Fine Carter… Sanji does use Martial Arts...
You know what? I don't even know why I even bothered. Apparently I've made myself into nothing but a joke for trying to support Paulie in this type of thing. So forget it I quit this debate.
So you guys can continue to laugh it up or whatever I'm done...
On the contrary. You've only tried to turn Franky down… rather than to forcus your supports on why Paulie is the one to join.
Because Chopper's style of fighting isn't fully hand to hand the way Franky's is. Chopper uses ALL of his transformations even his animal one's to fight. He doesn't just go out fists a flying like Franky. Most of the time he uses the rumble ball for is scope, using a form to give him high enough speed to get close using Jumping Point or Walk Point, and then takes out the enemies weak point with Arm Point. But Guard Point does serve advantages to Chopper as well.
Chopper's fights are more strategical as he has to use his techniques wisely considering he only has three minutes to work on. Whereas Franky's practically out of cola and he can still throw a punch? I'd say Chopper's fights are on the level of Usopp's.
YEA. AND. SO. WHAT.
You're still ignoring the fact that Franky's fighting is just as differant to Luffy's as Choppers is if you want to boil it down the way you did. And is just as differant, if not more so than Paulie's if you want to make it out to be.
And did I just imagine most of Franky's fights? You seem to be implying that he does nothing more than run in blindly punch his enemies. I must have been on drugs when I was reading those chapters cause I saw a whole hell of a lot more.
Because Chopper's style of fighting isn't fully hand to hand the way Franky's is.
He doesn't just go out fists a flying like Franky.
I'm sorry, but WHAT A CROCK OF SHIT.
If you don't like the guy, fair enough, but please stop making stuff up.
You keep banging on about what sets Choppers and Paulies attacks apart from Luffy's, but when it comes to Franky, you never mention the differances, only the similiarities.
Now you're assuming things.
Indeed I am, but from the looks of things, correctly in this case.
Paulie's attacks are based off of sailor knots that's the whole idea behind rope action. And I find a style like that very original and unique for a character. Not many could fight with rope after all.
Not many are cyborgs either.
This doesn't change the similiarities that you seem to be ignoring in Paulies style, or differances in Frankys.
The same could be said for Franky then.
It could. Were it not for the mountain of evidence the whole board is lining up to present to you, and that you keep ignoring. Or passing off for no apparant reason.
Then if Franky and Iceberg form a partnership why would Franky endanger his Nakama then? The world government couldn't go after Franky if he's in league with Iceberg. They'd probably keep a close eye on him though.
All true. BUT. Franky couldn't chase his dream in this case since building a ship like that takes time, and the Straw Hats can't and/or won't stick around.
And who's to say Franky's won't be either? After all how do you build a dream ship while sailing the grand line? Franky would be better off staying in Water 7.
By as I already pointed out upgrading a standard (but still probably top of the line) Galley-La ship as he goes along with them with whatever materials and inventions he and Usopp can get.
Yet Luffy doesn't know Usopp forgave him
YET being the missing word here I think you'll find.
and even then who's to say Luffy will even agree just because Franky helped them out?
Precedent. Luffy's always willing to forgive and forget. Zoro and Robin are two good cases.
Heck he was the cause of all their trouble to begin with since if it hadn't been for Franky Usopp wouldn't have left in general and left the straw hat's so broken afterwards.
He might not have left just then, but he would have left eventually. The feelings Usopp had weren't just going to disappear if he hadn't been attacked. They'd just have taken longer to fester and boil to the surface.
Since the whole argument started because Usopp blamed himself for losing the money which is why he thought Luffy was getting a new ship.
Yea, I'm sure that was the ONLY reason he had for leaving the crew :unsure:
Sarcasm aside, it always came across to me that the was only the proverbial straw that broke the camels back, and that it was overall the most minor reason he had for leaving the crew. The perceived abondonment of the Going Merry, and his feelings of inadequacy seem to me to be a lot more major, even if you want to brush them off as something he'd have just left sit inside himself, gnawing away at his personality indefinately.
Notice how Usopp would have never felt that way if none of that had ever happened. Sure he still would have been upset about losing Going Merry but I doubt he would have taken it to the extreme he had.
Yea, for all the reasons I just listed I think its safe to say thats complete and utter bollocks.
Then isn't Franky fighting just to help the Straw Hat's save Robin because she's their nakama? Why would he need to join them then? It's not like he NEEDS nakama. He already has it.
Sorry, my point seems to have passed over you completely. Perphaps it was because your head seems to be permanently buried in the sand and singing showtunes.
I'm not arguing about their respective motives. I'm arguing that while Vivi never really had any major fights in the story, Franky has. And he won quite easily and definately.
Yeah but that's because Franky is conviently THERE during the whole thing since he was kept with Robin. In any other situation I doubt people would be saying Franky is going to join.
Oh for fucks sake. This is just retarded. You might as well just be saying that Luffy only got any of his nakama just because they were "conveniently" there. That Luffy's only as strong as he is because he "conveniently" ate the Devil Fruit.
If you're going to start bringing the mechanics of the story and story telling method into question you really are just floundering, and need to give up the ghost.
On the contrary. You've only tried to turn Franky down… rather than to forcus your supports on why Paulie is the one to join.
Meh they can do what they want. Heh you know I bet if this was back in Arabasta and I was going on about how Robin was going to join around the time Luffy asked Vivi to come with them. I bet I would have been laughed at then too.
@TheSoundofBattles:
Oh for fucks sake. This is just retarded. You might as well just be saying that Luffy only got any of his nakama just because they were "conveniently" there. That Luffy's only as strong as he is because he "conveniently" ate the Devil Fruit.
If you're going to start bringing the mechanics of the story and story telling method into question you really are just floundering, and need to give up the ghost.
I'm saying he was conviently re-captured with Robin on the train which is why he was able to get the resolve to help them in the first place. Had Sanji and Sogeking gotten Franky out of there along with them on the train do you think Franky would have had any resolve to fight CP9? If only because he wanted to help?
No. Franky wouldn't have even cared at that point. Either that or he would have been stuck on the other side of the gap fighting the marines with Pauly, his nakama, and galley la. But I'm sure even then you'd be putting down Paulie based on Franky having a tragic past and all and how that makes him more qualified than Paulie.
Not once did I say that I would hate if Franky joined the straw hat's even if my arguments sounded like it but you're getting worked up over this.
Meh they can do what they want. Heh you know I bet if this was back in Arabasta and I was going on about how Robin was going to join around the time Luffy asked Vivi to come with them. I bet I would have been laughed at then too.
Oh good, play the martyr card, that'll really add weight to your post!
We're not saying Paulie will or won't join the crew. ONLY who is more likely to join based on precedents set in other arcs, and evidence presented thus far in the arc.
Being as how, you know, thats all we really actually have to go on.
Shocking isn't it :blink:
Yea, Oda could easily pull something out of left field and have Paulie, or Zambie, or Kaku or someone completely new join. Or no one. But thats something we can't actually argue about, because in that case:
THERES. NO. FUCKING. EVIDENCE. TO. ARGUE. ON.
How hard a concept is this to grasp man?
I'm saying he was conviently re-captured with Robin on the train which is why he was able to get the resolve to help them in the first place. Had Sanji and Sogeking gotten Franky out of there along with them on the train do you think Franky would have had any resolve to fight CP9? If only because he wanted to help?
No. Franky wouldn't have even cared at that point. Either that or he would have been stuck on the other side of the gap fighting the marines with Pauly, his nakama, and galley la.
Sorry, I still think this is a retarded line of argument. BUT. If you insist, then yes I think he would still have tried to go against the CP9 for a very simple reason.
He either had to go against them then, or later, and at least now he'd have the help of people he knows are good and strong.
Also, how can you say he wouldn't have cared? We can see in the manga obvious precedent that he is a caring kind of guy, you just have to get into his good books first, which Usopp, and by extension the entire Straw Hat crew had well before they were taken onto the train.
EDIT: By the way, no one will take your posts seriously as long as you continue to try to maintain that Franky's fighting style is so much more similiar to Luffys than Chopper's or Paulie's without presenting any actual evidence, and simultaneously ignoring lots of peoples to the contrary. And continue to try to evade all the other points, and subsequent evidence we put out there that you have yet to comment on.
Either step up, or piss off quite frankly. Because you're coming across as nothing more than a troll to me at least at the moment.
! Also, I'm quite likely to get banned, or at least warned if I continue to act heavy handed (most people think swearing is for some sad reason) toward you while trying to get you to answer peoples points. And I don't want that.
I'm saying he was conviently re-captured with Robin on the train which is why he was able to get the resolve to help them in the first place. Had Sanji and Sogeking gotten Franky out of there along with them on the train do you think Franky would have had any resolve to fight CP9? If only because he wanted to help?
No. Franky wouldn't have even cared at that point. Either that or he would have been stuck on the other side of the gap fighting the marines with Pauly, his nakama, and galley la. But I'm sure even then you'd be putting down Paulie based on Franky having a tragic past and all and how that makes him more qualified than Paulie.
Not once did I say that I would hate if Franky joined the straw hat's even if my arguments sounded like it but you're getting worked up over this.
You're really dense. What about those points about Franky's unique fighting style? I good arguement protects its weakpoints, and you've left enough to restart this topic. Frankly, I think most of these posts aren't to discuss Franky vs. Paulie, but to correct your poorly thoughout "essays." Now, onto this quote:
Yes. He was conviently captured because Oda wanted him to be captured. Would he want to save Robin without being re-captured? Tough call, but as I recall Franky is concerned about the revival of Pluton and that concerns Robin. I think he might care about that.
It's not like Franky is an asshole or something, he was crying over Robin's situation.
We're not saying Paulie will or won't join the crew. ONLY who is more likely to join based on precedents set in other arcs, and evidence presented thus far in the arc.
Being as how, you know, thats all we really actually have to go on.
Shocking isn't it :blink:
Yea, Oda could easily pull something out of left field and have Paulie, or Zambie, or Kaku or someone completely new join. Or no one. But thats something we can't actually argue about, because in that case:
THERES. NO. FUCKING. EVIDENCE. TO. ARGUE. ON.
How hard a concept is this to grasp man?
So I should become a rabid Franky fan then instead of a normal Franky fan and start dissing other people's arguments if they go against what I think will happen?
I'm just saying while Franky could join it's not 100% certain he will and Paulie still has a good enough shot of joining… but you go on and think Franky will join because he fought a CP9 member and because he has a tragic past and what not.
I never claimed though that I wouldn't like it if Franky joined I just personally think it's more Oda's style if he went with Paulie but that's me you can think whatever the heck you want for all I care. And hey if I'm wrong I'm wrong... big freakin' deal. But you don't have to be an ass about it.
Sorry, I still think this is a retarded line of argument. BUT. If you insist, then yes I think he would still have tried to go against the CP9 for a very simple reason.
He either had to go against them then, or later, and at least now he'd have the help of people he knows are good and strong.
Also, how can you say he wouldn't have cared? We can see in the manga obvious precedent that he is a caring kind of guy, you just have to get into his good books first, which Usopp, and by extension the entire Straw Hat crew had well before they were taken onto the train.
It's nice to know that my argument is "retarded." Oh wait I didn't even think it was an argument. I was under the impression I just threw that out on the table.as a "what if?"
Also when did the other straw hat members get into Franky's good book? Usopp did by spending actual time with Franky but what suddenly after being with Robin the straw hat's are in his good book? And this even after fighting Luffy back in Water 7? Sure he get's over emotional when it comes to Nakama but in the instance he hadn't spent time with Robin enough to get a second opinion why would he want to save her when he can save himself?
but hey as I said it wasn't a real serious argument. I was just putting it out on the table. Just like I could say how Paulie will join because he and Luffy made that pact to make CP9 pay back in Iceberg's manor.
But yeah it's nice to know how there are some One Piece fans who can be as passionate as Naruto fand get… geez to think I came here to get away from crap like that.
And fine. I admit that Franky's style is original. I just compared hand to hand combat to Luffy's style of fighting and that's why to me Paulie's style is just more original. But hey what do I know? I'm a retard according to you.
You're really dense. What about those points about Franky's unique fighting style? I good arguement protects its weakpoints, and you've left enough to restart this topic. Frankly, I think most of these posts aren't to discuss Franky vs. Paulie, but to correct your poorly thoughout "essays." Now, onto this quote:
Well maybe I find a guy who can fight with rope a lot more original and unique then Franky's "ZOMG I CAN PUNCH STUFF WHEN I DRINK COLA!" technique's., But hey that's just my personal taste. If anything you and SonofBattles are acting like a bunch of friggin' retarded flamers.
I admitted that I might have been mistaken by judging Franky's fighting style in regards to the other straw hat's but that's no reason to be a bunch of tight asses about it.
So I should become a rabid Franky fan then instead of a normal Franky fan and start dissing other people's arguments if they go against what I think will happen?
I'm just saying while Franky could join it's not 100% certain he will and Paulie still has a good enough shot of joining… but you go on and think Franky will join because he fought a CP9 member and because he has a tragic past and what not.
I never claimed though that I wouldn't like it if Franky joined I just personally think it's more Oda's style if he went with Paulie but that's me you can think whatever the heck you want for all I care. And hey if I'm wrong I'm wrong... big freakin' deal. But you don't have to be an ass about it.
It's nice to know that my argument is "retarded." Oh wait I didn't even think it was an argument. I was under the impression I just threw that out on the table.as a "what if?"
Also when did the other straw hat members get into Franky's good book? Usopp did by spending actual time with Franky but what suddenly after being with Robin the straw hat's are in his good book? And this even after fighting Luffy back in Water 7? Sure he get's over emotional when it comes to Nakama but in the instance he hadn't spent time with Robin enough to get a second opinion why would he want to save her when he can save himself?
but hey as I said it wasn't a real serious argument. I was just putting it out on the table. Just like I could say how Paulie will join because he and Luffy made that pact to make CP9 pay back in Iceberg's manor.
But yeah it's nice to know how there are some One Piece fans who can be as passionate as Naruto fand get… geez to think I came here to get away from crap like that.
I don't recall you saying that it was an unserious arguement. That would make a world of difference for me at least. But still, you're reasoning is very…unimaginative. Like selective reasoning or something, it's just so flawed.
Also, suggesting that Franky would choose to save himself after sacrificing himself before seems off.
So I should become a rabid Franky fan then instead of a normal Franky fan and start dissing other people's arguments if they go against what I think will happen?
Yea, sorry, not a huge Franky fan. Kaku first, Franky second.
I have no illusions there's any evidence for Kaku joining though. I'd still prefer him, but Franky makes a more than acceptable second.
but hey as I said it wasn't a real serious argument. I was just putting it out on the table. Just like I could say how Paulie will join because he and Luffy made that pact to make CP9 pay back in Iceberg's manor.
Oh, so thats what this is about?
What you THINK will happen?
Okay, like several people have said, if you think Paulie will join, then thats fine and dandy. But the evidence seems to be stacked against him.
You know, all that evidence we were so eager to show to you. The evidence you so nicely ignored, while trying to present your own non existant evidence on why you have a gut feeling it'll be Paulie instead?
Your gut could be right, but your gut isn't really evidence, so stop trying to present it, and your opinions as evidence.
If you wanted to present your point the way you now say you did all you had to do was say:
Hey guys, my gut still tells me Oda will pull a suprise on ye sucka's and have Paulie join. I think all the evidence he's putting out there is just to throw ye foo's off the scent.
P.S. I don't like Frankys fighting style!
See. Easy.
You present your opinion, state that it is only opinion, and either move on, or present some actual factual evidence to back it up. Something you so far have been very sketchy on as everyone here has been so nice to point out.
And hey if I'm wrong I'm wrong… big freakin' deal. But you don't have to be an ass about it.
Yes. I do. To try to get through to you since you seemed to be missing the point everyone was putting to you for the last several pages.
It's nice to know that my argument is "retarded." Oh wait I didn't even think it was an argument. I was under the impression I just threw that out on the table.as a "what if?"
And here is the crux of my point. You're point wasn't retarded. It was the way you tried to pass opinion and complete speculation off as fact, and then proceeded to ignore everyone else's points.
Also when did the other straw hat members get into Franky's good book?
Usopp = Hidden base.
Sanji = Train.
Robin = Train + Enies Lobby.
Chopper + Nami = Not complete, but he obviously gets on with them due to events during their fights in Enies Lobby.
Sure he get's over emotional when it comes to Nakama but in the instance he hadn't spent time with Robin enough to get a second opinion why would he want to save her when he can save himself?
Initially because as has been pointed out she ties into his past, and his and Toms shared goal of preventing the World Goverment from getting their hands on an ancient weapon.
But yeah it's nice to know how there are some One Piece fans who can be as passionate as Naruto fand get… geez to think I came here to get away from crap like that.
Oh hey, the old fight fire with fire tactic eh?
You're really proving yourself to be the better man there :huh:
Also, I guess those 5 or 6 essay length posts I, and several other people wrote out on why we disagreed with you, all being completely and totally polite and forgiving are worth nothing. As is the fact I stated I prefer Kaku to Franky, I'm just a rabid, raving, narutard (nice to place it all on one particular bunch of people by the way - isn't that kinda…elitist?)
all i can say is ROPE ACTION sux donkey balls…
FRANKY FTW
Yea, sorry, not a huge Franky fan. Kaku first, Franky second.
I have no illusions there's any evidence for Kaku joining though. I'd still prefer him, but Franky makes a more than acceptable second.
Well good for you then.
Oh, so thats what this is about?
What you THINK will happen?
Okay, like several people have said, if you think Paulie will join, then thats fine and dandy. But the evidence seems to be stacked against him.
You know, all that evidence we were so eager to show to you. The evidence you so nicely ignored, while trying to present your own non existant evidence on why you have a gut feeling it'll be Paulie instead?
Your gut could be right, but your gut isn't really evidence, so stop trying to present it, and your opinions as evidence.
If you wanted to present your point the way you now say you did all you had to do was say:
See. Easy.
Oh well gee thanks for making freakin' accusaions. Real childish of you. I don't even hate Franky's fighting style. I just prefer Paulie's more. Heck you came in this thing spouting off that all I was doing was bashing Franky when in all respect this entire debate is based on nothing but speculation anyways. You can try proving how Franky is the most likely to join but in the end it's nothing but speculation until it actually happens. Just like your little Kaku theory.
and what evidence? The fact he fought a CP9? The fact he has a tragic past? Is that all your evidence? Because to me that doesn't prove anything.
You present your opinion, state that it is only opinion, and either move on, or present some actual factual evidence to back it up. Something you so far have been very sketchy on as everyone here has been so nice to point out.
Well fine then… my first post in this thread for my argument WAS my opinion. Heck you could have ignored it you know instead of going on and on and on about how "I'm trying to keep Franky down!" You and the few others who have responded have constantly accused me of Franky bashing when I have done NO such thing. I even said I LIKED Franky!
Yes. I do. To try to get through to you since you seemed to be missing the point everyone was putting to you for the last several pages.
I'm just saying you could be more polite instead of coming off as some random rabid fan who's doing nothing but flaming me.
And here is the crux of my point. You're point wasn't retarded. It was the way you tried to pass opinion and complete speculation off as fact, and then proceeded to ignore everyone else's points.
Usopp = Hidden base.
Sanji = Train.
Robin = Train + Enies Lobby.
Chopper + Nami = Not complete, but he obviously gets on with them due to events during their fights in Enies Lobby.
Initially because as has been pointed out she ties into his past, and his and Toms shared goal of preventing the World Goverment from getting their hands on an ancient weapon.
But that doesn't mean he has to join the straw hat's in order to keep the World Government from getting it. Besides it's not like the world government could do anything about the weapon without Robin anyways.
Oh hey, the old fight fire with fire tactic eh?
You're really proving yourself to be the better man there :huh:
Oh like you were proving to be the better man? If you were trying to be the better man here then why not let it go instead of persist in trying to prove how "right" you are when I honestly don't care?
I admit that some of my arguments were wrong but I'm not going to go and admit I'm a troll and what not just to make you freakin' happy especially since it's not true at all. Oh and you called me an elitest but aren't you the one acting like an elitest?
And how exactly were you POLITE and FORGIVING? That's why you and the few others kept going "ZOMG U'RE JUST A PAULIE FAN OUT TO PUT DOWN FRANKY!111" Not to mention calling me dense and retarded.
yeah real freakin' mature of you.
Yep, after reading that, you too are getting far to high strung to keep this even remotely civil. I'm just going to piss off now so we don't both get banned.
Besides, everything I'd want to say to answer each of your points has already been said, mostly several times over, and not just by me.
I suggest you either P.M. or someone else step in for me. But most of all I suggest rereading the last 4 or 5 pages, like I said, everything I'd want to say is contained therein.
and what evidence? The fact he fought a CP9? The fact he has a tragic past? Is that all your evidence? Because to me that doesn't prove anything.
Oh god… i cant explain how ignorant and hypocritical you are to say that...
What you just said basically emits all what little evidence you had as well... because you know what? All those evidences on Franky were MUCH more stronger than the the ones you provided.
You are taking things WAY too personal and your arguments are becoming really off focus.
Oh god… i cant explain how ignorant and hypocritical you are to say that...
What you just said basically emits all what little evidence you had as well... because you know what? All those evidences on Franky were MUCH more stronger than the the ones you provided.
You are taking things WAY too personal and your arguments are becoming really off focus.
Well I'd be a lot more focused if this were a friendly discussion instead of everyone ganging up on me just to say how much of a retard I am 
and how so were they stronger anyways? Can you prove Franky's DEFINATELY joining the straw hat's? Did Oda say he was? If not how can you prove it? After all if my arguments are nothing but speculation why should I believe your arguments hold any merit since they're just speculation.
So fine there's not much evidence to go on considering Paulie's not over there with the straw hat's but that doesn't make my view any less valid. Not to mention you and the other Franky supporters make it sound like it'd be easy for Franky to just get up and leave the nakama he's already got. Heck if Franky's just going to leave then why even bother having Franky House help the straw hat's then? So what they help the straw hat's, rescue Franky, all for Franky to say "screw you guys I'm going with the straw hat's."
Yeah that wouldn't even seem like Franky at all and here I thought the Franky supporters claimed he wasn't an asshole.
Well I'd be a lot more focused if this were a friendly discussion instead of everyone ganging up on me just to say how much of a retard I am
and how so were they stronger anyways? Can you prove Franky's DEFINATELY joining the straw hat's? Did Oda say he was? If not how can you prove it? After all if my arguments are nothing but speculation why should I believe your arguments hold any merit since they're just speculation.
So fine there's not much evidence to go on considering Paulie's not over there with the straw hat's but that doesn't make my view any less valid. Not to mention you and the other Franky supporters make it sound like it'd be easy for Franky to just get up and leave the nakama he's already got. Heck if Franky's just going to leave then why even bother having Franky House help the straw hat's then? So what they help the straw hat's, rescue Franky, all for Franky to say "screw you guys I'm going with the straw hat's."
Yeah that wouldn't even seem like Franky at all and here I thought the Franky supporters claimed he wasn't an asshole.
Please now, all of us here are rather friendly, its just that we're all fustrated at the fact that you refuse to eat what we are feeding you.
I for one only see your defenses as mere personal opinions (such as not thinking Franky's techniques are amusing enough, or Franky not fitting in with the crew) Honestly I only said those arguments were probably stronger because it was built from logic and compared to past strawhat candidates (such as flashbacks, character development and etc)
Now, you are just repeating arguments that have already been answered. Like someone said before, not all the Straw-hats were alone before they joined. There were many sad goodbyes for the sake of pursuing their dreams. (Usopp with his mini pirate crew… Sanji with Zeff and the other chefs at the resturant... Nami with everyone at her village... and Chopper with Dr Kureha) If i was a part of the franky family, I personally wouldn't feel backstabbed as long as Franky explains his reasoning for leaving. The Franky Family should ultimately understand Franky the most now that they see the corruption in the world government.
Please now, all of us here are rather friendly, its just that we're all fustrated at the fact that you refuse to eat what we are feeding you.
I for one only see your defenses as mere personal opinions (such as not thinking Franky's techniques are amusing enough, or Franky not fitting in with the crew) Honestly I only said those arguments were probably stronger because it was built from logic and compared to past strawhat candidates (such as flashbacks, character development and etc)Now, you are just repeating arguments that have already been answered. Like someone said before, not all the Straw-hats were alone before they joined. There were many sad goodbyes for the sake of pursuing their dreams. (Usopp with his mini pirate crew… Sanji with Zeff and the other chefs at the resturant... Nami with everyone at her village... and Chopper with Dr Kureha) If i was a part of the franky family, I personally wouldn't feel backstabbed as long as Franky explains his reasoning for leaving. The Franky Family should ultimately understand Franky the most now that they see the corruption in the world government.
Well I gave up on the fighting style argument because there was no point fighting against it so why should I still continue to back it up when I gave up on it? It's not that I was saying Luffy was the only martial artist but he's the only martial artist who uses his fists and feet. Even if he is a brawler I feel that there doesn't need to be another fist fighter who just get's stronger punches from drinking cola. To me I feel Oda's style would more side towards Paulie joining since Paulie's rope technique's are very original and impressive compared to Franky who's just another brawler.
As for association with the crew members. It's not that I feel that there's a limit on the amount of buddies Usopp has but I don't feel that every Straw Hat who joins has to be a part of the Luffy/Chopper/Usopp comedy routine. I mean give Zoro someone else to interact with instead of Sanji when they're fighting or Nami when she's blackmailing him and hack it's not like Sanji couldn't interact with Pauly either since they'd get into fights sometimes too. Also I can see Nami using Paulie's bad luck at gambling to her advantage. See that's most of the crew right there. Plus Luffy doesn't seem to hold anything against Paulie like he did Franky.
Also even if Franky could leave just like that do you really think he would want too? Heck they could just find a new secret place to live in Water 7 or even Iceberg could do something to protect Franky. Whereas what reason does Paulie have to stay? Sure Iceberg is important to Paulie but Zeff was important to Sanji just as Kureha was to Chopper and yet Zeff let Sanji go and Kureha let Chopper go. So why can't Iceberg let Paulie go then? After all Paulie's already said he had nothing left except Iceberg after CP9 revealed itself so Tileston and the other guy must not be too important to Paulie.
Hopefully this sounds a little more logical even if most of it is based off my own opinions and speculation.
I am not taking sides, just replying to your original post Aethos. I'll be honest though, I am leaning more towards franky joining the SHs. Prepare for the mega post.
Lets look at your first point:
Firstly if we look at the Straw Hat crew in general we see that each member has a unique fighting style and no two characters are EVER the same. Now when we look at Franky we can clearly see his fighting style is based off martial arts. Here's a question… why would we need another martial artist when we've already got Luffy? I would think that would be rather bland if we get two martial artists in the same crew. Whereas Paulie's rope action techniques are very original and unique to Paulie on his own. I feel that having characters who have their own original and unique fighting style that no one else uses is more Oda's style.
Lets look at this from both sides.
You claim franky is mainly a melee fighter and he relies on that the most. (This is what I've gathered from your many posts.) Its true his melee combat is very good and that there are already many melee fighters in the crew already (i.e. Luffy, zoro, sanji, chopper). It's also true that the melee fighters do have unique characteristics (luffy rubber fighting, zoro sword fighting, sanji kicks, chopper transformations). However, your claim that Franky is mainly a martial arts fighter is an over-generalization. While his punches are very strong, he also utilizes punches which can be shot out as a cannon, has guns on his shoulders (ranged), a flamethrower (ranged), coup de vent/poo (ranged and quite strong given it knocked out a cp9 member), boomerang sideburns (ranged), centaur legs (close combat), and who knows what else since we cant be certain if he's shown all his abilities. Franky's attacks are numerous and very versatile. It would give and already has given Oda a lot of room to have fun with Franky in fights.
Lets look at Paulie. He has ropes. While this is cool because it is semi different, there's only so much he can do with it. He can tie people up, use them to punch people, use them to throw people, and cut people with them. There's not much room for future development in terms of fighting with ropes. I'm not sure seeing different types of knots will cut it for the future. (whereas seeing new types of kicks from sanji, sword fighting from zoro, and transformations from chopper are very interesting)
Overall in manga, melee fighting is usually favored more and is where most of the action is. Franky wins in this case with his ability to do both ranged and close combat.
Addressed points from your opinion:
Phew. Now lets look at your 2nd point:
Secondly let's look at character interaction in general. I mean if Franky joined the Straw Hats wouldn't you be afraid that he'd become a bland character? I mean Franky really doesn't have any outstanding personality traits that would fit into the rowdy lifestyle of the Straw Hat crew. He'd most likely fade into the background and we'd rarely ever see him whereas he could at least still drive Iceburg nuts at Water 7. Whereas look at Paulie. He'd practically fit right in especially in regards to his views on women and such. Heck I can even see Paulie and Zoro complaining about Sanji's fawning over Nami and Robin. Who would Franky usually hang with? Usopp? Heck he's already got Luffy and Chopper around he doesn't need a third person hanging with him. I think Paulie would be a good change on things considering he'd probably interact with Sanji, Zoro, and Luffy more than Usopp and Chopper.
Your first statement in this quote is probably something almost nobody has even thought I'd guess from the replies. Franky's character is pretty unique and definitely not bland. He's an older person and is pretty wise in terms of the ways of the world given his experiences. He's also quite silly. Franky also has a semi sinister side to his character as well since he's the self proclaimed leader of the underworld in water seven. Plus he flexes a lot. Honestly, he seems like the kind of person the SH's can easily get along with while at the same time be the type of person who can push his weight around. How you can say that he might not be able to fit in with the rowdy behavior of the SH crew is a little confusing given he's already lived a rowdy life with the franky family. Perhaps you chose the wrong words.
Franky has an intersting personality as well. He's semi-wreckless with his gambling habits and debt accrual. He also is very adamant about woman not dressing scantly.
Summary:
Onto your third point:
Thirdly let's not forget that Franky still has one thing Paulie doesn't have now… Nakama. Every single person who's joined Luffy has never had any Nakama or had some then lost them at some point. While Franky did have Tom and all that he still has all of Franky House as Nakama. Paulie has no one now since those whom he considered Nakama turned out to be the one's who shot Iceburg. Since Paulie basically has nothing really left to go back too at Water 7 it would make sense to see Iceburg allow Paulie to go with Luffy since the Straw Hat's need a shipwright.
There are a couple statements here which are incorrect. You say every single person who's joined Luffy has never had any Nakama, or that they did and that lost them at some point when they joined the SHs. Thats just untrue. Nami had her sister and the town folks whom she loved very much and who loved her. Sanji had everyone on the baratie including Jeff. Ussop had the 3 kids and the girl he loves on the island. Chopper had doctarinu. Robin would be the only case where your statement would be correct thus far. Because this original statement was false, your example therein cannot be used.
Some side comments:
If Franky could leave the island with the strawhats, he probably would. This is just my opinion. Not because he has nowhere to go but because I think he will build Luffy an incredible ship and want to sail with them to the end of the earth on it. After this arc is over, I'm sure he'll see the strength of the SH's and see that their crew would be able to do this and will try to fulfill his dream. Not to mention that he'd be a wanted man after this arc most likely and that he has no favor with the world government unlike Iceburg who is the mayor of water seven, well loved by the people (therefore well protected).
Paulie could also join the strawhats since you say he has no where else to go as you say. That would be similar to Robin's reason for joining the SH's initially. However, what are Paulie's goals, his ambitions, his motivation to staying with the SH's to the very end? His character hasnt been developed enough during this arc to address these questions and now would be a poor time to focus a lot on Paulie alone. Alternatives to joining the SH's would be to help rebuild water seven after everything is over, continue working under Iceburg, help keep water seven the thriving city its become. There's a lot of room for Paulie to do a lot of good in water seven.
Franky:
-A background and a dream
-The colorspread
-The introduction of his name as a chapter title
-Fighting the more significant villains.
-Developing relationships with the strawhats.
-Luffy's Drawing
For the love of fuck people, if this isn't evidence of Franky joining I don't know what the hell is. He's given us all the tell-tale signs of becoming a strawhat and it is inevitable. Why do we feel the need to constantly throw out the same damn arguements over and over again when it just comes down to the same conclusion. I don't like Franky, I actually downright hate him, but I know a strawhat when I see one.
The biggest reason for Paulie's not joining the crew is because of the lack of expansion of his character after they left Water 7. Ever since the SH and the Franky Family, Paulie has played little more than your standard background character. I've hoped countless times for Oda to make Paulie do something absolutely amazing (in terms of character developmet at least), but alas to no avail. Granted the fights and the plot is still developing wonderfully, there's just not as much of Paulie as I hoped. Perhaps he might still impress us when the Buster Call arrives…. but that's only wishful thinking.
Hello, all. Longtime lurker, firstime poster, and I've registered pretty much for the sake of saying:
The evidence pointing to Franky joining the Strawhats is overwhelming. It'd be pointless to reiterate all the reasons why, since the other forum-goers have done such a wonderful job of pointing them out.
Opinion does not a solid arguement make. Unless Oda throws all of the flashbacks, character development, and foreshadowing out the window…
Paulie is not joining the Strawhats. It's almost laughable to think so, at this point.
If one of them is joining I put my bet on Franky
But I think there might a possiblity that Oda surprises everyone and none of them join but instead a completely diferent character will join
The slightest desperate evidence that K a k u might join instead:
Luffy wanted a 5 meter height guy as his shipwright. As a giraffe, Kaku definitely reached over 5 m.
the YamaKaze, unforgettable moment of first appearance (oh ok, franky/paulie first appearance is also unforgettable)
he surely seems a bad guy for he is the one who dump Going Merry in front of Usopp. But as he argues, it is based on his judgement as a "respectable shipwright" and that he did the ship's measurement "diligently" which shows his dedication to the job. It hints that all his attitude towards the pirates all this time is also due to his dedication as a CP9.
while Franky has his own group, and Paulie dedicated to Iceberg, if the CP9 ruined, Kaku might have no nakama to attach to other than the strawhats.
the curious nose similarity and distinctive language might add something to the storyplot in advance
I am not taking sides, just replying to your original post Aethos. I'll be honest though, I am leaning more towards franky joining the SHs. Prepare for the mega post.
And as I was saying the ENTIRE time I don't give a crap if Franky joins. In fact if he does I'll be just as happy. I just don't like how everyone's pointing me out to be some kind of Franky hater or something. I don't even HATE Franky.
Lets look at your first point:
Lets look at this from both sides.
You claim franky is mainly a melee fighter and he relies on that the most. (This is what I've gathered from your many posts.) Its true his melee combat is very good and that there are already many melee fighters in the crew already (i.e. Luffy, zoro, sanji, chopper). It's also true that the melee fighters do have unique characteristics (luffy rubber fighting, zoro sword fighting, sanji kicks, chopper transformations). However, your claim that Franky is mainly a martial arts fighter is an over-generalization. While his punches are very strong, he also utilizes punches which can be shot out as a cannon, has guns on his shoulders (ranged), a flamethrower (ranged), coup de vent/poo (ranged and quite strong given it knocked out a cp9 member), boomerang sideburns (ranged), centaur legs (close combat), and who knows what else since we cant be certain if he's shown all his abilities. Franky's attacks are numerous and very versatile. It would give and already has given Oda a lot of room to have fun with Franky in fights.
Well I guess I should have said then that Franky's style of fighting is too identical to Luffy's considering most of what Franky does is melee combat as I stated. That martial arts thing was a stupid argument but then again I've seen Zoro comment on Luffy being a martial artist. I never heard anyone claim Sanji or any of the other melee fighters were. Which is probably why I didn't give it much thought when I put down that argument in my first post. After all I figured Sanji and Chopper's style of fighting deviated enough from Martial Arts to not be considered as such if that makes sense. Whereas Luffy's gomu gomu attacks are all based around it.
If that was a stupid argument for me to make then fine but that still doesn't tell me how Franky's style of fighting is better than Paulie's.
Lets look at Paulie. He has ropes. While this is cool because it is semi different, there's only so much he can do with it. He can tie people up, use them to punch people, use them to throw people, and cut people with them. There's not much room for future development in terms of fighting with ropes. I'm not sure seeing different types of knots will cut it for the future. (whereas seeing new types of kicks from sanji, sword fighting from zoro, and transformations from chopper are very interesting)
But I can't see how a new knot from Paulie would be any different from seeing a new kick from Sanji, a new move from Zoro, etc. Besides there's more Paulie can do with ropes such as knocking people out, slamming them into something, etc. I feel there's more room to do interesting moves with Paulie than there are with Franky. That's why I feel Paulie's a lot more original and unique to Franky who just uses melee attacks. I mean seriously does the Straw Hats really need TWO brawlers? They already got Luffy for that.
Overall in manga, melee fighting is usually favored more and is where most of the action is. Franky wins in this case with his ability to do both ranged and close combat.
Addressed points from your opinion:
- Franky is not the same as other fighters (has numerous melee and ranged attacks)
- Rope action is unique, but can end up being dull in the future.
But the discrepency in your argument is that you claim rope action couldn't be considered melee combat. I'm wondering why you think Paulie couldn't use it that way and that; that would make him more favored compared to Franky.
I feel that seeing Franky using the same moves over and over instead of making new moves to go along with the old one's like other Straw Hat's do would get old and dull whereas Paulie has that kind of room where he could make up some interesting techniques with rope action.
Phew. Now lets look at your 2nd point:
Your first statement in this quote is probably something almost nobody has even thought I'd guess from the replies. Franky's character is pretty unique and definitely not bland. He's an older person and is pretty wise in terms of the ways of the world given his experiences. He's also quite silly. Franky also has a semi sinister side to his character as well since he's the self proclaimed leader of the underworld in water seven. Plus he flexes a lot. Honestly, he seems like the kind of person the SH's can easily get along with while at the same time be the type of person who can push his weight around. How you can say that he might not be able to fit in with the rowdy behavior of the SH crew is a little confusing given he's already lived a rowdy life with the franky family. Perhaps you chose the wrong words.
What I was mostly saying is. Aren't you afraid that Franky's personality might be overshadowed by the other straw hat's if he does join? I mean we've already got three comedic characters those being Luffy, Usopp, and Chopper. Where does Franky really fit into that? If Franky joined I'd want him to still be the Franky we know now. I wouldn't want to see Franky's character turn stale as he just stands around the way Robin does. Not that I mind Robin being the silent person on board and all but I wouldn't want to see Franky turn into that. Whereas I feel that Paulie wouldn't exactly turn stale in that sense because he wouldn't be overshadowed by anyone other than Zoro. Which to me makes more room for interesting hijinxs.
Franky has an intersting personality as well. He's semi-wreckless with his gambling habits and debt accrual. He also is very adamant about woman not dressing scantly.
Summary:
- Character-wise, both are cool. However, I think Paulie would annoy Nami, Robin, and Sanji whereas Franky would get along with everyone more due to his ability to be both serious/wise and funny.
I don't think Paulie would annoy Robin and I think Nami would get a kick out of taking advantage of Paulie's gambling habits… Would he annoy Sanji? Yeah but I think that would be a welcome change. It's not that I mind Zoro being the only one to be so out spoken against Sanji the way he is but who said Zoro had to be the only one to do that?
Onto your third point:
There are a couple statements here which are incorrect. You say every single person who's joined Luffy has never had any Nakama, or that they did and that lost them at some point when they joined the SHs. Thats just untrue. Nami had her sister and the town folks whom she loved very much and who loved her. Sanji had everyone on the baratie including Jeff. Ussop had the 3 kids and the girl he loves on the island. Chopper had doctarinu. Robin would be the only case where your statement would be correct thus far. Because this original statement was false, your example therein cannot be used.
Fine I take that argument back then…
Some side comments:
If Franky could leave the island with the strawhats, he probably would. This is just my opinion. Not because he has nowhere to go but because I think he will build Luffy an incredible ship and want to sail with them to the end of the earth on it. After this arc is over, I'm sure he'll see the strength of the SH's and see that their crew would be able to do this and will try to fulfill his dream. Not to mention that he'd be a wanted man after this arc most likely and that he has no favor with the world government unlike Iceburg who is the mayor of water seven, well loved by the people (therefore well protected).
Paulie could also join the strawhats since you say he has no where else to go as you say. That would be similar to Robin's reason for joining the SH's initially. However, what are Paulie's goals, his ambitions, his motivation to staying with the SH's to the very end? His character hasnt been developed enough during this arc to address these questions and now would be a poor time to focus a lot on Paulie alone. Alternatives to joining the SH's would be to help rebuild water seven after everything is over, continue working under Iceburg, help keep water seven the thriving city its become. There's a lot of room for Paulie to do a lot of good in water seven.
But here's the problem. You say that it's easy for Paulie to stay and yet not Franky. That's the only thing I don't understand about your argument. If Franky built the dream ship for Luffy why would he need to leave water 7 then if his dream's been fulfilled? What other goal or ambition would Franky have to join the crew at that point?
And well let's be honest. Sure they have their differences but who's to say Iceberg couldn't do something to protect Franky from the world government. I remember someone stated that Franky and Robin can't be seperated. When did it become Luffy's job to take the carrier's of the ancient weapons? After all I don't remember him requesting Robin to join because she knew about the ancient weapons. He didn't do it to protect her from the world government even though they're saving her NOW from the world government. He brought her on because he felt responsible for saving her life and came to like her as one of his nakama. Luffy's not going to just bring Franky with him because of the ancient weapons issue. Heck I doubt Luffy even cares about those things.
And well as said before Luffy still doesn't like Franky. Whereas at any other time he was getting a crewmember Luffy liked the person whom he wanted to join. He liked Zoro, He liked Nami even after she betrayed him, He liked Usopp, He liked Sanji, He liked Chopper, and while he didn't show much like towards Robin he didn't really hate her or anything… at least he didn't see her in the same animosity as he does Franky. That's where I think Paulie has a better shot of joining. Because Paulie never got that kind of animosity from Luffy has towards Franky and how would we know Luffy would change his mind and allow Franky to join after this arc? Usually when Luffy doesn't like someone he doesn't like them period. He's stubborn that way. Even if he's not one to hold a grudge or anything.
But hey I could be wrong. Who knows?
But here's the problem. You say that it's easy for Paulie to stay and yet not Franky. That's the only thing I don't understand about your argument. If Franky built the dream ship for Luffy why would he need to leave water 7 then if his dream's been fulfilled? What other goal or ambition would Franky have to join the crew at that point?
Franky will want to be on the ship to make sure it makes it to the grand line. Not really a farfetched thought.
But hey I could be wrong. Who knows?
You are.
well now that the strawhats are going to the gate of justice and going forward instead of going back to water 7 it means the strawhats will have to get a new ship somehow. with franky there they can build a new ship since he is probably the best shipwright in the world next to iceburg. i have a feeling franky is building a really kickass ship somewhere and is building it little by little as he get's more money and parts. the ship may be hidden on some island and that will be the next stop for the strawhats. i think of it as the unfinished death star and as they sail on the grandline the ship will get more and more powerful until it's finished and then it's going to be unstoppable. having an unfished ship also give's franky something to do while they sail.
You are.
Yeah because your opinion equals fact right?
I didn't think so.
But hey. Fine. I'm wrong since after all apparently I'm not allowed to have a different view on things according to the majority of people who replied to this thread.
Sheesh I'm starting to think I would have been better off if I had continued to stay out of this.
well now that the strawhats are going to the gate of justice and going forward instead of going back to water 7 it means the strawhats will have to get a new ship somehow. with franky there they can build a new ship since he is probably the best shipwright in the world next to iceburg. i have a feeling franky is building a really kickass ship somewhere and is building it little by little as he get's more money and parts. the ship may be hidden on some island and that will be the next stop for the strawhats. i think of it as the unfinished death star and as they sail on the grandline the ship will get more and more powerful until it's finished and then it's going to be unstoppable. having an unfished ship also give's franky something to do while they sail.
Hmmm well that could make sense. I find that an acceptable explanation and I respect your opinion ::thumbs up::
^_^
I'm so surprised at this point Paulie has so many votes.
I mean, no bashing or anything but… He is tied up by lowly enemies while Franky has defeated two CP9 and berserker Chopper, and is on his way to bringing the keys to free Robin... >.>
well now that the strawhats are going to the gate of justice and going forward instead of going back to water 7 it means the strawhats will have to get a new ship somehow. with franky there they can build a new ship since he is probably the best shipwright in the world next to iceburg. i have a feeling franky is building a really kickass ship somewhere and is building it little by little as he get's more money and parts. the ship may be hidden on some island and that will be the next stop for the strawhats. i think of it as the unfinished death star and as they sail on the grandline the ship will get more and more powerful until it's finished and then it's going to be unstoppable. having an unfished ship also give's franky something to do while they sail.
Erm, I think Franky is superior to Iceburg. For the fact that before he learned from Tom, he was making cannons from junk. And he was making his own battle ships at such a young age. He is really a ship building prodigy, who may even have surpassed Tom. Hell, he turned his own body in to a cyborg, thats how creative/building this guy is.
I did not want to get involved at first, but after boredom drove me to read the entire arguement, there's something I feel like addressing.
Your arguement has had a noticable amount of inconsistancy, but there's one thing that you've remained steadfast on: ignorance.
There's three examples I'd like to give.
But hey. Fine. I'm wrong since after all apparently I'm not allowed to have a different view on things according to the majority of people who replied to this thread.
If you had not been selectively reading all of the arguements against yours (as I'm sure you will do with this one, if you don't outright ignore it), then you would have noticed something about them.
It's been stated over and over again that they have no problem with you having an opinion.
What they claimed to have a problem with was how you defended your points against theirs, ignoring most of the detailed points they make and contradicting yourself repeatedly.
that still doesn't tell me how Franky's style of fighting is better than Paulie's.
This one you've only said once, but you made the same point several times. You don't find Franky's fighting style interesting, while you think Paulie's style has a lot more potential.
Again there's no problem with this, but this is perhaps what you have been most selective about.
You say there that you haven't been told how Franky's style is better. But people have said why they think so. They have said it many times. Some people more than once. Some people listed every one of his special techniques, which for the record you never directly responded to once yet.
Have you really somehow missed every one of those points?
and what evidence? The fact he fought a CP9? The fact he has a tragic past? Is that all your evidence? Because to me that doesn't prove anything.
Same as the point about his fighting style. People have said more than that multiple times, as clearly as they can. It's you who isn't listening to them.
Also, before/if you respond:
I do not care if you think that you are being ganged up on.
I do not care if you think that you should not have gotten in to this in the first place.
I do not care if you think that this is not really an arguement, I think that it is.
I do not care if you do not actually hate Franky.
As many times as you bring most of these points up, it has no effect on your arguements.
And to go back to the original topic, I have to admit that I'm fairly biased on the Franky side. I think that Oda can write it well either way, but I'll be a little bit dissapointed if Paulie joins.
I think Franky will join.
The biggest reason I feel Paulie could never join, is his position to Water 7.
He seems to be the main guy of the Galley-La. Heck, he is almost like Iceburg's diciple.
Galley-La has just lost several, actually Water 7, has lost several important people. Lucci and Kaku were very good workers for Galley La, with their abilities they most likely made up for 10+ normal men each. Blueno and Kalifa had important roles too, Blueno was in charge of the bar which would have to get a new bartender. And Kalifa is gone, so Iceburg needs a new secretary.
This leaves open the possiblity for Franky Family to become Galley-La workers, and the two girls to be Iceburg's secretary/assisstant/whatever. Thus leaving Franky, with no real position if they all left him. Of course I theorize he would leave, so the others can get out of the crime light.
Paulie has to be in charge of all the Galley-La people. Since he is the main guy, he has to teach them and make sure everything is going smoothly. He is probably still learning as he is young. He has no ambitions, or possible dream at this moment to persuade him to leave behind Galley-La and Iceburg to go with the Strawhats.
Franky on the other hand, is going to be wanted by the World Government most likely. Is more or less a ship building prodigy. He loved Tom, and probably has a dream to make a ship and aid the next Pirate King, kind of like Tom did. With what I mentioned above, he would leave the Franky family in good hands, and they would be helping out Water 7 more than anything. Franky has also essentially befriended and chatted with each Strawhat, almost individually.
There is simply put, no way I could EVER see Paulie making it on the ship. Let alone OVER Franky. Paulie has too much responsibilities, he is a good guy who has a job to do. His whole reason for going to Enies Lobbies, was because of what happened to Iceburg. Would he really leave Iceburg, when he is that loyal to the man?
I mean really, its fine to like Paulie more than Franky… But the fact is, using logic... There is simply no chance for Paulie, let alone over Franky.
This leaves open the possiblity for Franky Family to become Galley-La workers, and the two girls to be Iceburg's secretary/assisstant/whatever. Thus leaving Franky, with no real position if they all left him. Of course I theorize he would leave, so the others can get out of the crime light.
That's actually a pretty nice idea -;; I always wondered what would happen to the Franky-Family. They are too weak to follow Luffy but can't be left alone as well, since they commited a capital crime by attacking Enies Lobby.
And they worship Franky, who feels responsible for their safety. If there's no other solution, Franky will be forced to escape with them.
But with the FF joining Galley-La, most problems will be solved -; The FF is safe and Franky can join the Strawhats without any regrets! :3 Great XD
Yes since Franky a supremely wanted felon now really has a reason to stay in one place nemore
why doesn't he just get some red paint and paint the bullseye on his chest for them
Shishou, the only problem I have with your post is that Sanji left Baratie despite having the same kind of role there. While Baratie did not lose people in key positions like Lucci, Kaku, Calipha, Galley La has still only lost 3 people out of hundreds. Plus, they still have Tilestone and Lulu.
However, I do agree that the evidence at this point for Franky joining is much more significant than for Paulie joining; and unless there is some serious character development for Paulie as we near the end of the arc, I just don't see how his joining over Franky could be justified.
People, people, listen. Arguments such as no develpement, no backstory, no attention, and Paulie isn't fighting cp9, ARE BAD ARGUMENTS. Why? Let's review the crew (not counting luffy).
Usopp - backstory? yes. fight important guys? yes developement? yes. Attention? alot
nami - backstory? when she fully joins. Developement? <–. Fighting? yes. Attention? moderate until arlong.
zoro - Backstory? quite a ways away but you get backround info. Developement? yes. fighting? yes. Attention? alot
sanji - Backstory? yes. Developement? yes. Fighting? yes. Attention? Dims after baratie but starts as alot.
Chopper - Backstory? yes. Developement? yes. Fighting? yes. Attention? good amount towards end and stays generally around that much.
Robin - backstory? No. developement? No. Fighting? No. Attention? Less then paulie.
See my point?
edit - Just for the record, I think Frankie will join, but i thought I'd just put that out there.
I did not want to get involved at first, but after boredom drove me to read the entire arguement, there's something I feel like addressing.
Your arguement has had a noticable amount of inconsistancy, but there's one thing that you've remained steadfast on: ignorance.
Well gee thanks a lot for being so blunt. Whereas I've come to realize on my own that my argument wasn't very thought out. I had just been thinking about it at the time when I posted it so I realize I made many inconsistancies when I should have thought out my argument better before posting.
Still I don't need people telling me something I already know thank you very much. It makes you come off as rude not to mention a total ass. If I'm wrong I'll come to that conclusion on my own and do my best to fix it. Like what happened with your second point for instance.
There's three examples I'd like to give.
If you had not been selectively reading all of the arguements against yours (as I'm sure you will do with this one, if you don't outright ignore it), then you would have noticed something about them.
It's been stated over and over again that they have no problem with you having an opinion.
What they claimed to have a problem with was how you defended your points against theirs, ignoring most of the detailed points they make and contradicting yourself repeatedly.
No what caused me to ignore them was when they came in here and referred to me as a troll, a retard, and a paulie fan out to bash Franky. I came into this looking for friendly discussion and/or debate. I don't want to have to deal with people who's maturity levels are on par with the common NaruTard. I happened to read their posts but the fact that they continued bashing me even when I acknowledged I made a few mistakes made me lose more focused and just pissed me off even more. If they would have left out the childish insults and instead tried to reason with me in a more mature fashion then I would have taken them a lot more seriously.
But let's use some of the points.
He was on a color spread. WHO CARES? That doesn't prove a thing in my view.
He fought a CP9 member. So? Vivi took out the Mr. 7 team and Wiper took out one of the friggin' priests. What's your point?
His whole tragic past. Well Vivi and Wiper ALSO had semi-tragic pasts too you know but didn't Franky's past serve more to establish Spandam as a bad guy? Oh and if Franky's past is a clue to him being a straw hat then how come we know next to NOTHING about Paulie? I doubt he has all those quirks because Oda just FELT like it. Why didn't Paulie get any flashback yet or development or anything if we're never going to see him again? Heck even Pell got a flashback and some development. Heck there's gotta be something going on with Paulie and I doubt Oda would just throw away Paulie's character in the end as if it were nothing.
The fact he has a dream. Okay so we don't know if Paulie has a dream yet or anything but hey why does Franky HAVE to leave Water 7 to build his dream ship when he could do it right there? Besides while Paulie may have his own speciality in Galley La it's not like the straw hat's need someone who can build an entire ship. They just need someone who can fix it up better since Usopp's quick fixes just aren't cutting it anymore. I can't see how Franky would do a better job than Paulie in that aspect. Especially considering Franky's speciality is dismantling ships.
I have no doubt though that Franky's going to build his dream ship for the Straw Hats to use but I see no reason why Franky would be the one who HAS to go with them when Paulie could do just as good of a job keeping good care of the ship.
This one you've only said once, but you made the same point several times. You don't find Franky's fighting style interesting, while you think Paulie's style has a lot more potential.
Again there's no problem with this, but this is perhaps what you have been most selective about.
You say there that you haven't been told how Franky's style is better. But people have said why they think so. They have said it many times. Some people more than once. Some people listed every one of his special techniques, which for the record you never directly responded to once yet.
Have you really somehow missed every one of those points?
And here lies the problem I was referring too. Considering how many people wouldn't let the damn thing go. I'm sure you remember me saying that Luffy was the only martial artist right? Okay then I admit I was stupid for making that comment when most of the styles are based on martial arts. But what I had REALLY meant by that was that no two straw hat's fighting styles are similar as they use their own unique ways to fight. Paulie in my view fits that description of having a unique fighting style all his own that none of the other straw hat's use. While Franky's style seems to be a combination of Luffy, Usopp, and Choppers. That's why I feel Franky's style ISN'T original or unique because it's already done and better I might add by three different straw hat members… while really who on the straw hat crew would fight using ropes?
Same as the point about his fighting style. People have said more than that multiple times, as clearly as they can. It's you who isn't listening to them.
And how do you know I'm not? Most of the arguments are saying that it's OBVIOUS Franky will join because he's one of the major fighters against CP9 and how he has a dream. Not to mention he was on a color spread and in a few One Piece games. I mean really it's not like I'm throwing out their evidence and saying it's nothing. I'm just saying that people are guessing too soon that it'll be Franky when it might not be. There's no proof at all that Paulie won't be the one who joins and saying it's because he hasn't been shown much is a rather stupid argument.
Also, before/if you respond:
I do not care if you think that you are being ganged up on.
I do not care if you think that you should not have gotten in to this in the first place.
I do not care if you think that this is not really an arguement, I think that it is.
I do not care if you do not actually hate Franky.
Well good for you then and might I add that I DON'T HATE FRANKY! I mean how many damn times do I have to say that?
As many times as you bring most of these points up, it has no effect on your arguements.
Well it's hard to make good arguments when the majority of reactions I got from Franky fans were the exact things you just stated above. I don't appreciate being treated like that. I really don't deserve it because I feel like they're disrespecting my opinion and my views by doing so. I don't care if they have different opinions from me but I do care if they can't argue about this in a mature manner.
And to go back to the original topic, I have to admit that I'm fairly biased on the Franky side. I think that Oda can write it well either way, but I'll be a little bit dissapointed if Paulie joins.
and that's fine. I don't care. Personally if Franky joins I'd be just as happy as if Paulie joined but right now I feel thhat Franky is more of a Wiper or a Vivi than Paulie is. Despite all the evidence the Franky fans have there is no definate proof that Franky's joining at least until Luffy out right asks Franky to join.
Despite all the evidence the Franky fans have there is no definate proof that Franky's joining at least until Luffy out right asks Franky to join.
Once again, All evidence had proving frankys joining is debunked by Robin and Wiper. And I must thank you for bringing up Wiper. I completely forgot about him.
Oh, and even if Luffy does ask, what makes you think He'll say yes? If Luffy had went: "Hey, Wiper, wanna join our crew?" He probably would have said no. And lets not forget something that could strip away almost all the possibility that Franky could join….Tom lives. Sure Spandam said he was dead. But, Spandams a tad bit twisted so he could be lying.
edit - I highly doubt my last arguement though.
edit2 - Unless of course they kept Tom alive to build Pluton. Who says if they got the plans then they'd be able to build it?
People, people, listen. Arguments such as no develpement, no backstory, no attention, and Paulie isn't fighting cp9, ARE BAD ARGUMENTS.
…
edit - Just for the record, I think Frankie will join, but i thought I'd just put that out there.
While these could be bad arguments to discount Paulie, when you have one character with all of those things, and another with very little, I think it just becomes more difficult to choose the latter.
Since you mentioned you think Franky will join, what is your reasoning for supporting that?
Supporting the possiblity that Paulie will join? It's because my mind is having an arguement with itself. Half of me wants Franky to join. The other half, Paulie. If it was Franky on the losing end I would most likely be defending him.
Plus I'm sick of seeing all the stuff that has no relavence what-so-ever because of Robin/Wiper.
I've made these arguments before (maybe not in this thread - most likely in other threads), but I guess I'll repeat these arguments here since this thread seems to be active again.
IMHO, Franky won't be the next Strawhat member. Why? Well a couple of reasons.
First of all, it would be too cold-hearted of Franky to leave his crew - a crew that just underwent a suicide mission to get him back (raiding Eneas Lobby in order to free a 'criminal' would indeed in almost all circumstances be considered suicide by any sane person), something Franky thought his crew would not in a million years ever have done for him. This shows just how much love the crew has for its leader. If Franky decides to repay this immense love the crew just displayed for him by selfishly leaving them then I can't help but be disappointed in his character. And anyways, I don't think this will happen since I also believe Franky loves his crew too much to leave them.
Others bring up the point that Sanji also had a crew, but left them to follow a dream. So why can't Franky? Well the circumstances are different. If Franky leaves, then who in the Franky family can replace him? I don't think anyone can. The Franky family would probably be disbanded without their charismatic, super strong leader to lead them. And besides, it's the Franky family, not the Zambai family, or the Kiwi and Mozu family, or another Franky family member family (my apologies for the awkward phrasing). The Franky family is just too dependent on Franky and just wouldn't survive without him.
That's not the case in Sanji's case. The Baratie will still survive even if Sanji leaves (as it indeed did). And hell, the Baratie crew even encouraged him to leave to follow his dream. Would the Franky family be willing to do the same for Franky? My feeling is that they need him too much and love him too much to encourage him to leave. But that's just my opinion anyway. Feel free to disagree.
And anyways his dream is to build a dream ship. Once it's built, there would be no need to follow the Strawhats to achieve his dream. He would have already achieved his dream by building the ship. So once he's built his dream ship, he'll be staying behind, much like his predecessor Tom did.
But oh, once he builds his dream ship, wouldn't this ship need a carpenter in order to keep the ship in top condition? And shouldn't this carpenter be Franky, as it would only make sense that the creator of a ship be its carpenter. No not really, since Franky's dream is not to be the best carpenter in the world, but to create the ultimate ship, a dream that would have already been fulfilled with the ship's inception, not its upkeep. So if Franky does join the crew as the crew's carpenter it would seem to me like nothing more than an overprotective father not wanting to let go of his child. But as with all children, it has to be set free someday and allowed to travel its own path. Also, I don't think the ship will need a carpenter anyway since I believe Franky will give the ship he creates for the Strawhats self-healing/self-repairing abilities (now that would be the ultimate ship).
Others bring up the point that he would need to travel with the Straw hats in order to verify that the ship he built for them is indeed the ultimate dream ship. But IMHO, once the Strawhats reach Laftel, once Luffy becomes the pirate king, news of this will no doubt spread around the world. This is really the only verification Franky needs to confirm that his dream was indeed fully met.
Still others theorize that Franky might build the dream ship along the way by picking up exotic ship parts from new islands they may encounter and incorporating them into their new ship. That is he builds the ship piecemeal along the way to Laftel until he finally feels like he's achieved his ultimate ship. I have some problems with this theory however. Building a ship requires nothing more than wood, steel and nails. Why the need for 'exotic' parts? Plus I feel it's a testament to Franky's skills if he can build the ultimate ship from scratch from with just wood, steel, and nails. It would not feel like it were as much of an accomplishment if he were to rely on the work of others to help him build his dream ship. Finally, an ultimate ship, in order to verify that it's an ultimate ship, needs an ultimate test. If the ultimate ship is finally built and achieved only after the Straw hats have reached (or neared) Laftel, then what challenge would be left for the ship to surpass in order to prove itself? IMHO, the only proper test for the ultimate ship cannot be anything less than traveling the grand line until it reaches Laftel, surviving in one piece (no pun intended).
So if Franky isn't the one who will be joining, who will? I don't believe Paulie is meant to join either for reasons others have most likely already stated. So if it's not Franky or Paulie that’s meant to be the next member, who is meant to be the next member?
It's my belief that it will be the Klabautermann, or rather the ship itself. The Klabautermann would be like the spirit member of the crew - traveling through walls, scaring Chopper, etc… And I don't care what anyone says. The Going Merry is indeed alive (the Klabautermann is proof of that), and it's alive in the Klabautermann. And as we all know, Oda isn't one for killing characters, especially one that has traveled with the Strawhats for so long, saving them on many occasions. As well the Klabautermann's dream (or rather the Going Merry's dream - it helps to think of the Klabautermann and the ship as just one being) has always been to travel with everyone, and to protect the Strawhats during their journey. If you kill the Klabautermann, then you kill his/her/its dream. And as we all know, Oda isn’t one for killing a person's dreams (and yes, the Going Merry is a person). So if the Klabautermann isn't meant to die, and is meant to join the Straw hats, how will Oda resurrect the Klabautermann, Going Merry's spirit, so that this happens? I theorize that some part of the Going Merry will be incorporated into the new ship that's to be built, transferring Going Merry's Klabautermann to the new ship.
Finally, in past threads, whenever I repeat this theory, someone always brings up the point that the Klabautermann has demonstrated nothing but piss poor carpentry in the past, so it wouldn't make sense for him to join the Strawhats. Let me respond to this point now so that hopefully others won't bring up this point again. It's IMHO that the new ship will be self-repairing with self-healing tools (which would truly make it the ultimate ship). So the ship is in essence it's own carpenter. And remember, the Klabautermann is really just the ship itself. If you give the ship self-repairing abilities and give it self-healing tools, then in essence you make the Klabautermann a better carpenter.
lalala:
Sorry, I guess I wasn't clear. I meant what is your support for having Franky join, if it isn't all those things you say are irrelevant? I didn't even realize you were putting forth evidence supporting Paulie to join. I thought it was mainly stuff to say why it won't necessarily be Franky (although these are basically the same, since Paulie seems like the only alternative).
Personally, up until the recent developments, I thought Paulie still had just as good of a chance of joining as Franky. This was from his interaction with Luffy at the mansion; the scene at the entrance to Enies Lobby where the guards ask "are you the Straw Hat Pirates!?" and he seems to think about it; and then later when he's thinking to himself "they will definitely be able to do it" referring to defeating CP9. I also still have the questions MasterDee just brought up about Franky leaving the Franky Family.
The reason I am leaning more towards Franky now is really just because of the more recent developments and interaction with the crew, seeming to develop feelings for them; and if Franky has some soul-to-soul talk with Luffy as he goes to rescue Robin, that could resolve some hard feelings Luffy has. Also the fact that Paulie has been mostly ignored for a pretty long time, except for the few lines he speaks while being tied up makes me less confident. For me to consider Paulie a real contender for the position again, a lot of stuff will have to happen between here and the end.
On another note:
I thought about trying to answer the questions about how Robin joined with little character development, while Wiper didn't join with more development, but it turned out really complicated in my mind and I couldn't organize it into a good argument.
I've made these arguments before (maybe not in this thread - most likely in other threads), but I guess I'll repeat these arguments here since this thread seems to be active again.
IMHO, Franky won't be the next Strawhat member. Why? Well a couple of reasons.
First of all, it would be too cold-hearted of Franky to leave his crew - a crew that just underwent a suicide mission to get him back (raiding Eneas Lobby in order to free a 'criminal' would indeed in almost all circumstances be considered suicide by any sane person), something Franky thought his crew would not in a million years ever have done for him. This shows just how much love the crew has for its leader. If Franky decides to repay this immense love the crew just displayed for him by selfishly leaving them then I can't help but be disappointed in his character. And anyways, I don't think this will happen since I also believe Franky loves his crew too much to leave them.
Others bring up the point that Sanji also had a crew, but left them to follow a dream. So why can't Franky? Well the circumstances are different. If Franky leaves, then who in the Franky family can replace him? I don't think anyone can. The Franky family would probably be disbanded without their charismatic, super strong leader to lead them. And besides, it's the Franky family, not the Zambai family, or the Kiwi and Mozu family, or another Franky family member family (my apologies for the awkward phrasing). The Franky family is just too dependent on Franky and just wouldn't survive without him.
That's not the case in Sanji's case. The Baratie will still survive even if Sanji leaves (as it indeed did). And hell, the Baratie crew even encouraged him to leave to follow his dream. Would the Franky family be willing to do the same for Franky? My feeling is that they need him too much and love him too much to encourage him to leave. But that's just my opinion anyway. Feel free to disagree.
And anyways his dream is to build a dream ship. Once it's built, there would be no need to follow the Strawhats to achieve his dream. He would have already achieved his dream by building the ship. So once he's built his dream ship, he'll be staying behind, much like his predecessor Tom did.
But oh, once he builds his dream ship, wouldn't this ship need a carpenter in order to keep the ship in top condition? And shouldn't this carpenter be Franky, as it would only make sense that the creator of a ship be its carpenter. No not really, since Franky's dream is not to be the best carpenter in the world, but to create the ultimate ship, a dream that would have already been fulfilled with the ship's inception, not its upkeep. So if Franky does join the crew as the crew's carpenter it would seem to me like nothing more than an overprotective father not wanting to let go of his child. But as with all children, it has to be set free someday and allowed to travel its own path. Also, I don't think the ship will need a carpenter anyway since I believe Franky will give the ship he creates for the Strawhats self-healing/self-repairing abilities (now that would be the ultimate ship).
Others bring up the point that he would need to travel with the Straw hats in order to verify that the ship he built for them is indeed the ultimate dream ship. But IMHO, once the Strawhats reach Laftel, once Luffy becomes the pirate king, news of this will no doubt spread around the world. This is really the only verification Franky needs to confirm that his dream was indeed fully met.
Still others theorize that Franky might build the dream ship along the way by picking up exotic ship parts from new islands they may encounter and incorporating them into their new ship. That is he builds the ship piecemeal along the way to Laftel until he finally feels like he's achieved his ultimate ship. I have some problems with this theory however. Building a ship requires nothing more than wood, steel and nails. Why the need for 'exotic' parts? Plus I feel it's a testament to Franky's skills if he can build the ultimate ship from scratch from with just wood, steel, and nails. It would not feel like it were as much of an accomplishment if he were to rely on the work of others to help him build his dream ship. Finally, an ultimate ship, in order to verify that it's an ultimate ship, needs an ultimate test. If the ultimate ship is finally built and achieved only after the Straw hats have reached (or neared) Laftel, then what challenge would be left for the ship to surpass in order to prove itself? IMHO, the only proper test for the ultimate ship cannot be anything less than traveling the grand line until it reaches Laftel, surviving in one piece (no pun intended).
So if Franky isn't the one who will be joining, who will? I don't believe Paulie is meant to join either for reasons others have most likely already stated. So if it's not Franky or Paulie that’s meant to be the next member, who is meant to be the next member?
It's my belief that it will be the Klabautermann, or rather the ship itself. The Klabautermann would be like the spirit member of the crew - traveling through walls, scaring Chopper, etc… And I don't care what anyone says. The Going Merry is indeed alive (the Klabautermann is proof of that), and it's alive in the Klabautermann. And as we all know, Oda isn't one for killing characters, especially one that has traveled with the Strawhats for so long, saving them on many occasions. As well the Klabautermann's dream (or rather the Going Merry's dream - it helps to think of the Klabautermann and the ship as just one being) has always been to travel with everyone, and to protect the Strawhats during their journey. If you kill the Klabautermann, then you kill his/her/its dream. And as we all know, Oda isn’t one for killing a person's dreams (and yes, the Going Merry is a person). So if the Klabautermann isn't meant to die, and is meant to join the Straw hats, how will Oda resurrect the Klabautermann, Going Merry's spirit, so that this happens? I theorize that some part of the Going Merry will be incorporated into the new ship that's to be built, transferring Going Merry's Klabautermann to the new ship.
Finally, in past threads, whenever I repeat this theory, someone always brings up the point that the Klabautermann has demonstrated nothing but piss poor carpentry in the past, so it wouldn't make sense for him to join the Strawhats. Let me respond to this point now so that hopefully others won't bring up this point again. It's IMHO that the new ship will be self-repairing with self-healing tools (which would truly make it the ultimate ship). So the ship is in essence it's own carpenter. And remember, the Klabautermann is really just the ship itself. If you give the ship self-repairing abilities and give it self-healing tools, then in essence you make the Klabautermann a better carpenter.
Interesting arguement, but I hate that it leads it neither Franky or Paulie joining. If Franky's family is the issue, then there are ways around it. Maybe his crew finds out about his dream and, being so kind and loving of their leader, ask him to go. Franky is hesitate, but they insist, maybe trying to insult him to leave. Franky cries because he know what they are trying to do, and something like that.
Just a thought, but it seems like Franky's flashack provides a possible motivation for Franky to leave with the SHs, if Oda chooses to use it.
Also, Franky's dream was something like this:
"I wanna make my own dreamship! A ship that can sail…to the end of the world..."
So...while a carpenter who wants to build a great ship doesn't need to attend it, wouldn't he want to see it reach "the end of the world."?
"I wanna make my own dreamship! A ship that can sail…to the end of the world..."
So...while a carpenter who wants to build a great ship doesn't need to attend it, wouldn't he want to see it reach "the end of the world."?
I've already responded to this point in the post I made.
Once the Strawhats reach Laftel, and once Luffy becomes the Pirate King (reaching Laftel, which is essentially the end of the world, is the only way to obtain One Piece, a necessary requirement for becoming the Pirate King), news of the this will no doubt travel 'round the world. Once news of this reaches Franky, that's really the only verification he needs.
Well gee thanks a lot for being so blunt. Whereas I've come to realize on my own that my argument wasn't very thought out. I had just been thinking about it at the time when I posted it so I realize I made many inconsistancies when I should have thought out my argument better before posting.
Still I don't need people telling me something I already know thank you very much. It makes you come off as rude not to mention a total ass. If I'm wrong I'll come to that conclusion on my own and do my best to fix it. Like what happened with your second point for instance.
I didn't just mean your first post, I meant the entire thing. I realize that you know your first point is faulty now, but I'm talking about your entire arguement that's been going on for around 5 or 6 pages now.
No what caused me to ignore them was when they came in here and referred to me as a troll, a retard, and a paulie fan out to bash Franky. I came into this looking for friendly discussion and/or debate. I don't want to have to deal with people who's maturity levels are on par with the common NaruTard. I happened to read their posts but the fact that they continued bashing me even when I acknowledged I made a few mistakes made me lose more focused and just pissed me off even more. If they would have left out the childish insults and instead tried to reason with me in a more mature fashion then I would have taken them a lot more seriously.
Well… If you were paying attention, only one person was really rude to you right away. I'm looking through the posts right now and most of them backed up their points well and handled it as I'd expect in a polite debate.
While I think that retard thing is a bit uncalled for, you did start to look like a troll and Franky basher.
Heck there's gotta be something going on with Paulie and I doubt Oda would just throw away Paulie's character in the end as if it were nothing.
I'll get to the rest of the point later with one of your other ones… But I agree here. I think that Franky has a much higher chance of joining, but I think that Paulie's going to at least get or be involved in a cover story.
And here lies the problem I was referring too. Considering how many people wouldn't let the damn thing go. I'm sure you remember me saying that Luffy was the only martial artist right? Okay then I admit I was stupid for making that comment when most of the styles are based on martial arts. But what I had REALLY meant by that was that no two straw hat's fighting styles are similar as they use their own unique ways to fight. Paulie in my view fits that description of having a unique fighting style all his own that none of the other straw hat's use. While Franky's style seems to be a combination of Luffy, Usopp, and Choppers. That's why I feel Franky's style ISN'T original or unique because it's already done and better I might add by three different straw hat members… while really who on the straw hat crew would fight using ropes?
Remember what I just said about you making the same point several times? I might not have made it clear enough, but I meant that I was already fully aware of your opinion on it.
What I meant is this:
-Shoot fire out of his mouth.
-Separate his fist from his arm via a chain.
-Shoot bullets out fo his left arm
-Shoot hyper air bullet
-Possess a front body made of steel, making him immune to some attacks, like bullets and ranykaku.
-Punch with a pure metal fist.
-Shoot nails out of his mouth.
-Shoot bullets from his knuckles and shoulders.
-Separate his legs for a "centaur mode"
-Is the only cola-powered cyborg….ever.
-Wears a speedo
-Shoot powerful wind out of his ass.
That's one of the more detailed examples of what I meant. Somebody listed out specifically just about every technique that Franky has shown up to this point (not counting stuff like "wears a speedo", I don't think that was meant as something serious) and you completely ignored it.
I cannot say that I actually know why you did, but currently it looks to me like you ignored it so that you can pretend your point was not actually disproved.
Now, If you dig deep enough, it's true that you can find similarities to strawhat techniques for most of them.
But…
A lot of Paulie's attacks are similiar to Luffy as well. I can't remember his attacks names since they got so little air time and such so bear with me. He attacks using a single rope with a knot on the end, which is basically Gomu Gomu no Pistol, only weaker. He does the same with multiple ropes, which is basically Gomu Gomu no Gatling Gun. Only again, much weaker. He ties up his enemy, Luffy can do the same.
You can just as easily do that for Paulie as you can for Franky, no matter how original the idea is. Even his knife attack. If you look far enough (read, too far) in to the issue, then Robin can imitate it with a lot of knives.
And how do you know I'm not? Most of the arguments are saying that it's OBVIOUS Franky will join because he's one of the major fighters against CP9 and how he has a dream. Not to mention he was on a color spread and in a few One Piece games. I mean really it's not like I'm throwing out their evidence and saying it's nothing. I'm just saying that people are guessing too soon that it'll be Franky when it might not be. There's no proof at all that Paulie won't be the one who joins and saying it's because he hasn't been shown much is a rather stupid argument.
Well, you have paid attention more than I thought here, I'll give you that. But there are still more points than the ones you listed here.
I don't think everybody was intending to argue that stuff as definate proof that he has to join no matter what, but I think they meant (and I agree) that it definately points things in his favor.
You've brought up some things about Paulie too, but most of those are the kind of thing that could apply for both Paulie and Franky depending on how Oda does it, so I don't think arguing those points either way works very well.
Also, keep in mind something else. It's true that he pulled a surprise with Robin and Vivi. But to this date it's the only time he's done it. He certainly could do that again, but more often than not he made it pretty obvious who is joining in each character arc.
Well good for you then and might I add that I DON'T HATE FRANKY! I mean how many damn times do I have to say that?
I didn't mean that I think you hate Franky. I stated those because you brought those points up several times. Therfore, I figured that it was very likely that you would bring it up again against my point, when they wouldn't help anything.
So I said that beforehand, in hopes that the dead horse could rest in peace.
Well it's hard to make good arguments when the majority of reactions I got from Franky fans were the exact things you just stated above. I don't appreciate being treated like that. I really don't deserve it because I feel like they're disrespecting my opinion and my views by doing so. I don't care if they have different opinions from me but I do care if they can't argue about this in a mature manner.
As I said before, even though the general tone did get more rude as it went, they started off pretty polite, as far as internet debates go.
You however, have been just as bad if not worse.
You've whined about being ganged up.
You tried the whole "okay I'm leaving now stop trying to disprove my points" thing, making it sound like you were only getting the kind of reaction that you did because you defended a less popular view. But then you came right back when one person continued arguing.
Perhaps by some amazing coincidence, a lot of the points that you ignore are the ones that either prove your point wrong, or are the hardest for you to work around.
You occasionally accept that your point is wrong. But again pretty much every one of those times you try to word it to make yourself sound like the victim here and you continued to argue some of them, even after you claimed you realized their faults.
Whether they are arguing in a mature manner or not, I have yet to see reason to believe that you are.
and that's fine. I don't care. Personally if Franky joins I'd be just as happy as if Paulie joined but right now I feel thhat Franky is more of a Wiper or a Vivi than Paulie is. Despite all the evidence the Franky fans have there is no definate proof that Franky's joining at least until Luffy out right asks Franky to join.
Err… that one wasn't directed at you actually, I was saying something on the original topic here.
I've already responded to this point in the post I made.
Once the Strawhats reach Laftel, and once Luffy becomes the Pirate King (reaching Laftel, which is essentially the end of the world, is the only way to obtain One Piece, a necessary requirement for becoming the Pirate King), news of the this will no doubt travel 'round the world. Once news of this reaches Franky, that's really the only verification he needs.
But if they don't, then Franky will never recieve that news. If this team fails, then odds are that Franky won't find out the fate of his ship, and that sounds pretty tortuous. While Franky seems confident in the Strawhats vs. the Cp9, he doesn't know that they're going to the Raftel yet. But, by going with the SHs, he guarantees the safety of the ship (he seems confident in his strength and skill).
I mean, you see how critical he is of others peoples shipwright skills.
But if they don't, then Franky will never recieve that news. If this team fails, then odds are that Franky won't find out the fate of his ship, and that sounds pretty tortuous.
And if they fail then they fail, and that's the end of his dream (though really, do you honestly believe this will happen?). Except if Franky were to join them, then the Strawhats failing would not only mean the end of Franky's dream, but also the end of his life. But anyways, it's pointless to argue this, because the Strawhats will NOT fail in achieving their dreams.
While Franky seems confident in the Strawhats vs. the Cp9, he doesn't know that they're going to the Raftel yet. But, by going with the SHs, he guarantees the safety of the ship (he seems confident in his strength and skill).
I mean, you see how critical he is of others peoples shipwright skills.
Luffy's dream has always been to become to the Pirate King, something he's never hesitant to tell others about, and something he's very confident in - a confidence so strong (with a strength of will to match) that it seems to illicit in others the same confidence that Luffy will achieve his dream. And becoming the Pirate King means traveling to Laftel to obtain One Piece. I believe that's common knowledge in the OP world.
And anyways, if the ship needs to be repaired all the time, and needs an A+ class ship builder like Franky to always be present in order to keep it running, then can Franky really claim that he's built an ultimate ship that can sail the Grand Line to the ends of the world? This is why I feel the ship will have self-healing/self-repairing abilities, and will not need the presence of a carpenter per se (the ship itself will be its own carpenter).
Also, as I've already stated, having Franky join as a carpenter is analogous to a parent being too overprotective of its child. When a parent is confident in his/her child, then that parent should let that child go, let it follow its own path, and allow it to prove itself without help from the parent.
To be honest, when I first started reading Water 7 and Enies Lobby I wanted Paulie to join more than Franky. That was probably because I still kind of hated Franky for what him and the Franky Family did to Usopp. But then it came to me that Paulie really wouldn't fit in with the Strawhats. He's the complete opposite of Sanji, but his fighting style is cool.
Now that we've gotten to Enies Lobby and Franky's bonded with Usopp, most of the signs point to him being their shipwright. He's helped out the crew the most in terms of beating Fukurou. I really have the feeling that he'll build Battle Franky 37 for the Strawhats.
And if they fail then they fail, and that's the end of his dream (though really, do you honestly believe this will happen?). Except if Franky were to join them, then the Strawhats failing would not only mean the end of Franky's dream, but also the end of his life. But anyways, it's pointless to argue this, because the Strawhats will NOT fail in achieving their dreams.
Well, Franky isn't Oda, and he doesn't know that Luffy will definitely achieve his dream. Plus, Franky isn't a coward, he wouldn't be afraid to die. Building a ship and letting it die is somehow heartless considering Franky's attitude towards ships.
And anyways, if the ship needs to be repaired all the time, and needs an A+ class ship builder like Franky to always be present in order to keep it running, then can Franky really claim that he's built an ultimate ship that can sail the Grand Line to the ends of the world? This is why I feel the ship will have self-healing/self-repairing abilities, and will not need the presence of a carpenter per se (the ship itself will be its own carpenter).
A self healing ship seems unlikely. And all ships needs repairs and maintaince, there's no shame in it. I mean, a self healing metal or wood is unprecedented. It will probably have heavy armor and powerful weapons and such.
Also, as I've already stated, having Franky join as a carpenter is analogous to a parent being too overprotective of its child. When a parent is confident in their child, then that parent should let that child go, let it follow its own path, and allow it to prove itself without help from the parent.
Again, unlike a child, ships don't heal. Plus, a ships success depends on the crew, the Going Merry wouldn't last nearly as long without a crew like the strawhats. Unless Franky develops unrelenting confidence in the SH crew, then I think he may want to join.
Plus, doesn't Franky have more shipwright experience then Paulie?
