Piccolo got shafted BIG TIME in the Majin Boo Arc.
Lots of characters got shafted in the Majin Buu arc.
Not least of which includes Gohan, which is still the main reason I absolutely despise that arc.
Piccolo got shafted BIG TIME in the Majin Boo Arc.
Lots of characters got shafted in the Majin Buu arc.
Not least of which includes Gohan, which is still the main reason I absolutely despise that arc.
Piccolo's role in the Buu saga was great and he got an assload of screentime. I don't think Vegeta got shafted either, since he still got some character development.
Gohan and the kids got shafted.
It was Vegeta's plan to defeat Buu with the Spirit Bomb (Genki Dama) plus his temporary fusion with Goku that was dominating Gohan Buu. And he trained in those 10 years afterwards unlike everyone else not named Goku. So I wouldn't say he got shafted in the last arc.
I was also disappointed in the kids of Goku and Vegeta. They had so much potential, even to surpass their fathers (Gohan did it twice) but yet they slacked off and Goku and Vegeta surpassed them again. Now I know part of it was the pressure to keep Goku the best, but still… Future Trunks is the exception though.
Actually, the kids were surpassing Goku. Gohan ended up being the strongest non-fused character in the entire series, and Gotenks SSJ3 transformation was better than Gokus.
These things for me is why the final fight of the series is such a major letdown; toyirama backs out on the whole speech Goku gave on passing the baton to the next generation, and is reeled in to fight the second weakest form of Buu, whom gotenks and Gohan could beat blindfolded. Once Gohan and the kids were ressurected, vegetas spirit bomb plan was pretty redundant.
True. I didn't think of that.
In any case thank you. I guess I'll just have to look outside of my dirthole of a town for the new DVD.
Part 5 of Kai is now being pushed back a month or two for some reason. Maybe it has something to do with Yamamoto's replaced score. Which for me feels like a loss since I have all 3 of Yamamoto's DragonBall Kai soundtracks, and they're really good. But I also do love Kikuchi's original DBZ score. But I still think it's a shame that Yamamoto is being replaced and we wont get to hear his music anymore. But I guess he brought it on himself for making some scores sound like other copywrited material, but I digress.
@The:
Actually, the kids were surpassing Goku. Gohan ended up being the strongest non-fused character in the entire series, and Gotenks SSJ3 transformation was better than Gokus.
These things for me is why the final fight of the series is such a major letdown; toyirama backs out on the whole speech Goku gave on passing the baton to the next generation, and is reeled in to fight the second weakest form of Buu, whom gotenks and Gohan could beat blindfolded. Once Gohan and the kids were ressurected, vegetas spirit bomb plan was pretty redundant.
Well after the 10 year timeskip after Buu's defeat (the very end of DBZ), I'm sure Goku surpassed Gohan's Mystic form since training's all Goku ever does and Gohan didn't. And since Goten and Trunks also slacked off in the 10 years after Buu's defeat, I'm sure SSJ3 Goku could defeat SSJ3 Gotenks as well. That's just my inference based on their behavior, though.
I agree with you on Gohan and Gotenks being enough for Kid Buu. Heck, even Goku thought that was Vegeta's plan at first.
Toriyama states that training one's body only goes so far. Gokû was pretty much at his limit during the Cell arc, which is why new transformations were introduced. Since Super Saiyan 3 only multiplies the strength of the user by four hundred-times, it'd mean that Gokû would have to improve his base strength, which–in comparison to how incredibly more powerful Ultimate Gohan was--I don't think necessarily leaves much room for Gokû to surpass him without another transformation.
@Yuugi's:
Since Super Saiyan 3 only multiplies the strength of the user by four hundred-times,
It sounds so silly and trite when you put it that way.
@RobbyBevard:
It sounds so silly and trite when you put it that way.
Well, by that point a character could breath an entire city away effortlessly. That's what happens when you push that far…
@Yuugi's:
Well, by that point a character could breath an entire city away effortlessly. That's what happens when you push that far…
I could be mistaken, but didn't King Piccolo destroy a city by flexing his bicep or something?
@Yuugi's:
Toriyama states that training one's body only goes so far. Gokû was pretty much at his limit during the Cell arc, which is why new transformations were introduced. Since Super Saiyan 3 only multiplies the strength of the user by four hundred-times, it'd mean that Gokû would have to improve his base strength, which–in comparison to how incredibly more powerful Ultimate Gohan was--I don't think necessarily leaves much room for Gokû to surpass him without another transformation.
Wow, Toriyama said that? Weird, cause (not doubting your info btw) the series sure never gave that impression!
Speaking of Piccolo getting screwed, that does make me feel slightly better about that arc. I remember hearing Piccolo reached his limit at the end of the Cell arc. I don't remember where I heard that though.
@Syan:
I could be mistaken, but didn't King Piccolo destroy a city by flexing his bicep or something?
I think King Piccolo just threw and energy blast. I recall it required an arm motion involving his bicep, you might be thinking of that.
YBM's info comes from the Super Exciting Guide.
Wow, Toriyama said that? Weird, cause (not doubting your info btw) the series sure never gave that impression!
YBM's info comes from the Super Exciting Guide.
Yeah, here's the thread for the Story Guide and the Character Guide.
ha kind of funny you just bring up Dragonball stuff, yet name this Dragonball Z discussion
But my favorite stuff in all of DB/DBZ/GT is the tournament sagas in Dragonball, also the Goku vs. cell fight was damn awesome too.
Got to agree with you on this. When I was young I used to watch DB everyday and indeed that saga had so much tension. Nice.
Piccolo got shafted BIG TIME in the Majin Boo Arc.
Speaking of Piccolo getting screwed, that does make me feel slightly better about that arc. I remember hearing Piccolo reached his limit at the end of the Cell arc. I don't remember where I heard that though.
There was a game where piccolo absorbed demon king piccolo and became even more powerful, which would be cool if he wasn't the reincarnated version of him
@Yuugi's:
Yeah, here's the thread for the Story Guide and the Character Guide.
I'm sorry. I didn't see anything in either of the first posts about Goku stopping at a certain point (although I did like learning about how the Kaios and Kaioshns are chosen). I was actually just now watching the end of the Boo fight in English subs (not dubs) at animecrazy.net and Goku said right before he destroyed Boo that he'd be even better for their rematch (episode 286) and when he convinced Vegeta to let Boo live, he said that they should train so they wouldn't lose to Boo one-on-one if the worst ever happened (episode 287). So it sounds like Goku doesn't feel that he's reached his limit. It may have been different in the manga, but the anime definitely gives the feel that Goku can still get stronger and that he does in those 10 years after Boo's defeat.
http://www.animecrazy.net/dragon-ball-z-episode-286/
http://www.animecrazy.net/dragon-ball-z-episode-287/
Although, this is really just speculation since the only fight we saw Goku have after that timeskip was the short fight with Oob so we have no way to know for sure just how strong he was.
Well, it's deeper in the thread.
It’s worth pointing out that it basically says the reason Goku’s weight training in Heaven was so effective was that he used Bukujutsu to float in midair as he used the weights, which made it much harder. Goku’s never shown using Bukujutsu during any of his gravity training on Kaio’s or in the spaceship (at least not in the manga, that I can remember). It also says his image training/meditation was a means to raise his maximum ki, as muscle training has a limit. Toriyama mentioned there being limits to how much training your muscles could do and needing ki to overcome that limit in the book's interview.
The idea is that Gokû would have had to focus solely on gaining strength through meditation and the like. So I suppose it doesn't explicitly say he won't get stronger (not that I said that), just that he probably won't get so strong so easily.
It also mentions Gohan's training was focused on him mastering ki, while Vegeta focused on training his muscles (we see this in how he trains at 300G to fight the Artificial Humans).
@RobbyBevard:
Not as bad as Vegeta. Dude sold his soul and then died in order to catch up to Goku, only to then discover Goku was totally holding back during their fight anyway.
That's your typical song n dance in Dragonball.
Well it appears that the Toonzai airing of DBZ Kai is now using the original DBZ score by Shunsuke Kikuchi instead of Yamamoto's score. It's odd that they've switched so quickly.
Here are the pieces used in the re-airing of Dragon Ball Kai #95:
@kei17:
According to 2ch, these are the pieces they used in episode 95:
Goku says goodbye to everyone and teleports with Cell -
Krillin comforts grieving Gohan -
Trunks gets killed and Perfect Cell appears -
Vegeta is shocked -Just as I thought, they're using the already-released BGMs only so far.
These are pretty good pieces to use, although it's clear they're only using pieces that were digitized for release on CD (meaning there's a ton of music from Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z that won't be used.
EDIT: Ah, an a clip from this morning's airing on Toonzai using the Kikuchi score:
Man, it's too bad that they won't get to continue Kai all the way through the Majin Buu arc.
I still hope they might finish it at a later date.
Wasn't the Majin Buu arc crappy?
@Kareem:
Wasn't the Majin Buu arc crappy?
Opinions on it differ greatly. I know Robby likes it.
I personally didn't like it because I felt it completely ruined Gohan's character as well as the passing-of-the-torch theme from the Cell arc.
Buu arc features Mr. Satan saving the world, therefore it is the best.
If you like a lot of Toriyama's weird direction and reclaiming his own story with all sorts of strange stuff and combining comedy back in his action, then you're generally a Buu fan. Otherwise…
Opinions on it differ greatly. I know Robby likes it.
I personally didn't like it because I felt it completely ruined Gohan's character as well as the passing-of-the-torch theme from the Cell arc.
Well, Toriyama already sort of threw him under the bus in the Cell arc when suddenly he didn't want to put the intense training he willingly undertook to use.
@Cyan:
Buu arc features Mr. Satan saving the world, therefore it is the best.
That made me like Mr.Satan or…as his real name is: Mark.
The Buu arc has plot holes and character problems, but it would have been an amazing pre-Freiza arc. Its full of twists and turns, comedy, and the spirit bomb actually works. And I actually really like the Gohan in high school portion of the story, for the one volume it lasts, its a big change of pace for the series.
Yes, Gohan stopped training nonstop WHEN THE WORLD WAS AT PEACE AND THERE WAS NO HINT OF A FUTURE LARGER THREAT. He was 7. And he'd already helped save the world a couple times. He was entitled. That Goku and Vegeta were fight happy Saiyans was their own buisness. And he still manned up and kicked ass after Buu arrived, and became the strongest non-fused character in the series again. Not his fault Buu had the ridiculous cheat of "I can break off a small piece of myself and fully absorb you with it."
Its only problem is it happened at the point in the story where people cracked the world if they farted so the actual powers at play made it harder to take seriously, and Supreme Kai was the biggest dumbass in the universe and can be blamed for pretty much everything ever.
That made me like Mr.Satan or…as his real name is: Mark.
If I ever enlist into the army, I'm changing my name to Mark Satan.
Gohan was great in the Buu arc. Even when the plot completely went to hell and Buu started absorbing left and right, Gohan still manned up and continued fighting.
The thing with Buu is, unlike with Frieza or Cell, you had this feeling that he could really destroy the entire reality if he wanted to. He was a threat of the ultimate level. At least that's how I've seen him.
@Cyan:
If I ever enlist into the army, I'm changing my name to Mark Satan.
I salute you sir
The main reason why I like the Buu arc was due to the Babidi tower. That a unique way for Toriyama to show off other worlds. When Vegeta fought KuiKui Babidi sent them to KuiKui's home world same as Yakon. Dabura on the otherhand should have been replaced with someone else. Hell Dabura should of had his own mini arc that took place between the time period of the end of Cell and the start of Majjin Boo.
@RobbyBevard:
The Buu arc has plot holes and character problems, but it would have been an amazing pre-Freiza arc. Its full of twists and turns, comedy, and the spirit bomb actually works. And I actually really like the Gohan in high school portion of the story, for the one volume it lasts, its a big change of pace for the series.
Yes, Gohan stopped training nonstop WHEN THE WORLD WAS AT PEACE AND THERE WAS NO HINT OF A FUTURE LARGER THREAT. He was 7. And he'd already helped save the world a couple times. He was entitled. That Goku and Vegeta were fight happy Saiyans was their own buisness. And he still manned up and kicked ass after Buu arrived, and became the strongest non-fused character in the series again. Not his fault Buu had the ridiculous cheat of "I can break off a small piece of myself and fully absorb you with it."
Its only problem is it happened at the point in the story where people cracked the world if they farted so the actual powers at play made it harder to take seriously, and Supreme Kai was the biggest dumbass in the universe and can be blamed for pretty much everything ever.
This is a point where I think some flak for the Buu arc can come from. While I enjoyed the Buu arc, it really feels like both the Cell and Frieza arc would have been a much better arc to have been the finale to the series.
@RobbyBevard:
The Boo arc has plot holes and character problems, but it would have been an amazing pre-Freeza arc. Its full of twists and turns, comedy, and the spirit bomb actually works. And I actually really like the Gohan in high school portion of the story, for the one volume it lasts, its a big change of pace for the series.
Yes, Gohan stopped training nonstop WHEN THE WORLD WAS AT PEACE AND THERE WAS NO HINT OF A FUTURE LARGER THREAT. He was 7. And he'd already helped save the world a couple times. He was entitled. That Goku and Vegeta were fight happy Saiyans was their own buisness. And he still manned up and kicked ass after Boo arrived, and became the strongest non-fused character in the series again. Not his fault Boo had the ridiculous cheat of "I can break off a small piece of myself and fully absorb you with it."
Its only problem is it happened at the point in the story where people cracked the world if they farted so the actual powers at play made it harder to take seriously, and East Kaioshin was the biggest dumbass in the universe and can be blamed for pretty much everything ever.
Lots of Fix'd
But I kindof see where you're coming from, a lot of the stuff in the arc is a little tainted by how Boo was able to just casually destroy a planet like he did with the Earth, a feat that Freeza had a hard time with way back when (Remember the "Five Minutes" that wasn't really five minutes?)
But I think the Boo arc has a lot going for it that was sorely needed before the story ended. Son needed to come full circle as a character, which his role as teacher through most of the arc (Teaching the Boys Fusion, Training Oob at the end) was setting him up for. Vegeta also, finally, got his sorely needed character development. I think it should have been cemented by calling Son "Son Goku" at some point during his final speech, but otherwise, I think it worked perfectly. That's why I enjoy the Boo arc so much, other than the return to a more Jokey story.
And you're right, East Kaioshin was a freakin' Moron…
I thought it was made clear that Freezer didn't destroy the planet right away due to his pride; He still wanted to finish off Goku with his own power. After all, first thing he does after throwing the bomb is charging up and charging at Goku.
And if Vegetas Galick Gun was capable of planetary destruction, Freezer should have zero problems. Like he didn't have any with planet Vegeta.
No, Freeza says he overestimated the amount of strength he used, while Gokû claims he was afraid that he might die in the explosion, so he held back.
The newest DBZK episodes on Toonzai had Kikuchi's score, so I guess this whole thing is gonna effect FUNi's dub. Someone on YouTube thought that Toonzai made that edit themselves and started getting pissed.
Edit: Read this article to send your genki to Japan:http://kanzentai.com/index.php?subaction=showcomments&id=1300742600&archive=&start_from=&ucat=&
The lastest Daizenshuu EX podcast covers the fall of Dragon Ball Kai and Toei's finances in general. It's very informative. They dug right through Japanese financial reports and the like and dug up a lot of interesting info.
Also, Kanzentai has a new feature that sums all of this financial talk up in an easy little article.
At its peak in Fiscal 2006, there were 91 different anime series being shown on TV in Japan. By Fiscal 2009 this number had significantly dropped down to 66 anime series.
Anybody know when DB online coming state side . It seems like a good story continueing game.
Here comes the newest release:
Dragon Ball Z Kai Part Five.
!
Product Info:
Contains Episodes 53 - 65 on 2 discs.
325 minutes
Available June 7th, 2011 (Originally May 5th, 2011).
$22.00 - DVD
$26.00 - Blu-ray
View Trailer:
!
Kind of a waste of money. Its never going to finish the entire series.
Kind of a waste of money. Its never going to finish the entire series.
FUNimation will release the entirety of the ninety-eight episodes of Dragon Ball Kai. That will be the entire series.
Here comes the newest release:
Dragon Ball Z Kai Part Five.! http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/814PIttc0ML.AA1500.jpg
Product Info:
Contains Episodes 53 - 65 on 2 discs.
325 minutes
Available June 7th, 2011 (Originally May 5th, 2011).
$22.00 - DVD
$26.00 - Blu-rayView Trailer:
!
Nice cover
@Yuugi's:
FUNimation will release the entirety of the ninety-eight episodes of Dragon Ball Kai. That will be the entire series.
I believe he means since the buu arc isn't going to get the kai treatment.
An speaking of which I say the Buu arc either becomes an OVA or A movie
You know what he means. Let's not split hairs here.
He means that DBKai is, by it's own, a waste because it doesn't even finish the Dragon Ball storyline. No Buu.
Why even go to Kai now when it's, in a sense, incomplete? Especially when Dragon Ball Z is readily available.
Smh… Dragon Ball Kai has been a complete failure. They should have just did a brand-new animation of the DBZ storyline.
It was never going to be complete to begin with, because they skipped the first 16 volumes.
True True.
But at the very least, finish the anime you're "re-mastering", this being DBZ.
Meh. Whatever.
What they should of done is have it "based off of dragonball" an go with there own thing. With new animation, using the same storyline formulas but changing some stuff here and there especially in the Cell and Buu arcs.
I'd really like to see them pull off more retellings like the Dragon Ball films did. Movie #3 was really interesting in how it played up the wuxia elements of the franchise more so than usual.
well the manga was suppose to end at the cell arc but fans made him continue. I mean I want to see the buu arc to but they following toriyama's original intention.That had some of the most interesting fights.gotenks vs super buu
@RPG:
well the manga was suppose to end at the cell arc but fans made him continue.
This is a completely unfounded rumour.