Enels atrtack can be deadly but people seem to forget the people in one piece world has an insane endurance
I doubt Enel can take many people with his attack after all even Pell could survive that
damn bomb.. sximply put people in one piece world has different level of endurance compared to our world. even buggy could survive a real lightning strike (Real one are supposed to be around one hundred millon to one thousand millon volt… although maybe that lightning volt was Dragons attack...
And Oda himself stated that There are crazy people in blue sea and we have seen many monsters who seems to not die... so Enels attack might not be that deadly in one piece world especially since he might have lost his maxim and there seems to be many sea stone in Blue sea compared to Skypia.
Althoug I agree if Enel starts taking fight seriously and practice more with his power he has a potential to become a top tier.
Shichibukai strength
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I don't think there is much need for any discussion on enel, 500,000,000 says it all. If he was a pirate on the blue sea i think its quite clear he would be top-tier and be able to deliver rape to the whole of thriller bark.
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Forest fire would win. Glacier are lazy fucks that don't move.
See thats what he wants you to think, but slowly he's manuvering you into the corner and then bam Gazelle punch bitch:happy:
It depends on who has more of their element.
It's a toss up really.
In that aspect would Aokiji have some pretty great help in the quanitity department since he pretty effortlessly apparently turn bodies of water into pretty much insta frozen wasteland. And if they do cancel each other out, i.e. a draw then would they revert to their normal forms?
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I am not sure about these Enel vs Thriller Bark discussion
If Moria has Oz and his general zombies it might be a difficult battle for Enel Adter all they cant feel pain and as we have seen with Enel most of his attack seems to only shock people and since they cant feel it.. they might act as perfiect bait for Enel while Moria just use the teleportation of doppleman and cut off Enels shadow, that bounty stated by Oda was more about his DF ability it does not mean he would defeat anyone who has lower bounty than him.Well and Oda stated there are way more crazuer(stronger) people than enel in Blue sea(this might be because he relies too much on his ability unlike croc and Ace who was preapred for many outcomes, and What BB stated I personally thought BB's statment about DF users were directed to Enel) SO he is not Top Tier he has potential to become top tier but what we have seen so far he cant be a top tier, (with maxim he might be, but its probably gone enow)
And remeber Moria fought with Kaidou on Equal terms before he lost all of his crewmate to Kaidou and we can assume Kaidou is more stronger than enel as he should be one of those crazy strong people Oda stated. (ALthough present Moria relying to much on his subordinated and all made him weak in terms of his indivisual strength.)
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This post is deleted!
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I am not sure about these Enel vs Thriller Bark discussion
If Moria has Oz and his general zombies it might be a difficult battle for Enel Adter all they cant feel pain and as we have seen with Enel most of his attack seems to only shock people and since they cant feel it.. they might act as perfiect bait for Enel while Moria just use the teleportation of doppleman and cut off Enels shadow, that bounty stated by Oda was more about his DF ability it does not mean he would defeat anyone who has lower bounty than him.Well and Oda stated there are way more crazuer(stronger) people than enel in Blue sea(this might be because he relies too much on his ability unlike croc and Ace who was preapred for many outcomes, and What BB stated I personally thought BB's statment about DF users were directed to Enel) SO he is not Top Tier he has potential to become top tier but what we have seen so far he cant be a top tier, (with maxim he might be, but its probably gone enow)
And remeber Moria fought with Kaidou on Equal terms before he lost all of his crewmate to Kaidou and we can assume Kaidou is more stronger than enel as he should be one of those crazy strong people Oda stated. (ALthough present Moria relying to much on his subordinated and all made him weak in terms of his indivisual strength.)
Eneru is a logia so Moria has no means of hurting him other than cutting off his shadow, i don't think Moria has shown much speed feats so i think he won't be dodging lightening. The zombies won't even matter after Moria, after perona, absolom and hogback are defeated they would be without a master and useless, with Maxim Enel would end TB. Yeah, but bounties are a rough indication of strength and noone else in the series has been shown anywhere near that amount, ofcourse that doesn't mean he can beat everyone that has a lower bounty that he does.
Relying on your devils fruit doesn't mean that you can't be top-tier, if bellamy were to eat the pika pika no mi he would head straight up the ladder in terms of strength and be with the best. Sometimes when you have such a powerful devils fruit it automaticaly sends you to the top, and don't forget about mantra.
I think its a fair assumption to say that Moria has goten weaker since then and Kaidou proberly stronger. Now i don't think that Enel is stronger than kaidou but with the above said i think he should come somewhere in the middle of the two, being in the middle of a Shichibkai and a Yonkou in terms of strength is surely top-tier. If Enel were to figh someone with haki then he would loose a large porion of his defense power, but Moria would be able to fight them with no restraints. Not sure if i was clea hear.
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Ace is fire, so logically he should have an advantage over Ao Kiji. Plus he's been established as a strong fighter despite what happened with Blackbeard. He's apparently on par with Jimbei.
Ao Kiji, on the other hand, seems to be an experienced and seasoned fighter, perhaps more then Ace. With that in mind, the whole elemental reasoning might not matter. Then again, it's possible to be too cold to melt. It depends on who has more of their element.
It's a toss up really.
Hey hey let's do some basic chemistry here Fire pawns Ice when ice melts in turns into water water pawns fire, but with the right temperature fire might evaporate water. so maybe it would turn out into a fist fight after all xD
"May The Haki Be With You…."
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Ice is more solid than fire and it does not melt in the blink of an eye, and when it does, it turns into water which PWNS fire.
Therefore Aokiji>Ace
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I don't think Aokiji wouldn't actually melt, just be unable to turn into ice, and if he did he wouldnt be able to control water which is why i would go with a ace advantage.
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Aokiji casually turning the sea into a plain of Ice>Ace strongest attack engulfing an Island of equal or less area. Fire doesn't beat Ice, heat does. If Ace can't produce enough heat he can't melt Aokiji and based on their feats he can't. Would be surprised if Aokiji can't perform Absolute Zero like Iceman.
A fight between the two would be like the (ridiculously stupid) Hitsuygaya vs. Halibel fight in Bleach where logically Ice freezes water but since Halibel is so much stronger than Hits his advantage becomes mute. All being fire would allow Ace to do is hit AoKiji without Haki.
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Yeah, i think aokiji would beat ace, but what i was trying to say is that i think that the fire fruit has the advantage over the ice fruit.
Absolute zero's pretty idiculous though, thats a bit much, but so is moving at the speed of light lol, maybe thats just admiral strength. -
might aswell include the terrain of battle in all aspects Ao Kiji wins. WHY? he goes Ice Age on the ground and when Ace uses some fire attacks it melts, well you know what will happen next :D.
By the way, can't wait to see some Teach's new techniques.
"May The Haki Be With You…."
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With all this talk of melting ice…the last few posters remember Ao Kiji can't control water right? If Ace melts Ao Kiji there's no way he can use that water to his advantage.
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he can freeze it again..
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And Ace can melt the ice again.
If anything Aokiji ability to turn things into Ice should be limited. I can see it having the same effect on Aokiji like Mr.3 on level 4 of Impel Down. Where if he still has the ability to make ice it'll be for a small window before it melts from Ace's fire.
Oh yeah anyways. There is canon evidence in the manga that Ace can emit enough heat to hinder ice if he wants to. Remember back at the Drum Arc when Ace left the message for Luffy. One of the villages commented on how it was weird how it wasn't snowing at all right around the time he appeared. Ice is fire's bitch.
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Seeing Aokiji can freeze the ocean for more than one weeks should tellhis control over his DF is far more superior than Mr.3 and Ace(what we have seen so far)
Ace might have advantage but Aokiji might freeze the fire itself we dont have a definite answer here although I think in terms of control over their elements Aokiji seems to have far more power compared to Ace, (although I hate to put it this way Ace is more like a developing fighter while Aokiji is a master fighter)
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Well Ice is frozen water. So Aokiji being able to freeze the ocean with Ice Age makes sense. But remember guys. They won't be fighting on top of ocean.
Nope I don't really see Aokiji being able to freeze Ace's fire. Hell from what we've seen of Aokiji he needs to touch you to do some of his uber attacks. All Ace has to do is do fireball ranged attacks from a distance to fuck up Aokiji from afar or create enough heat where it'll be hard for Aokiji to make solid ice while it constantly melts.
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Umm Ice time capsule???
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Why is it I get the feeling of versus thread?
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Because it is the ultimate direction for most of the discussion goes I personally think who is stronger king of discussion is probably one of the most worthless discussion as it kind of turns out to be fanboys crying out loud for their fav character to win over anything but than some people just do it for funa and all,, and this thread was bound to be versus thread with its title
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Umm Ice time capsule???
You mean the attack that hit Saul and he had enough time to talk to Robin and give her a speech. You really think Ace can't use that time to melt himself out of the ice? Hell how do you think Robin and Luffy got thawed out. Chopper said you need to generate heat internally. ZOMG something a fireman should be able to do easily. So you can consider Ice Time or Ice Time Capsule pretty much rendered useless.
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It used to be a sophisticated discussion on the effectiveness of each of the Shichibukai's powers on their enemies…nvm. this is the epitome of stupidity.Idiocracy here we come
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well we havent seen Aokiji's true power yet and you are trying to compare Aokiji from 20 years ago he might have gotten stronger and if you have read the fight he wasnt really trying that hard at all… and
All of the logic of fire owning Ice same can be applied in an opposite way... -
Water owns fire. Not Ice. Aokiji is a Iceman. Not a Water man. He manipulates Ice not water.
Hell for all we know Ice Time Capsule may be the weaker version of Ice Time.
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well when Ace uses fire to melt Aokijis ice water will come out and that might extinguish his damn fire… to tell you the truth I think you just like Ace too much.
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Nah I actually like Aokiji's character better than Ace. Dude rides a fucking bicycle on water. But nevermind that, we're not arguing who is the better character. We're arguing who has the elemental advantage. Hell we haven't enough talked about it's possible that enough heat can evaporate water and create steam. Another advantage for Ace but hey I won't go there. Let's stick to Ice being Fire's whore.
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Aokiji can suddenly shows his suepr power by performing absolute zero saint seiya style and owns everything!
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Wotaa doraunzu faia. Faia boiruzu wotaa. Aisu izu wotaa???? Chigau!!! Aizu wa faia ga uiiku desu.
What kind of argument is this? If anything, the contact of Ace and Aokiji's powers will result in an explosion of pressure and blow them both away.
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I always felt that Ruffy made up GEAR 2ND with Aokiji in mind…
Still, I bet he would beat the crap out of Ruffy once again.
As for Aokiji X Ace? Do you guys remember that big fire ball that he did against Teach? So I bet in Ace, once that shit hit Aokiji, he is history.
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Tbh, in a fight between Ace and Aokiji, my vote would have to go to Aokiji, but not because of the fire pwns ice or ice pwns fire argument. My opinion is based on the rather roundabout logic based on the statement made by one of the Gorosei: that Aokiji is the strongest marine at at Marine HQ. If thats th case, it means that Aokiji > Kizaru. Kizaru's ability and Ace's are quite similar in that they both are heat based and have explosive results, however Kizaru appears to have an edge over Ace in speed and experience, and while Ace is said to be quite powerful without his df, physical combat is not that useful on its own against logias. If Aokiji > Kizaru, he must have a way to cope with Kizaru's heat based attacks, which he could use in a similar fashion if faced with Ace.
I don't know, maybe I'm just cluthing at straws here….
On topic: About them there shichibukai....
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AoKiji being the strongest marine is common false interpretation. I don't know who, but someone in this forum explained it very clear.
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I've been reading these posts and i keep reading that MIHAWK IS A RIVAL OF SHANKS… THIS IS NOT TRUE. HE WAS A RIVAL OF SHANKS BEFORE HIS ARM GOT TAKEN WHEN LUFFY WAS YOUNG. HE DOES NOT LOOK AT SHANKS AS A RIVAL ANYMORE. can't wait for zoro to get that strong thats gonna be a crazy fight wanna see zoro fight shanks but doubt that would ever happen. smh
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they were also considered equals in swordfighting. . . no one ever said that shanks only uses a sword. He probably knows some other moves. I think that at least he is a lot stronger then Mihawk is now
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Aokiji casually turning the sea into a plain of Ice>Ace strongest attack engulfing an Island of equal or less area. Fire doesn't beat Ice, heat does. If Ace can't produce enough heat he can't melt Aokiji and based on their feats he can't. Would be surprised if Aokiji can't perform Absolute Zero like Iceman.
A fight between the two would be like the (ridiculously stupid) Hitsuygaya vs. Halibel fight in Bleach where logically Ice freezes water but since Halibel is so much stronger than Hits his advantage becomes mute. All being fire would allow Ace to do is hit AoKiji without Haki.
Ace and Blackbeard practically blew away an island, he certainly can make an inferno large enough but without knowing how hot it is i'm not sure.
We already know how cold aokiji can go around 273 degrees but he has'nt shown any physical traits like ace we've only seen his Devil fruit so he might be overly dependant on it, Ace on the other hand has shown to be able to take a beating something I don't think many logia type users could handle.
But I'd say ace could take him with his slight advantage.
@flandrian15 - Shanks has shown Haki, even if he is now at a disadvantage when swordsmanship is taken into acccount with haki he may still be more powerful.
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@ ganta
I don't think you become an admiral only depending on your devil fruit and have to learn how to actually fight as well. Shown by things invented and thought by the WG such as Rokushuki (that what CP9 and Coby use).
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@iSheep:
AoKiji being the strongest marine is common false interpretation. I don't know who, but someone in this forum explained it very clear.
[hide]Volume 32, Chapter 303
From stephen's scripts:
- Page 165 -
[Grand Line, Marine Headquarters]
Officers: …Vice Admiral!! He... he's not here!!
I'm not settling for that!!
Where the hell did he go?!
His bicycle is gone, so... probably to sea.
Tell the Gorousei at once!!!Gorousei: ...him again?
Well, it's probably only reconnaissance.
Honestly, what does he consider his own position to be...?
He can't just act on the spot like that.
The Marine Headquarters' Strongest,
"Admiral" Aokiji...Aokiji: Oops, sorry there.
...sigh...
There hasn't been a worthwhile one among 'em.[/hide]they were also considered equals in swordfighting. . . no one ever said that shanks only uses a sword. He probably knows some other moves. I think that at least he is a lot stronger then Mihawk is now
So far, there is no evidence that Shanks is stronger, or even as strong as Mihawk. In fact, all evidence points to the reverse, ie: the fact that Shanks has been seen primaraly using a sword (past and present), and the fact that he WAS a rival of Mihawk indicate he is a swordsman. The loss of his dominant hand must have weakened him, and the fact that Mihawk now holds the title of strongest swordsman shows that he has surpassed Shanks.
The whole "Shanks could have this or that power" argument is a really weak one as it lacks evidence and it could be used both ways. I could say that Mihawk could shoot optic blasts, or fart nuclear weapons, could you prove me wrong? Tbh, I really couldn't care who is stronger, and if you could prove Shanks is stronger I would be happy to accept it. Just don't use the whole "shanks is yonkou, mihawk is shichibukai, yonkou > shichibukai, shank > mihawk" argument because its not true, seeing as both Teach and Mihawk matched Shanks in a fight and Moria went toe to toe with Kaidou.
Rather live a coward than die a man. -
[hide]Volume 32, Chapter 303
From stephen's scripts:
- Page 165 -
[Grand Line, Marine Headquarters]
Officers: …Vice Admiral!! He... he's not here!!
I'm not settling for that!!
Where the hell did he go?!
His bicycle is gone, so... probably to sea.
Tell the Gorousei at once!!!Gorousei: ...him again?
Well, it's probably only reconnaissance.
Honestly, what does he consider his own position to be...?
He can't just act on the spot like that.
The Marine Headquarters' Strongest,
"Admiral" Aokiji...Aokiji: Oops, sorry there.
...sigh...
There hasn't been a worthwhile one among 'em.[/hide]The translation is right, but…
It's hard to explain, but right now I'm searching for this post.
Edit: damn, why can't I find it? -
It meant that the he is considered the strongest force in MHQ since he is one of the Admirals. Not that he is the strongest Admiral.
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It meant that the he is considered the strongest force in MHQ since he is one of the Admirals. Not that he is the strongest Admiral.
Robin also said that he is the most powerful man in the marines. Could also be a translation issue, or you could say she's traumatized, but in the English translation I read she said exactly that.
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That translation I belieave was wrong.
It was more like he is one of the strongest force of marine, and the same thing was said when Kizaru appeared.
So far we do not know who is the strongest Marine admiral. And it might be impossible to judge who is the strongest with all their Df ability and all might make the rock paper scissor arguments -
So far we do not know who is the strongest Marine admiral. And it might be impossible to judge who is the strongest with all their Df ability and all might make the rock paper scissor arguments
Yeah probably, the DF-abilities wouldn't work and they'd spend 24 hrs fighting with swords, sleep, and continue.
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From chapter 319. Stephen's translation. Robin talking about the Admirals "Greatest Power" in the WG and then saying Sengoku is the only one above them.
[hide]Robin: He's a sailor.
Marine Headquarters "Admiral" Aokiji.Crew: ADMIRAL??!!
- Page 54 -
Sanji: A…
...Admiral...?!!
How high up is that?!!Robin: The number of Marine officers who hold the rank of "Admiral"
is only three...!!!
"Akainu."
"Aokiji."
"Kizaru."(Note: Red-Dog, Blue-Pheasant and Yellow-Monkey, respectively.)
Robin: The only person above them is Sengoku, the head of the Marines.
He's one of the three men... called the "Greatest Powers" of the World Governments!!! [/hide] -
still I think Shanks is more powerfull then Mihawk. WB said their battles were long ago and Shanks having lost an arm doens't mean anything. He still managed to climb up to the position of Yonkou and that is not for nothing probably. I never heard tell that Moria was on equsl foot with Kaidou, in fact I heard that he was defeated miserably but your point does stand, for all we know both Mihawk and Shanks can fart atomc torpedo's so there really is now way of telling. I would just like it ore if Shakns were the strongest of the 2
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WB said their battles were long ago and Shanks having lost an arm doens't mean anything. He still managed to climb up to the position of Yonkou and that is not for nothing probably.
Where stands that he hasn’t the position of a Yonkou before he lost his arm?
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Where stands that he hasn’t the position of a Yonkou before he lost his arm?
aw come on, your such a Besserwisser!
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aw come on, your such a Besserwisser!
That was a question and it seems like you doesn’t know the answer and only try to insult because of this you are a Blödmann!
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Where stands that he hasn’t the position of a Yonkou before he lost his arm?
even if he was yonkou before he lost his arm, he still managed to maintain his status as one. so your post has no weight.
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even if he was yonkou before he lost his arm, he still managed to maintain his status as one. so your post has no weight.
I’m right there with you. But people tend to argue that Shanks was weak to this time because they think he wasn’t Yonkou in this time and I don’t agree with this argument.
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That was a question and it seems like you doesn’t know the answer and only try to insult because of this you are a Blödmann!
I know… I'm on your side and think he became a younku before he lost his arm.... i was making a joke about your username..... but, yea... carry on.
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About Aokiji being the strongest admiral:
http://forums.narutofan.com/showthread.php?t=400266
Yes, I know that the narutofan forum is horrible, but give it a read, It's a really good explanation.
