a short period of time, yes.
Zoro and Sanji actually did end up fighting Arlong though so I don't know what you're getting at here.
Luffy was the one to have the long extended battle with him, culminating with the destruction of Arlong Park. Zoro and Sanji distracted him for a few minutes in contrast.
Luffy did not grow a stronger bond with the minks within a single night most of which he probably slept away.
The Curly hats were the ones who saved them and have been with them nursing them back to health for 11 days. We saw the bond between them grow on-panel.
He has been talking to them for hours during the day, while travelling from place to place. They partied at night, slept, woke up, and then began to talk some more and travel to more places. It's not as measly as you're making it out to be.
Time spent compared to Luffy isn't really significant here though. He is one of the few characters in the series that can befriend and care for a person in minutes… like Bellamy, someone he hated 2 years prior.
And really, the amount of time the other Straw Hats have spent further shows that they aren't going to leave without helping. They've known the Minks personally for almost 2 weeks.
I could see them leaving because everyone there could take care of themselves.
And they'd want to risk something bad happening that they could've prevented? This would make that group of Straw Hats look pretty bad, to be honest, if they insist on leaving. Especially since they actually know the Minks really well.
They also left Dressrosa despite the battle there. They could have went back after they ditched the big mom pirates if the really wanted.
Nami, Brook, and Chopper had no connection to the people of Dressrosa, and did not bond with a single person there. The only exception was Sanji really.
Luffy also ordered them to continue to Zou. It made sense there, but it wouldn't here. Luffy would look really bad if he said "Alright guys, let's leave!" in the middle of a battle like this.
Nameless goons are fodder fam. The only named characters w/ jack are Ginrummy & sheepshead. Both weaksauce.
Again, reinforcements are a thing. We have no idea who else he has with him now. Just because they haven't been shown yet doesn't mean they don't exist.
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Luffy's shown zero haste in his plan to retrieve Sanji. Why would he leave a 1 billion Beri man to other people when he's already expressed the desire to beat Jack up?
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It's unlikely that Luffy would just leave looking at jack killing the elephant.
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This post is deleted!
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I wonder if Oda is actually going so far as to let Zounisha die. Sure, the typical Oda move is for the Straw Hats to save the day and is not only the most likely scenario but definitely the scenario, but what if?
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This Zunisha situation reminds me of Digimon Data Squad. Except with a turtle castle town.
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I wonder if Oda is actually going so far as to let Zounisha die. Sure, the typical Oda move is for the Straw Hats to save the day and is not only the most likely scenario but definitely the scenario, but what if?
everyone dies with zunisha in that scenario.. so. probably not
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everyone dies with zunisha in that scenario.. so. probably not
Well I dont think he meant instantaneously
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Does anyone know if Blackbeard has to kill someone in order to retrieve their DF? I'm asking because I just realize that Blackbeard missed a golden opportunity to take Marco's mythical Zoan's DF. Wasn't it stated that mythical Zoans are among the rarest of the rare when it comes to DF's? I also realized the one year ago date that Oda mentioned(when Marco and co fought Blackbeard) conicides with Rayleigh leaving Luffy for some reason. Maybe Rayleigh saved the WB pirates?
Edit: Of course when Oda mentions that something happened one year ago, in reality it could of happened 1 year plus 1 week ago etc.
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After reading Greg's post, I went back and re-read the chapter, and I have a sneaking suspicion I know the explanation to Momo's statement, but it depends on how bad Mangastream's translation was and/or how ambiguous the wording is in the original Japanese.
If my hunch is correct, then Momo's statement either said or implied "pirate" Roger, but could also be understood as saying "Roger pirate", and he means he met Rayleigh, the Roger pirate who was mentioned by Usopp in the same panel (and the only connection to Roger since halfway through the previous page). Or he actually said "Roger pirate", but in a way which could be interpreted either way in Japanese, and this was comically misunderstood.
It would be like "the corpses of your friends" all over again… which is to say, classic Oda.
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I think people are letting their love for Zoro or their longing for Sanji blind them. Jack has been being built up over the past 20 chapters and he's the first character whose bounty enters the decuple digits, and it's also nearly double what the highest known bounty was previously. It would be extremely anticlimactic if the battle were to happen off screen. I think it's a shame we won't be seeing Sanji for at least another 15-20 chapters, but I can't see anything else happening.
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Does anyone know if Blackbeard has to kill someone in order to retrieve their DF? I'm asking because I just realize that Blackbeard missed a golden opportunity to take Marco's mythical Zoan's DF. Wasn't it stated that mythical Zoans are among the rarest of the rare when it comes to DF's? I also realized the one year ago date that Oda mentioned(when Marco and co fought Blackbeard) conicides with Rayleigh leaving Luffy for some reason. Maybe Rayleigh saved the WB pirates?
Edit: Of course when Oda mentions that something happened one year ago, in reality it could of happened 1 year plus 1 week ago etc.
The fact that they could not take whitebeard's power until he was dead and the fact that smiley from punk hazard did not have his devil fruit resurrect into a nearby apple until he died also Blackbeard might be able to increase the chance of it resurrecting into a fruit he has on himself by sucking the devil out of a dying person into the nearby fruit instead of just leaving it to luck that the fruit he is holding will have the fruit turn into a devil fruit.
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Some of my thoughts and predictions after this chapter. I'm sure some points I have stated already.
Jack will be defeated by Luffy
- Gomu Gomu no Elephant Gun
- Gomu Gomu no Elephant Gatling
- Gomu Gomu no Thunder Elephant Gun
- Gomu Gomu no Mastodon Double Rifle (finisher?)
Luffy "Tea Party" Team
Luffy
Pekoms
Nami
Chopper
BrookAre 5, 4 if Pekoms doesn't help, people enough for this mission to see Sanji AND copy Road Poneglyph? Plus 4 Strawhats are going to Wano leaving a void in skills AND strength. Who will temporarily replace Zoro, Usopp, Robin, and Franky to rescue Sanji, if any? The 4 most prominent Minkmen minus Inuarashi and Nekomamushi could make sense. This could help with Minkmen character development and give each time to shine. Plus each could have special skills that may help.
Wanda–>Lead Minkmen this arc, Inu/Neko flashback
Carrot-->Adventure looks fun, Jumps REALLY high
Sicilian-->Hates sweets, Backbone!, Inu/Neko flashback?
Pedro-->Likes Sanji, Stealthy, Inu/Neko flashbackFind Marco/Whitebeard Allies Team
Nekomamushi
Nekomamushi underlings
Inuarashi?
Inuarashi underlings?GomuGomu Grand Fleet (5640 becomes 5656)
16 members left
Split between 4th and 6th division
8-12 Whitebeard Pirates
4-5 GiantsBuggy and Edward Weevil I think will be the main antagonists.
Wano Team
Zoro
Usopp
Robin
Franky
Momo
Kin'emon
Kanjuro
Raizo
Law
Heart PiratesRecruiting and preparing. Kin'emon may talk with Kitetsu who made one of Zoro's swords. This could help out Zoro and others tremendously.
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It would be like "the corpses of your friends" all over again… which is to say, classic Oda.
Actually that would be recent Oda (of which he's only done once so far)
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@Galaxy:
What we do know is that Jack coming back makes him the main antagonist of the arc. Whether he'll be down for good is the questionable part, but he's being defeated here in some form.
A returning antagonist has precedent. Mr. 3 at Alabasta, Mr. 5 & Miss Valentine at Little Garden, and Buggy at Loguetown, so I'm willing to bet that he'll be back at Wano for some sort of clash.
I'm not sure I'll buy that he'll be defeated yet. There have been several main antagonists that have never been beaten by the end of an arc. I don't know if it makes sense for one of Kaido's top warriors to be defeated before his actual arc especially since there are only 3.
I want his situation to be like Lucci. He'll display his strength as the main antagonist of one arc but is defeated in the next part of that story.
Buggy and the Baroque works agents were always comedic in nature and are low on the totem pole in terms of power.And then Hody got right back up with steroids and overwhelmed them underwater. That's not really a complete and utter defeat.
He was still fought and got defeated fair and square. He even lost consciousness.
If you consider those first three actual fights, Robin also "fought" Enel, Nami also "fought" Buggy, and Usopp also "fought" Arlong.
Don't be ridiculous. You're trying to diminish what actually happened because you don't want to admit they were actually fights and that you were wrong.
Robin, Nami' & Usopps situations were not even romotely comparable.Why not? Zoro is not going to say that, because why would he expect Luffy to leave the island now that it's actually under attack?
You deflected by saying "This is not a matter of trust". Then you acted like you could see the future and created a quote of what you "think" Luffy would say as if it were fact.
Now you're acting like what you think Zoro would do is factual and this still doesn't really answer what I said.They're still injured/scarred from the conflict a week ago. They'll be overwhelmed without all the help they can get.
They can still fight well. Everyone aside from Nekomamushi & Inuarashi is fine.
Now you're just contradicting yourself. He said he wouldn't capture them as a repayment. That was his promise at first.
How did I contradict myself? You're not making any sense.
That was not a promise and he never got the chance to act on his word.
The strawhats were still captured. The only reason they got away from Capone is because of Sanji."The fight ahead" and a "confrontation with Kaido" is referring to a confrontation with him and all of his forces coming up.
Stop making stuff up. Zoro never said anything about Kaido's forces.
You're twisting the words of a character to fit your own narrative yet again.
Zoro was directly talking about Kaido before and in that part of a scan you posted.He has been talking to them for hours during the day, while travelling from place to place. They partied at night, slept, woke up, and then began to talk some more and travel to more places. It's not as measly as you're making it out to be.
He talked to a few select minks briefly.
They weren't even there in the day. They arrived on Zou during a sunset, moments before Nekomamushi's time to wake up.
Stop acting like they have some strong connection.
You're just viewing the series through your own headcannon.
You see what you want to see and refuse to listen to anything that conflicts with that.
You also have some kind of complex where you're convinced that everything you personally "think" is factual.I'm not even going to bother reading the rest of your post.
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Why not give it a rest a little.
Like, here's a topic. What are the odds of marines being involved in Wano arc? I could see a couple of potential reasons for it. First, taking a chance to get Kaido. Especially if Drake is indeed a spy. I wouldn't really like this option, because it would be a clusterfuck.
Second, WG knew about Oden and his connection to Roger, but couldn't deal with it sooner, or didn't know, but found out during the events leading to Oden's death. Maybe even through Drake, the possible spy.
I like the second option more, because there probably wouldn't be a full marine forice led by an admiral involved, but a smaller contingent on assassins, targeting Inu, Neko and Momo.
Idk, just doesn't seem right that WG would let something like that slide easily.
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As for me, I'd like Wapol to be invited to the tea party.
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Why not give it a rest a little.
Like, here's a topic. What are the odds of marines being involved in Wano arc? I could see a couple of potential reasons for it. First, taking a chance to get Kaido. Especially if Drake is indeed a spy. I wouldn't really like this option, because it would be a clusterfuck.
Second, WG knew about Oden and his connection to Roger, but couldn't deal with it sooner, or didn't know, but found out during the events leading to Oden's death. Maybe even through Drake, the possible spy.
I like the second option more, because there probably wouldn't be a full marine forice led by an admiral involved, but a smaller contingent on assassins, targeting Inu, Neko and Momo.
Idk, just doesn't seem right that WG would let something like that slide easily.
Green Bull the mythical zoan introduced in the same arc that the Animal Kingdom goes down.
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Why not give it a rest a little.
Like, here's a topic. What are the odds of marines being involved in Wano arc? I could see a couple of potential reasons for it. First, taking a chance to get Kaido. Especially if Drake is indeed a spy. I wouldn't really like this option, because it would be a clusterfuck.
Second, WG knew about Oden and his connection to Roger, but couldn't deal with it sooner, or didn't know, but found out during the events leading to Oden's death. Maybe even through Drake, the possible spy.
I like the second option more, because there probably wouldn't be a full marine forice led by an admiral involved, but a smaller contingent on assassins, targeting Inu, Neko and Momo.
Idk, just doesn't seem right that WG would let something like that slide easily.
Well let's not forget it is not the best idea to have to many people involved. We already have many people involved :
- the strawhat-law alliance
- the Samourai-Ninja-Mink alliance (with some samourai yet to be revealed)
- Marco
- the Samourai-Shogun-Kaidou alliance
That is quite enough already don't you think ? Especially if Luffy brings more people from the tea party who we don't know how it will really end.
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Why not give it a rest a little.
Like, here's a topic. What are the odds of marines being involved in Wano arc? I could see a couple of potential reasons for it. First, taking a chance to get Kaido. Especially if Drake is indeed a spy. I wouldn't really like this option, because it would be a clusterfuck.
Second, WG knew about Oden and his connection to Roger, but couldn't deal with it sooner, or didn't know, but found out during the events leading to Oden's death. Maybe even through Drake, the possible spy.
I like the second option more, because there probably wouldn't be a full marine forice led by an admiral involved, but a smaller contingent on assassins, targeting Inu, Neko and Momo.
Idk, just doesn't seem right that WG would let something like that slide easily.
Smoker or another admiral might follow the straw hats around being able to catch the losers at wano but i don't think kaido will go down there since its the first island the strawhats are going to under kaido's control plus i don't think kaido will be there he is the boss of the beast pirates after all.
i also think jack will die making the reporting of his death true in the end
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Well let's not forget it is not the best idea to have to many people involved. We already have many people involved :
- the strawhat-law alliance
- the Samourai-Ninja-Mink alliance (with some samourai yet to be revealed)
- Marco
- the Samourai-Shogun-Kaidou alliance
That is quite enough already don't you think ? Especially if Luffy brings more people from the tea party who we don't know how it will really end.
That's why I said it would be a clusterfuck.
However, I could see it happening if Wano followed Alabasta model more than Dressrosa model. Wano should be closer to Alabasta's size than Dressrosa's anyway. And it's already apparent it won't be decided in the matter of days. If the plot lines are properly segmented, it could work without overcrowding the arc, allowing for potential problems or enemies to be dealt with over the course of several days, or even weeks. That's actually the main problem, from which all other Dressrosa arc's problems derived. Too much in too little time.
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As for me, I'd like Wapol to be invited to the tea party.
he is a king of a world government affiiated nation..no way he is invited..but we'll probably see him at the reverie
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he is a king of a world government affiiated nation..no way he is invited..but we'll probably see him at the reverie
Plus he would only be invited if he was married to one of big mom's daughters which he is not lol.
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@sanji''s_dad:
Plus he would only be invited if he was married to one of big mom's daughters which he is not lol.
Can you claim that with 100% certainty?
Big Mom's Jolly Roger has pink hair and Lola, a possible daughter, has pink hair. Miss Universe, Wapol's queen, has light purple hair. Then there's that "making connections through marriage" thing.
Just saying.
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Can you claim that with 100% certainty?
Big Mom's Jolly Roger has pink hair and Lola, a possible daughter, has pink hair. Miss Universe, Wapol's queen, has light purple hair. Then there's that "making connections through marriage" thing.
Just saying.
Big mom would not be having money problems if that was true he must be making billions off his wapol metal and whatever else he makes for the marines/world govt since he is the only one that can make it with his devil fruit lol.